Modelling and texturing study.  Usual drill, Wings mesh, procedural 
textures.
The mask actually has more parts to be added. Some metal hammered on the 
front.  It is of Western Sahara design.  Bamana.  I think I need to vary 
the finish somehow.

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is it suposed to look like leather tightly wrapped on wood? or is it
supposed to be wood? the shine doesn't look right for wood that might be
really old. however it all looks pretty authentic.

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Ross wrote:
> is it suposed to look like leather tightly wrapped on wood? or is it
> supposed to be wood? the shine doesn't look right for wood that might be
> really old. however it all looks pretty authentic.
> 
> 
> 
Bare Wood.  The problem is the normal I believe.  It needs much more 
irregular detail and crisper edges.  I think a little variety in the 
finish would also help.  I thought I would just settle for a slightly 
burnished patina on this cut before I spent the rest of my lifetime on it ;)
Even when examining the masks in the museum, I is often hard to tell if 
it is covered in skin as you mention.  Usually the peeling away around 
the eyes is the only way to decide for sure.  Then there is the various 
layers of pigment, dirt etc.  The photo reference I am using for this 
one leaves no doubt that it is bare chiselled wood that has become 
burnished with wear.  But I could find nothing quite like it in the 
museum to observe for real.

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Fantastic, though it doesn't look like wood, but rather like very realistic
natural clay (still wet, perhaps). Very good.

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Jim Charter nous apporta ses lumieres ainsi en ce 19/07/2004 14:46... :

> Modelling and texturing study.  Usual drill, Wings mesh, procedural 
> textures.
> The mask actually has more parts to be added. Some metal hammered on 
> the front.  It is of Western Sahara design.  Bamana.  I think I need 
> to vary the finish somehow.
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
Looks like wood for me. Some varieties, like ebony, do take such a 
finish when polished with almost undistinguable grain. A litle light for 
ebony tough, as ebony is almost black.

Alain

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Jim Charter wrote:
> Ross wrote:
> 
>> is it suposed to look like leather tightly wrapped on wood? or is it
>> supposed to be wood? the shine doesn't look right for wood that might be
>> really old. however it all looks pretty authentic.
>>
>>
>>
> Bare Wood.  The problem is the normal I believe.  It needs much more 
> irregular detail and crisper edges.  I think a little variety in the 
> finish would also help.  I thought I would just settle for a slightly 
> burnished patina on this cut before I spent the rest of my lifetime on 
> it ;)
> Even when examining the masks in the museum, I is often hard to tell if 
> it is covered in skin as you mention.  Usually the peeling away around 
> the eyes is the only way to decide for sure.  Then there is the various 
> layers of pigment, dirt etc.  The photo reference I am using for this 
> one leaves no doubt that it is bare chiselled wood that has become 
> burnished with wear.  But I could find nothing quite like it in the 
> museum to observe for real.


I would expect this to be a very hard wood, but your specular highlights 
are too soft, more like a laquer. Try a very high phong_size to make it 
harder.  When I have worked with old wood that has that deeply burnished 
worn-in shine, the specular highlights are very tight, often changing 
with every line in the grain.

Very nice image though, great modeling.

RG

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gonzo wrote:
> Jim Charter wrote:
> 
>> Ross wrote:
>>
>>> is it suposed to look like leather tightly wrapped on wood? or is it
>>> supposed to be wood? the shine doesn't look right for wood that might be
>>> really old. however it all looks pretty authentic.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>> Bare Wood.  The problem is the normal I believe.  It needs much more 
>> irregular detail and crisper edges.  I think a little variety in the 
>> finish would also help.  I thought I would just settle for a slightly 
>> burnished patina on this cut before I spent the rest of my lifetime on 
>> it ;)
>> Even when examining the masks in the museum, I is often hard to tell 
>> if it is covered in skin as you mention.  Usually the peeling away 
>> around the eyes is the only way to decide for sure.  Then there is the 
>> various layers of pigment, dirt etc.  The photo reference I am using 
>> for this one leaves no doubt that it is bare chiselled wood that has 
>> become burnished with wear.  But I could find nothing quite like it in 
>> the museum to observe for real.
> 
> 
> 
> I would expect this to be a very hard wood, but your specular highlights 
> are too soft, more like a laquer. Try a very high phong_size to make it 
> harder.  When I have worked with old wood that has that deeply burnished 
> worn-in shine, the specular highlights are very tight, often changing 
> with every line in the grain.
> 
> Very nice image though, great modeling.
> 
> RG
> 
Thanks.  Yes you got the problem.  The thing is, in order to raise the 
specular and reduce the roughness keyword, and still get the desired 
appearance, I think I need to increase the actual micro roughness of the 
surface in order spread out the highlight, else it looks a little too 
shiny and molten. The surface of the wood has a gentle scalloping and a 
lot of random knicks like it was worked with a draw knife .

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Jim Charter wrote:
> Modelling and texturing study.  Usual drill, Wings mesh, procedural 
> textures.
> The mask actually has more parts to be added. Some metal hammered on the 
> front.  It is of Western Sahara design.  Bamana.  I think I need to vary 
> the finish somehow.
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 

My mother and step-father collect these (only fakes). Their bedroom is 
done in a safari theme. Elephants painted on the walls, African masks 
and art, electric torches, etc.. This woman is up for a (National 
Association of Home Builders) Prism award, and this is how she decorates 
her bedroom. Your quiet render looks so mysterious and interesting (as 
opposed to tacky) in comparison.

The mask material looks excellent to me. That is the same weird material 
I run into occasionally that even on close inspection can only *just* be 
identified as "some kind of wood". Maybe the finish is correct, but the 
light source is too bright in relation to whatever "global" light is 
present??? I've never seen one of these under a spotlight.

The model looks off to me where the ear attachers to the head. Is the 
ear nailed on or carved into the mask?

  -Shay

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Shay wrote:
> Jim Charter wrote:
> 
>> Modelling and texturing study.  Usual drill, Wings mesh, procedural 
>> textures.
>> The mask actually has more parts to be added. Some metal hammered on 
>> the front.  It is of Western Sahara design.  Bamana.  I think I need 
>> to vary the finish somehow.
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
> 
> My mother and step-father collect these (only fakes). Their bedroom is 
> done in a safari theme. Elephants painted on the walls, African masks 
> and art, electric torches, etc.. This woman is up for a (National 
> Association of Home Builders) Prism award, and this is how she decorates 
> her bedroom. Your quiet render looks so mysterious and interesting (as 
> opposed to tacky) in comparison.
> 
> The mask material looks excellent to me. That is the same weird material 
> I run into occasionally that even on close inspection can only *just* be 
> identified as "some kind of wood". Maybe the finish is correct, but the 
> light source is too bright in relation to whatever "global" light is 
> present??? I've never seen one of these under a spotlight.
> 
> The model looks off to me where the ear attachers to the head. Is the 
> ear nailed on or carved into the mask?
> 
>  -Shay
Yes the kitsch market in African masks is quite discouraging.  I can 
walk down West Broadway in the Soho area, (once the cradle of the Int'l 
Art scene here in the sixties and seventies, now gone to seed and the 
playland of Eurotrash, B&T's, and touristos ) and have my pick of little 
African figurines etc. That and the fact that a genuine article would 
still be a colonial product quite likely. That is why I cycle back to 
this subject matter after long absenses.  As you say, there is some 
emotive potential that gets overlooked. And my time in Columbus OH 
instilled some fledgling appreciation for folk art.   For me, all of 
this has to do with notions of sentience which, it stricks me, is the 
grand design of CG anyway.

Yes, working from a photo reference is very deceiving. You don't know 
what is the effect of lighting, what is the effect of the actual 
material, and what is the effect of the photofinishing.  I know for a 
fact that the photos I am working from (Hamill Gallery in Boston) are 
sometimes overexposed in order to show up detail but with the result of 
completely distorting the color.  For the sake of the current exercise I 
will see how close I can get to certain aspects of the photo.  Then 
adjust from there.  When I am done with this one I will link the photo 
reference, though it wouldn't be hard to find.  As I stated elsewhere I 
still need to stick a bunch of metal on the face.

Yes the ear needs work on its modelling.  All the joints are problematic 
because in reality the edges are not clean.  They are carved fairly 
crudely, and are all of a piece.  But the very regular filleting that 
the mesh smoothing algorithm gives does not capture the look.  It is too 
regular and metallic looking.  Instead, although the trasition is not 
very sharp, the look is more angular and inconsistent.  In many places 
the carved faceting of the surface can be sensed.  But if you let the 
faceting of the polygons suggest this, it just looks like polygons.  If 
you use a scalloped crackle normal, it looks like a crackle normal, and 
doesn't follow the logic of the shape.

I am having some thoughts about do these as iso's and applying the 
textures for real.  But I am doing the experimenting with mesh and 
procedurals.

Having fun. Keeps me out of traffic.

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> Modelling and texturing study.  Usual drill, Wings mesh, procedural textures.
> The mask actually has more parts to be added. Some metal hammered on the 
> front.  It is of Western Sahara design.  Bamana.  I think I need to vary the 
> finish somehow.

Very good !!!! perhaps a little to shiny, but the modeling is perfect 
!!!!

-- 

Dark Skull Software
http://www.darkskull.net

A+

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