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I have noticed, that some people name their entry file names so that their
image will be at the top of the viewing page. For example some filenames
from this round: 001.jpg, 00pfboat.jpg, 13youth.jpg, 1j_canal.jpg, 2000l2.jpg,
etc. It seems clear that at least some people deliberately name their files
so that they get at the top of the page (of course I'm not saying _all_ the
people at the top are doing this, but I suppose that at least a few of them).
Wouldn't it be a good idea to build the viewing page so that the entries
are not in alfabetical order, but in random order? This way nobody can get
advantage by naming his/her files with leading 0's.
Of course this makes it harder to find your own entry, but I think that's
a minimal disadvantage... :)
--
- Warp. -
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I agree to that!
Marc
---
Marc Schimmler
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good point warp !!
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Nieminen Mika <war### [at] assari cctutfi> writes:
> Wouldn't it be a good idea to build the viewing page so that the entries
> are not in alfabetical order, but in random order? This way nobody can get
> advantage by naming his/her files with leading 0's.
Random... Yuk. Why not sorting by submission time? Increasing or
decreasing, whatever. Most recently submitted first could be good, I feel.
> Of course this makes it harder to find your own entry, but I think that's
> a minimal disadvantage... :)
That's why a deterministic ordering is better (to my mind).
Well... I'll look at them all anyway :-)
Roland.
--
Les francophones m'appellent Roland Mas,
English speakers call me Rowlannd' Mass,
Nihongode hanasu hitoha [Lolando Masu] to iimasu.
Choisissez ! Take your pick ! Erande kudasai !
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Nieminen Mika wrote:
>
> I have noticed, that some people name their entry file names so that their
> image will be at the top of the viewing page. For example some filenames
> from this round: 001.jpg, 00pfboat.jpg, 13youth.jpg, 1j_canal.jpg, 2000l2.jpg,
> etc. It seems clear that at least some people deliberately name their files
> so that they get at the top of the page (of course I'm not saying _all_ the
> people at the top are doing this, but I suppose that at least a few of them).
>
> Wouldn't it be a good idea to build the viewing page so that the entries
> are not in alfabetical order, but in random order? This way nobody can get
> advantage by naming his/her files with leading 0's.
> Of course this makes it harder to find your own entry, but I think that's
> a minimal disadvantage... :)
For voters with Win95(98), Bob Franke's Winvote program does exactly
that. It presents images to the voter in a random order, different for
each voter, until the voter has voted on all images. It them allows the
voter to view the images sorted in any of several ways. While it is not
a general image viewing program, it is handy for IRTC fans whether they
are voters or not. I should also point out that Nathan O'Brien (No. 13)
does not name his images thus as a position trick. According to him,
the No. 13 that has become his trademark originated from a slurred
rendition of his initials: N O'B that looked like N O 1 3. The Winvote
program is located at: http://www.halcyon.com/wordsltd/pov/winvote.htm.
Jerry Anning
cle### [at] dholcom
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Jerry Anning <cle### [at] dholcom> wrote:
: For voters with Win95(98), Bob Franke's Winvote program does exactly
: that.
The win95-virus strikes again... Anyone wishing to port it to SunOS so
that other people can use it also?
: I should also point out that Nathan O'Brien (No. 13)
: does not name his images thus as a position trick. According to him,
: the No. 13 that has become his trademark originated from a slurred
: rendition of his initials: N O'B that looked like N O 1 3.
That's exactly why I added the comment:
:> (of course I'm not saying _all_ the people
:> at the top are doing this, but I suppose that at least a few of them).
I just didn't want to be prejudiced (is this the right term?) so I listed
his entry among the others although I know he is not one of those people
which name their files deliberately to get at the top.
: The Winvote
: program is located at: http://www.halcyon.com/wordsltd/pov/winvote.htm.
As I said, I can't use it, since I don't have win95.
--
- Warp. -
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Is there any indication going early is an advantage? It may
well be a disadvantage, as voters intentionally compensate while
going through the list, if they in fact do so in alphabetical
order.
Nevertheless, I see no problem in randomly sorting entries until
the voting is closed. After the results are sealed, they could be
restored to a less chaotic, more useful sequence.... alphabetical
by entrant name would perhaps be most useful.
Dan
Nieminen Mika wrote:
> Wouldn't it be a good idea to build the viewing page so that the entries
> are not in alfabetical order, but in random order? This way nobody can get
> advantage by naming his/her files with leading 0's.
> Of course this makes it harder to find your own entry, but I think that's
> a minimal disadvantage... :)
--
http://www.flash.net/~djconnel/
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Dan Connelly wrote:
>
> Is there any indication going early is an advantage? It may
> well be a disadvantage, as voters intentionally compensate while
> going through the list, if they in fact do so in alphabetical
> order.
Good point. It seems likely that at least some sequential voters would
behave like figure skating judges and tend to slightly downrate good
images that appear early in the list in order to "leave room" for
possible better entries later.
Jerry Anning
cle### [at] dholcom
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Jerry Anning <cle### [at] dholcom> wrote:
:> Is there any indication going early is an advantage? It may
:> well be a disadvantage, as voters intentionally compensate while
:> going through the list, if they in fact do so in alphabetical
:> order.
: Good point. It seems likely that at least some sequential voters would
: behave like figure skating judges and tend to slightly downrate good
: images that appear early in the list in order to "leave room" for
: possible better entries later.
I think it doesn't matter if it's an advantage or a disadvantage. I think
the list should be in random order anyways. This way you have little
possibilities to cheat in any way and have a small chance to get a
disadvantaged place in the list even if your image name starts with '0' or 'z'.
--
- Warp. -
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Nieminen Mika wrote:
> I have noticed, that some people name their entry file names so that their
> image will be at the top of the viewing page. For example some filenames
> from this round: 001.jpg, 00pfboat.jpg, 13youth.jpg, 1j_canal.jpg, 2000l2.jpg,
> etc. It seems clear that at least some people deliberately name their files
> so that they get at the top of the page (of course I'm not saying _all_ the
> people at the top are doing this, but I suppose that at least a few of them).
>
> Wouldn't it be a good idea to build the viewing page so that the entries
> are not in alfabetical order, but in random order? This way nobody can get
> advantage by naming his/her files with leading 0's.
> Of course this makes it harder to find your own entry, but I think that's
> a minimal disadvantage... :)
>
> --
> - Warp. -
Personaly I think it's all a bunch of paranoid hogwash. Either the
submission contains the artisctic quality to win or it doesn't. To
presume that people will favor a certain entry due to it's relitive
position on a list is putting the judging staff in a less than
intelligent light. I would be insulted to think that you think that
such a trivial matter would in any way cloud my judgment when voting.
I base my judgment soley on artstic merit and nothing else. If others
are not then they should re-evaluate whether they should participate
in the judging process at all.
Ken Tyler
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