POV-Ray : Newsgroups : povray.unix : POV-Ray v3.8.0-beta.1 Server Time
28 Sep 2021 15:44:53 EDT (-0400)
  POV-Ray v3.8.0-beta.1 (Message 17 to 26 of 28)  
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From: clipka
Subject: Re: POV-Ray v3.8.0-beta.1
Date: 16 Jul 2021 23:16:31
Message: <60f24b8f$1@news.povray.org>
Am 16.07.2021 um 13:45 schrieb jr:

> fwiw, the 'github.com/POV-Ray/povray/tags' page would benefit from showing
> checksums (sha256?) for the archives, too.

I'm not sure what the benefit of that would be.

If you do not trust to get the proper archives from GitHub, I see no 
reason to trust that you'll see the proper SHAs for those files.

(Or do you mena SHAs of the commits corresponding to those tags? Well, 
the first 7 digits of those _are_ shown on that page; and if you click 
on those, it'll take you to a page where the full SHA of the commit is 
shown in all its glory.)

Now, publishing checksums on the POV-Ray home page, that might be 
another matter. But even then, it only really makes sense for versions 
we build on our own machines and upload to GitHub later. Not so much for 
the betas: They are built directly on GitHub servers.

(And yes, I do trust Microsoft's GitHub servers more than I do my own 
Windows 10 machine.)


>> GitHub _is_ our preferred place for bug reports these days.
> 
> sure.  (though regrettable from my perspective)  as long as no account is needed
> to download the source archive.

These days, there is pretty much no software project that allows the 
reporting of bugs without _some_ form of identification. It's just not 
possible anymore - they'd be swamped by spambots.

And with that in mind, I for one welcome our new insect overl... erm, I 
mean, I for one applaud every project that uses some reasonably common 
bug tracking service, rather than rolling their own. Because although I 
do agree that it sucks to be unable to report a bug without registering 
_somewhere_, in my opinion it sucks less if that registration is good 
for multiple pieces of software that I use.


>> And we're by far not the only ones. There is an ever growing number of
>> other pieces of open source software ...
> 
> the "not the only ones" argument reminds me of an old saying "people, eat more
> shit, four billion flies can't be wrong".  fifteen or twenty years ago,
> SourceForge was the place to be (seen) on, maybe github will do better, who
> knows?

SourceForge thought they could exploit their pole position with 
impunity. Which is how they lost it to GitHub.

We didn't go to GitHub because we thought it was the bee's knees; we 
went there because we decided to set up a public repository, in hopes to 
get more people to contribute - and SourceForge had just gone rogue at 
the time we were ready to actually go ahead with that step. GitHub just 
happened to be pretty much the only contender, and actually we were 
initially quite skeptical, not the least because we had no experience 
with Git in particular nor even any other distributed version control 
system in general.

Looking back, I'm sure it wasn't the worst of choices.


Also, I'm not saying you should join the flies and host your own 
projects there (although I might, if you were to ask for advice in that 
matter). Going with that image, it's more like I'm saying that if you 
want to catch flies, that's where to find lots of them. That's not a 
question of taste - it's just pure matter of fact.


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From: jr
Subject: Re: POV-Ray v3.8.0-beta.1
Date: 17 Jul 2021 12:05:00
Message: <web.60f2fe9cb74fb8af5e0fed26cde94f1@news.povray.org>
hi,

clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
> ... github ...

I suspect you could sell ice boxes to the inuit -- in mid-winter.  ;-)


>> fwiw, ... checksums ...
>
> I'm not sure what the benefit of that would be.
>
> If you do not trust to get the proper archives from GitHub, I see no
> reason to trust that you'll see the proper SHAs for those files.

not worried/paranoid about GitHub as an organisation, just wary of .. clever
individuals, who always find some nook or cranny.


regards, jr.


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From: jr
Subject: Re: POV-Ray v3.8.0-beta.1
Date: 18 Jul 2021 07:10:00
Message: <web.60f40b7eb74fb8af5e0fed26cde94f1@news.povray.org>
hi,

clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
> ... v3.8.0-beta.1 ...
> Happy Testing!

when I run the beta with '-cc +w400 +h300 +a +rtr +kla', the preview window pops
up but shows nothing.  the current 'povr' is fine with exact same command-line.


regards, jr.


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From: clipka
Subject: Re: POV-Ray v3.8.0-beta.1
Date: 18 Jul 2021 12:56:13
Message: <60f45d2d$1@news.povray.org>
Am 18.07.2021 um 13:07 schrieb jr:
> hi,
> 
> clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
>> ... v3.8.0-beta.1 ...
>> Happy Testing!
> 
> when I run the beta with '-cc +w400 +h300 +a +rtr +kla', the preview window pops
> up but shows nothing.  the current 'povr' is fine with exact same command-line.

"povr" is not POV-Ray. It is a derivative work by someone who also 
happens to work on POV.Ray.

I don't have the capacity (nor even an overwiew of what would have to be 
done) to merge Bill's changes into POV-Ray proper.


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From: Kenneth
Subject: Re: POV-Ray v3.8.0-beta.1
Date: 18 Jul 2021 19:05:00
Message: <web.60f4b355b74fb8af4cef624e6e066e29@news.povray.org>
"jr" <cre### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
>
> when I run the beta with '-cc +w400 +h300 +a +rtr +kla', the preview window pops
> up but shows nothing.
>
Those settings work OK in the Windows version.

Do you correctly have *multiple* camera in your scene for rtr and kla to work
properly? (or a #while/#for loop to generate the multiple cameras?) With just a
single camera in such a scene, the parsing/rendering seems to go into an
endless(?) loop-- although I still see a single render of my scene in the
preview, not a blank screen like you mention.


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From: Kenneth
Subject: Re: POV-Ray v3.8.0-beta.1
Date: 18 Jul 2021 19:15:00
Message: <web.60f4b55db74fb8af4cef624e6e066e29@news.povray.org>
"Kenneth" <kdw### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
> ...With just a
> single camera in such a scene, the parsing/rendering seems to go into an
> endless(?) loop--

I mean an endless loop with the computer chugging away, but doing nothing. The
real-time raytracing feature, when working properly, also generates an endless
looping animation-- but that's with all the new camera positions, one after the
other.


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From: jr
Subject: Re: POV-Ray v3.8.0-beta.1
Date: 19 Jul 2021 05:20:00
Message: <web.60f542e4b74fb8af5e0fed26cde94f1@news.povray.org>
hi,

"Kenneth" <kdw### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
> "jr" <cre### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
> >
> > when I run the beta with '-cc +w400 +h300 +a +rtr +kla', the preview window pops
> > up but shows nothing.
> >
> Those settings work OK in the Windows version.
>
> Do you correctly have *multiple* camera in your scene for rtr and kla to work
> properly? ...

I think so, yes.  the code (and command-line) works fine with one particular
executable (WFP's povr) but not with the official "unofficial" alpha + beta
versions I have.  cheers.


regards, jr.


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From: Thomas de Groot
Subject: Re: POV-Ray v3.8.0-beta.1
Date: 19 Jul 2021 08:17:24
Message: <60f56d54$1@news.povray.org>
Rendering a 3.8 version scene which includes functions.inc, I get the 
following parse warning:

"functions.inc" line 167: Parse warning: use of POV-Ray v3.7 keyword 
('deprecated') detected in alleged v3.5 scene.

The only place were version 3.5 is mentioned is precisely at the start 
of functions.inc:

#ifndef(Functions_Inc_Temp)
#declare Functions_Inc_Temp = version;
#version 3.5;
...
#end

At the mentioned line 167 of this /new/ functions.inc shipped with the 
beta, a /new/ if statement has been introduced, not there in previous 
versions:

#if (Functions_Inc_Temp < 3.8)
     #declare deprecated once "f_enneper was broken prior to v3.8; 
results will most likely differ."
              f_enneper = function { internal(18) }
#else
     #declare f_enneper = function { internal(18) }
#end


-- 
Thomas


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From: Thomas de Groot
Subject: Re: POV-Ray v3.8.0-beta.1
Date: 29 Jul 2021 11:45:03
Message: <6102ccff$1@news.povray.org>
I still do not understand this parse warning as I do *not* run a version 
3.5 scene. Does it refer to POV-Ray includes which /mention/ version 3.5?
functions.inc seem to be the only include file containing this.

Just a short explanation would be enough about this mysterious warning.

Thanks,

Thomas

Op 19-7-2021 om 14:17 schreef Thomas de Groot:
> Rendering a 3.8 version scene which includes functions.inc, I get the 
> following parse warning:
> 
> "functions.inc" line 167: Parse warning: use of POV-Ray v3.7 keyword 
> ('deprecated') detected in alleged v3.5 scene.
> 
> The only place were version 3.5 is mentioned is precisely at the start 
> of functions.inc:
> 
> #ifndef(Functions_Inc_Temp)
> #declare Functions_Inc_Temp = version;
> #version 3.5;
> ...
> #end
> 
> At the mentioned line 167 of this /new/ functions.inc shipped with the 
> beta, a /new/ if statement has been introduced, not there in previous 
> versions:
> 
> #if (Functions_Inc_Temp < 3.8)
>      #declare deprecated once "f_enneper was broken prior to v3.8; 
> results will most likely differ."
>               f_enneper = function { internal(18) }
> #else
>      #declare f_enneper = function { internal(18) }
> #end
> 
> 


-- 
Thomas


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From: clipka
Subject: Re: POV-Ray v3.8.0-beta.1
Date: 29 Jul 2021 15:54:36
Message: <6103077c$1@news.povray.org>
Am 29.07.2021 um 17:45 schrieb Thomas de Groot:
> I still do not understand this parse warning as I do *not* run a version 
> 3.5 scene. Does it refer to POV-Ray includes which /mention/ version 3.5?
> functions.inc seem to be the only include file containing this.
> 
> Just a short explanation would be enough about this mysterious warning.

It's a bug in `functions.inc`: At the start it claims that it needs only 
v3.5, but later it uses the `deprecated` keyword, which wasn't 
introduced until v3.7.

In other words, if someone were to use genuine POV-Ray v3.5, and render 
the scene with that very same include file, they'd get an error message.

The fact that POV-Ray warns about such scenarios is a brand new feature 
of v3.8.0-beta.1.


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