I've thought about this for a while: What, indeed, is so different 
between Saul's posts in this newsgroup, and the other 
"political-related" posts here?

The conclusion I've come to is that virtually all politics-related 
discussions on this newsgroups have been discussions /among people/ 
first, and /about politics/ second. It's always about how individual 
people think (and feel!) about stuff going on in the world - sometimes 
backing up their opinion by external sources, but it's always /their/ 
opinion.

This is an entirely different approach from someone just presenting 
external sources, without relating to them on a personal level.

It seems to me that we, the people participating in this newsgroup, to 
the most degree prefer a discussion among peers, rather than discussing 
other people's views, let alone that of authorities. Which I consider 
quite healthy, because it shows a free spirit, and the desire to come to 
one's own conclusion rather than just believe what others say.

I also think it quite healthy because it includes both reason /and/ 
emotion, and my guess is that this is exactly what most of us like best 
about the atmosphere (do you say that in English?) of this newsgroup.

Post a reply to this message

Am 27.09.2014 21:04, schrieb clipka:

> It seems to me that we, the people participating in this newsgroup, to
> the most degree prefer a discussion among peers, rather than discussing
> other people's views, let alone that of authorities.

Just noticed that I might have picked the wrong word here: What I meant 
was what in German would be called "Autoritäten": People whose opinion 
is highly valued, because they are experts, are perceived as such, or 
for some other reason are presumed to know better than most people. Not 
sure whether there's a single matching word for this in English.

Post a reply to this message

On 27/09/14 20:04, clipka wrote:
> 
> I also think it quite healthy because it includes both reason /and/
> emotion, and my guess is that this is exactly what most of us like best
> about the atmosphere (do you say that in English?) of this newsgroup.

Yes, atmosphere is the right word. I agree with you completely.

I would add one thing. The reason we all get on so well is that we
respect that others may hold contradictory viewpoints; we may disagree
but, although we may attempt to dissuade them from their wrong-headed (
:-) ) opinions, we don't descend to infantile name-calling.*

John

*Unless, of course, we are discussing the superiority of Vi vs Emacs
-- 
Protect the Earth
It was not given to you by your parents
You hold it in trust for your children

Post a reply to this message

On 27/09/14 20:18, clipka wrote:
> 
> Just noticed that I might have picked the wrong word here: What I meant
> was what in German would be called "Autoritäten": People whose opinion
> is highly valued, because they are experts, are perceived as such, or
> for some other reason are presumed to know better than most people. Not
> sure whether there's a single matching word for this in English.
> 

I think the words are perfectly equivalent. We might prefix
'authorities' with 'respected' but it's not generally necessary.

John
-- 
Protect the Earth
It was not given to you by your parents
You hold it in trust for your children

Post a reply to this message

On 27/09/2014 21:19, Doctor John wrote:
> *Unless, of course, we are discussing the superiority of Vi vs Emacs

hmmm, that subject is nope opened to discussion, ever. Anyone with a
functioning brain knows...



/me hides, runs and covers, jumps in the atomic shelter and slams the door.

-- 
IQ of crossposters with FU: 100 / (number of groups)
IQ of crossposters without FU: 100 / (1 + number of groups)
IQ of multiposters: 100 / ( (number of groups) * (number of groups))

Post a reply to this message

On 27/09/2014 20:27, Doctor John wrote:
> On 27/09/14 20:18, clipka wrote:
>>
>> Just noticed that I might have picked the wrong word here: What I meant
>> was what in German would be called "Autoritäten": People whose opinion
>> is highly valued, because they are experts, are perceived as such, or
>> for some other reason are presumed to know better than most people. Not
>> sure whether there's a single matching word for this in English.
>>
>
> I think the words are perfectly equivalent. We might prefix
> 'authorities' with 'respected' but it's not generally necessary.
>


Or prefix it with cursed, damned, bloody etc.
Not always respected, often loathed.

I would just say experts.

-- 

Regards
     Stephen

Post a reply to this message

We might disagree with each otherbut there is seldom any personal attacks.

I think there is too much respect for that to happen.

-- 

Regards
     Stephen

Post a reply to this message

On 27-9-2014 21:19, Doctor John wrote:
> On 27/09/14 20:04, clipka wrote:
>>
>> I also think it quite healthy because it includes both reason /and/
>> emotion, and my guess is that this is exactly what most of us like best
>> about the atmosphere (do you say that in English?) of this newsgroup.
>
> Yes, atmosphere is the right word. I agree with you completely.
>
> I would add one thing. The reason we all get on so well is that we
> respect that others may hold contradictory viewpoints;

What is the point of a discussion when you agree?

> we may disagree
> but, although we may attempt to dissuade them from their wrong-headed (
> :-) ) opinions, we don't descend to infantile name-calling.*

Often it is about culture and politics. Which makes it even more 
interesting than arguing with your neighbour.
Although most regulars are (older) man from western countries.

Getting a few asians or africans on board would make things even more 
interesting (or from latin america, but I am not sure if the last one 
was a success). Definitely lacking a female perspective also.



-- 
Everytime the IT department forbids something that a researcher deems
necessary for her work there will be another hole in the firewall.

Post a reply to this message

Am 28.09.2014 00:55, schrieb Stephen:
> On 27/09/2014 20:27, Doctor John wrote:
>> On 27/09/14 20:18, clipka wrote:
>>>
>>> Just noticed that I might have picked the wrong word here: What I meant
>>> was what in German would be called "Autoritäten": People whose opinion
>>> is highly valued, because they are experts, are perceived as such, or
>>> for some other reason are presumed to know better than most people. Not
>>> sure whether there's a single matching word for this in English.
>>>
>>
>> I think the words are perfectly equivalent. We might prefix
>> 'authorities' with 'respected' but it's not generally necessary.
>>
>
>
> Or prefix it with cursed, damned, bloody etc.
> Not always respected, often loathed.
>
> I would just say experts.

Hum...I wouldn't call the pope an expert, though he'd certainly fill the 
shoes of an "Autorität".

Post a reply to this message

On 28/09/2014 00:15, andrel wrote:
> Definitely lacking a female perspective also.

I think we drove the last one off.
Janet was somewhat irritated the last time she was here.

-- 

Regards
     Stephen

Post a reply to this message

On 28/09/2014 00:29, clipka wrote:
> Am 28.09.2014 00:55, schrieb Stephen:
>> On 27/09/2014 20:27, Doctor John wrote:
>>> On 27/09/14 20:18, clipka wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Just noticed that I might have picked the wrong word here: What I meant
>>>> was what in German would be called "Autoritäten": People whose opinion
>>>> is highly valued, because they are experts, are perceived as such, or
>>>> for some other reason are presumed to know better than most people. Not
>>>> sure whether there's a single matching word for this in English.
>>>>
>>>
>>> I think the words are perfectly equivalent. We might prefix
>>> 'authorities' with 'respected' but it's not generally necessary.
>>>
>>
>>
>> Or prefix it with cursed, damned, bloody etc.
>> Not always respected, often loathed.
>>
>> I would just say experts.
>
> Hum...I wouldn't call the pope an expert, though he'd certainly fill the
> shoes of an "Autorität".
>

Jesus Christ
Is his field of expertise. I would think.

But I did miss out the other category to fill "are perceived as such, or
for some other reason are presumed to know better than most people."

Know all, know nothing's and politicians.


-- 

Regards
     Stephen

Post a reply to this message

On 28-9-2014 1:15, andrel wrote:
> On 27-9-2014 21:19, Doctor John wrote:
>> On 27/09/14 20:04, clipka wrote:
>>>
>>> I also think it quite healthy because it includes both reason /and/
>>> emotion, and my guess is that this is exactly what most of us like best
>>> about the atmosphere (do you say that in English?) of this newsgroup.
>>
>> Yes, atmosphere is the right word. I agree with you completely.
>>
>> I would add one thing. The reason we all get on so well is that we
>> respect that others may hold contradictory viewpoints;
>
> What is the point of a discussion when you agree?

I suppose there are different levels of discussion, from where somebody 
is curious about the opinion of others on a certain matter, to help 
making up one's own mind, to really address issues to may generate 
disagreement. But I agree with Christoph and John that this is done here 
with due respect to the other's integrity. Nobody tries to convert sword 
in hand.

>
>> we may disagree
>> but, although we may attempt to dissuade them from their wrong-headed (
>> :-) ) opinions, we don't descend to infantile name-calling.*
>
> Often it is about culture and politics. Which makes it even more
> interesting than arguing with your neighbour.
> Although most regulars are (older) man from western countries.
>
> Getting a few asians or africans on board would make things even more
> interesting (or from latin america, but I am not sure if the last one
> was a success). Definitely lacking a female perspective also.
>
>
Yes indeed but I am afraid that linguistic barriers maybe more than 
cultural barriers are at play in that respect. The female perspective is 
another matter however.

Thomas

Post a reply to this message

[I wonder why sometimes my keyboard is typing different letters from 
what I intend....]

Post a reply to this message

Stephen <mca### [at] aolcom> wrote:
> We might disagree with each otherbut there is seldom any personal attacks.

> I think there is too much respect for that to happen.

Unfortunately it's not always true, though. At least not in the past.

Sometimes something that I would call "surprise flamewar" happens.
You present an opinion that you think is pretty reasonable and rather
non-controversial, and even afterwards you still think so, but it
surprisingly results in a full-on flamewar.

For example, I remember this one time that I posted a reply to someone
where I expressed an opinion on whether it's appropriate to mock the
president of a country that's not your own. I thought (and still think)
that it was a quite reasonable opinion. Sure, some people may very well
see it in another way, but I was never expecting in a million years the
incredible flamewar that ensued. Because of an opinion that I think that
it's not appropriate that the presidents of other countries should be
mocked and ridiculed... I'm still having a hard time understanding why.

(The other surprising thing was that I was completely alone in that
opinion. There were like five people ganged up against me, and yes,
it eventually succumbed to personal attacks from their part, and not
a single person, not even one, expressed even the slightest amount of
understanding or agreement. It was almost surreal.)

I suppose it's hopeless to understand the chaotic nature of the human mind.

-- 
                                                          - Warp

Post a reply to this message

Am 28.09.2014 09:36, schrieb Thomas de Groot:
> [I wonder why sometimes my keyboard is typing different letters from
> what I intend....]

As I suspect you understand a bit of German, here's a little poem for you:

-------------------------------------
"O unberachenbere Schreibmischane
Was bist du für ein winderluches Tier
Du tauschst die Bachstuben günz nach Vergnagen
Und schröbst so scheinen Unsinn aufs Papier."

"Du tappst die falschen Tisten, luber Bieb.
O sige mar, was kann da ich dafür?"
-------------------------------------

;-)

Post a reply to this message

On 28-9-2014 12:09, clipka wrote:
> Am 28.09.2014 09:36, schrieb Thomas de Groot:
>> [I wonder why sometimes my keyboard is typing different letters from
>> what I intend....]
>
> As I suspect you understand a bit of German, here's a little poem for you:
>
> -------------------------------------
> "O unberachenbere Schreibmischane
> Was bist du für ein winderluches Tier
> Du tauschst die Bachstuben günz nach Vergnagen
> Und schröbst so scheinen Unsinn aufs Papier."
>
> "Du tappst die falschen Tisten, luber Bieb.
> O sige mar, was kann da ich dafür?"
> -------------------------------------
>
> ;-)
>

LOL! Yes indeed!

Alien contraptions. I sometimes suspect that it sends coded messages to 
the Rigellians by manipulating my fingers...

Thomas

Post a reply to this message

On 28/09/2014 08:36, Thomas de Groot wrote:
> [I wonder why sometimes my keyboard is typing different letters from
> what I intend....]
>

So that is where mine went!

-- 

Regards
     Stephen

Post a reply to this message

On 28/09/2014 09:13, Warp wrote:
> Stephen<mca### [at] aolcom>  wrote:
>> >We might disagree with each otherbut there is seldom any personal attacks.
>> >I think there is too much respect for that to happen.
> Unfortunately it's not always true, though. At least not in the past.

I remember that and it was in my mind when I wrote.

It was getting heated when I dropped out. Then I heard what happened.
He was visibly unravelling. "Speaking Tagalog on a walkie talkie so no 
one could understand his escape plans." IIRC

But since you bring the topic up again, I been thinking about it and I 
think tha


-- 

Regards
     Stephen

Post a reply to this message

On 27/09/14 23:36, Le_Forgeron wrote:
> /me hides, runs and covers, jumps in the atomic shelter and slams the door.
> 

Just in time, my friend. Just in time.

[Powers down the flame-thrower}

John
-- 
Protect the Earth
It was not given to you by your parents
You hold it in trust for your children

Post a reply to this message

> Sometimes something that I would call "surprise flamewar" happens.
> You present an opinion that you think is pretty reasonable and rather
> non-controversial, and even afterwards you still think so, but it
> surprisingly results in a full-on flamewar.

Every forum needs a good flamewar now and again :-)

Post a reply to this message

On 29/09/14 08:36, scott wrote:
>> Sometimes something that I would call "surprise flamewar" happens.
>> You present an opinion that you think is pretty reasonable and rather
>> non-controversial, and even afterwards you still think so, but it
>> surprisingly results in a full-on flamewar.
> 
> Every forum needs a good flamewar now and again :-)
> 
> 

NO THEY DON'T. HOW COULD YOU POSSIBLY THINK OF SUCH A RIDICULOUS THING ;-)

John
-- 
Protect the Earth
It was not given to you by your parents
You hold it in trust for your children

Post a reply to this message

>> Every forum needs a good flamewar now and again :-)
>>
>
> NO THEY DON'T. HOW COULD YOU POSSIBLY THINK OF SUCH A RIDICULOUS THING ;-)

YOUR A IDIOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post a reply to this message

On 29-9-2014 11:58, scott wrote:
>>> Every forum needs a good flamewar now and again :-)
>>>
>>
>> NO THEY DON'T. HOW COULD YOU POSSIBLY THINK OF SUCH A RIDICULOUS THING
>> ;-)
>
> YOUR A IDIOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>

YOU'RE
AN



-- 
Everytime the IT department forbids something that a researcher deems
necessary for her work there will be another hole in the firewall.

Post a reply to this message

>>>> Every forum needs a good flamewar now and again :-)
>>>>
>>>
>>> NO THEY DON'T. HOW COULD YOU POSSIBLY THINK OF SUCH A RIDICULOUS THING
>>> ;-)
>>
>> YOUR A IDIOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>>
>
> YOU'RE
> AN

SHUT UP!!!!! YOU HAVE TO CORRECT MY SPELLING BECAUSE YOU KNOW I AM 
RIGHT!!!!!!!

Post a reply to this message

On 29/09/2014 08:42, Doctor John wrote:
> On 29/09/14 08:36, scott wrote:
>>> Sometimes something that I would call "surprise flamewar" happens.
>>> You present an opinion that you think is pretty reasonable and rather
>>> non-controversial, and even afterwards you still think so, but it
>>> surprisingly results in a full-on flamewar.
>>
>> Every forum needs a good flamewar now and again :-)
>>
>>
>
> NO THEY DON'T. HOW COULD YOU POSSIBLY THINK OF SUCH A RIDICULOUS THING ;-)
>

Oh! YES they do.


-- 

Regards
     Stephen

Post a reply to this message

On 29/09/14 11:20, Stephen wrote:
> 
> Oh! YES they do.
> 
> 
... and this coming from a self-proclaimed expert in opera. AS ENNY FULE
KNO etc etc
-- 
Protect the Earth
It was not given to you by your parents
You hold it in trust for your children

Post a reply to this message

On 29/09/2014 11:45, Doctor John wrote:
> On 29/09/14 11:20, Stephen wrote:
>>
>> Oh! YES they do.
>>
>>
> .... and this coming from a self-proclaimed expert in opera. AS ENNY FULE
> KNO etc etc
>

I cannot remember the last time the ROH put on a panto. :-P

I am no expert. I just find it a comfortable place to sleep.



-- 

Regards
     Stephen

Post a reply to this message

On 29-9-2014 12:49, Stephen wrote:
> On 29/09/2014 11:45, Doctor John wrote:
>> On 29/09/14 11:20, Stephen wrote:
>>>
>>> Oh! YES they do.
>>>
>>>
>> .... and this coming from a self-proclaimed expert in opera. AS ENNY FULE
>> KNO etc etc
>>
>
> I cannot remember the last time the ROH put on a panto. :-P
>
> I am no expert. I just find it a comfortable place to sleep.
>
>
>
When the lights are out and the audience gone?

Thomas

Post a reply to this message

Am 29.09.2014 12:06, schrieb scott:
>>>>> Every forum needs a good flamewar now and again :-)
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> NO THEY DON'T. HOW COULD YOU POSSIBLY THINK OF SUCH A RIDICULOUS THING
>>>> ;-)
>>>
>>> YOUR A IDIOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>>>
>>
>> YOU'RE
>> AN
>
> SHUT UP!!!!! YOU HAVE TO CORRECT MY SPELLING BECAUSE YOU KNOW I AM
> RIGHT!!!!!!!

Stupid retard children - grow up, and for fuck's sake RIP OUT THAT CAPS 
LOCK KEY!

Or, better yet, STFU!

Post a reply to this message

On 29/09/14 16:31, clipka wrote:
> 
> Stupid retard children - grow up, and for fuck's sake RIP OUT THAT CAPS
> LOCK KEY!
> 
> Or, better yet, STFU!
> 

[Whole group now rounds on clipka, criticising everything from his
hairstyle to his taste in music]

-- 
Protect the Earth
It was not given to you by your parents
You hold it in trust for your children

Post a reply to this message

On 29/09/2014 16:52, Doctor John wrote:
> On 29/09/14 16:31, clipka wrote:
>>
>> Stupid retard children - grow up, and for fuck's sake RIP OUT THAT CAPS
>> LOCK KEY!
>>
>> Or, better yet, STFU!
>>
>
> [Whole group now rounds on clipka, criticising everything from his
> hairstyle to his taste in music]
>

Who rattled your cage, today?

-- 

Regards
     Stephen

Post a reply to this message

On 29/09/2014 19:27, Stephen wrote:
> On 29/09/2014 16:52, Doctor John wrote:
>> On 29/09/14 16:31, clipka wrote:
>>>
>>> Stupid retard children - grow up, and for fuck's sake RIP OUT THAT CAPS
>>> LOCK KEY!
>>>
>>> Or, better yet, STFU!
>>>
>>
>> [Whole group now rounds on clipka, criticising everything from his
>> hairstyle to his taste in music]
>>
> 
> Who rattled your cage, today?
> 

It's Hug-time. come all and hug together.

Repeat, and again.

-- 
IQ of crossposters with FU: 100 / (number of groups)
IQ of crossposters without FU: 100 / (1 + number of groups)
IQ of multiposters: 100 / ( (number of groups) * (number of groups))

Post a reply to this message

On 29/09/14 18:58, Le_Forgeron wrote:
> 
> It's Hug-time. come all and hug together.
> 
> Repeat, and again.
> 

Aiee! Infinite loop

John
-- 
Protect the Earth
It was not given to you by your parents
You hold it in trust for your children

Post a reply to this message

On 29/09/2014 18:58, Le_Forgeron wrote:
> It's Hug-time. come all and hug together.

Hug his throat, maybe. ;-)

Oh! Dear. I have done it again. Threatened violence.
Bad boy. Off to bed with no super. :-(

-- 

Regards
     Stephen

Post a reply to this message

On 29/09/14 19:38, Stephen wrote:
> Oh! Dear. I have done it again. Threatened violence.
> Bad boy. Off to bed with no super. :-(
> 

... and no supper either :-)
(sorry, couldn't resist it)

John
-- 
Protect the Earth
It was not given to you by your parents
You hold it in trust for your children

Post a reply to this message

On 29/09/2014 19:43, Doctor John wrote:
> On 29/09/14 19:38, Stephen wrote:
>> Oh! Dear. I have done it again. Threatened violence.
>> Bad boy. Off to bed with no super. :-(
>>
>
> .... and no supper either :-)
> (sorry, couldn't resist it)
>
> John
>

No. No supercalifragilisticexpialidocious

-- 

Regards
     Stephen

Post a reply to this message

clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:

> I also think it quite healthy because it includes both reason /and/
> emotion, and my guess is that this is exactly what most of us like best
> about the atmosphere (do you say that in English?) of this newsgroup.

This newsgroup is typical in that disagreement is "allowed" as long as *certain*
assertions are not challenged.

In the US currently, we can calmly argue over /how/ to deal with Isis, but
anyone suggesting we /don’t/ deal with Isis at all is characterized as a
nutcase.

Similarly, in p.o-t we can calmly argue over the specifics of king-for-a-day
Progressivism (a typical older white man’s perspective), but anyone questioning
the king-for-a-day premise itself is quickly, sharply admonished.

Post a reply to this message

Am 30.09.2014 21:45, schrieb Shay:
> clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
>
>> I also think it quite healthy because it includes both reason /and/
>> emotion, and my guess is that this is exactly what most of us like best
>> about the atmosphere (do you say that in English?) of this newsgroup.
>
> This newsgroup is typical in that disagreement is "allowed" as long as *certain*
> assertions are not challenged.
>
> In the US currently, we can calmly argue over /how/ to deal with Isis, but
> anyone suggesting we /don’t/ deal with Isis at all is characterized as a
> nutcase.
>
> Similarly, in p.o-t we can calmly argue over the specifics of king-for-a-day
> Progressivism (a typical older white man’s perspective), but anyone questioning
> the king-for-a-day premise itself is quickly, sharply admonished.

... whatever "king-for-a-day Progressivism" or "the king-for-a-day 
premise" is.

Post a reply to this message

Hi(gh)!

On 28.09.2014 01:15, andrel wrote:

> Often it is about culture and politics. Which makes it even more
> interesting than arguing with your neighbour.
> Although most regulars are (older) man from western countries.

Older? Do you mean "elderly" or just above 40? The latter would be 
easily explainable to me - the heydays of POV-Ray were in the 1990s, 
when also the Internet in its easily accessible GUI incarnation, called 
the World Wide Web emerged... and POV-Ray was one of the achievements 
emerging from the free software culture that had developed during the 
pre-WWW stages of the Internet. So, not so few of the twentysomethings 
who entered the Internet during the early to mid-1990s (and who already 
became familiar with home computers as teenagers in the 1980s) also gave 
POV-Ray a try - while the later generations of users did not have that 
"geek" background anymore, as the Internet soon became as ubiquitous and 
(seemingly!) trivial to use as TV or telephone, and so it may appear 
that such absorbing computer hobbies like raytracing have gone out of 
fashion with younger people on the Internet...

>
> Getting a few asians or africans on board would make things even more
> interesting (or from latin america, but I am not sure if the last one
> was a success). Definitely lacking a female perspective also.

And I also wonder how extremely people from Islamic countries are 
here... I keep track of p.b.i. since 2000, and I remember only 2 (two!) 
active posters (out of currently 1,360!) whose names clearly indicate an 
Islamic background! Which I think is somewhat strange, as the 
traditional abstract, geometrical and mathematical Islamic approach to 
art goes perfectly well with POV-Ray...

See you in Khyberspace!

Yadgar

Post a reply to this message

Hi(gh)!

On 01.10.2014 21:28, clipka wrote:

> ... whatever "king-for-a-day Progressivism" or "the king-for-a-day
> premise" is.

It would be better to have this explained by Shay himself, rather than 
to look it up using Google (it's tempting, but the chance is high to end 
up with a strangely different definition, not to mention lunatic fringe 
rantings on the issue)...

See you in Khyberspace!

Yadgar

Now playing: Desert Dream (Tangerine Dream)

Post a reply to this message

Am 14.10.2014 01:45, schrieb Jörg 'Yadgar' Bleimann:

>> Getting a few asians or africans on board would make things even more
>> interesting (or from latin america, but I am not sure if the last one
>> was a success). Definitely lacking a female perspective also.
>
> And I also wonder how extremely people from Islamic countries are
> here... I keep track of p.b.i. since 2000, and I remember only 2 (two!)
> active posters (out of currently 1,360!) whose names clearly indicate an
> Islamic background! Which I think is somewhat strange, as the
> traditional abstract, geometrical and mathematical Islamic approach to
> art goes perfectly well with POV-Ray...

To be honest, I couldn't care less what background the /name/ of a 
poster indicates, whether Islamic or otherwise.

If the /image/ indicates some particular background, that's an entirely 
different story, as it might be relevant to understand the image.

Post a reply to this message

Am 14.10.2014 01:58, schrieb Jörg 'Yadgar' Bleimann:
> Hi(gh)!
>
> On 01.10.2014 21:28, clipka wrote:
>
>> ... whatever "king-for-a-day Progressivism" or "the king-for-a-day
>> premise" is.
>
> It would be better to have this explained by Shay himself, rather than
> to look it up using Google (it's tempting, but the chance is high to end
> up with a strangely different definition, not to mention lunatic fringe
> rantings on the issue)...

I did indeed google it, but didn't find anything I could remotely make 
sense of in the context of Shay's posting.

Post a reply to this message

On 14-10-2014 5:02, clipka wrote:
> Am 14.10.2014 01:45, schrieb Jörg 'Yadgar' Bleimann:
>
>>> Getting a few asians or africans on board would make things even more
>>> interesting (or from latin america, but I am not sure if the last one
>>> was a success). Definitely lacking a female perspective also.
>>
>> And I also wonder how extremely people from Islamic countries are
>> here... I keep track of p.b.i. since 2000, and I remember only 2 (two!)
>> active posters (out of currently 1,360!) whose names clearly indicate an
>> Islamic background! Which I think is somewhat strange, as the
>> traditional abstract, geometrical and mathematical Islamic approach to
>> art goes perfectly well with POV-Ray...
>
> To be honest, I couldn't care less what background the /name/ of a
> poster indicates, whether Islamic or otherwise.
>
> If the /image/ indicates some particular background, that's an entirely
> different story, as it might be relevant to understand the image.
>

That was the point. By not being cultural and gender diverse enough we 
are missing valuable aesthetic input.

-- 
Everytime the IT department forbids something that a researcher deems
necessary for her work there will be another hole in the firewall.

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On 14-10-2014 10:42, andrel wrote:
> That was the point. By not being cultural and gender diverse enough we
> are missing valuable aesthetic input.
>

Absolutely. However, how to increase diversity? We cannot establish 
quota ;-) People have to come by themselves...

Thomas

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Thomas de Groot <tho### [at] degrootorg> wrote:

> Absolutely. However, how to increase diversity?
.....   People have to come by themselves...
>
> Thomas

"Invite" them.

Post images and/or links on other boards - "raytraced with POV-Ray
(www.povray.org)".

Art - painting, wordles, abstract shapes and blobs and textures, it's endless...

Architecture,

Home furnishings - especially with the popularity of home improvement shows -
(Love it or List it, Property Brothers, Flip Flop, House Hunters....) POV-Ray
has wood, granite, marble, tiling, landscaping plants, animation, etc.

Anatomy and Biology

Math - this is a natural, considering the nature of computer graphics, SDL,
Friederich Lohmueller's site, Mike Williams' Isosurfaces, many others, and the
fact that not one but TWO 2-hour movies (Chaos and Dimensions) exist

Computers graphics

Programming - write a solution - but, "gosh, I only know how to do that in
SDL..."  "I have a file to do that, but it's a .pov, .mcr, .inc ...."

Optics

Lasers

Finite Element Analysis

Civil Engineering - I've seen several people working on city-building macros

Science Fiction

Find some niche or "movement" or fad, and post interest-related images that
would be hard to create otherwise.   "Wow!  How'd you _DO_ that??!!"  "POV-Ray."

Astronomy

Meteorology

Geological surveying

Fluid dynamics

Mechanical engineering
     http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RE04CTpCIdQ
     http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M3QbgwgxSO0

Geography - http://earthview.sourceforge.net/    and lots of other globe-mapping
utilities...

Education

Web Design

Woodworking

Electronics - Eagle 3D, etc     http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cjoLYp_uLSs

Physics

Lighting

Photography

Entertainment

Origami

Chemistry

Fireworks display simulations

Ebay - Buy It Now!  For only $0.00  Click here to download...   :)

YouTube - "Here's how easy it is to do x, y, or z..."

Facebook

Email - put some sort of mention of POV-Ray in your signature file



And there are probably 500 things I haven't thought of.
(Sorry - only on my 1st cup of coffee...)

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On 2014-10-14 09:27, Bald Eagle wrote:
> Post images and/or links on other boards - "raytraced with POV-Ray
> (www.povray.org)".
>
> Math - this is a natural, considering the nature of computer graphics, SDL,
> Friederich Lohmueller's site, Mike Williams' Isosurfaces, many others, and the
> fact that not one but TWO 2-hour movies (Chaos and Dimensions) exist

This one is probably the most-relevant to POV-Ray; people simply wanting 
to 'get into 3D rendering' are far more likely to be drawn to one of the 
big names like 3DS or Maya.

I'm not aware of (though I don't get out much) an equivalent of 
isosurface elsewhere in the world of CGI.

For programming, there are also far more popular languages which have 
direct applicability to real-world skill of being able to claim you are 
fluent in.

 From what I've read[citation needed], POV-Ray is somewhat popular for 
data visualisation for astronomy and such.  Since this specific thread 
is sociopolitical, perhaps generating some nice graphs from crunched 
numbers of related data would be a draw for sociologists?

--
Tim Cook
http://empyrean.sjcook.com

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Hi(gh)!

On 14.10.2014 16:27, Bald Eagle wrote:

> Astronomy
>
> Meteorology
>
> Geological surveying

...not to forget cartography and geography in general!

Did you heard of "Associativity-O-Blast" (German: Assoziations-Blaster), 
www.a-blast.org ? An experimental hypertext project growing continuously 
since 1999. The underlying idea is to write texts ("associations") about 
keywords; each keyword in the text about which other texts already have 
been posted, is linked automatically. But these links work randomly - 
you cannot link to a certain association on a given keyword. You also 
can enter a keyword on the start page of the Assoziations-Blaster, which 
then will display an information page containing the current number of 
associations on the chosen keyword as well a random selection of 
positively evaluated associations.

Each participant in the Assoziations-Blaster (which is perfectly 
anonymous, no registration required!) is assigned some evaluation points 
from time to time, depending on his or her time spent on the 
Assoziations-Blaster and amount of published ("blasted") associations. 
On every association (except his or her own) the participant can place a 
positive or negative evualation, which cumulatively add up to a positive 
or negative total value. The lower this value is, the less frequently 
the association is displayed when clicked on or entered a keyword. 
Associations with a score below a certain threshold (default is -3) are 
not shown at all.

Frequent posters of associations are sooner or later (but still 
random-based to some degree) asked by the software to introduce 
("launch") a new keyword and write a first association - which then also 
is automatically linked in all existing associations.

So, some years ago, I started blasting simple POV-Ray scene scripts in 
the German section (there also is an English one) on keywords 
designating colours or geometrical forms, for example:

Yadgar, Ambassador of POVghanistan schrieb am 4.11. 2009 um 01:26:46 Uhr 
über

Quadrat [meaning "square" in German]

box { -1, 1 texture { pigment { color rgb 1 } finish { ambient 1 } } 
translate z*6}

There should be much more ambassadors of POV-Ray on the Blaster!

See you in Khyberspace!

Yadgar

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