Astronomy is 2012 photographer of the year ... some of the composites 
are really stunning. I particularly like the ones that drive home the 
point that we are just a tiny speck in the scheme of things, kind of 
makes you wonder how long before we finally get over ourselves.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-19637073

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On 20/09/2012 03:28 PM, James Holsenback wrote:
> Astronomy is 2012 photographer of the year ... some of the composites
> are really stunning. I particularly like the ones that drive home the
> point that we are just a tiny speck in the scheme of things, kind of
> makes you wonder how long before we finally get over ourselves.

Every time I look at something like this, I can't help thinking "if only 
the resolution was higher..."

Also: In what part of the world are stars actually visible to the naked 
eye at night?

Post a reply to this message

> Also: In what part of the world are stars actually visible to the naked
> eye at night?

http://www.darkskydiscovery.org.uk/images/darksky01.jpg

Somewhere that's not red :-)

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Orchid Win7 v1 wrote:
>
> Also: In what part of the world are stars actually visible to the naked
> eye at night?

At my yard. You're welcome to come and see.

-Aero

Post a reply to this message

Orchid Win7 v1 <voi### [at] devnull> wrote:
> On 20/09/2012 03:28 PM, James Holsenback wrote:
> > Astronomy is 2012 photographer of the year ... some of the composites
> > are really stunning. I particularly like the ones that drive home the
> > point that we are just a tiny speck in the scheme of things, kind of
> > makes you wonder how long before we finally get over ourselves.
>
> Every time I look at something like this, I can't help thinking "if only
> the resolution was higher..."
>

And you could zoom in.

> Also: In what part of the world are stars actually visible to the naked
> eye at night?

Years ago I was driving in the bush in Australia. Whan I stopped the car at
night and looked up. I almost fell over backwards, the sky was so full of stars.
They looked a solid mass compaired to metropolitan European skys.

Post a reply to this message

Orchid Win7 v1 <voi### [at] devnull> wrote:
> Also: In what part of the world are stars actually visible to the naked 
> eye at night?

What an odd question. Even in the most lit and polluted cities you can see
at least some stars.

I'm assuming you meant to ask "in what part of the world is the milky way
visible to the naked eye at night?"

-- 
                                                          - Warp

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On 20/09/2012 04:44 PM, Warp wrote:
> Orchid Win7 v1<voi### [at] devnull>  wrote:
>> Also: In what part of the world are stars actually visible to the naked
>> eye at night?
>
> What an odd question. Even in the most lit and polluted cities you can see
> at least some stars.

Sure. Two or three isolated points of light. But that's not what these 
photographs show at all.

> I'm assuming you meant to ask "in what part of the world is the milky way
> visible to the naked eye at night?"

I always assumed that "the milky way" was something you could only see 
with a space-based telescope. Certainly I've never seen anything vaguely 
approximating the astonishing images shown here. (Then again, some of 
them probably have a 3-minute exposure or something insane like that, 
which the human eye can't do.)

Post a reply to this message

On 20/09/2012 04:10 PM, scott wrote:
>> Also: In what part of the world are stars actually visible to the naked
>> eye at night?
>
> http://www.darkskydiscovery.org.uk/images/darksky01.jpg
>
> Somewhere that's not red :-)

I think this one better:

http://www.darkskydiscovery.org.uk/images/darksky02.jpg

Seems to suggest that the UK has far more light pollution than anywhere 
else in Europe. So I guess that'll be why then...

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Orchid Win7 v1 <voi### [at] devnull> wrote:
> I always assumed that "the milky way" was something you could only see 
> with a space-based telescope.

When do you think the name was invented?

-- 
                                                          - Warp

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On 20/09/2012 05:32 PM, Warp wrote:
> Orchid Win7 v1<voi### [at] devnull>  wrote:
>> I always assumed that "the milky way" was something you could only see
>> with a space-based telescope.
>
> When do you think the name was invented?

I have no idea - it's not something I've ever devoted a lot of thought to.

Post a reply to this message

"Stephen" <mcavoys_AT_aolDOT.com> wrote:
> Orchid Win7 v1 <voi### [at] devnull> wrote:
> > Also: In what part of the world are stars actually visible to the naked
> > eye at night?
>
> Years ago I was driving in the bush in Australia. Whan I stopped the car at
> night and looked up. I almost fell over backwards, the sky was so full of stars.
> They looked a solid mass compaired to metropolitan European skys.

my exact reaction too.  You look up and you feel like you're in orbit, not on
Earth anymore.  It's that stunning, at least for us city dwellers...

The sky is a blurry foggy mess in urban centers.  You gotta go to the fields to
enjoy it, specially on moonless nights.

Post a reply to this message

Orchid Win7 v1 <voi### [at] devnull> wrote:
> On 20/09/2012 05:32 PM, Warp wrote:
> > Orchid Win7 v1<voi### [at] devnull>  wrote:
> >> I always assumed that "the milky way" was something you could only see
> >> with a space-based telescope.
> >
> > When do you think the name was invented?
>
> I have no idea - it's not something I've ever devoted a lot of thought to.

the old greeks explained that bright white smudge up there by saying it was milk
from the breast of one of the Titans who first created the cosmos.  Thus, milky
way.

Post a reply to this message

On 09/20/2012 11:26 AM, Stephen wrote:
> Orchid Win7 v1 <voi### [at] devnull> wrote:
>> On 20/09/2012 03:28 PM, James Holsenback wrote:
>>> Astronomy is 2012 photographer of the year ... some of the composites
>>> are really stunning. I particularly like the ones that drive home the
>>> point that we are just a tiny speck in the scheme of things, kind of
>>> makes you wonder how long before we finally get over ourselves.
>>
>> Every time I look at something like this, I can't help thinking "if only
>> the resolution was higher..."
>>
>
> And you could zoom in.
>
>> Also: In what part of the world are stars actually visible to the naked
>> eye at night?
>
> Years ago I was driving in the bush in Australia. Whan I stopped the car at
> night and looked up. I almost fell over backwards, the sky was so full of stars.
> They looked a solid mass compaired to metropolitan European skys.
>

yep ... that was one example I know of, also northern canada during the 
winter. in addition to less light pollution, when it's cold fewer 
heatwaves to distort the view

Post a reply to this message

On 09/20/2012 11:59 AM, Orchid Win7 v1 wrote:
> On 20/09/2012 04:44 PM, Warp wrote:
>> Orchid Win7 v1<voi### [at] devnull>  wrote:
>>> Also: In what part of the world are stars actually visible to the naked
>>> eye at night?
>>
>> What an odd question. Even in the most lit and polluted cities you can
>> see
>> at least some stars.
>
> Sure. Two or three isolated points of light. But that's not what these
> photographs show at all.
>
>> I'm assuming you meant to ask "in what part of the world is the milky way
>> visible to the naked eye at night?"
>
> I always assumed that "the milky way" was something you could only see
> with a space-based telescope. Certainly I've never seen anything vaguely
> approximating the astonishing images shown here. (Then again, some of
> them probably have a 3-minute exposure or something insane like that,
> which the human eye can't do.)

I remember my ex-brother-in-law trying to argue that it was just high 
clouds ... give me a break (he'd argue white was black if it suited him) 
... I've seen the milky way naked eye MANY times

Post a reply to this message

Stephen wrote:
>
> Years ago I was driving in the bush in Australia. Whan I stopped the car at
> night and looked up. I almost fell over backwards, the sky was so full of stars.
> They looked a solid mass compaired to metropolitan European skys.
>

There are cities ~15-20 kilometers away from where I live, though they 
aren't visible to this exact location (hence a good view for stars 
here). But when I leave home and head for the motorway (which is 7 
kilomters away), in the halfway there's a nice view on a straight road - 
straigth ahead, where the road goes it's absolute darkness, but on both 
sides you can see the light ramming up from both cities. The view is 
absolutely fascinating, I think I'll have to try to photo it some night.

-Aero

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On 20-9-2012 16:59, Orchid Win7 v1 wrote:
> On 20/09/2012 03:28 PM, James Holsenback wrote:
>> Astronomy is 2012 photographer of the year ... some of the composites
>> are really stunning. I particularly like the ones that drive home the
>> point that we are just a tiny speck in the scheme of things, kind of
>> makes you wonder how long before we finally get over ourselves.
>

> Also: In what part of the world are stars actually visible to the naked
> eye at night?

Until last year I used to tell that I had only seen the milky way 3 or 4 
times in my life and that that was in Amsterdam...

at the planetarium.


-- 
Women are the canaries of science. When they are underrepresented
it is a strong indication that non-scientific factors play a role
and the concentration of incorruptible scientists is also too low

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On Thu, 20 Sep 2012 21:00:41 +0200, andrel wrote:

> Until last year I used to tell that I had only seen the milky way 3 or 4
> times in my life and that that was in Amsterdam...
> 
> at the planetarium.

I remember Neil DeGrasse Tyson saying that he initially learned about the 
stars through the local planetarium where he grew up in New York City, 
and after a few years of having only seen them at the planetarium, he 
went on a stargazing trip with his class to a rural part of PA, and was 
amazed to see that it looked "just like the planetarium".

Jim

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On 20/09/2012 06:59 PM, nemesis wrote:
> The sky is a blurry foggy mess in urban centers.  You gotta go to the fields to
> enjoy it, specially on moonless nights.

One time I drove to a tiny village. Google informs me it's about 7 miles 
outside Milton Keynes. It was a dark October night. I went outside, 
about 11pm. I didn't see more than about 5 stars, but I did see that one 
entire side of the sky was a different colour. I believe they call it 
the "sodium D-line"...

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On 20/09/2012 07:01 PM, nemesis wrote:
> the old greeks explained that bright white smudge up there by saying it was milk
> from the breast of one of the Titans who first created the cosmos.  Thus, milky
> way.

Man, those dudes had way too many magic mushrooms. :-P

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On 20/09/2012 7:41 PM, Eero Ahonen wrote:
> Stephen wrote:
>>
>> Years ago I was driving in the bush in Australia. Whan I stopped the
>> car at
>> night and looked up. I almost fell over backwards, the sky was so full
>> of stars.
>> They looked a solid mass compaired to metropolitan European skys.
>>
>
> There are cities ~15-20 kilometers away from where I live, though they
> aren't visible to this exact location (hence a good view for stars
> here). But when I leave home and head for the motorway (which is 7
> kilomters away), in the halfway there's a nice view on a straight road -
> straigth ahead, where the road goes it's absolute darkness, but on both
> sides you can see the light ramming up from both cities. The view is
> absolutely fascinating, I think I'll have to try to photo it some night.
>
> -Aero

I can imagine and if the photos turn out okay, post them. :-D

-- 
Regards
     Stephen

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On 21/09/2012 10:47 AM, Stephen wrote:
> I can imagine

When I used to work for a living. ;-)
I was on an oil production platform midway between the Shetland islands 
and Norway. For years there was nothing in sight but sea to the horizon. 
At night we could see the glow of other platforms gas flares below the 
horizon illuminating the clouds above with an orange glare.

We were not alone!

-- 
Regards
     Stephen

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On 20/09/2012 7:11 PM, James Holsenback wrote:
> I remember my ex-brother-in-law trying to argue that it was just high
> clouds ... give me a break (he'd argue white was black if it suited him)

Sounds like a "wind up merchant" :-)


> .... I've seen the milky way naked eye MANY times

I've not, I've mostly lived in urban areas.

-- 
Regards
     Stephen

Post a reply to this message

On 20/09/2012 7:05 PM, James Holsenback wrote:
> yep ... that was one example I know of, also northern canada during the
> winter. in addition to less light pollution, when it's cold fewer
> heatwaves to distort the view

I believe that the view from the Southern Hemisphere is better as it has 
a view to the galactic centre.

-- 
Regards
     Stephen

Post a reply to this message

On 20/09/2012 6:59 PM, nemesis wrote:
> my exact reaction too.  You look up and you feel like you're in orbit, not on
> Earth anymore.  It's that stunning, at least for us city dwellers...
>

Yes, I was stunned. The memory will be with me forever.

> The sky is a blurry foggy mess in urban centers.  You gotta go to the fields to
> enjoy it, specially on moonless nights.

If you look at the light pollution maps that Scott and Andrew posted in 
this thread. You will see that in the UK you have to go to the mountains 
to get away from urban lights.


-- 
Regards
     Stephen

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On 21/09/2012 11:04 AM, Stephen wrote:
> If you look at the light pollution maps that Scott and Andrew posted in
> this thread. You will see that in the UK you have to go to the mountains
> to get away from urban lights.

The UK is a small, densely-populated island.

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On 21/09/2012 11:09 AM, Orchid Win7 v1 wrote:
> On 21/09/2012 11:04 AM, Stephen wrote:
>> If you look at the light pollution maps that Scott and Andrew posted in
>> this thread. You will see that in the UK you have to go to the mountains
>> to get away from urban lights.
>
> The UK is a small, densely-populated island.

Well it is also the eight largest island in the world by area and the 
third by population.

http://geography.about.com/od/lists/a/largestislands.htm

-- 
Regards
     Stephen

Post a reply to this message

>> The UK is a small, densely-populated island.
>
> Well it is also the eight largest island in the world by area and the
> third by population.

OK, this bothers me. Since the planet is more than 50% water, surely 
*all* land masses are surrounded by water on all sides, and are 
technically "islands"...

Post a reply to this message

Orchid Win7 v1 <voi### [at] devnull> wrote:
> On 20/09/2012 06:59 PM, nemesis wrote:
> > The sky is a blurry foggy mess in urban centers.  You gotta go to the fields to
> > enjoy it, specially on moonless nights.
>
> One time I drove to a tiny village. Google informs me it's about 7 miles
> outside Milton Keynes. It was a dark October night. I went outside,
> about 11pm. I didn't see more than about 5 stars

wearing your glasses my help. ;)

or perhaps UK has an everlasting fog no doubt

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Stephen <mca### [at] aolcom> wrote:
> On 21/09/2012 11:09 AM, Orchid Win7 v1 wrote:
> > On 21/09/2012 11:04 AM, Stephen wrote:
> >> If you look at the light pollution maps that Scott and Andrew posted in
> >> this thread. You will see that in the UK you have to go to the mountains
> >> to get away from urban lights.
> >
> > The UK is a small, densely-populated island.
>
> Well it is also the eight largest island in the world by area and the
> third by population.
>
> http://geography.about.com/od/lists/a/largestislands.htm

"Source: Wikipedia" LOL

Japan is second.  I guess you guys can forgive not seeing the stars but at least
not being bothered by huge earthquakes, tsunamis and huge rubber monsters.

Post a reply to this message

Orchid Win7 v1 <voi### [at] devnull> wrote:
> On 20/09/2012 07:01 PM, nemesis wrote:
> > the old greeks explained that bright white smudge up there by saying it was milk
> > from the breast of one of the Titans who first created the cosmos.  Thus, milky
> > way.
>
> Man, those dudes had way too many magic mushrooms. :-P

more like Dionysus' wine

magic mushrooms were appetizers for Celts, Gauls and Marius Brothus

Post a reply to this message

On 21/09/2012 3:39 PM, nemesis wrote:
> or perhaps UK has an everlasting fog no doubt

Funnily enough we do have. But some breve people volunteer to gather it 
around themselves so that everyone else can see clearly. ;-)

-- 
Regards
     Stephen

Post a reply to this message

On 21/09/2012 3:53 PM, nemesis wrote:
> "Source: Wikipedia" LOL
>

Good enough for here. :-)

> Japan is second.  I guess you guys can forgive not seeing the stars but at least
> not being bothered by huge earthquakes, tsunamis and huge rubber monsters.

We had an earthquake last year and it rattled some tea cups, I'll have 
you know!

As for the huge rubber monsters, the least said about that the better. :-P

-- 
Regards
     Stephen

Post a reply to this message

Stephen wrote:
>
> I can imagine and if the photos turn out okay, post them. :-D
>

The view is way too wide to get one scene-showing picture, but last 
night as driving through I did take couple shots. The place is this: 
http://goo.gl/maps/DJ4L0 - looking from a map you can see ~600 meters 
forward during the day. I did have to have parking lights on while 
stopping, but I took the pics with manual mode and exactly same 
lightning parameters. Facing forward it's not actually totally black 
either, the motorway's (5 km away via straight line) light flood can be 
seen on the photo, even though it's not easy to realize with plain eyes 
(especially with the car lights on), but you can't see the same 600 
meters forward that you see on the day:
http://aero.1g.fi/kuvat/Misc/Dark_night/_DSC7734.JPG

On the left there's Riihimäki, around 12-13 kilometers away with a 
straight line:
http://aero.1g.fi/kuvat/Misc/Dark_night/_DSC7733.JPG

On the right there's Turenki after 7 kilometers and Hämeenlinna after 
~17 kilometers:
http://aero.1g.fi/kuvat/Misc/Dark_night/_DSC7735.JPG

And as extra, one long-exposure shot of the motorway:
http://aero.1g.fi/kuvat/Misc/Dark_night/_DSC7736.JPG

-Aero

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On 21-9-2012 15:32, Orchid Win7 v1 wrote:
>>> The UK is a small, densely-populated island.
>>
>> Well it is also the eight largest island in the world by area and the
>> third by population.
>
> OK, this bothers me. Since the planet is more than 50% water, surely
> *all* land masses are surrounded by water on all sides, and are
> technically "islands"...
Worse, all water is surrounded by land and are technically lakes.


-- 
Women are the canaries of science. When they are underrepresented
it is a strong indication that non-scientific factors play a role
and the concentration of incorruptible scientists is also too low

Post a reply to this message

>> OK, this bothers me. Since the planet is more than 50% water, surely
>> *all* land masses are surrounded by water on all sides, and are
>> technically "islands"...

> Worse, all water is surrounded by land and are technically lakes.

No. That's my point; because there is [drastically] more than 50% water, 
it is the water that surrounds the land, not the other way around.

Post a reply to this message

On 22/09/2012 9:55 AM, Eero Ahonen wrote:
> The view is way too wide to get one scene-showing picture, but last
> night as driving through I did take couple shots.

Thanks for taking the time. Photographs can seldom do scenery justice 
IMO. But these give a good impression.
Although with the recent set of Scandinavian crime/thriller series 
broadcast on British TV. I would not be parking in remote dark lanes, 
myself. ;-)

One more bit of eye candy I saw when I was in Oz. The Sydney tower is 
illuminated at night and in the right season it attracts millions of 
moths which circle round it like a moth around a light. In turn these 
moths attract bats which feed on them. The effect was a cylinder of 
light rotating 300 metres in the air.


-- 
Regards
     Stephen

Post a reply to this message

Stephen wrote:
>
> Thanks for taking the time. Photographs can seldom do scenery justice
> IMO. But these give a good impression.

Yep. The effect is beautiful - you drive into almost total darkness, but 
can see light shining far away on both sides.

> Although with the recent set of Scandinavian crime/thriller series
> broadcast on British TV. I would not be parking in remote dark lanes,
> myself. ;-)

Hah :D. I guess mostly Swedish? So far I'm under impression that they've 
done more thrillers than other Scandinavian countries.

OTOH, there's nothing scary to park where I parked to take those pics, 
but I still won't leave the car with lights off at there even for a 
moment. There isn't a proper space to park so other drivers has to be 
able to see the car. On my own yard the feeling was much worse, 
something was certainly moving at the corner of my sauna. It wasn't a 
cat, because it didn't care when I stomped - so it was either something 
much smaller or something much bigger... The fact that I couldn't find 
it with a flashlight even though I still heard it makes sure it was 
something smaller - probably either a mouse or a frog. Or it wasn't alone.

> One more bit of eye candy I saw when I was in Oz. The Sydney tower is
> illuminated at night and in the right season it attracts millions of
> moths which circle round it like a moth around a light. In turn these
> moths attract bats which feed on them. The effect was a cylinder of
> light rotating 300 metres in the air.

That does sound absolutely stunning, like a slightly boosted natures own 
parade.

-Aero

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On 9/21/2012 7:53, nemesis wrote:
>  and huge rubber monsters.

They get rubber monsters. They just have a doctor to deal with the situation.

-- 
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
   "They're the 1-800-#-GORILA of the telecom business."

Post a reply to this message

On 22/09/2012 9:02 PM, Eero Ahonen wrote:
> Stephen wrote:
>>
>> Thanks for taking the time. Photographs can seldom do scenery justice
>> IMO. But these give a good impression.
>
> Yep. The effect is beautiful - you drive into almost total darkness, but
> can see light shining far away on both sides.
>

I can imagine it is a little bit distracting, though.

>> Although with the recent set of Scandinavian crime/thriller series
>> broadcast on British TV. I would not be parking in remote dark lanes,
>> myself. ;-)
>
> Hah :D. I guess mostly Swedish? So far I'm under impression that they've
> done more thrillers than other Scandinavian countries.

Yes Swedish and Danish I really liked Borgan.


>> One more bit of eye candy I saw when I was in Oz. The Sydney tower is
>> illuminated at night and in the right season it attracts millions of
>> moths which circle round it like a moth around a light. In turn these
>> moths attract bats which feed on them. The effect was a cylinder of
>> light rotating 300 metres in the air.
>
> That does sound absolutely stunning, like a slightly boosted natures own
> parade.
>

Yes, it lasted for about a week. IIRC



-- 
Regards
     Stephen

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