On Tue, 07 Aug 2012 17:26:43 -0400, Warp wrote:

> Why do so many people lean back when firing?

Inexperience.

Jim

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On 8/7/2012 2:30 PM, Warp wrote:
> clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
>> ... and they're apparently pretty good at it:
>
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8uqD8Ja6IZ0
>
> Some more pro tips:
>
> "There are two types of gun owners. Those who have had their guns
> discharge accidentally, and those who will have their guns discharge
> accidentally."
>
> "Treat a gun as if it's always loaded, especially when it's not."
>
> There are probably thousands and thousand of cases of people shooting
> themselves or others accidentally, sometimes fatally, believing that
> a gun is not loaded (or that the safety is on, or whatever).
>
And, most of them are the same people that imagine that they will be 
able to get to it, load the ammo, and remember to turn off the safety, 
in the short frame of time it takes someone breaking in to their house, 
or the like, to point and fire their *already loaded, safety off, and 
pointed* gun at them.

Having a long discussion on this on a blog today. It has, as usual, 
degenerated into two arguments, one from each side:

Regulation - Less guns tend to produce less deaths, including in the 
homes of the people that own them, and some guns are just bloody stupid 
to have at all.

NRA - But, people have been known to kill other people with paper clips. 
If you have a paper clip, I should have the right to defend myself with 
a bigger paper clip, and if I can have that, why not a knife, or a gun, 
since, if I get a knife, so will you, so I obviously need a gun!

One of them even argued that, without guns, the US would somehow fall 
into 3rd world country territory, and gangs of youths might rampage 
around with machetes (you know the ones given to them by the African 
military, or government...), raiding people's homes, and killing them.

Yeah, well. If we go third world, its going to be due to gun nuts + 
right wingers + 1%ters, or the sort that support the first two, because 
the first thing to go with be the economy, then semi-effective law 
enforcement, and.. oddly, I don't imagine the common citizens being in a 
position to buy a lot of guns, to defend themselves against roving bands 
of government funded teenagers, without money, jobs, or an economy. But, 
when does logic have jack shit to do with the sort of idiots that pass 
laws like we have in Arizona:

1. You must, to buy from a trade show, have ID, no criminal record, etc.
2. As soon as you leave the show, you can change your mind, and give 
away all the weapons you bought to anyone you like, on the street.

The only thing more bloody stupid, imho, is the few states that don't 
even bother with some limited form of #1, or where some other loophole 
is available, which lets people get one easily, without knowing who the 
fuck they are, or how likely they are to use the things.

Apparently, their waiting for a "bigger" body count. See, a few dozen 
people isn't big enough. Someone has to show up, alone, and kill 
thousands, without being stopped, and even then they have to do with 
without a) someone else with a gun intervening, and b) with most of the 
dead people armed. If they are stopped, after only a few hundred people, 
but someone else with a gun, then QED the problem wasn't that 100 people 
died, but that two of those people where not armed.

:head-desk:

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On Tue, 07 Aug 2012 14:59:48 -0700, Patrick Elliott wrote:

> NRA - But, people have been known to kill other people with paper clips.
> If you have a paper clip, I should have the right to defend myself with
> a bigger paper clip, and if I can have that, why not a knife, or a gun,
> since, if I get a knife, so will you, so I obviously need a gun!

"When you can kill 20 people and wound 30 others with a paperclip in 
under 30 seconds, then we might have something to talk about."

Jim

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Am 07.08.2012 22:43, schrieb Stephen:
> On 07/08/2012 9:15 PM, clipka wrote:
>> Another Pro-tip: Don't leave any loaded & armed gun where your toddler
>> can grab it.
>
> Why? ;-)

Well, the guy at 00:20 could tell you... if he could.

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Am 07.08.2012 23:26, schrieb Warp:
> Orchid Win7 v1 <voi### [at] devnull> wrote:
>> Pro-tip: Don't lean backwards while firing a gun.
>
> Why do so many people lean back when firing? They are *begging* to lose
> their balance and hurt themselves.

Because they chose a gun that is too heavy for them to hold otherwise?

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> On 07/08/2012 09:15 PM, clipka wrote:
>> Another Pro-tip: Don't leave any loaded & armed gun where your toddler
>> can grab it.
>
> FUCK YES! o_O
>
> Who the HELL would do that??

Too many people, unfortunately.

some Americans are (rightly or wrongly) so scared of burglars that they 
leave a loaded weapon in their night table.

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Am 07.08.2012 23:30, schrieb Warp:
> clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
>> ... and they're apparently pretty good at it:
>
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8uqD8Ja6IZ0
>
> Some more pro tips:
>
> "There are two types of gun owners. Those who have had their guns
> discharge accidentally, and those who will have their guns discharge
> accidentally."
>
> "Treat a gun as if it's always loaded, especially when it's not."
>
> There are probably thousands and thousand of cases of people shooting
> themselves or others accidentally, sometimes fatally, believing that
> a gun is not loaded (or that the safety is on, or whatever).

Relevant:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IouUsPsUg4Y

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On 07/08/2012 10:26 PM, Warp wrote:
> Orchid Win7 v1<voi### [at] devnull>  wrote:
>> Pro-tip: Don't lean backwards while firing a gun.
>
> Why do so many people lean back when firing? They are *begging* to lose
> their balance and hurt themselves.

"Apprehension" is the only thing I can think of...

When you're nervous about something, you unconsciously do all sorts of 
odd things with your body.

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Patrick Elliott <kag### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
> Regulation - Less guns tend to produce less deaths, including in the 
> homes of the people that own them, and some guns are just bloody stupid 
> to have at all.

It depends a lot on the country. For example in Finland there is a
relatively high amount of legally owned firearms per capita, yet Finland
has a pretty low rate of firearm-related crime and accidents, when compared
to all other countries.

The United States is completely in its own league with this. It's probably
a cultural/upbringing thing.

-- 
                                                          - Warp

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On Wed, 08 Aug 2012 12:10:31 -0400, Warp wrote:

> The United States is completely in its own league with this. It's
> probably a cultural/upbringing thing.

It's entirely cultural.  When the US was nothing more than the British 
colonies, King George III attempted to disarm the populace in order to 
prevent an uprising.

The colonists felt they had the right to defend themselves, and did so - 
and based on the experience of the revolutionary war, decided that it 
should be one of the fundamental rights of citizenship so the government 
couldn't take other rights away at a whim.  The purpose was to provide 
for defense (indeed, that's part of the 2nd amendment to the constitution 
- "a well regulated Militia being necessary to the security of a free 
State [...]"

Jim

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