OK, so I have a problem. The obvious way to solve this problem is to ask 
the Internet, and then act on whatever advice the random strangers there 
offer me. :-)

My problem is simple: I spend almost every waking hour sitting perfectly 
motionless in front of a computer screen. Except that once a week, I 
spend a hour leaping around a dance floor like a crazy thing. And you 
know what? It turns out that I do not have the necessary stamina. 
Socking, I know.

So my question is: How do I increase my stamina?

Let's leave aside the obvious answer of "quit my job and spend every 
waking hour running around a race track until my legs drop off". Clearly 
that isn't happening.

Given that my job necessarily involves remaining absolutely motionless 
for hours on end, and that I only have an hour or two of spare time per 
day, is there *anything* I can do with that time which will make the 
slightest shred of difference? Or is the situation just hopeless?

People say to me "oh, with all that dancing, you must be really fit". I 
cannot help but think that a piffling one hour out of every 168 isn't 
going to make any difference at all. It's like pouring a litre of fresh 
water into the ocean and expecting it to be less salty afterwards. How 
many hours a day do you need to work to actually achieve something?

Now, "fitness" can mean many things. So let us be clear here. It's not 
that I don't have enough /strength/ and I need to grow bigger muscles. 
(As an aside, it seems I have some pretty damned impressive shoulder 
muscles now... Well, for a skinny computer nerd, anyway.) I'm interested 
in /stamina/. So, what kind of exercise am I looking for?

The answer, presumably, is "anything that makes you feel tired". So how 
do I approach this?

- Go flat out until you collapse. Rest until tomorrow.

- Go gently, but for as long as possible.

- Go until you're tired. Stop. Rest until you're not tired. Go again. 
Repeat.

- Go as hard as you can without needing to actually stop.

- Something else?

Any other suggestions?

Post a reply to this message

On 02/02/2012 11:14 AM, Invisible wrote:

> So my question is: How do I increase my stamina?

Hmm, actually... I seem to recall I got some spam about this the other 
day... Something about driving female people insane when they're asleep, 
or something like that... Maybe I should check it out.

Post a reply to this message

Le 2012-02-02 06:14, Invisible a écrit :
> OK, so I have a problem. The obvious way to solve this problem is to ask
> the Internet, and then act on whatever advice the random strangers there
> offer me. :-)
>
> My problem is simple: I spend almost every waking hour sitting perfectly
> motionless in front of a computer screen. Except that once a week, I
> spend a hour leaping around a dance floor like a crazy thing. And you
> know what? It turns out that I do not have the necessary stamina.
> Socking, I know.
>
> So my question is: How do I increase my stamina?
>
> Let's leave aside the obvious answer of "quit my job and spend every
> waking hour running around a race track until my legs drop off". Clearly
> that isn't happening.
>
> Given that my job necessarily involves remaining absolutely motionless
> for hours on end, and that I only have an hour or two of spare time per
> day, is there *anything* I can do with that time which will make the
> slightest shred of difference? Or is the situation just hopeless?
>

Bike to work?
Can you park at the far end of the parking lot and walk to the door?
Take the stairs instead of the elevator?
Go for a walk after dinner?
Go on romantic strolls in the park on the week-end?


> People say to me "oh, with all that dancing, you must be really fit". I
> cannot help but think that a piffling one hour out of every 168 isn't
> going to make any difference at all. It's like pouring a litre of fresh
> water into the ocean and expecting it to be less salty afterwards. How
> many hours a day do you need to work to actually achieve something?
>
> Now, "fitness" can mean many things. So let us be clear here. It's not
> that I don't have enough /strength/ and I need to grow bigger muscles.
> (As an aside, it seems I have some pretty damned impressive shoulder
> muscles now... Well, for a skinny computer nerd, anyway.) I'm interested
> in /stamina/. So, what kind of exercise am I looking for?

Light exercice for long periods of time.  Walking, running, biking, etc...

>
> The answer, presumably, is "anything that makes you feel tired". So how
> do I approach this?
>
> - Go flat out until you collapse. Rest until tomorrow.
>

Never a good idea, unless you are being chased by a pack of wolves or 
training for a ironman triathlon.

> - Go gently, but for as long as possible.
>

Yes, or

> - Go until you're tired. Stop. Rest until you're not tired. Go again.
> Repeat.
>

This.

> - Go as hard as you can without needing to actually stop.
>

Eventually, you'll be able to judge what pace you can keep for an 
extended period of time.  For example, I can walk all day, it's the feet 
that tell me I need to stop and take the shoes off.


-- 
/*Francois Labreque*/#local a=x+y;#local b=x+a;#local c=a+b;#macro P(F//
/*    flabreque    */L)polygon{5,F,F+z,L+z,L,F pigment{rgb 9}}#end union
/*        @        */{P(0,a)P(a,b)P(b,c)P(2*a,2*b)P(2*b,b+c)P(b+c,<2,3>)
/*   gmail.com     */}camera{orthographic location<6,1.25,-6>look_at a }

Post a reply to this message

>> Given that my job necessarily involves remaining absolutely motionless
>> for hours on end, and that I only have an hour or two of spare time per
>> day, is there *anything* I can do with that time which will make the
>> slightest shred of difference? Or is the situation just hopeless?
>
> Bike to work?

1. I spent 2 years cycling to college every day. First time I did the 
trip, I was exhausted. The final time I did the trip... I was still 
exhausted. And it still took the same amount of time. So, no measurable 
increase in fitness.

2. The trip to college was just under 5 miles, and took 1 hour. The trip 
to work is 50 miles, and so would theoretically take 10 hours. As such, 
it would be impossible to make a round trip in a single 24-hour period 
and actually get any work done in between.

3. There are no cycle paths. I would have to cycle along roads. Unlit, 
winding country roads with no curb. Some of which haven't been 
resurfaced in the last 10 years.

> Can you park at the far end of the parking lot and walk to the door?

Oh, I already do that. A lot of people arrive at work for 8am rather than 9.

> Take the stairs instead of the elevator?

I work on the ground floor?

> Go for a walk after dinner?

I often do that too. Not that I imagine it makes any difference.

> Go on romantic strolls in the park on the week-end?

Not sure what would be "romantic" about being hassled by a bunch of 
bored skinheads... The terrified running might boost my fitness perhaps 
though.

>> I'm interested
>> in /stamina/. So, what kind of exercise am I looking for?
>
> Light exercice for long periods of time. Walking, running, biking, etc...

Right, OK.

>> - Go flat out until you collapse. Rest until tomorrow.
>
> Never a good idea, unless you are being chased by a pack of wolves or
> training for a ironman triathlon.

Interesting. Everybody else seems to think this is exactly the way to 
go, and the only way to improve. "No pain, no gain" and all that.

>> - Go gently, but for as long as possible.
>
> Yes, or
>
>> - Go until you're tired. Stop. Rest until you're not tired. Go again.
>> Repeat.
>
> This.

Right, OK.

>> - Go as hard as you can without needing to actually stop.
>
> Eventually, you'll be able to judge what pace you can keep for an
> extended period of time. For example, I can walk all day, it's the feet
> that tell me I need to stop and take the shoes off.

My question was really whether you want to go as hard as possible and 
then rest until you're ready again, or whether you should just back off 
enough to keep going.

Post a reply to this message

On 2/2/2012 6:14 AM, Invisible wrote:
> OK, so I have a problem. The obvious way to solve this problem is to ask
> the Internet, and then act on whatever advice the random strangers there
> offer me. :-)
>
> My problem is simple: I spend almost every waking hour sitting perfectly
> motionless in front of a computer screen. Except that once a week, I
> spend a hour leaping around a dance floor like a crazy thing. And you
> know what? It turns out that I do not have the necessary stamina.
> Socking, I know.
>
> So my question is: How do I increase my stamina?
>
> Let's leave aside the obvious answer of "quit my job and spend every
> waking hour running around a race track until my legs drop off". Clearly
> that isn't happening.
>
> Given that my job necessarily involves remaining absolutely motionless
> for hours on end, and that I only have an hour or two of spare time per
> day, is there *anything* I can do with that time which will make the
> slightest shred of difference? Or is the situation just hopeless?
>
> People say to me "oh, with all that dancing, you must be really fit". I
> cannot help but think that a piffling one hour out of every 168 isn't
> going to make any difference at all. It's like pouring a litre of fresh
> water into the ocean and expecting it to be less salty afterwards. How
> many hours a day do you need to work to actually achieve something?
>
> Now, "fitness" can mean many things. So let us be clear here. It's not
> that I don't have enough /strength/ and I need to grow bigger muscles.
> (As an aside, it seems I have some pretty damned impressive shoulder
> muscles now... Well, for a skinny computer nerd, anyway.) I'm interested
> in /stamina/. So, what kind of exercise am I looking for?
>
> The answer, presumably, is "anything that makes you feel tired". So how
> do I approach this?
>
> - Go flat out until you collapse. Rest until tomorrow.
>
> - Go gently, but for as long as possible.
>
> - Go until you're tired. Stop. Rest until you're not tired. Go again.
> Repeat.
>
> - Go as hard as you can without needing to actually stop.
>
> - Something else?
>
> Any other suggestions?

Try turning your desk into a standing desk - raise the monitors and get 
some boxes for the keyboard/mouse.

Guys at our office really like it.

Post a reply to this message

On 02/02/2012 02:00 PM, Tom Austin wrote:

> Try turning your desk into a standing desk - raise the monitors and get
> some boxes for the keyboard/mouse.
>
> Guys at our office really like it.

+5 insightful

Post a reply to this message

>> Try turning your desk into a standing desk - raise the monitors and get
>> some boxes for the keyboard/mouse.
>>
>> Guys at our office really like it.
>
> +5 insightful

Although, it probably isn't feasible. And I'm not sure /standing/ 
motionless uses any more energy than just sitting motionless...

Post a reply to this message

Invisible <voi### [at] devnull> wrote:
> So my question is: How do I increase my stamina?

This, for example:

http://therunningbug.co.uk/articles/beginners/b/weblog/archive/2011/01/11/start-to-run-with-the-running-bug-beginner-s-
guide.aspx

Post a reply to this message

Invisible <voi### [at] devnull> wrote:
> So my question is: How do I increase my stamina?

  1 hour of cardio each day, 6 days a week.

  "Cardio" means that your heart rate raises, you sweat and you have to
breath slightly more heavily than normally.

  It doesn't really matter how you achieve this, but walking/jogging is
a good way. (The advantage in your case is that it makes your leg muscles
fitter at the same time, which should be a bonus.)

  I recommend a 7-10 km route. Start walking it at a relatively fast pace.
If you are not very fit, don't even try to jog. Just walk. At first you
probably won't make it under 1 hour, but with time you will. Aim for that.

  Not on asphalt! Find a nature trail or similar softer route.

  No slacking off. It doesn't matter if it's raining (just take an umbrella)
or you are feeling lazy. No excuses. (Don't go if you have the flu, though.
That could be even deadly.)

  In about 3 to 5 months you could start trying to jog a bit. Perhaps you'll
find that you can jog all the way. Don't start too early, though. Walk for
the first 3 to 5 months.

  I can assure you that if you follow this for at least 6 months, you'll
be fitter than you have ever been in your life.

-- 
                                                          - Warp

Post a reply to this message

On 2/2/2012 9:12 AM, Invisible wrote:
>>> Try turning your desk into a standing desk - raise the monitors and get
>>> some boxes for the keyboard/mouse.
>>>
>>> Guys at our office really like it.
>>
>> +5 insightful
>
> Although, it probably isn't feasible. And I'm not sure /standing/
> motionless uses any more energy than just sitting motionless...

It is very feasable - I've done it my self.  Some boxes for the poor 
man's version - one guy here used an old computer case for a while.

Do a lookup on standing vs sitting at a desk job.  There are many 
benefits - like reducing the risk of heart attacks, etc...

If you try it, it may feel weird and unnatural at first - give it a 
little time - you are used to sitting.

Post a reply to this message

On Thu, 02 Feb 2012 11:14:02 +0000, Invisible wrote:

> Given that my job necessarily involves remaining absolutely motionless
> for hours on end, and that I only have an hour or two of spare time per
> day, is there *anything* I can do with that time which will make the
> slightest shred of difference? Or is the situation just hopeless?

Are you going to be willing to listen to the answers, or are you just 
going to assert "no, that can't possibly be true" because you don't 
believe it could possibly be true?

Jim

Post a reply to this message

On 2/2/2012 3:14, Invisible wrote:
> So my question is: How do I increase my stamina?

1) Don't sit motionless all day. Get up, move around, go outside to walk 
around the building every hour.

2) Get something like a stairmaster. Set it up in front of the TV. Play 
exciting video games while climbing to keep from going crazy with boredom. 
You'll go from doing 10 minutes without being tired to doing an hour without 
being tired.

3) Go swimming. Buy a book on "Total Immersion" swimming, and learn to swim 
properly. Then swim several times a week until you can do 30 laps without 
stopping.


-- 
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
   People tell me I am the counter-example.

Post a reply to this message

Le 2012/02/02 06:14, Invisible a écrit :
> OK, so I have a problem. The obvious way to solve this problem is to ask
> the Internet, and then act on whatever advice the random strangers there
> offer me. :-)
>
> My problem is simple: I spend almost every waking hour sitting perfectly
> motionless in front of a computer screen. Except that once a week, I
> spend a hour leaping around a dance floor like a crazy thing. And you
> know what? It turns out that I do not have the necessary stamina.
> Socking, I know.
>
> So my question is: How do I increase my stamina?
>
> Let's leave aside the obvious answer of "quit my job and spend every
> waking hour running around a race track until my legs drop off". Clearly
> that isn't happening.
>
> Given that my job necessarily involves remaining absolutely motionless
> for hours on end, and that I only have an hour or two of spare time per
> day, is there *anything* I can do with that time which will make the
> slightest shred of difference? Or is the situation just hopeless?
>
> People say to me "oh, with all that dancing, you must be really fit". I
> cannot help but think that a piffling one hour out of every 168 isn't
> going to make any difference at all. It's like pouring a litre of fresh
> water into the ocean and expecting it to be less salty afterwards. How
> many hours a day do you need to work to actually achieve something?
>
> Now, "fitness" can mean many things. So let us be clear here. It's not
> that I don't have enough /strength/ and I need to grow bigger muscles.
> (As an aside, it seems I have some pretty damned impressive shoulder
> muscles now... Well, for a skinny computer nerd, anyway.) I'm interested
> in /stamina/. So, what kind of exercise am I looking for?
>
> The answer, presumably, is "anything that makes you feel tired". So how
> do I approach this?
>
> - Go flat out until you collapse. Rest until tomorrow.
>
> - Go gently, but for as long as possible.
>
> - Go until you're tired. Stop. Rest until you're not tired. Go again.
> Repeat.
>
> - Go as hard as you can without needing to actually stop.
>
> - Something else?
>
> Any other suggestions?

A dayly 1/2 hour of jogging will greatly help.
Usualy, about 20 to 30 minutes per day of moderate effort will improve 
your stamina.
When going to work, take the stairs and, whenever possible, don't use 
the escalators. Also, refrain from using the elevators when possible, 
like going up or down up to 3 or 4 stories.
Take any occasion to take a walk.
If at all possible, use a bike instead of your car. It's often faster 
using a bike than a car for short intra-city travels, like up to 30 
minutes worth.


Alain

Post a reply to this message

>> Any other suggestions?
>
> Usualy, about 20 to 30 minutes per day of moderate effort will improve
> your stamina.

Right. So moderate exercise for longish duration then?

> When going to work, take the stairs and, whenever possible, don't use
> the escalators. Also, refrain from using the elevators when possible,
> like going up or down up to 3 or 4 stories.

I work on the ground floor anyway. ;-)

> Take any occasion to take a walk.

I do sometimes go for a walk around the site during my lunch break. But 
obviously, not today, because it's -6°C outside.

> If at all possible, use a bike instead of your car. It's often faster
> using a bike than a car for short intra-city travels, like up to 30
> minutes worth.

I would need to *own* a bike for that. ;-) And usually I don't *go* 
anywhere anyway.

Post a reply to this message

On 03/02/2012 03:01 AM, Darren New wrote:
> On 2/2/2012 3:14, Invisible wrote:
>> So my question is: How do I increase my stamina?
>
> 1) Don't sit motionless all day. Get up, move around, go outside to walk
> around the building every hour.

Yeah, I've been trying to do that lately - if only because my legs keep 
going numb.

> 2) Get something like a stairmaster. Set it up in front of the TV. Play
> exciting video games while climbing to keep from going crazy with
> boredom. You'll go from doing 10 minutes without being tired to doing an
> hour without being tired.

I'm not overly keen on spending lots of money unless I really have no 
choice.

What I did do last night was to put some music on and dance on the spot 
while I was waiting for the stuff in the oven to finish cooking. I think 
I'd probably need to sort out a CD containing only music of a suitable 
tempo though, if I'm going for a long continuous workout rather than a 
brief frenzy followed by exhaustion.

> 3) Go swimming. Buy a book on "Total Immersion" swimming, and learn to
> swim properly. Then swim several times a week until you can do 30 laps
> without stopping.

I can't swim.

Or rather, I can't swim more than about 6 feet or so without stopping 
due to exhaustion.

Post a reply to this message

On 02/02/2012 10:14 PM, Jim Henderson wrote:
> On Thu, 02 Feb 2012 11:14:02 +0000, Invisible wrote:
>
>> Given that my job necessarily involves remaining absolutely motionless
>> for hours on end, and that I only have an hour or two of spare time per
>> day, is there *anything* I can do with that time which will make the
>> slightest shred of difference? Or is the situation just hopeless?
>
> Are you going to be willing to listen to the answers, or are you just
> going to assert "no, that can't possibly be true" because you don't
> believe it could possibly be true?

I'm no fitness expert. I'm just asking whether a few hours a week is 
enough to make a difference or not.

Post a reply to this message

On 02/02/2012 04:46 PM, Warp wrote:

>    1 hour of cardio each day, 6 days a week.
>
>    "Cardio" means that your heart rate raises, you sweat and you have to
> breath slightly more heavily than normally.

Right. So if I break out my heart monitor again, measure my resting 
rate, and then find a suitable level of intensity to raise it a little, 
then I just need to figure out how to work an hour into my schedule.

>    It doesn't really matter how you achieve this, but walking/jogging is
> a good way. (The advantage in your case is that it makes your leg muscles
> fitter at the same time, which should be a bonus.)

I find it interesting that all this dancing has had no noticeable effect 
on my legs, but my shoulders and arms are now significantly more muscular...

>    I recommend a 7-10 km route.

At school one time, they took us on a 5 mile walk. It took us over 8 
hours to complete that. (5 miles is, what, 8 km?) I think this might be 
a bit extreme.

I do sometimes take a walk around the site at work in my lunch break. 
One lap, maybe two. That's probably about a quarter of a mile, maybe. 
Then again, I'm not going to do that on a day like today.

> Start walking it at a relatively fast pace.

I always find that makes my shins hurt. (Which is odd, considering that 
there's no muscle there...) Perhaps I'm doing it wrong. Or maybe my 
office shoes just aren't very good for walking in.

>    Not on asphalt! Find a nature trail or similar softer route.

That's /definitely/ not going to walk in my office shoes. ;-)

>    No slacking off. It doesn't matter if it's raining (just take an umbrella)
> or you are feeling lazy. No excuses.

More importantly, I need to work it into my schedule such that 
scheduling issues don't constantly prevent me from doing it.

>    I can assure you that if you follow this for at least 6 months, you'll
> be fitter than you have ever been in your life.

In fairness, me being "fitter than I've ever been in my life" wouldn't 
mean that I'm particularly fit. :-S

Post a reply to this message

Invisible <voi### [at] devnull> wrote:
> > 3) Go swimming. Buy a book on "Total Immersion" swimming, and learn to
> > swim properly. Then swim several times a week until you can do 30 laps
> > without stopping.
>
> I can't swim.
>
> Or rather, I can't swim more than about 6 feet or so without stopping
> due to exhaustion.

Assuming that you *can* swim, but you're just unused to it: do a length, rest.
Do another, rest. Do that for 30-45mins each time you go. Go at least twice a
week. You'll be surprised how quickly you become able to do many lengths without
having to stop. Doesn't matter what stroke you do, or even if you're doing it
efficiently or not.

Of course, swimming is not necessarily convenient if your time is short, and
hardly ever free.

Post a reply to this message

>> I can't swim.
>>
>> Or rather, I can't swim more than about 6 feet or so without stopping
>> due to exhaustion.
>
> Assuming that you *can* swim, but you're just unused to it: do a length, rest.
> Do another, rest. Do that for 30-45mins each time you go. Go at least twice a
> week. You'll be surprised how quickly you become able to do many lengths without
> having to stop. Doesn't matter what stroke you do, or even if you're doing it
> efficiently or not.

Erm... if I can't swim more than a few feet, how am I supposed to do an 
entire length?

> Of course, swimming is not necessarily convenient if your time is short, and
> hardly ever free.

Too true.

(I hear it's quite good non-impact exercise though...)

Post a reply to this message

Invisible <voi### [at] devnull> wrote:
> Erm... if I can't swim more than a few feet, how am I supposed to do an
> entire length?

I assumed you were exaggerating. You'd go further than six feet just by kicking
off from the side!

> (I hear it's quite good non-impact exercise though...)

It's very good. Good cardio, and works many muscle groups at once. Aside from
drowning or being kicked by fellow swimmers, it's also very difficult to injure
oneself :)

Post a reply to this message

On 03/02/2012 11:54 AM, Bill Pragnell wrote:
> Invisible<voi### [at] devnull>  wrote:
>> Erm... if I can't swim more than a few feet, how am I supposed to do an
>> entire length?
>
> I assumed you were exaggerating. You'd go further than six feet just by kicking
> off from the side!

Well, yes, but that isn't exactly "swimming", is it? Take a run up and 
jump in and you can go further still - right before they throw you out. ;-)

>> (I hear it's quite good non-impact exercise though...)
>
> It's very good. Good cardio, and works many muscle groups at once. Aside from
> drowning or being kicked by fellow swimmers, it's also very difficult to injure
> oneself :)

Yeah, aside from the whole "being completely surrounded by an efficient 
asphyxiant", it's really safe. :-P

Post a reply to this message

Invisible <voi### [at] devnull> wrote:
> >    I recommend a 7-10 km route.

> At school one time, they took us on a 5 mile walk. It took us over 8 
> hours to complete that. (5 miles is, what, 8 km?) I think this might be 
> a bit extreme.

  It's not extreme at all. A walking speed of 5 km/h isn't even very fast.
Making 7 km in 1 hour is not only possible even for a slightly less fit
person (at least after a while), it's quite an optimal amount.

  You won't get fit by walking a quarter mile. (Nor if you walk significantly
less than an hour every day, nor if you don't get sweaty and with a raised
heart rate.)

> > Start walking it at a relatively fast pace.

> I always find that makes my shins hurt. (Which is odd, considering that 
> there's no muscle there...) Perhaps I'm doing it wrong.

  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shin_splints

  It can be alleviated with proper shoes and walking on proper terrain.
Other than that, there's no easy solution, but usually it gets better
when you get fitter.

-- 
                                                          - Warp

Post a reply to this message

Darren New <dne### [at] sanrrcom> wrote:
> 3) Go swimming. Buy a book on "Total Immersion" swimming, and learn to swim 
> properly. Then swim several times a week until you can do 30 laps without 
> stopping.

  The proper swimming technique is absolutely crucial.

  If your technique sucks (which it does for most people who haven't been
taught, or taught themselves from a competent source, the proper technique)
you'll lucky if you can swim 25 meters in one go, especially if you are
unfit. With the proper technique, however, even a very unfit person can
swim 2 km in one go with ease. (Personal experience.)

  (The above is true only for warm indoor swimming pools of course. Swimming
in a cold lake requires at least 10 times as much effort even with the
proper technique. It's a real killer.)

  Swimming is an excellent form of exercise, but its downside is that it
does not stress your bones at all. Regular exercise that stresses your bones
is important to prevent many old-age diseases like osteoporosis.

-- 
                                                          - Warp

Post a reply to this message

Invisible <voi### [at] devnull> wrote:
> >> Any other suggestions?
> >
> > Usualy, about 20 to 30 minutes per day of moderate effort will improve
> > your stamina.

> Right. So moderate exercise for longish duration then?

  You are already slacking off, do you see? That "20 to 30" minutes is
immediately sounding a lot more tempting than the 1 hour I suggested.
That's the path to failure, I tell you...

  (I'm not saying 20 minutes a day isn't enough to raise your fitness.
However, in my experience it's not efficient enough if you want relatively
fast and good results.)

-- 
                                                          - Warp

Post a reply to this message

Le 03/02/2012 19:33, Warp nous fit lire :
> Invisible <voi### [at] devnull> wrote:
>>>> Any other suggestions?
>>>
>>> Usualy, about 20 to 30 minutes per day of moderate effort will improve
>>> your stamina.
> 
>> Right. So moderate exercise for longish duration then?
> 
>   You are already slacking off, do you see? That "20 to 30" minutes is
> immediately sounding a lot more tempting than the 1 hour I suggested.
> That's the path to failure, I tell you...
> 
>   (I'm not saying 20 minutes a day isn't enough to raise your fitness.
> However, in my experience it's not efficient enough if you want relatively
> fast and good results.)
> 
The key to exercise is:
rather short daily than long weekly.

3 times 40 minutes per week is better than 3 hours once a week.
(if you want some impact on weight, you need a session of at least 40
minutes, otherwise you are running on free sugar instead of fat)

I know that, but fails to practice it.

PS: you should choose if you want to work on the fast or long lasting
muscles.

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Le_Forgeron <jgr### [at] freefr> wrote:
> The key to exercise is:
> rather short daily than long weekly.

> 3 times 40 minutes per week is better than 3 hours once a week.
> (if you want some impact on weight, you need a session of at least 40
> minutes, otherwise you are running on free sugar instead of fat)

  True, but 3 times a week is not enough if you want to see some real
improvement.

  About 3 times a week is good if you are already very fit, and simply
want to maintain that fitness. However, if what you want is to *get* fit,
it won't be enough. (Or, at the very least, it will be very slow.)

  If you want some serious improvement, it's better to have an hour of
cardiovascular exercise *at least* 5 times a week, preferaby 6. (It's
good to have at least one day of rest per week. If nothing else,
judeo-christianity got at least that right.)

  It's a mistake to exercise too little, too infrequently and/or
improperly (from a cardiovascular perspective; for example walking
too slowly so that you don't sweat, or thinking that leisurely riding
a bike on flat terrain counts as exercise).

  Of course this doesn't mean you have to kill yourself. The exercise
doesn't have to be extremely tiring. A good rule of thumb is if you
sweat, your pulse fastens and you have to slightly breath more heavily,
but you are still able to talk without much effort. (This way you'll be
able to get through the entire hour, which, as said many times, is
important.)

-- 
                                                          - Warp

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On 2/3/2012 1:35, Invisible wrote:
> Or rather, I can't swim more than about 6 feet or so without stopping due to
> exhaustion.

Neither could I, until I learned how. Read the book, try it out, and in 2 
weeks worth of swimming every day, you'll swim several laps without a problem.


-- 
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
   People tell me I am the counter-example.

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>>>     I recommend a 7-10 km route.
>
>> At school one time, they took us on a 5 mile walk. It took us over 8
>> hours to complete that. (5 miles is, what, 8 km?) I think this might be
>> a bit extreme.
>
>    It's not extreme at all. A walking speed of 5 km/h isn't even very fast.
> Making 7 km in 1 hour is not only possible even for a slightly less fit
> person (at least after a while), it's quite an optimal amount.

OK, well I guess there's only one way to find out.

>    You won't get fit by walking a quarter mile.

Well, that seems true enough...

>>> Start walking it at a relatively fast pace.
>
>> I always find that makes my shins hurt. (Which is odd, considering that
>> there's no muscle there...) Perhaps I'm doing it wrong.
>
>    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shin_splints
>
>    It can be alleviated with proper shoes and walking on proper terrain.
> Other than that, there's no easy solution, but usually it gets better
> when you get fitter.

OK.

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On 03/02/2012 20:07, Warp wrote:
> Le_Forgeron<jgr### [at] freefr>  wrote:
>> The key to exercise is:
>> rather short daily than long weekly.

>    True, but 3 times a week is not enough if you want to see some real
> improvement.

>    If you want some serious improvement, it's better to have an hour of
> cardiovascular exercise *at least* 5 times a week, preferaby 6. (It's
> good to have at least one day of rest per week. If nothing else,
> judeo-christianity got at least that right.)

>    Of course this doesn't mean you have to kill yourself. The exercise
> doesn't have to be extremely tiring. A good rule of thumb is if you
> sweat, your pulse fastens and you have to slightly breath more heavily,
> but you are still able to talk without much effort. (This way you'll be
> able to get through the entire hour, which, as said many times, is
> important.)

This gets to the nub of what I'm talking about: Whether it's better to 
have a short high-intensity burst, or a long lower-intensity slog. How 
hard exactly do you need to push? How long do you keep going before 
enough is enough? When do you rest, and when do you keep going?

I don't want to be so cripled that I can't walk for a week - but on the 
other hand, I do want to achieve some kind of progress.

My dance partner seems to think the answer is just to dance as hard as 
possible, for as long as possible, with as little rest as possible. She 
says to dance until you can't take any more, rest, and then start again 
before you've completely recovered. "It's all about recovery time."

Then I discovered that Stack Overflow has a sister site that deals with 
fitness. I asked those guys, and WOAH... They're talking abou complex 
programs and exercise plans and building up to being able to lift 1.5 
your own body weight and doing sprint exercises and... I think perhaps 
these people don't realise that some people's lives don't recolve 
/entirely/ around fitness. :-P

That said, the picture I seem to be getting is that if I can just spend 
more time per day in motion, hard enough to actually get my heart rate 
up, and keep it there for as long as possible, that ought to do it. The 
key now is to adjust my schedule so that I actually /do/ this for more 
than three days...

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On 2/3/2012 1:58, Invisible wrote:
> I always find that makes my shins hurt. (Which is odd, considering that
> there's no muscle there...) Perhaps I'm doing it wrong. Or maybe my office
> shoes just aren't very good for walking in.

Don't walk in office shoes. Buy a pair of walking shoes.

Also, you probably have flat feet.

-- 
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
   People tell me I am the counter-example.

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On 05/02/2012 00:26, Darren New wrote:
> On 2/3/2012 1:58, Invisible wrote:
>> I always find that makes my shins hurt. (Which is odd, considering that
>> there's no muscle there...) Perhaps I'm doing it wrong. Or maybe my
>> office shoes just aren't very good for walking in.
>
> Don't walk in office shoes. Buy a pair of walking shoes.

OK. So what does one look for in walking shoes?

> Also, you probably have flat feet.

No, I *do* have flat feet. This is a fact.

My sister has flat feet too. As I recall, when she was a teenager, she 
did dancing, she was captin of the school netball team, she did hockey, 
she did everything. Her feet often hurt because they were so flat. She 
asked the doctor what she could do, he said "try doing exercise". Yeah, 
big help there. :-P

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Orchid Win7 v1 <voi### [at] devnull> wrote:
> This gets to the nub of what I'm talking about: Whether it's better to 
> have a short high-intensity burst, or a long lower-intensity slog.

  1 hour/day.

> That said, the picture I seem to be getting is that if I can just spend 
> more time per day in motion, hard enough to actually get my heart rate 
> up, and keep it there for as long as possible, that ought to do it. The 
> key now is to adjust my schedule so that I actually /do/ this for more 
> than three days...

  You don't want to execrise while doing other things, such as going to
work or to the grocery store. You should *dedicate* the hour to the cardio.

  (In theory you *could* do the cardio by walking to work. However, it's
unlikely that your situation would permit that. As said, you would have
to walk for an hour, on a softer terrain (not asphalt), and after that
you'll need a shower and clearn clothes.)

-- 
                                                          - Warp

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On 2/5/2012 3:36, Orchid Win7 v1 wrote:
>> Don't walk in office shoes. Buy a pair of walking shoes.
> OK. So what does one look for in walking shoes?

Go to a store that sells waking shoes, and ask them what you should buy for 
walking with flat feet.

> doctor what she could do, he said "try doing exercise". Yeah, big help
> there. :-P

My problems were cured simply by getting inserts for my shoes that conformed 
them to the shape of my feet. You can probably get cheap ones for just $10 
or so to see if it helps at all.

-- 
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
   People tell me I am the counter-example.

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On Fri, 03 Feb 2012 09:38:10 +0000, Invisible wrote:

> On 02/02/2012 10:14 PM, Jim Henderson wrote:
>> On Thu, 02 Feb 2012 11:14:02 +0000, Invisible wrote:
>>
>>> Given that my job necessarily involves remaining absolutely motionless
>>> for hours on end, and that I only have an hour or two of spare time
>>> per day, is there *anything* I can do with that time which will make
>>> the slightest shred of difference? Or is the situation just hopeless?
>>
>> Are you going to be willing to listen to the answers, or are you just
>> going to assert "no, that can't possibly be true" because you don't
>> believe it could possibly be true?
> 
> I'm no fitness expert. I'm just asking whether a few hours a week is
> enough to make a difference or not.

In my experience, it is.  You may recall that I went to the gym for a 
couple years and worked out on a treadmill and a stationary bike.

20 minutes of solid cardio every day is enough to improve things, but you 
have to get your heart rate up to a good rate - for me, the ideal zone at 
the time was in the 140-145 bpm range.  Sustaining that for 20-30 minutes 
to start with is a good place to start at (or was for me, it does vary 
from individual to individual).  I had been up to an hour.

It also is more effective if you change the workout up regularly.  Not 
*too* frequently, or your body gets used to the change.  I had been 
alternating daily between the bike and treadmill, and my trainer said 
that was changing things up too frequently.  Changing once a week was his 
recommendation.

Jim

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Invisible <voi### [at] devnull> wrote:
>
> The answer, presumably, is "anything that makes you feel tired". So how
> do I approach this?
>
> - Go flat out until you collapse. Rest until tomorrow.

Almost. Search Tabata. Takes four minutes. Try jump rope or star jumps. Work up
to Hindu squats.

>
> - Go gently, but for as long as possible.

Won't help your VO2 max (much), but will teach you to breath. People often go
from "can't make it around the block" to "running a marathon" in a few months.

>
> - Go until you're tired. Stop. Rest until you're not tired. Go again.
> Repeat.

Probably not optimal, but definitely helpful. Play some piano, take a lap, check
out p.o-t, take a lap, etcetera.

>
> - Go as hard as you can without needing to actually stop.

Combine this with the previous option.

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On 2/2/2012 6:14 AM, Invisible wrote:
> OK, so I have a problem. The obvious way to solve this problem is to ask
> the Internet, and then act on whatever advice the random strangers there
> offer me. :-)
>
> My problem is simple: I spend almost every waking hour sitting perfectly
> motionless in front of a computer screen. Except that once a week, I
> spend a hour leaping around a dance floor like a crazy thing. And you
> know what? It turns out that I do not have the necessary stamina.
> Socking, I know.
>
> So my question is: How do I increase my stamina?

Pick another two days a week.  Do not pick the day before or the day 
after dance day for either day, and make sure there two days are not 
consecutive.

On each day, one hour before your regular bedtime, find some stairs near 
your residence.  Go up and down these stairs for twenty to thirty minutes.

After the stair climbing, shower and go to bed.

That is all.

Regards,
John

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