I bought an Amazon Kindle. It's very nice. Feel free to ask me about it if 
you care. :-)

-- 
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
    Quoth the raven:
        Need S'Mores!

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On Mon, 23 Aug 2010 11:51:04 -0700, Darren New wrote:

> I bought an Amazon Kindle. It's very nice. Feel free to ask me about it
> if you care. :-)

My wife and I both bought the B&N Nook (so we each have one).  Really 
like it, prefer it to the little time I've spent looking at a Kindle.

The thing that would be *really* nice, though is to be able to run the 
Kindle Android app on the Nook (as the Nook runs on Android).  Best of 
both worlds, then.  Unfortunately, the version of the Android SDK used in 
the Nook isn't up to what the Kindle app requires.

Jim

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Darren New wrote:
> I bought an Amazon Kindle. It's very nice. Feel free to ask me about it 
> if you care. :-)
> 

How well does it handle PDFs?  Particularly PDFs with pictures, graphs, 
equations and such?  Also how easy/hard is it to download a PDF from the 
web and transfer it to the Kindle?

Post a reply to this message

Darren New <dne### [at] sanrrcom> wrote:
> I bought an Amazon Kindle. It's very nice. Feel free to ask me about it if
> you care. :-)

does it run Crysis while you listen to the Fifth Symphony by Beethoven?

Post a reply to this message

On Mon, 23 Aug 2010 12:38:14 -0700, Kevin Wampler wrote:

> Darren New wrote:
>> I bought an Amazon Kindle. It's very nice. Feel free to ask me about it
>> if you care. :-)
>> 
>> 
> How well does it handle PDFs?  Particularly PDFs with pictures, graphs,
> equations and such?  Also how easy/hard is it to download a PDF from the
> web and transfer it to the Kindle?

For the Nook, it handles them fairly well - I have loaded a couple PDFs 
of Linux Format on it and it renders fairly well for full-page views, and 
then reflows the text if you enlarge the font in order to actually be 
able to read it.

I have run into a problem with some content-protected PDFs, but I'm not 
yet sure why - I think the one I tried was just print restricted (Nook 
doesn't have text-to-speech capabilities, which print restrictions can 
interfere with I've heard) but it wouldn't open it properly.

Jim

Post a reply to this message

Kevin Wampler wrote:
> How well does it handle PDFs?  Particularly PDFs with pictures, graphs, 
> equations and such? 

It seems to do just fine. The native format is apparently something like 
HTML inside (the same as "mobi" format). However, there's also a PDF 
interpreter that will draw PDFs exactly as presented (as far as I can tell). 
Of course, modulo color. It's grayscale.

Now, the PDF is going to either fit the screen, or be some multiple 
(including 100%) of the PDF with you having to awkwardly cursor around. But 
it'll display OK.  I scanned some travel book pages as a PDF and got maps 
and stuff for when I was in Cologne last week.

If you want to send me a sample PDF to look at, I'm happy to do that.

I haven't tried any really complex PDFs, but I did do a couple of brochures 
from the people I was meeting with, so it handles powerpoint-level 
complexity just fine.


> Also how easy/hard is it to download a PDF from the 
> web and transfer it to the Kindle?

Trivial. If you want the actual PDF, then plug in the Kindle as a USB drive 
and copy it to K:\Documents.

If you want to convert a PDF into text (because, say, the PDF is mostly 
text), then you email it to your Kindle's email address with "convert" in 
the subject line, and amazon either charges you $0.15 to wirelessly zoop it 
to your kindle, or amazon emails you a link to a .AMZ file which you can 
click on and then copy into K:\Documents for free.  There's a limit of 25 
files at once (which you can zip up or attach separately) *per request*, but 
you can bop off several requests and then download all the results.

-- 
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
    Quoth the raven:
        Need S'Mores!

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nemesis wrote:
> does it run Crysis while you listen to the Fifth Symphony by Beethoven?

It actually seems to be an amazingly slow CPU. But then, the battery goes 
for a week or two.

But it'll play background music while you read, if you like.

-- 
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
    Quoth the raven:
        Need S'Mores!

Post a reply to this message

On 23-8-2010 22:57, Darren New wrote:
> nemesis wrote:
>> does it run Crysis while you listen to the Fifth Symphony by Beethoven?
> 
> It actually seems to be an amazingly slow CPU. But then, the battery 
> goes for a week or two.
> 
> But it'll play background music while you read, if you like.

So you can have books with sound effects, neat.

<very quit, with a little noise of a trolley outside the room. Some 
birdsong outside the window>
It was starting to end, after what seemed most of eternity to me.
   I attempted to wriggle my toes, succeeded. I was sprawled there in a 
hospital bed and my legs were done up in plaster casts, but they were 
still mine.

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On 23/08/2010 9:56 PM, Darren New wrote:
> If you want to convert a PDF into text (because, say, the PDF is mostly
> text), then you email it to your Kindle's email address with "convert"
> in the subject line, and amazon either charges you $0.15 to wirelessly
> zoop it to your kindle, or amazon emails you a link to a .AMZ file which
> you can click on and then copy into K:\Documents for free.  There's a
> limit of 25 files at once (which you can zip up or attach separately)
> *per request*, but you can bop off several requests and then download
> all the results.

Just a quick post in case you don't know about calibre
http://calibre-ebook.com/
It is free and converts all sorts of document types to lots of ebook 
formats. I've got a Sony PRS-600 and my wife (the Luddite) has one too.


-- 

Best Regards,
	Stephen

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Stephen wrote:
> Just a quick post in case you don't know about calibre
> http://calibre-ebook.com/
> It is free and converts all sorts of document types to lots of ebook 
> formats. I've got a Sony PRS-600 and my wife (the Luddite) has one too.

Thanks!  I knew about this, but I'm not sure I realized it's free.  This 
will be helpful if it can convert PDFs to AMZ.

-- 
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
    Quoth the raven:
        Need S'Mores!

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andrel wrote:
> So you can have books with sound effects, neat.

Well, the hardware is there, yes. I don't think you can embed audio in books 
yet. It's more like a really super primitive MP3 player built in. It's under 
the "experimental" menu, along with a web browser that's good enough to do 
mobile gmail, yahoo mail, and browse a few sites they have built-in 
bookmarks for like wikipedia and the weather channel and stuff like that.

-- 
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
    Quoth the raven:
        Need S'Mores!

Post a reply to this message

>> So you can have books with sound effects, neat.

Oh, and it does audio books, of course. No idea what the battery is like for 
that.

-- 
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
    Quoth the raven:
        Need S'Mores!

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On Mon, 23 Aug 2010 22:30:24 +0100, Stephen wrote:

> On 23/08/2010 9:56 PM, Darren New wrote:
>> If you want to convert a PDF into text (because, say, the PDF is mostly
>> text), then you email it to your Kindle's email address with "convert"
>> in the subject line, and amazon either charges you $0.15 to wirelessly
>> zoop it to your kindle, or amazon emails you a link to a .AMZ file
>> which you can click on and then copy into K:\Documents for free. 
>> There's a limit of 25 files at once (which you can zip up or attach
>> separately) *per request*, but you can bop off several requests and
>> then download all the results.
> 
> Just a quick post in case you don't know about calibre
> http://calibre-ebook.com/
> It is free and converts all sorts of document types to lots of ebook
> formats. I've got a Sony PRS-600 and my wife (the Luddite) has one too.

Yep, we use that software quite a bit here.  :-)

Jim

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On Mon, 23 Aug 2010 15:15:21 -0700, Darren New wrote:

> andrel wrote:
>> So you can have books with sound effects, neat.
> 
> Well, the hardware is there, yes. I don't think you can embed audio in
> books yet. It's more like a really super primitive MP3 player built in.
> It's under the "experimental" menu, along with a web browser that's good
> enough to do mobile gmail, yahoo mail, and browse a few sites they have
> built-in bookmarks for like wikipedia and the weather channel and stuff
> like that.

The "Readability" software that Kindle uses (also usable on the Nook) is 
quite good much of the time, too.

MP3 player standard on ours.  :-)

Jim

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On 24/08/2010 4:51 AM, Jim Henderson wrote:
>> Just a quick post in case you don't know about calibre
>> >  http://calibre-ebook.com/
>> >  It is free and converts all sorts of document types to lots of ebook
>> >  formats. I've got a Sony PRS-600 and my wife (the Luddite) has one too.
> Yep, we use that software quite a bit here.:-)
>

The developer seems to upgrade it a lot. The last upgrade is suposed to 
have better support for different libraries for different users. Which 
will be handy as my wife reads entirely different books from me.

-- 

Best Regards,
	Stephen

Post a reply to this message

On Tue, 24 Aug 2010 08:59:31 +0100, Stephen wrote:

> On 24/08/2010 4:51 AM, Jim Henderson wrote:
>>> Just a quick post in case you don't know about calibre
>>> >  http://calibre-ebook.com/
>>> >  It is free and converts all sorts of document types to lots of
>>> >  ebook formats. I've got a Sony PRS-600 and my wife (the Luddite)
>>> >  has one too.
>> Yep, we use that software quite a bit here.:-)
>>
>>
> The developer seems to upgrade it a lot. The last upgrade is suposed to
> have better support for different libraries for different users. Which
> will be handy as my wife reads entirely different books from me.

That's interesting - on Linux, that isn't generally a problem (esp. since 
my wife and I use different computers). :-)

Jim

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On 24/08/2010 5:10 PM, Jim Henderson wrote:
>> The developer seems to upgrade it a lot. The last upgrade is suposed to
>> >  have better support for different libraries for different users. Which
>> >  will be handy as my wife reads entirely different books from me.
> That's interesting - on Linux, that isn't generally a problem (esp. since
> my wife and I use different computers).:-)
>

Different computers would help. But I do all the work and rich get all 
the pleasure. ;-)

-- 

Best Regards,
	Stephen

Post a reply to this message

Darren New wrote:
> Kevin Wampler wrote:
>> How well does it handle PDFs?  Particularly PDFs with pictures, 
>> graphs, equations and such? 
> 
> It seems to do just fine. The native format is apparently something like 
> HTML inside (the same as "mobi" format). However, there's also a PDF 
> interpreter that will draw PDFs exactly as presented (as far as I can 
> tell). Of course, modulo color. It's grayscale.
> 

Thanks!  Both this and Jim's replies have been very useful.  I imagine 
I'll end up getting a e-reader at some point, although probably not for 
a little while yet as I've already spent a bit more than I wanted this 
summer.

Post a reply to this message

Stephen wrote:
> have better support for different libraries for different users. Which 

It boggles my mind that people don't find it easier to do it right than 
wrong. I guess it can get confusing if you only want *one* copy of the book 
even if it's in multiple libraries.

And, heck, it's free software, so who am I to complain? :-)

-- 
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
    Quoth the raven:
        Need S'Mores!

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Kevin Wampler wrote:
> Thanks!  Both this and Jim's replies have been very useful. 

As I say, send me a complex PDF and I'll take a photo of the screen so you 
can see how it looks.

The other thing about the Kindle is if you don't like it, send it back and 
they give you your money back.  Really, it's the only way they could 
reasonably sell such a product.

-- 
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
    Quoth the raven:
        Need S'Mores!

Post a reply to this message

On 24-8-2010 0:15, Darren New wrote:
> andrel wrote:
>> So you can have books with sound effects, neat.
> 
> Well, the hardware is there, yes. I don't think you can embed audio in 
> books yet. It's more like a really super primitive MP3 player built in. 

I guessed so (not having one of these myself or in the family), but 
don't you think it would be a nice addition? You'll have to estimate how 
fast a person reads however to play it at the right time. (or have eye 
tracking).

Post a reply to this message

On Tue, 24 Aug 2010 17:33:29 +0100, Stephen wrote:

> On 24/08/2010 5:10 PM, Jim Henderson wrote:
>>> The developer seems to upgrade it a lot. The last upgrade is suposed
>>> to
>>> >  have better support for different libraries for different users.
>>> >  Which will be handy as my wife reads entirely different books from
>>> >  me.
>> That's interesting - on Linux, that isn't generally a problem (esp.
>> since my wife and I use different computers).:-)
>>
>>
> Different computers would help. But I do all the work and rich get all
> the pleasure. ;-)

Ah, I wish I was rich. ;-)

Jim

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andrel wrote:
> don't you think it would be a nice addition? 

Certainly. And audiobooks make sense. If you're having the kindle read out 
loud, it'll turn the pages as the voice crosses the border. I imagine the 
same could be done for sound effects, if you're reading it out loud or 
playing an audiobook for which there's embedded text or however such things 
work.  Having it know what you're looking at is definitely not in the cards 
any time soon, methinks.

-- 
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
    Quoth the raven:
        Need S'Mores!

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Darren New wrote:
> Kevin Wampler wrote:
>> Thanks!  Both this and Jim's replies have been very useful. 
> 
> As I say, send me a complex PDF and I'll take a photo of the screen so 
> you can see how it looks.
> 

One other quick question.  It looks like you have a Kindle DX, which 
seems to be significantly more expensive than the Kindle version with 
smaller display sizes.  What's your impression of how much of a 
difference the larger display makes?

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Kevin Wampler wrote:
> What's your impression of how much of a 
> difference the larger display makes?

Hard to say. I've never really used the small one for any length of time.

You can't put either in your pocket very conveniently. The DX isn't big 
enough to make it hard to pack or anything.

The DX screen is just about the same size as a iPad screen (altho B&W 
obviously). It's the same size as a US letter-sized paper (i.e., the USA 
equivalent of A4) folded in half.

The small one's screen is about as as big as a paperback novel. Of course, 
both have edges, keyboards, etc.

Or, to put it another way, the small one including the frame is a touch 
smaller than the big one's screen. So if you go in a B&N and see a nook, you 
can estimate that the reading surface on the big kindle is about as big as 
the entire nook.

I'm getting old enough I was worried about using the small screen and not 
having enough text at once at the point size I can handle without glasses 
for a long time, plus I'm old enough that the price difference wasn't a 
major factor in my decision. But that doesn't actually seem to be a problem. 
I don't need to bump the text size up to read indefinitely without strain. 
(Maybe I just get strained after looking at a computer all day or something.)

It's definitely helpful when looking at full-sized PDFs, as they don't 
really lose much size compared to if the screen was half as big. (You can 
zoom and scroll PDFs, but it's a little annoying to not see an entire page 
at once, and the processor is slow enough that it's several seconds to 
scroll a complex PDF.)

-- 
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
    Quoth the raven:
        Need S'Mores!

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Darren New <dne### [at] sanrrcom> writes:

> I bought an Amazon Kindle. It's very nice. Feel free to ask me about it
> if you care. :-)

Why?

Honest question. The things preventing me from buying one are worry
over how long I can keep any books I buy, and because I've shifted to
libraries anyway.

Post a reply to this message

On Tue, 24 Aug 2010 21:11:52 -0700, Neeum Zawan wrote:

> Darren New <dne### [at] sanrrcom> writes:
> 
>> I bought an Amazon Kindle. It's very nice. Feel free to ask me about it
>> if you care. :-)
> 
> Why?
> 
> Honest question. The things preventing me from buying one are worry over
> how long I can keep any books I buy, and because I've shifted to
> libraries anyway.

Well, that's the reason I didn't get a Kindle, honestly - with the whole 
fiasco Amazon had over 1984, I prefer something where I can back up my 
books manually (which I can do with the Nook).

Jim

Post a reply to this message

On 24/08/2010 8:32 PM, Jim Henderson wrote:
> Ah, I wish I was rich.;-)
>

Would it help if I called you Rich(ard) ;-)

-- 

Best Regards,
	Stephen

Post a reply to this message

On 24/08/2010 6:46 PM, Darren New wrote:
> Stephen wrote:
>> have better support for different libraries for different users. Which
>
> It boggles my mind that people don't find it easier to do it right than
> wrong. I guess it can get confusing if you only want *one* copy of the
> book even if it's in multiple libraries.
>

That is the way I would like it,too. But not all of these developers are 
professionals with decades of experience.

> And, heck, it's free software, so who am I to complain? :-)
>

Too true. :-D

-- 

Best Regards,
	Stephen

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On 25/08/2010 5:20 AM, Jim Henderson wrote:
> Well, that's the reason I didn't get a Kindle, honestly - with the whole
> fiasco Amazon had over 1984, I prefer something where I can back up my
> books manually (which I can do with the Nook).
>

The same with the Sony.

-- 

Best Regards,
	Stephen

Post a reply to this message

> I bought an Amazon Kindle. It's very nice. Feel free to ask me about it if 
> you care. :-)

I find two things most important with these kind of gagdets:

1) How responsive is the UI?  There's no excuse nowadays for the GUI not to 
change instantly when you press buttons.

2) How comfortable is the screen to read from?  What's the resolution and 
does it work under all lighting conditions (direct sunlight, office, dark 
room etc).

Post a reply to this message

On 25/08/2010 11:33 AM, scott wrote:
>> I bought an Amazon Kindle. It's very nice. Feel free to ask me about
>> it if you care. :-)
>
> I find two things most important with these kind of gagdets:
>
> 1) How responsive is the UI? There's no excuse nowadays for the GUI not
> to change instantly when you press buttons.
>

There is a reason. The Electronic papers used have a very low refresh 
rate and ghosting can occur. My Sony flashes black then white to 
overcome this, slowing page turning down even further. Having said that 
I find it acceptable.

> 2) How comfortable is the screen to read from? What's the resolution and
> does it work under all lighting conditions (direct sunlight, office,
> dark room etc).
>
>
Mine has a resolution of 600 x 800 pixels on a 6” screen, 8-levels gray 
scale, fits in a jacket pocket and although a bit reflective can easily 
be read under artificial light or bright sunlight.

-- 

Best Regards,
	Stephen

Post a reply to this message

>> 1) How responsive is the UI? There's no excuse nowadays for the GUI not
>> to change instantly when you press buttons.
>
> There is a reason. The Electronic papers used have a very low refresh rate 
> and ghosting can occur. My Sony flashes black then white to overcome this, 
> slowing page turning down even further. Having said that I find it 
> acceptable.

I meant more that when you press a button, there should be some instant 
feedback that you actually pressed it (I understand due to the low power 
screen technology used the refresh rate is going to be slow, but there are 
ways around that like you mentioned with the black/white flash).  There's 
nothing worse than pressing a button, apparently nothing is happening so you 
press it again, only to find the system registered two presses of the button 
and you need to go back.

> Mine has a resolution of 600 x 800 pixels on a 6” screen, 8-levels gray 
> scale, fits in a jacket pocket and although a bit reflective can easily be 
> read under artificial light or bright sunlight.

What about low light conditions?  Is it comfortable to read in the dark with 
just a bed-side lamp or similar?  I'm guessing it doesn't have any lighting 
of its own to keep battery usage down?

Post a reply to this message

On 25/08/2010 1:55 PM, scott wrote:
>
> I meant more that when you press a button, there should be some instant
> feedback that you actually pressed it (I understand due to the low power
> screen technology used the refresh rate is going to be slow, but there
> are ways around that like you mentioned with the black/white flash).
> There's nothing worse than pressing a button, apparently nothing is
> happening so you press it again, only to find the system registered two
> presses of the button and you need to go back.
>

With mine there is the tactical feedback of pressing a button but 
swiping the touch screen is less obvious that the command has been 
recognised.

>> Mine has a resolution of 600 x 800 pixels on a 6” screen, 8-levels
>> gray scale, fits in a jacket pocket and although a bit reflective can
>> easily be read under artificial light or bright sunlight.
>
> What about low light conditions?  Is it comfortable to read in the dark
> with just a bed-side lamp or similar?  I'm guessing it doesn't have any
> lighting of its own to keep battery usage down?
>

When using a bedside lamp I increase the font size to Medium as Small is 
too hard for me to read. But then my eyes are not as young as they used 
to be.

I would recommend e-readers to anyone who can afford them. My wife who 
has a penchant for 19th century authors now has an almost unlimited 
supply of free books. A good site, besides Project Guttenberg is 
http://www.archive.org/details/texts


-- 

Best Regards,
	Stephen

Post a reply to this message

Neeum Zawan wrote:
> Why?

For one, it's easy to travel.

> Honest question. The things preventing me from buying one are worry
> over how long I can keep any books I buy, and because I've shifted to
> libraries anyway. 

That bothered me for a while also. Then I realized I have large stacks of 
books that I've read once and will likely never read again. As well as other 
stacks of technical books that will be obsolete long before I run out of 
space on the kindle. As well as bunches of free books in electronic form 
that would be quite annoying to read on a computer screen.

Any book I want to read again in 15 years I'll buy again, or buy in 
paperback in the first place, assuming I didn't find it online for free 
somewhere without the DRM.

I might have bought a Nook if it had the bigger screen; the fact that it's 
android (and hence likely going to have a jailbreak at some point) and the 
"loan a book" thing were cool.  I thought the UI on the Nook was very 
confusing for the half hour I played with one.

I might have bought an iPad if I had any other Apple hardware in the house.

As it is, I bought a Kindle.

Sure, they could take books off the machine in spite of their promises not 
to. (After the 1984 thing, they promised that while they'll take it out of 
the library, they won't retroactively delete it from your device.) Sure lots 
of the books probably have DRM on them. But there's ways around that for the 
occasions where it's a problem.

-- 
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
    Quoth the raven:
        Need S'Mores!

Post a reply to this message

Jim Henderson wrote:
> Well, that's the reason I didn't get a Kindle, honestly - with the whole 
> fiasco Amazon had over 1984, I prefer something where I can back up my 
> books manually (which I can do with the Nook).

You can back up your Kindle books. I think most of the new ones have DRM, 
but the classics (that Amazon gives you for free) have bunches of readable 
words in them (like, Arabian Nights has Knight and Dog and Sand and stuff 
like that amongst the gibberish) so I'm assuming that one isn't encrypted.

But you can trivially copy everything off the kindle, reset it back to 
factory defaults, and copy the files back on and everything works fine.

Altho I admit I haven't bought a DRMed book yet, so I couldn't guarantee 
anything there until I do.

-- 
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
    Quoth the raven:
        Need S'Mores!

Post a reply to this message

scott wrote:
> 1) How responsive is the UI?  There's no excuse nowadays for the GUI no
t 
> to change instantly when you press buttons.

The buttons are clicky. Taking it out of sleep mode takes a couple of 
seconds, for whatever reason, turning pages takes a quarter second betwee
n 
button push and the page changing. Or, to put it another way, it takes 
longer to redraw the screen than to respond to the click.  A particularly
 
nasty PDF gives you an "opening page 3 of 7" kind of please-wait screen.

> 2) How comfortable is the screen to read from?  What's the resolution 
> and does it work under all lighting conditions (direct sunlight, office
, 
> dark room etc).

(Come now. Some of these things are a simple google away. :-)

  9.7" diagonal E Ink® electronic paper display, 1200 x 824 pixel re
solution 
at 150 ppi, 16-level gray scale, new 10:1 contrast ratio.

It's comfortable to read in all different reading environments. A dark ro
om, 
obviously, needs a book light.  It's pretty much like a paperback book, 
except a touch smoother so there's a bit of radiosity going on. No glare,
 
tho. It's pretty much the same e-ink that the nook and the sony readers 
have, so take a look at those for an idea.

Oh, and I found a very nice hard zippered case, as well as a hard plastic
 
clamshell and screen protector, if you take it traveling or something. I'
ll 
dig up the details if anyone cares.

-- 
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
    Quoth the raven:
        Need S'Mores!

Post a reply to this message

On 24-8-2010 19:47, Darren New wrote:
> Kevin Wampler wrote:
>> Thanks!  Both this and Jim's replies have been very useful. 
> 
> As I say, send me a complex PDF and I'll take a photo of the screen so 
> you can see how it looks.

what about 3D pdf? The only one I have here ATM is too big to post

Post a reply to this message

On Wed, 25 Aug 2010 10:28:28 +0100, Stephen wrote:

> On 24/08/2010 8:32 PM, Jim Henderson wrote:
>> Ah, I wish I was rich.;-)
>>
>>
> Would it help if I called you Rich(ard) ;-)

Nope, 'cause that's one of my older brothers. ;-)

Jim

Post a reply to this message

On Wed, 25 Aug 2010 22:32:39 +0200, andrel wrote:

> On 24-8-2010 19:47, Darren New wrote:
>> Kevin Wampler wrote:
>>> Thanks!  Both this and Jim's replies have been very useful.
>> 
>> As I say, send me a complex PDF and I'll take a photo of the screen so
>> you can see how it looks.
> 
> what about 3D pdf? The only one I have here ATM is too big to post

Honestly don't know, if you wanted to e-mail it to me, I could try it and 
see.  I'm thinking it probably won't have full functionality (at least).

hendersj at gmail.

Jim

Post a reply to this message

On Wed, 25 Aug 2010 10:31:14 +0100, Stephen wrote:

> On 25/08/2010 5:20 AM, Jim Henderson wrote:
>> Well, that's the reason I didn't get a Kindle, honestly - with the
>> whole fiasco Amazon had over 1984, I prefer something where I can back
>> up my books manually (which I can do with the Nook).
>>
>>
> The same with the Sony.

Yeah, I had considered a Sony as well, but I really like that Nook is 
android-based.  :-)

Jim

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On Wed, 25 Aug 2010 08:39:43 -0700, Darren New wrote:

> Jim Henderson wrote:
>> Well, that's the reason I didn't get a Kindle, honestly - with the
>> whole fiasco Amazon had over 1984, I prefer something where I can back
>> up my books manually (which I can do with the Nook).
> 
> You can back up your Kindle books. I think most of the new ones have
> DRM, but the classics (that Amazon gives you for free) have bunches of
> readable words in them (like, Arabian Nights has Knight and Dog and Sand
> and stuff like that amongst the gibberish) so I'm assuming that one
> isn't encrypted.
> 
> But you can trivially copy everything off the kindle, reset it back to
> factory defaults, and copy the files back on and everything works fine.
> 
> Altho I admit I haven't bought a DRMed book yet, so I couldn't guarantee
> anything there until I do.

That's interesting, I had been led to believe that with Kindle, you were 
more or less at the mercy of Amazon (probably because of the whole 1984 
thing).  The idea of the retailer being able to 'unsell' something to me 
really turned me off of buying one of their devices - in fact, if I had 
won one in a drawing, I'd have sold it because of that...

Not that I think Bezos didn't ultimately do the right thing, but really, 
something like that should've never happened in the first place.

Jim

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On Wed, 25 Aug 2010 08:37:17 -0700, Darren New wrote:

> I might have bought a Nook if it had the bigger screen; the fact that
> it's android (and hence likely going to have a jailbreak at some point)

Already does.  nook-devs.com IIRC.  I'm running it with the Android 
development kit for access to the system filesystem.

> and the "loan a book" thing were cool.  I thought the UI on the Nook was
> very confusing for the half hour I played with one.

I found it easy to get used to fairly quickly myself.  Another *huge* 
advantage is that many e-books can be viewed in their entirety if you go 
to a B&N physical store - for up to an hour a day.  And free wireless at 
places with AT&T wifi (if you don't have the 3G version, which I don't) 
is pretty cool.  Like Kindle, with the 3G option, you don't have to pay 
anything extra for access (the device just costs $50 more, and I have 
wifi pretty much everywhere I go these days).

I do wish the USB cable was longer - I'm using an extension with mine.  
The 'standard' cable is about 5' long, which isn't long enough to reach 
the nearest outlet to the bed if I want to read in bed while charging.  I 
also wish the USB port wasn't on the bottom of the device.

Jim

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On Wed, 25 Aug 2010 12:33:04 +0200, scott wrote:

>> I bought an Amazon Kindle. It's very nice. Feel free to ask me about it
>> if you care. :-)
> 
> I find two things most important with these kind of gagdets:
> 
> 1) How responsive is the UI?  There's no excuse nowadays for the GUI not
> to change instantly when you press buttons.

With Nook, very responsive.

> 2) How comfortable is the screen to read from?  What's the resolution
> and does it work under all lighting conditions (direct sunlight, office,
> dark room etc).

I find the eInk screen extremely comfortable; the page size is about that 
of a standard small paperback.  Works great in almost all lighting 
conditions, but you do need light (it's not backlit, so it's a no-go in 
the dark, just like with a real book).  Battery life is really good.

I'll have to look up the screen resolution for the two screens on the 
Nook; there's the eInk screen and the little touchscreen.

Jim

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On Wed, 25 Aug 2010 13:44:30 +0100, Stephen wrote:

> There is a reason. The Electronic papers used have a very low refresh
> rate and ghosting can occur. My Sony flashes black then white to
> overcome this, slowing page turning down even further. Having said that
> I find it acceptable.

Yes, that's true, Nook does the same thing.  I find it pretty good, 
though, and it doesn't interfere with reading anywhere near as much as I 
thought it might.

Jim

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On Wed, 25 Aug 2010 14:55:31 +0200, scott wrote:

>> Mine has a resolution of 600 x 800 pixels on a 6” screen, 8-levels gray
>> scale, fits in a jacket pocket and although a bit reflective can easily
>> be read under artificial light or bright sunlight.
> 
> What about low light conditions?  Is it comfortable to read in the dark
> with just a bed-side lamp or similar?  

I find it so, though I do generally increase the font size when I'm in 
low light conditions.

> I'm guessing it doesn't have any
> lighting of its own to keep battery usage down?

Correct.

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andrel wrote:
> On 24-8-2010 19:47, Darren New wrote:
>> Kevin Wampler wrote:
>>> Thanks!  Both this and Jim's replies have been very useful. 
>>
>> As I say, send me a complex PDF and I'll take a photo of the screen so 
>> you can see how it looks.
> 
> what about 3D pdf? The only one I have here ATM is too big to post

WTF is a 3D pdf?

-- 
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
    Quoth the raven:
        Need S'Mores!

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Jim Henderson wrote:
> That's interesting, I had been led to believe that with Kindle, you were 
> more or less at the mercy of Amazon (probably because of the whole 1984 
> thing).

Technologically, yes, you are. But it's not something they're going to do, 
or at least so they say.  In the case of 1984, it was because they weren't 
authorized to actually sell that copy. I.e., they were violating copyrights 
by selling you the book that way.

> The idea of the retailer being able to 'unsell' something to me 
> really turned me off of buying one of their devices - in fact, if I had 
> won one in a drawing, I'd have sold it because of that...

Ehn. You have to balance it out. I have lots of worries in my life. Amazon 
pulling a book off my kindle and giving me the money back so I can go buy it 
on paper is low on my list of worries.

I was reluctant for a long time to buy DRMed books, until I realized I'll 
likely always have the non-DRMed version available if I really want it. I 
can pick which books I'll buy cheaper with less access and which books I'll 
spend more on to be able to keep for 20+ years.

That book on C# 4.0?  The likelihood of me having to refer to that in 3 
years is really, really low.  :-)

> Not that I think Bezos didn't ultimately do the right thing, but really, 
> something like that should've never happened in the first place.

True, and he acknowledged that *and* gave people back the book as well. Not 
sure what more you could ask for.

Amazon's licensing at least isn't obnoxious. You can put it on up to five or 
six devices simultaneously, and if you delete it off your kindle, it frees 
up a license for use somewhere else. (Assuming you eventually turn on the 
radio, of course.) And there's readers for pretty much every popular 
electronic device except the direct competition.

-- 
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
    Quoth the raven:
        Need S'Mores!

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Jim Henderson wrote:
> Already does.  

Unsurprising! :-)

> I found it easy to get used to fairly quickly myself.  

Yep, could be. But the touch-screen where you weren't actually touching the 
thing you were interested in threw me.

Or, as my brother said, "I got an iPad, because it has a touch screen."  "My 
  Kindle doesn't have a touch-screen, which is why my wife's fingerprints 
are all over the screen."

> Another *huge* 
> advantage is that many e-books can be viewed in their entirety if you go 
> to a B&N physical store - for up to an hour a day. 

That's a pretty slick marketing move.

> And free wireless at 
> places with AT&T wifi (if you don't have the 3G version, which I don't) 
> is pretty cool.  Like Kindle, with the 3G option, you don't have to pay 
> anything extra for access (the device just costs $50 more, and I have 
> wifi pretty much everywhere I go these days).

It was helpful on my trip to germany. The hotel wanted like $100/week for 
wifi, but I found out the Kindle will do 3G web browsing for free, so for 
the couple of "arrived safely" sorts of emails I wanted to send, it worked 
out with webmail just fine.  (My phone isn't GSM, ya see.)

> I do wish the USB cable was longer - I'm using an extension with mine.  

I bought a second cable to leave plugged into my computer all the time, 
running under the desk and all that. Happily, it's at least a standard USB 
cable.

> also wish the USB port wasn't on the bottom of the device.

I haven't been bothered by that, but then I don't really read with it 
plugged in.

-- 
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
    Quoth the raven:
        Need S'Mores!

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Darren New <dne### [at] sanrrcom> writes:

> Neeum Zawan wrote:
>> Why?
>
> For one, it's easy to travel.

True, if you travel often.

> That bothered me for a while also. Then I realized I have large stacks
> of books that I've read once and will likely never read again. As well

That's why I switched to libraries (if they have the book) ;-)

> as other stacks of technical books that will be obsolete long before I
> run out of space on the kindle. As well as bunches of free books in

I think for me, a physical book is still more convenient when it comes
to technical books. For everything else, electronic is probably fine.

> electronic form that would be quite annoying to read on a computer
> screen.

Free books are definitely worth the Kindle, I guess. Years ago, I read
half a book on my PDA (Palm OS). As you can guess, the screen was small,
but it wasn't an issue for text-only. It had the extra benefit over the
Kindle in that I could fit it in my pocket. 

Unfortunately, it would lose everything in memory every time you ran out
of power.

I have quite a few non-technical books lying around unread. So a year
ago I told myself that I'm not going to buy any more until I either read
the ones sitting around, or get rid of them. And after /that/, I'll buy
only if the library can't get it. So an ebook reader is a no-no for now.

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