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I have no problems in understanding spoken American English. I understand
it so well, in fact, that I never need subtitles when I watch DVD movies.
(On the contrary, subtitles for English-speaking movies bother me a lot,
as the disturb my concentration. For languages which I don't understand
it's less of a bother because there's less to be disturbed from.)
However, in the movie "No country for old men" they spoke with such a
thick Texan accent that at many places I had really hard time understanding
what they were saying. Do Texans really speak with such a thick accent?
--
- Warp
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In article <4a847c54@news.povray.org>,
Warp wrote:
> I have no problems in understanding spoken American English. I understand
> it so well, in fact, that I never need subtitles when I watch DVD movies.
> (On the contrary, subtitles for English-speaking movies bother me a lot,
> as the disturb my concentration. For languages which I don't understand
> it's less of a bother because there's less to be disturbed from.)
What's your first language?
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Daniel Bastos <dbastos+0### [at] toledo com> wrote:
> In article <4a847c54@news.povray.org>,
> Warp wrote:
> > I have no problems in understanding spoken American English. I understand
> > it so well, in fact, that I never need subtitles when I watch DVD movies.
> > (On the contrary, subtitles for English-speaking movies bother me a lot,
> > as the disturb my concentration. For languages which I don't understand
> > it's less of a bother because there's less to be disturbed from.)
> What's your first language?
Finnish.
--
- Warp
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On 13 Aug 2009 16:49:25 -0400, Warp <war### [at] tagpovrayorg> wrote:
> I have no problems in understanding spoken American English. I understand
>it so well, in fact, that I never need subtitles when I watch DVD movies.
My wife has noted that over the years American accents in the media have gotten
more unintelligible and she has to use subtitles more often.
--
Regards
Stephen
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Warp <war### [at] tagpovrayorg> wrote:
> However, in the movie "No country for old men" they spoke with such a
> thick Texan accent that at many places I had really hard time understanding
> what they were saying. Do Texans really speak with such a thick accent?
It didn't strike me as out of the ordinary based on a trailer I just watched
(the English one, not the French one I found first). Of course it varies a lot
even in one place since some people speak more lazily than others. I can see
where that would be tougher to understand, but the movie "Fargo" jumped out at
me a lot more. Maybe because it's not as common an accent. Enjoyable though.
It really makes the movie.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oy2HfixB9_8
- Ricky
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triple_r <nomail@nomail> wrote:
> It didn't strike me as out of the ordinary based on a trailer I just watched
The trailer doesn't show any scenes where the accent is really thick.
--
- Warp
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On Thu, 13 Aug 2009 16:49:25 -0400, Warp wrote:
> Do Texans really speak with such a
> thick accent?
Some do, yes.
Jim
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Stephen schrieb:
> My wife has noted that over the years American accents in the media have gotten
> more unintelligible and she has to use subtitles more often.
Or, over the years her ears have suffered just enough to make a
difference with understanding foreign accents...?
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On 08/13/09 15:49, Warp wrote:
> However, in the movie "No country for old men" they spoke with such a
> thick Texan accent that at many places I had really hard time understanding
> what they were saying.
And funnily enough, the wife of the main character is either Irish or
from the UK. Maybe she just botched the accent.
--
Doctor to patient: Although it's nothing serious, let's keep an eye on
it to make sure it doesn't turn into a major lawsuit.
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Warp wrote:
> I have no problems in understanding spoken American English. I understand
> it so well, in fact, that I never need subtitles when I watch DVD movies.
> (On the contrary, subtitles for English-speaking movies bother me a lot,
> as the disturb my concentration. For languages which I don't understand
> it's less of a bother because there's less to be disturbed from.)
On the other hand, I often need to turn subtitles on to understand
movies, and I'm from the USA!
(Usually it's due to a poor job mixing sound levels, as the dialog will
be quite low while the music / sound effects will be incredibly loud).
> However, in the movie "No country for old men" they spoke with such a
> thick Texan accent that at many places I had really hard time understanding
> what they were saying. Do Texans really speak with such a thick accent?
No, they don't. The accents in the movie were quite "toned down"
compared to reality, which is far, far worse ;)
...Chambers
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On Thu, 13 Aug 2009 23:59:55 +0200, clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
>Stephen schrieb:
>> My wife has noted that over the years American accents in the media have gotten
>> more unintelligible and she has to use subtitles more often.
>
>Or, over the years her ears have suffered just enough to make a
>difference with understanding foreign accents...?
That is true to some extent but when watching films from the 70's, 60's or
earlier the soundtracks are intelligible. It is as if the actors now a days have
not been trained to enunciate properly.
--
Regards
Stephen
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Speaking of accents, most people, at least here, when they think about
"British accent" what they really are thinking about is an exaggerated
"posh English" accent, like the ones used in some British comedies (such
as "Keeping Up Appearances").
However, in practice it seems that the difference between an average
British accent and an average American accent is way subtler and much more
indistinguishable, at least to me. That may be because I'm not a native
speaker of either, but it still strikes me a bit odd that I can't make
the distinction even in situations where there ought to be one.
For example, consider this interview with Hugh Laurie:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ETLHO8kbi_c
Hugh Laurie is a British actor who is currently acting in an American
TV-series, and is basically "faking" an American accent when acting in
the role, while his natural accent is more British. This is a subject
in that interview (as with most such interviews he participates in).
However, I simply can't hear a clear difference between how he talks
in that interview (and many other similar intervies), and how an American
typically talks. In other words, I can't hear the difference in accent.
Or more precisely, I couldn't tell that he is British by the way he speaks.
Is that just me?
Here's an old comedy sketch where he deliberately uses an exaggerated
Southern American accent, and there's a clear difference:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=00y3gV0dJow
But as said, that's rather exaggerated and most Americans (not even the
ones from the South) don't speak like that. :)
--
- Warp
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On 14 Aug 2009 09:34:53 -0400, Warp <war### [at] tagpovrayorg> wrote:
> Speaking of accents, most people, at least here, when they think about
>"British accent" what they really are thinking about is an exaggerated
>"posh English" accent, like the ones used in some British comedies (such
>as "Keeping Up Appearances").
Oo ar! Warp, ye be a bitty confused ye be.
I believe that Americans say there is a British accent but they are only being
polite. That may stem from the non English Brits getting fed up being called
English and being quite vocal about it. The "posh English" is called Received
Pronunciation and is naturally found near London. Other English dialects vary
considerably as do they between North and South Wales, various parts of Scotland
and Ireland.
…
I would say that you can't hear the difference in that interview because he is
speaking to an American on an American TV show and he wants to be understood.
Also I have spoken to some Americans from the Southern States and his accent is
a bit mild.
--
Regards
Stephen
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Stephen <mcavoysAT@aoldotcom> wrote:
> I would say that you can't hear the difference in that interview because he is
> speaking to an American on an American TV show and he wants to be understood.
> Also I have spoken to some Americans from the Southern States and his accent is
> a bit mild.
He certainly doesn't seem to be talking in the "heaviest" British accent
as he has done in the past, like here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wwo8qxUit00
There even I can hear a difference... :)
--
- Warp
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Warp wrote:
> However, in the movie "No country for old men" they spoke with such a
> thick Texan accent that at many places I had really hard time understanding
> what they were saying. Do Texans really speak with such a thick accent?
I haven't seen the film, so I really can't say. I live in the Dallas
area, and for the most part there isn't much of a southern accent here.
Now, Tennessee, Mississippi, Alabama, South Carolina and Georgia are a
completely different story.
--
~Mike
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On Fri, 14 Aug 2009 10:47:20 -0400, Warp wrote:
> He certainly doesn't seem to be talking in the "heaviest" British
> accent
> as he has done in the past, like here:
That happens when one spends a lot of time speaking in a non-native
accent, at least for some people.
The few times I've been to the UK, I've noticed that my volume tends to
come down (I'm not that loud to begin with), and after a week or so of
talking with Brits, I start subconsciously mimicking the accent (probably
not very well, but it's enough that natives can't tell where I'm from -
I've had a few comment on that, actually).
If you want to see something really wacky, watch interviews with Renée
Zellweger (and the other cast in Bridget Jones' Diary) around the time
that filming completed. Reportedly the British cast members didn't know
she's from Texas because from the first time they met her, they hadn't
heard her speak in her native accent - she was always practicing her
British accent. When she got up to accept an award (IIRC), that was the
first time they heard her speak like a Texan, and it kinda freaked them
out; they reportedly asked her why she was "doing a voice" and she
explained that she was speaking in her "real" voice, but they didn't
believe it.
Jim
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Stephen schrieb:
> I believe that Americans say there is a British accent but they are only being
> polite. That may stem from the non English Brits getting fed up being called
> English and being quite vocal about it. The "posh English" is called Received
> Pronunciation and is naturally found near London. Other English dialects vary
> considerably as do they between North and South Wales, various parts of Scotland
> and Ireland.
Reminds me of a trip to Great Britain, Scotland in particular. I had
expected them to speak some unintelligible accent, but no person I spoke
to did.
Then I drove down to the English Midlands, and at some point had to ask
for directions late at night. I stopped and asked some bloke that
happened to be there. He told me, and I nodded and thanked him politely.
Then I drove further down the road to ask someone else... >_<
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On 14 Aug 2009 10:47:20 -0400, Warp <war### [at] tagpovrayorg> wrote:
>
> He certainly doesn't seem to be talking in the "heaviest" British accent
>as he has done in the past, like here:
>
>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wwo8qxUit00
>
> There even I can hear a difference... :)
I'm not sure how to say this but there is no "British" accent. I would say that
he was speaking in an uneducated English voice, quite common (as in poor/rude).
The range of accents and dialects in Britain is very large and can change
considerably over a 20 mile/30 Km distance. Some thing to do with all these
Jutes/Angles/Saxons/Normans that came to stay when the Romans left.
It is not surprising that you find it difficult to follow as he is speaking
quite fast as well.
--
Regards
Stephen
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On Sat, 15 Aug 2009 05:41:12 +0200, clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
>Reminds me of a trip to Great Britain, Scotland in particular. I had
>expected them to speak some unintelligible accent, but no person I spoke
>to did.
>
>Then I drove down to the English Midlands, and at some point had to ask
>for directions late at night. I stopped and asked some bloke that
>happened to be there. He told me, and I nodded and thanked him politely.
>
>Then I drove further down the road to ask someone else... >_<
Scots is a Germanic language and if you have a noticeable German accent the
people will speak slowly. Which is more than can be said of a lot of people in
the midlands (Bill excepted, I'm sure :). They make no allowances for outsiders.
Having said that in parts of the North East of Scotland I've had great
difficulty understanding their accent, Doric.
--
Regards
Stephen
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Stephen <mcavoysAT@aoldotcom> wrote:
> It is not surprising that you find it difficult to follow as he is speaking
> quite fast as well.
Hmm, I didn't say I find it difficult to follow. I just said I can hear
the difference between his current American accent and his old British
accent.
--
- Warp
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On 15 Aug 2009 05:03:00 -0400, Warp <war### [at] tagpovrayorg> wrote:
>
> Hmm, I didn't say I find it difficult to follow. I just said I can hear
>the difference between his current American accent and his old British
>accent.
OK, that's good.
--
Regards
Stephen
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Stephen <mcavoysAT@aolDOTcom> wrote:
> On Sat, 15 Aug 2009 05:41:12 +0200, clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
> >Then I drove down to the English Midlands, and at some point had to ask
> >for directions late at night. I stopped and asked some bloke that
> >happened to be there. He told me, and I nodded and thanked him politely.
> >
> >Then I drove further down the road to ask someone else... >_<
>
> Scots is a Germanic language and if you have a noticeable German accent the
> people will speak slowly. Which is more than can be said of a lot of people in
> the midlands (Bill excepted, I'm sure :). They make no allowances for outsiders.
Well actually if you'd asked me for directions you'd hear a generic southern,
possibly south london accent - I don't originate from these parts!
I think a lot of the difficulty with understanding brits (I'm sure this holds
true in other languages too) is the huge variation in vernacular and idiom.
Rhyming slang in particular, a great deal of which has been absorbed into
standard english without many people noticing - there's a brilliant and
hilarious scene in Guy Ritchie's 'Lock, Stock and Two Smoking Barrels' where a
minor character relates a story using well over 50% cockney rhyming slang. Even
the english versions of the film subtitled that scene!
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On Sun, 16 Aug 2009 11:57:43 EDT, "Bill Pragnell" <bil### [at] hotmailcom>
wrote:
>
>Well actually if you'd asked me for directions you'd hear a generic southern,
>possibly south london accent - I don't originate from these parts!
>
Phew! :)
>I think a lot of the difficulty with understanding brits (I'm sure this holds
>true in other languages too) is the huge variation in vernacular and idiom.
It is strange going abroad to English speaking countries who have their own
idioms. In Nigeria I spent ages greeting people with "Howdy" when actually they
were saying "How day" or "How are they" meaning "how are your family?" a
traditional greeting. Or nearer home in Aberdeen where they say "Fit like ma
loon". In Glasgow we say "no bad" when we mean it's good.
>Rhyming slang in particular, a great deal of which has been absorbed into
>standard english without many people noticing - there's a brilliant and
>hilarious scene in Guy Ritchie's 'Lock, Stock and Two Smoking Barrels' where a
>minor character relates a story using well over 50% cockney rhyming slang. Even
>the english versions of the film subtitled that scene!
>
>
Cockney rhyming slang is beyond the pale (the English controlled parts of
Ireland in the 15th Cent.) China.
--
Regards
Stephen
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On 08/16/09 12:31, Stephen wrote:
> It is strange going abroad to English speaking countries who have their own
> idioms. In Nigeria I spent ages greeting people with "Howdy" when actually they
Freeman Dyson wrote in a recent article about a Russian advisor of his
at university:
"Although I was only seventeen years old and Besicovitch was already a
famous professor, he gave me a great deal of his time and attention, and
we became life-long friends. He set the style in which I began to work
and think about mathematics. He gave wonderful lectures on
measure-theory and integration, smiling amiably when we laughed at his
glorious abuse of the English language. I remember only one occasion
when he was annoyed by our laughter. He remained silent for a while and
then said, 'Gentlemen. Fifty million English speak English you
speak. Hundred and fifty million Rus- sians speak English I speak.'"
--
I'm addicted to placebos. I'd give them up, but it wouldn't make any
difference. - Steven Wright
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On Sun, 16 Aug 2009 16:04:13 -0500, Neeum Zawan <m.n### [at] ieeeorg> wrote:
>"Although I was only seventeen
...
I'm not sure that I follow you.
BTW I was not laughing at Nigerians I was amused at my own misunderstanding.
You understand me mon?
--
Regards
Stephen
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Chambers wrote:
> (Usually it's due to a poor job mixing sound levels, as the dialog will
> be quite low while the music / sound effects will be incredibly loud).
That might be your sound system. Check that you don't have 5.1 turned on
with two speakers, or vice versa. Usually the voices are mixed for the
center channel, and if you're missing the center speaker it sounds muddled
like that.
--
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
"We'd like you to back-port all the changes in 2.0
back to version 1.0."
"We've done that already. We call it 2.0."
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Bill Pragnell wrote:
> the english versions of the film subtitled that scene!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H7Ef5Aob4cE
--
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
"We'd like you to back-port all the changes in 2.0
back to version 1.0."
"We've done that already. We call it 2.0."
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Darren New wrote:
> Chambers wrote:
>> (Usually it's due to a poor job mixing sound levels, as the dialog
>> will be quite low while the music / sound effects will be incredibly
>> loud).
>
> That might be your sound system. Check that you don't have 5.1 turned on
> with two speakers, or vice versa. Usually the voices are mixed for the
> center channel, and if you're missing the center speaker it sounds
> muddled like that.
>
Hmm... that would make sense. I guess a more permanent solution would
be to fork out for a surround sound system, of course :) Unfortunately,
it's going to be a while before I can do that, so I'll try setting it to
stereo instead and see if that helps.
...Chambers
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> However, in practice it seems that the difference between an average
> British accent and an average American accent is way subtler and much more
> indistinguishable, at least to me.
The most universal difference I've come across is how "t" is pronounced. In
America it seems nobody actually pronounces it as a "t" but more of a soft
"d" sound. To me, an American who says "Dakota" sounds pretty much the same
as "Dakoda", in an average British English accent they are completely
different sounds.
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"scott" <sco### [at] scottcom> wrote:
> > However, in practice it seems that the difference between an average
> > British accent and an average American accent is way subtler and much more
> > indistinguishable, at least to me.
>
> The most universal difference I've come across is how "t" is pronounced. In
> America it seems nobody actually pronounces it as a "t" but more of a soft
> "d" sound. To me, an American who says "Dakota" sounds pretty much the same
> as "Dakoda", in an average British English accent they are completely
> different sounds.
Indeed, many southern english accents wouldn't pronounce the 't' at all...! I
bet that's a real pain for non-brits.
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Warp wrote:
> However, in the movie "No country for old men" they spoke with such a
> thick Texan accent that at many places I had really hard time understanding
> what they were saying. Do Texans really speak with such a thick accent?
Some do, some don't. It could be that in those places, the actor was
not speaking very clearly to begin with, such that other Texans would
have trouble understanding the dialogue as well.
However, I am told that from a accent/dialect viewpoint, English is one
of the least diverse of the major languages, although some regional
accents take a bit of getting used to.
Regards,
John
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