POV-Ray : Newsgroups : povray.off-topic : Going postal Server Time
14 Oct 2026 00:15:08 EDT (-0400)
  Going postal (Message 1 to 36 of 36)  
From: Orchid XP v8
Subject: Going postal
Date: 3 May 2009 08:32:34
Message: <49fd8ee2$1@news.povray.org>
GOD DAMNIT! >_<

WHY will the Royal Mail not just GIVE ME my damned parcel?!

It's bad enough that they DELIBERATELY shut JUST BEFORE I can get there 
every single weekday JUST TO **** ME OFF, but NOW it turns out that they 
only actually open ONE DAY each weekend as well. So there's only 
actually ONE DAY in an entire week that I can pick up my mail.

No doubt they won't open at all tomorrow because it's a bank holiday, so 
that means I won't be able to pick up my parcel until next weekend - and 
by then, the ****ers will have sent the parcel back to America. Not like 
I haven't already waited several weeks for it to get here. But because I 
was away from home for one friggin' day, now I can't have the parcel at all.

GRRRR!! I WANT MY PARCEL!!!! >8-[

-- 
http://blog.orphi.me.uk/
http://www.zazzle.com/MathematicalOrchid*


Post a reply to this message

From: Warp
Subject: Re: Going postal
Date: 3 May 2009 08:57:17
Message: <49fd94ad@news.povray.org>
What do you think lunch breaks are for? ;)

-- 
                                                          - Warp


Post a reply to this message

From: Orchid XP v8
Subject: Re: Going postal
Date: 3 May 2009 09:00:48
Message: <49fd9580@news.povray.org>
Warp wrote:
>   What do you think lunch breaks are for? ;)

Heh, well, I guess I *could* spend 1.25 hours driving from Coventry back 
to Milton Keynes, pick up my parcel, and then spend another 1.25 hours 
driving back to work... but I don't think my employer would be too 
happy. (Assuming that fatface actually notices, of course...)

I presume I'm not the only person on Earth who has this problem.

-- 
http://blog.orphi.me.uk/
http://www.zazzle.com/MathematicalOrchid*


Post a reply to this message

From: Stephen
Subject: Re: Going postal
Date: 3 May 2009 09:11:04
Message: <0u5rv4p01puu5vim6l4415eogmu0arqghp@4ax.com>
On Sun, 03 May 2009 14:00:55 +0100, Orchid XP v8 <voi### [at] devnull> wrote:

>
>I presume I'm not the only person on Earth who has this problem.

You can ask for it to be re-deliverd on Saturday morning.
-- 

Regards
     Stephen


Post a reply to this message

From: Orchid XP v8
Subject: Re: Going postal
Date: 3 May 2009 09:13:22
Message: <49fd9872@news.povray.org>
>> I presume I'm not the only person on Earth who has this problem.
> 
> You can ask for it to be re-deliverd on Saturday morning.

How do I do that?

More to the point, is there some way I can get large parcels to be 
delivered the first time around? Obviously I can't make the letterbox 
any bigger, but maybe I could build some kind of enclosure or something...

-- 
http://blog.orphi.me.uk/
http://www.zazzle.com/MathematicalOrchid*


Post a reply to this message

From: Stephen
Subject: Re: Going postal
Date: 3 May 2009 10:27:49
Message: <learv4tt0136e4cqrddufbrcjc7ekseugt@4ax.com>
On Sun, 03 May 2009 14:13:29 +0100, Orchid XP v8 <voi### [at] devnull> wrote:

>>> I presume I'm not the only person on Earth who has this problem.
>> 
>> You can ask for it to be re-deliverd on Saturday morning.
>
>How do I do that?
>

There should be a phone number on the card they left telling you that you were
in the wrong place when they called with a smile. ;)

>More to the point, is there some way I can get large parcels to be 
>delivered the first time around? Obviously I can't make the letterbox 
>any bigger, but maybe I could build some kind of enclosure or something...


Hahahahaha :-)

-- 

Regards
     Stephen


Post a reply to this message

From: Chambers
Subject: Re: Going postal
Date: 3 May 2009 13:35:29
Message: <49fdd5e1$1@news.povray.org>
Two options:

1) Take a vacation day so you can go get it at your leisure.
2) Have it shipped to your work address.

-- 
...Chambers
www.pacificwebguy.com


Post a reply to this message

From: scott
Subject: Re: Going postal
Date: 4 May 2009 03:14:29
Message: <49fe95d5$1@news.povray.org>
> It's bad enough that they DELIBERATELY shut JUST BEFORE I can get there 
> every single weekday JUST TO **** ME OFF, but NOW it turns out that they 
> only actually open ONE DAY each weekend as well. So there's only actually 
> ONE DAY in an entire week that I can pick up my mail.

Do you think you are the only one in your company with this problem?  What 
do other people do?  Just never order anything?

If your employer is really so inflexible that they do not allow personal 
packages to be delivered there, and they do not let you arrive a bit later 
or leave a bit earlier one day to collect your package, then I would just 
phone in sick one morning while I go to the post office to collect it.

In Germany they have the "pack station" that solves this exact problem. 
Unmanned 24/7 place in almost every town where you can collect and deposit 
parcels - genius.


Post a reply to this message

From: Orchid XP v8
Subject: Re: Going postal
Date: 4 May 2009 07:51:22
Message: <49fed6ba$1@news.povray.org>
>> It's bad enough that they DELIBERATELY shut JUST BEFORE I can get 
>> there every single weekday JUST TO **** ME OFF, but NOW it turns out 
>> that they only actually open ONE DAY each weekend as well. So there's 
>> only actually ONE DAY in an entire week that I can pick up my mail.
> 
> Do you think you are the only one in your company with this problem?  
> What do other people do?  Just never order anything?

They live 10 minutes down the road from where they work. (Remember, I'm 
the only person who commutes there.)

> If your employer is really so inflexible that they do not allow personal 
> packages to be delivered there, and they do not let you arrive a bit 
> later or leave a bit earlier one day to collect your package, then I 
> would just phone in sick one morning while I go to the post office to 
> collect it.

Yeah, maybe. I'll probably just get Eric to pick it up tomorrow. (Ah, 
but now he needs proof of authorisation... *sigh*)

> In Germany they have the "pack station" that solves this exact problem. 
> Unmanned 24/7 place in almost every town where you can collect and 
> deposit parcels - genius.

That could indeed be quite useful...

-- 
http://blog.orphi.me.uk/
http://www.zazzle.com/MathematicalOrchid*


Post a reply to this message

From: scott
Subject: Re: Going postal
Date: 4 May 2009 08:23:09
Message: <49fede2d$1@news.povray.org>
> They live 10 minutes down the road from where they work. (Remember, I'm 
> the only person who commutes there.)

Did you ask your boss if you could work slightly different hours for one day 
to allow you to pick up your parcel?  It would seem a bit unreasonable if 
they said no, assuming you had nothing planned at work for the first or last 
hour of your day.


Post a reply to this message

From: Warp
Subject: Re: Going postal
Date: 4 May 2009 11:16:09
Message: <49ff06b8@news.povray.org>
scott <sco### [at] scottcom> wrote:
> It would seem a bit unreasonable if they said no

  Bosses? Reasonable? ;)

-- 
                                                          - Warp


Post a reply to this message

From: scott
Subject: Re: Going postal
Date: 4 May 2009 11:26:40
Message: <49ff0930$1@news.povray.org>
>> It would seem a bit unreasonable if they said no
>
>  Bosses? Reasonable? ;)

Fortunately I've never come across an unreasonable one yet, although I hear 
a lot about them :-)


Post a reply to this message

From: clipka
Subject: Re: Going postal
Date: 4 May 2009 12:20:01
Message: <web.49ff14b131a304e52c9ab000@news.povray.org>
Orchid XP v8 <voi### [at] devnull> wrote:
> > In Germany they have the "pack station" that solves this exact problem.
> > Unmanned 24/7 place in almost every town where you can collect and
> > deposit parcels - genius.
>
> That could indeed be quite useful...

It is, I can tell you. Whoever invented it, I do owe him some :)

Unfortunately it only works with shipments via DHL - UPS or FedEx or some such
won't do. But it is a start.


Post a reply to this message

From: Jim Henderson
Subject: Re: Going postal
Date: 4 May 2009 12:24:02
Message: <49ff16a2@news.povray.org>
On Mon, 04 May 2009 09:14:29 +0200, scott wrote:

> If your employer is really so inflexible that they do not allow personal
> packages to be delivered there,

A lot of companies don't allow personal mail to be delivered to the 
office.  Reason is they get enough business related mail that hiring 
extra people to deliver people's personal mail isn't enhancing the 
business but does increase their expenses.

I'm trying to think if I've ever worked for a company that has allowed 
personal mail to be delivered there, and I can't think of a one.

Jim


Post a reply to this message

From: clipka
Subject: Re: Going postal
Date: 4 May 2009 12:25:00
Message: <web.49ff162631a304e52c9ab000@news.povray.org>
"scott" <sco### [at] scottcom> wrote:
> >  Bosses? Reasonable? ;)
>
> Fortunately I've never come across an unreasonable one yet, although I hear
> a lot about them :-)

Strangely enough, I've yet have to come across an unreasonable immediate
superior as well - but I did see (or rather, typically didn't) some
higher-level bosses who didn't seem to have any idea what was going on "at the
bottom". Which I consider unreasonable enough to qualify (their decisions
seemed to be, at any rate, and I decided to presume they weren't just plain
assholes).


Post a reply to this message

From: St 
Subject: Re: Going postal
Date: 4 May 2009 12:59:15
Message: <49ff1ee3@news.povray.org>
"Jim Henderson" <nos### [at] nospamcom> wrote in message 
news:49ff16a2@news.povray.org...
> On Mon, 04 May 2009 09:14:29 +0200, scott wrote:
>
>> If your employer is really so inflexible that they do not allow personal
>> packages to be delivered there,
>
> A lot of companies don't allow personal mail to be delivered to the
> office.  Reason is they get enough business related mail that hiring
> extra people to deliver people's personal mail isn't enhancing the
> business but does increase their expenses.
>
> I'm trying to think if I've ever worked for a company that has allowed
> personal mail to be delivered there, and I can't think of a one.

    In my job, we're always sending packages to works addresses, and some of 
those addresses are Govt. departments or big companies like the BBC/ITV.

     ~Steve~


>
> Jim


Post a reply to this message

From: Jim Henderson
Subject: Re: Going postal
Date: 4 May 2009 13:21:18
Message: <49ff240e$1@news.povray.org>
On Mon, 04 May 2009 17:59:11 +0100, St. wrote:

>     In my job, we're always sending packages to works addresses, and
>     some of
> those addresses are Govt. departments or big companies like the BBC/ITV.

Interesting.  I think maybe my job in college had that, but that doesn't 
really count.

My current employer strongly discourages having personal packages sent to 
the office, and I seem to recall the one before that (a Fortune 50 
company) also did.  Before that the memory gets a little fuzzy.

Jim


Post a reply to this message

From: Tim Cook
Subject: Re: Going postal
Date: 4 May 2009 13:29:06
Message: <49ff25e2@news.povray.org>
Somewhat related, package from amazon.co.jp arrived this morning.  Thing is, 
I only just ordered it Friday.  Now that's fast!  Some books I ordered from 
domestic version should arrive later this week.  Or next...  Then there's 
the amazon.co.jp marketplace book... (1¥ plus 1200¥ shipping, lol)

Completed my collections of Yokohama Kaidashi Kikou (was missing vol. 7) and 
Kaoru Mori's Emma, and got the new art book by Akemi Takada.  Marketplace 
order was another by Akemi Takada, and domestic amazon was two Franklin 
Booth books and Watson-Guptil's Rendering in Pen and Ink, so I'm pretty 
satisfied.  Whole lot for about $200, shipping included.

-- 
Tim Cook
http://empyrean.freesitespace.net


Post a reply to this message

From: Mike Raiford
Subject: Re: Going postal
Date: 4 May 2009 13:32:03
Message: <49ff2693$1@news.povray.org>
Orchid XP v8 wrote:
> GOD DAMNIT! >_<

... rant snipped ...

> GRRRR!! I WANT MY PARCEL!!!! >8-[
> 

if it's any consolation, the USPS isn't much better.
-- 
~Mike


Post a reply to this message

From: Orchid XP v8
Subject: Re: Going postal
Date: 4 May 2009 13:40:39
Message: <49ff2897$1@news.povray.org>
> if it's any consolation, the USPS isn't much better.

DHL also sucks. (The Royal Mail at least *attempt* to deliver. DHL 
couldn't be bothered to do that...)

-- 
http://blog.orphi.me.uk/
http://www.zazzle.com/MathematicalOrchid*


Post a reply to this message

From: St 
Subject: Re: Going postal
Date: 4 May 2009 14:08:02
Message: <49ff2f02@news.povray.org>
"Jim Henderson" <nos### [at] nospamcom> wrote in message 
news:49ff240e$1@news.povray.org...
> On Mon, 04 May 2009 17:59:11 +0100, St. wrote:
>
>>     In my job, we're always sending packages to works addresses, and
>>     some of
>> those addresses are Govt. departments or big companies like the BBC/ITV.
>
> Interesting.  I think maybe my job in college had that, but that doesn't
> really count.
>
> My current employer strongly discourages having personal packages sent to
> the office, and I seem to recall the one before that (a Fortune 50
> company) also did.  Before that the memory gets a little fuzzy.

     Hmm, I wonder if it's because of the 'security' issue now?

      As for the packages that we send, the people receiving them are 
usually 90% women receiving their wedding rings, so I wonder if it's more a 
case of "The Boss better not dare say anything!"  :)

      ~Steve~


>
> Jim


Post a reply to this message

From: St 
Subject: Re: Going postal
Date: 4 May 2009 14:08:02
Message: <49ff2f02$2@news.povray.org>
"Orchid XP v8" <voi### [at] devnull> wrote in message 
news:49ff2897$1@news.povray.org...
>> if it's any consolation, the USPS isn't much better.
>
> DHL also sucks. (The Royal Mail at least *attempt* to deliver. DHL 
> couldn't be bothered to do that...)

   Yeah, do you know why that is? I think it's because it's got to the stage 
where they actually deliver the *most* parcels that are allocated for that 
van/truck. I.e., if your parcel was the only one in your area, they'll leave 
it a couple of days (or more?) until they have enough to make it worth their 
while. I can't really see that happening where you are though, but then 
again a full load is better than half a load too.

      ~Steve~


>
> -- 
> http://blog.orphi.me.uk/
> http://www.zazzle.com/MathematicalOrchid*


Post a reply to this message

From: Orchid XP v8
Subject: Re: Going postal
Date: 4 May 2009 14:32:29
Message: <49ff34bd$1@news.povray.org>
>> DHL also sucks. (The Royal Mail at least *attempt* to deliver. DHL 
>> couldn't be bothered to do that...)
> 
>    Yeah, do you know why that is? I think it's because it's got to the stage 
> where they actually deliver the *most* parcels that are allocated for that 
> van/truck. I.e., if your parcel was the only one in your area, they'll leave 
> it a couple of days (or more?) until they have enough to make it worth their 
> while. I can't really see that happening where you are though, but then 
> again a full load is better than half a load too.

Well, the parcel was due to be delivered, so I sat next to the front 
door. All day. And at the end of the day, I discovered a small slip of 
paper shoved through the letterbox claiming that they tried to deliver 
at 2PM but nobody was home. This is obviously an outright lie.

I suspect that what they *actually* do is that rather than send round a 
delivery van, they just send a guy in an empty van to put notes through 
everybody's door so they eventually have to pick up their parcels 
themselves. Probably saves DHL a considerable amount of money not having 
to actually provide the service they're paid for.

(I did arrange to have it redelivered on Wednesday. Took the whole day 
off work. No parcel. Eventually discovered it was scheduled for delivery 
Thursday. Not Wednesday, as I'd agreed over the phone. So in the end I 
had to collect the ****ing thing myself anyway! And it's quite a long 
drive - about an hour each way.)

On top of all that, *then* they had the cheeck to try to charge me 
import duty...

-- 
http://blog.orphi.me.uk/
http://www.zazzle.com/MathematicalOrchid*


Post a reply to this message

From: Jim Henderson
Subject: Re: Going postal
Date: 4 May 2009 15:47:57
Message: <49ff466d$1@news.povray.org>
On Mon, 04 May 2009 19:07:32 +0100, St. wrote:

> "Jim Henderson" <nos### [at] nospamcom> wrote in message
> news:49ff240e$1@news.povray.org...
>> On Mon, 04 May 2009 17:59:11 +0100, St. wrote:
>>
>>>     In my job, we're always sending packages to works addresses, and
>>>     some of
>>> those addresses are Govt. departments or big companies like the
>>> BBC/ITV.
>>
>> Interesting.  I think maybe my job in college had that, but that
>> doesn't really count.
>>
>> My current employer strongly discourages having personal packages sent
>> to the office, and I seem to recall the one before that (a Fortune 50
>> company) also did.  Before that the memory gets a little fuzzy.
> 
>      Hmm, I wonder if it's because of the 'security' issue now?

Could be, I'll have to ask some coworkers who have been with the company 
longer if that's relatively new or not.

>       As for the packages that we send, the people receiving them are
> usually 90% women receiving their wedding rings, so I wonder if it's
> more a case of "The Boss better not dare say anything!"  :)

Sending isn't a problem, because we take it to the mailroom and pay for 
it - it's just receiving that's a problem because it adds to the delivery 
load (and possibly other reasons).

Jim


Post a reply to this message

From: scott
Subject: Re: Going postal
Date: 5 May 2009 04:12:32
Message: <49fff4f0@news.povray.org>
> A lot of companies don't allow personal mail to be delivered to the
> office.  Reason is they get enough business related mail that hiring
> extra people to deliver people's personal mail isn't enhancing the
> business but does increase their expenses.
>
> I'm trying to think if I've ever worked for a company that has allowed
> personal mail to be delivered there, and I can't think of a one.

I guess it also depends on the size of the company.  Where I've worked has 
always been in small sites (100 or fewer people) and there was no such thing 
as someone delivering the mail/packages, you had to go and collect it 
yourself from reception when you got a package.

Where I work now there are only 3 people in my office, so often I am the one 
who opens the door to the delivery guy :-)


Post a reply to this message

From: scott
Subject: Re: Going postal
Date: 5 May 2009 04:15:15
Message: <49fff593$1@news.povray.org>
> Somewhat related, package from amazon.co.jp arrived this morning.  Thing 
> is, I only just ordered it Friday.  Now that's fast!

Are you sure it actually was shipped from Japan?  I have ordered stuff from 
amazon.co.uk to be shipped to Germany (because it's cheaper than amazon.de) 
and it's actually been sent from Germany.  I guess it saves amazon the extra 
shipping costs if they have the product already available in the country you 
are shipping to.


Post a reply to this message

From: Mike Raiford
Subject: Re: Going postal
Date: 5 May 2009 08:10:19
Message: <4a002cab$1@news.povray.org>
Orchid XP v8 wrote:

> DHL also sucks. (The Royal Mail at least *attempt* to deliver. DHL 
> couldn't be bothered to do that...)

Hey, that sounds like our post office. I'm guessing DHL is one step 
above in terms of customer service, here...

My favorite thing about driving clear to the other side of town, and 
waiting half an hour in line to pick up my package, is I drive by 
another post office on the way. That one I have mailed packages from. 
It's usually not very busy. The one where my packages are is the busiest 
post office in the city. Oh, and forget about ringing the bell at the 
door that says "For parcel pick-up only" nobody ever actually answers that.

FUn spelled with a capital F-U .. :D

-- 
~Mike


Post a reply to this message

From: Tim Cook
Subject: Re: Going postal
Date: 5 May 2009 11:15:09
Message: <4a0057fd$1@news.povray.org>
"scott" <sco### [at] scottcom> wrote:
> Are you sure it actually was shipped from Japan?  I have ordered stuff 
> from amazon.co.uk to be shipped to Germany (because it's cheaper than 
> amazon.de) and it's actually been sent from Germany.  I guess it saves 
> amazon the extra shipping costs if they have the product already available 
> in the country you are shipping to.

Well, I doubt a brand-new artbook (imprint of the first of this or last 
month) by a Japanese artist would be available anywhere else yet.  Another 
thing to factor in is express shipping runs 'round the clock and on 
weekends, so they had like three days.

-- 
Tim Cook
http://empyrean.freesitespace.net


Post a reply to this message

From: andrel
Subject: Re: Going postal
Date: 5 May 2009 16:50:04
Message: <4A00A67B.2060006@hotmail.com>
On 4-5-2009 20:07, St. wrote:
> "Jim Henderson" <nos### [at] nospamcom> wrote in message 
> news:49ff240e$1@news.povray.org...
>> On Mon, 04 May 2009 17:59:11 +0100, St. wrote:
>>
>>>     In my job, we're always sending packages to works addresses, and
>>>     some of
>>> those addresses are Govt. departments or big companies like the BBC/ITV.
>> Interesting.  I think maybe my job in college had that, but that doesn't
>> really count.
>>
>> My current employer strongly discourages having personal packages sent to
>> the office, and I seem to recall the one before that (a Fortune 50
>> company) also did.  Before that the memory gets a little fuzzy.
> 
>      Hmm, I wonder if it's because of the 'security' issue now?
> 
>       As for the packages that we send, the people receiving them are 
> usually 90% women receiving their wedding rings, 

Don't wedding rings come in pairs, one for each gender?


Post a reply to this message

From: andrel
Subject: Re: Going postal
Date: 5 May 2009 16:56:50
Message: <4A00A811.1010109@hotmail.com>
Thread been going on for some time but I though it was mainly about 
postmen. Now it seems to get more general, so here is my personal 
experience with parcels: When my wife and I are not at home, parcels are 
generally delivered to a neighbour. Likewise we get parcels for 
neighbours. Delivery addresses are sort of normally distributed with a 
standard deviation of 1.5 houses. The delivery guy leaves a note at 
which address the parcel is. That is of course only for parcels that 
have been paid for already.


Post a reply to this message

From: Orchid XP v8
Subject: Re: Going postal
Date: 5 May 2009 17:07:24
Message: <4a00aa8c$1@news.povray.org>
andrel wrote:
> Thread been going on for some time but I though it was mainly about 
> postmen. Now it seems to get more general, so here is my personal 
> experience with parcels: When my wife and I are not at home, parcels are 
> generally delivered to a neighbour. Likewise we get parcels for 
> neighbours. Delivery addresses are sort of normally distributed with a 
> standard deviation of 1.5 houses. The delivery guy leaves a note at 
> which address the parcel is. That is of course only for parcels that 
> have been paid for already.

Yeah, that happens sometimes.

But not if the neighbors aren't home either. ;-)

-- 
http://blog.orphi.me.uk/
http://www.zazzle.com/MathematicalOrchid*


Post a reply to this message

From: St 
Subject: Re: Going postal
Date: 5 May 2009 17:20:54
Message: <4a00adb6@news.povray.org>
"andrel" <a_l### [at] hotmailcom> wrote in message 
news:4A0### [at] hotmailcom...

>>       As for the packages that we send, the people receiving them are 
>> usually 90% women receiving their wedding rings,
>
> Don't wedding rings come in pairs, one for each gender?


    Yes, and it's usually the ladies that organise and buy them.  ;)

     ~Steve~


Post a reply to this message

From: Chambers
Subject: Re: Going postal
Date: 5 May 2009 21:09:04
Message: <4a00e330@news.povray.org>
On 5/5/2009 1:50 PM, andrel wrote:
> Don't wedding rings come in pairs, one for each gender?

None of the shops we looked at had to sell them that way; in fact, it 
was only the pricier stuff that came like that.

-- 
...Chambers
www.pacificwebguy.com


Post a reply to this message

From: Darren New
Subject: Re: Going postal
Date: 7 May 2009 01:19:52
Message: <4a026f78$1@news.povray.org>
Mike Raiford wrote:
> if it's any consolation, the USPS isn't much better.

Actually, last time I rescheduled a delivery, I typed in at 11PM the code 
off the card and they redelivered the next morning.

Of course, they wouldn't have needed to do that if they actually waited the 
30 seconds it takes me to get to the front door from my office on the other 
side of the house on the wrong floor.

-- 
   Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
   There's no CD like OCD, there's no CD I knoooow!


Post a reply to this message

From: John VanSickle
Subject: Re: Going postal
Date: 8 May 2009 07:31:53
Message: <4a041829$1@news.povray.org>
Warp wrote:
>   What do you think lunch breaks are for? ;)

Assuming the postal workers aren't also on lunch break at that time...

Regards,
John


Post a reply to this message

From: Tim Cook
Subject: Re: Going postal
Date: 8 May 2009 14:22:24
Message: <4a047860$1@news.povray.org>
Interestingly, I checked the ship date on my domestic amazon 
order...June 2/3.  Heh.  I know I selected the free shipping, but is 
that really that much to explain a month's difference?

--
Tim Cook
http://empyrean.freesitespace.net


Post a reply to this message

Copyright 2003-2023 Persistence of Vision Raytracer Pty. Ltd.