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> Poll: What do you like more?
> a) hard science fiction
> b) fantastical sci-fi
> c) space operas
What would your definition of b) be (no pun intended)? What's a good example of
this??
Dan
--
See my movies -- http://goofygraffix.com
Read my blog -- http://goofygraffix.blogspot.com
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Dan Byers wrote:
>> Poll: What do you like more?
>> a) hard science fiction
>> b) fantastical sci-fi
>> c) space operas
>
> What would your definition of b) be (no pun intended)? What's a good example of
> this??
>
> Dan
Hmm, maybe Brook's Magic Kingdom For Sale. Heinlein's Glory Road comes
to mind, too.
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Dan Byers wrote:
>> Poll: What do you like more?
>> a) hard science fiction
>> b) fantastical sci-fi
>> c) space operas
>
> What would your definition of b) be (no pun intended)? What's a good example of
> this??
Grass, Sheri S. Tepper
http://www.amazon.com/Grass-Sheri-S-Tepper/dp/0553285653
My mom suggested this book to me, but I just couldn't get into it. It
was too frickin' boring.
Also, the Pern (one letter off from porn) series by Anne McCaffrey. I
read one book of it, and had a hard time finishing it. Fantasy sci-fi
just isn't that interesting, IMO.
Sam
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stbenge wrote:
> Poll: What do you like more?
> a) hard science fiction
> b) fantastical sci-fi
> c) space operas
I prefer hard science fiction. However, given that, I don't consider it
to be science fiction unless it's actually about the technology and how
people react to it. If you could take the story about war between worlds
with blasters, and set it down as war between countries with revolvers,
it isn't science fiction. On the other hand, if it's about how
technology affects people, even old technology then I'd call it science
fiction. Stories of how medieval peasants deal with the first knights in
armor would be SF in my book.
--
Darren New / San Diego, CA, USA (PST)
It's not feature creep if you put it
at the end and adjust the release date.
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On Wed, 12 Dec 2007 16:00:56 -0500, Sabrina Kilian wrote:
> Brook's Magic Kingdom For Sale.
I'd have considered that more in the fantasy genre than in sci fi...
Jim
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stbenge wrote:
> Sam
>
> Poll: What do you like more?
> a) hard science fiction
> b) fantastical sci-fi
> c) space operas
A good mix of all three, depending on the mood. I find it really hard to
read a) when I'm trying to relax and let my brain fall asleep, but when
I have a day off it's a great way to spend time.
The only sci-fi I avoid is stuff where the science just can not make
sense even in the author's alternate universe. If I read that everyone
having blue hair is the reason why FTL or time travel is available, I'm
giving the book away to someone else.
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Sabrina Kilian <"ykgp at vtSPAM.edu"> wrote:
>
> Hmm, maybe Brook's Magic Kingdom For Sale. Heinlein's Glory Road comes
> to mind, too.
I grew up on Brooks' "Shannara" series (LOTR for dummies, like me). Never read
the "Magic Kingdom" series, though. I was under the impression that was
fantasy, not sci-fi...
Dan
--
See my movies -- http://goofygraffix.com
Read my blog -- http://goofygraffix.blogspot.com
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On Wed, 12 Dec 2007 17:01:50 -0500, Dan Byers wrote:
> Sabrina Kilian <"ykgp at vtSPAM.edu"> wrote:
>>
>> Hmm, maybe Brook's Magic Kingdom For Sale. Heinlein's Glory Road comes
>> to mind, too.
>
> I grew up on Brooks' "Shannara" series (LOTR for dummies, like me).
> Never read the "Magic Kingdom" series, though. I was under the
> impression that was fantasy, not sci-fi...
Been a long time since I read the Shannara series. I also liked Eddings
and Feist's books (Faerie Tale was one of my favourites)
Jim
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Jim Henderson <nos### [at] nospam com> wrote:
> Been a long time since I read the Shannara series. I also liked Eddings
> and Feist's books (Faerie Tale was one of my favourites)
>
> Jim
Well, I gotta say, I'm not a huge fan of a), although I liked "Dune" and I enjoy
Ray Bradbury. In fact, I read "Fahrenheit 451" again about six months ago, and
the parallels between that world and this one are spooky...
I'd like to read "Dune" again, maybe explore some of the other books in the
series. Then again, I'd like to climb out of this movie-making hole I've dug
for myself before I turn 80, so I think books, sadly, will be relegated to the
back burner :(
Dan
--
See my movies -- http://goofygraffix.com
Read my blog -- http://goofygraffix.blogspot.com
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On Wed, 12 Dec 2007 17:36:15 -0500, Dan Byers wrote:
> In fact, I read "Fahrenheit 451" again about six months ago, and the
> parallels between that world and this one are spooky...
I need to read that one one of these days - got a copy out in the other
room, just never got around to it...
Jim
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Dan Byers wrote:
> Sabrina Kilian <"ykgp at vtSPAM.edu"> wrote:
>> Hmm, maybe Brook's Magic Kingdom For Sale. Heinlein's Glory Road comes
>> to mind, too.
>
> I grew up on Brooks' "Shannara" series (LOTR for dummies, like me). Never read
> the "Magic Kingdom" series, though. I was under the impression that was
> fantasy, not sci-fi...
It's been ages since I read it. I just recalled the start of it,
something about an amulet that transported a person from a spot just a
few miles up the road from me into another world.
Guess the difference in that is if it's science that transports him,
it's fantastical scifi. If it's magic, it's fantasy. Guess I need to
re-read it and find out.
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Sabrina Kilian wrote:
> Guess the difference in that is if it's science that transports him,
> it's fantastical scifi. If it's magic, it's fantasy.
Nah. It's whether the plot of the story revolves around being
transported, or whether that just happens to be a way to drop someone
into a magical (or scientific) realm.
Like, the Myst series is science fiction. The point is to figure out how
to work the books. Without the book technology (whether it be magic,
science, or something else), the entire series would make no sense. You
couldn't re-do Myst without the teleportation aspect.
Quake and Quake II and Half-Life are fantasy, even tho they're set in
technological worlds. The point isn't that these are aliens. You could
make them "evil communists" just as easily and the game would play the
same.
--
Darren New / San Diego, CA, USA (PST)
It's not feature creep if you put it
at the end and adjust the release date.
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Darren New <dne### [at] sanrrcom> wrote:
> I don't consider it
> to be science fiction unless it's actually about the technology and how
> people react to it. If you could take the story about war between worlds
> with blasters, and set it down as war between countries with revolvers,
> it isn't science fiction. On the other hand, if it's about how
> technology affects people, even old technology then I'd call it science
> fiction. Stories of how medieval peasants deal with the first knights in
> armor would be SF in my book.
a very good definition indeed.
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nemesis wrote:
> Darren New <dne### [at] sanrrcom> wrote:
>> I don't consider it
>> to be science fiction unless it's actually about the technology and how
>> people react to it. If you could take the story about war between worlds
>> with blasters, and set it down as war between countries with revolvers,
>> it isn't science fiction. On the other hand, if it's about how
>> technology affects people, even old technology then I'd call it science
>> fiction. Stories of how medieval peasants deal with the first knights in
>> armor would be SF in my book.
>
> a very good definition indeed.
I must confess, it is not mine. I don't remember where I heard it, but
it stuck with me since then.
I also like a series where a world is created, populated with a range of
people (or species), and presented. Larry Niven and Terry Pratchett both
do these very well.
(Heh. Nerdware. Apparently Firefox's spelling dictionary recognises both
those names. :-)
--
Darren New / San Diego, CA, USA (PST)
It's not feature creep if you put it
at the end and adjust the release date.
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Jim Henderson wrote:
>> In fact, I read "Fahrenheit 451" again about six months ago, and the
>> parallels between that world and this one are spooky...
>
> I need to read that one one of these days - got a copy out in the other
> room, just never got around to it...
Great book.
I think it's incorrect to refer to him as a sci/fi writer, though.
--
He collects mouthwash bottles, and they're all in mint condition.
/\ /\ /\ /
/ \/ \ u e e n / \/ a w a z
>>>>>>mue### [at] nawazorg<<<<<<
anl
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Mueen Nawaz wrote:
> I think it's incorrect to refer to him as a sci/fi writer, though.
The only Bradbury I ever liked was Martian Chronicles and Illustrated
Man. Everything else seemed... well, I just couldn't get past the first
chapter.
--
Darren New / San Diego, CA, USA (PST)
It's not feature creep if you put it
at the end and adjust the release date.
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On Wed, 12 Dec 2007 13:30:07 -0800, Darren New <dne### [at] sanrrcom> wrote:
>stbenge wrote:
>> Poll: What do you like more?
>> a) hard science fiction
>> b) fantastical sci-fi
>> c) space operas
>
>I prefer hard science fiction. However, given that, I don't consider it
>to be science fiction unless it's actually about the technology and how
>people react to it. If you could take the story about war between worlds
>with blasters, and set it down as war between countries with revolvers,
>it isn't science fiction. On the other hand, if it's about how
>technology affects people, even old technology then I'd call it science
>fiction.
I agree with this bit too.
>Stories of how medieval peasants deal with the first knights in
>armor would be SF in my book.
Sorry, for me this is historical fiction. It did happen, you know. :)
I like a) hard SF best followed by b) fantastical SF and only if there is
nothing else to read c) space operas (Cowboys with space guns, I call them)
Sam's mom recommends Grass by Sheri S. Tepper I would recommend "The Gate to
Women's Country" by her. (Not a boys-ie book IMO)
There is some interesting work by women writers hiding amongst the stories of
"Feisty Girlies with Balls". Has anyone read Elizabeth Moon's "Remnant
Population" or "The Speed of Dark"? Or "Drinking Sapphire Wine" by Tanith Lee"?
Regards
Stephen
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stbenge wrote:
> Dan Byers wrote:
>>> Poll: What do you like more?
>>> a) hard science fiction
>>> b) fantastical sci-fi
>>> c) space operas
>>
>> What would your definition of b) be (no pun intended)? What's a good
>> example of
>> this??
>
> Grass, Sheri S. Tepper
> http://www.amazon.com/Grass-Sheri-S-Tepper/dp/0553285653
>
> My mom suggested this book to me, but I just couldn't get into it. It
> was too frickin' boring.
>
> Also, the Pern (one letter off from porn) series by Anne McCaffrey. I
> read one book of it, and had a hard time finishing it. Fantasy sci-fi
> just isn't that interesting, IMO.
Hmm, I wouldn't describe the Pern stories as fantasy, unless you ignore
all the prologues and some of the later (and lesser) books. But they
certainly appear superficially fantastical (the word 'dragon' mainly...
:)). Just goes to show that there's a finer line than people might think
between these three categories.
I'm sorry you didn't enjoy the one you tried, I remember the first one I
read was a little hard going simply because of all the new words and
strange names she'd thought up. They get much easier. Which one did you
read first? It should have been Dragonflight, or you wouldn't have
understood a thing! :)
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Stephen wrote:
> On Wed, 12 Dec 2007 13:30:07 -0800, Darren New <dne### [at] sanrrcom> wrote:
>> Stories of how medieval peasants deal with the first knights in
>> armor would be SF in my book.
>
> Sorry, for me this is historical fiction. It did happen, you know. :)
Try Pasquale's Angel, by Paul J McAuley. How Florence might have turned
out if da Vinci had leaned more towards engineering than art.
Contemporary celebrities are some of the main characters. A very good read!
> I like a) hard SF best followed by b) fantastical SF and only if there is
> nothing else to read c) space operas (Cowboys with space guns, I call them)
Hmm, sounds like everyone else has a different definition of space opera
to me. I always thought that galaxy-spanning adventure and action were
the main staples, which clearly can include hard sf as well as fantasies
like Star Wars or Lensman. I'd put Iain M Banks' Culture novels into
both categories without even thinking about it.
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Darren New wrote:
> nemesis wrote:
>> Darren New <dne### [at] sanrrcom> wrote:
>>> I don't consider it
>>> to be science fiction unless it's actually about the technology and how
>>> people react to it. If you could take the story about war between worlds
>>> with blasters, and set it down as war between countries with revolvers,
>>> it isn't science fiction. On the other hand, if it's about how
>>> technology affects people, even old technology then I'd call it science
>>> fiction. Stories of how medieval peasants deal with the first knights in
>>> armor would be SF in my book.
How about things like Orwell's 1984 then? That extrapolates many
possible paths from its time, but doesn't really dwell on technology. Or
would you put this into 'speculative fiction' but separate from sf?
> I also like a series where a world is created, populated with a range of
> people (or species), and presented. Larry Niven and Terry Pratchett both
> do these very well.
Niven must be my favourite author, I think. He's not as good with human
characters as other authors, but he's a genius at aliens, concepts and
stories.
> (Heh. Nerdware. Apparently Firefox's spelling dictionary recognises both
> those names. :-)
And so it should :)
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On Thu, 13 Dec 2007 10:59:26 +0000, Bill Pragnell <bil### [at] hotmailcom>
wrote:
>Stephen wrote:
>> On Wed, 12 Dec 2007 13:30:07 -0800, Darren New <dne### [at] sanrrcom> wrote:
>>> Stories of how medieval peasants deal with the first knights in
>>> armor would be SF in my book.
>>
>> Sorry, for me this is historical fiction. It did happen, you know. :)
>
>Try Pasquale's Angel, by Paul J McAuley. How Florence might have turned
>out if da Vinci had leaned more towards engineering than art.
>Contemporary celebrities are some of the main characters. A very good read!
>
I've never been able to enjoy alternative history novels, I don't know why. I
read some of McAuley's earlier work but found it too dark for my liking. I might
give him another try if I can find anything in the library.
>> I like a) hard SF best followed by b) fantastical SF and only if there is
>> nothing else to read c) space operas (Cowboys with space guns, I call them)
>
>Hmm, sounds like everyone else has a different definition of space opera
>to me.
Naturally :)
>I always thought that galaxy-spanning adventure and action were
>the main staples, which clearly can include hard sf as well as fantasies
>like Star Wars or Lensman. I'd put Iain M Banks' Culture novels into
>both categories without even thinking about it.
So do I but a lot of the plots are so derivative. It always brings to mind
Battle Beyond the Stars which was a remake of the magnificent seven which was a
remake of the seven samurai.
Have you tried Alastair Reynolds's Revelation Space series. IMO that is both
hard and a space opera.
Regards
Stephen
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Stephen wrote:
> Have you tried Alastair Reynolds's Revelation Space series. IMO that is both
> hard and a space opera.
I have, and they're exceedingly good, some of the best sf I've ever
read. I've read Revelation Space and Chasm City; both very different
stories but I like the way some of the characters overlap - people
mentioned in passing in RS are the main characters in CC...
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On Thu, 13 Dec 2007 12:16:56 +0000, Bill Pragnell <bil### [at] hotmailcom>
wrote:
>Stephen wrote:
>> Have you tried Alastair Reynolds's Revelation Space series. IMO that is both
>> hard and a space opera.
>
>I have, and they're exceedingly good, some of the best sf I've ever
>read. I've read Revelation Space and Chasm City; both very different
>stories but I like the way some of the characters overlap - people
>mentioned in passing in RS are the main characters in CC...
I enjoyed "The Prefect" the latest in the series. I also really liked "Century
Rain" and "Pushing Ice". He is one of my favourite authors.
Regards
Stephen
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> I need to read that one one of these days - got a copy out in the other
> room, just never got around to it...
I have that same problem with "Huckleberry Finn"... going on thirty years now :D
Dan
--
See my movies -- http://goofygraffix.com
Read my blog -- http://goofygraffix.blogspot.com
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stbenge <stb### [at] hotmailcom> wrote:
(quoted out of order)
....
> Poll: What do you like more?
> a) hard science fiction
> b) fantastical sci-fi
> c) space operas
Sort Answer: a) & b)... NOT c)
I enjoy works that creatively explore the realm of possibilities, especially
those that provide a brief excursion, albeit an imaginary one, outside the
sphere of the mundane. Generally, I'm a fan of "The Classics": Asimov,
Bradbury, Heinlein, Clarke, Pohl, Kornbluth, del Rey, and the rest of that
beloved old rouges gallery. Doug Adams was a true genius and any zarking
turlingdrome who says otherwise is full of jujuflop and can go straight to
Belgium! Interesting ideas can come out of either the "hard" or "fantastical"
styles, so I like them both. Generally, mixing the two styles is a bad idea,
but a truly inventive writer just might create an exception to just about any
rule.
I find "Space Opera" wholly repugnant. The same modern pop culture mass
marketing mindset that gives us fat-free ice cream and decaffeinated coffee
brings us idea-free science fiction... "all the spaceships, explosions and
blinky lights that the public loves, with none of those annoying challenging
concepts to dilute the nonstop ACTION!"
....
> How about a nice redirect of attention? Something to take your minds off
> of possibilities which may or may not exist. A good read.... something
> about.... well, possibilities which may or may not exist :) Of course
> I'm talking about Science Fiction.
Like many who have read Heinlein, I often find myself thinking "That's really
clever!" one moment and "How can you say THAT!" the next. This having been
said, I present the following excerpts to bridge the gap between threads:
From: "Notebooks of Lazarus Long" By: Robert Heinlein
"One man’s theology is another man’s belly laugh."
"History does not record anywhere at any time a religion that has any rational
basis. Religion is a crutch for people not strong enough to stand up to the
unknown without help. But, like dandruff, most people do have a religion and
spend time and money on it and seem to derive considerable pleasure from
fiddling with it."
"Men rarely (if ever) manage to dream up a God superior to themselves. Most Gods
have the manners and morals of a spoiled child."
"God is omnipotent, omniscient, and omnibenevolent-it says so right here on the
label. If you have a mind capable of believing all three of these divine
attributes simultaneously, I have a wonderful bargain for you. No checks,
please. Cash and in small bills."
"The most preposterous notion that H. Sapiens has ever dreamed up is that the
Lord God of Creation, Shaper and Ruler of all the Universes, wants the
saccharine adoration of His creatures, can be swayed by their prayers, and
becomes petulant if He does not receive this flattery. Yet this absurd fantasy,
without a shred of evidence to bolster it, pays all the expenses of the oldest,
largest, and least productive industry in all of history."
(end quotations)
=========================================
Best Regards,
Mike C.
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Bill Pragnell wrote:
> How about things like Orwell's 1984 then? That extrapolates many
> possible paths from its time, but doesn't really dwell on technology. Or
> would you put this into 'speculative fiction' but separate from sf?
Good question. I'd call it more speculative, because it's mostly about
people affecting people, rather than technology. If it was about how
people were monitored, and about how people found ways around the
monitoring, for example, it would be more science fiction, I think.
I recently read a book called "The Wittling" (or some such spelling),
wherein the humans get stranded on a planet with natives who have the
natural ability to teleport. They are at medieval technology levels, but
it's still SF, as it's how the humans cope with people who can teleport
you or themselves.
> Niven must be my favourite author, I think.
I gain a new appreciation every time I go back and read his stuff again.
The way those two hold together an entire universe of
reasonably-interacting but very different peoples over the course of a
dozen books is pretty amazing.
--
Darren New / San Diego, CA, USA (PST)
It's not feature creep if you put it
at the end and adjust the release date.
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Stephen wrote:
>> Stories of how medieval peasants deal with the first knights in
>> armor would be SF in my book.
>
> Sorry, for me this is historical fiction. It did happen, you know. :)
Well, yes. And Jules Verne's stuff was SF, even tho it became real. :-)
OK, so do the Mark Twain bit. That was SF too.
--
Darren New / San Diego, CA, USA (PST)
It's not feature creep if you put it
at the end and adjust the release date.
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On Thu, 13 Dec 2007 07:50:58 -0800, Darren New <dne### [at] sanrrcom> wrote:
>Stephen wrote:
>>> Stories of how medieval peasants deal with the first knights in
>>> armor would be SF in my book.
>>
>> Sorry, for me this is historical fiction. It did happen, you know. :)
>
>Well, yes. And Jules Verne's stuff was SF, even tho it became real. :-)
I won't argue with that :)
>OK, so do the Mark Twain bit. That was SF too.
I've only read "A Connecticut Yankee in King Arthur's Court" * and yes I would
class it as SF.
Remember that he is not one of my national authors so the "so do the Mark Twain
bit." intrigues me. Over here he is mostly known for Tom and Huck with a lot of
irrelevant shouts of racism. But I believe that he is required reading in the
US. Is there an old chestnut in your words?
* That could be classed as SF
Regards
Stephen
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And lo on Thu, 13 Dec 2007 01:41:33 -0000, Sabrina Kilian <"ykgp at
vtSPAM.edu"> did spake, saying:
> Dan Byers wrote:
>> Sabrina Kilian <"ykgp at vtSPAM.edu"> wrote:
>>> Hmm, maybe Brook's Magic Kingdom For Sale. Heinlein's Glory Road comes
>>> to mind, too.
>>
>> I grew up on Brooks' "Shannara" series (LOTR for dummies, like me).
>> Never read
>> the "Magic Kingdom" series, though. I was under the impression that was
>> fantasy, not sci-fi...
>
> It's been ages since I read it. I just recalled the start of it,
> something about an amulet that transported a person from a spot just a
> few miles up the road from me into another world.
>
> Guess the difference in that is if it's science that transports him,
> it's fantastical scifi. If it's magic, it's fantasy. Guess I need to
> re-read it and find out.
I'd put the series in the same fantasy category as the Xanth series, which
it resembles closely.
--
Phil Cook
--
I once tried to be apathetic, but I just couldn't be bothered
http://flipc.blogspot.com
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And lo on Wed, 12 Dec 2007 21:07:21 -0000, stbenge <stb### [at] hotmailcom>
did spake, saying:
> Grass, Sheri S. Tepper
> http://www.amazon.com/Grass-Sheri-S-Tepper/dp/0553285653
>
> My mom suggested this book to me, but I just couldn't get into it. It
> was too frickin' boring.
Heh I've just read the first paragraph and felt ill.
> Also, the Pern (one letter off from porn) series by Anne McCaffrey. I
> read one book of it, and had a hard time finishing it. Fantasy sci-fi
> just isn't that interesting, IMO.
I tried one ages ago and couldn't get into it either, might try again some
time though.
--
Phil Cook
--
I once tried to be apathetic, but I just couldn't be bothered
http://flipc.blogspot.com
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Sabrina Kilian wrote:
> stbenge wrote:
>> Sam
>>
>> Poll: What do you like more?
>> a) hard science fiction
>> b) fantastical sci-fi
>> c) space operas
>
> A good mix of all three, depending on the mood. I find it really hard to
> read a) when I'm trying to relax and let my brain fall asleep, but when
> I have a day off it's a great way to spend time.
Hmm, I feel a) is perfect for falling sleepy to. There's only so much
the brain can take before demanding rest. Then, you get to have all
sorts of dreams related to what you just read. Good times.
Sam
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Mike the Elder wrote:
> stbenge <stb### [at] hotmailcom> wrote:
> (quoted out of order)
> ....
>> Poll: What do you like more?
>> a) hard science fiction
>> b) fantastical sci-fi
>> c) space operas
>
> Sort Answer: a) & b)... NOT c)
>
> I enjoy works that creatively explore the realm of possibilities, especially
> those that provide a brief excursion, albeit an imaginary one, outside the
> sphere of the mundane. Generally, I'm a fan of "The Classics": Asimov,
> Bradbury, Heinlein, Clarke, Pohl, Kornbluth, del Rey, and the rest of that
> beloved old rouges gallery.
Those last three don't even ring the smallest bell. Could you provide
some favorite titles from these authors? I'm about to embark on a
mission to acquire some creative works, but I don't think your reply
will reach me in time.
> Doug Adams was a true genius and any zarking
> turlingdrome who says otherwise is full of jujuflop and can go straight to
> Belgium! Interesting ideas can come out of either the "hard" or "fantastical"
> styles, so I like them both. Generally, mixing the two styles is a bad idea,
> but a truly inventive writer just might create an exception to just about any
> rule.
The general feeling here seems to be that any work, properly executed,
has the potential for adoration regardless the genre.
> I find "Space Opera" wholly repugnant. The same modern pop culture mass
> marketing mindset that gives us fat-free ice cream and decaffeinated coffee
> brings us idea-free science fiction... "all the spaceships, explosions and
> blinky lights that the public loves, with none of those annoying challenging
> concepts to dilute the nonstop ACTION!"
Having been exposed to the Star Wars trilogy very early in life, I was
given an appreciation for those particular LucasFilms. Maybe it's the
love of nostalgia more than an intellectual love. I guess it's the same
reason I like The Moody Blues an Jefferson Airplane now.
> Like many who have read Heinlein, I often find myself thinking "That's really
> clever!" one moment and "How can you say THAT!" the next. This having been
> said, I present the following excerpts to bridge the gap between threads:
Time to find some new authors....
Sam
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Stephen wrote:
>>>> Stories of how medieval peasants deal with the first knights in
>>>> armor would be SF in my book.
>> OK, so do the Mark Twain bit. That was SF too.
> I've only read "A Connecticut Yankee in King Arthur's Court" * and yes I would
> class it as SF.
That's what I was referring to. I just couldn't remember the title. :-)
--
Darren New / San Diego, CA, USA (PST)
It's not feature creep if you put it
at the end and adjust the release date.
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stbenge wrote:
> Sabrina Kilian wrote:
>> stbenge wrote:
>>> Sam
>>>
>>> Poll: What do you like more?
>>> a) hard science fiction
>>> b) fantastical sci-fi
>>> c) space operas
>>
>> A good mix of all three, depending on the mood. I find it really hard to
>> read a) when I'm trying to relax and let my brain fall asleep, but when
>> I have a day off it's a great way to spend time.
>
> Hmm, I feel a) is perfect for falling sleepy to. There's only so much
> the brain can take before demanding rest. Then, you get to have all
> sorts of dreams related to what you just read. Good times.
>
> Sam
Hard sci-fi doesn't do that to me. I start reading about the science and
then start thinking about how to make it happen.
For graphical depiction of me and hard sci-fi, see http://xkcd.com/356/
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On Thu, 13 Dec 2007 16:32:13 -0800, Darren New <dne### [at] sanrrcom> wrote:
>Stephen wrote:
>>>>> Stories of how medieval peasants deal with the first knights in
>>>>> armor would be SF in my book.
>
>>> OK, so do the Mark Twain bit. That was SF too.
>
>> I've only read "A Connecticut Yankee in King Arthur's Court" * and yes I would
>> class it as SF.
>
>That's what I was referring to. I just couldn't remember the title. :-)
I'm pleased to be of assistance :)
Regards
Stephen
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On Thu, 13 Dec 2007 13:45:58 -0800, stbenge <stb### [at] hotmailcom> wrote:
>> I enjoy works that creatively explore the realm of possibilities, especially
>> those that provide a brief excursion, albeit an imaginary one, outside the
>> sphere of the mundane. Generally, I'm a fan of "The Classics": Asimov,
>> Bradbury, Heinlein, Clarke, Pohl, Kornbluth, del Rey, and the rest of that
>> beloved old rouges gallery.
>
>Those last three don't even ring the smallest bell. Could you provide
>some favorite titles from these authors? I'm about to embark on a
>mission to acquire some creative works, but I don't think your reply
>will reach me in time.
You must try Frederik Pohl one of IMO the greats.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frederik_Pohl#Collections
The Heechee, Eschaton, Starchild Trilogy (with Jack Williamson) and of course
the Space Merchants, series are recommended.
Cyril M. Kornbluth collaborated with Pohl a lot.
Lester del Rey
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lester_del_Rey#Novels
says it all.
Regards
Stephen
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Thanks, Stephen, for filling in the info whilst I was away. Those unreasonable
people who provide my paycheck sometimes insist that I devote myself to the
silly tasks they assign to me for two or three hours... in a SINGLE day! ;-)
Stephen <mcavoysATaolDOTcom@> wrote:
> On Thu, 13 Dec 2007 13:45:58 -0800, stbenge <stb### [at] hotmailcom> wrote:
>
> >> ... Pohl, Kornbluth, del Rey, and the rest of that
> >> beloved old rouges gallery.
> >
> >Those last three don't even ring the smallest bell. Could you provide
> >some favorite titles from these authors?
>
> You must try Frederik Pohl one of IMO the greats.
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frederik_Pohl#Collections
>
> The Heechee, Eschaton, Starchild Trilogy (with Jack Williamson) and of course
> the Space Merchants, series are recommended.
>
>
> Cyril M. Kornbluth collaborated with Pohl a lot.
>
>
> Lester del Rey
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lester_del_Rey#Novels
> says it all.
>
>
> Regards
> Stephen
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Sabrina Kilian <"ykgp at vtSPAM.edu"> wrote:
> For graphical depiction of me and hard sci-fi, see http://xkcd.com/356/
terrific webcomic! XD
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Stephen wrote:
>> I prefer hard science fiction. However, given that, I don't consider it
>> to be science fiction unless it's actually about the technology and how
>> people react to it. If you could take the story about war between worlds
>> with blasters, and set it down as war between countries with revolvers,
>> it isn't science fiction. On the other hand, if it's about how
>> technology affects people, even old technology then I'd call it science
>> fiction.
>
> I agree with this bit too.
I almost do. I'd replace "technology" with "science".
>> Stories of how medieval peasants deal with the first knights in
>> armor would be SF in my book.
>
> Sorry, for me this is historical fiction. It did happen, you know. :)
SF is not just about the future...
--
Lisa: Oedipus killed his father and married his mother.
Homer: Who payed for THAT wedding?
/\ /\ /\ /
/ \/ \ u e e n / \/ a w a z
>>>>>>mue### [at] nawazorg<<<<<<
anl
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stbenge wrote:
> Poll: What do you like more?
> a) hard science fiction
> b) fantastical sci-fi
> c) space operas
Someone just recommended to me "The Man From Earth":
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0756683/
Independent movie, I think. Made this year. As you can see, the ratings
are quite high. Anyone seen it?
(No spoilers here, but if you want to avoid them, don't read the plot
summary on the IMDB page).
I liked it, and generally like this "kind" of science fiction. I used
to call it "philosophical" science fiction - a subgenre of hard science
fiction (as Darren defined it). These kinds of stories don't actually
have much of a story - it's mostly exploring certain ideas or concepts.
Oh, and just curious if anyone here would rather this movie not be
labeled as science fiction?
--
Lisa: Oedipus killed his father and married his mother.
Homer: Who payed for THAT wedding?
/\ /\ /\ /
/ \/ \ u e e n / \/ a w a z
>>>>>>mue### [at] nawazorg<<<<<<
anl
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On Thu, 13 Dec 2007 10:32:30 -0500, Dan Byers wrote:
>> I need to read that one one of these days - got a copy out in the other
>> room, just never got around to it...
>
> I have that same problem with "Huckleberry Finn"... going on thirty
> years now :D
>
> Dan
I believe that was required reading for me in Jr. High school....
Jim
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On Wed, 12 Dec 2007 21:47:04 -0600, Mueen Nawaz wrote:
> Jim Henderson wrote:
>>> In fact, I read "Fahrenheit 451" again about six months ago, and the
>>> parallels between that world and this one are spooky...
>>
>> I need to read that one one of these days - got a copy out in the other
>> room, just never got around to it...
>
> Great book.
>
> I think it's incorrect to refer to him as a sci/fi writer, though.
What do you think would be a better classification?
Jim
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Jim Henderson wrote:
>> Jim Henderson wrote:
>>>> In fact, I read "Fahrenheit 451" again about six months ago, and the
>>>> parallels between that world and this one are spooky...
>>> I need to read that one one of these days - got a copy out in the other
>>> room, just never got around to it...
>> Great book.
>>
>> I think it's incorrect to refer to him as a sci/fi writer, though.
>
> What do you think would be a better classification?
A "good" writer?<G>
Don't know. It's just that I think most of his work is entirely
unrelated to sci-fi, and even most of his "sci-fi" stories are somewhat
incidentally sci-fi. As Darren would put it, you could take (most of)
those stories, remove the sci-fi elements, and the story is still more
or less the same. The science aspect was not important in most of his
stories.
--
Lisa: Oedipus killed his father and married his mother.
Homer: Who payed for THAT wedding?
/\ /\ /\ /
/ \/ \ u e e n / \/ a w a z
>>>>>>mue### [at] nawazorg<<<<<<
anl
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On Fri, 14 Dec 2007 18:20:24 -0600, Mueen Nawaz wrote:
> Jim Henderson wrote:
>>> Jim Henderson wrote:
>>>>> In fact, I read "Fahrenheit 451" again about six months ago, and the
>>>>> parallels between that world and this one are spooky...
>>>> I need to read that one one of these days - got a copy out in the
>>>> other room, just never got around to it...
>>> Great book.
>>>
>>> I think it's incorrect to refer to him as a sci/fi writer, though.
>>
>> What do you think would be a better classification?
>
> A "good" writer?<G>
Life in the library would certainly be easier if the dewey decimal system
included numbers for "good" and "bad" writers. That'd make it easier to
know which books to avoid, that's for sure. As mentioned before, L. Ron
Hubbard certainly would belong in the "really crap writer" section from
my experience.
> Don't know. It's just that I think most of his work is entirely
> unrelated to sci-fi, and even most of his "sci-fi" stories are somewhat
> incidentally sci-fi. As Darren would put it, you could take (most of)
> those stories, remove the sci-fi elements, and the story is still more
> or less the same. The science aspect was not important in most of his
> stories.
Maybe, but I like books in the sci-fi genre that don't depend on the
science other than to be a storytelling tool. I think of the authors
I've read, though, Michael Creighton comes the closest to a "pure"
science-fiction definition.
Jim
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On Fri, 14 Dec 2007 08:36:24 EST, "Mike the Elder" <zer### [at] wyanorg>
wrote:
>Thanks, Stephen, for filling in the info whilst I was away. Those unreasonable
>people who provide my paycheck sometimes insist that I devote myself to the
>silly tasks they assign to me for two or three hours... in a SINGLE day! ;-)
I'm glad it meets with your approval Mike. I should have mentioned Hal Clement
and Clifford D Simak as well. Oh! And John Wyndham to represent the Brits.
I don't know if I can wholly agree with you on Space Opera. Most modern Space
Operas are other genre set in the stars and are just long. But have you read:
Tiger! Tiger! Or "The stars are my destination" by Alfred Bester? One novel but
it could be set to music.
Alastair Reynolds's "Revelation Space" series? I've mentioned this before.
Vernor Vinge's "A Fire Upon the Deep"?
There are a few but you have to sift a lot of dross to find a gem.
Are you in a union, is there someone you can complain to about your paymaster's
unreasonable demands? :)
BTW I envy your nome de plume. Stevie the Senile doesn't have the same ring :)
Regards
Stephen
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Jim Henderson nous apporta ses lumieres en ce 2007/12/14 20:05:
> On Fri, 14 Dec 2007 18:20:24 -0600, Mueen Nawaz wrote:
> Life in the library would certainly be easier if the dewey decimal system
> included numbers for "good" and "bad" writers. That'd make it easier to
> know which books to avoid, that's for sure. As mentioned before, L. Ron
> Hubbard certainly would belong in the "really crap writer" section from
> my experience.
>
The main problem here, is that your definition of "good" and "bad" writers is
not the same as that of almost anybody else, and that is independant of WHO the
"you" is...
> Jim
--
Alain
-------------------------------------------------
You know you've been raytracing too long when you look at a matrix transform and
know instantly what it does.
John VanSickle
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Mueen Nawaz nous apporta ses lumieres en ce 2007/12/14 17:02:
> stbenge wrote:
>> Poll: What do you like more?
>> a) hard science fiction
>> b) fantastical sci-fi
>> c) space operas
>
> Someone just recommended to me "The Man From Earth":
>
> http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0756683/
>
> Independent movie, I think. Made this year. As you can see, the ratings
> are quite high. Anyone seen it?
>
> (No spoilers here, but if you want to avoid them, don't read the plot
> summary on the IMDB page).
>
> I liked it, and generally like this "kind" of science fiction. I used
> to call it "philosophical" science fiction - a subgenre of hard science
> fiction (as Darren defined it). These kinds of stories don't actually
> have much of a story - it's mostly exploring certain ideas or concepts.
>
> Oh, and just curious if anyone here would rather this movie not be
> labeled as science fiction?
>
>
Ever red "The Master's voice" from Stanislas Lemm? I supported it to a little
past the middle, and I was still in the "prehamble" part. I mean, there was
absolutely nothing appening, just situational placements, and "background"
deblaterations.
--
Alain
-------------------------------------------------
You know you have been raytracing for too long when the animation you render
will be finished after yourself.
Urs Holzer
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On Sun, 16 Dec 2007 12:26:19 -0500, Alain wrote:
> The main problem here, is that your definition of "good" and "bad"
> writers is not the same as that of almost anybody else, and that is
> independant of WHO the "you" is...
Well, yeah, that was kinda my point. ;-)
Jim
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Stephen wrote:
> Vernor Vinge's "A Fire Upon the Deep"?
I'm halfway through this, and so far it's 100% genius. I've not read
anything this imaginative since Ringworld. :)
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On Mon, 17 Dec 2007 10:34:09 +0000, Bill Pragnell <bil### [at] hotmailcom>
wrote:
>Stephen wrote:
>> Vernor Vinge's "A Fire Upon the Deep"?
>
>I'm halfway through this, and so far it's 100% genius. I've not read
>anything this imaginative since Ringworld. :)
It is my favourite of his. I'm glad that you like it.
Regards
Stephen
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