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A neat effect seen in 3D-Engines are particle effects which
add to each other. So, what the Engine does, is take point in
space, check if a certain disc around it isn't blocked, and then
just add a certain RGB-Component to the "rendered" image
from the engine.
The effect is much like emission-media, which just "adds" color
on top of the background, whereas absorption-media "subtracts".
The problem is speed. To get faily smooth "discs" (got to use spheres),
POV needs a pretty high sample rate.
Though I know, POV isn't a 3D-Engine, doesn't do scanline and
all the typical answers we get... We have transparent and filtering
"channels". Isn't it possible to somehow add an "adding" channel?
Negative values could subtract, much like absorption, and positive
values add, much like emission.
In have no idea about the handling of colors and such in POV's
workings, but a guess would be to add this feature by making use
of the way media-attenuation is stored... That's just a guess!
I'm not too sure if the proposed idea is actually possible within
the "confines" of POV-Ray 3.5... Nontheless, has anybody got
any good ideas how this may be made possible with "common"
3.5 techniques (aside using the tracing-intensive media)?
--
Tim Nikias
Homepage: http://www.digitaltwilight.de/no_lights/index.html
Email: Tim### [at] gmx de
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"Tim Nikias" <tim### [at] gmxde> wrote in message
news:3e01f0ea@news.povray.org...
Just use the object pattern. With a pigment map like this:
pigment_map {
[0 Pigment_Alone]
[1 Predefined_Average_Pigment]
}
-Shay
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I don't really understand how you want me to apply
the object-pattern...
I'm talking about an effect that I can place a disc/sphere,
the center being bright, the rim just transparent, and add
this rgb-value to any background-element the traced
ray may find.
How does object-pattern come into play there?
--
Tim Nikias
Homepage: http://www.digitaltwilight.de/no_lights/index.html
Email: Tim### [at] gmxde
>
> Just use the object pattern. With a pigment map like this:
>
> pigment_map {
> [0 Pigment_Alone]
> [1 Predefined_Average_Pigment]
> }
>
> -Shay
>
>
>
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"Tim Nikias" <tim### [at] gmxde> wrote in message
news:3e020428@news.povray.org...
> I don't really understand how you want me to apply
> the object-pattern...
>
> I'm talking about an effect that I can place a disc/sphere,
> the center being bright, the rim just transparent, and add
> this rgb-value to any background-element the traced
> ray may find.
> How does object-pattern come into play there?
>
I misunderstood the question some. How about a disk object oriented towards
the camera with a filter value>1 and no_image, no_shadow, no_reflection? I'm
not sure what this would produce, it's just a guess.
-Shay
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"Shay" <sah### [at] simcopartscom> wrote in message
news:3e0206b0@news.povray.org...
Another possibility might be to use oriented cones and to then combine the
object and proximity patterns. I know proximity is slow, but I'm not sure
how slow it would be in this simple case.
Yet another possibility is to use oriented spot lights if lights will take a
negative color.
-Shay
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On Thu, 19 Dec 2002 12:46:41 -0600, "Shay" <sah### [at] simcopartscom> wrote:
> Another possibility might be to use oriented cones and to then combine the
> object and proximity patterns. I know proximity is slow, but I'm not sure
> how slow it would be in this simple case.
In case of cones you can use functions from iso_csg library instead of
proximity pattern. It should be very fast then.
ABX
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"ABX" <abx### [at] abxartpl> wrote in message
news:69540vkpvcv57ntng5p0s6ljjosohe7o8k@4ax.com...
>
> In case of cones you can use functions from iso_csg library instead of
> proximity pattern. It should be very fast then.
>
> ABX
cool. This definitely seems like the best solution then, because an even
amount of color will always be added or subtracted despite the number of
light sources which are reaching a surface.
-Shay
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But that was exactly the effect I was looking for!
In 3D-Engines, these particles are just thrown onto
a rendered image and brighten the image, a lot of
particles get very bright (some more enhanced engines
blend between colors when things are getting bright,
causing neat color effects), a few stay dark.
Spotlights was an idea that seemed very useful, but
it throws shadows or lights up all objects in its path,
except when using light-groups in a very complicated
and difficult manner in order to get the correct spotlights
for the correct objects...
Nobody played Soul Reaver, Vampire, Descent or
such? Freespace, Aquanox, anything? All these use that
technique! I'm pretty much sure that almost any 3D-Engine
of today does that...
--
Tim Nikias
Homepage: http://www.digitaltwilight.de/no_lights/index.html
Email: Tim### [at] gmxde
> > In case of cones you can use functions from iso_csg library instead of
> > proximity pattern. It should be very fast then.
> >
> > ABX
>
> cool. This definitely seems like the best solution then, because an even
> amount of color will always be added or subtracted despite the number of
> light sources which are reaching a surface.
>
> -Shay
>
>
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Tim Nikias wrote:
> But that was exactly the effect I was looking for!
>
> In 3D-Engines, these particles are just thrown onto
> a rendered image and brighten the image, a lot of
> particles get very bright (some more enhanced engines
> blend between colors when things are getting bright,
> causing neat color effects), a few stay dark.
I believe Chris Huff's glows patch (included in the latest MegaPOV version)
worked just the way you describe. So, you just need to wait for a 3.5-based
MegaPOV version (I sincerely wish the project is continued). Or perhaps
Chris could update his patch for 3.5? :)
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"Johannes Dahlstrom" <sad### [at] tkukoulufi> wrote in message
news:3e022f08@news.povray.org...
> Tim Nikias wrote:
>
> > But that was exactly the effect I was looking for!
> >
> > In 3D-Engines, these particles are just thrown onto
> > a rendered image and brighten the image, a lot of
> > particles get very bright (some more enhanced engines
> > blend between colors when things are getting bright,
> > causing neat color effects), a few stay dark.
>
> I believe Chris Huff's glows patch (included in the latest MegaPOV
version)
> worked just the way you describe. So, you just need to wait for a
3.5-based
> MegaPOV version (I sincerely wish the project is continued). Or perhaps
> Chris could update his patch for 3.5? :)
If this is what you want (bright glows will obscure whatever is behind
them), then just use spheres colored with the wood pattern and oriented to
point at the camera.
-Shay
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In article <3e0231ce$1@news.povray.org>, "Shay" <sah### [at] simcopartscom>
wrote:
> If this is what you want (bright glows will obscure whatever is behind
> them), then just use spheres colored with the wood pattern and oriented to
> point at the camera.
Disc objects would be better. And maybe the cylindrical pattern instead
of wood, but there is very little difference. If you use spherical, you
won't have to mess around with reorient transformations. This is
approximately what the glow patch did internally, though with more
overhead (processing an intersection and casting an additional ray, and
not being able to re-use some calculations).
Use discs with diffuse to 0 and ambient to 1 and try filter or transmit
values > 1. Point the disc normal at the camera, and turn hollow on to
keep the disks from interacting with the camera.
--
Christopher James Huff <cja### [at] earthlinknet>
http://home.earthlink.net/~cjameshuff/
POV-Ray TAG: chr### [at] tagpovrayorg
http://tag.povray.org/
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In article <3e022f08@news.povray.org>,
Johannes Dahlstrom <sad### [at] tkukoulufi> wrote:
> I believe Chris Huff's glows patch (included in the latest MegaPOV version)
> worked just the way you describe. So, you just need to wait for a 3.5-based
> MegaPOV version (I sincerely wish the project is continued). Or perhaps
> Chris could update his patch for 3.5? :)
I am working on an updated version. It will be a while, because it will
depend on tesselation and proximity patches that also aren't written yet.
--
Christopher James Huff <cja### [at] earthlinknet>
http://home.earthlink.net/~cjameshuff/
POV-Ray TAG: chr### [at] tagpovrayorg
http://tag.povray.org/
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"Christopher James Huff" <chr### [at] maccom> wrote in message
news:chr### [at] netplexaussieorg...
Well, there's the answer from the man himself. Is *this* what you were
looking for, Tim.<g> If not, I'm sure we'll get it eventually.
-Shay
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Yeah, I guess. I'll have to try it, but if what Chris
said actually does have a similiar effect like the
glows, then it probably is exactly what I was
looking for. Got to experiment with that a little...
Anyways, thanks to all you guys!
--
Tim Nikias
Homepage: http://www.digitaltwilight.de/no_lights/index.html
Email: Tim### [at] gmxde
>
> Well, there's the answer from the man himself. Is *this* what you were
> looking for, Tim.<g> If not, I'm sure we'll get it eventually.
>
> -Shay
>
>
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In article <3e0251e1@news.povray.org>, "Tim Nikias" <tim### [at] gmxde>
wrote:
> Yeah, I guess. I'll have to try it, but if what Chris
> said actually does have a similiar effect like the
> glows, then it probably is exactly what I was
> looking for. Got to experiment with that a little...
BTW, make sure to set max_trace_level high enough, and remember that
they won't look right in reflections: the discs are oriented to the
camera at parse time.
A sphere filled with media will look correct from any direction, but
will obviously take more processing power.
--
Christopher James Huff <cja### [at] earthlinknet>
http://home.earthlink.net/~cjameshuff/
POV-Ray TAG: chr### [at] tagpovrayorg
http://tag.povray.org/
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