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I have been approached by a fellow who wishes to show one of my Rusty
animations as part of a 30-minute presentation at a comedy club. I am
amenable to this, especially since this individual is willing to pay
real money for this.
What would be a reasonable figure to charge?
Regards,
John
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As much as you can get + $20
Count up all the time you spent making it (not rendering time) and
multiply by minimum wage.
Then multiply by about $20/hr.
Then quote him the high figure, and don't negotiate below the low one.
For Instance,
If the number of work hours was say, 60,
60 x (what is minimum wage, 5.65?) 5.65 is $339
60 x 20 is $1200
so ask for $1220.00
and don't go below $350
ALSO!
I went to a "new music and multimedia" show at the local junior college,
and someone actually got a scholarship for their animation work (and I
have seen lots better in here). So, don't be afraid to show your work at
those festivals.
--
Bryan Valencia
Software Services - Making Windows Scream
http://www.209software.com
mailto:bry### [at] 209software com
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Is this a one time deal or does he want to develop an act and take it on
the road? I would charge more for a one time thing than for repeat shows
for each time it was played.
Josh
John VanSickle wrote:
> I have been approached by a fellow who wishes to show one of my Rusty
> animations as part of a 30-minute presentation at a comedy club. I am
> amenable to this, especially since this individual is willing to pay
> real money for this.
>
> What would be a reasonable figure to charge?
>
> Regards,
> John
--
Josh English
eng### [at] spiritonecom
"May your hopes, dreams, and plans not be destroyed by a few zeros."
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Personally, I would be careful not to get too greedy. He'll be showing your
work to other people, so the free exposure is nice even if you don't get
paid. Besides, if you go asking for some obscene amount he'll never come
back for another one.
-Doug Eichenberg
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Josh English wrote:
>
> Is this a one time deal or does he want to develop an act and take it
> on the road? I would charge more for a one time thing than for repeat
> shows for each time it was played.
My intent was to quote a certain figure, to be paid for each showing
before a paying audience. I might ask for the expected attendance
figures.
Regards,
John
--
ICQ: 46085459
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Bryan Valencia wrote:
>
> As much as you can get + $20
>
> Count up all the time you spent making it (not rendering time) and
> multiply by minimum wage.
>
> Then multiply by about $20/hr.
> Then quote him the high figure, and don't negotiate below the low one.
>
> For Instance,
>
> If the number of work hours was say, 60,
>
> 60 x (what is minimum wage, 5.65?) 5.65 is $339
> 60 x 20 is $1200
>
> so ask for $1220.00
> and don't go below $350
This strikes me a kind of high for a simple showing to a night club
audience. It is a minor part of the act. The fact that it might be
seen by somebody worth knowing in the industry is more important to me
than the money.
Regards,
John
--
ICQ: 46085459
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You shouldn't charge by the hour - what if you were learning a new
technique - you shouldn't charge your customer for your training...
Some charge based on the complexity of the image/animation. Can we see the
animation in question?
"Bryan Valencia" <bry### [at] 209softwarecom> wrote in message
news:393C09AC.AE4E24BE@209software.com...
> As much as you can get + $20
>
> Count up all the time you spent making it (not rendering time) and
> multiply by minimum wage.
>
> Then multiply by about $20/hr.
> Then quote him the high figure, and don't negotiate below the low one.
>
> For Instance,
>
> If the number of work hours was say, 60,
>
> 60 x (what is minimum wage, 5.65?) 5.65 is $339
> 60 x 20 is $1200
>
> so ask for $1220.00
> and don't go below $350
>
> ALSO!
>
> I went to a "new music and multimedia" show at the local junior college,
> and someone actually got a scholarship for their animation work (and I
> have seen lots better in here). So, don't be afraid to show your work at
> those festivals.
>
> --
> Bryan Valencia
> Software Services - Making Windows Scream
> http://www.209software.com
> mailto:bry### [at] 209softwarecom
>
>
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"Mike Weber" <mik### [at] pyxiscom> wrote in message
news:393c254b$1@news.povray.org...
> You shouldn't charge by the hour - what if you were learning a new
> technique - you shouldn't charge your customer for your training...
>
Why not ? Companies routinely factor design and development costs into
their product prices. Learning a new technique is, surely, just a part of
that design and development process.
--
Scott Hill. (sco### [at] innocentcom)
Software Engineer.
Author of Pandora's Box (coming to a web page soon(ish)).
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A company that can absord the cost will do that, but an individual
shouldn't.
Would you pay someone to build your house and charged according to time, and
part of that time was to learn how to cut wood? (don't take into account
quality - since the quality of an animation isn't hidden in the walls...)
"Scott Hill" <sco### [at] geniecouk> wrote in message
news:393c2c0e@news.povray.org...
> "Mike Weber" <mik### [at] pyxiscom> wrote in message
> news:393c254b$1@news.povray.org...
> > You shouldn't charge by the hour - what if you were learning a new
> > technique - you shouldn't charge your customer for your training...
> >
>
> Why not ? Companies routinely factor design and development costs into
> their product prices. Learning a new technique is, surely, just a part of
> that design and development process.
>
> --
> Scott Hill. (sco### [at] innocentcom)
> Software Engineer.
> Author of Pandora's Box (coming to a web page soon(ish)).
>
>
>
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Ask him how much he's willing to pay, and then decide from there if you feel
that is enough or not.
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Good point as well. My problem is that I undervalue my time and effort so
much that I might as well give work away free (In fact, I usually do), so I
am not one to advise you on pricing. You should definitely make sure your
name is mentioned, tho.
Personally, I'm wondering how mayn IRTC entries it will take before Rusty
appears in his own half hour tape....
Josh
John VanSickle wrote:
> Josh English wrote:
> >
> > Is this a one time deal or does he want to develop an act and take it
> > on the road? I would charge more for a one time thing than for repeat
> > shows for each time it was played.
>
> My intent was to quote a certain figure, to be paid for each showing
> before a paying audience. I might ask for the expected attendance
> figures.
>
> Regards,
> John
> --
> ICQ: 46085459
--
Josh English
eng### [at] spiritonecom
"May your hopes, dreams, and plans not be destroyed by a few zeros."
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50$
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On Mon, 05 Jun 2000 15:37:17 -0400, John VanSickle
<van### [at] erolscom> wrote:
>What would be a reasonable figure to charge?
I can't give you a figure, but there is something that no one else
seems to be mentioning here. Photographers and many other artists that
sell to magazines, for example, adjust their charge based upon things
such as the expected size of the audience (how big the circulation
is), and the size the work will actually be printed at, (ie.,
full-page, 1/4 page, etc.)
A rough translation to your situation would be something like this:
If this will only be shown to small audiences, for a limited time, by
a person that doesn't draw large crowds, you might want to charge less
than someone else that performs on national TV to vast audiences.
Likewise, if this is to be a big or important part of his act, he
should pay more, than if it is just a small or minor part of his act.
To put it in the most primitive terms: The more *he* benefits, the
more *you* should benefit. Whatever arrangement you decide upon, keep
this in mind. Some have mentioned that the exposure alone might be of
benefit to you, regardless of actual payment. This is certainly a
factor to keep in mind, but only can decide how much this is worth to
you personally.
Your idea to charge for each showing is definitely a good idea. You
might also want to charge a figure based upon screen-time for the
animation itself, instead of the amount of hours you put into the
creation of the piece. In the future, if you made a longer animation
for him, it would naturally cost him more.
(That doesn't mean that you can't factor your labor into the price
somehow, but I think you should consider presenting a price to your
customer as being based upon the running length of the animation.)
Finally, I do hope you are only licensing the rights to show your
animation for a specified time period, in a specified manner, and
don't make the mistake of letting him "buy" the animation from you
entirely. (Unless you get paid a very large sum for giving up all your
future rights to the piece.)
There are a million different ways to handle this, and many of them
are good ways. I hope I gave you at least one or two good ideas to
think about.
Later,
Glen Berry
7no### [at] ezwvcom
(Remove the "7" to reply via email.)
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John VanSickle wrote:
>
> I have been approached by a fellow who wishes to show one of my Rusty
> animations as part of a 30-minute presentation at a comedy club. I am
> amenable to this, especially since this individual is willing to pay
> real money for this.
>
> What would be a reasonable figure to charge?
A friend of mine and myself show Super-8 (yes, it's still alive)
animations at disco events. We get paid about $500 per evening,
but it's all evening's work. I'd guess (especially since you didn't
do the animation to earn money with it in the first place) that
an amount of $50 to $200 would be good, depending on how much
the "fellow" gets. What about a fixed percentage of the fellow's
earnings?
Markus
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"Mike Weber" <mik### [at] pyxiscom> wrote in message
news:393c30f7@news.povray.org...
> "Scott Hill" <sco### [at] geniecouk> wrote in message
> news:393c2c0e@news.povray.org...
> > "Mike Weber" <mik### [at] pyxiscom> wrote in message
> > news:393c254b$1@news.povray.org...
> > > You shouldn't charge by the hour - what if you were learning a new
> > > technique - you shouldn't charge your customer for your training...
> > >
> >
> > Why not ? Companies routinely factor design and development costs
into
> > their product prices. Learning a new technique is, surely, just a part
of
> > that design and development process.
> >
>
> A company that can absord the cost will do that, but an individual
> shouldn't.
> Would you pay someone to build your house and charged according to time,
and
> part of that time was to learn how to cut wood?
>
Yes, but I wouldn't expect to pay anywhere near as much per hour as I
would for an experienced workman.
Set your hourly rate with respect to your ability - so although you'll
charge for more hours you'll probably still be cheaper, because your hourly
rate is lower, than someone more experienced (if not, you're over pricing
your time). Then, when you're more experienced you charge for less hours but
at a higher rate.
I think amongst artists, workmen, contract programmers and a whole host
of other people there's a kind of moral concensus that you shouldn't charge
for the time you spend learning your craft. Well, as a programmer who is
considering going semi-independent, excuse the french, but bollocks to that!
When I'm working for a company I get paid for both the time I spend working
and the time I spend learning, so, when I work for myself, am I going to
factor the time I spent learning into what I charge ? Hell yeah! But, as I
said before you charge a rate that reflects your ability, so, if your still
learning, that hourly rate should be really low.
--
Scott Hill. (sco### [at] innocentcom)
Software Engineer.
Author of Pandora's Box (coming to a web page soon(ish)).
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Serge LAROCQUE wrote:
>
> > A friend of mine and myself show Super-8 (yes, it's still alive)
> > animations at disco events.
>
> disco events? :-)
Disco is still alive ?
--
Ken Tyler - 1400+ POV-Ray, Graphics, 3D Rendering, and Raytracing Links:
http://home.pacbell.net/tylereng/index.html http://www.povray.org/links/
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Ken wrote:
>
> Disco is still alive ?
Disco isn't dead; it only smells that way.
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find out how much your client has, then charge him that - if he quibbles
drop it a bit
Rick
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John VanSickle wrote:
>
> What would be a reasonable figure to charge?
>
I recently netted about $500 US for a 3 minute clip; however it was for a
commercial trade show presentation and ran continuously for several days. So
perhaps not exactly an equivalent case.
--
Margus Ramst
Personal e-mail: mar### [at] peakeduee
TAG (Team Assistance Group) e-mail: mar### [at] tagpovrayorg
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On Tue, 06 Jun 2000 11:01:58 -0700 Ken <tyl### [at] pacbellnet> wrote:
>Disco is still alive ?
I had visions of rendered mirrored balls reflecting colored lights
around the room, Donna Summer being mixed by a deejay, wide lapels, and
platform shoes <bg>. Probably exists in more places than people might
think... although they can be clubs that feature 'dance' music, not
necessarily those '70s disco numbers.
--
Alan - ako### [at] povrayorg - a k o n g <at> p o v r a y <dot> o r g
http://www.povray.org - Home of the Persistence of Vision Ray Tracer
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Ken wrote:
>
> Disco is still alive ?
>
Retro is, like, in. Not into it much myself, tho.
--
Margus Ramst
Personal e-mail: mar### [at] peakeduee
TAG (Team Assistance Group) e-mail: mar### [at] tagpovrayorg
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Hard to tell if I was serious or joking about this "50$" amount eh? Truth is
I didn't know which myself.
Anyhow, I came across a persons 3D rendered art while looking for people who
might be selling their POV-Ray stuff. No luck far as POV for Sale goes but
someone is selling their Lightwave and Strata Studio Pro (not exactly sure if
that's what was used) images as prints for what seems to me an enormous sum of
money.
http://www.antarcticamedia.com/gallery/index.html
Me? Well, I'm cheap and I come cheap too :-)
Bob
"Bob Hughes" <per### [at] aolcom?subject=PoV-News:> wrote in message
news:393c7c09$1@news.povray.org...
| 50$
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I think I have to clarify this a little bit.
Ken wrote:
>
> > > A friend of mine and myself show Super-8 (yes, it's still alive)
> > > animations at disco events.
> Disco is still alive ?
In German, "Disco" is not only the word for a special kind
of music. Here it mostly means the location, I guess I should
have written "club events", as the music they play is more modern
than the word "disco" implies....
Markus
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"Serge LAROCQUE" <sgl### [at] hotmailcom> wrote in message
news:393### [at] hotmailcom...
| > http://www.antarcticamedia.com/gallery/index.html
|
| I just went to take a look..... you think it would be possible to reproduce
these
| without great difficulty? Specifically 'Element 115' in the 'Space' section.
A bit
| of motion blur, a nice ocean surface, and some CSG saucers ought to do it?
and
| 800$ for this???
Yes, I'm not sure what the pricing is based on. I tend to think of art I see
for sale at certain events like Alabama Jubilee this last Memorial Day
holiday. Although other exhibited art, paintings I'm talking about, can be
nearly that range. We're talking prints though in this case, not originals
:-)
While on the subject, want to see a whole collection of good stuff? Mostly 3D
Studio things it seems.
Try: http://www.raph.com/3dartists/artgallery/
Someone at an AOL message board posted about that place. Might take a couple
hours to look through the gallery.
Bob
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Josh English wrote:
>
> Personally, I'm wondering how mayn IRTC entries it will take before Rusty
> appears in his own half hour tape....
About five year's worth...
--
ICQ: 46085459
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7no### [at] ezwvcom wrote:
>
> On Mon, 05 Jun 2000 15:37:17 -0400, John VanSickle
> <van### [at] erolscom> wrote:
>
> >What would be a reasonable figure to charge?
>
> I can't give you a figure, but there is something that no one else
> seems to be mentioning here. Photographers and many other artists that
> sell to magazines, for example, adjust their charge based upon things
> such as the expected size of the audience (how big the circulation
> is), and the size the work will actually be printed at, (ie.,
> full-page, 1/4 page, etc.)
True, and I am leaning in this direction. If the venue is the
size I think it is, a dollar per showing is a reasonable amount;
and I will be selling only permission to show at those times, and
not any more rights in general.
Regards,
John
--
ICQ: 46085459
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"Serge LAROCQUE" <sgl### [at] hotmailcom> wrote in message
news:393FCC63.546B8AF5@hotmail.com...
| I think I might have come across that place a year or so ago, but it's nice
to see
| it again :-)
I got an email from Brenda (Ant### [at] aolcom) saying she had read these posts
about her site (who knew?). Just wanted to say here that I wasn't trying to
point her out of the crowd or anything, just so happened hers was the only I
had found even after a search for such things, i.e. 3D digital (POV-Ray) art
for sale.
No, she wasn't yelling at me for publicly posting about prices of her artworks
as an example :-) just letting me know the why's and how's to her reasoning.
To quote (and hope I don't step on her toes again :-)):
"I'm not trying to justify my pricing structure, however, I do graphics for a
living and this gallery is a test market. I can always adjust the prices
later.
BTW, I created Element 115 in Bryce and did not use any other programs (ie.
motion blur). Everything on display in the gallery was created in Bryce."
Unquote. There was more though, she had made the Element 115 for a bands CD.
Now be nice people, Bryce is a 3D renderer too you know ;-)
Bob
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> http://www.digitalblasphemy.com
>
> That is the site that got me into 3d graphics. I would not charge a lot.
Brendan Ryan
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I would say the most important thing is to assert that the arrangement is
not equivalent to his "purchase" of the Rusty character. If your local dry
cleaner wants to use Rusty in a TV commercial next month, make sure you
haven't made Rusty part of Joe Comedian's property.
John VanSickle wrote:
> I have been approached by a fellow who wishes to show one of my Rusty
> animations as part of a 30-minute presentation at a comedy club. I am
> amenable to this, especially since this individual is willing to pay
> real money for this.
>
> What would be a reasonable figure to charge?
>
> Regards,
> John
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