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Bald Eagle wrote in the "Metallic cityscape WIP' thread above, by Cousin
Ricky:
"I had been hunting down ... something or other ... and was reminded that
Blender, Maya, Grasshopper, and other modelers/renderers had some form of
default test object, and felt that POV-Ray ought to have something
slightly more
modern and similar - for no other reason than if it popped up in an image
search, it might arouse the curiosity of CG enthusiasts who might not
yet have
discovered our beloved raytracer."
Well, here is something that was triggered by Bill's comment... The
planet is Sam's RidgedMFPlanetB (thanks Sam).
--
Thomas
Post a reply to this message
Attachments:
Download 'logoplanet_05.jpg' (597 KB)
Preview of image 'logoplanet_05.jpg'
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Thomas de Groot <tho### [at] degroot org> wrote:
> Bald Eagle wrote in the "Metallic cityscape WIP' thread above, by Cousin
> Ricky:
>
> "I had been hunting down ... something or other ... and was reminded that
> Blender, Maya, Grasshopper, and other modelers/renderers had some form of
> default test object, and felt that POV-Ray ought to have something
> slightly more
> modern and similar - for no other reason than if it popped up in an image
> search, it might arouse the curiosity of CG enthusiasts who might not
> yet have
> discovered our beloved raytracer."
>
> Well, here is something that was triggered by Bill's comment... The
> planet is Sam's RidgedMFPlanetB (thanks Sam).
>
> --
> Thomas
Hi Thomas,
Your render looks good! It feels like it should be on an album cover for
something featured on Hearts of Space :D
Are the craters procedural, or a texture map? I've been wondering how one might
make procedural craters and your post is making me think about it again...
Sam
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"Samuel B." <stb### [at] hotmailcom> wrote:
> I've been wondering how one might
> make procedural craters and your post is making me think about it again...
Hi Sam,
You might check out the work of Sebastian Lague:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lctXaT9pxA0
and related
https://www.reddit.com/r/proceduralgeneration/comments/l4ml53/generating_lunar_craters/
https://github.com/smcameron/space-nerds-in-space/blob/master/crater.c#L146
https://www.blendswap.com/blend/17050
I gave it a whirl, but the isosurface version was too challenging to debug after
a long day, but the normal worked "better" - still hella buggy.
Maybe you'll be able to puzzle out something better.
- Bill
Post a reply to this message
Attachments:
Download 'proceduralcrater.png' (860 KB)
Preview of image 'proceduralcrater.png'
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Op 12-1-2024 om 04:00 schreef Samuel B.:
> Hi Thomas,
>
> Your render looks good! It feels like it should be on an album cover for
> something featured on Hearts of Space :D
>
> Are the craters procedural, or a texture map? I've been wondering how one might
> make procedural craters and your post is making me think about it again...
>
You are not far wrong ;-) I had one of those covers from the SF magazine
Analog in mind (somewhen 1966 - 1972) which I was reading at that time
(does not make me feel younger...) and I have half a mind to continue in
that particular vein.
The craters are generated by an uv_mapped bump_map. As I rarely do
uv_mapping directly on primitive POV objects like here, I got some
surprises which I need to investigate further. I shall certainly be back
here with some questions. The documentation only gave me partial, for my
purpose unsatisfactory answers.
Procedural craters might be an interesting option indeed. No idea at
present on how to go about it...
--
Thomas
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Op 12-1-2024 om 06:49 schreef Bald Eagle:
> "Samuel B." <stb### [at] hotmailcom> wrote:
>> I've been wondering how one might
>> make procedural craters and your post is making me think about it again...
>
>
> Hi Sam,
>
> You might check out the work of Sebastian Lague:
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lctXaT9pxA0
>
> and related
>
>
https://www.reddit.com/r/proceduralgeneration/comments/l4ml53/generating_lunar_craters/
>
> https://github.com/smcameron/space-nerds-in-space/blob/master/crater.c#L146
>
> https://www.blendswap.com/blend/17050
>
> I gave it a whirl, but the isosurface version was too challenging to debug after
> a long day, but the normal worked "better" - still hella buggy.
>
> Maybe you'll be able to puzzle out something better.
>
Not bad indeed, although the image looks a bit more like "seals" than
anything else ;-) but is might be a start. I shall visit those sites next.
--
Thomas
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"Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
> "Samuel B." <stb### [at] hotmailcom> wrote:
> > I've been wondering how one might
> > make procedural craters and your post is making me think about it again...
>
>
> Hi Sam,
>
> You might check out the work of Sebastian Lague:
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lctXaT9pxA0
>
> and related
>
>
https://www.reddit.com/r/proceduralgeneration/comments/l4ml53/generating_lunar_craters/
>
> https://github.com/smcameron/space-nerds-in-space/blob/master/crater.c#L146
>
> https://www.blendswap.com/blend/17050
Thanks for the links. I only skimmed Sebastian's video, but I got the gist of
what I need to focus on if/when I get something going myself.
> I gave it a whirl, but the isosurface version was too challenging to debug after
> a long day, but the normal worked "better" - still hella buggy.
I'm not sure what's happening with that, but experimental things rarely work the
first time (or after long days).
> Maybe you'll be able to puzzle out something better.
>
> - Bill
I'm thinking of using layered form x crackle patterns. I found some smooth
minumum/maximum functions that might help with the blending...
Sam
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Thomas de Groot <tho### [at] degrootorg> wrote:
> Op 12-1-2024 om 04:00 schreef Samuel B.:
> > Hi Thomas,
> >
> > Your render looks good! It feels like it should be on an album cover for
> > something featured on Hearts of Space :D
> >
> > Are the craters procedural, or a texture map? I've been wondering how one might
> > make procedural craters and your post is making me think about it again...
> >
> You are not far wrong ;-) I had one of those covers from the SF magazine
> Analog in mind (somewhen 1966 - 1972) which I was reading at that time
> (does not make me feel younger...) and I have half a mind to continue in
> that particular vein.
Is Analog even still being published? Some of those stories were great.
> The craters are generated by an uv_mapped bump_map. As I rarely do
> uv_mapping directly on primitive POV objects like here, I got some
> surprises which I need to investigate further. I shall certainly be back
> here with some questions. The documentation only gave me partial, for my
> purpose unsatisfactory answers.
The default uv mapping is going to be different for every primitive, of course,
and some stretching is guaranteed in any case.
I'm thinking that for complex objects, triplanar mapping might be the best thing
to use. (Triplanar mapping in POV-Ray would probably use 3 nested slope maps,
with each axis getting one planar map). There /is/ a blending issue when using
triplanar mapping, but it can be mitigated somewhat. It's one of those things I
haven't gotten around to yet (I was going to use something similar to depict
claymation-style fingerprints on objects), but if I make any headway I'll post
it.
> Procedural craters might be an interesting option indeed. No idea at
> present on how to go about it...
>
> --
> Thomas
I'm thinking crackle form x patterns as a basis, but it's going to take a bit of
work...
Sam
Post a reply to this message
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"Samuel B." <stb### [at] hotmailcom> wrote:
> I'm thinking that for complex objects, triplanar mapping might be the best thing
> to use. (Triplanar mapping in POV-Ray would probably use 3 nested slope maps,
> with each axis getting one planar map). There /is/ a blending issue when using
> triplanar mapping, but it can be mitigated somewhat. It's one of those things I
> haven't gotten around to yet (I was going to use something similar to depict
> claymation-style fingerprints on objects), but if I make any headway I'll post
> it.
I was _just_ reading this article ... last night, in fact.
At work.
Because I had gotten all of my work done already.
:D
http://iquilezles.org/articles/biplanar/
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Op 13/01/2024 om 02:30 schreef Samuel B.:
>
> Is Analog even still being published? Some of those stories were great.
>
It seems to be:
https://www.analogsf.com/
> The default uv mapping is going to be different for every primitive, of course,
> and some stretching is guaranteed in any case.
>
Yes, I noticed that.
> I'm thinking that for complex objects, triplanar mapping might be the best thing
> to use. (Triplanar mapping in POV-Ray would probably use 3 nested slope maps,
> with each axis getting one planar map). There /is/ a blending issue when using
> triplanar mapping, but it can be mitigated somewhat. It's one of those things I
> haven't gotten around to yet (I was going to use something similar to depict
> claymation-style fingerprints on objects), but if I make any headway I'll post
> it.
>
>
> I'm thinking crackle form x patterns as a basis, but it's going to take a bit of
> work...
>
Exciting info indeed! I shall study these ideas also; I don't like to
sit back and wait for others to do the dirty jobs :-)
--
Thomas
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"Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
> "Samuel B." <stb### [at] hotmailcom> wrote:
>
> > I'm thinking that for complex objects, triplanar mapping might be the best thing
> > to use. (Triplanar mapping in POV-Ray would probably use 3 nested slope maps,
> > with each axis getting one planar map). There /is/ a blending issue when using
> > triplanar mapping, but it can be mitigated somewhat. It's one of those things I
> > haven't gotten around to yet (I was going to use something similar to depict
> > claymation-style fingerprints on objects), but if I make any headway I'll post
> > it.
>
> I was _just_ reading this article ... last night, in fact.
> At work.
> Because I had gotten all of my work done already.
>
> :D
>
> http://iquilezles.org/articles/biplanar/
Hmm, I seem to remember seeing something about that before. I haven't looked at
the code very closely, but using two texture samples instead of three seems a
bit like magic. I wonder if it's more expensive than doing it the standard
way...
Sam
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Thomas de Groot <tho### [at] degrootorg> wrote:
> Op 13/01/2024 om 02:30 schreef Samuel B.:
> >
> > Is Analog even still being published? Some of those stories were great.
> >
> It seems to be:
>
> https://www.analogsf.com/
Ah cool. I'm a bit tempted to get a subscription for my mom (which would
eventually make its way here as well). I should probably check with the library
before doing that, though :D
> > The default uv mapping is going to be different for every primitive, of course,
> > and some stretching is guaranteed in any case.
> >
> Yes, I noticed that.
>
> > I'm thinking that for complex objects, triplanar mapping might be the best thing
> > to use. (Triplanar mapping in POV-Ray would probably use 3 nested slope maps,
> > with each axis getting one planar map). There /is/ a blending issue when using
> > triplanar mapping, but it can be mitigated somewhat. It's one of those things I
> > haven't gotten around to yet (I was going to use something similar to depict
> > claymation-style fingerprints on objects), but if I make any headway I'll post
> > it.
> >
> > I'm thinking crackle form x patterns as a basis, but it's going to take a bit of
> > work...
> >
> Exciting info indeed! I shall study these ideas also; I don't like to
> sit back and wait for others to do the dirty jobs :-)
>
> --
> Thomas
That's the spirit!
I managed to get one thing done today: the triplanar mapping
(https://news.povray.org/povray.binaries.images/thread/%3Cweb.65a4705751388f9716bed5696e741498%40news.povray.org%3E/).
It's very basic and doesn't have a sharpness setting (rate of transition between
normals).
The craters idea will have to wait for another day.
Sam
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Op 15/01/2024 om 00:50 schreef Samuel B.:
> Thomas de Groot <tho### [at] degrootorg> wrote:
>> Op 13/01/2024 om 02:30 schreef Samuel B.:
>>>
>>> Is Analog even still being published? Some of those stories were great.
>>>
>> It seems to be:
>>
>> https://www.analogsf.com/
>
> Ah cool. I'm a bit tempted to get a subscription for my mom (which would
> eventually make its way here as well). I should probably check with the library
> before doing that, though :D
>
<grin>
It is amazing that they still do exist after such a long time (1930, if
I am correct). Analog was indeed my first introduction to the (serious)
SF literature.
>>> The default uv mapping is going to be different for every primitive, of course,
>>> and some stretching is guaranteed in any case.
>>>
>> Yes, I noticed that.
>>
>>> I'm thinking that for complex objects, triplanar mapping might be the best thing
>>> to use. (Triplanar mapping in POV-Ray would probably use 3 nested slope maps,
>>> with each axis getting one planar map). There /is/ a blending issue when using
>>> triplanar mapping, but it can be mitigated somewhat. It's one of those things I
>>> haven't gotten around to yet (I was going to use something similar to depict
>>> claymation-style fingerprints on objects), but if I make any headway I'll post
>>> it.
>>>
>>> I'm thinking crackle form x patterns as a basis, but it's going to take a bit of
>>> work...
>>>
>> Exciting info indeed! I shall study these ideas also; I don't like to
>> sit back and wait for others to do the dirty jobs :-)
>>
>> --
>> Thomas
>
> That's the spirit!
>
> I managed to get one thing done today: the triplanar mapping
>
(https://news.povray.org/povray.binaries.images/thread/%3Cweb.65a4705751388f9716bed5696e741498%40news.povray.org%3E/).
> It's very basic and doesn't have a sharpness setting (rate of transition between
> normals).
>
That is really looking good, Sam! I shall have to play with this.
Yesterday, I was exploring different issues more or less related to this
and I experimented with the lunar crater image inside a cubic pattern,
thinking that, perhaps, it would do something /similar/ to triplanar
mapping. Of course it didn't, but it was a useful sidetrack because I
could use it in an interesting way with a superellipsoid for instance,
and even with the ovus object (which last one has a strange basic
uv_mapping which I cannot agree with).
I had not got around to switch to pigment_pattern or image_pattern use,
but it was on my ToDo.
> The craters idea will have to wait for another day.
>
Of course. Still, a great progress already and worth a warm round of
applause!
--
Thomas
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From: Thomas de Groot
Subject: Re: Logo Planet + triplanar mapping (wip)
Date: 17 Jan 2024 11:49:38
Message: <65a80522@news.povray.org>
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And here is a first view of the logo with triplanar mapping (and other
background changes).
Still wip scene of course...
--
Thomas
Post a reply to this message
Attachments:
Download 'logoplanet_triplanar.png' (832 KB)
Preview of image 'logoplanet_triplanar.png'
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hi,
Thomas de Groot <tho### [at] degrootorg> wrote:
> And here is a first view ...
"Just turn your eyeballs into craters ..." ;-)
(could that device be Hawkwind's long sought for "Orgone Accumulator" ?)
regards, jr.
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Op 17-1-2024 om 18:19 schreef jr:
> hi,
>
> Thomas de Groot <tho### [at] degrootorg> wrote:
>> And here is a first view ...
>
> "Just turn your eyeballs into craters ..." ;-)
>
Thanks! I am very happy to have triplanar mapping available within
POV-Ray now. Could solve some issues I had in the past.
>
> (could that device be Hawkwind's long sought for "Orgone Accumulator" ?)
>
LOL yes, might well be indeed...
[now playing: Hawkwind - "Orgone Accumulator" from Space Ritual album]
...ancient memories... ;-)
--
Thomas
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Thomas de Groot <tho### [at] degrootorg> wrote:
> And here is a first view of the logo with triplanar mapping (and other
> background changes).
>
> Still wip scene of course...
>
> [...]
>
> Thanks! I am very happy to have triplanar mapping available within
> POV-Ray now. Could solve some issues I had in the past.
It's coming right along! I like the idea of the moon-textured P exterior around
the planet.
I forgot to mention it (and you probably already know this), but triplanar
mapping doesn't play well with hard edges. I can't really see a problem in your
image due to the shadows on the inside of the round shape, but discontinuities
are likely there.
SAm
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Op 19-1-2024 om 00:54 schreef Samuel B.:
> It's coming right along! I like the idea of the moon-textured P exterior around
> the planet.
>
Thanks Sam, yes, this triplanar mapping is what was needed here.
Different little ideas I got at night while not sleeping I want to
try/implement into the next version.
> I forgot to mention it (and you probably already know this), but triplanar
> mapping doesn't play well with hard edges. I can't really see a problem in your
> image due to the shadows on the inside of the round shape, but discontinuities
> are likely there.
>
No problem here and, possibly, not even a real problem if visible: I can
imagine that craters would not line-up over hard edges like here. I have
not decided yet if the inside of the crescent should not get a different
texture though...
--
Thomas
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Thomas de Groot <tho### [at] degrootorg> wrote:
> Op 19-1-2024 om 00:54 schreef Samuel B.:
> > It's coming right along! I like the idea of the moon-textured P exterior around
> > the planet.
> >
> Thanks Sam, yes, this triplanar mapping is what was needed here.
> Different little ideas I got at night while not sleeping I want to
> try/implement into the next version.
What is it with not being able to sleep as well over time? Less endogenous
melatonin?
> > I forgot to mention it (and you probably already know this), but triplanar
> > mapping doesn't play well with hard edges. I can't really see a problem in your
> > image due to the shadows on the inside of the round shape, but discontinuities
> > are likely there.
> >
> No problem here and, possibly, not even a real problem if visible: I can
> imagine that craters would not line-up over hard edges like here.
Right, that makes sense. The only way that would happen is if the impacts blew
holes through the edges, but making that work wouldn't be easy...
> I have not decided yet if the inside of the crescent should not get a different
> texture though...
>
> --
> Thomas
Like what? Something half molten? Or crumbly?
Sam
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Op 22/01/2024 om 02:10 schreef Samuel B.:
> Thomas de Groot <tho### [at] degrootorg> wrote:
>> Op 19-1-2024 om 00:54 schreef Samuel B.:
>>> It's coming right along! I like the idea of the moon-textured P exterior around
>>> the planet.
>>>
>> Thanks Sam, yes, this triplanar mapping is what was needed here.
>> Different little ideas I got at night while not sleeping I want to
>> try/implement into the next version.
>
> What is it with not being able to sleep as well over time? Less endogenous
> melatonin?
>
Oh no! nothing as dramatic! :-) I sleep very well indeed (eight to nine
hours on an average night) which, at my age, is rather exceptional.
However, and I think that many experience the same, I may wake up at
night with an idea/solution for something I have been working on during
the previous day(s).
>>> I forgot to mention it (and you probably already know this), but triplanar
>>> mapping doesn't play well with hard edges. I can't really see a problem in your
>>> image due to the shadows on the inside of the round shape, but discontinuities
>>> are likely there.
>>>
>> No problem here and, possibly, not even a real problem if visible: I can
>> imagine that craters would not line-up over hard edges like here.
>
> Right, that makes sense. The only way that would happen is if the impacts blew
> holes through the edges, but making that work wouldn't be easy...
>
Correct, but I am not modelling the Real World, as you probably may have
noticed by now... :-)
>> I have not decided yet if the inside of the crescent should not get a different
>> texture though...
>
> Like what? Something half molten? Or crumbly?
>
Not sure yet. The ideas are in flux...
--
Thomas
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Il 17/01/2024 17:49, Thomas de Groot ha scritto:
> And here is a first view of the logo with triplanar mapping (and other
> background changes).
>
> Still wip scene of course...
>
A very nice improvement of the scene, Thomas!
Just a question: the detail of the planet seems different respect the
detail of the rusted P of the logo. Is it intended?
Paolo
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Op 28/01/2024 om 19:06 schreef Paolo Gibellini:
> Il 17/01/2024 17:49, Thomas de Groot ha scritto:
>> And here is a first view of the logo with triplanar mapping (and other
>> background changes).
>>
>> Still wip scene of course...
>>
>
> A very nice improvement of the scene, Thomas!
> Just a question: the detail of the planet seems different respect the
> detail of the rusted P of the logo. Is it intended?
>
> Paolo
Totally different textures and, I should say, totally different
modelling. The planet is Sam Benge's work: RidgedMFPlanetB.pov in his
post here "Ridged Multifractal Planet", in October 2023.
--
Thomas
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Il 29/01/2024 08:36, Thomas de Groot ha scritto:
> Op 28/01/2024 om 19:06 schreef Paolo Gibellini:
>> Il 17/01/2024 17:49, Thomas de Groot ha scritto:
>>> And here is a first view of the logo with triplanar mapping (and
>>> other background changes).
>>>
>>> Still wip scene of course...
>>>
>>
>> A very nice improvement of the scene, Thomas!
>> Just a question: the detail of the planet seems different respect the
>> detail of the rusted P of the logo. Is it intended?
>>
>> Paolo
>
> Totally different textures and, I should say, totally different
> modelling. The planet is Sam Benge's work: RidgedMFPlanetB.pov in his
> post here "Ridged Multifractal Planet", in October 2023.
>
Oh, i see. Thanks,
Paolo
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