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My younger son's Cub Scout Pinewood Derby is coming up and I thought it
would be fun to model the car before we build it. So far I've done the
wheel and have started on the axle. The image below was modeled in Moray
3.3, uses MegaPov 0.6, antialiasing, radiousity (I think), and reflection.
It took about 4hrs 15min to render on a AMD Athlon 1.2Ghz. DUDE! Isn't
that an unrealistically long time for an image like this? It has ALOT of
CSG, but the render time surprised me. I've heard bounding mentioned here
before but don't really have a good understanding of how to use it. Anyone
have any suggestions about how to decrease the render time, or about
improvements on the wheel? Does MegaPov need a command line switch to
actually turn on radiousity?
Thanks,
Cris Williams
Post a reply to this message
Attachments:
Download 'pwd wheel.jpg' (144 KB)
Preview of image 'pwd wheel.jpg'
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> It took about 4hrs 15min to render on a AMD Athlon 1.2Ghz. DUDE! Isn't
> that an unrealistically long time for an image like this?
Wait for a Googlehertze machine to come out...?
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From: Christoph Hormann
Subject: Re: Pinewood Derby Phase I (143 KB)
Date: 22 Feb 2001 04:14:51
Message: <3A94D889.58B131A4@gmx.de>
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Cris Williams wrote:
>
> My younger son's Cub Scout Pinewood Derby is coming up and I thought it
> would be fun to model the car before we build it. So far I've done the
> wheel and have started on the axle. The image below was modeled in Moray
> 3.3, uses MegaPov 0.6, antialiasing, radiousity (I think), and reflection.
> It took about 4hrs 15min to render on a AMD Athlon 1.2Ghz. DUDE! Isn't
> that an unrealistically long time for an image like this? It has ALOT of
> CSG, but the render time surprised me. I've heard bounding mentioned here
> before but don't really have a good understanding of how to use it. Anyone
> have any suggestions about how to decrease the render time, or about
> improvements on the wheel?
It's not that astonishing IMO, since you are using several light sources,
reflection, complex objects, ...
Maybe try turning off those things one after the other and check the
render time.
BTW, the wood texture looks a bit strange with the concentric rings
(normal?)
> Does MegaPov need a command line switch to
> actually turn on radiousity?
Yes, you have to add '+qr' to turn it on in addition to the radiosity{}
block.
Christoph
--
Christoph Hormann <chr### [at] gmx de>
IsoWood include, radiosity tutorial, TransSkin and other
things on: http://www.schunter.etc.tu-bs.de/~chris/
Post a reply to this message
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The wood textured plane is just something I picked at random to slide under
the wheels at this point. But your right, I could have picked a less
distracting texture. Another question about radiousity - since I'm using
Moray, the Pov code doesn't have the "#version unofficial MegaPOV 0.6;" line
in it. Will the radiousity be Pov-style or MegaPov-style without it? At
this point I'm not using any MegaPov-specific features (but I do want
MegaPov radiosity).
Cris Williams
"Christoph Hormann" <chr### [at] gmxde> wrote in message
news:3A94D889.58B131A4@gmx.de...
>
> BTW, the wood texture looks a bit strange with the concentric rings
> (normal?)
>
>
> > Does MegaPov need a command line switch to
> > actually turn on radiousity?
>
> Yes, you have to add '+qr' to turn it on in addition to the radiosity{}
> block.
>
> Christoph
>
> --
> Christoph Hormann <chr### [at] gmxde>
> IsoWood include, radiosity tutorial, TransSkin and other
> things on: http://www.schunter.etc.tu-bs.de/~chris/
Post a reply to this message
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From: Christoph Hormann
Subject: Re: Pinewood Derby Phase I (143 KB)
Date: 22 Feb 2001 09:43:47
Message: <3A9525A0.5B2D79D8@gmx.de>
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Cris Williams wrote:
>
> The wood textured plane is just something I picked at random to slide under
> the wheels at this point. But your right, I could have picked a less
> distracting texture. Another question about radiousity - since I'm using
> Moray, the Pov code doesn't have the "#version unofficial MegaPOV 0.6;" line
> in it. Will the radiousity be Pov-style or MegaPov-style without it? At
> this point I'm not using any MegaPov-specific features (but I do want
> MegaPov radiosity).
>
Megapov docu, section: Enabling MegaPov Features:
"Backwards compatibility is not available for radiosity."
meaning that it always uses megapov radiosity.
Anyway using old style radiosity settings will not give any reasonable
results so you will probably not be able to avoid editing the files
manually.
Christoph
--
Christoph Hormann <chr### [at] gmxde>
IsoWood include, radiosity tutorial, TransSkin and other
things on: http://www.schunter.etc.tu-bs.de/~chris/
Post a reply to this message
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In article <3a9494ea@news.povray.org>, Cris Williams says...
> My younger son's Cub Scout Pinewood Derby is coming up and I thought it
> would be fun to model the car before we build it. So far I've done the
> wheel and have started on the axle. The image below was modeled in Moray
> 3.3, uses MegaPov 0.6, antialiasing, radiousity (I think), and reflection.
> It took about 4hrs 15min to render on a AMD Athlon 1.2Ghz. DUDE! Isn't
> that an unrealistically long time for an image like this? It has ALOT of
> CSG, but the render time surprised me. I've heard bounding mentioned here
> before but don't really have a good understanding of how to use it. Anyone
> have any suggestions about how to decrease the render time, or about
> improvements on the wheel? Does MegaPov need a command line switch to
> actually turn on radiousity?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Cris Williams
>
I can't help you to explain the long render time, but I think the
texture is great! Will you publish it??
--
Regards, Sander
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It's nothin' fancy, but thanks!
#declare wheel_texture =
material // wheel_texture
{
texture
{
pigment
{
color rgb <0.239567, 0.239567, 0.1979>
}
normal
{
bumps , 0.05
bump_size 0.05
}
finish
{
ambient 0.0
diffuse 0.1007
brilliance 3.909667
phong 0.165467
phong_size 30.463333
specular 0.194233
roughness 0.3308
reflection 0.0275
crand 0.0935
}
}
}
Cris Williams
"Sander" <san### [at] stolscom> wrote in message
news:MPG### [at] NEWSPOVRAYORG...
> >
> I can't help you to explain the long render time, but I think the
> texture is great! Will you publish it??
> --
> Regards, Sander
Post a reply to this message
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*DEFINATLY* look at using some isosurface boards using the Isowood
include. Make things VERY nice, even if just for background stuffs..
"Cris Williams" <wor### [at] netscapenet> wrote in message
news:3a9494ea@news.povray.org...
> My younger son's Cub Scout Pinewood Derby is coming up and I thought it
> would be fun to model the car before we build it. So far I've done the
> wheel and have started on the axle. The image below was modeled in Moray
> 3.3, uses MegaPov 0.6, antialiasing, radiousity (I think), and reflection.
> It took about 4hrs 15min to render on a AMD Athlon 1.2Ghz. DUDE! Isn't
> that an unrealistically long time for an image like this? It has ALOT of
> CSG, but the render time surprised me. I've heard bounding mentioned here
> before but don't really have a good understanding of how to use it.
Anyone
> have any suggestions about how to decrease the render time, or about
> improvements on the wheel? Does MegaPov need a command line switch to
> actually turn on radiousity?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Cris Williams
>
>
>
>
>
Post a reply to this message
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From: Christoph Hormann
Subject: Re: Pinewood Derby Phase I (143 KB)
Date: 22 Feb 2001 11:27:30
Message: <3A953DE4.FD7BE4D@gmx.de>
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Cris Williams wrote:
>
> finish
> {
> ambient 0.0
> diffuse 0.1007
> brilliance 3.909667
> phong 0.165467
> phong_size 30.463333
> specular 0.194233
> roughness 0.3308
> reflection 0.0275
> crand 0.0935
> }
There usually is not much need to use both phong and specular highlights
apart from slowing things down and creating certain special effects.
Christoph
--
Christoph Hormann <chr### [at] gmxde>
IsoWood include, radiosity tutorial, TransSkin and other
things on: http://www.schunter.etc.tu-bs.de/~chris/
Post a reply to this message
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"Christoph Hormann" <chr### [at] gmxde> wrote in message
news:3A9### [at] gmxde...
>
> > phong 0.165467
> > phong_size 30.463333
> > specular 0.194233
> > roughness 0.3308
>
> There usually is not much need to use both phong and specular highlights
> apart from slowing things down and creating certain special effects.
Ah yes, but in this case it does make a difference. Seeing this message I
at first thought the roughness was 0.03308, not 0.3308. If it were then
both highlights would have been very similar in both intensity and size.
This texture actually has a relatively large specular and smaller phong
highlight.
I often use the both of them together. Anyway, I figure you might have also
thought the two were close in appearance so I wanted to speak up here.
Bob H.
Post a reply to this message
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From: Christoph Hormann
Subject: Re: Pinewood Derby Phase I (143 KB)
Date: 22 Feb 2001 12:37:06
Message: <3A954E3F.FD34CF80@gmx.de>
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"Bob H." wrote:
>
> Ah yes, but in this case it does make a difference. Seeing this message I
> at first thought the roughness was 0.03308, not 0.3308. If it were then
> both highlights would have been very similar in both intensity and size.
> This texture actually has a relatively large specular and smaller phong
> highlight.
> I often use the both of them together. Anyway, I figure you might have also
> thought the two were close in appearance so I wanted to speak up here.
>
That's what i meant with 'special effects'. I'm not sure if i leads to
visible results here, brilliance is also quite high giving a third factor
to take into account.
Christoph
--
Christoph Hormann <chr### [at] gmxde>
IsoWood include, radiosity tutorial, TransSkin and other
things on: http://www.schunter.etc.tu-bs.de/~chris/
Post a reply to this message
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I would say that's not totally outrageous for your render time. You have
some pretty complex CSG going on there. I'm guessing that you've subtracted
a torus from your text to get the curved effect on the surface of the wheel.
If this is correct, then that's an even more complicated calculation. Also,
it depends on your AA settings. Finally, check for subtraction vs. merge
settings on your CSG's. You might be able to speed things up a bit.
"Cris Williams" <wor### [at] netscapenet> wrote in message
news:3a9494ea@news.povray.org...
> My younger son's Cub Scout Pinewood Derby is coming up and I thought it
> would be fun to model the car before we build it. So far I've done the
> wheel and have started on the axle. The image below was modeled in Moray
> 3.3, uses MegaPov 0.6, antialiasing, radiousity (I think), and reflection.
> It took about 4hrs 15min to render on a AMD Athlon 1.2Ghz. DUDE! Isn't
> that an unrealistically long time for an image like this? It has ALOT of
> CSG, but the render time surprised me. I've heard bounding mentioned here
> before but don't really have a good understanding of how to use it.
Anyone
> have any suggestions about how to decrease the render time, or about
> improvements on the wheel? Does MegaPov need a command line switch to
> actually turn on radiousity?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Cris Williams
>
>
>
>
>
Post a reply to this message
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Well, it comes down to this - you gentlemen know exactly how each of the
finish components interact and thus approach the task of creating textures
methodically and scientifically. I, on the other hand, have only a vague
understanding of what I'm doing, and just sit and wiggle the slider knobs
until I arrive at something acceptably close to the desired appearance. :-)
I am pretty happy with what I ended up, though, despite my hit-and-miss
approach. I prefer to think of textures as half art and half voodoo. If
you know what you're going to end up with before you start, then it takes
all the fun away!
Cris Williams
"Christoph Hormann" <chr### [at] gmxde> wrote in message
news:3A954E3F.FD34CF80@gmx.de...
>
>
> "Bob H." wrote:
> >
> > Ah yes, but in this case it does make a difference. Seeing this message
I
> > at first thought the roughness was 0.03308, not 0.3308. If it were then
> > both highlights would have been very similar in both intensity and size.
> > This texture actually has a relatively large specular and smaller phong
> > highlight.
> > I often use the both of them together. Anyway, I figure you might have
also
> > thought the two were close in appearance so I wanted to speak up here.
> >
>
> That's what i meant with 'special effects'. I'm not sure if i leads to
> visible results here, brilliance is also quite high giving a third factor
> to take into account.
>
> Christoph
>
> --
> Christoph Hormann <chr### [at] gmxde>
> IsoWood include, radiosity tutorial, TransSkin and other
> things on: http://www.schunter.etc.tu-bs.de/~chris/
Post a reply to this message
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Actually, I merged the text and a torus to curve the text. It seemed more
efficient than subtracting a torus from a cylinder (or rectangle), and then
subtracting the result from the text. I'm using an AA setting of 0.3.
I'm not sure what you are saying about the CSG's. Which is faster,
difference or merge?
Cris Williams
"Dennis McDaniel" <dmc### [at] yahoocom> wrote in message
news:3a955e00$1@news.povray.org...
> I would say that's not totally outrageous for your render time. You have
> some pretty complex CSG going on there. I'm guessing that you've
subtracted
> a torus from your text to get the curved effect on the surface of the
wheel.
> If this is correct, then that's an even more complicated calculation.
Also,
> it depends on your AA settings. Finally, check for subtraction vs. merge
> settings on your CSG's. You might be able to speed things up a bit.
>
Post a reply to this message
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Sorry couldn't resist.
This scene took 8m 18s at a 750MHz Athlon.
The picture doesn't exactly look like yours, but I think the important
parts are done.
Rendert with 512x384 Pixel and a antialiasing of 0.3
Stefan
--
http://home.t-online.de/home/StefanWz/
Post a reply to this message
Attachments:
Download 'reifen3.jpg' (19 KB)
Download 'reifen2.pov.txt' (5 KB)
Preview of image 'reifen3.jpg'
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I am pretty happy with what I ended up, though, despite my hit-and-miss
approach. I prefer to think of textures as half art and half voodoo. If
you know what you're going to end up with before you start, then it takes
all the fun away!
***
Exactly !!!
My greatest finds are those things I discover because I've made a
wrong turn and ended up in a place that I never would have imagined
even existed if I hadn't strayed from the path. I never finish a program
. . . always something new to add or try . . . some new direction grabs
me and I'm off. Of course, I never complete anything either and that is
probably a fault. I am never lacking for ideas but If I worked for R&D,
I'd need a team of people to finish the task 'cause as soon as I've fingered
out how some thing works . . . I'm off to the next. Character flaw to be
sure but by god its MY flaw and I don't have time to worry about it ;) hehe
However, with POVray and MegaPOV . . . there is no need to worry
about getting bored . . . awesome stuff this !!! Thanks to all of you here
for making it work.
Y
where to next?
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So tell me! How was this done? (Um, and why?) :-)
Cris Williams
"Weinzierl Stefan" <Ste### [at] t-onlinede> wrote in message
news:3A9590DF.A2C9C05C@t-online.de...
> Sorry couldn't resist.
>
> This scene took 8m 18s at a 750MHz Athlon.
>
> The picture doesn't exactly look like yours, but I think the important
> parts are done.
>
> Rendert with 512x384 Pixel and a antialiasing of 0.3
>
> Stefan
>
> --
> http://home.t-online.de/home/StefanWz/
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
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Nekar Xenos wrote:
> Wait for a Googlehertz machine to come out...?
In one googolhert, an electrical signal in copper (~.7c) can travel 2.1e-68
yoctometers, or seven quadrillionths of one vigintillionth of the Compton
charge radius of an electron. I don't think we'll be seeing processors that
fast anytime soon. <G>
--
David Fontaine <dav### [at] faricynet> ICQ 55354965
My raytracing gallery: http://davidf.faricy.net/
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Still, it's nice to dream... :)
Just think... a game engine like 'the Matrix'...
Nekar Xenos
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Cris Williams wrote in message <3a958309@news.povray.org>...
>I am pretty happy with what I ended up, though, despite my hit-and-miss
>approach. I prefer to think of textures as half art and half voodoo. If
>you know what you're going to end up with before you start, then it takes
>all the fun away!
I agree. If you look back through the newsgroup, you'll find an image of a
spaceship I posted under the title of "Generation Blobship". I was trying
to get an oily metal texture for the surface, but instead got foam rubber!
--
Mark
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Hi,
Cris Williams schrieb:
>
> So tell me! How was this done? (Um, and why?) :-)
>
I've attached my scene at the first posting.
But I think that you used merge instead of union, which I think is a
little bit faster.
Stefan
--
http://home.t-online.de/home/StefanWz/
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Oh, yea - I missed the source the first time around. Thank you! After
comparing yours to mine I came to the conclusion that we weren't doing
anything differently enough to account for such a big render time
difference, that is until I looked at the lighting. Area lights kill! Of
course, I was using area lighting to the extreme, and when I changed them to
point lights my scene rendered 15 TIMES FASTER! Oh well, live and learn.
I'll probably still use area lights for my final renders, but it's nice to
know that I don't have to wait 5 hours for an intermediate render. Thanks
for your help!
Cris Williams
"Weinzierl Stefan" <Ste### [at] t-onlinede> wrote in message
news:3A963831.6B13C7B8@t-online.de...
> Hi,
>
> Cris Williams schrieb:
> >
> > So tell me! How was this done? (Um, and why?) :-)
> >
> I've attached my scene at the first posting.
> But I think that you used merge instead of union, which I think is a
> little bit faster.
>
> Stefan
>
> --
> http://home.t-online.de/home/StefanWz/
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