POV-Ray : Newsgroups : povray.beta-test : Call to Arms: Datetime Server Time
24 Sep 2021 05:30:27 EDT (-0400)
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From: clipka
Subject: Call to Arms: Datetime
Date: 11 Aug 2021 07:08:47
Message: <6113afbf$1@news.povray.org>
Folks,

regarding the `datetime(now)` issue, I need more information from you 
folks, to make sure I'm not hunting a phantom.


As far as I can tell, there may be as many as three variants of behavior 
out there, with `datetime(now)` returning the current time as either...:

(A) UTC time,

(B) LOCAL time, properly respecting daylight savings time, or

(C) LOCAL time, IGNORING daylight savings time,

with all variants appending a literal "Z" (intended to indicate UTC, but 
being bonkers in cases (B) and (C)).


There are also two variants of the source code out there... well, 
actually three by now:

(1) Some old boost-based source code;

(2) some newer C++11-based code; and

(3) a variant of (1) with a fix to enforce behavior (A).


These variants were used in the following POV-Ray versions:

v3.7.0.0 - v3.8.0-alpha.10013324 (2019-01-14):
Variant (1)

v3.8.0-alpha.10064268 (2019-02-19) - v3.8.0-alpha.11272893 (last alpha):
Variant (2)

v3.8.0-beta.1:
Variant (1) again

v3.8.0-beta.2:
Variant (3)


I need your help to test the different variants of the code (especially 
(1) and (2)) on your machines, and let me know:

- What behavior you are observing for code variant (1);
- what behavior you are observing for code variant (2);
- what operating system you are using; and
- what version of boost POV-Ray has been compiled with.

Bonus questions:

- Using genuine POV-Ray, have you ever, and beyond doubt, observed 
behavior (B) during times when DST was in effect in your time zone?


(Please disregard derivatives such as rpov in this test/poll. They have 
no impact whatsoever on the question I'm eager to get answers to.)


I have a hunch that I may have been looking in a completely wrong 
direction in this matter.


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From: Thomas de Groot
Subject: Re: Call to Arms: Datetime
Date: 11 Aug 2021 08:13:42
Message: <6113bef6$1@news.povray.org>
I don't know if the following is answering your questions but anyway, 
these are the versions I have currently accessible on my laptop:

Using win10

v3.7.0 local time (daylight-saving): 13:36 datetime(now): 11:36:53Z

v3.8.0-alpha.9893777+av622.msvc14.win64 local time (daylight-saving): 
13:42 datetime(now): 11:42:52Z

v3.8.0-x.freetype.4+av723.msvc14.win64 local time (daylight-saving): 
13:47 datetime(now): 12:47:09Z

v3.8.0-beta.1+gh6.msvc14.win64 local time (daylight-saving): 13:51 
datetime(now): 11:51:38Z

v3.8.0-beta.2+gh7.msvc14.win64 local time (daylight-saving): 13:54 
datetime(now): 11:54:14Z

The third one is deviant. No idea about "boost version".

Thomas


Op 11-8-2021 om 13:08 schreef clipka:
> Folks,
> 
> regarding the `datetime(now)` issue, I need more information from you 
> folks, to make sure I'm not hunting a phantom.
> 
> 
> As far as I can tell, there may be as many as three variants of behavior 
> out there, with `datetime(now)` returning the current time as either...:
> 
> (A) UTC time,
> 
> (B) LOCAL time, properly respecting daylight savings time, or
> 
> (C) LOCAL time, IGNORING daylight savings time,
> 
> with all variants appending a literal "Z" (intended to indicate UTC, but 
> being bonkers in cases (B) and (C)).
> 
> 
> There are also two variants of the source code out there... well, 
> actually three by now:
> 
> (1) Some old boost-based source code;
> 
> (2) some newer C++11-based code; and
> 
> (3) a variant of (1) with a fix to enforce behavior (A).
> 
> 
> These variants were used in the following POV-Ray versions:
> 
> v3.7.0.0 - v3.8.0-alpha.10013324 (2019-01-14):
> Variant (1)
> 
> v3.8.0-alpha.10064268 (2019-02-19) - v3.8.0-alpha.11272893 (last alpha):
> Variant (2)
> 
> v3.8.0-beta.1:
> Variant (1) again
> 
> v3.8.0-beta.2:
> Variant (3)
> 
> 
> I need your help to test the different variants of the code (especially 
> (1) and (2)) on your machines, and let me know:
> 
> - What behavior you are observing for code variant (1);
> - what behavior you are observing for code variant (2);
> - what operating system you are using; and
> - what version of boost POV-Ray has been compiled with.
> 
> Bonus questions:
> 
> - Using genuine POV-Ray, have you ever, and beyond doubt, observed 
> behavior (B) during times when DST was in effect in your time zone?
> 
> 
> (Please disregard derivatives such as rpov in this test/poll. They have 
> no impact whatsoever on the question I'm eager to get answers to.)
> 
> 
> I have a hunch that I may have been looking in a completely wrong 
> direction in this matter.


-- 
Thomas


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From: jr
Subject: Re: Call to Arms: Datetime
Date: 11 Aug 2021 08:30:00
Message: <web.6113c1c821f771715e0fed26cde94f1@news.povray.org>
hi,

clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
> Folks,
>
> regarding the `datetime(now)` issue, I need more information from you
> folks, to make sure I'm not hunting a phantom.
>
>
> As far as I can tell, there may be as many as three variants of behavior
> out there, with `datetime(now)` returning the current time as either...:
>
> (A) UTC time,
>
> (B) LOCAL time, properly respecting daylight savings time, or
>
> (C) LOCAL time, IGNORING daylight savings time,
>
> with all variants appending a literal "Z" (intended to indicate UTC, but
> being bonkers in cases (B) and (C)).

I get, for Slackware 14.[12] systems, '(c)'; tried with 3.7.0.8 and 3.7.1 (alpha
and rc), and various 3.8.0, from alpha 9945627 to beta.1.  same for 3.7.0.8 on a
Debian VM.  all but Debian "unofficial" versions built from tarballs.


regards, jr.


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From: William F Pokorny
Subject: Re: Call to Arms: Datetime
Date: 11 Aug 2021 09:14:33
Message: <6113cd39$1@news.povray.org>
On 8/11/21 7:08 AM, clipka wrote:
> Bonus questions:
> 
> - Using genuine POV-Ray, have you ever, and beyond doubt, observed 
> behavior (B) during times when DST was in effect in your time zone?

No.

Bill P.


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From: clipka
Subject: Re: Call to Arms: Datetime
Date: 11 Aug 2021 10:18:55
Message: <6113dc4f$1@news.povray.org>
Am 11.08.2021 um 14:13 schrieb Thomas de Groot:
> I don't know if the following is answering your questions but anyway, 
> these are the versions I have currently accessible on my laptop:

Information about your actual time zone would have been helpful, but I 
have enough material to make an educated guess about that.

> The third one is deviant. No idea about "boost version".

When you start up POV-Ray for Windows, the initial message pane content 
will list the boost version close to the bottm. But with the Windows 
versions being distributed as binaries I can reconstruct that piece of 
information myself, so no worries there.


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From: Alain Martel
Subject: Re: Call to Arms: Datetime
Date: 11 Aug 2021 11:36:01
Message: <6113ee61$1@news.povray.org>
Le 2021-08-11 à 07:08, clipka a écrit :

> Bonus questions:
> 
> - Using genuine POV-Ray, have you ever, and beyond doubt, observed 
> behavior (B) during times when DST was in effect in your time zone?
> 
> 
> (Please disregard derivatives such as rpov in this test/poll. They have 
> no impact whatsoever on the question I'm eager to get answers to.)
> 
> 
> I have a hunch that I may have been looking in a completely wrong 
> direction in this matter.

I get (C) using v3.8.0-x.freetype.3+AV693.MSVC14.windows, 64bits under 
Windows 10.
Local time ignoring DST with an appended «Z».


Post a reply to this message

From: Alain Martel
Subject: Re: Call to Arms: Datetime
Date: 11 Aug 2021 11:38:40
Message: <6113ef00$1@news.povray.org>
Le 2021-08-11 à 11:36, Alain Martel a écrit :
> Le 2021-08-11 à 07:08, clipka a écrit :
> 
>> Bonus questions:
>>
>> - Using genuine POV-Ray, have you ever, and beyond doubt, observed 
>> behavior (B) during times when DST was in effect in your time zone?
>>
>>
>> (Please disregard derivatives such as rpov in this test/poll. They 
>> have no impact whatsoever on the question I'm eager to get answers to.)
>>
>>
>> I have a hunch that I may have been looking in a completely wrong 
>> direction in this matter.
> 
> I get (C) using v3.8.0-x.freetype.3+AV693.MSVC14.windows, 64bits under 
> Windows 10.
> Local time ignoring DST with an appended «Z».
My time zone is Eastern, Montréal, Québec.


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From: clipka
Subject: Re: Call to Arms: Datetime
Date: 11 Aug 2021 11:45:17
Message: <6113f08d$1@news.povray.org>
Am 11.08.2021 um 14:29 schrieb jr:

> I get, for Slackware 14.[12] systems, '(c)'; tried with 3.7.0.8 and 3.7.1 (alpha
> and rc), and various 3.8.0, from alpha 9945627 to beta.1.  same for 3.7.0.8 on a
> Debian VM.  all but Debian "unofficial" versions built from tarballs.

How is beta.2 doing in this respect? Does that at least give (A) as 
intended?

Also, can you dig up what version of boost is being used by POV-Ray in 
your case?


Information about what time zone you've set up on your system would also 
be of interest (at least if it's very close to UTC; if it's far off, 
"not even close to UTC" is all I'd need to know).


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From: jr
Subject: Re: Call to Arms: Datetime
Date: 11 Aug 2021 12:20:00
Message: <web.6113f81121f771715e0fed26cde94f1@news.povray.org>
clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
> Am 11.08.2021 um 14:29 schrieb jr:
>
> > I get, for Slackware 14.[12] systems, '(c)'; tried with 3.7.0.8 and 3.7.1 (alpha
> > and rc), and various 3.8.0, from alpha 9945627 to beta.1.  same for 3.7.0.8 on a
> > Debian VM.  all but Debian "unofficial" versions built from tarballs.
>
> How is beta.2 doing in this respect? Does that at least give (A) as
> intended?

have not yet downloaded/built beta.2, sorry.


> Also, can you dig up what version of boost is being used by POV-Ray in
> your case?

the Debian VM uses v1.67, on Slackware it's v1.54 + v1.59.


> Information about what time zone you've set up on your system would also
> be of interest (at least if it's very close to UTC; if it's far off,
> "not even close to UTC" is all I'd need to know).

v close, GMT.  currently on "British Summer Time" (Wed 11 Aug 17:15:45 BST
2021).


regards, jr.


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From: clipka
Subject: Re: Call to Arms: Datetime
Date: 11 Aug 2021 14:11:16
Message: <611412c4$1@news.povray.org>
Am 11.08.2021 um 18:17 schrieb jr:

>> Information about what time zone you've set up on your system would also
>> be of interest (at least if it's very close to UTC; if it's far off,
>> "not even close to UTC" is all I'd need to know).
> 
> v close, GMT.  currently on "British Summer Time" (Wed 11 Aug 17:15:45 BST
> 2021).

Thanks, that's an important piece of the puzzle. If I'm not having a 
total brain fart, this means that (A) and (C) are indistinguishable on 
your system.


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