"St." <dot### [at] dotcom> schreef in bericht news:45e760ab$1@news.povray.org...
>
> "Trevor G Quayle" <Tin### [at] hotmailcom> wrote in message 
> news:web.45e70633ac010f74c150d4c10@news.povray.org...
>>> Third, during the March/April round,
>
>   This topic is now confirmed - 'Before and After'. A nice one for you, I 
> think, Trevor.  :)
>
Nice! I like that topic! I have something exactly taylored to that!

Post a reply to this message

"St." <dot### [at] dotcom> schreef in bericht news:45e760aa$3@news.povray.org...
>
>
>    Step aboard, Sherry.
>

Oh yes! And Hildur too!! I missed her entry in the first round, especially 
after all she did for putting new life in the contest!

Thomas

Post a reply to this message

St. wrote:

>    Step aboard, Sherry.
>
>
>       ~Steve~ 
>
>  
>
All right!  I'm in!  (Hastily sacrifices goat to weather gods...)

I actually flung together an entry that looked pretty good in the wee 
hours of the 28th.  When I looked at it again after a few hours sleep, 
it had somehow gone from "witty" to "half-witted."  The cat must have 
fiddled with it while I was sleeping, I guess.  Damn cat.  ;)

--Sherry Shaw

-- 
#macro T(E,N)sphere{x,.4rotate z*E*60translate y*N pigment{wrinkles scale
.3}finish{ambient 1}}#end#local I=0;#while(I<5)T(I,1)T(1-I,-1)#local I=I+
1;#end camera{location-5*z}plane{z,37 pigment{granite color_map{[.7rgb 0]
[1rgb 1]}}finish{ambient 2}}//                                   TenMoons

Post a reply to this message

"Sherry Shaw" <tenmoonsPutAtCharacterHereaol-dot-com> schreef in bericht 
news:45e80d3a@news.povray.org...

> All right!  I'm in!  (Hastily sacrifices goat to weather gods...)
>
> I actually flung together an entry that looked pretty good in the wee 
> hours of the 28th.  When I looked at it again after a few hours sleep, it 
> had somehow gone from "witty" to "half-witted."  The cat must have fiddled 
> with it while I was sleeping, I guess.  Damn cat.  ;)
>

Never trust cats!  :-)
[ I know because I was one in a former life  :-) ]

Thomas

Post a reply to this message

"Thomas de Groot" <t.d### [at] internlDOTnet> wrote:

> Never trust cats!  :-)
> [ I know because I was one in a former life  :-) ]
>
> Thomas

You can always trust cats.

To do what they want to do.


Stephen

Post a reply to this message

"Stephen" <mcavoys_AT_aolDOT.com> schreef in bericht 
news:web.45e819ebac010f74f1cb1e660@news.povray.org...
>
> You can always trust cats.
>
> To do what they want to do.
>

Aahh!! You guessed the right answer! You must have cats!  :-)

After all, cat owners are only there for the convenience of the cats 
themselves. And are they stupid, those owners! You must always be very 
patient with them, and explain ten times before they understand the most 
simple things! Incredible. They *look* so intelligent from the outside, but 
when you have to deal with them....

Thomas

Post a reply to this message

"Thomas de Groot" <t.d### [at] internlDOTnet> wrote:
> "Stephen" <mcavoys_AT_aolDOT.com> schreef in bericht
> news:web.45e819ebac010f74f1cb1e660@news.povray.org...
> >
> > You can always trust cats.
> >
> > To do what they want to do.
> >
>
> Aahh!! You guessed the right answer! You must have cats!  :-)
>
> After all, cat owners are only there for the convenience of the cats
> themselves. And are they stupid, those owners! You must always be very
> patient with them, and explain ten times before they understand the most
> simple things! Incredible. They *look* so intelligent from the outside, but
> when you have to deal with them....
>
> Thomas

Not any more, I’ve been bullied enough.
I’d like to have a cat again but living in a flat in the city isn’t fair. My
last cat (a tom) came in through the window and stayed for years, until it
took on a car and lost.


Stephen

Post a reply to this message

"Stephen" <mcavoys_AT_aolDOT.com> schreef in bericht 
news:web.45e843ceac010f74f1cb1e660@news.povray.org...
> Not any more, I've been bullied enough.
> I'd like to have a cat again but living in a flat in the city isn't fair. 
> My
> last cat (a tom) came in through the window and stayed for years, until it
> took on a car and lost.
>

I know what you mean. Our last cat died of a stroke. Just old age. For the 
time being, we dote on the neighbours'  :-)

Thomas

Post a reply to this message

On Sun, 4 Mar 2007 09:04:34 +0100, "Thomas de Groot" <t.d### [at] internlDOTnet>
wrote:

>
>I know what you mean. Our last cat died of a stroke. Just old age. For the 
>time being, we dote on the neighbours'  :-)

LOL

Regards
	Stephen

Post a reply to this message

> Oh yes! And Hildur too!! I missed her entry in the first round, especially
> after all she did for putting new life in the contest!
>
> Thomas

Thanks Thomas,
and sorry guys, my life has unfortunately been a bit hectic lately. I got
myself a new job, partly working from home, and also, too much other stuff
happening all at the same time. Real life getting in the way of raytracing.
I hate it when it happens. Especially after everything we have been
discussing.

So I must apologize for my absence in the Tina Chep round.  I did start
something, but ran out of time... had to spend the last week of the round
away from home. Away from my computer!

Anyway, I like the new topic, it probably has endless possibilities, and now
we have two months to work on it. I´m sure lots of interesting entries will
come out of it.

I´ll be back in front of my computer in about a week, so I should be able to
come up with something.

I haven´t had the time to view properly the entries yet, but I will as soon
as I get the time.

Is it OK for me to comment on them even though I didn´t submit?

Hildur

Post a reply to this message

A lurker de-lurking... :-)

I just wanted to say thanks, Steve, and everyone else who's helping the IRTC
continue in some form! Must...have...external inspiration...

I created a picture for the TINA CheP competition, but I didn't submit it
(for shame, I know!). I interpreted the topic as a challenge, so I used all
the advanced techniques I've learned since my checkered plane days to create
the picture. By the time I was finished, it was so far from the topic, I
chickened out and didn't send it in.

But without that spark of inspiration you gave me, I never would have
created a picture at all. So thanks again!

*relurks*

~Angela

P.S. Sherry, how cool to find another female raytracer! I thought I was the
only one in the whole world... ;-)

Post a reply to this message

"Angela" <ang### [at] yahoocom> schreef in bericht 
news:web.45ef910aac010f74ee398cbc0@news.povray.org...

> P.S. Sherry, how cool to find another female raytracer! I thought I was 
> the
> only one in the whole world... ;-)
>

Oh no! There are several: Janet, Gail Shaw, Sherry of course, Hélène Dumur, 
Hildur K, Sabrina Kilian, Joanne Simpson... and I am sure I forgot several 
:-)
But, the proportion is way too low indeed.

THomas

Post a reply to this message

"Angela" <ang### [at] yahoocom> schreef in bericht 
news:web.45ef910aac010f74ee398cbc0@news.povray.org...
>
> I created a picture for the TINA CheP competition, but I didn't submit it
> (for shame, I know!). I interpreted the topic as a challenge, so I used 
> all
> the advanced techniques I've learned since my checkered plane days to 
> create
> the picture. By the time I was finished, it was so far from the topic, I
> chickened out and didn't send it in.
>

What I forgot to say... You can always show the picture in p.b.i.
To tell the truth, I am very curious now that you revealed it's existence 
:-)

Thomas

Post a reply to this message

The posts in this thread give me hope (confidence?) that the March/April
"Before & After" round will have a significant increase in the number of
entries.  Perhaps we could  use a web page that would show prospective
entrants the topic, rules, submission process and a link to the existing
images.   I would be willing to produce this unless there is someone else
who has a burning desire to do so.  Before beginning, I would like to get
some feedback and suggestions from the folks involved (or anyone else with
good ideas). Especially welcomed would be ideas for a short catchy name for
our endeavor.  The name "The Interim Pseudo IRTC / TINA CheP Ray Tracing
Forum" is unlikely to have potential participants submitting in droves.  I
was rather hoping that ~Steve~ would be willing to host the page so that
everything would be together in one place, but I could find a spot for it
myself if this was not agreeable for any reason.  I would like to have the
whole thing up and running by the end of this weekend if at all possible so
that anyone introduced to the project by the page would have plenty of time
to get an entry ready.  Also, I’m not particularly concerned with the
notion of judging and picking winners myself, but we really ought to
discuss what , if anything, we’re going to do in that regard so that
decisions will be forthcoming in a reasonable amount of time.

Thanks in advance to everyone for their input.

-Mike C.

Post a reply to this message

"Mike the Elder" <zer### [at] wyanorg> wrote in message 
news:web.45f00276ac010f746d4565230@news.povray.org...
> The posts in this thread give me hope (confidence?) that the March/April
> "Before & After" round will have a significant increase in the number of
> entries.

    Hi Mike, me too.

Perhaps we could  use a web page that would show prospective
> entrants the topic, rules, submission process and a link to the existing
> images.

   This, I'm dealing with right now. Over the weekend, (or sooner), your 
suggestions below will also be implemented.


 I would be willing to produce this unless there is someone else
> who has a burning desire to do so.  Before beginning, I would like to get
> some feedback and suggestions from the folks involved (or anyone else with
> good ideas). Especially welcomed would be ideas for a short catchy name 
> for
> our endeavor.  The name "The Interim Pseudo IRTC / TINA CheP Ray Tracing
> Forum" is unlikely to have potential participants submitting in droves.

   You are correct, and I'm thinking that if the present competition is 
going to be a world-wide one, (as it is), then how about '3D-IRTC'? I'm just 
wondering though, are there any copyright issues with using 'IRTC'? 
Afterall, someone, at some point came up with that name, and I guess it's 
their copyright?


> I was rather hoping that ~Steve~ would be willing to host the page so that
> everything would be together in one place, but I could find a spot for it
> myself if this was not agreeable for any reason.  I would like to have the
> whole thing up and running by the end of this weekend if at all possible 
> so
> that anyone introduced to the project by the page would have plenty of 
> time
> to get an entry ready.  Also, I'm not particularly concerned with the
> notion of judging and picking winners myself, but we really ought to
> discuss what , if anything, we're going to do in that regard so that
> decisions will be forthcoming in a reasonable amount of time.

     Hey Mike, please don't worry about this. I've literally just been to 
see our local hosting company in town, and I'm assured that I can have a 
format whereby entrants can upload their images, vote, and comment, (this 
will also include the animations). How this is actually going to work, I'm 
not sure at the moment. But just for now, I'll keep it the way it is, (with 
your suggestions above implemented).

    Why am I doing this? Well, because I have a passion for the IRTC. It was 
the place to go to try and further your skills and improve yourself by 
taking in the various suggestions and (often precious) comments that other 
people gave from around the world. It harvested a whole new community back 
in 1994 that is still going strong today, (and it appears to be stronger 
than ever now). Another reason is that I had a look at the IRTC site again 
last night, (and just now), and I can't even comprehend why it says: 
"deadline was passed by 66 days, 5 hours, 54 minutes, and 22 seconds".

   That's just mad.

  Another reason is that if you Google IRTC, there are 192,000 references. 
Now, that's not to say that they're all to to with the IRTC as we know it, 
but heck, I'm willing to bet that one hell of a lot ARE to do with it. I 
know there are a stack of people who have linked to it from their own sites, 
and of course, you do get stuff like this too: 
http://acronyms.thefreedictionary.com/Internet+Ray+Tracing+Competition.

   And lastly, the IRTC site admins say on the website that they are on 
'Hiatus' which means "a break or interruption in the continuity of a work, 
series, action, etc." They also say, "We will provide more details soon", 
but they haven't, and I don't believe they will. And anyway, how soon is 
'soon'? Do we wait another 66 days? More? If any of the admins read this, I 
hope that IF they are doing something about it *now*, then they would have 
the decency to reply and say so, because otherwise, I'm going ahead with my 
plans.

    ~Steve~



> Thanks in advance to everyone for their input.
>
> -Mike C.
>
>
>
>

Post a reply to this message

"St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote:
....
>    This, I'm dealing with right now. Over the weekend, (or sooner), your
> suggestions below will also be implemented.
>
....
>      Hey Mike, please don't worry about this. I've literally just been to
> see our local hosting company in town, and I'm assured that I can have a
> format whereby entrants can upload their images, vote, and comment, (this
> will also include the animations). How this is actually going to work, I'm
> not sure at the moment. But just for now, I'll keep it the way it is, (with
> your suggestions above implemented).

This all sounds fine.  Thanks again for all of your efforts.  I just wanted
to make sure that one person didn't get stuck with all the work. Also, it
just seemed more appropriate for me to offer to make a page than to suggest
that someone else ought to do it.  Please don’t hesitate to let me know if
you do decide that you would like some help.  For the present, I’ll just
stand by and await further developments.

Post a reply to this message

Steve and Mike,

It is fantastic how you feel committed to build a new site hosting this new 
avatar of the defunct(?) IRTC. My sincesre and humble thanks for this. And 
of course to all the people that have joined in the discussions over the 
past months. The concept is very much alive and kicking!

Concerning the name of the competition, there is the problem that - as long 
as we are not certain that the IRTC will not be revived one day, and I 
believe Chris Cason implied this more or less, or am I mistaken? - this 
competition will have a provisional status. Not that that is a problem in 
itself. On the contrary, I think it enables us all to explore new avenues 
and expand our challenges, and maybe it will even continue in its own right. 
But how to call it? with reference to the IRTC, like Steve suggests 
(3D-IRTC), or IRTC-2 (my humble suggestion), apart from copyright problems 
maybe, or try to imagine a new name that immediately will attract people to 
it? That is more difficult, although more challenging, no doubt. Something 
like the CGSphere competition name, but better :-) for instance 3DC (3D 
Competition)? Not very good, I know, but I'm just scratching my mind's 
convolutions...

>  ....Another reason is that I had a look at the IRTC site again last 
> night, (and just now), and I can't even comprehend why it says: "deadline 
> was passed by 66 days, 5 hours, 54 minutes, and 22 seconds".
>
>   That's just mad.

Yeah... It's weird. The clock still ticking in an abandoned house... spooky!


Thomas

Post a reply to this message

Thomas de Groot wrote:

> 
> What I forgot to say... You can always show the picture in p.b.i.
> To tell the truth, I am very curious now that you revealed it's existence 
> :-)
And the interpretation of topic.

Post a reply to this message

For a name I'd go for N-IRTC which would either mean New IRTC or
"Not the IRTC".
--

I'd like to keep the same spirit as the IRTC - anyone (especialy 
beginners) can enter with any software (especially free/home grown).
--

I'd like to use a similar judging system to the old IRTC and to have 
comments attatched to the images. The TinaChep round did have the plus 
point that people could reply to their comments (I will soon) but the 
comments were not attached to or grouped by image, which makes reading a 
little harder.
--

I would like it if we could change the file size limit so that we can 
submit reasonable images at least 1024x768 (possibly larger).
--

I'd also personally like the post processing rules changed / clarified, 
as some irtc judges seemed to frown on any post processing while in my 
view scripted/scriptable post processing should be fine.

For example global Colour / brightness adjustment should be allowed.
If people create HDRI images then to convert them to a normal JPEG they 
need to mess with the brightness etc and should be allowed to let the 
highlights flare/bleed if they want.

In my book painting or retouching is bad, global filters are fine. (most 
global filters *could* be done in POV but photoshop/gimp are far simpler 
and save re-rendering)

Post a reply to this message

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Verm wrote:
> I would like it if we could change the file size limit so that we can
> submit reasonable images at least 1024x768 (possibly larger).
> -- 
	I've seen this point raised several times now, so I'd like to point
out that this is already allowed by the IRTC (and has been for some
time). Quoting the IRTC rules:

<quote>
The JPEG file may have any width or height dimension, though we
recommend keeping it "reasonable". The only size restriction on
images now is the file size.
</quote>

	And from the FAQ:

<quote>
[1.1.5] Can I enter an image with any size ratio?
    Yes, you can. The only limit now is the file size, which must be
smaller than 250kb. Anyhow, we recommend to use "reasonable" ratios
(and surely the judges too).
</quote>

		Jerome
- --
+------------------------- Jerome M. BERGER ---------------------+
|    mailto:jeb### [at] freefr      | ICQ:    238062172            |
|    http://jeberger.free.fr/     | Jabber: jeb### [at] jabberfr   |
+---------------------------------+------------------------------+
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Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (GNU/Linux)

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rhZ6QLDheVDk7gAJ1H0AjIg=
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Post a reply to this message

"St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote in message news:45f01e2c$1@news.povray.org...
> "Mike the Elder" <zer### [at] wyanorg> wrote in message

  The name "The Interim Pseudo IRTC / TINA CheP Ray Tracing
>> Forum" is unlikely to have potential participants submitting in droves.
>
>   You are correct, and I'm thinking that if the present competition is 
> going to be a world-wide one, (as it is), then how about '3D-IRTC'? I'm 
> just wondering though, are there any copyright issues with using 'IRTC'? 
> Afterall, someone, at some point came up with that name, and I guess it's 
> their copyright?

   Ok, being a jeweller, (as in designer, maker, blah, blah, blah), by 
trade, I do know a little about copyright. ;)

     I'm thinking of dropping the 'I' to leave RTC. So I'm now thinking 
along the lines of  '3D-RTC', or, it could be 'RTC-3D'

     But, I'm still hoping that someone has something to propose. So, if 
anyone is thinking of a suitable name, or can adjust the above to be more 
suitable, please post it, it might be just the right thing.

      ~Steve~

Post a reply to this message

Jérôme M. Berger wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
> 
> Verm wrote:
>> I would like it if we could change the file size limit so that we can
>> submit reasonable images at least 1024x768 (possibly larger).
>> -- 
> 	I've seen this point raised several times now, so I'd like to point
> out that this is already allowed by the IRTC (and has been for some
> time). Quoting the IRTC rules:
> 
> <quote>
> The JPEG file may have any width or height dimension, though we
> recommend keeping it "reasonable". The only size restriction on
> images now is the file size.
> </quote>

I did say increase the file size limit, I know there's no explicit image 
dimensions limit :-) .

I was suggesting the file size was too low to allow larger images 
without compression artefacts, not that larger images were not allowed.

I've rechecked through the irtc archives and seen that most images don't 
seem have difficulty fitting in the 250k limit, (so the problem isn't 
that great) but still I'd think some images with lots of hard edges 
might have difficulty fitting 1024x768 or 1280x1024 into 250k. I just 
thought now might be a good time to re-raise the issue.

- has anyone found the 250k limit restrictive and does anyone think we 
should soften the limit a bit? (bandwidth allowing of course)

Post a reply to this message

"Thomas de Groot" <t.d### [at] internlDOTnet> wrote:
> Oh no! There are several: Janet, Gail Shaw, Sherry of course, Hélène Dumur,
> Hildur K, Sabrina Kilian, Joanne Simpson... and I am sure I forgot several
> :-)
> But, the proportion is way too low indeed.

How very cool! That's way more than I ever thought there were. Not that I
don't like hanging out with the guys ;-) It's just nice to know I can chat
with another woman about something besides scrapbooking or the kids'
soccer.

"Thomas de Groot" <t.d### [at] internlDOTnet> wrote:
> What I forgot to say... You can always show the picture in p.b.i.
> To tell the truth, I am very curious now that you revealed it's existence
> :-)

*blushes and mumbles* Well, it's not that great. I focused a lot more on
technique than actual results. But what the hey *grins* I'll post it this
evening when I get home.

"St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote:
>      But, I'm still hoping that someone has something to propose. So, if
> anyone is thinking of a suitable name, or can adjust the above to be more
> suitable, please post it, it might be just the right thing.

Something Thomas said really struck my fancy. He used the word "avatar" in
reference to the new competition. How about "Avatar Ray-tracing
Competition" or ARTC (or even ARC, for a pronounceable acronym)? It has the
lovely connotation of IRTC being reborn, and we could use one of the
renditions of TINA CheP as the site avatar...

~Angela

Post a reply to this message

"Verm" <pov### [at] thirteeendynucom> wrote in message 
news:45f09073$1@news.povray.org...
> Jérôme M. Berger wrote:
>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>> Hash: SHA1
>>
>> Verm wrote:
>>> I would like it if we could change the file size limit so that we can
>>> submit reasonable images at least 1024x768 (possibly larger).
>>> -- 
>> I've seen this point raised several times now, so I'd like to point
>> out that this is already allowed by the IRTC (and has been for some
>> time). Quoting the IRTC rules:
>>
>> <quote>
>> The JPEG file may have any width or height dimension, though we
>> recommend keeping it "reasonable". The only size restriction on
>> images now is the file size.
>> </quote>
>
> I did say increase the file size limit, I know there's no explicit image 
> dimensions limit :-) .

  Yes! Should we give this a go? I was thinking exactly this when Bruno 
re-posted his busy and well-worked-on 'POVLAB' image! Should we increase it 
to 500kb's or slightly lower? Say, 350kb's or 400kb's or so?


>
> I was suggesting the file size was too low to allow larger images without 
> compression artefacts, not that larger images were not allowed.
>
> I've rechecked through the irtc archives and seen that most images don't 
> seem have difficulty fitting in the 250k limit, (so the problem isn't that 
> great) but still I'd think some images with lots of hard edges might have 
> difficulty fitting 1024x768 or 1280x1024 into 250k. I just thought now 
> might be a good time to re-raise the issue.

    And a good time to raise this issue too. Thanks Verm.


>
> - has anyone found the 250k limit restrictive and does anyone think we 
> should soften the limit a bit? (bandwidth allowing of course)

   250k is ok, but let's all face it, in today's present climate with BB, 
<me, late starter>, upping it would be good. Bandwidth *shouldn't* be a 
problem.

     ~Steve~

Post a reply to this message

"Angela" <ang### [at] yahoocom> schreef in bericht 
news:web.45f0917bac010f74a8b830d10@news.povray.org...
>
> Something Thomas said really struck my fancy. He used the word "avatar" in
> reference to the new competition. How about "Avatar Ray-tracing
> Competition" or ARTC (or even ARC, for a pronounceable acronym)? It has 
> the
> lovely connotation of IRTC being reborn, and we could use one of the
> renditions of TINA CheP as the site avatar...
>

ARC...!  I like this!!! How about that folks??

Thomas

Post a reply to this message

"St." <dot### [at] dotcom> schreef in bericht news:45f09f1c@news.povray.org...
>

>> I did say increase the file size limit, I know there's no explicit image 
>> dimensions limit :-) .
>
>  Yes! Should we give this a go? I was thinking exactly this when Bruno 
> re-posted his busy and well-worked-on 'POVLAB' image! Should we increase 
> it to 500kb's or slightly lower? Say, 350kb's or 400kb's or so?
>
>
>>
>> I was suggesting the file size was too low to allow larger images without 
>> compression artefacts, not that larger images were not allowed.
>>
>> I've rechecked through the irtc archives and seen that most images don't 
>> seem have difficulty fitting in the 250k limit, (so the problem isn't 
>> that great) but still I'd think some images with lots of hard edges might 
>> have difficulty fitting 1024x768 or 1280x1024 into 250k. I just thought 
>> now might be a good time to re-raise the issue.
>
>    And a good time to raise this issue too. Thanks Verm.
>
>
>>
>> - has anyone found the 250k limit restrictive and does anyone think we 
>> should soften the limit a bit? (bandwidth allowing of course)
>
>   250k is ok, but let's all face it, in today's present climate with BB, 
> <me, late starter>, upping it would be good. Bandwidth *shouldn't* be a 
> problem.
>

If it's no problem for you, Steve, I think it would be a good idea. 250k was 
no problem for me, but some more room to move in would be more confortable 
:-)

Thomas

Post a reply to this message

Thomas de Groot wrote:
> "St." <dot### [at] dotcom> schreef in bericht news:45f09f1c@news.povray.org...
> 
>>> I did say increase the file size limit, I know there's no explicit image 
>>> dimensions limit :-) .
>>  Yes! Should we give this a go? I was thinking exactly this when Bruno 
>> re-posted his busy and well-worked-on 'POVLAB' image! Should we increase 
>> it to 500kb's or slightly lower? Say, 350kb's or 400kb's or so?
>>
>>
>>> I was suggesting the file size was too low to allow larger images without 
>>> compression artefacts, not that larger images were not allowed.
>>>
>>> I've rechecked through the irtc archives and seen that most images don't 
>>> seem have difficulty fitting in the 250k limit, (so the problem isn't 
>>> that great) but still I'd think some images with lots of hard edges might 
>>> have difficulty fitting 1024x768 or 1280x1024 into 250k. I just thought 
>>> now might be a good time to re-raise the issue.
>>    And a good time to raise this issue too. Thanks Verm.
>>
>>
>>> - has anyone found the 250k limit restrictive and does anyone think we 
>>> should soften the limit a bit? (bandwidth allowing of course)
>>   250k is ok, but let's all face it, in today's present climate with BB, 
>> <me, late starter>, upping it would be good. Bandwidth *shouldn't* be a 
>> problem.
>>
> 
> If it's no problem for you, Steve, I think it would be a good idea. 250k was 
> no problem for me, but some more room to move in would be more confortable 
> :-)

Hi,

i'm really looking forward to the new "*RTC" (whatever it's 
going to be called - as long as it's not "the competition 
formerly known as IRTC" ;)

Now this may be a bit much to ask for, but just as a thought 
- if you're going to automate the whole site anyway, could 
this new page accommodate the animations, too...?

-Markus

Post a reply to this message

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote in message 
news:45f11b49@news.povray.org...

> Hi,
>
> i'm really looking forward to the new "*RTC" (whatever it's going to be 
> called - as long as it's not "the competition formerly known as IRTC" ;)

   Yes, this is the plan, because for all we know, the IRTC may come back in 
a few months, it's just that nobody knows what's happening. So, we either do 
this to keep us trundling along, or we use Chris Casson' (kindly offered) 
POVCOMP code where it will need 4 people to keep it working. Or... we do 
nothing.

  Hopefully, the exact same rules will apply with the addition of a higher 
file-size limit for the stills, which will now be 350kb's.


>
> Now this may be a bit much to ask for, but just as a thought - if you're 
> going to automate the whole site anyway, could this new page accommodate 
> the animations, too...?

     Yes, this is the plan too Markus.  :)

       ~Steve~


>
> -Markus

Post a reply to this message

"Thomas de Groot" <t.d### [at] internlDOTnet> wrote in message 
news:45f117a2@news.povray.org...
>
> "Angela" <ang### [at] yahoocom> schreef in bericht 
> news:web.45f0917bac010f74a8b830d10@news.povray.org...
>>
>> Something Thomas said really struck my fancy. He used the word "avatar" 
>> in
>> reference to the new competition. How about "Avatar Ray-tracing
>> Competition" or ARTC (or even ARC, for a pronounceable acronym)? It has 
>> the
>> lovely connotation of IRTC being reborn, and we could use one of the
>> renditions of TINA CheP as the site avatar...
>>
>
> ARC...!  I like this!!! How about that folks??

      Yes, Angela's suggestion is a good one. Although, I'm not so sure 
about 'avatar' as to me, it means that little still or animated logo at the 
side of a post in a forum. I might be wrong about that. But, the 'A' could 
mean 'Artists'?

        ~Steve~


>
> Thomas
>
>

Post a reply to this message

"Angela" <ang### [at] yahoocom> wrote in message 
news:web.45f0917bac010f74a8b830d10@news.povray.org...

 It has the
> lovely connotation of IRTC being reborn, and we could use one of the
> renditions of TINA CheP as the site avatar...

     This is being done already. Malcolm Findlay has given us kind 
permission to use his 'Tina Chep - Evolution' image to use as the logo 
(which looks good).

      Thank you for your input Angela!  :)

        ~Steve~


>
> ~Angela
>
>
>

Post a reply to this message

"Thomas de Groot" <t.d### [at] internlDOTnet> wrote in message 
news:45f118d1$1@news.povray.org...

> If it's no problem for you, Steve, I think it would be a good idea. 250k 
> was no problem for me, but some more room to move in would be more 
> confortable :-)

     Ok, we'll raise it to 350kb's.

        ~Steve~


>
> Thomas
>
>
>

Post a reply to this message

In the spirit of our our enthusiasm for the continuity of the IRTC or
alternatively, a similar competition, and most of us being POV users...

how about PORC - "Persistence Of Raytracing Competition",

I thought it might be appropriate to emphasize the admirable persistence of
everybody here

Hildur

Post a reply to this message

"St." <dot### [at] dotcom> schreef in bericht news:45f12d5c$2@news.povray.org...
>
>
>      Yes, Angela's suggestion is a good one. Although, I'm not so sure 
> about 'avatar' as to me, it means that little still or animated logo at 
> the side of a post in a forum. I might be wrong about that. But, the 'A' 
> could mean 'Artists'?
>

The real sense of 'avatar' (from the Sanscrit) is: "The "avatar" derives 
from the Sanskrit word Avatara, meaning "incarnation" and usually implying a 
deliberate descent into mortal realms for special purposes." See: 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avatar_%28icon%29

In my view, the computer representation is a secondary meaning. The problem 
is of course that most people relate to that secondary meaning, and the true 
sense is lost.... :-(

'Artists' might be a valid substitute but would loose that strong 
connotation of a 'rebirth' or 're-incarnation', which was my primary 
objective in using the word.

Thomas

Post a reply to this message

"Hildur K." <hil### [at] 3dcafemailevery1net> schreef in bericht 
news:web.45f15912ac010f74868934860@news.povray.org...
>
> In the spirit of our our enthusiasm for the continuity of the IRTC or
> alternatively, a similar competition, and most of us being POV users...
>
> how about PORC - "Persistence Of Raytracing Competition",
>
> I thought it might be appropriate to emphasize the admirable persistence 
> of
> everybody here
>

LOL
I love it!

"What are you doing, son?"
"I'm doing a PORC."
"Pork?? Now, don't eat too much of that stuff! Dinner is being served."

Thomas

Post a reply to this message

Thomas de Groot wrote:

> 'Artists' might be a valid substitute but would loose that strong 
> connotation of a 'rebirth' or 're-incarnation', which was my primary 
> objective in using the word.

Also (as I suspect you can tell from my entry :-) ) I am not an artist. 
One of Pov's and the IRTC's attractions is that it attracts a broad 
spectrum from artistic to purely technical people.

Post a reply to this message

St. wrote:
>> i'm really looking forward to the new "*RTC" (whatever it's going to be 
>> called - as long as it's not "the competition formerly known as IRTC" ;)
> 
>    Yes, this is the plan, because for all we know, the IRTC may come back in 
> a few months, it's just that nobody knows what's happening. So, we either do 
> this to keep us trundling along, or we use Chris Casson' (kindly offered) 
> POVCOMP code where it will need 4 people to keep it working. Or... we do 
> nothing.

 From my reading Chris Casson wasn't saying that the
   "at least three trusted people who are willing to make a long term 
commitment* to supervising the operation of the contest"
would have to do a vast deal to keep it working as the contest would be 
pretty much automated.

I think its an important point that any competition no matter how 
automated will need some human supervision and it would be very 
desirable for it to be organised so it didn't rely on just one person.

Holidays/ deaths / births / marriages / equipment failures / 
incarceration / illness etc can all present long or short term 
interferences with someone's ability to run an event and it would be 
wise to try plan around the "hit by a bus" scenario.

Even without anything bad happening someone needs to make sure Steve is 
allowed to go on holidays :- ).

*I'd rather not make more long term commitments ... but would be willing 
if needed...

Post a reply to this message

Only a semi-serious suggestion, but...

CALM - Competition for Amateur Light & Magic  ...?

(as opposed to the industrial variety, of course)

:-D

Post a reply to this message

"Verm" <pov### [at] thirteeendynucom> schreef in bericht 
news:45f15ee2@news.povray.org...
> Thomas de Groot wrote:
>
>> 'Artists' might be a valid substitute but would loose that strong 
>> connotation of a 'rebirth' or 're-incarnation', which was my primary 
>> objective in using the word.
>
> Also (as I suspect you can tell from my entry :-) ) I am not an artist. 
> One of Pov's and the IRTC's attractions is that it attracts a broad 
> spectrum from artistic to purely technical people.

Yes, you have a point there. The term is too restrictive in meaning and 
indeed purely "technical" people are participating too (which makes them 
automatically "artists")  :-)

Thomas

Post a reply to this message

I haven't been a major player in any IRTC round, only 3 entries so far, but
I'm keeping a watchful eye on the discussions here regarding the future.
IRTC or not.  I would hope that any substitute will welcome any program and
not just POVRay as the IRTC allowed.  Not all of us have the patience. :)
I've used POVRay in only one round and Carrara in the other two.

The naming of the substitute competition got me thinking.

ORC    - Open Ray-Tracing Competition/Challenge/Contest
WROC   - Worldwide Ray-Tracing Online Competition.
TRACE  - Themed Ray-Traced Art Competition and Education/Exposition
  or TRA-C (pronounce: Tracy)
CRIMP  - Competition for Ray-Traced Images and Moving Pictures.
GRAS-C - Global Ray-Traced Animation and Still Competition.
PERC   - Peer Enforced/Endorsed Ray-Tracing Competition

Blah.  That's all I have.

Post a reply to this message

"Zekaric" <zek### [at] NyOaShPoAoMca> wrote:
> I haven't been a major player in any IRTC round, only 3 entries so far, but
> I'm keeping a watchful eye on the discussions here regarding the future.
> IRTC or not.  I would hope that any substitute will welcome any program and
> not just POVRay as the IRTC allowed.  Not all of us have the patience. :)
> I've used POVRay in only one round and Carrara in the other two.
>
> The naming of the substitute competition got me thinking.
>
> ORC    - Open Ray-Tracing Competition/Challenge/Contest
> WROC   - Worldwide Ray-Tracing Online Competition.
> TRACE  - Themed Ray-Traced Art Competition and Education/Exposition
>   or TRA-C (pronounce: Tracy)
> CRIMP  - Competition for Ray-Traced Images and Moving Pictures.
> GRAS-C - Global Ray-Traced Animation and Still Competition.
> PERC   - Peer Enforced/Endorsed Ray-Tracing Competition
>
> Blah.  That's all I have.

Tracy is wonderful and 100% on-topic! A friend for Tina ..


   Bruno

Post a reply to this message

"Thomas de Groot" <t.d### [at] internlDOTnet> wrote:
> What I forgot to say... You can always show the picture in p.b.i.
> To tell the truth, I am very curious now that you revealed it's existence
> :-)

Ta da! If anyone is curious, I posted my unsubmitted TINA CheP entry in
p.b.i :-)

I think Steve bring up a good point about ARC. We don't want people to think
all we trace are avatars...

"Zekaric" <zek### [at] NyOaShPoAoMca> wrote:
> TRACE  - Themed Ray-Traced Art Competition and Education/Exposition
>   or TRA-C (pronounce: Tracy)

I'm voting for this one! It's clever and says what we want, I think.

~Angela

Post a reply to this message

St. wrote:

>      But, I'm still hoping that someone has something to propose. So, if 
> anyone is thinking of a suitable name, or can adjust the above to be more 
> suitable, please post it, it might be just the right thing.
>  




Turn off your computer right now,  No cheating.

Take a pencil and paper and write down all or any of the currently 
suggested acronyms from memory.

Post a reply to this message

"Zekaric" <zek### [at] NyOaShPoAoMca> schreef in bericht 
news:web.45f1c264ac010f74aa9878c30@news.povray.org...
>I haven't been a major player in any IRTC round, only 3 entries so far, but
> I'm keeping a watchful eye on the discussions here regarding the future.
> IRTC or not.  I would hope that any substitute will welcome any program 
> and
> not just POVRay as the IRTC allowed.  Not all of us have the patience. :)
> I've used POVRay in only one round and Carrara in the other two.
>
> The naming of the substitute competition got me thinking.
>
> ORC    - Open Ray-Tracing Competition/Challenge/Contest
> WROC   - Worldwide Ray-Tracing Online Competition.
> TRACE  - Themed Ray-Traced Art Competition and Education/Exposition
>  or TRA-C (pronounce: Tracy)
> CRIMP  - Competition for Ray-Traced Images and Moving Pictures.
> GRAS-C - Global Ray-Traced Animation and Still Competition.
> PERC   - Peer Enforced/Endorsed Ray-Tracing Competition
>
> Blah.  That's all I have.
>
>

Tracy is really nice!
The competition is open to all ray-tracers as far as I know, isn't it?

Thomas

Post a reply to this message

"Mike the Elder" <zer### [at] wyanorg> wrote in message 
news:web.45e6c6feac010f746d4565230@news.povray.org...
> First of all, thanks a bunch, Steve, for doing a great job hosting the 
> TINA
> CheP round.
>
> Secondly, I suggest we pick a fun topic for March/April straight away so
> that folks will have plenty of time to work.  I'll toss out the "Before 
> and
> After" idea again because I think it would give people a lot of creative
> options both technically and artistically, but another topic would be
> welcome - as long it was named SOON.  If this is going to be an ongoing
> enterprise, we will, of course, want to set up a method of selecting 
> topics
> that gives participants an opportunity to have input  and an opportunity 
> for
> discussion.  For the upcoming round, however, I hereby nominate ~Steve~ 
> for
> the post of One-Time-Benevolent-Topic-Dictator. (Seconds?)

      Well, I think we've got a system that's going to work fine for now. 
Based on Greg M. Johnson' idea of using old book titles from the Gutenberg 
Project, we now have a text file that's been whittled down to around 750 
titles. This file could then be loaded into a small program that I have 
called 'The Hat'. Basically, it shuffles the list for however long you want 
it to run, and then you hit STOP, and the one at the top of the list is the 
topic. I tried it earlier with some impressive titles/topics being shown. As 
Greg has mentioned on the IRTC mailing list, you wouldn't have to depict the 
title literally if you didn't want to, but use the words of that title in 
any way that you want.

    Typical examples:
    "The Son Of The Wolf" by Jack London.
    "The Bee's And The Flies" by Rudyard Kipling.


     How does this sound so far?

     ~Steve~

Post a reply to this message

On Fri, 9 Mar 2007 09:47:27 -0000, "St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote:

>
>     This is being done already. Malcolm Findlay has given us kind 
>permission to use his 'Tina Chep - Evolution' image to use as the logo 
>(which looks good).
>
> 
Interesting how the manikin keeps coming up in raytracing. I built a scene with
one using Hugo Arnaut's Bishop3d. Then there was Poser 3 (?) and uvmapper.  

http://www.bishop3d.com/scripts/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=255


Regards
	Stephen

Post a reply to this message

"Thomas de Groot" <t.d### [at] internlDOTnet> wrote in message 
news:45e7e8b8$1@news.povray.org...
>
> "St." <dot### [at] dotcom> schreef in bericht news:45e760ab$1@news.povray.org...
>>
>> "Trevor G Quayle" <Tin### [at] hotmailcom> wrote in message 
>> news:web.45e70633ac010f74c150d4c10@news.povray.org...
>>>> Third, during the March/April round,
>>
>>   This topic is now confirmed - 'Before and After'. A nice one for you, I 
>> think, Trevor.  :)
>>
> Nice! I like that topic! I have something exactly taylored to that!

    Can't wait to see it!  ;)

     I've only just started mine Thomas. Mine is a little cliche, but I hope 
I do a good job.

       ~Steve~




>
>

Post a reply to this message

"St." <dot### [at] dotcom> schreef in bericht news:45f484a4@news.povray.org...
>>>   This topic is now confirmed - 'Before and After'. A nice one for you, 
>>> I think, Trevor.  :)
>>>
>> Nice! I like that topic! I have something exactly taylored to that!
>
>    Can't wait to see it!  ;)
To tell the truth, I had a scene on which I had been working for a couple of 
months and which was in the process of some radical conceptual change. The 
topic just put things in place. The most difficult hurdles have been taken. 
I have to implement a number of details still, and then pay close attention 
to the correct radiosity settings especially.
>
>     I've only just started mine Thomas. Mine is a little cliche, but I 
> hope I do a good job.
Cliche can be interesting! Especially if they are tongue in cheek....
I think this is going to be a terrific round  :-)

Thomas

Post a reply to this message

"Thomas de Groot" <t.d### [at] internlDOTnet> wrote:
> "Zekaric" <zek### [at] NyOaShPoAoMca> schreef in bericht
> > TRACE  - Themed Ray-Traced Art Competition and Education/Exposition
> >  or TRA-C (pronounce: Tracy)
>
> Tracy is really nice!
> The competition is open to all ray-tracers as far as I know, isn't it?
>
> Thomas

I hope so.  From some of the other messages, I was getting the impression
that POVRay was 'preferred' or the only allowed program.  I might have read
into it too much.

I liked Tracy as well.  I was thinking at year ends there could be the grand
award ceremony,  "The Tracies!"  (Yeah, taking from those other award shows
like the Genies, Junos, Geminis, Oscars. Etc. Enz...)

Post a reply to this message

"Verm" <pov### [at] thirteeendynucom> wrote in message 
news:45f1658a$1@news.povray.org...

> I think its an important point that any competition no matter how 
> automated will need some human supervision and it would be very desirable 
> for it to be organised so it didn't rely on just one person.
>
> Holidays/ deaths / births / marriages / equipment failures / incarceration 
> / illness etc can all present long or short term interferences with 
> someone's ability to run an event and it would be wise to try plan around 
> the "hit by a bus" scenario.

     Extremely good points Verm! However, I'm sure my time won't be up just 
yet, so everything should be fine for now. BUT, just in case, (eek!)  I will 
look into this, and hopefully appoint someone that will be as proficient as 
I hope to be.


>
> Even without anything bad happening someone needs to make sure Steve is 
> allowed to go on holidays :- ).

      Holiday? Now there's a strange word...  ;)


>
> *I'd rather not make more long term commitments ... but would be willing 
> if needed...

     And there's the proof of the pudding - once a Tracer, always a Tracer. 
Thank you Verm, will put you on the list if you don't mind.

       ~Steve~

Post a reply to this message

> Tracy is wonderful and 100% on-topic! A friend for Tina ..

I like the name Tracy, but them I'm biased. ;-)

-- 
William Tracy
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|w|t|r|a|c|y|@|c|a|l|p|o|l|y|.|e|d|u|
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You know you've been raytracing too long when you find yourself hungry 
and discover that it is 9 PM and that you have been rendering since 8 AM 
without a pause.

Post a reply to this message