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Has a new topic been announced yet for the stills round?
Just wondering.
Hildur
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Hildur K. wrote:
> Has a new topic been announced yet for the stills round?
> Just wondering.
>
> Hildur
>
Nope. http://irtc.org/ftp/.message still shows the old topic.
Hopefully this will be one of the things they automate as they rewrite
the irtc scripts.
Hopefully I'll actually finish an entry this year too :-)
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>
> Hopefully I'll actually finish an entry this year too :-)
Yeah, me too!
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"Verm" <pov### [at] thirteeen dynucom> wrote in message
news:45a8cf8f$1@news.povray.org...
> Hildur K. wrote:
>> Has a new topic been announced yet for the stills round?
>> Just wondering.
>>
>> Hildur
>>
>
> Nope. http://irtc.org/ftp/.message still shows the old topic.
>
> Hopefully this will be one of the things they automate as they rewrite the
> irtc scripts.
And hopefully, it's a really interesting subject for the start of the New
Year. :o)
~Steve~
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"St." <dot### [at] dotcom> a écrit dans le message de news:
45a97afd@news.povray.org...
>
> And hopefully, it's a really interesting subject for the start of the New
> Year. :o)
>
For the start? you are a bit optimistic ;-)
Marc
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"Marc" <jac### [at] wanadoofr> wrote in message
news:45aa6344$1@news.povray.org...
>
> "St." <dot### [at] dotcom> a écrit dans le message de news:
> 45a97afd@news.povray.org...
>>
>> And hopefully, it's a really interesting subject for the start of the
>> New Year. :o)
>>
> For the start? you are a bit optimistic ;-)
Optimistic in mind, optimistic in nature. But it doesn't change
anything - time goes on. :o)
~Steve~
>
> Marc
>
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On Mon, 15 Jan 2007 04:26:03 -0000, "St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote:
> Optimistic in mind, optimistic in nature. But it doesn't change
>anything - time goes on. :o)
>
Perhaps the new topic will be "optimism". ;-)
Kyle
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"Kyle" <hob### [at] gatenet> wrote in message
news:a0vmq2hhrmt78hl2tdag1o0s4vgm9vo95q@4ax.com...
> On Mon, 15 Jan 2007 04:26:03 -0000, "St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote:
>
>> Optimistic in mind, optimistic in nature. But it doesn't change
>>anything - time goes on. :o)
>>
>
> Perhaps the new topic will be "optimism". ;-)
Ha ha! :o) Yes, what a good one that would be!
~Steve~
>
>
> Kyle
>
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"Hildur K." <hil### [at] 3dcafemailevery1net> wrote:
> Has a new topic been announced yet for the stills round?
> Just wondering.
>
> Hildur
I think, there is some problems. (It is very deep thinking :) ).
1. Problems with WEB-submission form, for example, exist for few month.
2. Problems with September-October 2006 stills round - submissions for this
round first allocated in 2006-12-31 folder, and then it was moved.
3. Problems with receiving answer messages and so on.
May be current topic "Complexity" be a last topic? B-r-r-r. :(
P.S. Sorry for my language.
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"Andrey K." <run### [at] yandexru> schreef in bericht
news:web.45af2410dc71f6c48123242a0@news.povray.org...
>
> I think, there is some problems. (It is very deep thinking :) ).
>
So, maybe, the next topic will be "problems"....
Thomas
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> >
> > I think, there is some problems. (It is very deep thinking :) ).
There are problems, we all know that. The question remains, what is causing
these problems? Is is general lack of interest for this competition? I
donīt believe that for a minute. As long as I have been following the IRTC
there have always been plenty of submissions, just until recently.
All those delays seem to me to be the main reason, why there have been fewer
submissins lately. Even though I havenīt submitted myself for a while, it
is more due to me being overworked, not having time or energy to
partipicate.
Iīm still very interested in this competition and almost every day I check
the ftp server too see if a new topic has been announced. Also Iīm always
excited to browse the summissins, even though I donīt get to vote.
I understand there have been some problems with uploading submissions as
well. I donīt understand, this used to work smoothly in the past. I thought
the whole process was supposed to be automatic, no need for human
intervention.
I expect to have more time now and in the coming months, so I was planning
to submit this time. But not being able to guess the topic, time passing
quickly, itīs already 19 days into the round and no topic has been
announced, I donīt know if this round is going to happen or not???
I would hate to see the IRTC go. This competition has served me as a strict
teacher and companion for some years now, not to mention the very good
friends Iīve made in the process.
So please please donīt let the IRTC die!!!!
Canīt we just all join our forces and make this work?
There must be someone else out there who feels the same.
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"Hildur K." <hil### [at] 3dcafemailevery1net> wrote in message
news:web.45b0b9a7dc71f6c42e3296b70@news.povray.org...
> Can´t we just all join our forces and make this work?
> There must be someone else out there who feels the same.
I feel the same. I really don't understand why it's so difficult to put
a new topic up on the very first day!
Can someone please let me be in charge of the topic? People wouldn't
mind so much with the viewing/voting if this was the case.
~Steve~
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I sincerely agree with you, like probably everybody who has participated in
the IRTC or is just curious to see what POV-Ray addicts are up to. And, like
you say, it is an excellent school for progress.
Thomas
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Hey everyone,
I don't get why it is taking so long. Rather dissappointing as the
November-December round was the first time that I have submitted an entry
(despite being a bit of a rushed one!). However I agree with 'Hildur K.' as
I have followed it closely in previous rounds and learnt so much from it
that it has become an invaluable way to learn new stuff. Without it i am
not sure i would ever have got round to learning as much pov ray as i have,
certainly would be stuck for inspiration on what to draw next more often.
I am always in expectation of the next topic so i can get started with some
new ideas. And from now on i will certainly be entering whenever I can come
up with an image on time.
Totally agree that we should join forces. Any ideas how? I definatly feel
the same even as a fairly recent participant in the IRTC history.
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"milco2006" <mil### [at] hotmailcom> wrote:
>
> Totally agree that we should join forces. Any ideas how? I definatly feel
> the same even as a fairly recent participant in the IRTC history.
Welcome milco2006.
Sounds like this is the time to start a "fight for our right to raytrace"
movement :)
I have to admit, even though Iīve followed this competition for several
years now, I havenīt the slightest idea how we can make a difference.
Any ideas anyone???
Hildur
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Hildur K. wrote:
> "milco2006" <mil### [at] hotmailcom> wrote:
>
>> Totally agree that we should join forces. Any ideas how? I definatly feel
>> the same even as a fairly recent participant in the IRTC history.
>
> Welcome milco2006.
>
>
> Sounds like this is the time to start a "fight for our right to raytrace"
> movement :)
>
> I have to admit, even though Iīve followed this competition for several
> years now, I havenīt the slightest idea how we can make a difference.
> Any ideas anyone???
I guess a first step would be to try and contact any admin
currently available... however, in November, Jesse Becker,
the current admin-in-charge (for animations only, or
including stills?), explained that he was almost completely
cut off from the internet (new house, out of range for DSL,
no cable, no phone)... (see:
http://irtc.org/pipermail/irtc-l/2006-November/012792.html
)
*sigh*
-Markus
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Hmm, the mystery deepens. Your idea of contacting admin is not a bad one
however that last document that you flagged up would infer that might be
not as easy as you might imagine. Notably though some of us wouldn't mind
spending a good bit of time just to find out the next topic and see the
continuation of our beloved competition.
~Malcolm
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"milco2006" <mil### [at] hotmailcom> wrote in message
news:web.45b267cddc71f6c4af38a6540@news.povray.org...
> Hmm, the mystery deepens. Your idea of contacting admin is not a bad one
> however that last document that you flagged up would infer that might be
> not as easy as you might imagine. Notably though some of us wouldn't mind
> spending a good bit of time just to find out the next topic and see the
> continuation of our beloved competition.
I've offered to help twice now, (once in a previous thread, and now
in this thread). Nobody listens and nobody that's official replies. In fact,
I can't remember when an IRTC official has replied to any post in the five
years that I've known about the IRTC and its groups - ever. (I could be
wrong about that, but seeing as the IRTC admins are invisible, I wouldn't
know).
When I say that I would like to help with the IRTC *topic*, I mean that
I would want to make sure that the topic is updated on time so that everyone
can get on with the next round if they want to - stills or anims. You know,
take some pressure off the guys that do all the downloading/uploading of
stills and anims, (appreciated from me).
I'm always here, I work from home and run a serious commercial website. My
main computer (this one) never goes down, and even if it did, I have two
others spare that are working just fine.
It only needs someone, (admin), to tell me the right way to do it,
(which I can handle), and it's a done deal.
Let's face it, the first topic of this year isn't going to happen this
time around, (not properly anyway) and if it does, everyone has FIVE (or
less) weeks to complete their offering now. From my experience, that isn't
long enough.
My 'offer' is still valid.
(BTW, welcome Malcolm, enjoy the rest of the PoV groups (everything else
works just fine). :o)
~Steve~
> ~Malcolm
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I followed the link above and read all the posts. It seems that the guy
responsible (admin) is more or less cut off from the outside world!!! At
least in November he was. This is a very strange situation. How can anyone
update the server without an proper access to the internet???
What baffles me is the fact that this responsibility hasnīt been (at least
temporarily) delegated to somebody else who has better access.
At the same time they say they are working on a better code to make the
process run more smoothly. Itīs just a question of time I guess.
To the admins: let it be clear: we are grateful and appreciate all the work
you are putting into the IRTC in your own free time. All we need right now
is a new topic. Some delays regarding voting and announcement of winners
are less important, they donīt affect our work much.
As it is now, we have 39 days left of this round, which is perhaps enough
time to make some stunning art, but further delays would make it impossible
for some people. Some people work faster, some have more free time. Others,
who otherwise would have entered, will have to skip this one, which is too
bad.
This competition has always been about anyone being able to participate,
regardless of skills or experience. I see the whole thing as a huge
experiment, with lotīs of people individually experimenting with art,
technology and ideas all at the same time.
This is the place where new artist are born, supported by the whole
community, having the freedom to express themselves as they please, and
getting individual feedback which is invaluable. The sharing of ideas, of
code, of technique, of artistic expression. No commercial interest
whatsoever makes the whole experience even greater, people having the
freedom to choose their combination of tools at their own discretion and
ability.
This is pretty unique if you ask me and adds to the variety and creativity.
So if anyone is having doubts about the IRTC, about it being an old
competition which has run itīs course, I have to strongly disagree. Things
have changed in the last 10 years, software has improved and more people
are playing with raytracing than before. If the above mentioned technical
problems are solved, Iīm sure we will see more people being drawn to this
competition than ever before.
Personally I would like to see the IRTC grow and become bigger and stronger,
still having this unique flavor of freedom.
Hildur.
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I am in complete agreement with the sentiments expressed by Hildur.
(Repeated below) By far the best outcome would be for the IRTC to continue
and be revitalized. I would like to add my name to the list of persons
repeating an offer to help. I fear, however, that it may be time for those
of us who feel this way to begin thinking about and discussing what we might
do as an alternative if our wishes regarding the IRTC do not come true. Any
project that would pick up where the IRTC would leave off would need to get
off to a quick start lest the community available to support it begin to
dissipate. Does ANYONE here know how to contact the IRTC Admins for their
input? The LAST thing that I would want to do is to undermine the IRTC by
with an alternative forum, but I do believe the time has come when we need
to do something more than just waiting around and hoping for the best. I
look forward to hearing what others think about this.
Best Wishes to All,
Mike C.
"Hildur K." <hil### [at] 3dcafemailevery1net> wrote:
> ... This is the place where new artist are born, supported by the whole
> community, having the freedom to express themselves as they please, and
> getting individual feedback which is invaluable. The sharing of ideas, of
> code, of technique, of artistic expression. No commercial interest
> whatsoever makes the whole experience even greater, people having the
> freedom to choose their combination of tools at their own discretion and
> ability.
> This is pretty unique if you ask me and adds to the variety and creativity.
>
> So if anyone is having doubts about the IRTC, about it being an old
> competition which has run itīs course, I have to strongly disagree. Things
> have changed in the last 10 years, software has improved and more people
> are playing with raytracing than before. If the above mentioned technical
> problems are solved, Iīm sure we will see more people being drawn to this
> competition than ever before.
>
> Personally I would like to see the IRTC grow and become bigger and stronger,
> still having this unique flavor of freedom.
>
> Hildur.
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Mike the Elder wrote:
> I am in complete agreement with the sentiments expressed by Hildur.
> (Repeated below) By far the best outcome would be for the IRTC to continue
> and be revitalized. I would like to add my name to the list of persons
> repeating an offer to help. I fear, however, that it may be time for those
> of us who feel this way to begin thinking about and discussing what we might
> do as an alternative if our wishes regarding the IRTC do not come true. Any
> project that would pick up where the IRTC would leave off would need to get
> off to a quick start lest the community available to support it begin to
> dissipate. Does ANYONE here know how to contact the IRTC Admins for their
> input? The LAST thing that I would want to do is to undermine the IRTC by
> with an alternative forum, but I do believe the time has come when we need
> to do something more than just waiting around and hoping for the best. I
> look forward to hearing what others think about this.
From what i dug out of list archives, and NIC entries, the
IRTC is hosted on, and most likely also from a logistic
point of view a part of, the POVray main server. Maybe
there's someone "a level higher" in the hierarchy able to
answer to our concerns?
-Markus
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Markus Altendorff <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote:
> From what i dug out of list archives, and NIC entries, the
> IRTC is hosted on, and most likely also from a logistic
> point of view a part of, the POVray main server. Maybe
> there's someone "a level higher" in the hierarchy able to
> answer to our concerns?
>
> -Markus
Your right. The Pov people should be interested in keeping the IRTC running
as this encourages people to use Povray.
Anyway, this is the contact they offer on the IRTC page
http://www.irtc.org/email.html
donīt know if anyone has tried it recently.
Hildur
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Hildur K. wrote:
> Anyway, this is the contact they offer on the IRTC page
>
> http://www.irtc.org/email.html
> donīt know if anyone has tried it recently.
Yes, i sent a mail asking them to please replace my
uploaded-and-in-waiting animation, last tuesday. Haven't
heard back from them yet.
-Markus
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Just wondering: Do the admins read the newsgroups? Should
those things also be mentioned on the mailing lists?
-Markus
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Hi all.
It's been years since I posted something in this newsgroup, but the
situation is a chaos as I see it.
I don't remember exactly how many years I've been following the IRTC, I
believe they are 10 or so, sometimes like a participant, always as a 3D
fan.
IRTC was to me the better place for learning, working and sharing ideas,
techniques and friendship.
The problem you are talking about, delays, seems like no one at charge,
strange explanations, happened some years ago, but people is always polite,
and povers more than anyone.
Sometimes I've tried to push me to do something and to submit it to the
IRTC, but the way it worked has made me to quit.
Something like to say the new topic the very first day of the round (as
Steve says) would be a big step. Is it difficult? No it's a nonsense. Just
to edit a page and upload it.
Having to wait more than 20 days always to see the submitted works and to
began the voting process... something is not working here, but not now,
some years ago.
That's one reason why the IRTC is going down, better said it's drowning, and
if the ones who own it don't do anything about it, the only reason I can
think of it's because they don't care.
It's a shame to see what's happening.
Hoping someone will react.
Bye.
Txemi Jendrix
"Hildur K." <hil### [at] 3dcafemailevery1net> wrote:
> > >
> > > I think, there is some problems. (It is very deep thinking :) ).
>
>
> There are problems, we all know that. The question remains, what is causing
> these problems? Is is general lack of interest for this competition? I
> donīt believe that for a minute. As long as I have been following the IRTC
> there have always been plenty of submissions, just until recently.
>
> All those delays seem to me to be the main reason, why there have been fewer
> submissins lately. Even though I havenīt submitted myself for a while, it
> is more due to me being overworked, not having time or energy to
> partipicate.
>
> Iīm still very interested in this competition and almost every day I check
> the ftp server too see if a new topic has been announced. Also Iīm always
> excited to browse the summissins, even though I donīt get to vote.
>
> I understand there have been some problems with uploading submissions as
> well. I donīt understand, this used to work smoothly in the past. I thought
> the whole process was supposed to be automatic, no need for human
> intervention.
>
> I expect to have more time now and in the coming months, so I was planning
> to submit this time. But not being able to guess the topic, time passing
> quickly, itīs already 19 days into the round and no topic has been
> announced, I donīt know if this round is going to happen or not???
>
> I would hate to see the IRTC go. This competition has served me as a strict
> teacher and companion for some years now, not to mention the very good
> friends Iīve made in the process.
>
> So please please donīt let the IRTC die!!!!
>
> Canīt we just all join our forces and make this work?
> There must be someone else out there who feels the same.
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"Mike the Elder" <zer### [at] wyanorg> wrote in message
news:web.45b37f97dc71f6c4d27726630@news.povray.org...
Does ANYONE here know how to contact the IRTC Admins for their
> input?
I've just emailed them now via their official address posted by Hildur.
I hope to get an answer.
~Steve~
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"Txemi Jendrix" <nomail@nomail> wrote:
> Something like to say the new topic the very first day of the round (as
> Steve says) would be a big step. Is it difficult? No it's a nonsense. Just
> to edit a page and upload it.
> Having to wait more than 20 days always to see the submitted works and to
> began the voting process... something is not working here, but not now,
> some years ago.
> That's one reason why the IRTC is going down, better said it's drowning, and
> if the ones who own it don't do anything about it, the only reason I can
> think of it's because they don't care.
> It's a shame to see what's happening.
> Hoping someone will react.
> Bye.
>
> Txemi Jendrix
Your right Txemi, this has been going on for some time now. Itīs
like...letīs say you skip school once, you get away with it, so you do it
again, and again until it becomes a regular habit and finally you drop yout
completely.
Iīve followed this competition for about seven years now and started
submitting about four or five years ago. In the beginning things were fine,
but, Iīm not sure when, at some point these delays started. If we dig
through the older messages in these forums we can probably find out exactly
when.
I donīt know if this has something to do with a new person taking over the
role as an administrator at this point, or the person in charge got tired
of it, but couldnīt find anyone else to do it??? At least this is what it
looks like, even though there may well be other explanations.
The main problem here is that we donīt really know whatīs going on, and the
admins donīt leave messages here, and nobody knows if they ever visit this
forum. So we are fumbling in total darkness, all we can ever do is guess,
which is not really helping.
It seems that the admins do sometimes make announcements and answer
questions on the IRTC pipe mail, maybe thatīs the place to express our
concerns.
http://irtc.org/pipermail/irtc-l/
Hildur
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Hey Txemi, nice to see you around here.
~Steve~
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Just wanted to say: I agree with the consensus here.
I suspect we'll need to take this up with the povray.org hosting team to get
anywhere.
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I too am in agreement with the consensus here. I've been a long-time Povray
user now, and the IRTC has always been a great source of enjoyment and
inspiration for me. I'd hate to see anything happen to this great
competition, and I'm willing to offer my skills in web development and web
administration if they can be of any help.
As Kjetil said in the previous post, it's obvious that we need to get in
contact with someone close to the Povray.org or IRTC.org admin team before
any steps can be taken towards improving the current situation with the
IRTC.
So what do we know about contacting these people so far?
1. The Povray Pipe Mail has been suggested as a means of making contact with
some of the admins:
http://irtc.org/pipermail/irtc-l/
2. The IRTC website contains the following email contact page:
http://www.irtc.org/email.html
(I've already tried using this earlier in the month and I haven't heard back
from anyone yet.)
3. I did some snooping around the povray.org site and I found a page for the
Povray "Technical Assistance Group" or "TAG":
http://tag.povray.org/
(this includes a lot of email addresses near the bottom of the page. I
don't know if anyone checks them anymore, but Chris Colfax is listed at the
webmaster, and his TAG email address is at the bottom of this page.)
4. Several other povray email addresses are listed at:
http://www.povray.org/webmaster.html
I'll try sending off a couple messages tonight. If anyone manages to get in
contact with one of the admins, it would be greatly appreciated if you would
post whatever information they might have for us in this newsgroup.
Hopefully we'll be able to get an idea of what's going with the IRTC
administration, and what help they might be willing to accept concerning
the on-going maintenance of the IRTC website.
I'll post more information if I learn anything.
-Isaac K
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Hi all,
Long time no posting for me too, this is just going to be another
agreement. I've never seen a message from an IRTC admin in the news, so
don't expect any answer here.
Also they have never shown any interest for help proposals from anyone.
When I made the IRTC stats site ( http://exether.free.fr/irtc/ ) and
proposed my help to automate a few things on the official web site, I
hardly had a short message showing NO interest at all in my work.
Concerning participation, you can see there (
http://exether.free.fr/irtc/index.php?sub=graph&lang=fr ) that it has
been decreasing since a long time.
I think a solution would be to create a functional IRTC site and then
'force' the admins to hand over. I don't understand why they want to
remain in history as the creators of a dead competition when there is so
many people wanting to take the lead.
Have a good day ! :-)
JC
Txemi Jendrix a écrit :
> Hi all.
> It's been years since I posted something in this newsgroup, but the
> situation is a chaos as I see it.
> I don't remember exactly how many years I've been following the IRTC, I
> believe they are 10 or so, sometimes like a participant, always as a 3D
> fan.
> IRTC was to me the better place for learning, working and sharing ideas,
> techniques and friendship.
> The problem you are talking about, delays, seems like no one at charge,
> strange explanations, happened some years ago, but people is always polite,
> and povers more than anyone.
> Sometimes I've tried to push me to do something and to submit it to the
> IRTC, but the way it worked has made me to quit.
> Something like to say the new topic the very first day of the round (as
> Steve says) would be a big step. Is it difficult? No it's a nonsense. Just
> to edit a page and upload it.
> Having to wait more than 20 days always to see the submitted works and to
> began the voting process... something is not working here, but not now,
> some years ago.
> That's one reason why the IRTC is going down, better said it's drowning, and
> if the ones who own it don't do anything about it, the only reason I can
> think of it's because they don't care.
> It's a shame to see what's happening.
> Hoping someone will react.
> Bye.
>
> Txemi Jendrix
>
>
> "Hildur K." <hil### [at] 3dcafemailevery1net> wrote:
>>>> I think, there is some problems. (It is very deep thinking :) ).
>>
>> There are problems, we all know that. The question remains, what is causing
>> these problems? Is is general lack of interest for this competition? I
>> donīt believe that for a minute. As long as I have been following the IRTC
>> there have always been plenty of submissions, just until recently.
>>
>> All those delays seem to me to be the main reason, why there have been fewer
>> submissins lately. Even though I havenīt submitted myself for a while, it
>> is more due to me being overworked, not having time or energy to
>> partipicate.
>>
>> Iīm still very interested in this competition and almost every day I check
>> the ftp server too see if a new topic has been announced. Also Iīm always
>> excited to browse the summissins, even though I donīt get to vote.
>>
>> I understand there have been some problems with uploading submissions as
>> well. I donīt understand, this used to work smoothly in the past. I thought
>> the whole process was supposed to be automatic, no need for human
>> intervention.
>>
>> I expect to have more time now and in the coming months, so I was planning
>> to submit this time. But not being able to guess the topic, time passing
>> quickly, itīs already 19 days into the round and no topic has been
>> announced, I donīt know if this round is going to happen or not???
>>
>> I would hate to see the IRTC go. This competition has served me as a strict
>> teacher and companion for some years now, not to mention the very good
>> friends Iīve made in the process.
>>
>> So please please donīt let the IRTC die!!!!
>>
>> Canīt we just all join our forces and make this work?
>> There must be someone else out there who feels the same.
>
>
>
>
--
http://sibylone.free.fr
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Kjetil wrote:
> I suspect we'll need to take this up with the povray.org hosting team to get
> anywhere.
The POV-Team is (and has been for a long time) well aware of the situation.
However, note that hosting the site does not mean Chris Cason (POV-Team
server admin) can just "take away" IRTC from the current IRTC operators, or
take any other "quick" action. Basically, the issue is political, and I
strongly suspect that if you get a very sizable number of past IRTC
submitters (and in particular winners) to support your cause, you are most
likely to succeed.
I should point out that this is just my personal opinion as a POV-Team
member and that I actually never have been in contact with any IRTC admins
myself.
Thorsten
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Thorsten Froehlich <tho### [at] trfde> wrote:
> The POV-Team is (and has been for a long time) well aware of the situation.
> However, note that hosting the site does not mean Chris Cason (POV-Team
> server admin) can just "take away" IRTC from the current IRTC operators, or
> take any other "quick" action. Basically, the issue is political, and I
> strongly suspect that if you get a very sizable number of past IRTC
> submitters (and in particular winners) to support your cause, you are most
> likely to succeed.
> Thorsten
Thanks for your insight Thorsten.
As Thorsten points out, the more people who express their concerns, the more
likely it is for something to be done.
So what could be the next step? Should we try to collect a list of IRTC
submitters (winners or not) who are sharing our concerns and are willing to
support the continuity of the IRTC?
What is the easiest way to create a list? Is it possible to do this here on
the newsgroups, by starting a new thread asking everybody to write a few
comments and their full name/IRTC name?
Or should somebody write one statement for all, then collecting signatures?
Is it somehow possible to make more submitters aware of this?
Iīm no expert on this kind of things, and as you must have noticed, English
isnīt my native language, is there someone who is willing to write such a
statement? How can this be implemented, that is, the collection of names?
Or should we encourage people to e-mail their thoughts en masse to the
Pov-team/IRTC admins? I think that would be more annoying than effective. I
suspect they are already receiving a lotīs of angry e-mails from irritated
people, they probably donīt read them anymore.
Or maybe somebody else has some other suggestions?
Hildur
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"Hildur K." <hil### [at] 3dcafemailevery1net> wrote in message
news:web.45b620d7dc71f6c42e3296b70@news.povray.org...
<snip> ...
>
> Or maybe somebody else has some other suggestions?
>
> Hildur
>
One very simple one - Why don't we start our own competition? It seems
obvious to me that IRTC is now dead (defunct, gone to join the choir
invisible, etc) and the powers that be have so little respect for the
competitors and those who have donated free web space, news space and mirror
space that they just can't be *rsed to tell us.
IRTC was at one time good. It was fun. It was educational and it sparked not
a few friendships. It is now dead. Mourn its passing if you wish but don't
waste time in mourning when you could be planning something new and better.
John
--
"That's one of those irregular verbs, isn't it? I give confidential
security briefings. You leak. He has been charged under section 2a of
the Official Secrets Act." --Jim Hacker.
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"Hildur K." <hil### [at] 3dcafemailevery1net> wrote in message
news:web.45b620d7dc71f6c42e3296b70@news.povray.org...
> Thorsten Froehlich <tho### [at] trfde> wrote:
>
>> The POV-Team is (and has been for a long time) well aware of the
>> situation.
>> However, note that hosting the site does not mean Chris Cason (POV-Team
>> server admin) can just "take away" IRTC from the current IRTC operators,
>> or
>> take any other "quick" action. Basically, the issue is political, and I
>> strongly suspect that if you get a very sizable number of past IRTC
>> submitters (and in particular winners) to support your cause, you are
>> most
>> likely to succeed.
>
>> Thorsten
>
>
> Thanks for your insight Thorsten.
(Yes, thank you Thorsten. Although, I wouldn't want to even hazard a
guess at what 'political' means in the context of the IRTC).
>
> As Thorsten points out, the more people who express their concerns, the
> more
> likely it is for something to be done.
Personally, I think *everyone* is well aware of the problems by now, and
that making a list of participants would be a moot point to follow. It would
be akin to a petition.
All we really need is for *someone* official to let us know what's going
on. If this round isn't happening because coding the new system is going
slow and it won't be ready until the start of the next topic at the end of
February, then fine, that's ok with me, and I suspect a whole bunch of
others too. If the system has really fallen over, and there won't be an IRTC
comp for some time, then we need to know this too, otherwise people will
start to look at other competitions out there. I'm really liking the idea of
bombarding CGSphere to give me something to do with my free time, but then
again, it's nothing compared to the IRTC where you learn new things all the
time.
(No reply from my email as yet).
~Steve~
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My own preference would be (but that's just my 2 cents):
- open a new thread in irtc.stills (or irtc.general? that ng doesn't seem to
be so alive...)
- post a call for answers in povray.general, povray.international, and on
the news.lightning-generator.org/povray.general (the french-speaking pov-ray
forum)
- ask people to give comments, voice concern, give suggestions
- ask them to give their relation to IRTC (winners, submitters, browsers),
although this would not be of prime importance in my view.
- after a suitable period of time, somebody could bundle all this in one
message and send it petition-like to Chris Cason, with a copy to the IRTC
admin.
To tell the truth, Hildur, I believe you have voiced very effectively the
concerns of a lot of people here. You are quite good at it, I think.
Thomas
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I agree with most of your comments. However, I believe we should first
receive an official death certificate before starting our own -
off-Broadway - competition. :-)
Thomas
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"Thomas de Groot" <t.d### [at] internlDOTnet> wrote in message
news:45b62c00$1@news.povray.org...
>I agree with most of your comments. However, I believe we should first
>receive an official death certificate before starting our own -
>off-Broadway - competition. :-)
>
> Thomas
So who's going to issue the death certificate? As I pointed out, TPTB don't
give a damn about keeping us informed so what makes you think they're going
to care about officially announcing their own demise?
John
--
"That's one of those irregular verbs, isn't it? I give confidential
security briefings. You leak. He has been charged under section 2a of
the Official Secrets Act." --Jim Hacker.
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"Thomas de Groot" <t.d### [at] internlDOTnet> wrote:
> I agree with most of your comments. However, I believe we should first
> receive an official death certificate before starting our own -
> off-Broadway - competition. :-)
>
> Thomas
I think that it would be better if the name IRTC could be kept but the
competition put under new management. The IRTC has a honourable history and
the name has some sort of cachet. As others have said it would be courteous
if an explanation for the problems was given.
Stephen
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"Doctor John" <doc### [at] linuxmailorg> wrote:
> "Hildur K." <hil### [at] 3dcafemailevery1net> wrote in message
> news:web.45b620d7dc71f6c42e3296b70@news.povray.org...
> <snip> ...
> >
> > Or maybe somebody else has some other suggestions?
> >
> > Hildur
> >
> One very simple one - Why don't we start our own competition?
Ok, I vote for JC to get this going, (I've admired JC's work for some time
now).
I also agree with Stephen's view that the 'IRTC' name should be kept, (if
we're allowed to do this - opinions?)
I'm here to help if needed. So, let's *Rock 'n' Roll 'n' PoV* guys.
My email can be found easily enough.
~Steve~
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Hello Guys,
I am pretty new to all this although I know of povray for more than 10 years
and have followed the IRTC for about the same amount of time. I want to
offer you my help when you decide to implement a new IRTC. I am pretty
experienced in C++ and VB and know a little about web development and I
have the time to do this now.
If we want to write a new (read decent) upload and voting system that
doesn’t fail. I suggest we take a few people. Log into an MIRC server or
whatever chat client you guys prefer and talk this trough.
I have a few suggestions of how this new system could work better and with
less hassle as it did before… but I’ll leave it at this for the moment.
Only remember that rebuilding a system from scratch will take at least 3
months to work out the major problems.
I’ll be watching this forum regularly but if anyone wants to contact me my
public Email is Nap### [at] yahoofr
Koen Van Vlasselaer
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"St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote:
> "Doctor John" <doc### [at] linuxmailorg> wrote:
> > >
> > One very simple one - Why don't we start our own competition?
>
Iīm not 100% convinced that the IRTC is dead.. yet.
Besides I think this competition has a certain "flavor" or spirit to it
which I like very much, and that would be difficult, if not impossible, to
match in another competition.
There is something charming and mysterious about the IRTC. I never figured
out exactly who is who and the admins are always hidden behind a veil of
invisibility. Us participants can just look up to them in awe and hope to
be noticed....
Think about the mysterious comment:
"from file: notable for textures, lighting, composition, modelling" :-)
who writes that stuff anyway??? Looks like a standard comment, sometimes you
get several of them, maybe with some small variation.
At least it looks like somebody is watching us from "above".
I sincerely hope that person is reading this thread and will soon send us a
note, telling us everything is O.K. and we got nothing to worry about. That
they just had a minor technical problem and everything will be soon sorted
out.... happy ending.
On a more serious note:
There must be a way to find out what exactly is going on!
Hildur
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"Hildur K." <hil### [at] 3dcafemailevery1net> wrote:
> "St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote:
> > "Doctor John" <doc### [at] linuxmailorg> wrote:
>
> > > >
> > > One very simple one - Why don't we start our own competition?
> >
>
> Iīm not 100% convinced that the IRTC is dead.. yet.
Nor am I Hildur, but when will you be convinced? In 50 days time?
They know these messages are here. If they don't, that's how much they
care. I would have posted *something* by now if I was admin.
It's coming up for 24 days...
That's not fair to a world-wide community. :o/
~Steve~
> Hildur
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"St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote:
> Nor am I Hildur, but when will you be convinced? In 50 days time?
>
> They know these messages are here. If they don't, that's how much they
> care. I would have posted *something* by now if I was admin.
>
> It's coming up for 24 days...
>
> That's not fair to a world-wide community. :o/
>
> ~Steve~
Yourīre probably right. And I agree with you that this is by no means fair
to all those who have put so much effort into their 3d work and contributed
to this competition.
But what if this poor guy in charge doesnīt have any internet access
whatsoever, which means that we have to write an old fashioned letter and
put it in the post if we want to contact him?
If this turns out to be the case.... us feeling left out in the cold,
feeling sorry for ourselves, nobody cares about us poor IRTC submitters,
letīs just start our own competition, etc.... :-) And then we find out that
all the time this poor guy, sitting in the middle of nowhere, biting off his
fingernails, the phone line is broken or something, and he canīt get the
message out: The current topic is.... or maybe something happened to him
and nobody knows about it yet.
I think we have to know for sure before we start discussing other
arrangements.
I guess us Povers have developed a unique kind of patience after raytracing
complicated radiosity scenes for years. In our world good things happen
VERY slowly....
zzzzzzzzzzzz
Maybe we should start a "who can guess the current topic" competition while
we wait?
Hildur
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"Hildur K." <hil### [at] 3dcafemailevery1net> wrote:
> "St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote:
> > "Doctor John" <doc### [at] linuxmailorg> wrote:
>
> > > >
> > > One very simple one - Why don't we start our own competition?
> >
>
> Iīm not 100% convinced that the IRTC is dead.. yet.
I wasn’t saying we give up on IRTC yet… I was saying it might be time to get
a group together and start drawing up some plans in case. I sincerely hope
that IRTC comes out of hibernation (soon).
Maintaining a system like the IRTC is trouble enough. Designing, building
and debugging one from scratch will take time… Again I hope I am jumping
the gun and that all plans make can be put in the recycle bin
Staying hidden on the internet is easy enough once the system runs only a
few will know who created it and who is maintaining it. Wrapping yourself
in a veil of mystery, certainly in this case, is more of a problem to a
community then it’s worth,
Being open in the community and taking part in it. Getting hailed when
everything runs smooth and blasted when everything fails shows courage,
Hiding and silence when everything goes wrong is easy enough and I would go
as far as call it cowardice….
At least I would have put an announcement on the front page telling people
that I was experiencing technical problems and couldn’t tell them how long
they would last…. It’s the least you can do as sysadmin.
Oh well… Sorry for my ramblings.
Napivo
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I agree up to 100% with this.
Thomas
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"Thomas de Groot" <t.d### [at] internlDOTnet> wrote in message
news:45b711cd@news.povray.org...
>I agree up to 100% with this.
I agree too, but surely there should be some kind of back-up system
where Hildurs' scenario becomes the case?
<shrug>
~Steve~
>
> Thomas
>
>
>
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Thomas de Groot wrote:
> My own preference would be (but that's just my 2 cents):
>
> - open a new thread in irtc.stills (or irtc.general? that ng doesn't seem to
> be so alive...)
> - post a call for answers in povray.general, povray.international, and on
> the news.lightning-generator.org/povray.general (the french-speaking pov-ray
> forum)
Also as these newsgroups are not the official site for discussion for
the IRTC could someone post a couple of messages on the official mailing
lists? http://www.irtc.org/mlists.html
(I'd post but as I've never submitted an entry....)
Seeing as you've just shown your strawberry on the French fora, I'd say
you were an ideal candidate for pestering them :-)
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Thomas de Groot wrote:
> - post a call for answers in povray.general, povray.international, and on
> the news.lightning-generator.org/povray.general (the french-speaking pov-ray
> forum)
> - ask people to give comments, voice concern, give suggestions
> - ask them to give their relation to IRTC (winners, submitters, browsers),
> although this would not be of prime importance in my view.
> - after a suitable period of time, somebody could bundle all this in one
> message and send it petition-like to Chris Cason, with a copy to the IRTC
> admin.
>
> To tell the truth, Hildur, I believe you have voiced very effectively the
> concerns of a lot of people here. You are quite good at it, I think.
>
Well, I would feel delinquent if I did not voice my concern here also.
Posting as a response to you, Thomas, because you have put so much good
will and good energy into this community of late.
I admit that the IRTC has not been a focus for me personally, for some
time, but I would certainly would be sad to see it expire.
It has some unique and venerable characteristics. For one, the voting
system, with its pragmatic attempt to quantify factors for appreciating
a raytracing. Two, it's topic system...it's kinda nerdy, which is just
how we like it. There is a real comfort level to it which has lead to
some wonderful moments, creatively, over it's history. Three, the
patheon of talent that continues to show up year after year and mix,
good naturedly with the newcomers. Four, it's international scope, and
potential for fometing goodwill. Afterall, imagemaking is a very
intellectually and emotionally revealing enterprise.
I would like, possibly, to go back through the archives of entries and
just revisit some of the riches that are to be found there.
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I think that whatever we can say from now on concerning the ITRC and its
managers, we won't have neither a quick solution for the competition, nor
an quick answer to our question "what is going on?". It seems obvious to me
that the concerned people are aware of the situation and of our concern. So,
it is useless harrassing them any more and feeding the polemics. They know
we are wondering and that some of us are likely and ready to
help/participate/take the lead if necessary to continue the competition,
whatever the form it will take.
For now, I can propose an idea that came up to my mind. The current periodis
now too much out of date. The next 'offical topic' will come for the next
period (March/April). This may be considered as too long by some of us
here.
So why not quickly set up a pseudo-competition here, discuss a 'simple'
topic, for the rest of the current period, ie Jan/Feb, with end-Feb as dead
line? No real evaluation with anonymous notation and ranking, just an
appreciation by people here. For me this can motivate people and keep us in
the 'competition mood' and keep it warm, until someting official is decided.
Bruno
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