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Warp wrote:
> Invisible <voi### [at] dev null> wrote:
>> Still, at least this isn't Windows - you don't have to reboot. Oh, wait,
>> yes you do apparently. At least, you don't *have* to, they just tell you
>> that some updates won't completely take effect until you do.
>
> Linux doesn't support switching kernels on-the-fly. Not many OSes do.
No, that's understandable.
Presumably though if the updates hadn't included changes to the kernel,
it would have just restarted a few services or whatever... Usually Linux
is quite good at that sort of thing.
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Warp wrote:
> Invisible <voi### [at] devnull> wrote:
>> *** Starting YaST...
>> src/module82/sub46/foo.c: malloc(1) failed. Aborting.
>
> How about making a bug report?
I'm surprised there isn't one listed already.
Of course, if I was going to do that, I'd have to sit there and freeze
the VM at the exact point where the error pops up so I can write down
precisely what it said.
And then find the bug tracker, register an account, log in, write a
description... I guess if I was committed to using OpenSUSE on a
long-term basis, it might be worth the effort. But it's not the kind of
effort you're going to expend on every product you try out.
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Invisible wrote:
> Did somebody fail basic software engineering?
Yes.
> How difficult would it be to detect,
More difficult than the guy writing the software for free felt like writing.
That's one fundamental problem with FOSS. (Altho that might start changing
given the number of people now being paid to write FOSS is outweighing the
number of people not paid to write FOSS.)
> Additionally: Maybe I'm just going soft in my old age. But does anybody
> else here remember a time when the most touted advantage of Linux was
> "it's much less of a resource hog than Windows"? I realise that RAM is
> cheap these days, but a distro that won't even install unless you have
> ONE GIGABYTE of RAM?? What the hell does the installer need a gig for?!
Don't confuse the distro with the OS. Linux installs happily in <32M (at
least on my set-top box). That a distro takes more isn't a problem, any more
than Win7 taking more memory than WinCE is.
> Services and applications can be restarted, but the kernel really, really can't.]
This is misleading too. If you're running a web server or a DB server, the
difference between restarting the services and restarting the kernel is
minimal. You're still not running while it's happening. And depending on
what component you've replaced, you very well may not have updated
everything you think you have. E.g., if you replace the PHP interpreter with
one that has security bugs fixed, you now have to restart every service
written in PHP to ensure that fix is in place. Which services are they? You
can't tell. At least with Windows locking executables that are running, you
can tell if an executable is in use when you update it and figure out which
service is using it.
--
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
Forget "focus follows mouse." When do
I get "focus follows gaze"?
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Invisible wrote:
> Of course, if I was going to do that, I'd have to sit there and freeze
> the VM at the exact point where the error pops up so I can write down
> precisely what it said.
Does it reboot after the install completes? If not, see if the messages are
out there somewhere, like with the "dmesg" command or whatever it's called?
--
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
Forget "focus follows mouse." When do
I get "focus follows gaze"?
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>> How difficult would it be to detect,
>
> More difficult than the guy writing the software for free felt like
> writing. That's one fundamental problem with FOSS. (Altho that might
> start changing given the number of people now being paid to write FOSS
> is outweighing the number of people not paid to write FOSS.)
...which is interesting, given that SUSE is a Novell product. (Although
we are talking about OpenSUSE here, so maybe that doesn't count?)
> Don't confuse the distro with the OS. Linux installs happily in <32M (at
> least on my set-top box). That a distro takes more isn't a problem
It is if you wanted to use that distro. ;-)
>> Services and applications can be restarted, but the kernel really,
>> really can't.]
>
> This is misleading too. If you're running a web server or a DB server,
> the difference between restarting the services and restarting the kernel
> is minimal. You're still not running while it's happening. And depending
> on what component you've replaced, you very well may not have updated
> everything you think you have. E.g., if you replace the PHP interpreter
> with one that has security bugs fixed, you now have to restart every
> service written in PHP to ensure that fix is in place. Which services
> are they? You can't tell. At least with Windows locking executables that
> are running, you can tell if an executable is in use when you update it
> and figure out which service is using it.
...OK...but isn't this [part of] what package managers are supposed to
manage?
--
http://blog.orphi.me.uk/
http://www.zazzle.com/MathematicalOrchid*
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Orchid XP v8 wrote:
> ...which is interesting, given that SUSE is a Novell product. (Although
> we are talking about OpenSUSE here, so maybe that doesn't count?)
I wasn't talking specifically about one package or another. Just in general.
> ...OK...but isn't this [part of] what package managers are supposed to
> manage?
Tell me how a Linux package manager is going to tell you whether anyone is
currently running a program that needs some DLL it's going to replace.
--
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
Forget "focus follows mouse." When do
I get "focus follows gaze"?
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>> Of course, if I was going to do that, I'd have to sit there and freeze
>> the VM at the exact point where the error pops up so I can write down
>> precisely what it said.
>
> Does it reboot after the install completes? If not, see if the messages
> are out there somewhere, like with the "dmesg" command or whatever it's
> called?
It says it's going to "reboot", but there's no BIOS screen. I don't know
if it just stops one kernel and loads the other or what...
Trying to pause the VM at the right instant would probably be a lot less
work than trying to figure out Linux.
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On Tue, 26 Jan 2010 11:17:47 +0000, Invisible wrote:
> I used to quite like OpenSUSE. However, the other day I installed it
> about 13 seperate times. Let me tell you why.
If you were to ask some questions over in forums.opensuse.org, I'm sure
someone would be happy to help you out with the issues.
Jim
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On Tue, 26 Jan 2010 08:18:07 -0500, Warp wrote:
> Linux doesn't support switching kernels on-the-fly. Not many OSes do.
The stock kernel doesn't, but there is a company that has developed a way
to patch the live kernel and have the patch take effect. I forget who it
is, but I've heard about it and from people who've used it.
Jim
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On Wed, 27 Jan 2010 18:44:18 +0100, Jim Henderson <nos### [at] nospamcom>
wrote:
> On Tue, 26 Jan 2010 08:18:07 -0500, Warp wrote:
>
>> Linux doesn't support switching kernels on-the-fly. Not many OSes do.
>
> The stock kernel doesn't, but there is a company that has developed a way
> to patch the live kernel and have the patch take effect. I forget who it
> is, but I've heard about it and from people who've used it.
http://www.ksplice.com
--
FE
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