It means "electrocardiogram".

I just had one.

I was expecting them to use metal electrodes and electrolytic gel, but 
actually the nurse got out a sheet of card, peeled about a dozen 
stickers off of it and started sticking them to me like I was a stamp 
book. :-| Obviously several around my ribcage, but oddly enough also 
around my various extremities... presumably so they have something to 
measure the potential difference against.

Having covered me in stickers, she then started attaching crocodile 
clips to them. (Personally, having crocodile clips that close to my 
nipples made me nervous!)

I didn't actually get to see the trace myself, but the nurse reconned it 
looked quite normal. Obviously I'm waiting for the doctor to have a 
chance to look at it for confirmation.

The fun part, of course, is *removing* all the stickers. It's amazing 
how far human skin can distort without ripping. o_O Amazing and 
uncomfortable! Of course, human hair is not nearly so elastic... >_<

The nurse tells me that for really hairy people, she has a whole box 
full of disposible razors. "It's really quite weird shaving some random 
Asian man's chest..."

Still, it could have been worse - if I needed an EEG, I really would 
have to shave. O_O

And fortunately, no blood samples required! :-D (Why do they always have 
to take blood samples from the most tender parts of your anatomy? Why 
not your finger or something? I'm sure it's the same blood...)

-- 
http://blog.orphi.me.uk/
http://www.zazzle.com/MathematicalOrchid*

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On 05-Nov-08 14:16, Orchid XP v8 wrote:
> It means "electrocardiogram".
> 
> I just had one.
Great, why?
> 
> I was expecting them to use metal electrodes and electrolytic gel, but 
> actually the nurse got out a sheet of card, peeled about a dozen 
> stickers off of it and started sticking them to me like I was a stamp 
> book. :-| Obviously several around my ribcage, but oddly enough also 
> around my various extremities... presumably so they have something to 
> measure the potential difference against.
No, the extremity leads (Einthoven (and Goldberger) leads) are the 
oldest ones (about 1903) and still used very much for the diagnosis. The 
six precordial ones were added later to improve diagnosis by looking are 
more local phenomena.

> 
> Having covered me in stickers, she then started attaching crocodile 
> clips to them. (Personally, having crocodile clips that close to my 
> nipples made me nervous!)

wimp

> I didn't actually get to see the trace myself, 

Do you think you could judge it yourself?

> but the nurse reconned it looked quite normal. 

I bet she says that to all the boys.

> Obviously I'm waiting for the doctor to have a 
> chance to look at it for confirmation.
> 
> The fun part, of course, is *removing* all the stickers. 

Indeed it is. I do 65 lead ECG with double adhesive tape. \o/

> It's amazing 
> how far human skin can distort without ripping. o_O Amazing and 
> uncomfortable! Of course, human hair is not nearly so elastic... >_<
> 
> The nurse tells me that for really hairy people, she has a whole box 
> full of disposible razors. "It's really quite weird shaving some random 
> Asian man's chest..."

I have electrodes all around the upper body. I regularly shave the front 
and sometimes even the back of very hairy men.

> Still, it could have been worse - if I needed an EEG, I really would 
> have to shave. O_O

No, they generally use very different electrodes.

> And fortunately, no blood samples required! :-D (Why do they always have 
> to take blood samples from the most tender parts of your anatomy? Why 
> not your finger or something? I'm sure it's the same blood...)
> 
1) they do the finger for diabetes testing and also for testing at the 
blood bank.
2) In don't know where you think they take blood, and possibly don't 
want to know. In my experience it is mostly from the arms.

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>> It means "electrocardiogram".
>>
>> I just had one.

> Great, why?

I keep having random chest pains for no defined reason. Presumably my 
doctor wants to check it's not due to a life-threatening heart condition.

>> I was expecting them to use metal electrodes and electrolytic gel, but 
>> actually the nurse got out a sheet of card, peeled about a dozen 
>> stickers off of it and started sticking them to me like I was a stamp 
>> book. :-| Obviously several around my ribcage, but oddly enough also 
>> around my various extremities... presumably so they have something to 
>> measure the potential difference against.

> No, the extremity leads (Einthoven (and Goldberger) leads) are the 
> oldest ones (about 1903) and still used very much for the diagnosis. The 
> six precordial ones were added later to improve diagnosis by looking are 
> more local phenomena.

I still find it astonishing that they can build an amplifying powerful 
enough and sensitive enough to detect the absurdly small electrical 
currents, diluted across vast distances in space, and yet *not* pick up 
the sea of EM interference in the room... Pretty amazing stuff!

> wimp

Er, yes...?

>> I didn't actually get to see the trace myself, 
> 
> Do you think you could judge it yourself?

No. I'm just curios. (Personally I wouldn't even know a T wave from a U 
wave...)

>> but the nurse reconned it looked quite normal. 
> 
> I bet she says that to all the boys.

THAT'S WHAT *SHE* SAID!

>> The fun part, of course, is *removing* all the stickers. 
> 
> Indeed it is. I do 65 lead ECG with double adhesive tape. \o/

o_O

> I have electrodes all around the upper body. I regularly shave the front 
> and sometimes even the back of very hairy men.

TMI?

>> Still, it could have been worse - if I needed an EEG, I really would 
>> have to shave. O_O
> 
> No, they generally use very different electrodes.

Sure. But I'd imagine you still need to shave your head to get them 
anywhere near your scalp.

What gets me is the people who try to *sleep* wearing those things...

>> And fortunately, no blood samples required! :-D (Why do they always 
>> have to take blood samples from the most tender parts of your anatomy? 
>> Why not your finger or something? I'm sure it's the same blood...)
>>
> 1) they do the finger for diabetes testing and also for testing at the 
> blood bank.
> 2) In don't know where you think they take blood, and possibly don't 
> want to know. In my experience it is mostly from the arms.

Yeah - the soft, tender part in your elbow. What, they couldn't find 
anywhere more painful? :-S

-- 
http://blog.orphi.me.uk/
http://www.zazzle.com/MathematicalOrchid*

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On 05-Nov-08 16:49, Orchid XP v8 wrote:
>>> It means "electrocardiogram".
>>>
>>> I just had one.
> 
>> Great, why?
> 
> I keep having random chest pains for no defined reason. Presumably my 
> doctor wants to check it's not due to a life-threatening heart condition.

makes sense.

> 
> I still find it astonishing that they can build an amplifying powerful 
> enough and sensitive enough to detect the absurdly small electrical 
> currents, diluted across vast distances in space, and yet *not* pick up 
> the sea of EM interference in the room... Pretty amazing stuff!

EM (if you mean computers, mobile phones etc) is not the problem 
generally, mains power supply is.

I tried to find an image of the first string galvanometer in use, this 
is not the one I was looking for, but it will do:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Willem_Einthoven_ECG.jpg

Note that this is a lead between a leg and the left arm. The buckets 
contain salty water. Here comes the part that may or may not amaze you: 
Here the patient is sitting next the machine. In actual clinical use the 
first one was 2 kilometer down the road connected with a telephone wire 
to the buckets in the hospital. There were actual two lines, one for the 
machine and one for Einthoven to talk to the clinician. At our ECG 
course I show this picture to the students, tell them about the 
telephone and ask them why that was technically possible then, but 
absolutely impossible with the current state of technology. Sometimes 
they get it, after some confusion.

>>> I didn't actually get to see the trace myself, 
>>
>> Do you think you could judge it yourself?
> 
> No. I'm just curios. (Personally I wouldn't even know a T wave from a U 
> wave...)

The T is the slow part after the QRS, the fast part with the highest 
excursions. The U wave may be after that. It is not present in every 
lead and not in every person. Frankly, no one knows what generates it.

>> I have electrodes all around the upper body. I regularly shave the 
>> front and sometimes even the back of very hairy men.
> 
> TMI?
?Can't find a relevant meaning for that acronym
> 
>>> Still, it could have been worse - if I needed an EEG, I really would 
>>> have to shave. O_O
>>
>> No, they generally use very different electrodes.
> 
> Sure. But I'd imagine you still need to shave your head to get them 
> anywhere near your scalp.

No. small electrodes fitted with conduction glue like material IIRC
> 
> What gets me is the people who try to *sleep* wearing those things...

This is from the company that builds our amplifiers, they are also used 
for sleep research so this could give you an idea: 
http://www.biosemi.com/applications.htm

>>> And fortunately, no blood samples required! :-D (Why do they always 
>>> have to take blood samples from the most tender parts of your 
>>> anatomy? Why not your finger or something? I'm sure it's the same 
>>> blood...)
>>>
>> 1) they do the finger for diabetes testing and also for testing at the 
>> blood bank.
>> 2) In don't know where you think they take blood, and possibly don't 
>> want to know. In my experience it is mostly from the arms.
> 
> Yeah - the soft, tender part in your elbow. What, they couldn't find 
> anywhere more painful? :-S
> 
Ah, it seems we have found a biological abnormality here. FYI, in most 
people the density of nerve endings in the elbow is much less tjan in 
the fingertips.

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Orchid XP v8 <voi### [at] devnull> wrote:
> Still, it could have been worse - if I needed an EEG, I really would
> have to shave. O_O

I've never had to shave for an EEG, and my hair is pretty thick and
uncooperative.

Never had to shave for a sleep study either.

Ooops, TMI?

(POV community now wondering about Cousin Ricky's mental stability)

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On 05-Nov-08 17:23, Cousin Ricky wrote:
> Orchid XP v8 <voi### [at] devnull> wrote:
>> Still, it could have been worse - if I needed an EEG, I really would
>> have to shave. O_O
> 
> I've never had to shave for an EEG, and my hair is pretty thick and
> uncooperative.
> 
> Never had to shave for a sleep study either.
> 
> Ooops, TMI?

This TMI one could be Too Much Information, correct?

> (POV community now wondering about Cousin Ricky's mental stability)

I assume you either have a sleep disorder or a suspicion of sleep apnoea.

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Orchid XP v8 <voi### [at] devnull> wrote:
> And fortunately, no blood samples required! :-D (Why do they always have 
> to take blood samples from the most tender parts of your anatomy? Why 
> not your finger or something? I'm sure it's the same blood...)

  The fingertips are the most sensitive part of the human body. You *really*
want blood samples taken from your fingers?

-- 
                                                          - Warp

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andrel wrote:
>>> I have electrodes all around the upper body. I regularly shave the
>>> front and sometimes even the back of very hairy men.
>>
>> TMI?
> ?Can't find a relevant meaning for that acronym
>>

Too much information :-)

John
-- 
"Eppur si muove" - Galileo Galilei

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Orchid XP v8 <voi### [at] devnull> wrote:
> It means "electrocardiogram".
>
> I just had one.
>




http://www.fiftythree.org/etherkiller/

???


Stephen

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Warp wrote:
> Orchid XP v8 <voi### [at] devnull> wrote:
>> And fortunately, no blood samples required! :-D (Why do they always have 
>> to take blood samples from the most tender parts of your anatomy? Why 
>> not your finger or something? I'm sure it's the same blood...)
> 
>   The fingertips are the most sensitive part of the human body. You *really*
> want blood samples taken from your fingers?

I believe the distinction of being *the* most sentivite part belongs 
to... well no, let's not go there... but I believe your mouth rates 
higher than your fingertips.

The important thing is that fingers get a lot of wear, so fingertips are 
*touch*. Just the other day, I used mine to hang off a 10 m rock wall. 
You wouldn't dare do that with your elbow! It'd hurt too much. (Fewer 
nerves, but the skin is soft.)

-- 
http://blog.orphi.me.uk/
http://www.zazzle.com/MathematicalOrchid*

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