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In article <3df436ba$1@news.povray.org> , "Apache"
<apa### [at] yahoo com> wrote:
> Then why is emulating a mac on a intel so difficult?
Because you need the Apple firmware (aka bios) and you cannot just copy it
because that would be illegal?
Apart from that, I said emulating a RISC processor on a CISC processor is
difficult.
> I've tried to find out
> if there is any way to run OSX on an intel machine and I haven't found one
> yet!
Google helps ... i.e. <http://www.google.com/search?q=Mac+powerpc+emulator>
Thorsten
____________________________________________________
Thorsten Froehlich, Duisburg, Germany
e-mail: tho### [at] trfde
Visit POV-Ray on the web: http://mac.povray.org
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Thorsten Froehlich wrote:
> In article <3df436ba$1@news.povray.org> , "Apache"
> <apa### [at] yahoocom> wrote:
>
>> Then why is emulating a mac on a intel so difficult?
>
> Because you need the Apple firmware (aka bios) and you cannot just
> copy it because that would be illegal?
If you own the relavent hardware then you can make a backup for emulation
purposes, OTOH I am sure any commercial OSX capable emulator will ship with
a rom card
--
Rick
Kitty5 NewMedia http://Kitty5.co.uk
POV-Ray News & Resources http://Povray.co.uk
TEL : +44 (01270) 501101 - FAX : +44 (01270) 251105 - ICQ : 15776037
PGP Public Key
http://pgpkeys.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0x231E1CEA
---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
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In article <3df436ba$1@news.povray.org>,
"Apache" <apa### [at] yahoocom> wrote:
> Then why is emulating a mac on a intel so difficult? I've tried to find out
> if there is any way to run OSX on an intel machine and I haven't found one
> yet!
Your question doesn't make sense, I'm gussing you didn't read things
closely enough. As Thorsten said, "Emulating a CISC on a RISC system is
easy. Emulating a RISC system on a CISC system is difficult."
This is why you have things like VirtualPC, but no VirtualMac. Emulating
a Mac on an Intel processor is trying to emulate a RISC system on a CISC
one.
--
Christopher James Huff <cja### [at] earthlinknet>
http://home.earthlink.net/~cjameshuff/
POV-Ray TAG: chr### [at] tagpovrayorg
http://tag.povray.org/
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Wasn't it Thorsten Froehlich who wrote:
>In article <3df3e6ca$1@news.povray.org> , "Apache"
><apa### [at] yahoocom> wrote:
>
>> No clue. I remember my grandpa running a pc emulator with win95 on an Acorn
>> many years ago. I was very impressed that such a small box could actually do
>> that. For CISC machines not that hard to emulate a RISC machine. The other
>> way around is another story!
>
>No, actually the other way around it the easy part. Emulating a CISC on a
>RISC system is easy. Emulating a RISC system on a CISC system is difficult.
>Of course I am talking in terms of a _fast_ emulation. Some slow emulation
>is easy in either case as one can just write it in C and run everywhere. A
>fast emulation requires to generate native code. And it is easy to generate
>good native code for a CISC system on a RISC system. The other way around
>you already run into problems as you most likely don't have enough registers
>on the CISC system to store all the emulated RISC registers in...
I thought he wanted a POV port for RicsOS. There is a RiscOS 3.11 port
that runs under Windows available under the names "VirtualA5000" and
"VirtualAcorn".
--
Mike Williams
Gentleman of Leisure
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> No clue. I remember my grandpa running a pc emulator with win95 on an Acorn
> many years ago. I was very impressed that such a small box could actually do
> that. For CISC machines not that hard to emulate a RISC machine. The other
> way around is another story! BTW my grandpa was almost eighty years at
> that time and he's become a true computer nerd doing all kinds of things
> with computers only people like "us" would do!
You sure he didn't just have a PC card in his Arc?
That's the usual way I've seen of running PC stuff on Acorns.
Jamie.
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In article <3df45a93$1@news.povray.org>, tho### [at] trfde says...
> In article <3df436ba$1@news.povray.org> , "Apache"
> <apa### [at] yahoocom> wrote:
>
> > Then why is emulating a mac on a intel so difficult?
>
> Because you need the Apple firmware (aka bios) and you cannot just copy it
> because that would be illegal?
>
> Apart from that, I said emulating a RISC processor on a CISC processor is
> difficult.
>
> > I've tried to find out
> > if there is any way to run OSX on an intel machine and I haven't found one
> > yet!
>
> Google helps ... i.e. <http://www.google.com/search?q=Mac+powerpc+emulator>
>
>
> Thorsten
>
>
> ____________________________________________________
> Thorsten Froehlich, Duisburg, Germany
> e-mail: tho### [at] trfde
>
> Visit POV-Ray on the web: http://mac.povray.org
>
Precisely.. Think of it as having all the .dll libraries that windows
uses built into the machines basic ROM, while on a PC the same chip only
contains some very basic boot code and drivers that support the most
simple means to access various pieces of hardware you install. Assuming
you had a way to boot the machine into an editor mode like with the old
Apple IIgs (that used different ID numbers for firmware calls, but the
same basic code and the Macs back then!?!), you could create a window,
drop a menu into it, display a picture, etc. All without ever loading an
actual operating system. It was sort of fun to play with some of it on
the IIgs, but since you couldn't do much with it without the OS to load
programs and stuff...
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I love doing those kind of things: I talk bad about macs to mac-fans and I
pretend to adore Microsoft to unix/linux folks and I tell windows users that
those wintel boxes are very slow and crash about once an hour.
"Peter Popov" <pet### [at] vipbg> wrote in message
news:mlh8vus62t4l2fd30no67fup0tfshdddp8@4ax.com...
> On Mon, 9 Dec 2002 07:56:26 +0100, "Apache"
> <apa### [at] yahoocom> wrote:
>
> >Then why is emulating a mac on a intel so difficult? I've tried to find
out
> >if there is any way to run OSX on an intel machine and I haven't found
one
> >yet!
>
> Someone has to do it, but who would want to have a Mac if they already
> have a PC? :)
>
> *ducks*
>
>
> Peter Popov ICQ : 15002700
> Personal e-mail : pet### [at] vipbg
> TAG e-mail : pet### [at] tagpovrayorg
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Wow! That means that I have been mixing up CISC and RISC for years!!!! I
thought intel=RISC and acorn/mac = CISC. That's weird weird weird!!!! I've
never mixed up things for such a long time? (In fact I still can't believe
it.)
"Christopher James Huff" <chr### [at] maccom> wrote in message
news:chr### [at] netplexaussieorg...
> In article <3df436ba$1@news.povray.org>,
> "Apache" <apa### [at] yahoocom> wrote:
>
> > Then why is emulating a mac on a intel so difficult? I've tried to find
out
> > if there is any way to run OSX on an intel machine and I haven't found
one
> > yet!
>
> Your question doesn't make sense, I'm gussing you didn't read things
> closely enough. As Thorsten said, "Emulating a CISC on a RISC system is
> easy. Emulating a RISC system on a CISC system is difficult."
> This is why you have things like VirtualPC, but no VirtualMac. Emulating
> a Mac on an Intel processor is trying to emulate a RISC system on a CISC
> one.
>
> --
> Christopher James Huff <cja### [at] earthlinknet>
> http://home.earthlink.net/~cjameshuff/
> POV-Ray TAG: chr### [at] tagpovrayorg
> http://tag.povray.org/
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I don't know/remember. He was running win95 with it just for fun. And he
told me that win95 reminded him of *why* he used acorn. (or uses, because
he's still very alive)
"Jamie Davison" <jam### [at] ntlworldcom> wrote in message
news:MPG.185f02f05a64deaa989c29@news.povray.org...
> > No clue. I remember my grandpa running a pc emulator with win95 on an
Acorn
> > many years ago. I was very impressed that such a small box could
actually do
> > that. For CISC machines not that hard to emulate a RISC machine. The
other
> > way around is another story! BTW my grandpa was almost eighty years at
> > that time and he's become a true computer nerd doing all kinds of things
> > with computers only people like "us" would do!
>
> You sure he didn't just have a PC card in his Arc?
>
> That's the usual way I've seen of running PC stuff on Acorns.
>
> Jamie.
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Remembers me ...
the Archimedes
-even with a Coprozessor & ARM 3 -
was that time 5-10 times slower in
Floating Point then even a Pentium 100.
I had that all in my house so I could make a
comparisson. I guess it was with POV-Ray that time, or whatever was in use.
There was a fast raytracing software avaible, which tried to use "non-fp"
however it was "tricked", the picture were not really "ray-traced".
I guess i have a friend who has all those ald archimedes (& Amiga) stuff
from me.
I don't see even the slightest advantage currently. Do they plan to make a
new RiscOS-Desktop PC with the new Intel-ARM Prozesor ?
Then a port should be avaiable soon.
However AMIGA OS was in many things (take aside the builtin BBC-Basic)
better then the Risc-OS. Real Multi-Tasking, better File-System, Screen &
Windows. Even the PC nowadays does not have the "Screens" concept ...
Yeah .. old times.
--Theo
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------------------------
Distributed Network-Rendering or Local SMP-Rendering on all CPU's you have.
With SMPOV und POV-Ray 3.5. download free at:
http://www.it-berater.org/smpov.htm
"Rick [Kitty5]" <ric### [at] kitty5com> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
news:3df2a673@news.povray.org...
> Where might I find a RiscOS3 (Acorn Arc) port ?
>
> --
>
> Rick
>
> Kitty5 NewMedia http://Kitty5.co.uk
> POV-Ray News & Resources http://Povray.co.uk
> TEL : +44 (01270) 501101 - FAX : +44 (01270) 251105 - ICQ : 15776037
>
> PGP Public Key
> http://pgpkeys.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0x231E1CEA
>
>
>
> ---
> Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
> Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
> Version: 6.0.426 / Virus Database: 239 - Release Date: 02/12/2002
>
>
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