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3 May 2024 09:51:39 EDT (-0400)
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From: Stephen
Subject: Re: Unexpected double_illuminate tradeoffs
Date: 4 Aug 2018 03:20:33
Message: <5b6553c1$1@news.povray.org>
On 04/08/2018 07:52, Thomas de Groot wrote:
> On 3-8-2018 13:55, Stephen wrote:
>> On 03/08/2018 12:09, Thomas de Groot wrote:

>>>
>>> This is a case for the Brexit team I guess. 
>>
>> Might as well. They are not doing much at the moment.
>>
> 
> Pretty quiet on that front, ain't they? Loitering on the beach, no 
> doubt. ;-)
> 

Hiding under the table?


>>
>>
>>> Does the UK want to continue to use the continental written version, 
>>> or switch to the US version? A new challenge for Mrs May.
>>>
>>
>> US version. That would put the cat amongst the pigeons. :-)
> 
> I should have expected that answer!
>

Indeed. :-)

>>
>>> I am sure the potus has something to twitter about that.
>>>
>>
>> Wonderful country, great Queen. They all love me over there. ;-)
>>
>>
> 
> LOL! (oh dear saints in heaven... I almost pissed my pants...)
> 

:-D
I can hear his voice when I read it. :-)

But we should not mock the afflicted.




-- 

Regards
     Stephen


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From: Jim Holsenback
Subject: Re: Unexpected double_illuminate tradeoffs
Date: 4 Aug 2018 07:37:24
Message: <5b658ff4$1@news.povray.org>
On 08/04/2018 03:20 AM, Stephen wrote:
> I can hear his voice when I read it. :-)

likewise

> But we should not mock the afflicted.

why not ... it's become a sport in my household


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From: Jim Holsenback
Subject: Re: Unexpected double_illuminate tradeoffs
Date: 4 Aug 2018 07:55:56
Message: <5b65944c$1@news.povray.org>
On 08/03/2018 07:09 AM, Thomas de Groot wrote:
> I am sure the potus has something to twitter about that.

Pricks Often Tell Unsubstantiated Stories?


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From: Cousin Ricky
Subject: Re: Unexpected double_illuminate tradeoffs
Date: 4 Aug 2018 12:34:38
Message: <5b65d59e$1@news.povray.org>
On 2018-08-04 03:20 AM (-4), Stephen wrote:
> On 04/08/2018 07:52, Thomas de Groot wrote:
>> On 3-8-2018 13:55, Stephen wrote:
>>> On 03/08/2018 12:09, Thomas de Groot wrote:
>
>>>> I am sure the potus has something to twitter about that.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Wonderful country, great Queen. They all love me over there. ;-)
>>>
>>>
>>
>> LOL! (oh dear saints in heaven... I almost pissed my pants...)
>>
>
> :-D
> I can hear his voice when I read it. :-)

So can I.  Thanks for that auditory imagery, Stephen.  :-P

> But we should not mock the afflicted.

When the affliction is comorbid with narcissism, assholitis, and the 
Dunning-Kruger affect, I will mock.  Especially when this megalomaniac 
who hates dark-skinned people who don't pay lip service to Jesus[1] and 
denies that I have a constitutional right to citizenship is making 
policy that affects me.

________________
[1] I deliberately phrased it that way, because you know damn well that 
the Afflicted One is only pretending to love Jesus.


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From: Stephen
Subject: Re: Unexpected double_illuminate tradeoffs
Date: 4 Aug 2018 13:39:16
Message: <5b65e4c4$1@news.povray.org>
On 04/08/2018 12:37, Jim Holsenback wrote:
> On 08/04/2018 03:20 AM, Stephen wrote:
>> I can hear his voice when I read it. :-)
> 
> likewise
> 
A boon to comedians. :)


>> But we should not mock the afflicted.
> 
> why not ... it's become a sport in my household
> 


I am quoting the late Frankie Howard. "Mock not the afflicted." was one 
of his catchphrases.
And he was certainly "afflicted". ;)

-- 

Regards
     Stephen


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From: Stephen
Subject: Re: Unexpected double_illuminate tradeoffs
Date: 4 Aug 2018 13:52:42
Message: <5b65e7ea$1@news.povray.org>
On 04/08/2018 17:35, Cousin Ricky wrote:
> On 2018-08-04 03:20 AM (-4), Stephen wrote:
>> On 04/08/2018 07:52, Thomas de Groot wrote:
>>> On 3-8-2018 13:55, Stephen wrote:
>>>> On 03/08/2018 12:09, Thomas de Groot wrote:
>>
>>>>> I am sure the potus has something to twitter about that.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Wonderful country, great Queen. They all love me over there. ;-)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> LOL! (oh dear saints in heaven... I almost pissed my pants...)
>>>
>>
>> :-D
>> I can hear his voice when I read it. :-)
> 

> 

Not a problem, cuz. :)

Now, if you want an earworm. ;)

Try this from the 80's. Sophia George
https://youtu.be/nDKb4O-l02U?t=22



>> But we should not mock the afflicted.
> 
> When the affliction is comorbid with narcissism, assholitis, and the 
> Dunning-Kruger affect, 

Ooo! it has a name. :)

> I will mock.  

Afflicted might be referring to the people who are afflicted by him, 
yes, yes?

It is too easy really. But see my reply to Jim.



> Especially when this megalomaniac 
> who hates dark-skinned people who don't pay lip service to Jesus[1] and 
> denies that I have a constitutional right to citizenship is making 
> policy that affects me.
> 

Well, he is not making it a secret. At least you can say that of him. :)

> ________________
> [1] I deliberately phrased it that way, because you know damn well that 
> the Afflicted One is only pretending to love Jesus.
> 

Not Jesus the Mexican welder I met in NM? And yes his wife's name was 
Mary and he had a sunscreen on his car that said; "Mary and Jesus".

-- 

Regards
     Stephen


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From: Kenneth
Subject: Re: Unexpected double_illuminate tradeoffs
Date: 4 Aug 2018 16:30:01
Message: <web.5b660bd341922aca47873e10@news.povray.org>
"Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:

>
> Miles, baby.  Miles.

LOL! Brilliant.

I always *knew* there was a difference between meters and...uh...yards, but I
could never quite put my finger on it...

Gonna save that image and show it to my mathematically-challenged friends:
PROOF that the U.S. system of measurement is BIGGER and BETTER! I'm sure POTUS
would think so.  :-P


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From: Kenneth
Subject: Re: Unexpected double_illuminate tradeoffs
Date: 4 Aug 2018 17:10:01
Message: <web.5b6615cc41922aca47873e10@news.povray.org>
Cousin Ricky <ric### [at] yahoocom> wrote:
> Tradeoffs, tradeoffs, tradeoffs.
>...
> I found the black borders on the smooth triangles unexpectedly
> disturbing.  They do show up on my height field hills under some
> circumstances, but are quite tolerable.  But seeing them cap my trees
> sent me straight to double_illuminate.  Disappointingly, double
> illumination had its own peculiarities near the shadow lines.  And when
> I added surface normals to the trees, it got really weird.

About your low-res smooth_triangle trees: I still think that at least the
edge-normal artifacts can be made to look a bit better.

I've been playing around with a low-res height_field, testing double_illuminate
vs. an inside_texture (a RED color in my example), and I think the latter can be
a more effective solution as a tradeoff. From the tests, it's clear that the
object's edge normals are not picking up any of the SKY color (YELLOW), but
rather, the black unlit 'inside' of the closed mesh. (The docs clearly explain
this 'reversed-normal' situation, of course.) But using the recommended
double_illuminate causes strange visual artifacts to appear on an 'applied'
normal{...}.

About the image:
There are to lights in the scene (one of very low intensity from the right, just
to help show some of the bumps normals on that side of the HF, rather than
completely featureless triangle faces that are in shadow.) That by itself helps
with the other problems a little bit.

Image 1 contains the edge artifacts, although they're difficult to see (your
trees are a better test case.)

Image 2-- using double_illuminate-- shows the changed appearance of the bumps
normal. (See the exact center of the image.)

Image 3 shows the true edge artifacts in all their glory ;-) But it also shows
that, by using an *appropriate* color for the inside_texture, it might be
possible to 'hide the edge artifacts in plain sight' so to speak. For example,
if the sky behind the tree edges is a light blue color, and the trees are olive
green, the inside_texture's pigment could be a 'mottled blend' between the two.
A quick and dirty example:
   pigment{
          bumps
          scale <...to be determined...>
          color_map{
                  [0 <...sky blue...>]
                  [1 <... tree green...>]
                   }
           --- some warp{turbulence...}---
           }
   finish{ambient 0 emission .5 diffuse 0}

The basic idea is to give a kind of random blue/green color to the edges of the
trees, in a broken-up way, to help them visually blend in better with the sky
and with their neighbors.


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Attachments:
Download 'low_rez_hf_tests.jpg' (288 KB)

Preview of image 'low_rez_hf_tests.jpg'
low_rez_hf_tests.jpg


 

From: Kenneth
Subject: Re: Unexpected double_illuminate tradeoffs
Date: 4 Aug 2018 18:05:01
Message: <web.5b66222841922aca47873e10@news.povray.org>
"Kenneth" <kdw### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
> But using the recommended
> double_illuminate causes strange visual artifacts to appear on an 'applied'
> normal{...}.
>

"Artifacts" is the wrong word, I admit; the effect is probably a natural result
of 'double-illuminating' the applied normal-- which is not the general way that
normals are expected to interact with a *single* light-source direction. A
better way to describe it would be: a more 'complex' interaction.


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From: Thomas de Groot
Subject: Re: Unexpected double_illuminate tradeoffs
Date: 5 Aug 2018 02:30:12
Message: <5b669974$1@news.povray.org>
On 4-8-2018 19:52, Stephen wrote:
> On 04/08/2018 17:35, Cousin Ricky wrote:
>> On 2018-08-04 03:20 AM (-4), Stephen wrote:
>>> On 04/08/2018 07:52, Thomas de Groot wrote:
>>>> On 3-8-2018 13:55, Stephen wrote:
>>>>> On 03/08/2018 12:09, Thomas de Groot wrote:
>>>
>>>>>> I am sure the potus has something to twitter about that.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Wonderful country, great Queen. They all love me over there. ;-)
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> LOL! (oh dear saints in heaven... I almost pissed my pants...)
>>>>
>>>
>>> :-D
>>> I can hear his voice when I read it. :-)
>>

>>
> 
> Not a problem, cuz. :)
> 
> Now, if you want an earworm. ;)
> 
> Try this from the 80's. Sophia George
> https://youtu.be/nDKb4O-l02U?t=22
> 
> 
> 
>>> But we should not mock the afflicted.
>>
>> When the affliction is comorbid with narcissism, assholitis, and the 
>> Dunning-Kruger affect, 
> 
> Ooo! it has a name. :)
> 
>> I will mock. 
> 
> Afflicted might be referring to the people who are afflicted by him, 
> yes, yes?
> 
> It is too easy really. But see my reply to Jim.
> 
> 
> 
>> Especially when this megalomaniac who hates dark-skinned people who 
>> don't pay lip service to Jesus[1] and denies that I have a 
>> constitutional right to citizenship is making policy that affects me.
>>
> 
> Well, he is not making it a secret. At least you can say that of him. :)
> 
>> ________________
>> [1] I deliberately phrased it that way, because you know damn well 
>> that the Afflicted One is only pretending to love Jesus.
>>

I am afraid he sincerely(?) believes that. However, his guru was/is a 
creepy guy in my view...

> 
> Not Jesus the Mexican welder I met in NM? And yes his wife's name was 
> Mary and he had a sunscreen on his car that said; "Mary and Jesus".
> 

Till the end of my days, I shall be amazed by the world I live in.

-- 
Thomas


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