In article <47e69cb7$1@news.povray.org>, ben### [at] pacificwebguycom says...
> Patrick Elliott wrote:
> > All of which is a lie.
> 
> How do you know?  Were you there?  Or did you read it among all those 
> hate-mongering comments you pointed us to originally?
> 
Snort. Try doing the same searches on domain name registration they did, 
for one. Then there are the emails they sent, etc. As for hate 
mongering... Try @#$@#$#@$ reading the shit posting on anti-evolution 
sites before you call the places I linked to hate mongering. Places like 
Uncommon descent and done everything from claim racism, totalitarianism, 
conspiracy, devil worship, plans of atheists to build concentration 
camps, and damn near every other piece of hate filled bullshit you can 
imagine about scientists. All we have ever done is say, "These people 
are wrong, they get the science wrong, they make things up and when none 
of that works, they sometimes lie, and here are the ****actual**** 
books, chapters, lines, etc. they copied the stuff they quoted from to 
prove it." How the hell hard is it to get that the people filled with 
hate are the ones that will, have, and continue, to quote entire 
chapters that say things like, "Fossil evidence is not sufficient to 
establish ancestry, but dozens of other methods, including...", then 
chop it up into something that says, "Fossil evidence is not 
sufficient...". ID proponents pull that all the time. They get called 
heroes. We point out that they cut out the entire rest of the sentence, 
or in some cases, **pages**, in between the place where the ellipses was 
placed, and that everything in between says the exact opposite, and get 
called, "hateful people that want to suppress the Truth(tm)."

Well, you know, when one side pulls this BS, doesn't let you comment 
even single sentences, never mind clear explanations, on their web 
sites, calls you liars and conspirators at every opertunity, and can't 
so much as describe their supposed alternate theory, never mind provide 
some way to test it, and tries to claim that everything from chicken 
soup to the big bang somehow disproves evolution, when they themselves 
have *accepted* the version of it (minus what ever the hell macro 
evolution is), that scientists actually study, you can imagine why 
people might get damn pissed off, and spend a bit of time laughing at 
their enemies.

Hate mongering.. What a laugh. If we are hate mongering then you should 
be damn happy someone doesn't come along that is also militant. Oh 
wait... been accused of that too, never mind that we are not the ones a) 
throwing people out of our sites, throwing people out of conventions, 
throwing people out of our movies... Wait, who is militant and Nazi like 
again? I am afraid the abject refusal to allow anyone to refute you, and 
the tendency to shut out, silence, forcefully expel and then slander 
everyone that doesn't agree with you kind of makes the picture look a 
bit skewed.

Ok, don't believe me. Go to just about *any* website run by one of these 
pro-ID groups. Make a new user name, pick some topic they are ranting 
about with regard to evolution, then post something relevant to it, that 
comes from the scientists side of things. Watch how fast you post, on 
most of them, gets deleted. I have done this many times, most of the 
time it was something simple, like saying, in one case, "Actually 
evolution doesn't imply completely random chance. While the mutation may 
be, the environment and the body itself prevent most mutations from 
doing anything. That is why its descent with modification, or natural 
selection, *not* random chance." That is all I said. I didn't rant, 
didn't call anyone an idiot, nothing. The post *never* appeared on the 
site.

Just try it. I don't care if you post your own comment, based on piecing 
together details from some place like talkorigins, or you copy 1-2 
sentences from there, without mentioning that you got it from that site. 
90% of creationist/ID sites will delete the comment, 50% of those won't 
even allow it to pass moderation, and about 20% of them will ban you, so 
you can't try to post anything again.

You people keep whining about level playing fields. The truth is, you 
don't want any such thing. You want a playing field where everything is 
stacked in your favor, you don't have to listen to opposition, you can 
shout down anyone that drops in to say something, and you can then claim 
that no one shows up at all, to rebut any of your arguments.

Why the hell shouldn't people hate those that pull this kind of crap?

Snort.. Why do I bother. Nothing I say is likely to get you to try what 
I suggest, take anything we say with enough respect to try to verify any 
of it, and the default argument, when ever someone tries to point out an 
error is to either ignore it, claim that your version of evolution is 
the right one (never mind that it fits **no** definition of it ever 
published, other than your own), or claim that the sites containing the 
information are some sort of vast propaganda campaign invented in the 
last few years to discredit ID. You will never look at PubMed for the 
original material, never mind verify how old much of it is. And while 
everyone else in the world considers the ability of science to recognize 
a mistake and correct it, and it has done so, even going so far as to 
reject *huge* amounts of what Darwin himself originally said, to you 
this is a sign of weakness, not strength. Fine. Wallow in ignorance. I 
don't give a #$@$@#. Just don't insist that everyone else join you in 
the damn mud.

-- 
void main () {

    if version = "Vista" {
      call slow_by_half();
      call DRM_everything();
    }
    call functional_code();
  }
  else
    call crash_windows();
}

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