Stefan Viljoen schrieb:
> 
> I'm seriously doubtful about the USAF planning regarding these aircraft. The
> F-22 specifically, it is so HORRIBLY expensive, and they have bought much
> less than the Air Force generals wanted. If they get into a fight with,
> say, China, which has got thousands of Mig-21s and comparable aircraft, I
> think they'll get whipped.

Even given that the MiG-21 pilots would "see" the F-22 at all before 
being hit by some long-range AA missile, that would be a problem only if 
the U.S. of A. had nothing else to bring into the air besides their F-22s.

> The simple reason being the F-22 is so expensive that the budget won't allow
> for enough AIM-120's or whatever to be bought. So you got, say, 70 F-22s
> sent to Korea or Taiwan for a fight with China (bear with my simplistic
> view of international politics.) They take along 200 of the available 600
> AIM-120 AMRAAM missiles. They use those to shoot down (perfectly, and at
> great range) 175 old, 1950's era MiGs.
> 
> But China has a thousand of those cheap aircraft. And the entire USAF has
> only 600 AMRAAMs, of which many still have to be shipped to Taiwan or S.
> Korea in order to get into the fight.
> 
> What happens next? The F-22s go "Winchester" - they have to engage in gun to
> gun duels, at low level (where the 60+ year old Chinese Mig-17, for
> example, is a KING of maneuverability.) The F-22 now has to go "low and
> slow" in the weeds, against a fighter that was DESIGNED for that, while
> itself is a beyond-visual-range 30 000 feet plus rather neurotic
> thoroughbred. 

You're having some misconceptions here:

(A) Besides being able to carry BVR AIM-120 AMRAAMs, the F-22 is 
designed to bear much cheaper AIM-9 Sidewinders into battle.

(B) Are you aware of what the F-22 can do in slow flight? Just take a 
look at this one - especially from 1:25 to 2:45:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JTK3zeFRLO8&feature=related

(Thrust vectoring is the key to this, by the way.)

(C) As long as it's missiles against missiles, the MiG-21 will have a 
hard time getting a lock on the target. And when it comes to guns, the 
F-22 can always just outclimb or outrun the MiGs. Being good in a 
dogfight may be one thing, but being able to choose whether or not to 
enter into or leave one is another.

(D) You're forgetting about the countless F-15s, F-16s and F-18s (and/or 
the F-35s to come), that would fight side by side with the F-22.


> It's the Vietnam paradigm all over again, losing a tens of millions of
> dollars price F-4 Phantom in blowing up a bamboo bridge that is
> reconstructed that very night, with $3 Chinese bicycles once more carrying
> ammunition across it for the Viet Cong.

That's a totally different point. The U.S. of A. did have air 
superiority in Vietnam, and they will have it again and again and again, 
in whatever war you like.

The problem in Vietnam was that air superiority is only half the job 
when it comes to wrestling down an opponent in his own home country. But 
that doesn't make the F-22 inferior against MiG-21s.

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