Darren New wrote:
>> I can see how that could make my position confusing, though, and I 
>> should have been more clear.
> 
> OK. Altho I must say, if the teaching of the church is that all blacks 
> are descendants of the first murderer and cannot be spiritually whole, 
> it kind of throws a wrench into the McCain/Obama "vote whoever you feel 
> best about" doctrine. :-)

That's not really the teaching, though a lot of people (Mormons 
included, unfortunately) take it that way.

What it really is, is that one particular group of people were colored 
black because they descended from Cain.

But, wait a minute... there are SEVERAL colors of people, and several 
different ethnic groups that are "black"!  Which is which?!?!?

Mormon doctrine doesn't say anything about the other groups, where they 
came from or how they came to be the way they are.

Like I said, though, that's a common misunderstanding.

>> Yeah, that one surprised a lot of people at the time,
> 
> Funny. My understanding from other Mormons is that everyone at the time 
> knew exactly why God had commanded that.  Namely, that Mrs Smith didn't 
> like cleaning up when people missed the spittoon.

That complaint started it... the response of the Lord was basically, 
"Since you asked, you're getting the whole deal..."

A prohibition on tobacco like that was pretty much unprecedented, 
however, and it surprised the majority of people.

>>> To masturbate? To be homosexual?
>> Yes, those behaviors are prohibited.
> 
> Well, since that's the specific bit we're talking about, and it sounds 
> like the church is giving specific instructions about what to do about 
> that, I'm not sure why you're disagreeing with me.

Well, you happened to touch on one of the few subject where the Church 
gets really specific.  You seemed to be taking my statement about 
generality and saying, "That can't be right because of this instance!" 
when that instance is one of the few exceptions.

>>> when he mentioned that homosexuality is unholy?
> 
>> What's wrong with saying that homosexuality is unholy?  Whether or not 
>> you believe it is your decision, but it's one of the teachings of the 
>> LDS Church, and they're unapologetic about it.
> 
> Sure. But then to say "but we won't tell you how to vote on the gay 
> marriage bill" is being kind of disingenuous.

Not particularly.  My own understanding of the issues led me to believe 
that I should vote for bills like that.  While I couldn't (as a member 
of the Church) approve of homosexual behavior, I also couldn't approve 
of discrimination against homosexuals.

Not to mention, that I think it's just plain stupid to try and legislate 
morality.

-- 
Chambers

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