On 29-1-2011 23:36, Darren New wrote:
> andrel wrote:
>> You might say that, but you would be wrong. At least for the people I
>> was talking about.
>
> I don't know who you're talking about. I'm saying that the expense of
> guns doesn't seem to have an obvious and direct correlation on the
> number of people who get shot, given that lots of people were shot in
> countries where guns were very expensive.

And I am saying they would be even more expensive if there wasn't such a 
large market in the US. BTW from what I have heard guns (if you know 
where to get them) are not outside the budget of a 15 YO.

>>>> Get over it, your second amendment is getting people killed outside
>>>> the US. But don't worry they are mostly foreigners.
>>>
>>> Yep. And the EU's stance on non-GMO food is getting a lot of people
>>> killed outside the EU.
>>
>> Interesting counterargument. Or is it?
>
> I'm not arguing. I'm just pointing out that there are good and bad
> things going on everywhere. Blaming the US for people getting shot in
> the UK or wherever you are is like blaming the EU for people starving in
> Africa.

BTW I was not blaming anyone. I was just pointing out that also people 
abroad may die as a result of a US policy on guns. In the Netherlands 
they are mainly foreigners involved in drugs who get shot here, but still.

>> Anyway never heard this theory before, care to explain?
>
> http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/2233839.stm
>
> We had enough grain to outweigh a couple of battleships ready to go
> (hundreds of thousands of tons), and some African countries wouldn't
> accept it until it was milled, because they didn't want to lose their EU
> market for their produce. Instead, millions of people starved in Africa
> because the EU wouldn't import grain from them in the future if they
> took this grain now.

Ok, you are blaming the EU for a decision in Africa by leaders that are 
more concerned about themselves than their people? Ok the EU is involved 
somewhere in this line of reasoning and I admit the reasons for that EU 
policy are mixed. Both large groups of EU citizens not wanting to 
consume GM food, as well as not wanting to be dependent on a US 
monopoly. Though both are probably not independent.

> http://denbeste.nu/cd_log_entries/2002/08/Bettertostarve.shtml

That sounds not so objective.

>>> You enforce your laws, we'll enforce ours. :-) We
>>> don't blame the netherlands for the US locking up pot users either.
>>
>> OTOH we blame the US for locking up Dutch citizens for pot related
>> 'crimes'.
>
> Sure. That whole thing is screwed up here. We don't like it either.
>
>> Talking about drugs, having strict drug laws *and* freely available
>> guns is a recipe for disaster. ;)
>
> Honestly, Mexico is worse. They have just as many guns, if not more.

Yes for exactly that reason.

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