On Sat, 14 Feb 2009 20:03:53 +0000, Orchid XP v8 wrote:

>>> I've got it all straightened out *now*. ;-)
>>>
>>> My problem wasn't actually "getting Linux to work", but rather
>>> "getting Linux to do what I want". But in my experience, Linux package
>>> managers are often very awkward to use. You know - the whole "I want
>>> to install this one package, and no I don't want to also upgrade 3,657
>>> other packages to a different version".
>> 
>> openSUSE's package management seems to do pretty well with this.  If I
>> want to install Virtualbox OSE, I just run "yast2 -i" (for a graphical
>> way to do this) or "zypper in virtualbox-ose" in a terminal window.
>> 
>> The package manager figures out what's needed, resolves all
>> dependencies, and installs the necessary packages.
> 
> Yeah. It's great when it works like that. But sometimes it decides that
> it wants to install version X of the thing you asked for, which depends
> on a completely different version of something critical - GCC, the Linux
> kernel, libc, whatever. Obviously, replace that and you have to replace
> half the software on your HD. :-}

Funny, I don't run into that problem - and generally haven't in the 
nearly 15 years I've been running Linux.

You *can* run into this if you use nonstandard repos regularly, but I 
don't.  What's in a repo like the openSUSE repos is tested so that these 
types of conflicts don't occur.

Case in point:

--- snip ---

[jhenderson@krikkit ~]$ sudo zypper in virtualbox-ose
Downloading repository 'Packman Repository' metadata [done]
Building repository 'Packman Repository' cache [done]
Reading installed packages...

The following NEW packages are going to be installed:
  virtualbox-ose virtualbox-ose-kmp-default libXerces-c-28 libXalan-c-110 


Overall download size: 6.2 M. After the operation, additional 26.2 M will 
be used.
Continue? [YES/no]: 
Downloading package virtualbox-ose-kmp-
default-1.5.6_2.6.25.5_1.1-33.1.x86_64 (1/4), 71.0 K (1.7 M unpacked)
Downloading: virtualbox-ose-kmp-
default-1.5.6_2.6.25.5_1.1-33.1.x86_64.rpm [done]
Installing: virtualbox-ose-kmp-default-1.5.6_2.6.25.5_1.1-33.1 [done]
Downloading package libXerces-c-28-2.8.0-10.1.x86_64 (2/4), 1.0 M (4.5 M 
unpacked)
Downloading: libXerces-c-28-2.8.0-10.1.x86_64.rpm [done (200.7 K/s)]
Installing: libXerces-c-28-2.8.0-10.1 [done]
Downloading package libXalan-c-110-1.10-116.1.x86_64 (3/4), 862.0 K (4.4 
M unpacked)
Downloading: libXalan-c-110-1.10-116.1.x86_64.rpm [done (91.6 K/s)]
Installing: libXalan-c-110-1.10-116.1 [done]
Downloading package virtualbox-ose-1.5.6-33.2.x86_64 (4/4), 4.2 M (15.6 M 
unpacked)
Downloading: virtualbox-ose-1.5.6-33.2.x86_64.rpm [done (12.9 K/s)]
Installing: virtualbox-ose-1.5.6-33.2 [done]

--- snip ---

And just to make the point:

--- snip ---

[jhenderson@krikkit ~]$ rpm -ql virtualbox-ose | grep bin
/usr/bin/VBoxAddIF
/usr/bin/VBoxDeleteIF
/usr/bin/VBoxManage
/usr/bin/VBoxSDL
/usr/bin/VBoxSVC
/usr/bin/VBoxTunctl
/usr/bin/VirtualBox
/usr/bin/vditool

--- snip ---

Nope, these are not source files.  These are *binary* files from the 
package I installed.

>> While not as common as it used to be, dll hell still (to what I hear,
>> not being a Windows user) happens.  But much of the time packages
>> include the version of the DLLs they need and use them rather than the
>> installed system libraries.
> 
> This, of course, completely defies the entire purpose of shared
> libraries! :-D

Of course it does.  But you were lamenting that "This never happens in 
Windows" - this is a big part of the reason why.

>>> Plus getting hold of a human
>>> over IRC seems to be like getting blood out of a stone. I guess
>>> everybody is in a different timezone to me?
>> 
>> Try online forums instead - you're already familiar with them.  Ubuntu
>> and openSUSE have very vibrant online communities.
>> 
>> I never use IRC to ask for help - just never needed that sort of
>> immediacy.
> 
> No - this was for help with the open-source project I'm trying to
> contribute to, not for Linux. ;-)

And questions about VirtualBox (for example) are not out of place in an 
appropriate Ubuntu or openSUSE community group.

>>> It's sorted now, it just took rather a lot of effort considering the
>>> triviallity of what I actually set out to do. ;-)
>> 
>> Which was what, out of curiosity?
> 
> I added a section to the user manual. (Which is written in something
> called "docbook", by the way.)

Very cool.  Make sure you note that for your CV as well, things like that 
can be useful.

Jim

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