Warp wrote:
> Darren New <dne### [at] sanrrcom> wrote:
>> The fact that GRUB is no longer around once it has loaded the program 
>> means it's probably not actually an operating system.
> 
>   Sound pretty much like MS-DOS to me.

Err, no. MS-DOS is still around, supporting your application, once your 
application is running. That's why main() can call exit() and you get a 
prompt back.

>   Bios is, in fact, a perfect example of "operating system" by this
> definition.

Early operating systems were very primitive.

>> In my experience, when someone simply answers "That's BS and you know it", 
>> it often means "Good point, but shut up about it."
> 
>   Now you are insulting me.

Then stop accusing me of attempting to BS you. :-) If you're going to take 
that statement personally, then so will I.

Seriously, if you'd answer the question I asked, it's pretty easy to have a 
conversation. So far, you've done everything you can do to argue with me 
that MS-DOS *isn't* an operating system without actually telling me *why* 
you think that. *That* sounds like BS to me.

Given that the manufacturer and Wikipedia say that Xenix, MS-DOS, and MCP 
are operating systems, I would think it's incumbent upon you if you disagree 
to at least say why you disagree instead of saying they're all BSing.

>   Funny that you don't even know which phone I have.

I'm guessing it probably has a camera and a contact list on it.

>   Since you are talking in such an expert tone of voice about cellphone
> applications, I assume you have written programs for Symbian and know
> perfectly what you are talking about?

Yes. Not in cell phones, mind, but in credit card terminals.

In addition, my wife programs cell phones, so I have a pretty good idea of 
how the code is organized inside at least some of them, and how it's 
distributed to the OEMs, and so on.

>>>> Other than scoffing, what do you think, specifically, an OS has to do that 
>>>> MS-DOS doesn't do at least in a primitive way?
>>>   Maybe I could answer with a question: If grub is not an OS and MS-DOS is,
>>> then where exactly is the line?
> 
>> MS-DOS is still around after your application finishes running. It's 
>> providing services to multiple (sometimes even concurrent) applications. It 
>> manages resource allocations between different applications.
> 
>   Then bios is also an OS. I suppose that settles it.

I'll notice that you've still managed to avoid answering the question. I 
guess those batch processing monitors on the old mainframes weren't OSes 
either, then.

But, since you'd prefer to argue on an insulting and emotionally-driven 
level rather than actually discuss something that might lead to actually 
giving someone something to think about (or heaven forbid changing someone's 
opinion), I'll let it drop with a sad shake of the head.

-- 
   Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
   Why is there a chainsaw in DOOM?
   There aren't any trees on Mars.

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