Patrick Elliott wrote:
> Umm. Actually the problem with first cause arguments is that they are 
> perpetual. I.e., once you start claiming everything "must" have a cause, 
> therefore something had to make the universe, you inevitably have to ask 
> what caused that thing to exist.

The usual answer is "God is eternal and has always existed."  That's how you 
know it's God, you see.

> Or, if you prefer a quantum effect, what "causes" a thing doesn't always 
> have to "come before it",

And, given we're talking "the start of the universe", there is no "before" 
to talk about, either.

In any case, I wasn't aiming to get into a general religion rant. I was just 
looking for holes in my one argument. You, of course, should feel free to 
continue, but it's not anything new you're saying. :-)

-- 
   Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
   The NFL should go international. I'd pay to
   see the Detroit Lions vs the Roman Catholics.

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