Grassblade wrote:
> Lessee. Have you ever observed a point, a line or a segment? As I'm sure you
> know, the correct answer is: no, because they aren't defined.

Sure, they're defined. They're just not real in the real world. :-)

> They're oh-so-conveniently axiomatised (is that a word?). 

That would be how they got defined.


Have you ever seen an electron, or a single photon? How do you know they 
exist?

> If you have never seen them, and nobody has and never will, how do you know they
exist? 

They don't, as you're trying to mean it. They're mathematical 
abstractions. They exist as a thought construct in your brain and mine, 
but not as something "out there".

> Geometry is based on
> them, and space vectors too. Since there is no evidence of points' and lines'
> existence, I can claim with atheistic certainty, that geometry doesn't exist,
> and consequently neither ray-tracing.

Except they do exist. They just don't exist "out there". They're 
concepts, just like color is. They're a pattern in your brain, just like 
Microsoft Word is a pattern in RAM.

This is exactly what I was saying earlier: "It doesn't exist except as a 
pattern, therefore it isn't real."  It's not a valid argument.

>> Have you read Job?
> Yes. For those who don't know, it's about a very wise, very knowledgeable guy,
> who thinks he is wronged by God, and demands justice. It's supposed to teach
> humility. Funny that you should mention it.
>> He's a sadistic SOB in that book. It sure doesn't
>> sound like a good and loving God to me. And here I am, with the
>> knowledge of good and evil. Yet I'm being told to shut up,
> Who told you to shut up?!

Fair enough. :-)

> Don't you think you'd need all the relevant information to pass judgement? 

Yes. The problem is the number of people who believe I can't possibly 
have all the relevant information and come up with a different judgement 
than they do. *That* is the problem. "If only you understood, you'd 
agree." The primary hubris of the religious.

> judges just flip a coin or go by gut feeling in your country?

Only politicians. ;-)

> AFAIK the Bible
> only holds enough information to believe in God,

Been there. Done that. Didn't work.

> not to pass judgment on Him

I'm not judging God. I'm judging the world around me, and I see that it 
holds evil. And I'm judging some people who claim to know the will of 
God, and see them too doing evil.

How could I be passing judgement on God if I don't believe in God? 
That's kind of silly. I'm passing judgement on my belief, and its 
compatibility with God as described by many religious people. Since, of 
course, every religious person has a different conceptualization of God, 
I can't even imagine how I could pass judgement on *your* God.

-- 
   Darren New / San Diego, CA, USA (PST)
     It's not feature creep if you put it
     at the end and adjust the release date.

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