povray.windows message digest

[Bald Eagle] Re: Modern Pov-Ray & Modern AI: chat-style gener... [445 days 20 hours and 29 minutes ago]

Wed, 5 Feb 2025 17:25:00 GMT

"Kenneth" <kdw### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
> The AI-generated Pyramid macro is also badly composed:
>         #macro Pyramid(position, size)
>
> The lowercase 'size' variable used there is actually a POV-ray preserved
> keyword, meant only for use in a 'facets' pattern-- which has nothing to do with
> that particular macro. So the code would probably fail even with the additional
> closing bracket that Bald Eagle mentioned.

There are a lot of different AI packages, and I would assume each has their
particular strengths and weaknesses.

I have access to M$ CoPilot - which seems to do a truly suprisingly good job
with certain algorithms and SDL syntax - and then just completely drops the ball
when I try to model something which is (to me) comparatively simple, like
twisted rope.

> The AI generator should have written it differently, like  Size  or  SIZE  or
> something else, to be different from the keyword. Apparently 'the Brain' hasn't
> learned such syntax rules yet ;-)

Try a different AI model, or post a request for submitting your prompt to
another user's AI.

It's also just a good idea to hunt through your code and use it as a way to
learn proper SDL syntax, and good code formatting.

[Kenneth] Re: Modern Pov-Ray & Modern AI: chat-style gener... [445 days 21 hours and 4 minutes ago]

Wed, 5 Feb 2025 16:50:00 GMT

The AI-generated Pyramid macro is also badly composed:
        #macro Pyramid(position, size)

The lowercase 'size' variable used there is actually a POV-ray preserved
keyword, meant only for use in a 'facets' pattern-- which has nothing to do with
that particular macro. So the code would probably fail even with the additional
closing bracket that Bald Eagle mentioned.

The AI generator should have written it differently, like  Size  or  SIZE  or
something else, to be different from the keyword. Apparently 'the Brain' hasn't
learned such syntax rules yet ;-)

[Bald Eagle] Re: Modern Pov-Ray & Modern AI: chat-style gener... [446 days 15 hours and 39 minutes ago]

Tue, 4 Feb 2025 22:15:00 GMT

"Kinesis" <nomail@nomail> wrote:
> Here's an example, as a screenshot. It is broken! I have been trying to utilize
> PovRay for fun with AI but it is not working correctly (messages from Povray say
> that '}' is misplaced, commonly).
> --

You don't have a terminating } in your light source.

Try formatting your code to have { and } for each level at some fixed
indentation, so that it's easy to visually check opening and closing curly
braces.

texture
{
     pigment
     {
          pigment_map
          {

          }
     }
}

sorta thing.

- BW

[Kinesis] Modern Pov-Ray & Modern AI: chat-style generated... [446 days 16 hours and 9 minutes ago]

Tue, 4 Feb 2025 21:45:00 GMT

Here's an example, as a screenshot. It is broken! I have been trying to utilize
PovRay for fun with AI but it is not working correctly (messages from Povray say
that '}' is misplaced, commonly).
--

[yesbird] Re: Keeping line numbers [719 days 4 hours and 37 minutes ago]

Wed, 8 May 2024 09:17:34 GMT

On 08/05/2024 05:31, Ilya Razmanov wrote:
> "Note that, unlike the other settings on this property page, the Line 
> Numbers setting only applies to the current editor file. Additionally, 
> it is not preserved across invocations of the editor; once you exit, the 
> setting is forgotten."
> 

Thanks, Ilya.
This is unusual behavior, but at least I know the reason now.
--
YB

[Ilya Razmanov] Re: Keeping line numbers [719 days 11 hours and 22 minutes ago]

Wed, 8 May 2024 02:31:56 GMT

On 06.05.2024 11:08, yesbird wrote:
> Hi all !
> 
> Could someone suggest, how to turn on line numbers permanently in Povray
> windows editor ? Now they are disappears after editor restart.

https://www.povray.org/documentation/view/3.6.1/662/

"Note that, unlike the other settings on this property page, the Line 
Numbers setting only applies to the current editor file. Additionally, 
it is not preserved across invocations of the editor; once you exit, the 
setting is forgotten."

-- 
Ilyich the Toad
https://dnyarri.github.io/

[yesbird] Re: Keeping line numbers [720 days 4 hours and 2 minutes ago]

Tue, 7 May 2024 09:52:16 GMT

On 07/05/2024 07:20, Ilya Razmanov wrote:
> But we keep our experiments going. Public health is our main goal.
> 

Thanks, Ilya !
Hope you will heal the editor, at least ).
--
YB

[Ilya Razmanov] Re: Keeping line numbers [720 days 9 hours and 34 minutes ago]

Tue, 7 May 2024 04:20:12 GMT

On 07.05.2024 6:35, Ilya Razmanov wrote:

> HKEY_CURRENT_USER\SOFTWARE\POV-Ray\v3.7\POV-Edit

Ok, great, I've made some experiments and now I can't get line numbers 
to be seen at all. Excellent.

But we keep our experiments going. Public health is our main goal.

-- 
Ilyich the Toad
https://dnyarri.github.io/

[Ilya Razmanov] Re: Keeping line numbers [720 days 10 hours and 19 minutes ago]

Tue, 7 May 2024 03:35:15 GMT

On 06.05.2024 11:08, yesbird wrote:

> Could someone suggest, how to turn on line numbers permanently in Povray
> windows editor ? Now they are disappears after editor restart.

That's an interesting question. AFAIK, under Windows editor preferences 
go to (don't know how it it's called really without 
localization)\HKEY_CURRENT_USER\SOFTWARE\POV-Ray\v3.7\POV-Edit but I 
don't see which one may be related to line numbering. Anyway, may be 
it's worth checking out permissions for the whole group?

-- 
Ilyich the Toad
https://dnyarri.github.io/

[yesbird] Disable 'revision.txt' and 'changes.txt' loading [721 days 5 hours and 38 minutes ago]

Mon, 6 May 2024 08:15:40 GMT

Hi, all !

Can't figure out how to avoid loading annoying 'revision.txt' and
'changes.txt' on windows editor's start. Looked through all the settings
and did not find how to do it.

Any suggestions please !
--
YB.

[yesbird] Keeping line numbers [721 days 5 hours and 46 minutes ago]

Mon, 6 May 2024 08:08:05 GMT

Hi all !

Could someone suggest, how to turn on line numbers permanently in Povray
windows editor ? Now they are disappears after editor restart.

Thanks in advance.
--
YB.

[Ilya Razmanov] Precision problems? [821 days 23 hours and 44 minutes ago]

Fri, 26 Jan 2024 14:09:53 GMT

I have a weird problems with some prisms. Please see the file attached, 
it's tiny example. As you can see, both hexagonal prisms and their 
translations are calculated using school math; moreover, when it comes 
to irrational floats, the same values are used whenever possible via 
declaring the variable, so it have no choice but match. Still, there is 
a gap between objects in vertical direction.

I'm out of ideas regarding the cause of it. Any inspiration?

Ilyich the Tod

[Bald Eagle] Re: converting from openscad to povray [957 days 19 hours and 34 minutes ago]

Tue, 12 Sep 2023 18:20:00 GMT

"aysays" <nomail@nomail> wrote:
> can someone please help with the instructions here:
> https://github.com/archie305/openscad2povray
>
> I can't seem to get it right :/

I have written scripts in both POV-Ray and OpenSCAD, and I can tell by looking
at the output of that github repository, that you'd be far better off learning
to make the minor modifications to an existing OpenSCAD script in order to
convert it to a POV-Ray SDL scene.

The languages are nearly identical, the SDL scene that you write will be
shorter, more understandable, will parse and render faster, and will look better
and be more useful.

Now, having said that, since you're using a 9-year-old conversion utility, it
might be worth looking into what version it was designed to work with.  I'd
guess it was 3.6.

Also  - what aren't you getting right?
Does it run?
Do you get a POV-Ray SDL scene as output?
If you're running that in POV-Ray, what version are you using, and what errors
are you seeing?

- BW

[aysays] converting from openscad to povray [957 days 21 hours and 14 minutes ago]

Tue, 12 Sep 2023 16:40:00 GMT

can someone please help with the instructions here:
https://github.com/archie305/openscad2povray

I can't seem to get it right :/

[Leroy] Re: Problem with macros and translate function :/ [977 days 19 hours and 29 minutes ago]

Wed, 23 Aug 2023 18:25:00 GMT

"aysays" <nomail@nomail> wrote:
> Hello I'm new to Pov-Ray and am trying to write a broccoli fractal code however
> I'm having problems with the translate function. If I understood it correctly,
> translate only accepts numerical values. I tried writing a macro but that didn't
> work either. How am I supposed to write a recursive function that utilizes
> translate? :/ Here is my code:
>

Welcome to POV! Hope you'll have as much fun as I've had.

I don't do many recursive macros. But I do see that one problem is the i loop is
in a cone so you have a n-1 cones with 100 closing }. You can't put cones in
cones that way.

The #macro trans() look alright, the i and ang variables are #declare  before
it's called. That works fine. But when we write a macro we usually feed values
to it. Like #macro trans(C,A) and use C & A in the macro. It just help you keep
track of what the macro needs and makes the macro more mobile.

There is a lot more that macros can do. Read the documentation! There is a lot
to POV. I'm still learn something new once in awhile and been at it for over 30
years.

Come to think of it, do a search for POV recursive macros and there is probable
a few complete macros you can use.

Hoped I helped in a small way.

Have Fun!

[aysays] Problem with macros and translate function :/ [978 days 1 hour and 54 minutes ago]

Wed, 23 Aug 2023 12:00:00 GMT

Hello I'm new to Pov-Ray and am trying to write a broccoli fractal code however
I'm having problems with the translate function. If I understood it correctly,
translate only accepts numerical values. I tried writing a macro but that didn't
work either. How am I supposed to write a recursive function that utilizes
translate? :/ Here is my code:

#include "colors.inc"

global_settings {
    ambient_light rgb <1, 1, 1>
    assumed_gamma 1.0
}

camera {
    location <0, 0, -25>
    look_at <0, 0, 0>
}

light_source {
    <-100, -100, -100>
    color rgb <1, 1, 1>
}

#declare phi = (1 + sqrt(5))/2;
#declare ang = 360 * (1 - 1/phi);




#macro trans()
    translate< sqrt(i)* cos(i * ang),
           sqrt(i) * sin(i * ang),
           10-sqrt(pow(sqrt(i)* cos(i * ang),2) + pow(sqrt(i) * sin(i *
ang),2))>
#end

#macro frac(n)
    #if(n > 0)
        cone {
            <0, 10, 0>, 10
            <0, 0, 0>, 0
            texture {
                pigment { Green }
                finish { ambient 0.2 }
            }


        #declare i = 1;
        #while (i <= 100)
            //#declare theta = i * ang;
            //#declare r = sqrt(i);
            //#declare a = r * cos(theta);
            //#declare b = r * sin(theta);


            trans()



            scale 0.15
       }
            frac(n - 1)

            #declare i = i + 1;
        #end
    #end
#end

frac(3);



Thanks in advance :)

[gfernval] Re: povdos needed [1086 days 16 hours and 39 minutes ago]

Sat, 6 May 2023 21:15:00 GMT

"Mr" <mauriceraybaud [at] hotmail dot fr>> wrote:
> "DigitalBox" <nomail@nomail> wrote:
> > "Rocco" <nomail@nomail> wrote:
> > > Following this discussion, maybe someone will be interested. This will not be
> > > the latest version but this week I switched on my old computer and. I found my
> > > build scripts of POVRay 3.61 on MinGW32. I recompiled this with my MinGW64
> > > environment and the result is a command-line POVRay version that renders as
> > > expected. The build scripts is mostly inspired by what you see above. If there
> > > is demand about binaries, I can host it on my OneDrive for example. Even if 3.7
> > > is out now, 3.61 is still usable and feature-rich...
> > >
> > > This build works and renders as expected. You should only be careful about file
> > > paths (add them in the .INI for example).
> >
> > I have been able to compile last 3.7 version with MSYS2/MinGW64.
> >
> > It works fine and I've this unofficial version available if someone is
> > interesting by it
> >
> > Happy coding with POV :)
>
>     Yes! please , do share. And in thelong run, This might lay foundation for a
> truly Cross-platform build process.  I believe that suggestion made by Campbell
> Barton aka ideasman 42 a few months or year ago was one reason preventing to
> ship PoV along with its exporter, Making it disadvantaged compared to other open
> source renderers such as cycles, eevee, or Freestyle.



Hi: Could you post the patched file unixconsole.cpp and the another file in
order to be able to compile with MINGW32/MINGW64?

[kamalasubha] What is difference bt Release-AVX and Release So... [1235 days 20 hours and 4 minutes ago]

Thu, 8 Dec 2022 17:50:00 GMT

Hi,
I tried installing the latest release - POV-Ray Beta Release v3.8.0-beta.2 using
the installer
<https://github.com/POV-Ray/povray/releases/download/v3.8.0-beta.2/povwin-v3.8.0-beta.2-setup.exe>.
It installs and the bin directory from the installed path shows the following
set of executables 1) pvengine.exe 2) pvengine64.exe 3) pvengine-sse2.exe.

When I was checking the source code for the respective installer
<https://github.com/POV-Ray/povray/archive/refs/tags/v3.8.0-beta.2.zip>, I could
see windows shows the following set of build configurations 1) Debug 2) Release
3) Release-AVX 4) Release-SSE2.

I am able to map Release-SSE2 generates
pvengine-sse2.exe. But, which solution configuration generates pvengine.exe and
pvengine64.exe? Whether it is Release or Release-AVX? Kindly help me on this.

[Dick Balaska] Re: Testing Thunderbird [1626 days 17 hours and 39 minutes ago]

Fri, 12 Nov 2021 20:15:16 GMT

On 11/11/2021 9:17 AM, Chris Rath wrote:
> Sorry for the intrusion, just testing to see if posting with Thunderbird 
> is working.
> 
There is a povray.test group for just such porpoises.

dik

[Chris Rath] Testing Thunderbird [1627 days 23 hours and 37 minutes ago]

Thu, 11 Nov 2021 14:17:28 GMT

Sorry for the intrusion, just testing to see if posting with Thunderbird 
is working.

-- 
-- Chris Rath

[Thomas de Groot] Re: POV-Ray v3.8.0-beta.1 [1732 days 7 hours and 57 minutes ago]

Fri, 30 Jul 2021 05:57:15 GMT

Op 29/07/2021 om 21:54 schreef clipka:
> Am 29.07.2021 um 17:45 schrieb Thomas de Groot:
>> I still do not understand this parse warning as I do *not* run a 
>> version 3.5 scene. Does it refer to POV-Ray includes which /mention/ 
>> version 3.5?
>> functions.inc seem to be the only include file containing this.
>>
>> Just a short explanation would be enough about this mysterious warning.
> 
> It's a bug in `functions.inc`: At the start it claims that it needs only 
> v3.5, but later it uses the `deprecated` keyword, which wasn't 
> introduced until v3.7.
> 
> In other words, if someone were to use genuine POV-Ray v3.5, and render 
> the scene with that very same include file, they'd get an error message.
> 
> The fact that POV-Ray warns about such scenarios is a brand new feature 
> of v3.8.0-beta.1.

OK. Thanks for this. I shall just close my eyes ;-)

-- 
Thomas

[clipka] Re: POV-Ray v3.8.0-beta.1 [1732 days 18 hours ago]

Thu, 29 Jul 2021 19:54:36 GMT

Am 29.07.2021 um 17:45 schrieb Thomas de Groot:
> I still do not understand this parse warning as I do *not* run a version 
> 3.5 scene. Does it refer to POV-Ray includes which /mention/ version 3.5?
> functions.inc seem to be the only include file containing this.
> 
> Just a short explanation would be enough about this mysterious warning.

It's a bug in `functions.inc`: At the start it claims that it needs only 
v3.5, but later it uses the `deprecated` keyword, which wasn't 
introduced until v3.7.

In other words, if someone were to use genuine POV-Ray v3.5, and render 
the scene with that very same include file, they'd get an error message.

The fact that POV-Ray warns about such scenarios is a brand new feature 
of v3.8.0-beta.1.

[Thomas de Groot] Re: POV-Ray v3.8.0-beta.1 [1732 days 22 hours and 9 minutes ago]

Thu, 29 Jul 2021 15:45:03 GMT

I still do not understand this parse warning as I do *not* run a version 
3.5 scene. Does it refer to POV-Ray includes which /mention/ version 3.5?
functions.inc seem to be the only include file containing this.

Just a short explanation would be enough about this mysterious warning.

Thanks,

Thomas

Op 19-7-2021 om 14:17 schreef Thomas de Groot:
> Rendering a 3.8 version scene which includes functions.inc, I get the 
> following parse warning:
> 
> "functions.inc" line 167: Parse warning: use of POV-Ray v3.7 keyword 
> ('deprecated') detected in alleged v3.5 scene.
> 
> The only place were version 3.5 is mentioned is precisely at the start 
> of functions.inc:
> 
> #ifndef(Functions_Inc_Temp)
> #declare Functions_Inc_Temp = version;
> #version 3.5;
> ...
> #end
> 
> At the mentioned line 167 of this /new/ functions.inc shipped with the 
> beta, a /new/ if statement has been introduced, not there in previous 
> versions:
> 
> #if (Functions_Inc_Temp < 3.8)
>  Â Â Â  #declare deprecated once "f_enneper was broken
prior to v3.8; 
> results will most likely differ."
> 
Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â 
f_enneper = function { internal(18) }
> #else
>  Â Â Â  #declare f_enneper = function { internal(18) }
> #end
> 
> 


-- 
Thomas

[Thomas de Groot] Re: POV-Ray v3.8.0-beta.1 [1743 days 1 hour and 37 minutes ago]

Mon, 19 Jul 2021 12:17:24 GMT

Rendering a 3.8 version scene which includes functions.inc, I get the 
following parse warning:

"functions.inc" line 167: Parse warning: use of POV-Ray v3.7 keyword 
('deprecated') detected in alleged v3.5 scene.

The only place were version 3.5 is mentioned is precisely at the start 
of functions.inc:

#ifndef(Functions_Inc_Temp)
#declare Functions_Inc_Temp = version;
#version 3.5;
...
#end

At the mentioned line 167 of this /new/ functions.inc shipped with the 
beta, a /new/ if statement has been introduced, not there in previous 
versions:

#if (Functions_Inc_Temp < 3.8)
     #declare deprecated once "f_enneper was broken prior to v3.8; 
results will most likely differ."
              f_enneper = function { internal(18) }
#else
     #declare f_enneper = function { internal(18) }
#end


-- 
Thomas

[clipka] POV-Ray v3.8.0-beta.1 [1751 days 1 hour and 57 minutes ago]

Sun, 11 Jul 2021 11:56:51 GMT

It's official now:

https://github.com/POV-Ray/povray/releases/tag/v3.8.0-beta.1


A note to Unix users:

We're now providing Unix-specific source code packages again. We 
recommend that you build from the `povunix-*.tar.gz` tarball, rather 
than the "Source code (tar.gz)" or "Source code (zip)" packages or the 
raw repo contents.


A note to Windows XP users:

Let us know if there are still any of you out there. Otherwise we'll 
presume that Vista (and higher) support should be enough for everybody.


Happy Testing!

[Ray] Re: Download [1761 days 21 hours and 54 minutes ago]

Wed, 30 Jun 2021 16:00:00 GMT

Chris Cason <del### [at] deletethistoopovrayorg> wrote:
> I had a look at this also and did notice one thing: at least in Firefox,
> the FTP download links (present on the v3.6 page but not used for 3.7)
> don't work anymore. FTP is deprecated in v89 and will be removed
> entirely in v90. Chrome appears to have already turned it off by default.
>
> The FTP download links were a bit of a relic of a past age when dialup
> was the norm and a FTP connection was a little more stable than HTTP, so
> they're not really needed. Accordingly I've removed them (but kept a
> reference to the FTP server for those who want to use it).
>
> Not sure if this was the issue facing Ray but thought it worth mentioning.
>
> -- Chris

Hello Chris,

Yeah that seems to be the issue. I should have mentioned that I was using chrome
as the default browser.

Thanks

[Alain Martel] Re: Download [1761 days 22 hours and 51 minutes ago]

Wed, 30 Jun 2021 15:02:44 GMT

Le 2021-06-29 à 20:00, Ray a écrit :
> Hello,
> 
> I heard that you can render transparent backgrounds for images done in VMD. I am
> trying to download version 3.6 since I am not sure if the latest version will be
> compatible. Everytime I click on the download link nothing shows up; I have
> tried to do both x32 and x64 for windows and even tried to download the 3.7
> version. My browser does not seem to indicate that a pop-up is being blocked so
> I am lost as to why I cannot download the files. Any help would be awesome.
> 
> Thanks,
> Ray
> 

Unless your computer is very old with a very old OS, you should get 
version 3.7. By very old, I mean Pentium 3 or earlier running Windows ME 
or earlier.
If you have a multicore CPU, then, you should definitively get version 
3.7, as version 3.6 can only use a single core.
If your OS is 64 bits, then, get the 64 bits version.

[Chris Cason] Re: Download [1762 days 1 hour and 14 minutes ago]

Wed, 30 Jun 2021 12:40:30 GMT

I had a look at this also and did notice one thing: at least in Firefox, 
the FTP download links (present on the v3.6 page but not used for 3.7) 
don't work anymore. FTP is deprecated in v89 and will be removed 
entirely in v90. Chrome appears to have already turned it off by default.

The FTP download links were a bit of a relic of a past age when dialup 
was the norm and a FTP connection was a little more stable than HTTP, so 
they're not really needed. Accordingly I've removed them (but kept a 
reference to the FTP server for those who want to use it).

Not sure if this was the issue facing Ray but thought it worth mentioning.

-- Chris

[clipka] Re: Download [1762 days 8 hours and 51 minutes ago]

Wed, 30 Jun 2021 05:02:49 GMT

Am 30.06.2021 um 02:00 schrieb Ray:
> Hello,
> 
> I heard that you can render transparent backgrounds for images done in VMD. I am
> trying to download version 3.6 since I am not sure if the latest version will be
> compatible. Everytime I click on the download link nothing shows up; I have
> tried to do both x32 and x64 for windows and even tried to download the 3.7
> version. My browser does not seem to indicate that a pop-up is being blocked so
> I am lost as to why I cannot download the files. Any help would be awesome.

I presume you are trying to download from 
<https://www.povray.org/download/> and 
<https://www.povray.org/download/index-3.6.php>, respectively?

I don't see any immediate issue on our end. Using Firefox 89.0.2 
(64-Bit), I can download the .MSI installer files for both the 32-Bit 
and 64-Bit versions of POV-Ray v3.6.2.


In case something about the redirect is putting your browser off, you 
could try downloading directly from the FTP server:

https://www.povray.org/ftp/pub/povray/


If that also doesn't work, you could try downloading POV-Ray v3.7.0 from 
GitHub:

https://github.com/POV-Ray/povray/releases/tag/v3.7.0.0

[Ray] Download [1762 days 13 hours and 49 minutes ago]

Wed, 30 Jun 2021 00:05:00 GMT

Hello,

I heard that you can render transparent backgrounds for images done in VMD. I am
trying to download version 3.6 since I am not sure if the latest version will be
compatible. Everytime I click on the download link nothing shows up; I have
tried to do both x32 and x64 for windows and even tried to download the 3.7
version. My browser does not seem to indicate that a pop-up is being blocked so
I am lost as to why I cannot download the files. Any help would be awesome.

Thanks,
Ray

[clipka] Re: version 3.7.0.RC7.msvc10-sse2.win32 [1767 days 4 hours and 36 minutes ago]

Fri, 25 Jun 2021 09:17:53 GMT

Am 14.07.2020 um 09:01 schrieb Thomas de Groot:
> Alternatively, there is also this: 
> https://github.com/POV-Ray/povray/releases/tag/v3.7.1-rc.1

For the records: That version had officially been RETRACTED, and should 
not be used, distributed nor recommended anymore.

[clipka] POV-Ray v3.8 backing up a bit [1782 days 4 hours and 7 minutes ago]

Thu, 10 Jun 2021 09:47:02 GMT

Hi folks,

this is a heads-up for all of you who are faithfully working on 
derivatives of POV-Ray - be it qtpovray, the mac port, or what-have-you.

We're currently preparing to enter the beta phase of POV-Ray v3.8; 
however, in order to do so, we will _not_ continue from the current 
master, but rather back up a bit, to the last commit before we 
integrated the overhauled tokenizer/scanner into the parser. To help you 
more easily find that commit in question (85db57d9), we've tagged it as:

     `nexus-v3.8-v4.0`

Also, v3.8 development will _not_ continue in the `master` branch, but 
rather a dedicated branch, `release/v3.8.0` (which already exists and is 
currently ahead of The Nexus, but will be backed up and branch off soon).

Note that besides reverting to the old parser, this will also revert 
back to the use of the boost-thread and boost-system libraries.


We recommend that you _do_ keep all the work you've done since The 
Nexus, as the current state of v3.8 will live on under the moniker v4.0.

There's nothing fundamentally wrong with the changes we introduced since 
The Nexus - we just won't be able to get them to a clean state as fast 
as we'd like to, and we'd probably have to break backward compatibility 
more than we'd be comfortable with in a v3.x release.

[Dick Balaska] Re: qtpovray 3.80.15 [1887 days 15 hours and 46 minutes ago]

Wed, 24 Feb 2021 22:08:03 GMT

On 2/22/2021 4:51 AM, Mike Horvath wrote:

> 
> 
> Also, how do I change the folder for this stuff to the "Public" user 
> instead of my admin user. Thanks.
> 
> 
> Mike

The installer should have selected your Documents directory.  (I did see 
it pick admin once in testing, but I thought that was fixed.)

During install, there was a place where it asked what directory to 
install to.

qtpovray doesn't really use the register.  For povray sdl, the important 
thing is the root directory when you created the workspace.  For the 
help, includes, and inserts, those can be changed in the configure dialog.

I'm working on making the Windows ini usage of qtpovray more consistent 
with POV-Ray for Windows.

-- 
dik
Rendered 50,081,587,200 of 50,081,587,200 pixels (100%)

[Mike Horvath] Re: qtpovray 3.80.15 [1889 days 20 hours and 13 minutes ago]

Mon, 22 Feb 2021 17:41:24 GMT

On 2/22/2021 10:33 AM, Alain Martel wrote:
> Le 2021-02-22 Ã  04:45, Mike Horvath a Ã©critÂ :
>> On 2/11/2021 10:33 AM, Alain Martel wrote:
>>> Le 2021-02-08 Ã  16:20, Mike Horvath a Ã©critÂ :
>>>
>>>>
>>>> How do I specify the INI file in qtpovray? I don't know the correct 
>>>> menu option.
>>>>
>>>> (On Windows.)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Mike
>>>
>>> Those should be the same as the regular POV-Ray files.
>>>
>>> Â From POV-Ray for Windows, it's under Tools. The first two options.
>>>
>>> You can also find those, along with several other, in the Documents 
>>> folder.
>>> ../Documents/povray3.7/ini/
>>
>>
>> I don't see a Tools menu. I only see File, Edit and Help.
>>
>>
>> Mike
> 
> Not normal. There are 8 more menu top items.
> The following are missing : Search, Text, Editor, Insert, Render, 
> Options, Tools and Window.


I'm talking about qtpovray.


Mike

[Alain Martel] Re: qtpovray 3.80.15 [1889 days 22 hours and 20 minutes ago]

Mon, 22 Feb 2021 15:33:37 GMT

Le 2021-02-22 Ã  04:45, Mike Horvath a Ã©critÂ :
> On 2/11/2021 10:33 AM, Alain Martel wrote:
>> Le 2021-02-08 Ã  16:20, Mike Horvath a Ã©critÂ :
>>
>>>
>>> How do I specify the INI file in qtpovray? I don't know the correct 
>>> menu option.
>>>
>>> (On Windows.)
>>>
>>>
>>> Mike
>>
>> Those should be the same as the regular POV-Ray files.
>>
>> Â From POV-Ray for Windows, it's under Tools. The first two options.
>>
>> You can also find those, along with several other, in the Documents 
>> folder.
>> ../Documents/povray3.7/ini/
> 
> 
> I don't see a Tools menu. I only see File, Edit and Help.
> 
> 
> Mike

Not normal. There are 8 more menu top items.
The following are missing : Search, Text, Editor, Insert, Render, 
Options, Tools and Window.

[Mike Horvath] Re: qtpovray 3.80.15 [1890 days 4 hours and 3 minutes ago]

Mon, 22 Feb 2021 09:51:09 GMT

On 2/12/2021 10:16 PM, Dick Balaska wrote:
> On 2/7/2021 12:40 AM, Mike Horvath wrote:
>> I am a first time qtpovray user.
>>
>> Does the program not use an INI file for settings?
>>
>> How do I set up multiple include paths?
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>>
>> Mike
> 
> Um, erm, I guess I didn't really set that up properly.
> 
> On my box, it is looking for
> SYSINI = C:/Users/dick/Documents\qtpovray\v3.8\ini\povray.ini
> but it doesn't exist and I don't care.Â  I guess I should.
> 


Also, how do I change the folder for this stuff to the "Public" user 
instead of my admin user. Thanks.


Mike

[Mike Horvath] Re: qtpovray 3.80.15 [1890 days 4 hours and 9 minutes ago]

Mon, 22 Feb 2021 09:45:25 GMT

On 2/11/2021 10:33 AM, Alain Martel wrote:
> Le 2021-02-08 Ã  16:20, Mike Horvath a Ã©critÂ :
> 
>>
>> How do I specify the INI file in qtpovray? I don't know the correct 
>> menu option.
>>
>> (On Windows.)
>>
>>
>> Mike
> 
> Those should be the same as the regular POV-Ray files.
> 
>  From POV-Ray for Windows, it's under Tools. The first two options.
> 
> You can also find those, along with several other, in the Documents folder.
> ../Documents/povray3.7/ini/


I don't see a Tools menu. I only see File, Edit and Help.


Mike

[Mike Horvath] Re: qtpovray 3.80.15 [1890 days 4 hours and 12 minutes ago]

Mon, 22 Feb 2021 09:41:49 GMT

On 2/12/2021 10:16 PM, Dick Balaska wrote:
> On 2/7/2021 12:40 AM, Mike Horvath wrote:
>> I am a first time qtpovray user.
>>
>> Does the program not use an INI file for settings?
>>
>> How do I set up multiple include paths?
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>>
>> Mike
> 
> Um, erm, I guess I didn't really set that up properly.
> 
> On my box, it is looking for
> SYSINI = C:/Users/dick/Documents\qtpovray\v3.8\ini\povray.ini
> but it doesn't exist and I don't care.Â  I guess I should.
> 

A menu to pick whatever INI file I want like in standard POV-Ray for 
Windows would be nice to have. Thanks!


Mike

[Dick Balaska] Re: qtpovray 3.80.15 [1899 days 10 hours and 38 minutes ago]

Sat, 13 Feb 2021 03:16:18 GMT

On 2/7/2021 12:40 AM, Mike Horvath wrote:
> I am a first time qtpovray user.
> 
> Does the program not use an INI file for settings?
> 
> How do I set up multiple include paths?
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> 
> Mike

Um, erm, I guess I didn't really set that up properly.

On my box, it is looking for
SYSINI = C:/Users/dick/Documents\qtpovray\v3.8\ini\povray.ini
but it doesn't exist and I don't care.  I guess I should.

-- 
dik
Rendered 50,081,587,200 of 50,081,587,200 pixels (100%)

[Alain Martel] Re: qtpovray 3.80.15 [1900 days 22 hours and 20 minutes ago]

Thu, 11 Feb 2021 15:33:50 GMT

Le 2021-02-08 Ã  16:20, Mike Horvath a Ã©critÂ :

> 
> How do I specify the INI file in qtpovray? I don't know the correct menu 
> option.
> 
> (On Windows.)
> 
> 
> Mike

Those should be the same as the regular POV-Ray files.

 From POV-Ray for Windows, it's under Tools. The first two options.

You can also find those, along with several other, in the Documents folder.
../Documents/povray3.7/ini/

[Bald Eagle] Re: qtpovray 3.80.15 [1903 days 14 hours and 19 minutes ago]

Mon, 8 Feb 2021 23:35:00 GMT

Mike Horvath <mik### [at] gmailcom> wrote:

> How do I specify the INI file in qtpovray? I don't know the correct menu
> option.
>
> (On Windows.)

Not sure about that.

Pop off an email to DB:
http://www.buckosoft.com/mailto.php

[Mike Horvath] Re: qtpovray 3.80.15 [1903 days 16 hours and 34 minutes ago]

Mon, 8 Feb 2021 21:20:08 GMT

On 2/7/2021 9:15 AM, Bald Eagle wrote:
> 
> Mike Horvath <mik### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
>> I am a first time qtpovray user.
>>
>> Does the program not use an INI file for settings?
>>
>> How do I set up multiple include paths?
> 
> Mine got installed in
> 
> /usr/local/share/povray-3.8/ini
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 


How do I specify the INI file in qtpovray? I don't know the correct menu 
option.

(On Windows.)


Mike

[Alain Martel] Re: qtpovray 3.80.15 [1903 days 22 hours and 46 minutes ago]

Mon, 8 Feb 2021 15:08:01 GMT

Le 2021-02-07 Ã  00:40, Mike Horvath a Ã©critÂ :
> I am a first time qtpovray user.
> 
> Does the program not use an INI file for settings?
> 
> How do I set up multiple include paths?
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> 
> Mike

Under Windows, any current version.

In povray.imi, you need something like this :
Library_Path="C:\Users\<user>\POV Images"

You can have any number of Â«Library_PathÂ», and they'll be
explored in order.

And, in pvengine.ini, lines like this :
[Permitted Input Paths]
1=%INSTALLDIR%
2=%PROFILEDIR%
3=%FONTDIR%
4="C:\Users\<user>\POV Images"

The first 3 lines shoupd already be present. Don't change them.
The paths here must match those added in povray.ini.

The paths in povray.ini tell where to look.
The paths in pvengine.ini tell where you are allowed to look.



Alain

[Bald Eagle] Re: qtpovray 3.80.15 [1904 days 23 hours and 34 minutes ago]

Sun, 7 Feb 2021 14:20:10 GMT

Mike Horvath <mik### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
> I am a first time qtpovray user.
>
> Does the program not use an INI file for settings?
>
> How do I set up multiple include paths?

Mine got installed in

/usr/local/share/povray-3.8/ini

[Mike Horvath] Re: qtpovray 3.80.15 [1905 days 8 hours and 14 minutes ago]

Sun, 7 Feb 2021 05:40:01 GMT

I am a first time qtpovray user.

Does the program not use an INI file for settings?

How do I set up multiple include paths?

Thanks.


Mike

[Mr] Re: qtpovray 3.80.15 [1909 days 17 hours and 14 minutes ago]

Tue, 2 Feb 2021 20:40:08 GMT

Dick Balaska <dic### [at] buckosoftcom> wrote:
> On 2/2/2021 1:35 PM, Bald Eagle wrote:
> >
> > Dick Balaska <dic### [at] buckosoftcom> wrote:
> >
> >> Ah, all this time I read your name as "mister".  Now I know better. :)
> >
> > :D   I had been doing the same - but I figured out that it was Maurice.
>
> Yes, Now when I see "Mr" I get the earworm for Maurice Ravel's "Bolero"
> going in my head.
>
>  > I just got home after loading 14 cords of firewood,
>
> 14 cords!!!!!!!!!!!
> I can't even imagine, ... unless there was lots of heavy machinery involved.
>
> --
> dik
> Rendered 50,081,587,200 of 50,081,587,200 pixels (100%)

HAHAHA!  I'm not THAT spectacular X-D... qtpovray works nice for me now since I
sometimes have to switch unexpectedly between Windows, Linux, etc, it's good to
have more tools as alternatives. Especially the image preview looks very nice
docked with QT. I don't know yet how to use the breakpoints but this makes me
curious.

[Bald Eagle] Re: qtpovray 3.80.15 [1909 days 18 hours and 24 minutes ago]

Tue, 2 Feb 2021 19:30:02 GMT

Dick Balaska <dic### [at] buckosoftcom> wrote:

> 14 cords!!!!!!!!!!!
> I can't even imagine, ... unless there was lots of heavy machinery involved.

The first time I ever processed 10 cords of firewood was over a whole weekend
with 5 other people - chainsaws, log splitter, beer, smoke, on the side of a
mountain - at night.  :|      (they were insane)

This firewood comes split and packaged in 18 lb bags - 90 per pallet, but they
have to be broken up and re-stacked onto pallets according to truck load and
order number.   So, I have an electric ride-on Crown pallet jack to move the
pallets around - but I still have to lift and stack it all by hand.

Got it done with a bit of help in 5 hours.  B)

Good times.    Strong body, strong mind.   ;)

But lemme tell ya- between the lifting and the steering, I can really feel it in
my trapezius...

[Dick Balaska] Re: qtpovray 3.80.15 [1909 days 18 hours and 43 minutes ago]

Tue, 2 Feb 2021 19:11:35 GMT

On 2/2/2021 1:35 PM, Bald Eagle wrote:
> 
> Dick Balaska <dic### [at] buckosoftcom> wrote:
> 
>> Ah, all this time I read your name as "mister".  Now I know better. :)
> 
> :D   I had been doing the same - but I figured out that it was Maurice.

Yes, Now when I see "Mr" I get the earworm for Maurice Ravel's "Bolero" 
going in my head.

 > I just got home after loading 14 cords of firewood,

14 cords!!!!!!!!!!!
I can't even imagine, ... unless there was lots of heavy machinery involved.

-- 
dik
Rendered 50,081,587,200 of 50,081,587,200 pixels (100%)

[Bald Eagle] Re: qtpovray 3.80.15 [1909 days 19 hours and 14 minutes ago]

Tue, 2 Feb 2021 18:40:02 GMT

Nope - disregard, it's all good.

I just got home after loading 14 cords of firewood, and had someone talking to
me...   "multitasking with a new file while exhausted...."


Works fine.  :)

[Bald Eagle] Re: qtpovray 3.80.15 [1909 days 19 hours and 14 minutes ago]

Tue, 2 Feb 2021 18:40:01 GMT

Dick Balaska <dic### [at] buckosoftcom> wrote:

> Ah, all this time I read your name as "mister".  Now I know better. :)

:D   I had been doing the same - but I figured out that it was Maurice.

[Bald Eagle] Re: qtpovray 3.80.15 [1909 days 19 hours and 19 minutes ago]

Tue, 2 Feb 2021 18:35:01 GMT

Hmmm.

I did a
sudo apt-get update
sudo apt-get upgrade

and It opens the editor, but when I try to render, it just sends output to the
terminal:

PATHS
  HOME        = /home/oem
  SYSCONF     = /etc/qtpovray/3.8/povray.conf
  USERCONF    = /home/oem/.qtpovray/3.8/povray.conf
  SYSINI      = /etc/qtpovray/3.8/povray.ini
  SYSINI_OLD  = /etc/povray.ini
  USERINI     = /home/oem/.povray/3.8/povray.ini
  USERINI_OLD = /home/oem/.povrayrc

So, no idea what's going on there...  I guess one of the ini files got
overwritten...


(Good to see you here and updating qtpovray.   Hope you're doing lots better.
Congrats on the new box   :) )

[Dick Balaska] Re: qtpovray 3.80.15 [1909 days 19 hours and 25 minutes ago]

Tue, 2 Feb 2021 18:29:25 GMT

On 2/1/2021 5:42 AM, Mr wrote:
> Dick Balaska <dic### [at] buckosoftcom> wrote:

>> Some rando facebook messengered me saying he couldn't get the ppa for
>> Ubuntu 18 to work in Ubuntu 20.  So there's that build too.
>>
>>
> 
> I am the rando. thanks for the update(s!)
> 
> 

Ah, all this time I read your name as "mister".  Now I know better. :)

-- 
dik
Rendered 50,081,587,200 of 50,081,587,200 pixels (100%)

[Mr] Re: qtpovray 3.80.15 [1911 days 3 hours and 9 minutes ago]

Mon, 1 Feb 2021 10:45:00 GMT

Dick Balaska <dic### [at] buckosoftcom> wrote:
> https://github.com/dickbalaska/qtpovray/releases/tag/v3.80.15
> https://launchpad.net/~qtpovray/+archive/ubuntu/qtpovray
>
> Bug 27 - Release qtpovray for Windows
> Bug 28 - Release qtpovray for Ubuntu 20, focal
>
>
> So, my wife bought me this nifty new box (16 cores 32GB 2TB SSD) with
> the condition that I play steam games with her.  Hello Windows 10!
> I had to get qtpovray running on Windows again (clipka removed
> boost::thread) and I made an installer for it.
>
> Some rando facebook messengered me saying he couldn't get the ppa for
> Ubuntu 18 to work in Ubuntu 20.  So there's that build too.
>
>
> --
> dik
> Rendered 50,081,587,200 of 50,081,587,200 pixels (100%)

I am the rando. thanks for the update(s!)

[Dick Balaska] qtpovray 3.80.15 [1912 days 7 hours and 22 minutes ago]

Sun, 31 Jan 2021 06:32:13 GMT

https://github.com/dickbalaska/qtpovray/releases/tag/v3.80.15
https://launchpad.net/~qtpovray/+archive/ubuntu/qtpovray

Bug 27 - Release qtpovray for Windows
Bug 28 - Release qtpovray for Ubuntu 20, focal


So, my wife bought me this nifty new box (16 cores 32GB 2TB SSD) with 
the condition that I play steam games with her.  Hello Windows 10!
I had to get qtpovray running on Windows again (clipka removed 
boost::thread) and I made an installer for it.

Some rando facebook messengered me saying he couldn't get the ppa for 
Ubuntu 18 to work in Ubuntu 20.  So there's that build too.


-- 
dik
Rendered 50,081,587,200 of 50,081,587,200 pixels (100%)

[Thomas de Groot] Re: Not using all CPU [1928 days 6 hours and 9 minutes ago]

Fri, 15 Jan 2021 07:45:30 GMT

Op 14/01/2021 om 18:13 schreef Alain Martel:
> Leaving the rendering priority to normal and using all logical cores all 
> the time and I experience no slowing down for the other processes.
> IF I set the rendering priority to high, then I do need to reserve at 
> least one core for other tasks.
> 
> The normal priority set the rendering effective priority to Â«lower than 
> normalÂ» while the high priority do set the effective priority to high.
> 

Ah, ok. I still have ingrained habits from older times it seems ;-)

However, I do prefer to set a bit lower number of WT's on my laptop 
because of the insane noise of the fans otherwise when rendering complex 
scenes. Maybe I should use Duty Cycle instead... It is something I have 
not thought about really seriously.

-- 
Thomas

[Mike Horvath] Re: Not using all CPU [1928 days 7 hours and 53 minutes ago]

Fri, 15 Jan 2021 06:00:59 GMT

This worked, thank you.


Mike




On 1/14/2021 2:48 AM, Thomas de Groot wrote:
> Op 13/01/2021 om 20:46 schreef Mike Horvath:
>> Yeah, my old PC was always pegged at 100% CPU on all 4 cores.
>>
>> This is frustrating because the whole reason I got such a powerful CPU 
>> was so that I could do more raytracing. Otherwise, I don't need such a 
>> good CPU.
>>
>> :(
>>
> 
> 
> For a render, I typically set +WT at 'maximum logical processors minus 
> 2'. As I have here 6 cores and thus 12 logical processors, I set +WT10. 
> Thus I am always able to do something else besides the render.
> 
> Possibly, your WT is set low by default. Changing WT and watching the 
> Task Manager you will see CPU utilisation change. I noticed that when 
> CPU utilisation gets close to 90+% no render time is really gained, so 
> it seems always better to set a lower WT to keep it under the 100%
>

[Alain Martel] Re: Not using all CPU [1928 days 20 hours and 41 minutes ago]

Thu, 14 Jan 2021 17:13:04 GMT

Le 2021-01-14 Ã  02:48, Thomas de Groot a Ã©critÂ :
> Op 13/01/2021 om 20:46 schreef Mike Horvath:
>> Yeah, my old PC was always pegged at 100% CPU on all 4 cores.
>>
>> This is frustrating because the whole reason I got such a powerful CPU 
>> was so that I could do more raytracing. Otherwise, I don't need such a 
>> good CPU.
>>
>> :(
>>
> 
> 
> For a render, I typically set +WT at 'maximum logical processors minus 
> 2'. As I have here 6 cores and thus 12 logical processors, I set +WT10. 
> Thus I am always able to do something else besides the render.
> 
> Possibly, your WT is set low by default. Changing WT and watching the 
> Task Manager you will see CPU utilisation change. I noticed that when 
> CPU utilisation gets close to 90+% no render time is really gained, so 
> it seems always better to set a lower WT to keep it under the 100%
> 

Leaving the rendering priority to normal and using all logical cores all 
the time and I experience no slowing down for the other processes.
IF I set the rendering priority to high, then I do need to reserve at 
least one core for other tasks.

The normal priority set the rendering effective priority to Â«lower than 
normalÂ» while the high priority do set the effective priority to high.

[Thomas de Groot] Re: Not using all CPU [1929 days 6 hours and 5 minutes ago]

Thu, 14 Jan 2021 07:48:41 GMT

Op 13/01/2021 om 20:46 schreef Mike Horvath:
> Yeah, my old PC was always pegged at 100% CPU on all 4 cores.
> 
> This is frustrating because the whole reason I got such a powerful CPU 
> was so that I could do more raytracing. Otherwise, I don't need such a 
> good CPU.
> 
> :(
>


For a render, I typically set +WT at 'maximum logical processors minus 
2'. As I have here 6 cores and thus 12 logical processors, I set +WT10. 
Thus I am always able to do something else besides the render.

Possibly, your WT is set low by default. Changing WT and watching the 
Task Manager you will see CPU utilisation change. I noticed that when 
CPU utilisation gets close to 90+% no render time is really gained, so 
it seems always better to set a lower WT to keep it under the 100%

-- 
Thomas

[Mike Horvath] Re: Not using all CPU [1929 days 16 hours and 45 minutes ago]

Wed, 13 Jan 2021 21:09:16 GMT

On 1/13/2021 3:25 PM, Le_Forgeron wrote:
> Did the render take enough time ?
> What is the size of the image, compared to the blocksize (+BS setting,
> default is 32, IIRC)

Width=1920
Height=1440
Preview_Start_Size=16
Preview_End_Size=16
Render_Block_Size=16
Render_Pattern=3


> Did you try to run the benchmark ?
> 

No. I will do this when the current render is completed. (One or two days?)




> How is the temperature censor of the CPU as the render progresses ?
> 

I have been unable to get a temperature reading off the CPU using 
several programs. The readings for the GPU and even the HDD show up, but 
not the CPU. Weird. It's a Dell so maybe there is proprietary software? 
Dunno.




> Is it a laptop in economy mode ?
> 

Desktop.




> Is there some energy management in use ?
> 

I have no idea.




> i5 10400 is reported as 6 cores, 12 threads, base frequency 2.9, max
> turbo at 4.3 (but turbo is out of question with povray, it is a mode
> when only a single core is used)
> 
> TDP is 65 W, I do not know how much that is for a 14nm. (hence my
> question about temperature above)
> 
> Also, povray enjoy floating point operation everywhere, so it might
> trigger bottleneck on the execution of threads (2) over single true
> core(1). I do not know the cache size of the CPU per core either.
> 






> The graphic chip is also embedded, I do not know if it can have an impact.
> 

I am using an external nVidia card.



Thanks for the help.

Mike

[Le Forgeron] Re: Not using all CPU [1929 days 17 hours and 29 minutes ago]

Wed, 13 Jan 2021 20:25:03 GMT

Le 13/01/2021 Ã  20:53, Mike Horvath a Ã©critÂ :
> On 1/13/2021 12:09 PM, Alain Martel wrote:
>> What can make your CPU time go lower could be thermal throttling. This
>> can happen if there is to much dust in the heat sink of the CPU. It
>> should be cleaned at least once a year, more if you are in a dusty
>> environment.
> 
> The PC is virtually brand new and I just peeked inside the case a few
> weeks ago. It is clean.
> 
> 

Did the render take enough time ?
What is the size of the image, compared to the blocksize (+BS setting,
default is 32, IIRC)
So a picture of 256 x 256 is made of only 64 blocks, and they are not
evenly distributed, at the end it is always some late single block which
is blocking every one else.
64 blocks to render on a wallpaper, 12 cores remove 12 blocks,
52 blocks to render on a wallpaper, 12 cores remove 12 blocks,
40 blocks to render on a wallpaper, 11 cores remove 11 blocks, one core
is late.
29 blocks to render on a wallpaper, 10 cores remove 10 blocks, two cores
are late.
19 blocks to render on a wallpaper, 12 cores remove 12 blocks,
7 blocks to render on a wallpaper, 5 cores are idle, 4 cores remove 4
blocks,
3 blocks to render on a wallpaper...

Did you try to run the benchmark ?

How is the temperature censor of the CPU as the render progresses ?

Is it a laptop in economy mode ?

Is there some energy management in use ?

i5 10400 is reported as 6 cores, 12 threads, base frequency 2.9, max
turbo at 4.3 (but turbo is out of question with povray, it is a mode
when only a single core is used)

TDP is 65 W, I do not know how much that is for a 14nm. (hence my
question about temperature above)

Also, povray enjoy floating point operation everywhere, so it might
trigger bottleneck on the execution of threads (2) over single true
core(1). I do not know the cache size of the CPU per core either.

The graphic chip is also embedded, I do not know if it can have an impact.

[Mike Horvath] Re: Not using all CPU [1929 days 18 hours and 1 minute ago]

Wed, 13 Jan 2021 19:53:07 GMT

On 1/13/2021 12:09 PM, Alain Martel wrote:
> What can make your CPU time go lower could be thermal throttling. This 
> can happen if there is to much dust in the heat sink of the CPU. It 
> should be cleaned at least once a year, more if you are in a dusty 
> environment.

The PC is virtually brand new and I just peeked inside the case a few 
weeks ago. It is clean.

> 
> Some other possible causes would be another CPU hungry process running, 
> or memory use getting to high and swapping start happening.

The CPU is at about 40% usage (according to Task Manager) for all 
programs currently running.

Memory usage is like 60%.

Mike

[Mike Horvath] Re: Not using all CPU [1929 days 18 hours and 7 minutes ago]

Wed, 13 Jan 2021 19:46:56 GMT

Yeah, my old PC was always pegged at 100% CPU on all 4 cores.

This is frustrating because the whole reason I got such a powerful CPU 
was so that I could do more raytracing. Otherwise, I don't need such a 
good CPU.

:(


Mike



On 1/13/2021 1:51 PM, Norbert Kern wrote:
> Mike Horvath <mik### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
>> I just got a new PC with an i5 10400.
>>
>> I noticed that Povray for Windows is only using 35% of the CPU. The load
>> does seem spread across multiple cores however.
>>
>> Why isn't Povray using more CPU?
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>>
>> Mike
> 
> 
> Interesting - my win10 machine shows the opposite problem (since a recent
> win-update I assume). Despite setting povray priority to the lowest value
> possible, I have to pause any render for using Firefox or even the windows
> explorer...
> 
> According to the task-manager Povray uses at least 99 % CPU power (i7-8700K - 6
> cores 12 threads).
> 
> Norbert
> 
> 
> 
>

[Norbert Kern] Re: Not using all CPU [1929 days 18 hours and 59 minutes ago]

Wed, 13 Jan 2021 18:55:01 GMT

Mike Horvath <mik### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
> I just got a new PC with an i5 10400.
>
> I noticed that Povray for Windows is only using 35% of the CPU. The load
> does seem spread across multiple cores however.
>
> Why isn't Povray using more CPU?
>
> Thanks.
>
>
> Mike

Interesting - my win10 machine shows the opposite problem (since a recent
win-update I assume). Despite setting povray priority to the lowest value
possible, I have to pause any render for using Firefox or even the windows
explorer...

According to the task-manager Povray uses at least 99 % CPU power (i7-8700K - 6
cores 12 threads).

Norbert

[Alain Martel] Re: Not using all CPU [1929 days 20 hours and 45 minutes ago]

Wed, 13 Jan 2021 17:09:35 GMT

Le 2021-01-13 Ã  05:55, Le_Forgeron a Ã©critÂ :
> Le 12/01/2021 Ã  23:29, Mike Horvath a Ã©critÂ :
>> 6 physical cores
>> 12 logical cores
>>
>> What is "WT"? Thanks.
>>
> 
> WT is working thread; the number of thread uses by the engine to trace.
> 
> +WT1 forces to use a single thread.
> 
> IIRC, windows is not very cooperative in its scheduler, so using all the
> cores might be dangerous.
> Also, did you check if you have any "thermal" tuning (I do not know if
> that change make it in the production version, it was done for
> space-ship usage). It might be all in the menu part.
> 

As long as you don't set the priority to high, you should set WT to the 
actual number of logical cores.
For 6 cores with 12 logical cores, you should use +wt12.
Also, by default, POV-Ray version 1.7 and later is be set to use all the 
logical cores present. At least, that's the case on my computer.

Yes, the Â«duty cycleÂ» is present since version 1.6. It can be
set from 
10% to 100% in 10% increments, and yes, it was implemented for use on 
the ISS.

What can make your CPU time go lower could be thermal throttling. This 
can happen if there is to much dust in the heat sink of the CPU. It 
should be cleaned at least once a year, more if you are in a dusty 
environment.

Some other possible causes would be another CPU hungry process running, 
or memory use getting to high and swapping start happening.

[Le Forgeron] Re: Not using all CPU [1930 days 2 hours and 59 minutes ago]

Wed, 13 Jan 2021 10:55:20 GMT

Le 12/01/2021 Ã  23:29, Mike Horvath a Ã©critÂ :
> 6 physical cores
> 12 logical cores
> 
> What is "WT"? Thanks.
> 

WT is working thread; the number of thread uses by the engine to trace.

+WT1 forces to use a single thread.

IIRC, windows is not very cooperative in its scheduler, so using all the
cores might be dangerous.
Also, did you check if you have any "thermal" tuning (I do not know if
that change make it in the production version, it was done for
space-ship usage). It might be all in the menu part.

[Mike Horvath] Re: Not using all CPU [1930 days 15 hours and 24 minutes ago]

Tue, 12 Jan 2021 22:29:54 GMT

6 physical cores
12 logical cores

What is "WT"? Thanks.



Mike



On 1/12/2021 11:34 AM, Le_Forgeron wrote:
> Le 10/01/2021 Ã  07:55, Mike Horvath a Ã©critÂ :
>> I just got a new PC with an i5 10400.
>>
>> I noticed that Povray for Windows is only using 35% of the CPU. The load
>> does seem spread across multiple cores however.
>>
>> Why isn't Povray using more CPU?
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>>
>> Mike
> 
> How many core do you have now ?
> Have you any WT setting in your ini ?
>

[Le Forgeron] Re: Not using all CPU [1930 days 21 hours and 19 minutes ago]

Tue, 12 Jan 2021 16:34:52 GMT

Le 10/01/2021 Ã  07:55, Mike Horvath a Ã©critÂ :
> I just got a new PC with an i5 10400.
> 
> I noticed that Povray for Windows is only using 35% of the CPU. The load
> does seem spread across multiple cores however.
> 
> Why isn't Povray using more CPU?
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> 
> Mike

How many core do you have now ?
Have you any WT setting in your ini ?

[Mike Horvath] Not using all CPU [1933 days 6 hours and 58 minutes ago]

Sun, 10 Jan 2021 06:55:45 GMT

I just got a new PC with an i5 10400.

I noticed that Povray for Windows is only using 35% of the CPU. The load 
does seem spread across multiple cores however.

Why isn't Povray using more CPU?

Thanks.


Mike

[jr] Re: version 3.7.0.RC7.msvc10-sse2.win32 [2102 days 17 hours and 44 minutes ago]

Fri, 24 Jul 2020 20:10:00 GMT

hi,

"Leroy" <whe### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
> "Leroy" <whe### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
> >  I might download both the 3.7 and the 3.8. the more the merrier.
> >
>  Oh! no you won't. 3.8 don't like winXP or so the download page said.

you may need to post this in a different group:

"These binaries require Windows Vista or higher, due to limitations of our
automated build system. Please contact us on
http://news.povray.org/povray.beta-test if you need Windows XP-compatible
binaries of this particular version."
<https://github.com/POV-Ray/povray/releases/tag/v3.8.0-x.10064738>

regards, jr.

[Leroy] Re: version 3.7.0.RC7.msvc10-sse2.win32 [2102 days 18 hours and 4 minutes ago]

Fri, 24 Jul 2020 19:50:01 GMT

"Leroy" <whe### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
>
>  I might download both the 3.7 and the 3.8. the more the merrier.
>
 Oh! no you won't. 3.8 don't like winXP or so the download page said.

[Leroy] Re: version 3.7.0.RC7.msvc10-sse2.win32 [2104 days 19 hours and 49 minutes ago]

Wed, 22 Jul 2020 18:05:01 GMT

Thanks for all your replies.
 I just didn't remember when I download this win version.
I still have all the version of POV from dos3.0 to win3.7 on my computer. I
don't know Why I still keep them all. Lazy I guess. I still use win3.5 &6
editors to edit c++ files.

 I've gotten away from downloading betas. I use to wait with baited breath for a
new version and run it through it paces. I slowly turned to doing more objects
and scenes. And don't forget COLORS that's the reason I started with POV.

 I might download both the 3.7 and the 3.8. the more the merrier.

Have fun!

[Thomas de Groot] Re: version 3.7.0.RC7.msvc10-sse2.win32 [2113 days 6 hours and 52 minutes ago]

Tue, 14 Jul 2020 07:02:00 GMT

Alternatively, there is also this: 
https://github.com/POV-Ray/povray/releases/tag/v3.7.1-rc.1

Christoph wrote: [quote] **IMPORTANT NOTE:** In contrast to the betas, 
the Windows version of the
release candidate does NOT make any attempt to co-exist with v3.7.0. If
you intend to keep v3.7.0 around, make sure to back up the binaries, or
install v3.7.1 in a different location. You may also want to back up the
include files first. Also, there is no way to prevent the installations
from sharing most settings. [/quote]

I can tell that this version is stable and without problems.

There is also: 
https://github.com/POV-Ray/povray/releases/tag/v3.8.0-alpha.10064268

stable and with interesting new features; I use this version exclusively 
and without problems since start 2019. See the povray.beta-test newsgroup.

-- 
Thomas

[Thomas de Groot] Re: version 3.7.0.RC7.msvc10-sse2.win32 [2113 days 7 hours and 18 minutes ago]

Tue, 14 Jul 2020 06:36:05 GMT

Op 13/07/2020 om 22:20 schreef Leroy:
> Is this the latest version of 3.7.0 for windows?
> 
> I have been having problems with the insert menu. It's crazy to edit.
> First it displays all the folders backward (reverse order) but the files in
> these folders are normal. When I try to add a new folder it placed like the
> others in reverse order. But the files are all over the place, it seems no
> matter the name the last one made will be the last in the folder.
> 
> One other thing when I replace the insert menu with the 3.6 version it worked
> fine.
> 

No. According to http://www.povray.org/download/ it is: 
povwin-3.7-agpl3-setup.exe


-- 
Thomas

[Leroy] version 3.7.0.RC7.msvc10-sse2.win32 [2113 days 17 hours and 29 minutes ago]

Mon, 13 Jul 2020 20:25:07 GMT

Is this the latest version of 3.7.0 for windows?

I have been having problems with the insert menu. It's crazy to edit.
First it displays all the folders backward (reverse order) but the files in
these folders are normal. When I try to add a new folder it placed like the
others in reverse order. But the files are all over the place, it seems no
matter the name the last one made will be the last in the folder.

One other thing when I replace the insert menu with the 3.6 version it worked
fine.

[Mr] Re: Parsing error with Pov Ray addon for blender... [2221 days 1 hour and 14 minutes ago]

Sat, 28 Mar 2020 12:40:01 GMT

"tylerm8101" <tyl### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
> "Mr" <mauriceraybaud [at] hotmail dot fr>> wrote:
> > "tylerm8101" <tyl### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
> > > Thomas de Groot <tho### [at] degrootorg> wrote:
> > > > Op 10/09/2019 om 05:10 schreef tylerm8101:
> > > > > Hi.
> > > > >
> > > > > I'm using the Pov ray addon for Blender 2.79. On windows 10.
> > > > >
> > > > > Yesterday I ran into an issue where it wouldn't parse correctly. So... I
looked
> > > > > at what Pov ray said:
> > > > >
> > > > > "Parse error: No matching } in 'texture', undeclared identifier
'Material_051'
> > > > > found instead."
> > > > >
> > > > > It also highlighted a line of text:
> > > > >
> > > > > "texture{Material_051}"
> > > > >
> > > > > This text was apart of a larger group of text:
> > > > >
> > > > > #declare MAT_Material_034 =
> > > > > texture{
> > > > >          slope { lampTarget1 }
> > > > >          texture_map {
> > > > >              [0.98 finish {diffuse 0.72}]
> > > > >              [0.002
> > > > >                  pigment {rgbft<1, 0.638, 0.716, 0, 0>}
> > > > >                  finish {shader_Material_034}
> > > > >              ]
> > > > >          }
> > > > >      }
> > > > >      texture_list {
> > > > >          9
> > > > >   texture{Material_051}
> > > > >
> > > > >   texture{Material_052}
> > > > >
> > > > >   texture{Material_034}
> > > > >
> > > > >   texture{Material_035}
> > > > >
> > > > >   texture{Material_038}
> > > > >
> > > > >   texture{Material_059}
> > > > >
> > > > >   texture{Material_015}
> > > > >
> > > > > Im not sure if I needed to show more, I dont know what influences what.
Sorry.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > Those types of errors are often difficult to track down. At first guess
> > > > I would suggest to check:
> > > >
> > > > - is Material_51 included somewhere in the scene or in another include
> > > > file, and if yes, is its built consistent? If no, include the texture
> > > > and see if everything works.
> > > >
> > > > - what happens if you comment out texture{Material_051} (and change the
> > > > preceding '9' into '8')? Is the error gone? if not, does the error now
> > > > mention Material_052? i.d. the next texture in the list?
> > > >
> > > > - if no remedy, copy here the complete MAT_Material_034 texture so that
> > > > we may look at it.
> > > >
> > > > - as last resort (or first one) a successful testing involves to
> > > > gradually build up the texture from simple to complex and each time test
> > > > the result. If it works, add a new element until the error appears: you
> > > > then know where the problem arises from.
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Thomas
> > >
> > > Hi.
> > >
> > > Sorry this is a late reply but I was contacted by a dude named Alain Martel who
> > > emailed me and said this...
> > >
> > >
> > > " This looks highly suspicious to me :
> > >   #declare MAT_Material_034 =
> > >
> > > It looks like there is a «MAT_» prepended to the material's name.
> > >
> > > Look if you have a
> > > #dedclare MAT_Material_051
> > > somewhere in your scene.
> > >
> > > If that's the case, look in the settings if you can prevent prepending
> > > material's names with that «MAT_».
> > >
> > > Alternately, do a search and replace to replace all instances of
> > > «MAT_Material» to just «Material». "
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > I couldn't ask him anything because google can't recognize his address, Ill ask
> > > them here...
> > >
> > >
> > > I have a #declare MAT_Material_051 in the file, what exactly does this do and
> > > why is it bad?
> > >
> > > If I change the MAT_Material to just Material, would It need the same amount of
> > > indentation?
> > >
> > > And... how could I possibly prevent materials having MAT_ prepended by using the
> > > settings?
> >
> > Anything after declare can be arbitrary provided it's written the same way when
> > invoked into the objects that follow this definition, it´s just a name, with
the
> > "MAT" prefix, it appeared to us, in a way, safer, as it avoided confusion with
> > POV syntax reserved keywords such as "texture" or "material" and here "MAT" also
> > specifies the hierarchy of the translated Blender
> > item to be a material (in Blender terms), as opposed to a texture (in Blender
> > terms) that can be nested into the said materials. Since users of the graphical
> > interface could perfectly have given them the same names, this explains our way
> > of thinking as a disambiguation.  Now, this does not mean that you should not go
> > over your scene and check whether every named #declare MAT_something is also
> > called as MAT_something later in the scene. And, if not, you could indeed rename
> > them with the same name (but it can be whatever you want). To do this it is
> > required that you first fully grasp what is attempted by a stable working
> > version of the script (before Blender 2.8 broke everything leaving us with huge
> > rewriting tasks(2.78 should do)). Namely and as explained in my previous link,
> > try to understand:
> > *POV-Ray "finish map" trick that is used to create specular maps,
> > *layered textures, as they are used to overlay various textures that could have
> > transparencies,
> > *what the "metallic" keyword does since it is used to emulate the colored
> > specular feature of previous Blender versions by specifying a colored but
> > trasparent finish to put over a simpler form of pigment,
> > * normal and image_map to be used into the respective bump and diffuse Blender
> > influence channels from texture slots (Blender 2.8 broke texture slots)
> > *Finally the replacement of a texture by a function to be able to call its
> > components (whatever.s to get its saturation or .v for value) and this allows it
> > to be used equally in grey level expecting keywords or other channels with just
> > one initial declaration.
> >
> > You will find all of this, and even more, into the excellent POV-Ray
> > documentation which is objectively the best in the world, Thanks mostly to Jim
> > Holsenback ! (...and the rest of this lovely community :-))
> > I hope you do get there, so you can help us to get the exporter back on its feet
> > after the earthquake through which we managed to hold what remains together ;-)
> > Thanks for your patience.
>
> Hi.
>
> That is a lot of jargon.
>
>
> This doesn't have to do anything with my problem, but yesterday I downloaded the
> blender 2.79 nightly build, which allowed me to basically restart Blender.
>
> When I want to enable the Pov ray addon it has these 2 branches, one saying
> "binaries location" and the other say "include location".
>
> I usually put the pvengine64.exe in the Binary branch, but leave the "Included"
> empty. Am I supposed to put something there? And.. am I supposed to even put the
> pov ray executable in the binaries branch?

Hi, sorry for the very late response which probably is no longer necessary but
still worth giving for archival :
The two fields aren't as necessary under windows where most things get
autodetected but providing them is safer : Binary path is indeed your
pvengine64.exe path,  while include path is the path where your default POV
includes will be such as colors.inc etc.

[tylerm8101] Re: Parsing error with Pov Ray addon for blender... [2410 days 18 hours and 24 minutes ago]

Fri, 20 Sep 2019 19:30:01 GMT

"Mr" <mauriceraybaud [at] hotmail dot fr>> wrote:
> "tylerm8101" <tyl### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
> > Thomas de Groot <tho### [at] degrootorg> wrote:
> > > Op 10/09/2019 om 05:10 schreef tylerm8101:
> > > > Hi.
> > > >
> > > > I'm using the Pov ray addon for Blender 2.79. On windows 10.
> > > >
> > > > Yesterday I ran into an issue where it wouldn't parse correctly. So... I
looked
> > > > at what Pov ray said:
> > > >
> > > > "Parse error: No matching } in 'texture', undeclared identifier 'Material_051'
> > > > found instead."
> > > >
> > > > It also highlighted a line of text:
> > > >
> > > > "texture{Material_051}"
> > > >
> > > > This text was apart of a larger group of text:
> > > >
> > > > #declare MAT_Material_034 =
> > > > texture{
> > > >          slope { lampTarget1 }
> > > >          texture_map {
> > > >              [0.98 finish {diffuse 0.72}]
> > > >              [0.002
> > > >                  pigment {rgbft<1, 0.638, 0.716, 0, 0>}
> > > >                  finish {shader_Material_034}
> > > >              ]
> > > >          }
> > > >      }
> > > >      texture_list {
> > > >          9
> > > >   texture{Material_051}
> > > >
> > > >   texture{Material_052}
> > > >
> > > >   texture{Material_034}
> > > >
> > > >   texture{Material_035}
> > > >
> > > >   texture{Material_038}
> > > >
> > > >   texture{Material_059}
> > > >
> > > >   texture{Material_015}
> > > >
> > > > Im not sure if I needed to show more, I dont know what influences what. Sorry.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > > Those types of errors are often difficult to track down. At first guess
> > > I would suggest to check:
> > >
> > > - is Material_51 included somewhere in the scene or in another include
> > > file, and if yes, is its built consistent? If no, include the texture
> > > and see if everything works.
> > >
> > > - what happens if you comment out texture{Material_051} (and change the
> > > preceding '9' into '8')? Is the error gone? if not, does the error now
> > > mention Material_052? i.d. the next texture in the list?
> > >
> > > - if no remedy, copy here the complete MAT_Material_034 texture so that
> > > we may look at it.
> > >
> > > - as last resort (or first one) a successful testing involves to
> > > gradually build up the texture from simple to complex and each time test
> > > the result. If it works, add a new element until the error appears: you
> > > then know where the problem arises from.
> > >
> > > --
> > > Thomas
> >
> > Hi.
> >
> > Sorry this is a late reply but I was contacted by a dude named Alain Martel who
> > emailed me and said this...
> >
> >
> > " This looks highly suspicious to me :
> >   #declare MAT_Material_034 =
> >
> > It looks like there is a «MAT_» prepended to the material's name.
> >
> > Look if you have a
> > #dedclare MAT_Material_051
> > somewhere in your scene.
> >
> > If that's the case, look in the settings if you can prevent prepending
> > material's names with that «MAT_».
> >
> > Alternately, do a search and replace to replace all instances of
> > «MAT_Material» to just «Material». "
> >
> >
> >
> > I couldn't ask him anything because google can't recognize his address, Ill ask
> > them here...
> >
> >
> > I have a #declare MAT_Material_051 in the file, what exactly does this do and
> > why is it bad?
> >
> > If I change the MAT_Material to just Material, would It need the same amount of
> > indentation?
> >
> > And... how could I possibly prevent materials having MAT_ prepended by using the
> > settings?
>
> Anything after declare can be arbitrary provided it's written the same way when
> invoked into the objects that follow this definition, it´s just a name, with
the
> "MAT" prefix, it appeared to us, in a way, safer, as it avoided confusion with
> POV syntax reserved keywords such as "texture" or "material" and here "MAT" also
> specifies the hierarchy of the translated Blender
> item to be a material (in Blender terms), as opposed to a texture (in Blender
> terms) that can be nested into the said materials. Since users of the graphical
> interface could perfectly have given them the same names, this explains our way
> of thinking as a disambiguation.  Now, this does not mean that you should not go
> over your scene and check whether every named #declare MAT_something is also
> called as MAT_something later in the scene. And, if not, you could indeed rename
> them with the same name (but it can be whatever you want). To do this it is
> required that you first fully grasp what is attempted by a stable working
> version of the script (before Blender 2.8 broke everything leaving us with huge
> rewriting tasks(2.78 should do)). Namely and as explained in my previous link,
> try to understand:
> *POV-Ray "finish map" trick that is used to create specular maps,
> *layered textures, as they are used to overlay various textures that could have
> transparencies,
> *what the "metallic" keyword does since it is used to emulate the colored
> specular feature of previous Blender versions by specifying a colored but
> trasparent finish to put over a simpler form of pigment,
> * normal and image_map to be used into the respective bump and diffuse Blender
> influence channels from texture slots (Blender 2.8 broke texture slots)
> *Finally the replacement of a texture by a function to be able to call its
> components (whatever.s to get its saturation or .v for value) and this allows it
> to be used equally in grey level expecting keywords or other channels with just
> one initial declaration.
>
> You will find all of this, and even more, into the excellent POV-Ray
> documentation which is objectively the best in the world, Thanks mostly to Jim
> Holsenback ! (...and the rest of this lovely community :-))
> I hope you do get there, so you can help us to get the exporter back on its feet
> after the earthquake through which we managed to hold what remains together ;-)
> Thanks for your patience.

Hi.

That is a lot of jargon.


This doesn't have to do anything with my problem, but yesterday I downloaded the
blender 2.79 nightly build, which allowed me to basically restart Blender.

When I want to enable the Pov ray addon it has these 2 branches, one saying
"binaries location" and the other say "include location".

I usually put the pvengine64.exe in the Binary branch, but leave the "Included"
empty. Am I supposed to put something there? And.. am I supposed to even put the
pov ray executable in the binaries branch?

[Mr] Re: Parsing error with Pov Ray addon for blender... [2416 days 16 hours and 29 minutes ago]

Sat, 14 Sep 2019 21:25:01 GMT

"tylerm8101" <tyl### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
> Thomas de Groot <tho### [at] degrootorg> wrote:
> > Op 10/09/2019 om 05:10 schreef tylerm8101:
> > > Hi.
> > >
> > > I'm using the Pov ray addon for Blender 2.79. On windows 10.
> > >
> > > Yesterday I ran into an issue where it wouldn't parse correctly. So... I looked
> > > at what Pov ray said:
> > >
> > > "Parse error: No matching } in 'texture', undeclared identifier 'Material_051'
> > > found instead."
> > >
> > > It also highlighted a line of text:
> > >
> > > "texture{Material_051}"
> > >
> > > This text was apart of a larger group of text:
> > >
> > > #declare MAT_Material_034 =
> > > texture{
> > >          slope { lampTarget1 }
> > >          texture_map {
> > >              [0.98 finish {diffuse 0.72}]
> > >              [0.002
> > >                  pigment {rgbft<1, 0.638, 0.716, 0, 0>}
> > >                  finish {shader_Material_034}
> > >              ]
> > >          }
> > >      }
> > >      texture_list {
> > >          9
> > >   texture{Material_051}
> > >
> > >   texture{Material_052}
> > >
> > >   texture{Material_034}
> > >
> > >   texture{Material_035}
> > >
> > >   texture{Material_038}
> > >
> > >   texture{Material_059}
> > >
> > >   texture{Material_015}
> > >
> > > Im not sure if I needed to show more, I dont know what influences what. Sorry.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> > Those types of errors are often difficult to track down. At first guess
> > I would suggest to check:
> >
> > - is Material_51 included somewhere in the scene or in another include
> > file, and if yes, is its built consistent? If no, include the texture
> > and see if everything works.
> >
> > - what happens if you comment out texture{Material_051} (and change the
> > preceding '9' into '8')? Is the error gone? if not, does the error now
> > mention Material_052? i.d. the next texture in the list?
> >
> > - if no remedy, copy here the complete MAT_Material_034 texture so that
> > we may look at it.
> >
> > - as last resort (or first one) a successful testing involves to
> > gradually build up the texture from simple to complex and each time test
> > the result. If it works, add a new element until the error appears: you
> > then know where the problem arises from.
> >
> > --
> > Thomas
>
> Hi.
>
> Sorry this is a late reply but I was contacted by a dude named Alain Martel who
> emailed me and said this...
>
>
> " This looks highly suspicious to me :
>   #declare MAT_Material_034 =
>
> It looks like there is a «MAT_» prepended to the material's name.
>
> Look if you have a
> #dedclare MAT_Material_051
> somewhere in your scene.
>
> If that's the case, look in the settings if you can prevent prepending
> material's names with that «MAT_».
>
> Alternately, do a search and replace to replace all instances of
> «MAT_Material» to just «Material». "
>
>
>
> I couldn't ask him anything because google can't recognize his address, Ill ask
> them here...
>
>
> I have a #declare MAT_Material_051 in the file, what exactly does this do and
> why is it bad?
>
> If I change the MAT_Material to just Material, would It need the same amount of
> indentation?
>
> And... how could I possibly prevent materials having MAT_ prepended by using the
> settings?

Anything after declare can be arbitrary provided it's written the same way when
invoked into the objects that follow this definition, it´s just a name, with the
"MAT" prefix, it appeared to us, in a way, safer, as it avoided confusion with
POV syntax reserved keywords such as "texture" or "material" and here "MAT" also
specifies the hierarchy of the translated Blender
item to be a material (in Blender terms), as opposed to a texture (in Blender
terms) that can be nested into the said materials. Since users of the graphical
interface could perfectly have given them the same names, this explains our way
of thinking as a disambiguation.  Now, this does not mean that you should not go
over your scene and check whether every named #declare MAT_something is also
called as MAT_something later in the scene. And, if not, you could indeed rename
them with the same name (but it can be whatever you want). To do this it is
required that you first fully grasp what is attempted by a stable working
version of the script (before Blender 2.8 broke everything leaving us with huge
rewriting tasks(2.78 should do)). Namely and as explained in my previous link,
try to understand:
*POV-Ray "finish map" trick that is used to create specular maps,
*layered textures, as they are used to overlay various textures that could have
transparencies,
*what the "metallic" keyword does since it is used to emulate the colored
specular feature of previous Blender versions by specifying a colored but
trasparent finish to put over a simpler form of pigment,
* normal and image_map to be used into the respective bump and diffuse Blender
influence channels from texture slots (Blender 2.8 broke texture slots)
*Finally the replacement of a texture by a function to be able to call its
components (whatever.s to get its saturation or .v for value) and this allows it
to be used equally in grey level expecting keywords or other channels with just
one initial declaration.

You will find all of this, and even more, into the excellent POV-Ray
documentation which is objectively the best in the world, Thanks mostly to Jim
Holsenback ! (...and the rest of this lovely community :-))
I hope you do get there, so you can help us to get the exporter back on its feet
after the earthquake through which we managed to hold what remains together ;-)
Thanks for your patience.

[tylerm8101] Re: Parsing error with Pov Ray addon for blender... [2416 days 17 hours and 19 minutes ago]

Sat, 14 Sep 2019 20:35:06 GMT

Thomas de Groot <tho### [at] degrootorg> wrote:
> Op 10/09/2019 om 05:10 schreef tylerm8101:
> > Hi.
> >
> > I'm using the Pov ray addon for Blender 2.79. On windows 10.
> >
> > Yesterday I ran into an issue where it wouldn't parse correctly. So... I looked
> > at what Pov ray said:
> >
> > "Parse error: No matching } in 'texture', undeclared identifier 'Material_051'
> > found instead."
> >
> > It also highlighted a line of text:
> >
> > "texture{Material_051}"
> >
> > This text was apart of a larger group of text:
> >
> > #declare MAT_Material_034 =
> > texture{
> >          slope { lampTarget1 }
> >          texture_map {
> >              [0.98 finish {diffuse 0.72}]
> >              [0.002
> >                  pigment {rgbft<1, 0.638, 0.716, 0, 0>}
> >                  finish {shader_Material_034}
> >              ]
> >          }
> >      }
> >      texture_list {
> >          9
> >   texture{Material_051}
> >
> >   texture{Material_052}
> >
> >   texture{Material_034}
> >
> >   texture{Material_035}
> >
> >   texture{Material_038}
> >
> >   texture{Material_059}
> >
> >   texture{Material_015}
> >
> > Im not sure if I needed to show more, I dont know what influences what. Sorry.
> >
> >
> >
>
> Those types of errors are often difficult to track down. At first guess
> I would suggest to check:
>
> - is Material_51 included somewhere in the scene or in another include
> file, and if yes, is its built consistent? If no, include the texture
> and see if everything works.
>
> - what happens if you comment out texture{Material_051} (and change the
> preceding '9' into '8')? Is the error gone? if not, does the error now
> mention Material_052? i.d. the next texture in the list?
>
> - if no remedy, copy here the complete MAT_Material_034 texture so that
> we may look at it.
>
> - as last resort (or first one) a successful testing involves to
> gradually build up the texture from simple to complex and each time test
> the result. If it works, add a new element until the error appears: you
> then know where the problem arises from.
>
> --
> Thomas

Hi.

Sorry this is a late reply but I was contacted by a dude named Alain Martel who
emailed me and said this...


" This looks highly suspicious to me :
  #declare MAT_Material_034 =

It looks like there is a «MAT_» prepended to the material's name.

Look if you have a
#dedclare MAT_Material_051
somewhere in your scene.

If that's the case, look in the settings if you can prevent prepending
material's names with that «MAT_».

Alternately, do a search and replace to replace all instances of
«MAT_Material» to just «Material». "



I couldn't ask him anything because google can't recognize his address, Ill ask
them here...


I have a #declare MAT_Material_051 in the file, what exactly does this do and
why is it bad?

If I change the MAT_Material to just Material, would It need the same amount of
indentation?

And... how could I possibly prevent materials having MAT_ prepended by using the
settings?

[Mr] Re: Parsing error with Pov Ray addon for blender... [2420 days and 4 minutes ago]

Wed, 11 Sep 2019 13:50:01 GMT

Thomas de Groot <tho### [at] degrootorg> wrote:
> Op 10/09/2019 om 14:06 schreef William F Pokorny:
> > The SDL text posted is confusing to me. I doubt it's aligned well with
> > the error message. The texture_list keyword is used only within meshes(1).
> >
>
> As this is linked to Blender, I assume that the involved object is
> indeed a mesh.
>
> --
> Thomas

Indeed we used texture_list to assign different materials to different faces of
a mesh. that's the only way to support this former Blender feature (which might
no longer be available in Blender 2.8 afaik) This choice has led us to give up
the use of the POV-Ray material(texture+interior) wrapper as one object can have
only one interior while textures, on the other hand could be better modularized
and applied several at a time on one mesh object that way.

Here's a memo on guidelines for what we did :
https://archive.blender.org/wiki/index.php/Dev:2.6/Py/Scripts/Render/POV-Ray/#texture_list

[Thomas de Groot] Re: Parsing error with Pov Ray addon for blender... [2420 days 7 hours and 17 minutes ago]

Wed, 11 Sep 2019 06:36:39 GMT

Op 10/09/2019 om 14:06 schreef William F Pokorny:
> The SDL text posted is confusing to me. I doubt it's aligned well with 
> the error message. The texture_list keyword is used only within meshes(1).
> 

As this is linked to Blender, I assume that the involved object is 
indeed a mesh.

-- 
Thomas

[Bald Eagle] Re: Parsing error with Pov Ray addon for blender... [2420 days 19 hours and 29 minutes ago]

Tue, 10 Sep 2019 18:25:01 GMT

William F Pokorny <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
> The texture_list keyword is used only within meshes(1).

Well, let's just chalk up another thing that I don't think I've ever even heard
of...  :O

http://wiki.povray.org/content/Documentation:Tutorial_Section_3.9

Very cool.   [X] I have learned something new today.

> (1) There is a concept of TEXTURE_LIST which gets used with block
> patterns as in:
>
> #declare TextureChecker = texture {
>      checker
>      texture { Tred }
>      texture { Tgreen }
>      scale 0.2
>      warp {turbulence 0.5}
> }

I suppose that's implied...   Always good to go back and sift through the very
basics.   I kind of just dove in and probably just skipped over a lot   ;)

[William F Pokorny] Re: Parsing error with Pov Ray addon for blender... [2421 days 1 hour and 48 minutes ago]

Tue, 10 Sep 2019 12:06:04 GMT

On 9/9/19 11:10 PM, tylerm8101 wrote:
...
> 
> This text was apart of a larger group of text:
> 
> #declare MAT_Material_034 =
> texture{
>          slope { lampTarget1 }
>          texture_map {
>              [0.98 finish {diffuse 0.72}]
>              [0.002
>                  pigment {rgbft<1, 0.638, 0.716, 0, 0>}
>                  finish {shader_Material_034}
>              ]
>          }
>      }
>      texture_list {
>          9
>   texture{Material_051}
> 
>   texture{Material_052}
> 
>   texture{Material_034}
> 
>   texture{Material_035}
> 
>   texture{Material_038}
> 
>   texture{Material_059}
> 
>   texture{Material_015}
> 
> Im not sure if I needed to show more, I dont know what influences what. Sorry.
> 

As others have said the undeclared identifier means POV-Ray didn't know 
what that token meant, at the point it saw it, while parsing a texture 
block.

The SDL text posted is confusing to me. I doubt it's aligned well with 
the error message. The texture_list keyword is used only within meshes(1).

I'm pretty sure a texture_list {...} hanging in space won't itself 
parse. I don't know how we reached the token, Material_051, if this the 
SDL text causing the error.

Hmm, I guess it all could be inside a mesh/mesh2 block not shown, but 
declaring MAT_Material_034 inline/on the fly within a mesh like that 
would be odd - if such a thing works at all.

Bill P.

(1) There is a concept of TEXTURE_LIST which gets used with block 
patterns as in:

#declare TextureChecker = texture {
     checker
     texture { Tred }
     texture { Tgreen }
     scale 0.2
     warp {turbulence 0.5}
}

[Bald Eagle] Re: Parsing error with Pov Ray addon for blender... [2421 days 3 hours and 24 minutes ago]

Tue, 10 Sep 2019 10:30:01 GMT

"tylerm8101" <tyl### [at] gmailcom> wrote:

> "Parse error: No matching } in 'texture', undeclared identifier 'Material_051'
> found instead."
>
> It also highlighted a line of text:
>
> "texture{Material_051}"

Right.   So there's supposed to be a thing called Material_051 that gets
#declared somewhere for use in your layered texture.

PoseRay does the same thing and usually creates an include file   "Filename.inc"
that contains all of that info.

See if you have any .inc files in the directory where Blender exports your stuff
to, and somewhere before that group of text add

#include "Filename.inc"

for each of the .inc files and see if that works.

if one .inc file depends on what's in another, then that one needs to be after
the one it depends on, so you may have to reorder them if you get [new] errors.

If you can't get that to work, and just need to render the scene, you can just
define simple place-holder textures for those things or comment them out.

> Im not sure if I needed to show more, I dont know what influences what. Sorry.

Maybe some of the beginning of the scene to show any #include statements, and
the list of filenames in your Blender export directory.

[Thomas de Groot] Re: Parsing error with Pov Ray addon for blender... [2421 days 7 hours and 4 minutes ago]

Tue, 10 Sep 2019 06:49:44 GMT

Op 10/09/2019 om 05:10 schreef tylerm8101:
> Hi.
> 
> I'm using the Pov ray addon for Blender 2.79. On windows 10.
> 
> Yesterday I ran into an issue where it wouldn't parse correctly. So... I looked
> at what Pov ray said:
> 
> "Parse error: No matching } in 'texture', undeclared identifier 'Material_051'
> found instead."
> 
> It also highlighted a line of text:
> 
> "texture{Material_051}"
> 
> This text was apart of a larger group of text:
> 
> #declare MAT_Material_034 =
> texture{
>          slope { lampTarget1 }
>          texture_map {
>              [0.98 finish {diffuse 0.72}]
>              [0.002
>                  pigment {rgbft<1, 0.638, 0.716, 0, 0>}
>                  finish {shader_Material_034}
>              ]
>          }
>      }
>      texture_list {
>          9
>   texture{Material_051}
> 
>   texture{Material_052}
> 
>   texture{Material_034}
> 
>   texture{Material_035}
> 
>   texture{Material_038}
> 
>   texture{Material_059}
> 
>   texture{Material_015}
> 
> Im not sure if I needed to show more, I dont know what influences what. Sorry.
> 
> 
> 

Those types of errors are often difficult to track down. At first guess 
I would suggest to check:

- is Material_51 included somewhere in the scene or in another include 
file, and if yes, is its built consistent? If no, include the texture 
and see if everything works.

- what happens if you comment out texture{Material_051} (and change the 
preceding '9' into '8')? Is the error gone? if not, does the error now 
mention Material_052? i.d. the next texture in the list?

- if no remedy, copy here the complete MAT_Material_034 texture so that 
we may look at it.

- as last resort (or first one) a successful testing involves to 
gradually build up the texture from simple to complex and each time test 
the result. If it works, add a new element until the error appears: you 
then know where the problem arises from.

-- 
Thomas

[tylerm8101] Parsing error with Pov Ray addon for blender. "N... [2421 days 10 hours and 39 minutes ago]

Tue, 10 Sep 2019 03:15:01 GMT

Hi.

I'm using the Pov ray addon for Blender 2.79. On windows 10.

Yesterday I ran into an issue where it wouldn't parse correctly. So... I looked
at what Pov ray said:

"Parse error: No matching } in 'texture', undeclared identifier 'Material_051'
found instead."

It also highlighted a line of text:

"texture{Material_051}"

This text was apart of a larger group of text:

#declare MAT_Material_034 =
texture{
        slope { lampTarget1 }
        texture_map {
            [0.98 finish {diffuse 0.72}]
            [0.002
                pigment {rgbft<1, 0.638, 0.716, 0, 0>}
                finish {shader_Material_034}
            ]
        }
    }
    texture_list {
        9
 texture{Material_051}

 texture{Material_052}

 texture{Material_034}

 texture{Material_035}

 texture{Material_038}

 texture{Material_059}

 texture{Material_015}

Im not sure if I needed to show more, I dont know what influences what. Sorry.

[Mr] Re: povdos needed [2476 days 14 hours and 24 minutes ago]

Tue, 16 Jul 2019 23:30:00 GMT

"DigitalBox" <nomail@nomail> wrote:
> "Rocco" <nomail@nomail> wrote:
> > Following this discussion, maybe someone will be interested. This will not be
> > the latest version but this week I switched on my old computer and. I found my
> > build scripts of POVRay 3.61 on MinGW32. I recompiled this with my MinGW64
> > environment and the result is a command-line POVRay version that renders as
> > expected. The build scripts is mostly inspired by what you see above. If there
> > is demand about binaries, I can host it on my OneDrive for example. Even if 3.7
> > is out now, 3.61 is still usable and feature-rich...
> >
> > This build works and renders as expected. You should only be careful about file
> > paths (add them in the .INI for example).
>
> I have been able to compile last 3.7 version with MSYS2/MinGW64.
>
> It works fine and I've this unofficial version available if someone is
> interesting by it
>
> Happy coding with POV :)

    Yes! please , do share. And in thelong run, This might lay foundation for a
truly Cross-platform build process.  I believe that suggestion made by Campbell
Barton aka ideasman 42 a few months or year ago was one reason preventing to
ship PoV along with its exporter, Making it disadvantaged compared to other open
source renderers such as cycles, eevee, or Freestyle.

[Mr Robot Jacket] Great [2485 days 3 hours and 29 minutes ago]

Mon, 8 Jul 2019 10:25:01 GMT

"Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
> Stephen <mca### [at] aolcom> wrote:
>
> > I don't know if this will be of any use. It has equations in it, though. :-)
> >
> > http://www.beosil.com/download/MeshlessDeformations_SIG05.pdf
>
> Thanks - that looks interesting, from a mathematical modeler's point of view,
> anyway   ;)
>
> I always find it odd that papers like that don't mention what software they used
> to make the images.

Sorry for the wide extent of the inquiry. I mean the material science/code. Im
taking a shot at a pong clone and have everything filling in as I need (only 2
paddles that go here and there and stop at the edges of the board.) All I need
presently is the ball! Tho ive given it thought and I think itll be the hardest
part. So indeed, can any1 help? :)

Visit www.dailyonplanet.com/

[DigitalBox] Re: povdos needed [2492 days 1 hour and 19 minutes ago]

Mon, 1 Jul 2019 12:35:01 GMT

"Rocco" <nomail@nomail> wrote:
> Following this discussion, maybe someone will be interested. This will not be
> the latest version but this week I switched on my old computer and. I found my
> build scripts of POVRay 3.61 on MinGW32. I recompiled this with my MinGW64
> environment and the result is a command-line POVRay version that renders as
> expected. The build scripts is mostly inspired by what you see above. If there
> is demand about binaries, I can host it on my OneDrive for example. Even if 3.7
> is out now, 3.61 is still usable and feature-rich...
>
> This build works and renders as expected. You should only be careful about file
> paths (add them in the .INI for example).

I have been able to compile last 3.7 version with MSYS2/MinGW64.

It works fine and I've this unofficial version available if someone is
interesting by it

Happy coding with POV :)

[DigitalBox] Re: Installing CLI interface [2492 days 5 hours and 24 minutes ago]

Mon, 1 Jul 2019 08:30:01 GMT

dick balaska <dic### [at] buckosoftcom> wrote:
> Am 2017-02-02 01:08, also sprach binki:
> > How do I install the povray.exe CLI interface on Windows? I find the GUI
> > annoying. I want to be able to run the same scripts that I do on unix on my
> > Windows system, but I find pvengine with a bunch of hard to use parameters like
> > /EXIT and /RENDER. Also, the Windows GUI likes to make noise, etc.
> >
> > I am currently working around this by using the Windows 10 Subsystem for Linux
> > feature to install the Ubuntu POV-Ray binaries. But this is bulky because I have
> > to invoke the Ubuntu version of the povray CLI through an Ubuntu shell or
> > indirectly via bash -c "povray". When can I look forward to the
> > Download page’s Windows installer providing a native povray.exe which behaves
> > like the povray CLI for unix?
> >
> >
> >
> I have a build of povray3.7.1-alpha built. It's a wee bit old, but not
> too much...  http://www.buckosoft.com/povclipse2/povray/
> The only issue with it is I have to say +wt8 on the CL to use all 8
> threads on my box.
> It's just the .exe, you still need a povray distribution first.
>
>
> --
> dik

I have compiled an unofficial 3.7.0.8 version which behave like the Unix
version, so you can use all the CLI parameters :
digital.box.free.fr/files/win/povray-3.7-console.zip

[DigitalBox] Re: povdos needed [2495 days 4 hours and 14 minutes ago]

Fri, 28 Jun 2019 09:40:01 GMT

"Rocco" <nomail@nomail> wrote:
> Following this discussion, maybe someone will be interested. This will not be
> the latest version but this week I switched on my old computer and. I found my
> build scripts of POVRay 3.61 on MinGW32. I recompiled this with my MinGW64
> environment and the result is a command-line POVRay version that renders as
> expected. The build scripts is mostly inspired by what you see above. If there
> is demand about binaries, I can host it on my OneDrive for example. Even if 3.7
> is out now, 3.61 is still usable and feature-rich...
>
> This build works and renders as expected. You should only be careful about file
> paths (add them in the .INI for example).


Finally got it running by patching unixconsole.cpp plus another file, and
compiling it with MinWG64/MSYS2.

I have run a benchmark :

povray --benchmark
POV-Ray 3.7.0.8.unofficial (g++ 8.3.0 @ x86_64-w64-mingw32)

Entering the standard POV-Ray 3.7 benchmark version 2.01.

This built-in benchmark requires POV-Ray to be installed on your system
before running it.  There will be neither display nor file output, and
any additional command-line option except setting the number of render
threads (+wtN for N threads) and library paths (+Lpath) will be ignored.
To get an accurate benchmark result you might consider running POV-Ray
with the Unix 'time' command (e.g. 'time povray -benchmark').

The benchmark will run using 4 render thread(s).
Press <Enter> to continue or <Ctrl-C> to abort.
povray: creating C:\msys64\mingw64\bin/pov17784.ini
povray: creating C:\msys64\mingw64\bin/pov17784.pov
Running standard POV-Ray benchmark version 2.01
Persistence of Vision(tm) Ray Tracer Version 3.7.0.8.unofficial (g++ 8.3.0 @
 x86_64-w64-mingw32)
This is an unofficial version compiled by:
 DigitalBox
 The POV-Ray Team is not responsible for supporting this version.

POV-Ray is based on DKBTrace 2.12 by David K. Buck & Aaron A. Collins
Copyright 1991-2013 Persistence of Vision Raytracer Pty. Ltd.

Primary POV-Ray 3.7 Architects/Developers: (Alphabetically)
  Chris Cason         Thorsten Froehlich  Christoph Lipka

With Assistance From: (Alphabetically)
  Nicolas Calimet     Jerome Grimbert     James Holsenback    Christoph Hormann
  Nathan Kopp         Juha Nieminen

Past Contributors: (Alphabetically)
  Steve Anger         Eric Barish         Dieter Bayer        David K. Buck
  Nicolas Calimet     Chris Cason         Aaron A. Collins    Chris Dailey
  Steve Demlow        Andreas Dilger      Alexander Enzmann   Dan Farmer
  Thorsten Froehlich  Mark Gordon         James Holsenback    Christoph Hormann
  Mike Hough          Chris Huff          Kari Kivisalo       Nathan Kopp
  Lutz Kretzschmar    Christoph Lipka     Jochen Lippert      Pascal Massimino
  Jim McElhiney       Douglas Muir        Juha Nieminen       Ron Parker
  Bill Pulver         Eduard Schwan       Wlodzimierz Skiba   Robert Skinner
  Yvo Smellenbergh    Zsolt Szalavari     Scott Taylor        Massimo Valentini
  Timothy Wegner      Drew Wells          Chris Young

Other contributors are listed in the documentation.

Support libraries used by POV-Ray:
  ZLib 1.2.11, Copyright 1995-2012 Jean-loup Gailly and Mark Adler
  LibPNG 1.6.37, Copyright 1998-2012 Glenn Randers-Pehrson
  LibJPEG 80, Copyright 1991-2013 Thomas G. Lane, Guido Vollbeding
  LibTIFF 4.0.10, Copyright 1988-1997 Sam Leffler, 1991-1997 SGI
  Boost 1.70, http://www.boost.org/

Parser Options
  Input file: C:\msys64\mingw64\bin/pov17784.pov (compatible to version 3.70)
  Remove bounds........On
  Split unions.........Off
  Library paths:
    C:/msys64/mingw64/share/povray-3.7/include
  Clock value:    0.000  (Animation off)
Image Output Options
  Image resolution.....512 by 512 (rows 1 to 512, columns 1 to 512).
  Output file: Disabled
  Graphic display......Off
  Mosaic preview.......Off
  Continued trace......Off
Information Output Options
  All Streams to console..........On
  Debug Stream to console.........On
  Fatal Stream to console.........On
  Render Stream to console........On
  Statistics Stream to console....On
  Warning Stream to console.......On
==== [Parsing...] ==========================================================


 Building mesh2:
   - vertex_vectors
   - normal_vectors
   - uv_vectors
   - face_indices
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Parser Statistics
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Finite Objects:          175
Infinite Objects:          3
Light Sources:             2
Total:                   180
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Parser Time
  Parse Time:       0 hours  0 minutes  0 seconds (0.609 seconds)
              using 1 thread(s) with 0.609 CPU-seconds total
  Bounding Time:    0 hours  0 minutes  0 seconds (0.000 seconds)
              using 1 thread(s) with 0.000 CPU-seconds total
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Render Options
  Quality:  9
  Bounding boxes.......On   Bounding threshold: 3
  Antialiasing.........On  (Method 1, Threshold 0.300, Depth 3, Jitter 0.30,
 Gamma 2.50)
==== [Rendering...] ========================================================
Rendered 262144 of 262144 pixels (100%)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Render Statistics
Image Resolution 512 x 512
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Pixels:           294912   Samples:          775998   Smpls/Pxl: 2.63
Rays:            2453818   Saved:             10601   Max Level: 12/12
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ray->Shape Intersection          Tests       Succeeded  Percentage
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Box                           53069191        21485169     40.49
Cone/Cylinder                 64848797        13358692     20.60
CSG Intersection             203661468        98294162     48.26
CSG Merge                       561234           74939     13.35
Fractal                        1093319          206199     18.86
Height Field                   1667123          217055     13.02
Height Field Box               1667123         1353809     81.21
Height Field Triangle          7026328          224476      3.19
Height Field Block            11044350         3426121     31.02
Height Field Cell             45877326         3867015      8.43
Isosurface                    21603463         1002332      4.64
Isosurface Container          21604286        21604281    100.00
Isosurface Cache                279163           12870      4.61
Mesh                           1158111          127116     10.98
Plane                        145880456         1543897      1.06
Sphere                       296771754       123448817     41.60
Superellipsoid                  384031          115086     29.97
Torus                          3294658          786679     23.88
Torus Bound                    3294658          902675     27.40
True Type Font                  520626          172772     33.19
Clipping Object                3471491         1690222     48.69
Bounding Box                1114356805       217333697     19.50
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Isosurface roots:          21586045
Function VM calls:        288061729
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Crackle Cache Queries:          829946
Crackle Cache Hits:             825403 ( 99 percent)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Roots tested:                902675   eliminated:               557850
Media Intervals:           61485996   Media Samples:         554502063 (9.02)
Shadow Ray Tests:         148366414   Succeeded:              86336504
Shadow Cache Hits:          4929112
Reflected Rays:              375008   Total Internal:                2
Refracted Rays:              262061
Transmitted Rays:            636861
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Number of photons shot:           36326
Surface photons stored:           13877
Gather function called:         1378512
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Render Time:
  Photon Time:      0 hours  0 minutes  1 seconds (1.438 seconds)
              using 7 thread(s) with 1.718 CPU-seconds total
  Radiosity Time:   No radiosity
  Trace Time:       0 hours  3 minutes 47 seconds (227.777 seconds)
              using 4 thread(s) with 907.108 CPU-seconds total
povray: removing C:\msys64\mingw64\bin/pov17784.ini
povray: removing C:\msys64\mingw64\bin/pov17784.pov
POV-Ray finished

[DigitalBox] Re: povdos needed [2495 days 5 hours and 4 minutes ago]

Fri, 28 Jun 2019 08:50:00 GMT

"Rocco" <nomail@nomail> wrote:
> Following this discussion, maybe someone will be interested. This will not be
> the latest version but this week I switched on my old computer and. I found my
> build scripts of POVRay 3.61 on MinGW32. I recompiled this with my MinGW64
> environment and the result is a command-line POVRay version that renders as
> expected. The build scripts is mostly inspired by what you see above. If there
> is demand about binaries, I can host it on my OneDrive for example. Even if 3.7
> is out now, 3.61 is still usable and feature-rich...
>
> This build works and renders as expected. You should only be careful about file
> paths (add them in the .INI for example).

I could be interested by how to compile Povray 3.61 for MinGW64 if you still
have it :)

[clipka] Re: some question about windows cmd [2944 days 18 hours and 28 minutes ago]

Wed, 4 Apr 2018 19:26:14 GMT

Am 04.04.2018 um 15:32 schrieb 944291641:

> Thanks for you kindness, I have try to set the color of shaded leaf, but I
> failed.Could you give me a hand that how to setup the lit and the unlit in
> different color?

You could just use plain old boring standard illumination:

    #declare MyTree = mesh { ... /* no textures here */ }

    object {
      MyTree
      texture {
        pigment { rgb 1 /* white */ }
        finish {
          ambient 0 /* shadowed areas should look pitch black */
          diffuse 1 /* lit areas should look as bright as possible */
        }
      }
    }

This would give you an image where all unlit areas are pitch black, and
all lit areas are some shade of grey (or white).


You can also use the `brilliance` mechanism to make the brightness of
the lit areas independent of the direction of illumination:

    object {
      MyTree
      texture {
        pigment { rgb 1 /* white */ }
        finish {
          ambient 0 /* shadowed areas should look pitch black */
          diffuse 1 /* lit areas should look as bright as possible */
          brilliance 0 /* incident light angle is totally irrelevant */
        }
      }
    }

If you want to use two different colours instead of black and white, you
can achieve this as well by toying with the light source colour and
ambient; e.g. to have the shadowed areas look red and the lit areas
green, you could use:

    object {
      MyTree
      texture {
        pigment { rgb 1 /* white */ }
        finish {
          ambient rgb <1,0,0> /* red */
          diffuse 1
          brilliance 0
        }
      }
    }

    light_source {
      MyLightSourcePosition
      rgb <-1,1,0> /* negative red cancels the ambient on lit areas,
                      positive green makes them look green */
    }


If you need to know which portions of the leaves are lit, even for
leaves that are not visible from the camera, you can use the mesh camera
to "bake" a texture map for the tree with the corresponding colors for
the lit and unlit areas; I'm not familiar the syntax though.

[Alain] Re: some question about windows cmd [2944 days 18 hours and 57 minutes ago]

Wed, 4 Apr 2018 18:56:49 GMT

Le 18-04-04 Ã  09:32, 944291641 a Ã©critÂ :
> "Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
>> "944291641" <944### [at] qqcom> wrote:
>>
>>> Recently I have encounter another question , could you give me a hand?
>>>
>>> I build a scene which contains some trees, and I want calculate the area of the
>>> sunlit leaf and the shaded leaf. For that I am a  Pov-Ray beginner, I don't know
>>> if there is any functions that can achieve this goal.
>>
>>
>>
>> Do you need to calculate that for ALL the leaves in a scene, or just one?
>>
>> You could probably render a single leaf, with a fairly artificial setup that
>> gives a certain color of final rendered pixel for lit, a certain color for
>> unlit, and a distinct background color (I'd go with transparent).
>>
>> Then you could scan and count the pixels of the different colors.
>>
>> Sorta like this:
>>
http://news.povray.org/povray.binaries.images/thread/%3Cweb.58cfc0cf857600e8c437ac910%40news.povray.org%3E/?mtop=4161
> 51
>>
>>
>> POV-Ray has internal processes that count ray-object intersections, and there is
>> also trace () and eval_pigment ().
>>
>> Perhaps there's a way to determine how much total leaf area there is, how much
>> is directly lit, and then subtract lit from total.
> Thanks for you kindness, I have try to set the color of shaded leaf, but I
> failed.Could you give me a hand that how to setup the lit and the unlit in
> different color?
> 
> 
> 
> 

There is no reasonable way to assign a different colour to an object 
depending on whether it is lit or not. It's simply because the actual 
pigment is illumination independent.
To know if any point is illuminated or not, the only way is to trace 
from the light that interest you toward an union containing the surface 
that interest you and see if it get intercepted early.
You need to repeat for each point of your object, and it will get 
*really* long. For each point you need to compute the exact direction 
that may differ by only a fraction of arc second, perform the trace, 
check if the returned coordinate match that of your surface, then, 
somehow create a custom pattern based on that result.
Extremely long and error prone.

Without going through all that, when you render your scene, unlighted 
part will always be darker.
It's possible to get radically different colours by using the 
projected_through light option:

Set the ambient to zero everywhere.
Bind your whole scene into a big union.
Use a regular light that is coloured.
Use a second light using the complementary colour from the main light, 
place it at exactly the same location and make it projected_through 
using your union.

Now, every part of your scene that is in the shadow from the main light 
is illuminated only by the projected_through light with a totally 
different colour.

[944291641] Re: some question about windows cmd [2945 days and 19 minutes ago]

Wed, 4 Apr 2018 13:35:00 GMT

"Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
> "944291641" <944### [at] qqcom> wrote:
>
> > Recently I have encounter another question , could you give me a hand?
> >
> > I build a scene which contains some trees, and I want calculate the area of the
> > sunlit leaf and the shaded leaf. For that I am a  Pov-Ray beginner, I don't know
> > if there is any functions that can achieve this goal.
>
>
>
> Do you need to calculate that for ALL the leaves in a scene, or just one?
>
> You could probably render a single leaf, with a fairly artificial setup that
> gives a certain color of final rendered pixel for lit, a certain color for
> unlit, and a distinct background color (I'd go with transparent).
>
> Then you could scan and count the pixels of the different colors.
>
> Sorta like this:
>
http://news.povray.org/povray.binaries.images/thread/%3Cweb.58cfc0cf857600e8c437ac910%40news.povray.org%3E/?mtop=4161
51
>
>
> POV-Ray has internal processes that count ray-object intersections, and there is
> also trace () and eval_pigment ().
>
> Perhaps there's a way to determine how much total leaf area there is, how much
> is directly lit, and then subtract lit from total.
Thanks for you kindness, I have try to set the color of shaded leaf, but I
failed.Could you give me a hand that how to setup the lit and the unlit in
different color?

[944291641] Re: some question about windows cmd [2947 days 1 hour and 54 minutes ago]

Mon, 2 Apr 2018 12:00:03 GMT

Alain <kua### [at] videotronca> wrote:
> Le 18-04-01 Ã  11:30, Bald Eagle a Ã©critÂ :
> > "944291641" <944### [at] qqcom> wrote:
> >
> >> Recently I have encounter another question , could you give me a hand?
> >>
> >> I build a scene which contains some trees, and I want calculate the area of the
> >> sunlit leaf and the shaded leaf. For that I am a  Pov-Ray beginner, I don't know
> >> if there is any functions that can achieve this goal.
> >
> >
> >
> > Do you need to calculate that for ALL the leaves in a scene, or just one?
> >
> > You could probably render a single leaf, with a fairly artificial setup that
> > gives a certain color of final rendered pixel for lit, a certain color for
> > unlit, and a distinct background color (I'd go with transparent).
> >
> > Then you could scan and count the pixels of the different colors.
> >
> > Sorta like this:
> >
http://news.povray.org/povray.binaries.images/thread/%3Cweb.58cfc0cf857600e8c437ac910%40news.povray.org%3E/?mtop=41
6151
> >
> >
> > POV-Ray has internal processes that count ray-object intersections, and there is
> > also trace () and eval_pigment ().
> >
> > Perhaps there's a way to determine how much total leaf area there is, how much
> > is directly lit, and then subtract lit from total.
> >
> >
>
> eval_pigment() return the raw value of the pigment at a specific point.
> It can't take illumination into account.
>
> To tell is some point on some object is lit or not, you need to take
> that onject, bind it with every other objects in your scene, trace from
> the light's location toward the object.
> Now, you need to see if the trace hit your object, or some other
> intervening object. That mean comparing the result returned by the
> trace() with the actual location of your object.
>
> Any transparent object can intercept the trace, so, the fully
> transparent objects need to be removed.
> If you have an object that is transparent in only some of it's part, or
> is partially transparent due to a filtering or transmiting texture,
> then, you need to identify that object and do another trace from just
> past that object onward IF you hit a transparent part.
Thank you for your advice, I will try it as soon as possible.
Thank you again. :)

[944291641] Re: some question about windows cmd [2947 days 1 hour and 54 minutes ago]

Mon, 2 Apr 2018 12:00:02 GMT

"Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
> "944291641" <944### [at] qqcom> wrote:
>
> > Recently I have encounter another question , could you give me a hand?
> >
> > I build a scene which contains some trees, and I want calculate the area of the
> > sunlit leaf and the shaded leaf. For that I am a  Pov-Ray beginner, I don't know
> > if there is any functions that can achieve this goal.
>
>
>
> Do you need to calculate that for ALL the leaves in a scene, or just one?
>
> You could probably render a single leaf, with a fairly artificial setup that
> gives a certain color of final rendered pixel for lit, a certain color for
> unlit, and a distinct background color (I'd go with transparent).
>
> Then you could scan and count the pixels of the different colors.
>
> Sorta like this:
>
http://news.povray.org/povray.binaries.images/thread/%3Cweb.58cfc0cf857600e8c437ac910%40news.povray.org%3E/?mtop=4161
51
>
>
> POV-Ray has internal processes that count ray-object intersections, and there is
> also trace () and eval_pigment ().
>
> Perhaps there's a way to determine how much total leaf area there is, how much
> is directly lit, and then subtract lit from total.
Thanks for your reply!
What I need is to cal the number of lit leaf pixels from the image rendered by
pov-ray. I will try give it different color, thank you very much.

[Alain] Re: some question about windows cmd [2947 days 18 hours and 14 minutes ago]

Sun, 1 Apr 2018 19:40:12 GMT

Le 18-04-01 Ã  11:30, Bald Eagle a Ã©critÂ :
> "944291641" <944### [at] qqcom> wrote:
> 
>> Recently I have encounter another question , could you give me a hand?
>>
>> I build a scene which contains some trees, and I want calculate the area of the
>> sunlit leaf and the shaded leaf. For that I am a  Pov-Ray beginner, I don't know
>> if there is any functions that can achieve this goal.
> 
> 
> 
> Do you need to calculate that for ALL the leaves in a scene, or just one?
> 
> You could probably render a single leaf, with a fairly artificial setup that
> gives a certain color of final rendered pixel for lit, a certain color for
> unlit, and a distinct background color (I'd go with transparent).
> 
> Then you could scan and count the pixels of the different colors.
> 
> Sorta like this:
>
http://news.povray.org/povray.binaries.images/thread/%3Cweb.58cfc0cf857600e8c437ac910%40news.povray.org%3E/?mtop=416151
> 
> 
> POV-Ray has internal processes that count ray-object intersections, and there is
> also trace () and eval_pigment ().
> 
> Perhaps there's a way to determine how much total leaf area there is, how much
> is directly lit, and then subtract lit from total.
> 
> 

eval_pigment() return the raw value of the pigment at a specific point. 
It can't take illumination into account.

To tell is some point on some object is lit or not, you need to take 
that onject, bind it with every other objects in your scene, trace from 
the light's location toward the object.
Now, you need to see if the trace hit your object, or some other 
intervening object. That mean comparing the result returned by the 
trace() with the actual location of your object.

Any transparent object can intercept the trace, so, the fully 
transparent objects need to be removed.
If you have an object that is transparent in only some of it's part, or 
is partially transparent due to a filtering or transmiting texture, 
then, you need to identify that object and do another trace from just 
past that object onward IF you hit a transparent part.

[Bald Eagle] Re: some question about windows cmd [2947 days 22 hours and 19 minutes ago]

Sun, 1 Apr 2018 15:35:01 GMT

"944291641" <944### [at] qqcom> wrote:

> Recently I have encounter another question , could you give me a hand?
>
> I build a scene which contains some trees, and I want calculate the area of the
> sunlit leaf and the shaded leaf. For that I am a  Pov-Ray beginner, I don't know
> if there is any functions that can achieve this goal.

Do you need to calculate that for ALL the leaves in a scene, or just one?

You could probably render a single leaf, with a fairly artificial setup that
gives a certain color of final rendered pixel for lit, a certain color for
unlit, and a distinct background color (I'd go with transparent).

Then you could scan and count the pixels of the different colors.

Sorta like this:
http://news.povray.org/povray.binaries.images/thread/%3Cweb.58cfc0cf857600e8c437ac910%40news.povray.org%3E/?mtop=416151

POV-Ray has internal processes that count ray-object intersections, and there is
also trace () and eval_pigment ().

Perhaps there's a way to determine how much total leaf area there is, how much
is directly lit, and then subtract lit from total.

[944291641] Re: some question about windows cmd [2947 days 22 hours and 59 minutes ago]

Sun, 1 Apr 2018 14:55:01 GMT

Stephen <mca### [at] aolcom> wrote:
> On 19/03/2018 00:50, 944291641 wrote:
> > Stephen <mca### [at] aolcom> wrote:
> >> On 18/03/2018 15:00, 944291641 wrote:
> >>> when i use windows cmd to execute my pov program,it cannot find some file in the
> >>> path of pov program:
> >>> for example:
> >>> my cmd is:"start pvengine /render G:\\patht_to_code\\model.ini"
> >>> and code like this:
> >>> + source
> >>>     t1.pov // it contain "#include "TOMLEAF.inc"" ,but no means
> >>>     TOMLEAF.inc
> >>>     something else
> >>>
> >>> could anyone help me? thanks a million!
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >> Try implicitly defining the path to the *.pov file in the ini file and
> >> the include file.
> >> Also you could define the location of library files in povray.ini. Like:
> >> Library_Path="G:\Libraries\Documents\POV-Ray\v3.7\include"
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >>
> >> Regards
> >>       Stephen
> >
> > it work! thank you very much Stephen!
> >
> >
>
> Phew! I'm glad. :-)
>
> I ran into the same problem myself, last week.
> It was from using machine generated code that I was rendering manually
> from a different directory than where it was created.
>
> --
>
> Regards
>      Stephen
Thank you again for your help!
It is same for me that I was rendering a file which didn't in where it was
created.

Recently I have encounter another question , could you give me a hand?

I build a scene which contains some trees, and I want calculate the area of the
sunlit leaf and the shaded leaf. For that I am a  Pov-Ray beginner, I don't know
if there is any functions that can achieve this goal.

Thank you for your warm-hearted.
Regards
    Longkey

[Stephen] Re: some question about windows cmd [2957 days 16 hours and 24 minutes ago]

Thu, 22 Mar 2018 21:30:18 GMT

On 22/03/2018 20:55, Alain wrote:
> Le 18-03-22 Ã  04:33, Stephen a Ã©critÂ :
>> On 20/03/2018 23:42, Alain wrote:
>>>> I ran into the same problem myself, last week.
>>>> It was from using machine generated code that I was rendering 
>>>> manually from a different directory than where it was created.
>>>>
>>>
>>> When using those machine generated scenes, check if it contains any 
>>> hard coded paths and other full files paths.
>>> Those are totally non-portable, even within a single machine.
>>
>> For once I cannot agree with you, Alain.
>> If I am using image_maps or df3s and don't use the full file paths. I 
>> would gave to copy the images or df3s into the current directory. In 
>> the past when I did not use the full file paths. I ended up with 
>> multiple copies of the same file in scores of locations. Considering 
>> the number of image maps Poser can use. It is a waste of space and be 
>> confusing.
>>
> 
> My approach to that is to have a central repository that is refered to 
> from the master ini file.
> You already have a central repository for the inc files, just create one 
> for the image maps, one for the machine generated meshes,...
> Then, you have a single place to look for.

I would hazard a guess that you do not frequently use modellers to 
generate your scenes. If you do, like me, you have to work with what 
they give you. I look forward to when the Pov team can start working on 
the replacement for Moray, as promised all those years ago. Then we 
might get a program that is both functional and sophisticated.
I am not whinging btw. Just giving my opinion.

-- 

Regards
     Stephen

[Alain] Re: some question about windows cmd [2957 days 17 hours and 1 minute ago]

Thu, 22 Mar 2018 20:52:55 GMT

Le 18-03-22 Ã  04:33, Stephen a Ã©critÂ :
> On 20/03/2018 23:42, Alain wrote:
>>> I ran into the same problem myself, last week.
>>> It was from using machine generated code that I was rendering 
>>> manually from a different directory than where it was created.
>>>
>>
>> When using those machine generated scenes, check if it contains any 
>> hard coded paths and other full files paths.
>> Those are totally non-portable, even within a single machine.
> 
> For once I cannot agree with you, Alain.
> If I am using image_maps or df3s and don't use the full file paths. I 
> would gave to copy the images or df3s into the current directory. In the 
> past when I did not use the full file paths. I ended up with multiple 
> copies of the same file in scores of locations. Considering the number 
> of image maps Poser can use. It is a waste of space and be confusing.
> 

My approach to that is to have a central repository that is refered to 
from the master ini file.
You already have a central repository for the inc files, just create one 
for the image maps, one for the machine generated meshes,...
Then, you have a single place to look for.

[Stephen] Re: some question about windows cmd [2958 days and 44 minutes ago]

Thu, 22 Mar 2018 13:09:57 GMT

On 22/03/2018 11:11, clipka wrote:
> Am 22.03.2018 um 09:33 schrieb Stephen:
>> On 20/03/2018 23:42, Alain wrote:
>>>> I ran into the same problem myself, last week.
>>>> It was from using machine generated code that I was rendering
>>>> manually from a different directory than where it was created.
>>>>
>>>
>>> When using those machine generated scenes, check if it contains any
>>> hard coded paths and other full files paths.
>>> Those are totally non-portable, even within a single machine.
>>
>> For once I cannot agree with you, Alain.
>> If I am using image_maps or df3s and don't use the full file paths. I
>> would gave to copy the images or df3s into the current directory. In the
>> past when I did not use the full file paths. I ended up with multiple
>> copies of the same file in scores of locations. Considering the number
>> of image maps Poser can use. It is a waste of space and be confusing.
> 
> A smart approach to this might be to use variables for the file name,
> and place them at the top of the scene file (or even in the INI file).
> That way you can quickly see whether the scene uses files from a
> location other than the scene directory (and you can quickly change it
> if necessary, without having to sift through the entire scene file and
> possibly a couple of include files).
> 

That sounds a good idea if you are hand coding your scenes. Although it 
seems like a lot of work for little benefit if your scene is exported 
with the paths included. PoseRay has that option and that is what I do 
for my own rendering. For sharing scenes I don't use that option and the 
image maps are exported to the directory that the mesh2 is saved in. So 
the set can be zipped together.
The problem I mentioned above was a missing file (a df3). And was 
quickly rectified when Pov said it wasn't where the SDL said it was. I 
must have cut and pasted instead of copy and pasting.

Thanks for your thoughts.

-- 

Regards
     Stephen

[clipka] Re: some question about windows cmd [2958 days 2 hours and 43 minutes ago]

Thu, 22 Mar 2018 11:11:28 GMT

Am 22.03.2018 um 09:33 schrieb Stephen:
> On 20/03/2018 23:42, Alain wrote:
>>> I ran into the same problem myself, last week.
>>> It was from using machine generated code that I was rendering
>>> manually from a different directory than where it was created.
>>>
>>
>> When using those machine generated scenes, check if it contains any
>> hard coded paths and other full files paths.
>> Those are totally non-portable, even within a single machine.
> 
> For once I cannot agree with you, Alain.
> If I am using image_maps or df3s and don't use the full file paths. I
> would gave to copy the images or df3s into the current directory. In the
> past when I did not use the full file paths. I ended up with multiple
> copies of the same file in scores of locations. Considering the number
> of image maps Poser can use. It is a waste of space and be confusing.

A smart approach to this might be to use variables for the file name,
and place them at the top of the scene file (or even in the INI file).
That way you can quickly see whether the scene uses files from a
location other than the scene directory (and you can quickly change it
if necessary, without having to sift through the entire scene file and
possibly a couple of include files).

[Stephen] Re: some question about windows cmd [2958 days 5 hours and 20 minutes ago]

Thu, 22 Mar 2018 08:33:52 GMT

On 20/03/2018 23:42, Alain wrote:
>> I ran into the same problem myself, last week.
>> It was from using machine generated code that I was rendering manually 
>> from a different directory than where it was created.
>>
> 
> When using those machine generated scenes, check if it contains any hard 
> coded paths and other full files paths.
> Those are totally non-portable, even within a single machine.

For once I cannot agree with you, Alain.
If I am using image_maps or df3s and don't use the full file paths. I 
would gave to copy the images or df3s into the current directory. In the 
past when I did not use the full file paths. I ended up with multiple 
copies of the same file in scores of locations. Considering the number 
of image maps Poser can use. It is a waste of space and be confusing.

-- 

Regards
     Stephen

[Alain] Re: some question about windows cmd [2959 days 14 hours and 12 minutes ago]

Tue, 20 Mar 2018 23:41:56 GMT

Le 18-03-19 Ã  01:57, Stephen a Ã©critÂ :
> On 19/03/2018 00:50, 944291641 wrote:
>> Stephen <mca### [at] aolcom> wrote:
>>> On 18/03/2018 15:00, 944291641 wrote:
>>>> when i use windows cmd to execute my pov program,it cannot find some 
>>>> file in the
>>>> path of pov program:
>>>> for example:
>>>> my cmd is:"start pvengine /render G:\\patht_to_code\\model.ini"
>>>> and code like this:
>>>> + source
>>>> Â Â Â  t1.pov // it contain "#include
"TOMLEAF.inc"" ,but no means
>>>> Â Â Â  TOMLEAF.inc
>>>> Â Â Â  something else
>>>>
>>>> could anyone help me? thanks a million!
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> Try implicitly defining the path to the *.pov file in the ini file and
>>> the include file.
>>> Also you could define the location of library files in povray.ini. Like:
>>> Library_Path="G:\Libraries\Documents\POV-Ray\v3.7\include"
>>>
>>>
>>> -- 
>>>
>>> Regards
>>> Â Â Â Â Â  Stephen
>>
>> it work! thank you very much Stephen!
>>
>>
> 
> Phew! I'm glad. :-)
> 
> I ran into the same problem myself, last week.
> It was from using machine generated code that I was rendering manually 
> from a different directory than where it was created.
> 

When using those machine generated scenes, check if it contains any hard 
coded paths and other full files paths.
Those are totally non-portable, even within a single machine.

[Stephen] Re: some question about windows cmd [2961 days 7 hours and 56 minutes ago]

Mon, 19 Mar 2018 05:57:37 GMT

On 19/03/2018 00:50, 944291641 wrote:
> Stephen <mca### [at] aolcom> wrote:
>> On 18/03/2018 15:00, 944291641 wrote:
>>> when i use windows cmd to execute my pov program,it cannot find some file in the
>>> path of pov program:
>>> for example:
>>> my cmd is:"start pvengine /render G:\\patht_to_code\\model.ini"
>>> and code like this:
>>> + source
>>>     t1.pov // it contain "#include "TOMLEAF.inc"" ,but no means
>>>     TOMLEAF.inc
>>>     something else
>>>
>>> could anyone help me? thanks a million!
>>>
>>>
>>
>> Try implicitly defining the path to the *.pov file in the ini file and
>> the include file.
>> Also you could define the location of library files in povray.ini. Like:
>> Library_Path="G:\Libraries\Documents\POV-Ray\v3.7\include"
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Regards
>>       Stephen
> 
> it work! thank you very much Stephen!
> 
> 

Phew! I'm glad. :-)

I ran into the same problem myself, last week.
It was from using machine generated code that I was rendering manually 
from a different directory than where it was created.

-- 

Regards
     Stephen

[944291641] Re: some question about windows cmd [2961 days 12 hours and 59 minutes ago]

Mon, 19 Mar 2018 00:55:01 GMT

Stephen <mca### [at] aolcom> wrote:
> On 18/03/2018 15:00, 944291641 wrote:
> > when i use windows cmd to execute my pov program,it cannot find some file in the
> > path of pov program:
> > for example:
> > my cmd is:"start pvengine /render G:\\patht_to_code\\model.ini"
> > and code like this:
> > + source
> >    t1.pov // it contain "#include "TOMLEAF.inc"" ,but no means
> >    TOMLEAF.inc
> >    something else
> >
> > could anyone help me? thanks a million!
> >
> >
>
> Try implicitly defining the path to the *.pov file in the ini file and
> the include file.
> Also you could define the location of library files in povray.ini. Like:
> Library_Path="G:\Libraries\Documents\POV-Ray\v3.7\include"
>
>
> --
>
> Regards
>      Stephen

it work! thank you very much Stephen!

[Stephen] Re: some question about windows cmd [2961 days 20 hours ago]

Sun, 18 Mar 2018 17:54:32 GMT

On 18/03/2018 15:00, 944291641 wrote:
> when i use windows cmd to execute my pov program,it cannot find some file in the
> path of pov program:
> for example:
> my cmd is:"start pvengine /render G:\\patht_to_code\\model.ini"
> and code like this:
> + source
>    t1.pov // it contain "#include "TOMLEAF.inc"" ,but no means
>    TOMLEAF.inc
>    something else
> 
> could anyone help me? thanks a million!
> 
> 

Try implicitly defining the path to the *.pov file in the ini file and 
the include file.
Also you could define the location of library files in povray.ini. Like:
Library_Path="G:\Libraries\Documents\POV-Ray\v3.7\include"

-- 

Regards
     Stephen

[944291641] some question about windows cmd [2961 days 22 hours and 49 minutes ago]

Sun, 18 Mar 2018 15:05:00 GMT

when i use windows cmd to execute my pov program,it cannot find some file in the
path of pov program:
for example:
my cmd is:"start pvengine /render G:\\patht_to_code\\model.ini"
and code like this:
+ source
  t1.pov // it contain "#include "TOMLEAF.inc"" ,but no means
  TOMLEAF.inc
  something else

could anyone help me? thanks a million!

[dick balaska] Re: Where am I? [2971 days 4 hours and 59 minutes ago]

Fri, 9 Mar 2018 08:55:12 GMT

Am 2018-03-08 21:19, also sprach clipka:
> Am 08.03.2018 um 21:50 schrieb dick balaska:
>> povray emits 120 lines of text per render, and not a one of them tells
>> me which of my 21 copies of povray.ini it is reading. :(
>>
>> I booted Windows, and am trying to change my default size from 800x600
>> to 720x480.
> 
> Try the "Edit master POVRAY.INI" menu item from the "Tools" menu.
> 

I thought of that.  If only qtpov had such a thing. ;)
I thought of changing povconsole.exe (per se, actually povrayws64.exe) 
to tell me the location of the master .ini with the version command so I 
can get at that.

BTW, I stopped working on the integration of qtpov/povray because I have 
a leak in my povrayws64.exe.  That leak will exist after the 
integration, so I thought to tackle it first.  Prior to noticing the 
leak, I upgraded from Qt 5.9 to 5.10 and valgrind died. :(  So I have no 
easy way of chasing that down. I keep upgrading hoping one of these 
times it fixes valgrind.  google tells me I am the only person that 
valgrind crashes on startup since 2006.

It seems that my leak is Linux only. I wondered, because povwin doesn't 
leak.  I think that's somehow a clue.
-- 
dik

[clipka] Re: Where am I? [2971 days 11 hours and 34 minutes ago]

Fri, 9 Mar 2018 02:19:55 GMT

Am 08.03.2018 um 21:50 schrieb dick balaska:
> povray emits 120 lines of text per render, and not a one of them tells
> me which of my 21 copies of povray.ini it is reading. :(
> 
> I booted Windows, and am trying to change my default size from 800x600
> to 720x480.

Try the "Edit master POVRAY.INI" menu item from the "Tools" menu.

[Alain] Re: Where am I? [2971 days 16 hours and 31 minutes ago]

Thu, 8 Mar 2018 21:23:25 GMT

Le 18-03-08 Ã  15:50, dick balaska a Ã©critÂ :
> povray emits 120 lines of text per render, and not a one of them tells 
> me which of my 21 copies of povray.ini it is reading. :(
> 
> I booted Windows, and am trying to change my default size from 800x600 
> to 720x480.
> 

It use the one found in :
/Users/%CurrentUser%/My documents/POV-Ray/v3.7/ini

You can safely delete those located anywhere else.

[dick balaska] Where am I? [2971 days 17 hours and 4 minutes ago]

Thu, 8 Mar 2018 20:50:24 GMT

povray emits 120 lines of text per render, and not a one of them tells 
me which of my 21 copies of povray.ini it is reading. :(

I booted Windows, and am trying to change my default size from 800x600 
to 720x480.

-- 
dik

[Stephen] Re: Processor affinity? [2973 days 3 hours and 50 minutes ago]

Wed, 7 Mar 2018 10:04:02 GMT

On 07/03/2018 02:39, Alain wrote:
>> Not a PovRay problem but IIRC Moray and Bishop3D creates and export 
>> the file.ini using the settings in the workspace. Unfortunately 
>> neither of them have settings for the modern features of PovRay. Which 
>> is why I use a workaround.
>> Blender is better and allows you to put entries in the command line. 
>> But it is not mature enough for me to use it as my only modeller, yet.
>>
>> BTW how is the development of the new version of Moray coming along?
>>
>>
> 
> Unless the ini file made by the modeler set render_block_size, then, the 
> value that you set in povray.ini will always stick.

Yes I that is the nature of software. If it doesn't know about 
something. It cannot take it into account. Or so I understand.

-- 

Regards
     Stephen

[Alain] Re: Processor affinity? [2973 days 11 hours and 15 minutes ago]

Wed, 7 Mar 2018 02:38:46 GMT

Le 18-03-06 Ã  04:57, Stephen a Ã©critÂ :
> On 06/03/2018 09:18, clipka wrote:
>> Am 06.03.2018 um 05:22 schrieb Stephen:
>>> On 05/03/2018 20:48, Alain wrote:
>>>> You also can set it in povray.ini.
>>>
>>> Maybe it was not obvious just quoting the ini command, 
>>> Render_Block_Size.
>>>
>>> The reason I use the command line. Is that by using a modeller. The ini
>>> file is hard coded. So that is an extra step in running the render.
>>
>> The "master" INI file `povray.ini` is always loaded, even if the scene
>> comes with its own INI file.
>>
> 
> Not a PovRay problem but IIRC Moray and Bishop3D creates and export the 
> file.ini using the settings in the workspace. Unfortunately neither of 
> them have settings for the modern features of PovRay. Which is why I use 
> a workaround.
> Blender is better and allows you to put entries in the command line. But 
> it is not mature enough for me to use it as my only modeller, yet.
> 
> BTW how is the development of the new version of Moray coming along?
> 
> 

Unless the ini file made by the modeler set render_block_size, then, the 
value that you set in povray.ini will always stick.

[Stephen] Re: Processor affinity? [2974 days 2 hours and 12 minutes ago]

Tue, 6 Mar 2018 11:42:03 GMT

On 06/03/2018 10:14, Mike Horvath wrote:
> 
> My AMD processor only has 1 thread per core... which I only learned long 
> after I built my computer.Â  I should have done more research. :(

Isn't that the way of it? Why can't we have experience before the event? ;-)

-- 

Regards
     Stephen

[Mike Horvath] Re: Processor affinity? [2974 days 3 hours and 40 minutes ago]

Tue, 6 Mar 2018 10:14:12 GMT

On 3/5/2018 7:48 AM, Stephen wrote:
> On 05/03/2018 12:18, Thomas de Groot wrote:
>> On 5-3-2018 10:11, Stephen wrote:
>>> On 05/03/2018 08:55, Mike Horvath wrote:
>>>> On 3/5/2018 3:51 AM, Thomas de Groot wrote:
>>>>> On 5-3-2018 9:49, Thomas de Groot wrote:
>>>>> I probably should have written "threads" instead of "cores". ;-)
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Wow, +wt is even better!!
>>>>
>>>> The docs mention threads and cores. But some CPUs have 2 threads per 
>>>> core, correct?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> Yes my i7 CPU has 6 cores and 12 threads.
>>
>> I am always unsure about these things. I think my i7 CPU has one core 
>> and 8 threads. As far as I know...
>>
> It is generally 2 threads per core.
> 
>
http://www.expertreviews.co.uk/pcs/cpus/1400962/whats-the-difference-between-core-i3-i5-and-i7-processors


My AMD processor only has 1 thread per core... which I only learned long 
after I built my computer.  I should have done more research. :(


Mike

[Stephen] Re: Processor affinity? [2974 days 3 hours and 56 minutes ago]

Tue, 6 Mar 2018 09:57:44 GMT

On 06/03/2018 09:18, clipka wrote:
> Am 06.03.2018 um 05:22 schrieb Stephen:
>> On 05/03/2018 20:48, Alain wrote:
>>> You also can set it in povray.ini.
>>
>> Maybe it was not obvious just quoting the ini command, Render_Block_Size.
>>
>> The reason I use the command line. Is that by using a modeller. The ini
>> file is hard coded. So that is an extra step in running the render.
> 
> The "master" INI file `povray.ini` is always loaded, even if the scene
> comes with its own INI file.
> 

Not a PovRay problem but IIRC Moray and Bishop3D creates and export the 
file.ini using the settings in the workspace. Unfortunately neither of 
them have settings for the modern features of PovRay. Which is why I use 
a workaround.
Blender is better and allows you to put entries in the command line. But 
it is not mature enough for me to use it as my only modeller, yet.

BTW how is the development of the new version of Moray coming along?

-- 

Regards
     Stephen

[clipka] Re: Processor affinity? [2974 days 4 hours and 36 minutes ago]

Tue, 6 Mar 2018 09:18:25 GMT

Am 06.03.2018 um 05:22 schrieb Stephen:
> On 05/03/2018 20:48, Alain wrote:
>> You also can set it in povray.ini.
> 
> Maybe it was not obvious just quoting the ini command, Render_Block_Size.
> 
> The reason I use the command line. Is that by using a modeller. The ini
> file is hard coded. So that is an extra step in running the render.

The "master" INI file `povray.ini` is always loaded, even if the scene
comes with its own INI file.

[Thomas de Groot] Re: Processor affinity? [2974 days 6 hours ago]

Tue, 6 Mar 2018 07:53:59 GMT

On 5-3-2018 13:48, Stephen wrote:
> On 05/03/2018 12:18, Thomas de Groot wrote:
>> On 5-3-2018 10:11, Stephen wrote:
>>> On 05/03/2018 08:55, Mike Horvath wrote:
>>>> On 3/5/2018 3:51 AM, Thomas de Groot wrote:
>>>>> On 5-3-2018 9:49, Thomas de Groot wrote:
>>>>> I probably should have written "threads" instead of "cores". ;-)
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Wow, +wt is even better!!
>>>>
>>>> The docs mention threads and cores. But some CPUs have 2 threads per 
>>>> core, correct?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> Yes my i7 CPU has 6 cores and 12 threads.
>>
>> I am always unsure about these things. I think my i7 CPU has one core 
>> and 8 threads. As far as I know...
>>
> It is generally 2 threads per core.
> 
>
http://www.expertreviews.co.uk/pcs/cpus/1400962/whats-the-difference-between-core-i3-i5-and-i7-processors


It is like cars. I have no idea what is happening under the hood. For 
all I know there is a bunch of squirrels running about in a treadmill ;-)

> 
> 
> 
>>>
>>> One other thought, only slightly relevant.
>>>
>>> If, toward the end of rendering a frame, you find that you are 
>>> waiting for one or two blocks to finish. Setting Render_Block_Size to 
>>> a smallish value allows all of your cores to work on the blocks 
>>> instead of being idle. I generally use +BS8
>>>
>>> http://wiki.povray.org/content/Reference:Tracing_Options#Render_Block_Size 
>>>
>>>
>>
>> Ah, yes! That might be very relevant indeed. Thanks!
>>
> 
> Sorry if I did not mention it when we were working on Dhalgren? .

You probably did, and I did not pay attention :-)

> 
> I leave +BS8 in the command line box. It is persistent and is there 
> whenever I start Pov 3.7. Unless I delete or change it.
> 

Yes, that is an excellent idea.... Done.

-- 
Thomas

[Stephen] Re: Processor affinity? [2974 days 9 hours and 31 minutes ago]

Tue, 6 Mar 2018 04:22:56 GMT

On 05/03/2018 20:48, Alain wrote:
> You also can set it in povray.ini.

Maybe it was not obvious just quoting the ini command, Render_Block_Size.

The reason I use the command line. Is that by using a modeller. The ini 
file is hard coded. So that is an extra step in running the render.


-- 

Regards
     Stephen

[Mike Horvath] Re: Processor affinity? [2974 days 11 hours and 49 minutes ago]

Tue, 6 Mar 2018 02:05:34 GMT

On 3/5/2018 6:31 AM, dick balaska wrote:
> I have been grooving on Render_Pattern=3 lately.Â  This causes the middle 
> of the pic to be rendered first, which is usually where the heavy blocks 
> will live. It's also good for preview.
> 
> I was doing +wt6 for awhile. I agree leaving only 2 threads is 
> sufficient to have a responsive computer.Â  But I preferred to run +wt8 
> and then turn off 2 POV-Ray threads with Task Manager while using the 
> computer, and then turning them back on when done.
> 
> But, now I run Ubuntu and I have no control over affinity and priority 
> anyway. ;)
> 

A spiral render pattern might be nice. That way, the center regions of 
the screen get rendered first.


Mike

[Alain] Re: Processor affinity? [2974 days 17 hours and 6 minutes ago]

Mon, 5 Mar 2018 20:48:31 GMT

Le 18-03-05 Ã  07:48, Stephen a Ã©critÂ :
> On 05/03/2018 12:18, Thomas de Groot wrote:
>> On 5-3-2018 10:11, Stephen wrote:
>>> On 05/03/2018 08:55, Mike Horvath wrote:
>>>> On 3/5/2018 3:51 AM, Thomas de Groot wrote:
>>>>> On 5-3-2018 9:49, Thomas de Groot wrote:
>>>>> I probably should have written "threads" instead of "cores". ;-)
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Wow, +wt is even better!!
>>>>
>>>> The docs mention threads and cores. But some CPUs have 2 threads per 
>>>> core, correct?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> Yes my i7 CPU has 6 cores and 12 threads.
>>
>> I am always unsure about these things. I think my i7 CPU has one core 
>> and 8 threads. As far as I know...
>>
> It is generally 2 threads per core.
> 
>
http://www.expertreviews.co.uk/pcs/cpus/1400962/whats-the-difference-between-core-i3-i5-and-i7-processors

> 
> 
> 
>>>
>>> One other thought, only slightly relevant.
>>>
>>> If, toward the end of rendering a frame, you find that you are 
>>> waiting for one or two blocks to finish. Setting Render_Block_Size to 
>>> a smallish value allows all of your cores to work on the blocks 
>>> instead of being idle. I generally use +BS8
>>>
>>> http://wiki.povray.org/content/Reference:Tracing_Options#Render_Block_Size 
>>>
>>>
>>
>> Ah, yes! That might be very relevant indeed. Thanks!
>>
> 
> Sorry if I did not mention it when we were working on Dhalgren? .
> 
> I leave +BS8 in the command line box. It is persistent and is there 
> whenever I start Pov 3.7. Unless I delete or change it.
> 

You also can set it in povray.ini.

[Alain] Re: Processor affinity? [2974 days 17 hours and 11 minutes ago]

Mon, 5 Mar 2018 20:43:29 GMT

Le 18-03-04 Ã  20:53, Mike Horvath a Ã©critÂ :
> Is there a permanent way to set the processor affinity of the POV-Ray 
> render processes? I can do this Process Hacker, but as soon as I 
> minimize or exit Process Hacker, the changes are reversed.
> 
> I would like to still be able to use my computer for other stuff while 
> rendering, and setting the render priority isn't always enough.
> 
> 
> Mike

You can set the working treads number to something less than the number 
of cores on your system. You can use +wt# for that purpose.

Say, you have an 8 cores processor, you can add +wt7 or +wt6 to liberate 
1 or 2 cores for other tasks.

[Stephen] Re: Processor affinity? [2975 days 1 hour and 5 minutes ago]

Mon, 5 Mar 2018 12:48:57 GMT

On 05/03/2018 12:18, Thomas de Groot wrote:
> On 5-3-2018 10:11, Stephen wrote:
>> On 05/03/2018 08:55, Mike Horvath wrote:
>>> On 3/5/2018 3:51 AM, Thomas de Groot wrote:
>>>> On 5-3-2018 9:49, Thomas de Groot wrote:
>>>> I probably should have written "threads" instead of "cores". ;-)
>>>>
>>>
>>> Wow, +wt is even better!!
>>>
>>> The docs mention threads and cores. But some CPUs have 2 threads per 
>>> core, correct?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> Yes my i7 CPU has 6 cores and 12 threads.
> 
> I am always unsure about these things. I think my i7 CPU has one core 
> and 8 threads. As far as I know...
> 
It is generally 2 threads per core.

http://www.expertreviews.co.uk/pcs/cpus/1400962/whats-the-difference-between-core-i3-i5-and-i7-processors


>>
>> One other thought, only slightly relevant.
>>
>> If, toward the end of rendering a frame, you find that you are waiting 
>> for one or two blocks to finish. Setting Render_Block_Size to a 
>> smallish value allows all of your cores to work on the blocks instead 
>> of being idle. I generally use +BS8
>>
>> http://wiki.povray.org/content/Reference:Tracing_Options#Render_Block_Size 
>>
>>
> 
> Ah, yes! That might be very relevant indeed. Thanks!
> 

Sorry if I did not mention it when we were working on Dhalgren? .

I leave +BS8 in the command line box. It is persistent and is there 
whenever I start Pov 3.7. Unless I delete or change it.

-- 

Regards
     Stephen

[Thomas de Groot] Re: Processor affinity? [2975 days 1 hour and 36 minutes ago]

Mon, 5 Mar 2018 12:18:08 GMT

On 5-3-2018 10:11, Stephen wrote:
> On 05/03/2018 08:55, Mike Horvath wrote:
>> On 3/5/2018 3:51 AM, Thomas de Groot wrote:
>>> On 5-3-2018 9:49, Thomas de Groot wrote:
>>> I probably should have written "threads" instead of "cores". ;-)
>>>
>>
>> Wow, +wt is even better!!
>>
>> The docs mention threads and cores. But some CPUs have 2 threads per 
>> core, correct?
>>
>>
>>
> 
> Yes my i7 CPU has 6 cores and 12 threads.

I am always unsure about these things. I think my i7 CPU has one core 
and 8 threads. As far as I know...

> 
> One other thought, only slightly relevant.
> 
> If, toward the end of rendering a frame, you find that you are waiting 
> for one or two blocks to finish. Setting Render_Block_Size to a smallish 
> value allows all of your cores to work on the blocks instead of being 
> idle. I generally use +BS8
> 
> http://wiki.povray.org/content/Reference:Tracing_Options#Render_Block_Size
> 

Ah, yes! That might be very relevant indeed. Thanks!

-- 
Thomas

[Stephen] Re: Processor affinity? [2975 days 1 hour and 42 minutes ago]

Mon, 5 Mar 2018 12:12:10 GMT

On 05/03/2018 11:31, dick balaska wrote:
> 
> I have been grooving on Render_Pattern=3 lately.Â  This causes the middle 
> of the pic to be rendered first, which is usually where the heavy blocks 
> will live. It's also good for preview.
> 

Hmm! Something to remember.

> I was doing +wt6 for awhile. I agree leaving only 2 threads is 
> sufficient to have a responsive computer.Â  But I preferred to run +wt8 
> and then turn off 2 POV-Ray threads with Task Manager while using the 
> computer, and then turning them back on when done.
> 
I find that keeping the priority setting in PovRay at normal. PovRay 
gives up CPU ticks whenever I need them. Only when I use another CPU 
intensive process. Do I use affinity.

> But, now I run Ubuntu and I have no control over affinity and priority 
> anyway. ;)

There's where my confusion arose. I got you and Mike mixed up.
Sorry both of you. :$


-- 

Regards
     Stephen

[dick balaska] Re: Processor affinity? [2975 days 2 hours and 23 minutes ago]

Mon, 5 Mar 2018 11:31:33 GMT

On 03/05/2018 04:11 AM, Stephen wrote:
> On 05/03/2018 08:55, Mike Horvath wrote:
>> On 3/5/2018 3:51 AM, Thomas de Groot wrote:
>>> On 5-3-2018 9:49, Thomas de Groot wrote:
>>> I probably should have written "threads" instead of "cores". ;-)
>>>
>>
>> Wow, +wt is even better!!
>>
>> The docs mention threads and cores. But some CPUs have 2 threads per 
>> core, correct?
>>
>>
>>
> 
> Yes my i7 CPU has 6 cores and 12 threads.
> 
> One other thought, only slightly relevant.
> 
> If, toward the end of rendering a frame, you find that you are waiting 
> for one or two blocks to finish. Setting Render_Block_Size to a smallish 
> value allows all of your cores to work on the blocks instead of being 
> idle. I generally use +BS8
> 
> http://wiki.povray.org/content/Reference:Tracing_Options#Render_Block_Size
> 

I have been grooving on Render_Pattern=3 lately.  This causes the middle 
of the pic to be rendered first, which is usually where the heavy blocks 
will live. It's also good for preview.

I was doing +wt6 for awhile. I agree leaving only 2 threads is 
sufficient to have a responsive computer.  But I preferred to run +wt8 
and then turn off 2 POV-Ray threads with Task Manager while using the 
computer, and then turning them back on when done.

But, now I run Ubuntu and I have no control over affinity and priority 
anyway. ;)

-- 
dik
Rendered 920576 of 921600 pixels (99%)

[Stephen] Re: Processor affinity? [2975 days 3 hours and 17 minutes ago]

Mon, 5 Mar 2018 10:37:12 GMT

On 05/03/2018 09:57, Mike Horvath wrote:
> On 3/5/2018 4:11 AM, Stephen wrote:
>> One other thought, only slightly relevant.
>>
>> If, toward the end of rendering a frame, you find that you are waiting 
>> for one or two blocks to finish. Setting Render_Block_Size to a 
>> smallish value allows all of your cores to work on the blocks instead 
>> of being idle. I generally use +BS8
>>
>> http://wiki.povray.org/content/Reference:Tracing_Options#Render_Block_Size 
>>
>>
> 
> 
> Nice tip! Thanks!
> 
> 
My pleasure. :-D
It is handy if there are lots of reflections and or media.


-- 

Regards
     Stephen

[Mike Horvath] Re: Processor affinity? [2975 days 3 hours and 57 minutes ago]

Mon, 5 Mar 2018 09:57:13 GMT

On 3/5/2018 4:11 AM, Stephen wrote:
> One other thought, only slightly relevant.
> 
> If, toward the end of rendering a frame, you find that you are waiting 
> for one or two blocks to finish. Setting Render_Block_Size to a smallish 
> value allows all of your cores to work on the blocks instead of being 
> idle. I generally use +BS8
> 
> http://wiki.povray.org/content/Reference:Tracing_Options#Render_Block_Size
> 


Nice tip! Thanks!


Mike

[Stephen] Re: Processor affinity? [2975 days 4 hours and 41 minutes ago]

Mon, 5 Mar 2018 09:12:45 GMT

On 05/03/2018 08:57, Mike Horvath wrote:
> On 3/5/2018 3:24 AM, Stephen wrote:
>> On 05/03/2018 07:37, dick balaska wrote:
>>> On 03/05/2018 02:17 AM, Stephen wrote:
>>>> On 05/03/2018 06:38, dick balaska wrote:
>>>>> On 03/04/2018 08:53 PM, Mike Horvath wrote:
>>>>>> Is there a permanent way to set the processor affinity of the 
>>>>>> POV-Ray render processes? I can do this Process Hacker, but as 
>>>>>> soon as I minimize or exit Process Hacker, the changes are reversed.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I would like to still be able to use my computer for other stuff 
>>>>>> while rendering, and setting the render priority isn't always enough.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Mike
>>>>>
>>>>> I always set it from Task Manager. Right click on the process and 
>>>>> you can change its affinity and priority.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Task Manager works well for Windoze and Pov retains the affinity 
>>>> settings when it is closed but I have a feeling Mike uses Linux.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Ah.
>>>
>>> Wait. Why post this question in the windows group then? ;)
>>>
>>
>> Oh! That's a duh on my part. :-(
>>
> 
> Yeah, I meant Windows. But thanks for the help!
> 

I was up far too early this morning, 2 am.


-- 

Regards
     Stephen

[Stephen] Re: Processor affinity? [2975 days 4 hours and 43 minutes ago]

Mon, 5 Mar 2018 09:11:13 GMT

On 05/03/2018 08:55, Mike Horvath wrote:
> On 3/5/2018 3:51 AM, Thomas de Groot wrote:
>> On 5-3-2018 9:49, Thomas de Groot wrote:
>> I probably should have written "threads" instead of "cores". ;-)
>>
> 
> Wow, +wt is even better!!
> 
> The docs mention threads and cores. But some CPUs have 2 threads per 
> core, correct?
> 
> 
> 

Yes my i7 CPU has 6 cores and 12 threads.

One other thought, only slightly relevant.

If, toward the end of rendering a frame, you find that you are waiting 
for one or two blocks to finish. Setting Render_Block_Size to a smallish 
value allows all of your cores to work on the blocks instead of being 
idle. I generally use +BS8

http://wiki.povray.org/content/Reference:Tracing_Options#Render_Block_Size

-- 

Regards
     Stephen

[Mike Horvath] Re: Processor affinity? [2975 days 4 hours and 57 minutes ago]

Mon, 5 Mar 2018 08:57:11 GMT

On 3/5/2018 3:24 AM, Stephen wrote:
> On 05/03/2018 07:37, dick balaska wrote:
>> On 03/05/2018 02:17 AM, Stephen wrote:
>>> On 05/03/2018 06:38, dick balaska wrote:
>>>> On 03/04/2018 08:53 PM, Mike Horvath wrote:
>>>>> Is there a permanent way to set the processor affinity of the 
>>>>> POV-Ray render processes? I can do this Process Hacker, but as soon 
>>>>> as I minimize or exit Process Hacker, the changes are reversed.
>>>>>
>>>>> I would like to still be able to use my computer for other stuff 
>>>>> while rendering, and setting the render priority isn't always enough.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Mike
>>>>
>>>> I always set it from Task Manager. Right click on the process and 
>>>> you can change its affinity and priority.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Task Manager works well for Windoze and Pov retains the affinity 
>>> settings when it is closed but I have a feeling Mike uses Linux.
>>>
>>
>> Ah.
>>
>> Wait. Why post this question in the windows group then? ;)
>>
> 
> Oh! That's a duh on my part. :-(
> 

Yeah, I meant Windows. But thanks for the help!


Mike

[Mike Horvath] Re: Processor affinity? [2975 days 4 hours and 59 minutes ago]

Mon, 5 Mar 2018 08:55:32 GMT

On 3/5/2018 3:51 AM, Thomas de Groot wrote:
> On 5-3-2018 9:49, Thomas de Groot wrote:
> I probably should have written "threads" instead of "cores". ;-)
> 

Wow, +wt is even better!!

The docs mention threads and cores. But some CPUs have 2 threads per 
core, correct?



Mike

[Thomas de Groot] Re: Processor affinity? [2975 days 5 hours and 2 minutes ago]

Mon, 5 Mar 2018 08:51:53 GMT

On 5-3-2018 9:49, Thomas de Groot wrote:
I probably should have written "threads" instead of "cores". ;-)

-- 
Thomas

[Thomas de Groot] Re: Processor affinity? [2975 days 5 hours and 5 minutes ago]

Mon, 5 Mar 2018 08:49:19 GMT

On 5-3-2018 2:53, Mike Horvath wrote:
> Is there a permanent way to set the processor affinity of the POV-Ray 
> render processes? I can do this Process Hacker, but as soon as I 
> minimize or exit Process Hacker, the changes are reversed.
> 
> I would like to still be able to use my computer for other stuff while 
> rendering, and setting the render priority isn't always enough.
> 

I doubt if setting the affinity is such a good way to go (just googled 
the topic rapidly). Depending on the number of cores you have available 
on your computer, just set +wt in POV-Ray. In my case, I have 8 cores 
and I always render with +wt6. For most of my other activities while a 
render is in progress, the 2 remaining cores are more than enough.

-- 
Thomas

[Stephen] Re: Processor affinity? [2975 days 5 hours and 30 minutes ago]

Mon, 5 Mar 2018 08:24:30 GMT

On 05/03/2018 07:37, dick balaska wrote:
> On 03/05/2018 02:17 AM, Stephen wrote:
>> On 05/03/2018 06:38, dick balaska wrote:
>>> On 03/04/2018 08:53 PM, Mike Horvath wrote:
>>>> Is there a permanent way to set the processor affinity of the 
>>>> POV-Ray render processes? I can do this Process Hacker, but as soon 
>>>> as I minimize or exit Process Hacker, the changes are reversed.
>>>>
>>>> I would like to still be able to use my computer for other stuff 
>>>> while rendering, and setting the render priority isn't always enough.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Mike
>>>
>>> I always set it from Task Manager. Right click on the process and you 
>>> can change its affinity and priority.
>>>
>>
>> Task Manager works well for Windoze and Pov retains the affinity 
>> settings when it is closed but I have a feeling Mike uses Linux.
>>
> 
> Ah.
> 
> Wait. Why post this question in the windows group then? ;)
> 

Oh! That's a duh on my part. :-(

-- 

Regards
     Stephen

[dick balaska] Re: Processor affinity? [2975 days 6 hours and 17 minutes ago]

Mon, 5 Mar 2018 07:37:28 GMT

On 03/05/2018 02:17 AM, Stephen wrote:
> On 05/03/2018 06:38, dick balaska wrote:
>> On 03/04/2018 08:53 PM, Mike Horvath wrote:
>>> Is there a permanent way to set the processor affinity of the POV-Ray 
>>> render processes? I can do this Process Hacker, but as soon as I 
>>> minimize or exit Process Hacker, the changes are reversed.
>>>
>>> I would like to still be able to use my computer for other stuff 
>>> while rendering, and setting the render priority isn't always enough.
>>>
>>>
>>> Mike
>>
>> I always set it from Task Manager. Right click on the process and you 
>> can change its affinity and priority.
>>
> 
> Task Manager works well for Windoze and Pov retains the affinity 
> settings when it is closed but I have a feeling Mike uses Linux.
> 

Ah.

Wait. Why post this question in the windows group then? ;)

-- 
dik
Rendered 920576 of 921600 pixels (99%)

[Stephen] Re: Processor affinity? [2975 days 6 hours and 36 minutes ago]

Mon, 5 Mar 2018 07:17:54 GMT

On 05/03/2018 06:38, dick balaska wrote:
> On 03/04/2018 08:53 PM, Mike Horvath wrote:
>> Is there a permanent way to set the processor affinity of the POV-Ray 
>> render processes? I can do this Process Hacker, but as soon as I 
>> minimize or exit Process Hacker, the changes are reversed.
>>
>> I would like to still be able to use my computer for other stuff while 
>> rendering, and setting the render priority isn't always enough.
>>
>>
>> Mike
> 
> I always set it from Task Manager. Right click on the process and you 
> can change its affinity and priority.
> 

Task Manager works well for Windoze and Pov retains the affinity 
settings when it is closed but I have a feeling Mike uses Linux.

-- 

Regards
     Stephen

[dick balaska] Re: Processor affinity? [2975 days 7 hours and 15 minutes ago]

Mon, 5 Mar 2018 06:38:46 GMT

On 03/04/2018 08:53 PM, Mike Horvath wrote:
> Is there a permanent way to set the processor affinity of the POV-Ray 
> render processes? I can do this Process Hacker, but as soon as I 
> minimize or exit Process Hacker, the changes are reversed.
> 
> I would like to still be able to use my computer for other stuff while 
> rendering, and setting the render priority isn't always enough.
> 
> 
> Mike

I always set it from Task Manager. Right click on the process and you 
can change its affinity and priority.

-- 
dik
Rendered 920576 of 921600 pixels (99%)

[Mike Horvath] Processor affinity? [2975 days 12 hours and 1 minute ago]

Mon, 5 Mar 2018 01:53:21 GMT

Is there a permanent way to set the processor affinity of the POV-Ray 
render processes? I can do this Process Hacker, but as soon as I 
minimize or exit Process Hacker, the changes are reversed.

I would like to still be able to use my computer for other stuff while 
rendering, and setting the render priority isn't always enough.


Mike

[clipka] Re: Force save incomplete output? [2984 days 18 hours and 33 minutes ago]

Fri, 23 Feb 2018 19:20:44 GMT

Am 23.02.2018 um 12:58 schrieb Kenneth:
> clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
> 
>>
>> Nope.
> 
> IIRC, some older versions did... at least with Windows-specific .BMP renders
> (which is how I used to run POV-Ray.) Maybe 3.6.1 or 3.6.2? I remember stopping
> some time-consuming renders and taking a look at them. (But not partial PNG
> renders-- they didn't open. I'm guessing that some kind of 'header' file
> information was missing..) This was before the 'state' file implementation in
> 3.7.0(?)

v3.6 and earlier wrote image files "on the fly", leaving files
technically broken if render was aborted. However, depending on the file
format and reading application, such partial files could sometimes be
loaded in other applications.

At least that's what happened to my understanding. There may also have
been mechanisms in place that, when aborting a render, would just fill
the remainder of the file with black pixels to complete the image. But
in that case partial PNG files should have worked as well.

[Kenneth] Re: Force save incomplete output? [2984 days 23 hours and 4 minutes ago]

Fri, 23 Feb 2018 14:50:00 GMT

Alain <kua### [at] videotronca> wrote:
>  On 2/23/2018 6:58 AM, Kenneth wrote:
> > (But not partial PNG renders-- they didn't open.

> In my case, I was able to open incomplete renders saved as PNG with
> IrfanView. Some other viewers could have dificulty for those.
>

I was probably using just Windows Photo Viewer at the time (in Win XP), and/or
my old (and still old!) Photoshop.

[Alain] Re: Force save incomplete output? [2985 days and 8 minutes ago]

Fri, 23 Feb 2018 13:45:40 GMT

Le 18-02-23 Ã  08:25, Mike Horvath a Ã©critÂ :
> On 2/23/2018 6:58 AM, Kenneth wrote:
>> clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Nope.
>>
>> IIRC, some older versions did... at least with Windows-specific .BMP 
>> renders
>> (which is how I used to run POV-Ray.) Maybe 3.6.1 or 3.6.2? I remember 
>> stopping
>> some time-consuming renders and taking a look at them. (But not 
>> partial PNG
>> renders-- they didn't open. I'm guessing that some kind of 'header' file
>> information was missing..) This was before the 'state' file 
>> implementation in
>> 3.7.0(?)
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
> 
> 
> BMP is uncompressed, so I'm guessing each pixel is appended 
> sequentially, and a partial image will display by default.
> 
> PNG images are maybe compressed *after* all the pixels have been written.
> 
> Forcing output could still be done however. But continuing a stopped 
> render may no longer be possible afterward.
> 
> 
> Mike

Before 3.7, PNG images where compressed one line at a time. Render a 
line, compress THAT line, save to file with the previous lines.
In my case, I was able to open incomplete renders saved as PNG with 
IrfanView. Some other viewers could have dificulty for those.


Alain

[William F Pokorny] Re: Force save incomplete output? [2985 days and 20 minutes ago]

Fri, 23 Feb 2018 13:34:25 GMT

On 02/21/2018 06:31 AM, Mike Horvath wrote:
> Is there a way to force POV-Ray to save a render to disk, even though it 
> is incomplete?
> 
> 
> Mike

FYI:

https://github.com/POV-Ray/povray/issues/144

Bill P.

[Mike Horvath] Re: Force save incomplete output? [2985 days and 29 minutes ago]

Fri, 23 Feb 2018 13:24:50 GMT

On 2/23/2018 6:58 AM, Kenneth wrote:
> clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
> 
>>
>> Nope.
> 
> IIRC, some older versions did... at least with Windows-specific .BMP renders
> (which is how I used to run POV-Ray.) Maybe 3.6.1 or 3.6.2? I remember stopping
> some time-consuming renders and taking a look at them. (But not partial PNG
> renders-- they didn't open. I'm guessing that some kind of 'header' file
> information was missing..) This was before the 'state' file implementation in
> 3.7.0(?)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 

BMP is uncompressed, so I'm guessing each pixel is appended 
sequentially, and a partial image will display by default.

PNG images are maybe compressed *after* all the pixels have been written.

Forcing output could still be done however. But continuing a stopped 
render may no longer be possible afterward.

Mike

[Stephen] Re: Force save incomplete output? [2985 days and 36 minutes ago]

Fri, 23 Feb 2018 13:17:43 GMT

On 23/02/2018 11:58, Kenneth wrote:
> clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
> 
>>
>> Nope.
> 
> IIRC, some older versions did... at least with Windows-specific .BMP renders
> (which is how I used to run POV-Ray.) Maybe 3.6.1 or 3.6.2? I remember stopping
> some time-consuming renders and taking a look at them. (But not partial PNG
> renders-- they didn't open. I'm guessing that some kind of 'header' file
> information was missing..) This was before the 'state' file implementation in
> 3.7.0(?)


I seem to remember that too. Earlier than v3.6.2 I'm still running that 
for Bishop3D.



-- 

Regards
     Stephen

[Kenneth] Re: Force save incomplete output? [2985 days 1 hour and 54 minutes ago]

Fri, 23 Feb 2018 12:00:00 GMT

clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:

>
> Nope.

IIRC, some older versions did... at least with Windows-specific .BMP renders
(which is how I used to run POV-Ray.) Maybe 3.6.1 or 3.6.2? I remember stopping
some time-consuming renders and taking a look at them. (But not partial PNG
renders-- they didn't open. I'm guessing that some kind of 'header' file
information was missing..) This was before the 'state' file implementation in
3.7.0(?)

[clipka] Re: Force save incomplete output? [2986 days 20 hours and 52 minutes ago]

Wed, 21 Feb 2018 17:01:37 GMT

Am 21.02.2018 um 12:31 schrieb Mike Horvath:
> Is there a way to force POV-Ray to save a render to disk, even though it
> is incomplete?

Nope.

[Mike Horvath] Force save incomplete output? [2987 days 2 hours and 23 minutes ago]

Wed, 21 Feb 2018 11:31:33 GMT

Is there a way to force POV-Ray to save a render to disk, even though it 
is incomplete?


Mike

[Havana7] Re: Vs 2017 debug [2989 days 15 hours and 4 minutes ago]

Sun, 18 Feb 2018 22:50:00 GMT

clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
> - Can you successfully place breakpoints in the GUI version?

No, even in the GUI version it does not work.

> - Does the console project run without breakpoints set?

No. The command window opens but remains as black as it is. In the Relase
version everything works.

> - Can you give me a step-by-step description of what you're actually
> doing, i.e. how you're activating the console project in the first
> place, where you're setting breakpoints, how you're starting the
> project, what parameters you're passing, and whatnot?

I activated the console by selecting the project as initial, I modified the
windows \ povconfig \ syspovconfig.h file for the define. I cleaned the
solution, compiled, but it does not work.

Does anyone have any advice?

[clipka] Re: Vs 2017 debug [2990 days 1 hour and 32 minutes ago]

Sun, 18 Feb 2018 12:21:43 GMT

Am 18.02.2018 um 10:59 schrieb Havana7:
>> - Can you successfully place breakpoints in the GUI version?
> 
> No the window does not open and no breckpoint works

Can you successfully run the GUI debug version /without/ breakpoints set?

Either way, as long as you are having trouble running or debugging even
the GUI version of POV-Ray, it does not make sense trying to run or
debug the console version.

Since running and debugging the GUI version of POV-Ray in VS 2015 is a
routine thing and I'm not seeing any problems there, I suspect this to
be a problem specific to VS 2017, or even your installation thereof. I'd
therefore recommend seeking assistance from Microsoft or their community.

If running POV-Ray without breakpoints works fine, maybe the breakpoints
do work but the VS 2017 debugger isn't kicking in properly to take you
to the code being executed. That would explain the symptoms you are
reporting.


> I have a breackpoint in vfe / win / console / winconsole.cpp Main, I clean the
> solution, compile it and start debugging.
> 
> Nothing happens.

Try a breakpoint later in the program flow; I'd recommend
`parser_tokenizer.cpp`, about line 2633, right after
`CASE(DEBUG_TOKEN)`. This should cause the breakpoint to only be
triggered when a `#debug` statement in the scene file (or include file)
is encountered.

[Havana7] Re: Vs 2017 debug [2990 days 3 hours and 54 minutes ago]

Sun, 18 Feb 2018 10:00:01 GMT

> - Can you successfully place breakpoints in the GUI version?

No the window does not open and no breckpoint works

> - Does the console project run without breakpoints set?

No, Only the completely empty command window appears.

> - Can you give me a step-by-step description of what you're actually
> doing, i.e. how you're activating the console project in the first
> place, where you're setting breakpoints, how you're starting the
> project, what parameters you're passing, and whatnot?

I modify the windows / povconfig / syspovconfig.h file by editing the comment in
#define _CONSOLE. Set up console as a startup project, and choose Console
compilation management and deselect GUI.

I have a breackpoint in vfe / win / console / winconsole.cpp Main, I clean the
solution, compile it and start debugging.

Nothing happens.

> I myself am using VS 2015 instead of VS 2017, and haven't touched the
> console project in a while (it isn't officially supported), so without
> more detailed information, from my point it could be anything from a bug
> in VS 2017 to a problem with the console project to a simple user error.

The solution compile the console project perfectly in release mode.

Do you have any suggestions?

[Kenneth] Re: The question about depth image generation [2991 days 20 hours and 19 minutes ago]

Fri, 16 Feb 2018 17:35:06 GMT

clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:

> > This changes your scene's version number to 3.5, *if* you leave out
> > a #version directive in your scene...
>
> Actually pretty much the very opposite happens.
>
> The standard include files (including `colors.inc`) have the following
> structure:
>
>     #ifndef(Foo_Inc_Temp)
>     #declare Foo_Inc_Temp = version;
>     #version 3.5; // typical; value may differ
>     ...
>     #version Foo_Inc_Temp;
>     #end
>
> This structure is designed to reset the effective language version back
> to whatever it was before the include file.

Yep, I do understand that; but I didn't understand why the ending #version
statement was NOT changing it back (in the case when there was no #version
number in the scene file itself.) My only guess was, for some reason or other
the #version 'compatibility' was staying at 3.5. (Or maybe 3.62, as you
mentioned?) I didn't know how to explain that in detail :-)

BTW, I was running the examples in v3.7.1 beta 9, but adding #version 3.7 into
the scene instead (or not, to see the difference.) Just tried the scene using
#version 3.71 (or not); same behavior that I described. The other 'variable' was
assumed_gamma 1.0. Adding it to the scene -- even without a #version number--
fixed all the problems (no change in the gray color or gamma behavior, with or
without "colors.inc.") I think I understand that: The example code uses gradient
-z... which by default is using 'linear' rgb values... which agrees with
'linear' assumed_gamma 1.0 no matter what.

[clipka] Re: Vs 2017 debug [2991 days 21 hours and 7 minutes ago]

Fri, 16 Feb 2018 16:47:16 GMT

Am 16.02.2018 um 14:26 schrieb Havana7:
> clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
>> Am 15.02.2018 um 10:26 schrieb Havana7:
>>> I downloaded version 3.7.0 but I can not debug console project. I try to insert
>>> breakpoints in the console project but the window opens but remains black
>>> without any response. Do you have any advice on this? Thank you
>>
>> I don't think the v3.7.0 console project is even functional.
> 
> Sorry for the error, but I downloaded the master version. I tried with all but
> with Visual Studio 2017 Community they do not work.

- Can you successfully place breakpoints in the GUI version?

- Does the console project run without breakpoints set?

- Can you give me a step-by-step description of what you're actually
doing, i.e. how you're activating the console project in the first
place, where you're setting breakpoints, how you're starting the
project, what parameters you're passing, and whatnot?


I myself am using VS 2015 instead of VS 2017, and haven't touched the
console project in a while (it isn't officially supported), so without
more detailed information, from my point it could be anything from a bug
in VS 2017 to a problem with the console project to a simple user error.

[clipka] Re: The question about depth image generation [2991 days 21 hours and 17 minutes ago]

Fri, 16 Feb 2018 16:37:06 GMT

Am 16.02.2018 um 05:57 schrieb Kenneth:

> The "colors.inc" file has this at the top:
> #ifndef(Colors_Inc_Temp)
> #declare Colors_Inc_Temp = version;
> #version 3.5;
> ......
> 
> This changes your scene's version number to 3.5, *if* you leave out a #version
> directive in your scene. It looks like v3.5 of POV-ray used a different default
> 'gamma' value to apply to a scene's colors.

Actually pretty much the very opposite happens.

The standard include files (including `colors.inc`) have the following
structure:

    #ifndef(Foo_Inc_Temp)
    #declare Foo_Inc_Temp = version;
    #version 3.5; // typical; value may differ
    ...
    #version Foo_Inc_Temp;
    #end

This structure is designed to reset the effective language version back
to whatever it was before the include file.


There is a problem with this construct however: In v3.7.0, the effective
language version defaults to v3.6.2 for backwards compatibility, but the
`version` keyword, when used as an expression, defaults to the actual
software version, i.e. 3.7.

Thus, when a scene has no `#version` statement of its own and includes
one of the standard include files, the last `#version` statement in that
file does not reset the effective language version back to the default
of v3.6.2, but rather sets it to the actual software version, which is
v3.7.0 in that case.


This behaviour has been changed in later versions.

[Havana7] Re: Vs 2017 debug [2992 days and 24 minutes ago]

Fri, 16 Feb 2018 13:30:01 GMT

clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
> Am 15.02.2018 um 10:26 schrieb Havana7:
> > I downloaded version 3.7.0 but I can not debug console project. I try to insert
> > breakpoints in the console project but the window opens but remains black
> > without any response. Do you have any advice on this? Thank you
>
> I don't think the v3.7.0 console project is even functional.

Sorry for the error, but I downloaded the master version. I tried with all but
with Visual Studio 2017 Community they do not work.

[Havana7] Re: Vs 2017 debug [2992 days 6 hours and 39 minutes ago]

Fri, 16 Feb 2018 07:15:00 GMT

"Kenneth" <kdw### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
> Or, does you question relate to Visual Studio 2017, while using POV-ray's
> 'source code'? I apologize if I didn't understand your original message.

Sorry, but I'm referring to debugging in Visual Studio 2017!

[Kenneth] Re: The question about depth image generation [2992 days 8 hours and 54 minutes ago]

Fri, 16 Feb 2018 05:00:00 GMT

Did you leave out a #version directive at the top of your scene file AND the
assumed_gamma setting for your scene?

(Also: in my 'resolution INI file', I have Display_Gamma=sRGB and
File_Gamma=sRGB... both of which are the defaults, I think.)

What I see is that there is NO difference between these two, placed at the
beginning of your scene:

#version 3.7;
global_settings{assumed_gamma 1.0}

and

#version 3.7;
global_settings{assumed_gamma 1.0}
#include "colors.inc"

....But there IS a difference between these two:

NO #version directive
NO assumed_gamma

and

NO #version directive
NO assumed_gamma
#include "colors.inc"

I also see a difference between these two:

#version 3.7;
NO assumed_gamma
#include "colors.inc"

and

#version 3.5;
NO assumed_gamma
#include "colors.inc"


The "colors.inc" file has this at the top:
#ifndef(Colors_Inc_Temp)
#declare Colors_Inc_Temp = version;
#version 3.5;
.....

This changes your scene's version number to 3.5, *if* you leave out a #version
directive in your scene. It looks like v3.5 of POV-ray used a different default
'gamma' value to apply to a scene's colors.

[Hao] The question about depth image generation [2992 days 13 hours and 39 minutes ago]

Fri, 16 Feb 2018 00:15:00 GMT

I want to render the depth image of the scene. I follow the methods of :
'http://runevision.com/graphics/stereo/depthmap/'
This method is useful for some scenes. However, it is found that the color of
the rendered image changes when the "colors.inc" or other predefined inc files
are included. Could any one give me some suggestions?
The codes of 'http://runevision.com/graphics/stereo/depthmap/' are,

object {
  sphere{-z*20 10}
    texture {
      pigment {gradient -z}
      scale 40
      finish {ambient 1 diffuse 0}
      }

}
camera{
 perspective
 location <0,0,0>
 direction -z
}

Using this code, the color of the central pixel equal approximately about
255*(10/40)=64.
However, if the 'color.inc', 'functions.inc' or other inc files are included at
the begining of the file, the color of rendered image changes.

Does anyone know why?

[clipka] Re: Vs 2017 debug [2992 days 19 hours and 55 minutes ago]

Thu, 15 Feb 2018 17:59:07 GMT

Am 15.02.2018 um 10:26 schrieb Havana7:
> I downloaded version 3.7.0 but I can not debug console project. I try to insert
> breakpoints in the console project but the window opens but remains black
> without any response. Do you have any advice on this? Thank you

I don't think the v3.7.0 console project is even functional.

[Kenneth] Re: Vs 2017 debug [2993 days and 39 minutes ago]

Thu, 15 Feb 2018 13:15:00 GMT

Or, does you question relate to Visual Studio 2017, while using POV-ray's
'source code'? I apologize if I didn't understand your original message.

[Kenneth] Re: Vs 2017 debug [2993 days and 49 minutes ago]

Thu, 15 Feb 2018 13:05:00 GMT

Also see this in the newsgroup, for a detailed explanation...

http://news.povray.org/povray.beta-test/thread/%3Cweb.596dfc7892f71496883fb31c0%40news.povray.org%3E/

[Kenneth] Re: Vs 2017 debug [2993 days and 54 minutes ago]

Thu, 15 Feb 2018 13:00:01 GMT

It is a known problem (or behavior) with #debug and the message window.

#debug "This is my message"
....will NOT show up in the 'messages' window, even though it should do so. It
needs to have a 'line break' at the end   \n  like this:

#debug "This is my message\n"

Here is another example that also works, because it uses more than one #debug:
#debug "This is my message" // no \n  here this time-- but it WILL show up now,
// because the 2nd #debug *does* use \n
#declare FOO = 347.188;
#debug concat("\n","FOO = ", str(FOO,0,3),"\n")

It is complicated! ;-)

[Havana7] Vs 2017 debug [2993 days 4 hours and 24 minutes ago]

Thu, 15 Feb 2018 09:30:01 GMT

I downloaded version 3.7.0 but I can not debug console project. I try to insert
breakpoints in the console project but the window opens but remains black
without any response. Do you have any advice on this? Thank you

[clipka] Re: Opens two files separately. Opens more than ... [3017 days 16 hours and 57 minutes ago]

Sun, 21 Jan 2018 20:57:36 GMT

Am 21.01.2018 um 18:08 schrieb Mike Horvath:

> Oops. Wrong forum.

Not really. povray.bugreports is about bugs, povray.windows is about the
Windows version of POV-Ray. Your post is about a bug specific to the
Windows version, so that's right in the center of the Venn diagram.

[Mike Horvath] Re: Opens two files separately. Opens more than ... [3017 days 20 hours and 45 minutes ago]

Sun, 21 Jan 2018 17:08:43 GMT

On 1/21/2018 12:07 PM, Mike Horvath wrote:
> Weird issue with
> 
> Persistence of Vision(tm) Ray Tracer Version 
> 3.8.0-alpha.9475849+av541.msvc14.win64
> 
> and maybe earlier.
> 
> In Windows explorer I can select two POV files, then right click on one 
> of them and select "Edit in POVray". However, two separate instances of 
> POVray are created, with one file in each.
> 
> if you instead select three (or more) POV files and "Edit in POVray", 
> all three files are opened in the same instance.
> 
> 
> Mike

Oops. Wrong forum.


Mike

[Mike Horvath] Opens two files separately. Opens more than two ... [3017 days 20 hours and 47 minutes ago]

Sun, 21 Jan 2018 17:07:07 GMT

Weird issue with

Persistence of Vision(tm) Ray Tracer Version 
3.8.0-alpha.9475849+av541.msvc14.win64

and maybe earlier.

In Windows explorer I can select two POV files, then right click on one 
of them and select "Edit in POVray". However, two separate instances of 
POVray are created, with one file in each.

if you instead select three (or more) POV files and "Edit in POVray", 
all three files are opened in the same instance.


Mike

[Sven Littkowski] Re: POV-Ray Editors [3075 days 14 hours and 1 minute ago]

Fri, 24 Nov 2017 23:53:30 GMT

On 05.09.2017 11:01, Bald Eagle wrote:
> More info:
> https://github.com/h-a-n-n-e-s/atom-language-povray/issues/1
> 
> https://atom.io/packages/tools-povray
> 
> 
> 
Thanks!

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[Bald Eagle] Re: POV-Ray Editors [3155 days 22 hours and 49 minutes ago]

Tue, 5 Sep 2017 15:05:00 GMT

More info:
https://github.com/h-a-n-n-e-s/atom-language-povray/issues/1

https://atom.io/packages/tools-povray

[Bald Eagle] Re: POV-Ray Editors [3155 days 23 hours and 9 minutes ago]

Tue, 5 Sep 2017 14:45:01 GMT

If I get a chance to do so, I might try to install this at home tonight and see
how it goes:

https://atom.io/

"Atom is a text editor that's modern, approachable, yet hackable to the core—a
tool you can customize to do anything but also use productively without ever
touching a config file."

[Mr] Re: POV-Ray Editors [3164 days 4 hours and 19 minutes ago]

Mon, 28 Aug 2017 09:35:00 GMT

"Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
> "Mr" <nomail@nomail> wrote:
>
> > The release candidate 2 of Blender 2.79 has our latest patch for POV syntax
> > highlighting in:
> >
> > https://download.blender.org/release/Blender2.79/
> >
> > When you put your cursor next to a {} brace sign, it highlights in red the
> > corresponding pair of braces. Lanuhum and I added one more color than POVwin, so
> > "transforming" keywords are distinguished from objects, and in the same color
> > group as mathematical functions.
> > All this looks perfect for your need. And possibly of some others users.
> > I added a "run" operator to render a preview of edited text only regardless of
> > Blender 3D scene. Also note that another add-on exists that can enable
> > auto-completion and I successfully tried it with POV files.
>
>
> Thanks!
> This looks like something which is useful, and I'll have to see about installing
> it and trying it out.
>
> By the way:
> "Pov items can be anything but for now only the equivalent of Blender materials
> can be replaced with this method. In Povray, it is called texture {} don't get
> confused, it really includes all the material properties."
>
> Don't forget that POV-Ray also has an actual material{} directive...

I did not forget, but since the exporter doesn't make use of it, I decided to
keep things more simple in this explanation so as to not confuse Blender users
further (the developer page linked at the top of the wiki mentions it however)
The  problem goes much deeper than just differing terminologies.

In pov, the texture syntax is non standard as Blender's user interface used to
be before the rewrite ;-)
mostly, texture influences are not channelled in parallel user workflows
except for normal_map and image_map, ior are object related while they can be
texture related in Blender. etc.

[Bald Eagle] Re: POV-Ray Editors [3169 days 20 hours and 54 minutes ago]

Tue, 22 Aug 2017 17:00:01 GMT

"Mr" <nomail@nomail> wrote:

> The release candidate 2 of Blender 2.79 has our latest patch for POV syntax
> highlighting in:
>
> https://download.blender.org/release/Blender2.79/
>
> When you put your cursor next to a {} brace sign, it highlights in red the
> corresponding pair of braces. Lanuhum and I added one more color than POVwin, so
> "transforming" keywords are distinguished from objects, and in the same color
> group as mathematical functions.
> All this looks perfect for your need. And possibly of some others users.
> I added a "run" operator to render a preview of edited text only regardless of
> Blender 3D scene. Also note that another add-on exists that can enable
> auto-completion and I successfully tried it with POV files.

Thanks!
This looks like something which is useful, and I'll have to see about installing
it and trying it out.

By the way:
"Pov items can be anything but for now only the equivalent of Blender materials
can be replaced with this method. In Povray, it is called texture {} don't get
confused, it really includes all the material properties."

Don't forget that POV-Ray also has an actual material{} directive...

[Mr] Re: POV-Ray Editors [3170 days 5 hours and 34 minutes ago]

Tue, 22 Aug 2017 08:20:00 GMT

"Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
> clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
>
> > You can use /any/ text editor capable of saving plain vanilla ASCII
> > text. You could even use MS Word for that purpose.
> >
> > A text editor capable of syntax highlighting would be of advantage of
> > course. But you may need to roll your own highlighting rules.
>
>
> Yes, indeed.
> Te one thing I would find VERY useful is some sort of editor that has
> differential coloring of nested parentheses for mathematical formulae.
>
> Debugging those can drive me a little nuts sometimes.
>
> Does anyone have a [preferably small, lightweight, free] 3rd party editor that
> would work well for this?
> I suppose if I need to, I could use Excel...

The release candidate 2 of Blender 2.79 has our latest patch for POV syntax
highlighting in:

https://download.blender.org/release/Blender2.79/

When you put your cursor next to a {} brace sign, it highlights in red the
corresponding pair of braces. Lanuhum and I added one more color than POVwin, so
"transforming" keywords are distinguished from objects, and in the same color
group as mathematical functions.
All this looks perfect for your need. And possibly of some others users.
I added a "run" operator to render a preview of edited text only regardless of
Blender 3D scene. Also note that another add-on exists that can enable
auto-completion and I successfully tried it with POV files.

See the wiki for screen captures cluing how to use pov colored syntax in blender
(file suffixes are recognized automatically):
https://wiki.blender.org/index.php/Extensions:2.6/Py/Scripts/Render/POV-Ray#Adding_POV_code_directly

Please note that, as of today, Lanuhum and I are Python scripters (and I a lame
one!)yet we tried to mimic existing C code and successfully dared to submit this
C patch which is not our language, but was still accepted by the main Blender
developers, I mean to say that if you really preferred such changes to happen in
Povwin and the likes, don't be scared to try !

Otherwise of course, just tell us what's wrong with it in our Blender's
implementation, and we'll try to improve it based on your feedback. Thanks!

[Sven Littkowski] Re: POV-Ray Editors [3170 days 11 hours and 7 minutes ago]

Tue, 22 Aug 2017 02:47:16 GMT

On 04.08.2017 14:10, Bald Eagle wrote:
> clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
> 
>> You can use /any/ text editor capable of saving plain vanilla ASCII
>> text. You could even use MS Word for that purpose.
>>
>> A text editor capable of syntax highlighting would be of advantage of
>> course. But you may need to roll your own highlighting rules.
> 
> 
> Yes, indeed.
> Te one thing I would find VERY useful is some sort of editor that has
> differential coloring of nested parentheses for mathematical formulae.
> 
> Debugging those can drive me a little nuts sometimes.
> 
> Does anyone have a [preferably small, lightweight, free] 3rd party editor
 that
> would work well for this?
> I suppose if I need to, I could use Excel...
> 
> 
Weaverslave?

---
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[Bald Eagle] Re: POV-Ray Editors [3187 days 19 hours and 39 minutes ago]

Fri, 4 Aug 2017 18:15:06 GMT

clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:

> You can use /any/ text editor capable of saving plain vanilla ASCII
> text. You could even use MS Word for that purpose.
>
> A text editor capable of syntax highlighting would be of advantage of
> course. But you may need to roll your own highlighting rules.

Yes, indeed.
Te one thing I would find VERY useful is some sort of editor that has
differential coloring of nested parentheses for mathematical formulae.

Debugging those can drive me a little nuts sometimes.

Does anyone have a [preferably small, lightweight, free] 3rd party editor that
would work well for this?
I suppose if I need to, I could use Excel...

[Sven Littkowski] Re: POV-Ray Editors [3194 days 6 hours and 23 minutes ago]

Sat, 29 Jul 2017 07:30:41 GMT

On 27.07.2017 06:56, clipka wrote:
> Am 27.07.2017 um 05:19 schrieb Sven Littkowski:
> 
>> At the moment, I work with gray background, but this one and any other
>> background just looks not right. Since I do software programming, I work

>> since over 20 years with my own standard colors for the one or other
>> thing inside a syntax. But I cannot use "my" custom colors with the
>> editor at the moment. Thus I am not able to recognize things inside a
>> POV-Ray syntax based on the color code. Why such a big discussion about
>> such a small additional feature? It is not really difficult to add that
>> feature.
> 
> Well then... if you find the feature not really difficult to add, I
> recommend you implement those changes yourself, and license them to us
> under the old POV-Ray v3.6 license.
> 
> Our version of the proprietary 3rd party CodeMax library has remained
> virtually unchanged from POV-Ray v3.6 (except for bug fixes), so you can
> use the CodeMax source code from the POV-Ray v3.6 package as a starting
> point for your development.
> 
Just make it Delphi source code, and I will do this. It would be my
pleasure. And I have no problem to license it to the great POV-Ray team.

But I cannot program in other languages than Delphi (Pascal).

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[clipka] Re: POV-Ray Editors [3196 days 2 hours and 58 minutes ago]

Thu, 27 Jul 2017 10:56:22 GMT

Am 27.07.2017 um 05:19 schrieb Sven Littkowski:

> At the moment, I work with gray background, but this one and any other
> background just looks not right. Since I do software programming, I work
> since over 20 years with my own standard colors for the one or other
> thing inside a syntax. But I cannot use "my" custom colors with the
> editor at the moment. Thus I am not able to recognize things inside a
> POV-Ray syntax based on the color code. Why such a big discussion about
> such a small additional feature? It is not really difficult to add that
> feature.

Well then... if you find the feature not really difficult to add, I
recommend you implement those changes yourself, and license them to us
under the old POV-Ray v3.6 license.

Our version of the proprietary 3rd party CodeMax library has remained
virtually unchanged from POV-Ray v3.6 (except for bug fixes), so you can
use the CodeMax source code from the POV-Ray v3.6 package as a starting
point for your development.

[Stephen] Re: POV-Ray Editors [3196 days 7 hours and 4 minutes ago]

Thu, 27 Jul 2017 06:50:30 GMT

On 7/27/2017 4:19 AM, Sven Littkowski wrote:
> On 25.07.2017 09:02, Stephen wrote:
>> On 7/25/2017 1:54 PM, Stephen wrote:
>>> I am guess he is aware of how to
>>
>> Should read I guess he is...
>>
>>
>> It's not just my fingers playing up today. I'm beginning to hate
>> Thunderbird with its fancy skins.
>>
>
> At the moment, I work with gray background, but this one and any other
> background just looks not right. Since I do software programming, I work
> since over 20 years with my own standard colors for the one or other
> thing inside a syntax. But I cannot use "my" custom colors with the
> editor at the moment. Thus I am not able to recognize things inside a
> POV-Ray syntax based on the color code. Why such a big discussion about
> such a small additional feature? It is not really difficult to add that
> feature.
>

I must admit I was wrong. I thought the editor was configurable. I 
suppose it is, in a way. But reminiscent of the way DOS programs looked. 
It is so long since I looked at the settings I was remembering how I 
felt about them, then.
So I support your feature request.
But, if memory serves me well. There is no one to do it. The Pov team 
are all working on other things and your request is cosmetic.
So unless you can hack the editor code. The only other thing to do is 
keep nagging until one of them gets sick enough of it to add a custom 
colour into the list. That's how it was done in days of yore. ;)

-- 

Regards
     Stephen

[Sven Littkowski] Re: POV-Ray Editors [3196 days 9 hours and 35 minutes ago]

Thu, 27 Jul 2017 04:19:32 GMT

On 25.07.2017 09:02, Stephen wrote:
> On 7/25/2017 1:54 PM, Stephen wrote:
>> I am guess he is aware of how to
> 
> Should read I guess he is...
> 
> 
> It's not just my fingers playing up today. I'm beginning to hate
> Thunderbird with its fancy skins.
> 

At the moment, I work with gray background, but this one and any other
background just looks not right. Since I do software programming, I work
since over 20 years with my own standard colors for the one or other
thing inside a syntax. But I cannot use "my" custom colors with the
editor at the moment. Thus I am not able to recognize things inside a
POV-Ray syntax based on the color code. Why such a big discussion about
such a small additional feature? It is not really difficult to add that
feature.

---
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[Stephen] Re: POV-Ray Editors [3198 days and 51 minutes ago]

Tue, 25 Jul 2017 13:02:57 GMT

On 7/25/2017 1:54 PM, Stephen wrote:
> I am guess he is aware of how to

Should read I guess he is...


It's not just my fingers playing up today. I'm beginning to hate 
Thunderbird with its fancy skins.

-- 

Regards
     Stephen

[Stephen] Re: POV-Ray Editors [3198 days 1 hour ago]

Tue, 25 Jul 2017 12:54:03 GMT

On 7/25/2017 12:16 PM, Thomas de Groot wrote:
> On 25-7-2017 10:39, Sven Littkowski wrote:
>> I don't complain about any other faults of the editor, I rather like it.
>> A few ideas, however, i have suggested many months or over a year ago.
>>
>> But the improvement about customization (colors), I would really be
>> happy to see that. As i said before: based on my Windows 7 color scheme,
>> those few colors of the editor just don't look good or have too low
>> contrast towards the Windows environment. I really beg for a color
>> picker.
>>
>> ---
>> Diese E-Mail wurde von AVG auf Viren geprÃƒÂ¼ft.
>> http://www.avg.com
>>
>
> I don't know. Using a Win7 environment myself, I am quite happy with the
> (standard) colour scheme proposed. What is the problem?
>

Win7 here too. I always use a plain interface, myself. But I can see the 
requirement to have a fancy border. If that's what Sven means?
I am guess he is aware of how to customise the font, colour, shortcuts 
etc. There was some discussion about being able to use Truetype or 
Cleartype fonts a while back but we got a definitive answer with 
reasons. So it can't be that.

-- 

Regards
     Stephen

[Thomas de Groot] Re: POV-Ray Editors [3198 days 2 hours and 37 minutes ago]

Tue, 25 Jul 2017 11:16:51 GMT

On 25-7-2017 10:39, Sven Littkowski wrote:
> I don't complain about any other faults of the editor, I rather like it.
> A few ideas, however, i have suggested many months or over a year ago.
> 
> But the improvement about customization (colors), I would really be
> happy to see that. As i said before: based on my Windows 7 color scheme,
> those few colors of the editor just don't look good or have too low
> contrast towards the Windows environment. I really beg for a color picker.
> 
> ---
> Diese E-Mail wurde von AVG auf Viren geprÃƒÂ¼ft.
> http://www.avg.com
> 

I don't know. Using a Win7 environment myself, I am quite happy with the 
(standard) colour scheme proposed. What is the problem?

-- 
Thomas

[Stephen] Re: POV-Ray Editors [3198 days 5 hours and 3 minutes ago]

Tue, 25 Jul 2017 08:50:42 GMT

On 7/25/2017 9:39 AM, Sven Littkowski wrote:
> I don't complain about any other faults of the editor, I rather like it.
> A few ideas, however, i have suggested many months or over a year ago.
>

It surprised me yesterday. It did a "Find & Replace" on an almost 800 
Meg text file.
None of my other text editors could handle the file.

-- 

Regards
     Stephen

[Sven Littkowski] Re: POV-Ray Editors [3198 days 5 hours and 15 minutes ago]

Tue, 25 Jul 2017 08:39:01 GMT

On 14.07.2017 11:25, clipka wrote:
> Am 14.07.2017 um 09:53 schrieb Sven Littkowski:
> 
>> the current editor for the Windows version of POV-Ray is quite good, but

>> the only major lack it has is, that it comes only with 16 predefined
>> colors for usage within the editor. And most of these colors I don't
>> like, as they simply don't work well with the color scheme my Windows 7
>> is using.
> 
> POV-Ray for Windows has multiple major lacks, but I wouldn't consider
> this one of them. There are more serious problems.
> 
>> Can't the developers add support for True Color to the editor? That
>> would be nice.
>>
>> Or are there any other scene editors that can be integrated into the
>> Windows version of POV-Ray and allow a syntax with True Colors?
> 
> To the best of my knowledge, the editor colour picker is an integral
> part of CodeMax, which is a poor fit for the POV-Ray project, if only
> due to the licensing issues, so presumably we won't invest any
> noteworthy amount of work into it.
> 
> CodeMax is the only editor component the Windows GUI is designed to work
> with, and the Windows GUI itself is horribly outdated in itself, so
> presumably we won't invest a lot of work into that one either.
> 
> If we find the time to do any serious GUI development work, the plan is
> to build a new one from scratch, using a portable GUI framework as the
> basis (Qt comes to mind).
> 
I don't complain about any other faults of the editor, I rather like it.
A few ideas, however, i have suggested many months or over a year ago.

But the improvement about customization (colors), I would really be
happy to see that. As i said before: based on my Windows 7 color scheme,
those few colors of the editor just don't look good or have too low
contrast towards the Windows environment. I really beg for a color picker.

---
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[clipka] Re: POV-Ray Editors [3206 days 17 hours and 35 minutes ago]

Sun, 16 Jul 2017 20:19:26 GMT

Am 14.07.2017 um 20:06 schrieb Bald Eagle:
> Is there any chance that something like an in-browser text editor could be used?
> There seem to be quite a few of them.
> Not sure how that would all work out with backwards-compatibility and whatnot.
> 
> https://www.google.com/search?q=browser+text+editor
> 
> I've always desired something like RTF, but I know how desirable it is to have a
> simple text-only input for creating a render...

You can use /any/ text editor capable of saving plain vanilla ASCII
text. You could even use MS Word for that purpose.

A text editor capable of syntax highlighting would be of advantage of
course. But you may need to roll your own highlighting rules.

The difference of course is that it won't be an inbuilt editor, so
starting a render will be a bit more complex than just a button press.

[Bald Eagle] Re: POV-Ray Editors [3208 days 19 hours and 44 minutes ago]

Fri, 14 Jul 2017 18:10:03 GMT

Is there any chance that something like an in-browser text editor could be used?
There seem to be quite a few of them.
Not sure how that would all work out with backwards-compatibility and whatnot.

https://www.google.com/search?q=browser+text+editor

I've always desired something like RTF, but I know how desirable it is to have a
simple text-only input for creating a render...

[clipka] Re: POV-Ray Editors [3208 days 22 hours and 28 minutes ago]

Fri, 14 Jul 2017 15:25:51 GMT

Am 14.07.2017 um 09:53 schrieb Sven Littkowski:

> the current editor for the Windows version of POV-Ray is quite good, but
> the only major lack it has is, that it comes only with 16 predefined
> colors for usage within the editor. And most of these colors I don't
> like, as they simply don't work well with the color scheme my Windows 7
> is using.

POV-Ray for Windows has multiple major lacks, but I wouldn't consider
this one of them. There are more serious problems.

> Can't the developers add support for True Color to the editor? That
> would be nice.
> 
> Or are there any other scene editors that can be integrated into the
> Windows version of POV-Ray and allow a syntax with True Colors?

To the best of my knowledge, the editor colour picker is an integral
part of CodeMax, which is a poor fit for the POV-Ray project, if only
due to the licensing issues, so presumably we won't invest any
noteworthy amount of work into it.

CodeMax is the only editor component the Windows GUI is designed to work
with, and the Windows GUI itself is horribly outdated in itself, so
presumably we won't invest a lot of work into that one either.

If we find the time to do any serious GUI development work, the plan is
to build a new one from scratch, using a portable GUI framework as the
basis (Qt comes to mind).

[Sven Littkowski] POV-Ray Editors [3209 days 5 hours ago]

Fri, 14 Jul 2017 08:53:40 GMT

Hi,

the current editor for the Windows version of POV-Ray is quite good, but
the only major lack it has is, that it comes only with 16 predefined
colors for usage within the editor. And most of these colors I don't
like, as they simply don't work well with the color scheme my Windows 7
is using.

Can't the developers add support for True Color to the editor? That
would be nice.

Or are there any other scene editors that can be integrated into the
Windows version of POV-Ray and allow a syntax with True Colors?

Thank you.

---
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[qingshu] Re: compile povray3.62 source code with problem [3211 days 7 hours and 4 minutes ago]

Wed, 12 Jul 2017 06:50:01 GMT

clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
> Am 10.07.2017 um 16:10 schrieb qingshu:
> > Hello everyone:
> >  I opened project built in vs2008 in source code files to compile it. But i got
> > some error messages. I defined DISTRIBUTION_MESSAGE_2 in optout.h. There still
> > some errors like:
> > 1>d:\povray3.6\povwin-3.62\libraries\png\png.h(474) : fatal error C1083: Cannot
> > open include file: 'zlib.h': No such file or directory
> >
> >  However, the file zlib.h can be found in povwin-3.62\libraries\zlib. So, how
> > can i fix this problem. By the way, where can i find the document describing the
> > compile steps.
>
> From a quick look at the source code package, it seems to me that the VS
> 2008 project files were poorly maintained. While the `libpng.vcproj` for
> VS 2005 lists `..\..\libraries\zlib` as an additional include directory,
> the corresponding project for VS 2008 doesn't.
>
> My guess is that the dev team primarily used VS 2005 back then, and only
> tested on VS 2008 on rare occasions. An update to libPNG might have
> introduced a new dependency on ZLib, which might have gotten fixed in
> the VS 2005 libPNG project but forgotten in the one for VS 2008. I
> wouldn't be surprised if there were other pitfalls lurking in the VS
> 2008 project files.
>
> My personal recommendation would therefore be to try and convert the VS
> 2005 project files to VS 2008 (or use VS 2005 in the first place if you
> can get hold of a copy); or, if you have access to a good diff tool and
> can find your way around `.vcproj` files in a text editor, try to
> synchronize the VS 2008 project files with the VS 2005 ones.
>
>
> As an entirely different alternative, presuming you're using Windows 10,
> you might try Microsoft's "Windows Subsystem for Linux", which is
> essentially a Unix-ish command-line environment running on Windows. It
> comes with a C/C++ compiler, and since it works fine building (and
> running) POV-Ray 3.7 for Unix, chances are it might also work with a
> Unix source code package of POV-Ray 3.6. The Unix version does not come
> with a GUI though.

Thank you very much. The project in vs2005 works.

[clipka] Re: compile povray3.62 source code with problem [3212 days 22 hours and 1 minute ago]

Mon, 10 Jul 2017 15:53:06 GMT

Am 10.07.2017 um 16:10 schrieb qingshu:
> Hello everyone:
>  I opened project built in vs2008 in source code files to compile it. But i got
> some error messages. I defined DISTRIBUTION_MESSAGE_2 in optout.h. There still
> some errors like:
> 1>d:\povray3.6\povwin-3.62\libraries\png\png.h(474) : fatal error C1083: Cannot
> open include file: 'zlib.h': No such file or directory
> 
>  However, the file zlib.h can be found in povwin-3.62\libraries\zlib. So, how
> can i fix this problem. By the way, where can i find the document describing the
> compile steps.

From a quick look at the source code package, it seems to me that the VS
2008 project files were poorly maintained. While the `libpng.vcproj` for
VS 2005 lists `..\..\libraries\zlib` as an additional include directory,
the corresponding project for VS 2008 doesn't.

My guess is that the dev team primarily used VS 2005 back then, and only
tested on VS 2008 on rare occasions. An update to libPNG might have
introduced a new dependency on ZLib, which might have gotten fixed in
the VS 2005 libPNG project but forgotten in the one for VS 2008. I
wouldn't be surprised if there were other pitfalls lurking in the VS
2008 project files.

My personal recommendation would therefore be to try and convert the VS
2005 project files to VS 2008 (or use VS 2005 in the first place if you
can get hold of a copy); or, if you have access to a good diff tool and
can find your way around `.vcproj` files in a text editor, try to
synchronize the VS 2008 project files with the VS 2005 ones.


As an entirely different alternative, presuming you're using Windows 10,
you might try Microsoft's "Windows Subsystem for Linux", which is
essentially a Unix-ish command-line environment running on Windows. It
comes with a C/C++ compiler, and since it works fine building (and
running) POV-Ray 3.7 for Unix, chances are it might also work with a
Unix source code package of POV-Ray 3.6. The Unix version does not come
with a GUI though.

[qingshu] compile povray3.62 source code with problem [3212 days 23 hours and 39 minutes ago]

Mon, 10 Jul 2017 14:15:01 GMT

Hello everyone:
 I opened project built in vs2008 in source code files to compile it. But i got
some error messages. I defined DISTRIBUTION_MESSAGE_2 in optout.h. There still
some errors like:
1>d:\povray3.6\povwin-3.62\libraries\png\png.h(474) : fatal error C1083: Cannot
open include file: 'zlib.h': No such file or directory

 However, the file zlib.h can be found in povwin-3.62\libraries\zlib. So, how
can i fix this problem. By the way, where can i find the document describing the
compile steps.

Thanks!

[clipka] Re: How to uninstall? [3217 days 5 hours and 55 minutes ago]

Thu, 6 Jul 2017 07:59:35 GMT

Am 06.07.2017 um 07:25 schrieb Mike Horvath:
> Can I write a wiki article on how to properly install POV-Ray? Where in
> the wiki should it go?

You may want to ask this on the `povray.documentation.inbuilt` newsgroup.

[Mike Horvath] Re: How to uninstall? [3217 days 8 hours and 29 minutes ago]

Thu, 6 Jul 2017 05:24:54 GMT

On 6/23/2017 6:01 PM, clipka wrote:
> Am 23.06.2017 um 22:51 schrieb Mike Horvath:
> 
>> Next, I tried installing RC1 using my non-admin account, but the
>> installation failed when trying to write to "C:\Program
>> Files\POV-Ray\v3.7\agpl-3.0.txt". After switching to my admin account,
>> the installation completed successfully, but did not copy the Start Menu
>> items and assorted include files to my non-admin accounts. Is there no
>> way to install POV-Ray for all users?
> 
> No, not really. This is a systematic issue with modern Windows (and any
> multi-user system, actually), where technically the user-modifiable
> portions of any given program need to be installed for each user
> individually.
> 
> To my knowledge, running "pvengine.exe /INSTALL" should perform this
> step for the current user.
> 
> Theoretically there would be a way to "advertise" this step during
> installation, i.e. make it known to Windows so that it can automatically
> be executed when a user runs POV-Ray for the first time, but that's
> tricky to do, and might not be possible with the Nullsoft Installer
> System (NSIS) we're using to create the installer.
> 
> The alternative would be to let POV-Ray test whether it is being run by
> the user for the first time, and in that case perform the step
> automatically, but again this needs some time and effort to implement
> cleanly.
> 

Can I write a wiki article on how to properly install POV-Ray? Where in 
the wiki should it go?


Mike

[Mike Horvath] Re: How to uninstall? [3217 days 9 hours and 3 minutes ago]

Thu, 6 Jul 2017 04:50:43 GMT

On 7/4/2017 3:08 AM, clipka wrote:
> Am 04.07.2017 um 04:03 schrieb Mike Horvath:
> 
>>>> Further, even if this worked, it would not help when using the File >
>>>> Open command inside POV-Ray.
>>>
>>> If you were relying on UAC rather than the outdated (for end users)
>>> approach of using separate accounts, you wouldn't have that problem:
>>> You'd click on the other user's directory, would be prompted with a UAC
>>> dialog, and be perfectly fine.
>>
>> This is a security/privacy issue. User B gets access to all documents
>> belonging to User A, whether they have anything to do with POV-Ray or not.
> 
> If you are an admin of a computer that may be used by multiple users,
> then I agree, admin/user separation makes sense in that case.
> 
> But in that case you also should have enough background knowledge to
> work around the problems that you're presented with when installing
> POV-Ray in such a setting.
> 
> 
> That doesn't mean that the POV-Ray installer is perfect. But it means
> that I think you should be less vocal in your complaining about it.
> 

Well, when trying to figure this out for myself I have gotten mostly 
non-helpful suggestions that don't work in my OS.


Mike

[Mike Horvath] Re: How to uninstall? [3217 days 9 hours and 9 minutes ago]

Thu, 6 Jul 2017 04:45:28 GMT

On 7/4/2017 3:08 AM, clipka wrote:
> Am 04.07.2017 um 04:09 schrieb Mike Horvath:
>> On 7/3/2017 3:38 AM, clipka wrote:
>>>> Every other program ever has asked me for privileges during installation
>>>> if needed.
>>>
>>> Virtually no installer does that. Most rely on the operating system
>>> asking you for privileges /before/ the installer actually runs.
>>>
>>
>> Why not also the POV-Ray installer? Can't it also advertise that it
>> needs elevated privileges?
> 
> It does.
> 

Couldn't it also advertise this to non-admins?

Mike

[clipka] Re: How to uninstall? [3219 days 6 hours and 45 minutes ago]

Tue, 4 Jul 2017 07:08:52 GMT

Am 04.07.2017 um 04:09 schrieb Mike Horvath:
> On 7/3/2017 3:38 AM, clipka wrote:
>>> Every other program ever has asked me for privileges during installation
>>> if needed.
>>
>> Virtually no installer does that. Most rely on the operating system
>> asking you for privileges /before/ the installer actually runs.
>>
> 
> Why not also the POV-Ray installer? Can't it also advertise that it
> needs elevated privileges?

It does.

[clipka] Re: How to uninstall? [3219 days 6 hours and 46 minutes ago]

Tue, 4 Jul 2017 07:08:24 GMT

Am 04.07.2017 um 04:03 schrieb Mike Horvath:

>>> Further, even if this worked, it would not help when using the File >
>>> Open command inside POV-Ray.
>>
>> If you were relying on UAC rather than the outdated (for end users)
>> approach of using separate accounts, you wouldn't have that problem:
>> You'd click on the other user's directory, would be prompted with a UAC
>> dialog, and be perfectly fine.
> 
> This is a security/privacy issue. User B gets access to all documents
> belonging to User A, whether they have anything to do with POV-Ray or not.

If you are an admin of a computer that may be used by multiple users,
then I agree, admin/user separation makes sense in that case.

But in that case you also should have enough background knowledge to
work around the problems that you're presented with when installing
POV-Ray in such a setting.


That doesn't mean that the POV-Ray installer is perfect. But it means
that I think you should be less vocal in your complaining about it.

[Mike Horvath] Re: How to uninstall? [3219 days 10 hours and 56 minutes ago]

Tue, 4 Jul 2017 02:58:17 GMT

On 7/3/2017 10:43 PM, Mike Horvath wrote:
> On 6/28/2017 4:30 PM, clipka wrote:
>> Am 28.06.2017 um 20:50 schrieb Mike Horvath:
>>> On 6/28/2017 12:28 PM, clipka wrote:
>>>> But it doesn't make much sense to offer an "install for all users"
>>>> option if that only installs start menu shortcuts without a 
>>>> mechanism to
>>>> distribute the actual user-modifiable files to all users, as such an
>>>> option would be seriously misleading.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Not informing users that they can't install POV-Ray for non-admin
>>> accounts is also seriously misleading.
>>
>> Did anyone say you can't do /that/?
>>
>> Just install while logged in with the non-admin account, but choose an
>> install location to which that user account has write access, e.g.
>> `%LOCALAPPDATA%/POV-Ray/v3.7`. That should do the trick.
>>
>>
> 
> This is possible, but not recommended according to members of Super User:
> 
>
https://superuser.com/questions/199360/is-installing-programs-outside-of-the-default-program-files-directory-wise

> 
>
https://serverfault.com/questions/120681/how-important-is-it-to-install-on-the-program-files-folder

> 
> 
> 
> 
>> While it may not be standard knowledge how to install software for a
>> non-admin user, I think it is reasonably fair to expect such knowledge
>> from anyone using a non-standard Windows installation where they're
>> deliberately depriving their user account from the possibility of
>> temporarily elevating their access privileges to admin level.
>>
> 
> I also asked on Super User whether it's a good idea not to use an admin 
> account for day-to-day activities:
> 
>
https://superuser.com/questions/1225124/admin-rights-on-non-server-windows-installations

> 
> 
> It seems it is somewhat a matter of opinion, but not uncommon, and 
> definitely not a bad idea.
> 
> 
> Mike

Also, I don't understand what /"depriving their user account from the 
possibility of temporarily elevating their access privileges to admin 
level"/ means. I don't think this is even possible in Windows.


Mike

[Mike Horvath] Re: How to uninstall? [3219 days 11 hours and 11 minutes ago]

Tue, 4 Jul 2017 02:43:02 GMT

On 6/28/2017 4:30 PM, clipka wrote:
> Am 28.06.2017 um 20:50 schrieb Mike Horvath:
>> On 6/28/2017 12:28 PM, clipka wrote:
>>> But it doesn't make much sense to offer an "install for all users"
>>> option if that only installs start menu shortcuts without a mechanism to
>>> distribute the actual user-modifiable files to all users, as such an
>>> option would be seriously misleading.
>>>
>>
>> Not informing users that they can't install POV-Ray for non-admin
>> accounts is also seriously misleading.
> 
> Did anyone say you can't do /that/?
> 
> Just install while logged in with the non-admin account, but choose an
> install location to which that user account has write access, e.g.
> `%LOCALAPPDATA%/POV-Ray/v3.7`. That should do the trick.
> 
> 

This is possible, but not recommended according to members of Super User:

https://superuser.com/questions/199360/is-installing-programs-outside-of-the-default-program-files-directory-wise
https://serverfault.com/questions/120681/how-important-is-it-to-install-on-the-program-files-folder



> While it may not be standard knowledge how to install software for a
> non-admin user, I think it is reasonably fair to expect such knowledge
> from anyone using a non-standard Windows installation where they're
> deliberately depriving their user account from the possibility of
> temporarily elevating their access privileges to admin level.
> 

I also asked on Super User whether it's a good idea not to use an admin 
account for day-to-day activities:

https://superuser.com/questions/1225124/admin-rights-on-non-server-windows-installations

It seems it is somewhat a matter of opinion, but not uncommon, and 
definitely not a bad idea.


Mike

[Mike Horvath] Re: How to uninstall? [3219 days 11 hours and 45 minutes ago]

Tue, 4 Jul 2017 02:09:19 GMT

On 7/3/2017 3:38 AM, clipka wrote:
>> Every other program ever has asked me for privileges during installation
>> if needed.
> 
> Virtually no installer does that. Most rely on the operating system
> asking you for privileges /before/ the installer actually runs.
> 

Why not also the POV-Ray installer? Can't it also advertise that it 
needs elevated privileges?


Mike

[Mike Horvath] Re: How to uninstall? [3219 days 11 hours and 51 minutes ago]

Tue, 4 Jul 2017 02:03:12 GMT

On 7/3/2017 2:38 AM, clipka wrote:
> Am 03.07.2017 um 05:37 schrieb Mike Horvath:
>> On 7/2/2017 3:17 AM, clipka wrote:
>>> The proper way to do this stunt would be first of all to use a user
>>> account with the privilege to obtain admin privileges. As such a user,
>>> you would then invoke Windows Explorer via "run as admin" (which would
>>> prompt a UAC popup to grant you admin privileges for this instance of
>>> Windows Explorer), access the directory in question, and finally close
>>> Windows Explorer again (which would revoke the admin privileges again,
>>> because they were limited to the instance of the program anyway).
>>>
>>
>> I was unable to accomplish this in Windows 7, so I did some research. It
>> seems Microsoft disabled this capability after Windows XP. Maybe you
>> should actually test your advice first before offering any?
>>
>>
https://social.technet.microsoft.com/Forums/windows/en-US/2a366967-f9fb-4010-81f3-94dc15c86ad3/run-explorer-as-a-different-user?forum=w7itprosecurity
> 
> Don't confuse "run as different user" with "run as admin": The former
> would actually allow you to run the program as a different user (which
> in XP times may have had admin privileges); the latter allows you to run
> the program with admin privileges, without switching user accounts.
> 

On Windows 7 I have been using "Run as administrator".

> I wasn't aware that Microsoft has stipped the "run as admin" from the
> context menu of the link; but you can still run it as admin by
> navigating to "C:\Windows", right-clicking "explorer.exe", and choosing
> "run as admin".
> 

They didn't. The link still exists. It just has no effect as of Windows 
Vista. On Windows 7 your second suggestion makes no difference. The 
result is the same.


> That said, yes, I should probably have tested my advice: It turns out
> that you don't even need to run Windows Explorer as admin to access
> other users' directories. If you are using an account that has UAC
> privilege, Windows Explorer will prompt you for UAC elevation "on the
> fly" when you click on a folder you don't normally have access to.
> 
> 

As I explained earlier, doing this grants User A *permanent* access to 
all of User B's files. If User B's files are located in "C:\Users\User 
B\Documents\POV-Ray", then User A gets access to "C:\Users\UserB" and 
all sub-folders, which I don't want. Read the prompt more closely.


>> Further, even if this worked, it would not help when using the File >
>> Open command inside POV-Ray.
> 
> If you were relying on UAC rather than the outdated (for end users)
> approach of using separate accounts, you wouldn't have that problem:
> You'd click on the other user's directory, would be prompted with a UAC
> dialog, and be perfectly fine.
> 

This is a security/privacy issue. User B gets access to all documents 
belonging to User A, whether they have anything to do with POV-Ray or not.


Mike

[clipka] Re: How to uninstall? [3220 days 6 hours and 16 minutes ago]

Mon, 3 Jul 2017 07:38:07 GMT

Am 03.07.2017 um 05:45 schrieb Mike Horvath:

> I have installed dozens of programs over the past decade. and this
> "drawback" only occurs with POV-Ray!

Dozens over a decade is a pretty small sample size.

You might be surprised about the curious habits of diverse installers.
Heck, I've seen commercial(!) software that cannot even be installed in
"C:\Program Files" because it can't handle blanks in file names. And
yes, that was well within the last decade.

Give us a break. We're writing this software in our spare time for free.


> Every other program ever has asked me for privileges during installation
> if needed.

Virtually no installer does that. Most rely on the operating system
asking you for privileges /before/ the installer actually runs.

Of course you could presumably write a custom installer that doesn't
reveal to the OS beforehand that it needs admin rights, and only invokes
UAC via some API later; but since installers virtually always require
admin rights, it's rarely done that way. Instead, installers typically
seem to advertise to the OS (via a manifest) that they want the highest
privilege level available to the user, and that's that.

Since this is the mechanism POV-Ray uses, there is no need to ask for
privileges on demand; POV-Ray always gets the privileges it may need
during installation -- unless you try to install it as a locked-down
user and pick a target directory a locked-down user never gets access to
anyway.


> the simple fact is that the POV-Ray installer is not doing
> so! And WTF is a "privilege of obtaining admin privileges"? You just
> made this up.

No, I haven't. It's not the official nomenclature, but it's effectively
how UAC works: A user with "admin rights" (or however they call it in
the English version) no longer has (permanent) admin privileges. The
only privilege over a locked-down user is that he is prompted by UAC if
needs be, to obtain admin privileges temporarily.


Modern Linux distros, BTW, use a very similar mechanism for desktop
installations -- though their "UAC dialog equivalent" includes a
password prompt, and internally the admin privileges are tracked via the
"effective user ID" (as opposed to the "current user ID"; the former
determines what privileges a user has, while the latter governs stuff
like their home directory and such); to my knowledge, Windows tracks
only "the" user account, but switches between the regular user account
without admin privileges, and a "twin" user account with admin privileges.

So the difference in security between contemporary Linux distros and
Windows' UAC (as far as that particular concept is concerned) is
essentially just the password prompt in the dialog, which prevents a
physical intruder from obtaining admin-level access on your machine
while you're away from keyboard. In professional environments where this
is a problem, a professional edition of Windows can be used, allowing to
enable such a password prompt even on Windows.

[clipka] Re: How to uninstall? [3220 days 7 hours and 15 minutes ago]

Mon, 3 Jul 2017 06:38:58 GMT

Am 03.07.2017 um 05:37 schrieb Mike Horvath:
> On 7/2/2017 3:17 AM, clipka wrote:
>> The proper way to do this stunt would be first of all to use a user
>> account with the privilege to obtain admin privileges. As such a user,
>> you would then invoke Windows Explorer via "run as admin" (which would
>> prompt a UAC popup to grant you admin privileges for this instance of
>> Windows Explorer), access the directory in question, and finally close
>> Windows Explorer again (which would revoke the admin privileges again,
>> because they were limited to the instance of the program anyway).
>>
> 
> I was unable to accomplish this in Windows 7, so I did some research. It
> seems Microsoft disabled this capability after Windows XP. Maybe you
> should actually test your advice first before offering any?
> 
>
https://social.technet.microsoft.com/Forums/windows/en-US/2a366967-f9fb-4010-81f3-94dc15c86ad3/run-explorer-as-a-different-user?forum=w7itprosecurity

Don't confuse "run as different user" with "run as admin": The former
would actually allow you to run the program as a different user (which
in XP times may have had admin privileges); the latter allows you to run
the program with admin privileges, without switching user accounts.

I wasn't aware that Microsoft has stipped the "run as admin" from the
context menu of the link; but you can still run it as admin by
navigating to "C:\Windows", right-clicking "explorer.exe", and choosing
"run as admin".

That said, yes, I should probably have tested my advice: It turns out
that you don't even need to run Windows Explorer as admin to access
other users' directories. If you are using an account that has UAC
privilege, Windows Explorer will prompt you for UAC elevation "on the
fly" when you click on a folder you don't normally have access to.

> Further, even if this worked, it would not help when using the File >
> Open command inside POV-Ray.

If you were relying on UAC rather than the outdated (for end users)
approach of using separate accounts, you wouldn't have that problem:
You'd click on the other user's directory, would be prompted with a UAC
dialog, and be perfectly fine.

[Mike Horvath] Re: How to uninstall? [3220 days 10 hours and 8 minutes ago]

Mon, 3 Jul 2017 03:46:25 GMT

On 7/2/2017 6:10 PM, Alain wrote:
> Le 17-07-02 Ã  03:17, clipka a Ã©crit :
> 
>> (*again, by today's standards; note that the last Windows version
>> without UAC, Windows XP, is a zombie by now: It is way past the end of
>> its lifecycle. And while we're still producing XP-compatible binaries,
>> this is out of mere courtesy towards the walking dead, so that there is
>> still /some/ pathway to install POV-Ray on them. We're no longer putting
>> any effort into making that pathway particularly pretty.)
>>
> 
> As long as you use it offline, it's OK.
> By offline, I mean without any path to any network at all.

This only works in Windows XP.


Mike

[Mike Horvath] Re: How to uninstall? [3220 days 10 hours and 8 minutes ago]

Mon, 3 Jul 2017 03:46:00 GMT

On 7/2/2017 2:32 AM, clipka wrote:
> Am 01.07.2017 um 20:14 schrieb Mike Horvath:
>> On 6/29/2017 8:19 AM, clipka wrote:
>>> As I said: I think it is reasonable to expect you to already /know/ such
>>> stuff, given that you've deliberately chosen to set up a separate admin
>>> account. If you've been unaware of the associated pitfalls until now,
>>> blame it on the person who recommended to you that you should go that
>>> route - /they/ should have informed you about the side effects of that
>>> procedure.
>>>
>>
>> Having separate admin and limited user accounts is probably one of the
>> most important best practices on Windows, and is one of the cornerstones
>> of the concept of "least privilege". The fact that you don't know this
>> as a professional after 20+ years amazes me.
>>
>>
https://social.technet.microsoft.com/wiki/contents/articles/1510.best-practices-using-a-separate-account-for-admin-tasks.aspx
>>
>>
http://www.lbmcinformationsecurity.com/blog/are-your-administrators-using-admin-accounts-for-everything
> 
> (1) What does this (the question whether it's best practice or nor) have
> to do with whether, if you follow it, you should be aware of its drawbacks?
> 

I have installed dozens of programs over the past decade. and this 
"drawback" only occurs with POV-Ray!


> (3) What amazes /me/ is the fact that /you/ don't really understand the
> background of that best practice.
> 
> The articles cited are /not/ making a case for regular end users having
> an extra dedicated admin account -- they both are making a case for
> professional admins having an extra dedicated non-admin account.
> 
> As the latter, the practice is still valid. As the former, it is pretty
> much obsoleted by the UAC introduced with Windows Vista.
> 
> 

Ridiculous!

https://www.tomsguide.com/us/standard-accounts-stop-malware,news-18326.html


>> There is no Access Control popup during installation. All you get is a
>> generic error regarding "agpl-3.0.txt". There is also no Access Control
>> popup when trying to access the include files. You are simply denied
>> access to that folder.
> 
> There /would/ be a UAC popup if your regular user account was equipped
> with the privilege of obtaining admin privileges via UAC. But since
> you're trying to run the installer with a locked-down user account,
> you're denying yourself that route.
> 
> (Note that as of Vista, as a regular user you do not /have/ admin
> privileges anymore during regular operation. Only when you confirm a UAC
> dialog do you /temporarily gain/ those privileges, and only for the
> program in question, such as an installer.)
> 

Every other program ever has asked me for privileges during installation 
if needed. the simple fact is that the POV-Ray installer is not doing 
so! And WTF is a "privilege of obtaining admin privileges"? You just 
made this up.


Mike

[Mike Horvath] Re: How to uninstall? [3220 days 10 hours and 17 minutes ago]

Mon, 3 Jul 2017 03:37:31 GMT

On 7/2/2017 3:17 AM, clipka wrote:
> The proper way to do this stunt would be first of all to use a user
> account with the privilege to obtain admin privileges. As such a user,
> you would then invoke Windows Explorer via "run as admin" (which would
> prompt a UAC popup to grant you admin privileges for this instance of
> Windows Explorer), access the directory in question, and finally close
> Windows Explorer again (which would revoke the admin privileges again,
> because they were limited to the instance of the program anyway).
> 

I was unable to accomplish this in Windows 7, so I did some research. It 
seems Microsoft disabled this capability after Windows XP. Maybe you 
should actually test your advice first before offering any?

https://social.technet.microsoft.com/Forums/windows/en-US/2a366967-f9fb-4010-81f3-94dc15c86ad3/run-explorer-as-a-different-user?forum=w7itprosecurity

Further, even if this worked, it would not help when using the File > 
Open command inside POV-Ray.

Lastly, kudos for not mentioning the "proper way" of installing POV-Ray 
in any documentation.

> Don't blame it on POV-Ray if your operating system does weird stuff when
> you're using weird solutions to problems caused by your own weird(*)
> operating system setup.
> 
> 

There is nothing strange about my setup. You are the one not up-to-date 
about OS best practices.

Mike

[Alain] Re: How to uninstall? [3220 days 15 hours and 45 minutes ago]

Sun, 2 Jul 2017 22:09:24 GMT

Le 17-07-02 Ã  03:17, clipka a Ã©crit :

> (*again, by today's standards; note that the last Windows version
> without UAC, Windows XP, is a zombie by now: It is way past the end of
> its lifecycle. And while we're still producing XP-compatible binaries,
> this is out of mere courtesy towards the walking dead, so that there is
> still /some/ pathway to install POV-Ray on them. We're no longer putting
> any effort into making that pathway particularly pretty.)
> 

As long as you use it offline, it's OK.
By offline, I mean without any path to any network at all.

[clipka] Re: How to uninstall? [3221 days 6 hours and 37 minutes ago]

Sun, 2 Jul 2017 07:17:04 GMT

Am 01.07.2017 um 20:31 schrieb Mike Horvath:

> I checked a third time, and the popup is for *PERMANENT* access to the
> folder.
> 
> If a limited user tries to access the POV-Ray include files in the
> admin's Documents directory, he is given *PERMANENT* access to the whole
> profile folder.

That's because you're doing it wrong (by today's standards). I'm not
sure what you're using there, but whatever it is, I'm quite sure it is
not UAC.

The proper way to do this stunt would be first of all to use a user
account with the privilege to obtain admin privileges. As such a user,
you would then invoke Windows Explorer via "run as admin" (which would
prompt a UAC popup to grant you admin privileges for this instance of
Windows Explorer), access the directory in question, and finally close
Windows Explorer again (which would revoke the admin privileges again,
because they were limited to the instance of the program anyway).


Don't blame it on POV-Ray if your operating system does weird stuff when
you're using weird solutions to problems caused by your own weird(*)
operating system setup.


(*again, by today's standards; note that the last Windows version
without UAC, Windows XP, is a zombie by now: It is way past the end of
its lifecycle. And while we're still producing XP-compatible binaries,
this is out of mere courtesy towards the walking dead, so that there is
still /some/ pathway to install POV-Ray on them. We're no longer putting
any effort into making that pathway particularly pretty.)

[clipka] Re: How to uninstall? [3221 days 7 hours and 21 minutes ago]

Sun, 2 Jul 2017 06:32:51 GMT

Am 01.07.2017 um 20:14 schrieb Mike Horvath:
> On 6/29/2017 8:19 AM, clipka wrote:
>> As I said: I think it is reasonable to expect you to already /know/ such
>> stuff, given that you've deliberately chosen to set up a separate admin
>> account. If you've been unaware of the associated pitfalls until now,
>> blame it on the person who recommended to you that you should go that
>> route - /they/ should have informed you about the side effects of that
>> procedure.
>>
> 
> Having separate admin and limited user accounts is probably one of the
> most important best practices on Windows, and is one of the cornerstones
> of the concept of "least privilege". The fact that you don't know this
> as a professional after 20+ years amazes me.
> 
>
https://social.technet.microsoft.com/wiki/contents/articles/1510.best-practices-using-a-separate-account-for-admin-tasks.aspx
> 
>
http://www.lbmcinformationsecurity.com/blog/are-your-administrators-using-admin-accounts-for-everything

(1) What does this (the question whether it's best practice or nor) have
to do with whether, if you follow it, you should be aware of its drawbacks?

(2) Your "fact" is an alternative one, i.e. a falsehood: I /am/ well
aware of the practice, and that it is an important best practices on
Windows.

(3) What amazes /me/ is the fact that /you/ don't really understand the
background of that best practice.

The articles cited are /not/ making a case for regular end users having
an extra dedicated admin account -- they both are making a case for
professional admins having an extra dedicated non-admin account.

As the latter, the practice is still valid. As the former, it is pretty
much obsoleted by the UAC introduced with Windows Vista.

> There is no Access Control popup during installation. All you get is a
> generic error regarding "agpl-3.0.txt". There is also no Access Control
> popup when trying to access the include files. You are simply denied
> access to that folder.

There /would/ be a UAC popup if your regular user account was equipped
with the privilege of obtaining admin privileges via UAC. But since
you're trying to run the installer with a locked-down user account,
you're denying yourself that route.

(Note that as of Vista, as a regular user you do not /have/ admin
privileges anymore during regular operation. Only when you confirm a UAC
dialog do you /temporarily gain/ those privileges, and only for the
program in question, such as an installer.)

[Mike Horvath] Re: How to uninstall? [3221 days 19 hours and 23 minutes ago]

Sat, 1 Jul 2017 18:31:14 GMT

On 7/1/2017 2:21 PM, Mike Horvath wrote:
> On 7/1/2017 2:14 PM, Mike Horvath wrote:
>> There is also no Access Control popup when trying to access the 
>> include files. You are simply denied access to that folder.
>>
>>
>> Mike
>>
>>
> 
> I just tested this again, and there is a popup in this case.
> 
> 
> Mike

I checked a third time, and the popup is for *PERMANENT* access to the 
folder.

If a limited user tries to access the POV-Ray include files in the 
admin's Documents directory, he is given *PERMANENT* access to the whole 
profile folder.

Mike

[Mike Horvath] Re: How to uninstall? [3221 days 19 hours and 33 minutes ago]

Sat, 1 Jul 2017 18:21:00 GMT

On 7/1/2017 2:14 PM, Mike Horvath wrote:
> There is also no Access Control 
> popup when trying to access the include files. You are simply denied 
> access to that folder.
> 
> 
> Mike
> 
> 

I just tested this again, and there is a popup in this case.


Mike

[Mike Horvath] Re: How to uninstall? [3221 days 19 hours and 40 minutes ago]

Sat, 1 Jul 2017 18:14:28 GMT

On 6/29/2017 8:19 AM, clipka wrote:
> As I said: I think it is reasonable to expect you to already /know/ such
> stuff, given that you've deliberately chosen to set up a separate admin
> account. If you've been unaware of the associated pitfalls until now,
> blame it on the person who recommended to you that you should go that
> route - /they/ should have informed you about the side effects of that
> procedure.
> 

Having separate admin and limited user accounts is probably one of the 
most important best practices on Windows, and is one of the cornerstones 
of the concept of "least privilege". The fact that you don't know this 
as a professional after 20+ years amazes me.

https://social.technet.microsoft.com/wiki/contents/articles/1510.best-practices-using-a-separate-account-for-admin-tasks.aspx

http://www.lbmcinformationsecurity.com/blog/are-your-administrators-using-admin-accounts-for-everything


>> Suggesting that a user log in as admin every time just to use a
>> non-critical graphics program sounds like a pretty stupid risk to me.
>> And going into Control Panel and changing the access level of a person's
>> user account just to install or uninstall one piece of software makes
>> POV-Ray look like a special snowflake at best, and malware at worst.
> 
> You do know that the issue of admin vs. non-admin account has been
> addressed by the User Access Control mechanism? You know, the thing that
> pops up a dialog each time a program does something that needs admin
> rights, even if the current user /is/ an admin.
> 

There is no Access Control popup during installation. All you get is a 
generic error regarding "agpl-3.0.txt". There is also no Access Control 
popup when trying to access the include files. You are simply denied 
access to that folder.


Mike

[clipka] Re: How to uninstall? [3224 days 1 hour and 34 minutes ago]

Thu, 29 Jun 2017 12:20:00 GMT

Am 29.06.2017 um 02:15 schrieb Mike Horvath:
> On 6/28/2017 4:30 PM, clipka wrote:
>> Am 28.06.2017 um 20:50 schrieb Mike Horvath:
>>> On 6/28/2017 12:28 PM, clipka wrote:
>>>> But it doesn't make much sense to offer an "install for all users"
>>>> option if that only installs start menu shortcuts without a
>>>> mechanism to
>>>> distribute the actual user-modifiable files to all users, as such an
>>>> option would be seriously misleading.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Not informing users that they can't install POV-Ray for non-admin
>>> accounts is also seriously misleading.
>>
>> Did anyone say you can't do /that/?
>>
>> Just install while logged in with the non-admin account, but choose an
>> install location to which that user account has write access, e.g.
>> `%LOCALAPPDATA%/POV-Ray/v3.7`. That should do the trick.
>>
> 
> The installer doesn't suggest this. It just spawns an error message
> about a text file of all things, and then asks you whether to abort. A
> little hint would be helpful, and might even forestall threads such as
> this one.

As I said: I think it is reasonable to expect you to already /know/ such
stuff, given that you've deliberately chosen to set up a separate admin
account. If you've been unaware of the associated pitfalls until now,
blame it on the person who recommended to you that you should go that
route - /they/ should have informed you about the side effects of that
procedure.

> Suggesting that a user log in as admin every time just to use a
> non-critical graphics program sounds like a pretty stupid risk to me.
> And going into Control Panel and changing the access level of a person's
> user account just to install or uninstall one piece of software makes
> POV-Ray look like a special snowflake at best, and malware at worst.

You do know that the issue of admin vs. non-admin account has been
addressed by the User Access Control mechanism? You know, the thing that
pops up a dialog each time a program does something that needs admin
rights, even if the current user /is/ an admin.

Also, please note that I'm not saying POV-Ray's installer is perfect.
I'm just saying how things are at the moment, and explaining why that
is. Unfortunately the person on the team with the most expertise
regarding Windows installers also happens to be the person with the most
interference from RL, so we can't put as much effort and know-how into
the installer as we'd like to.

[Mike Horvath] Re: How to uninstall? [3224 days 13 hours and 39 minutes ago]

Thu, 29 Jun 2017 00:15:22 GMT

On 6/28/2017 4:30 PM, clipka wrote:
> Am 28.06.2017 um 20:50 schrieb Mike Horvath:
>> On 6/28/2017 12:28 PM, clipka wrote:
>>> But it doesn't make much sense to offer an "install for all users"
>>> option if that only installs start menu shortcuts without a mechanism to
>>> distribute the actual user-modifiable files to all users, as such an
>>> option would be seriously misleading.
>>>
>>
>> Not informing users that they can't install POV-Ray for non-admin
>> accounts is also seriously misleading.
> 
> Did anyone say you can't do /that/?
> 
> Just install while logged in with the non-admin account, but choose an
> install location to which that user account has write access, e.g.
> `%LOCALAPPDATA%/POV-Ray/v3.7`. That should do the trick.
> 

The installer doesn't suggest this. It just spawns an error message 
about a text file of all things, and then asks you whether to abort. A 
little hint would be helpful, and might even forestall threads such as 
this one.

> 
> While it may not be standard knowledge how to install software for a
> non-admin user, I think it is reasonably fair to expect such knowledge
> from anyone using a non-standard Windows installation where they're
> deliberately depriving their user account from the possibility of
> temporarily elevating their access privileges to admin level.
> 

Suggesting that a user log in as admin every time just to use a 
non-critical graphics program sounds like a pretty stupid risk to me. 
And going into Control Panel and changing the access level of a person's 
user account just to install or uninstall one piece of software makes 
POV-Ray look like a special snowflake at best, and malware at worst.

Mike

[clipka] Re: How to uninstall? [3224 days 17 hours and 24 minutes ago]

Wed, 28 Jun 2017 20:30:35 GMT

Am 28.06.2017 um 20:50 schrieb Mike Horvath:
> On 6/28/2017 12:28 PM, clipka wrote:
>> But it doesn't make much sense to offer an "install for all users"
>> option if that only installs start menu shortcuts without a mechanism to
>> distribute the actual user-modifiable files to all users, as such an
>> option would be seriously misleading.
>>
> 
> Not informing users that they can't install POV-Ray for non-admin
> accounts is also seriously misleading.

Did anyone say you can't do /that/?

Just install while logged in with the non-admin account, but choose an
install location to which that user account has write access, e.g.
`%LOCALAPPDATA%/POV-Ray/v3.7`. That should do the trick.

While it may not be standard knowledge how to install software for a
non-admin user, I think it is reasonably fair to expect such knowledge
from anyone using a non-standard Windows installation where they're
deliberately depriving their user account from the possibility of
temporarily elevating their access privileges to admin level.

[Mike Horvath] Re: How to uninstall? [3224 days 19 hours and 4 minutes ago]

Wed, 28 Jun 2017 18:50:17 GMT

On 6/28/2017 12:28 PM, clipka wrote:
> But it doesn't make much sense to offer an "install for all users"
> option if that only installs start menu shortcuts without a mechanism to
> distribute the actual user-modifiable files to all users, as such an
> option would be seriously misleading.
> 

Not informing users that they can't install POV-Ray for non-admin 
accounts is also seriously misleading.


Mike

[clipka] Re: How to uninstall? [3224 days 21 hours and 26 minutes ago]

Wed, 28 Jun 2017 16:28:10 GMT

Am 28.06.2017 um 11:25 schrieb Mike Horvath:
> On 6/24/2017 1:44 AM, clipka wrote:
>>> and "C:\ProgramData\Microsoft\Windows\Start Menu\Programs". See here:
>>>
>>>
http://windowsitpro.com/systems-management/q-how-do-i-add-item-start-menu-all-users-windows-7-and-windows-vista
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> My system has 94 items in the latter folder.
>>
>> Start Menu is a different matter.
>>
> 
> Why is it a different matter? It is part of the installation process, too.

What I mean is, technically it is entirely different from the issue of
installing user-modifiable files.

The start menu is just a bunch of shortcuts, and there /is/ a mechanism
to install such shortcuts for all users (both existing and future).

There is no such thing for actual files a user might tamper with. (And
there can't be, because the start menu mechanism relies on those
shortcuts being static.)

But it doesn't make much sense to offer an "install for all users"
option if that only installs start menu shortcuts without a mechanism to
distribute the actual user-modifiable files to all users, as such an
option would be seriously misleading.

[Mike Horvath] Re: How to uninstall? [3225 days 4 hours and 29 minutes ago]

Wed, 28 Jun 2017 09:24:58 GMT

On 6/24/2017 1:44 AM, clipka wrote:
>> and "C:\ProgramData\Microsoft\Windows\Start Menu\Programs". See here:
>>
>>
http://windowsitpro.com/systems-management/q-how-do-i-add-item-start-menu-all-users-windows-7-and-windows-vista
>>
>>
>> My system has 94 items in the latter folder.
> 
> Start Menu is a different matter.
> 

Why is it a different matter? It is part of the installation process, too.


Mike

[Alain] Re: Game Mode [3228 days 16 hours and 10 minutes ago]

Sat, 24 Jun 2017 21:44:36 GMT

Le 17-06-24 Ã  05:55, omniverse a Ã©crit :
> clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
>> Am 24.06.2017 um 00:53 schrieb Mike Horvath:
>>> Description:
>>>
>>>
http://gadgets.ndtv.com/games/features/how-to-enable-and-use-game-mode-on-windows-10-1680332
>>>
>>>
>>> Can this feature be made to work for POV-Ray as well? Maybe a few extra
>>> pps?
>>
>> Why not try it out for yourself?
>>
>> To my knowledge, this feature is fully controlled by the operating
>> system, and does not require the application to do anything special.
> 
> I didn't know about it so had to give that a look.
> 
> Game Mode itself was already activated, I guess just waiting for something to
> automatically be detected as compatible with it.
> 
> Found that running POV-Ray and using Windows key + G shows the "Game Bar", so
> going into Settings (gear icon) there's a couple checkboxes for recognizing the
> program.
> 
> A test of one hour for series of animation frames I had done previously was only
> 1 minute less than before.
> 
> I couldn't be sure of what the CPU activity list, via Task Manager, was showing
> me. Maybe there was more focus on POV-Ray, or rather less on all else, but I
> wasn't able to discern that for sure.
> 
> Bob
> 
> 

Essentially, what game mode does is to increase the priority of the 
Â«gameÂ» application to the high level while reducing the priority
of 
everything else to low level.

[omniverse] Re: Game Mode [3229 days 3 hours and 54 minutes ago]

Sat, 24 Jun 2017 10:00:00 GMT

clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
> Am 24.06.2017 um 00:53 schrieb Mike Horvath:
> > Description:
> >
> >
http://gadgets.ndtv.com/games/features/how-to-enable-and-use-game-mode-on-windows-10-1680332
> >
> >
> > Can this feature be made to work for POV-Ray as well? Maybe a few extra
> > pps?
>
> Why not try it out for yourself?
>
> To my knowledge, this feature is fully controlled by the operating
> system, and does not require the application to do anything special.

I didn't know about it so had to give that a look.

Game Mode itself was already activated, I guess just waiting for something to
automatically be detected as compatible with it.

Found that running POV-Ray and using Windows key + G shows the "Game Bar", so
going into Settings (gear icon) there's a couple checkboxes for recognizing the
program.

A test of one hour for series of animation frames I had done previously was only
1 minute less than before.

I couldn't be sure of what the CPU activity list, via Task Manager, was showing
me. Maybe there was more focus on POV-Ray, or rather less on all else, but I
wasn't able to discern that for sure.

Bob

[clipka] Re: How to uninstall? [3229 days 8 hours and 10 minutes ago]

Sat, 24 Jun 2017 05:44:35 GMT

Am 24.06.2017 um 00:34 schrieb Mike Horvath:
> On 6/23/2017 6:01 PM, clipka wrote:
...
>> No, not really. This is a systematic issue with modern Windows (and any
>> multi-user system, actually), where technically the user-modifiable
>> portions of any given program need to be installed for each user
>> individually.
...
> Alternately, you could put all this stuff in "C:\Users\Public\Documents"

That, per se, won't cut it: We expect users to modify those files
(that's why they're not residing in the "Program Files" folder in the
first place), so to prevent one user's modification to affect another
user, each needs their own copy.

What we probably should do, instead, is to put all the stuff in
"C:\Users\Default\Documents", and when a user runs POV-Ray for the first
time, copy it from there to the user's own documents folder.

> and "C:\ProgramData\Microsoft\Windows\Start Menu\Programs". See here:
> 
>
http://windowsitpro.com/systems-management/q-how-do-i-add-item-start-menu-all-users-windows-7-and-windows-vista
> 
> 
> My system has 94 items in the latter folder.

Start Menu is a different matter.

[clipka] Re: Game Mode [3229 days 8 hours and 19 minutes ago]

Sat, 24 Jun 2017 05:35:13 GMT

Am 24.06.2017 um 00:53 schrieb Mike Horvath:
> Description:
> 
>
http://gadgets.ndtv.com/games/features/how-to-enable-and-use-game-mode-on-windows-10-1680332
> 
> 
> Can this feature be made to work for POV-Ray as well? Maybe a few extra
> pps?

Why not try it out for yourself?

To my knowledge, this feature is fully controlled by the operating
system, and does not require the application to do anything special.

[Mike Horvath] Game Mode [3229 days 15 hours and 1 minute ago]

Fri, 23 Jun 2017 22:53:31 GMT

Description:

http://gadgets.ndtv.com/games/features/how-to-enable-and-use-game-mode-on-windows-10-1680332

Can this feature be made to work for POV-Ray as well? Maybe a few extra pps?


Mike

[Mike Horvath] Re: How to uninstall? [3229 days 15 hours and 20 minutes ago]

Fri, 23 Jun 2017 22:34:16 GMT

On 6/23/2017 6:01 PM, clipka wrote:
> Am 23.06.2017 um 22:51 schrieb Mike Horvath:
> 
>> Next, I tried installing RC1 using my non-admin account, but the
>> installation failed when trying to write to "C:\Program
>> Files\POV-Ray\v3.7\agpl-3.0.txt". After switching to my admin account,
>> the installation completed successfully, but did not copy the Start Menu
>> items and assorted include files to my non-admin accounts. Is there no
>> way to install POV-Ray for all users?
> 
> No, not really. This is a systematic issue with modern Windows (and any
> multi-user system, actually), where technically the user-modifiable
> portions of any given program need to be installed for each user
> individually.
> 
> To my knowledge, running "pvengine.exe /INSTALL" should perform this
> step for the current user.
> 
> Theoretically there would be a way to "advertise" this step during
> installation, i.e. make it known to Windows so that it can automatically
> be executed when a user runs POV-Ray for the first time, but that's
> tricky to do, and might not be possible with the Nullsoft Installer
> System (NSIS) we're using to create the installer.
> 
> The alternative would be to let POV-Ray test whether it is being run by
> the user for the first time, and in that case perform the step
> automatically, but again this needs some time and effort to implement
> cleanly.
> 

I ran "pvengine.exe /INSTALL". It indicated "Success!" but did not add 
anything to the Start Menu or copy the include files over.

Alternately, you could put all this stuff in "C:\Users\Public\Documents" 
and "C:\ProgramData\Microsoft\Windows\Start Menu\Programs". See here:

http://windowsitpro.com/systems-management/q-how-do-i-add-item-start-menu-all-users-windows-7-and-windows-vista

My system has 94 items in the latter folder.

Mike

[clipka] Re: How to uninstall? [3229 days 15 hours and 52 minutes ago]

Fri, 23 Jun 2017 22:01:43 GMT

Am 23.06.2017 um 22:51 schrieb Mike Horvath:

> Next, I tried installing RC1 using my non-admin account, but the
> installation failed when trying to write to "C:\Program
> Files\POV-Ray\v3.7\agpl-3.0.txt". After switching to my admin account,
> the installation completed successfully, but did not copy the Start Menu
> items and assorted include files to my non-admin accounts. Is there no
> way to install POV-Ray for all users?

No, not really. This is a systematic issue with modern Windows (and any
multi-user system, actually), where technically the user-modifiable
portions of any given program need to be installed for each user
individually.

To my knowledge, running "pvengine.exe /INSTALL" should perform this
step for the current user.

Theoretically there would be a way to "advertise" this step during
installation, i.e. make it known to Windows so that it can automatically
be executed when a user runs POV-Ray for the first time, but that's
tricky to do, and might not be possible with the Nullsoft Installer
System (NSIS) we're using to create the installer.

The alternative would be to let POV-Ray test whether it is being run by
the user for the first time, and in that case perform the step
automatically, but again this needs some time and effort to implement
cleanly.

[Mike Horvath] Re: How to uninstall? [3229 days 17 hours and 2 minutes ago]

Fri, 23 Jun 2017 20:51:37 GMT

On 6/23/2017 4:43 PM, Mike Horvath wrote:
> On 6/23/2017 3:11 PM, clipka wrote:
>> Am 23.06.2017 um 20:28 schrieb Mike Horvath:
>>> I have POV-Ray 3.7 and 3.7 beta installed. How do I uninstall them? They
>>> do not appear in the 'Programs and Features' list. I also ran the
>>> uninstallers in the program directories, but the files remain.
>>>
>>> Windows 7 x64 Pro
>>
>> Sounds like the uninstallers have already run, but unsuccessfully so
>> (for unknown reasons). Otherwise, you should find the application listed
>> as "POV-Ray for Windows ..."
>>
>> If that is the case, try installing again, then uninstalling.
>>
> 
> I logged into my administrator account and the programs showed up in the 
> list there. I've never encountered this behavior before, where a program 
> doesn't appear in "Programs and Features" unless you are logged in as 
> admin.
> 
> Mike

Next, I tried installing RC1 using my non-admin account, but the 
installation failed when trying to write to "C:\Program 
Files\POV-Ray\v3.7\agpl-3.0.txt". After switching to my admin account, 
the installation completed successfully, but did not copy the Start Menu 
items and assorted include files to my non-admin accounts. Is there no 
way to install POV-Ray for all users?

Mike

[Mike Horvath] Re: How to uninstall? [3229 days 17 hours and 11 minutes ago]

Fri, 23 Jun 2017 20:43:13 GMT

On 6/23/2017 3:11 PM, clipka wrote:
> Am 23.06.2017 um 20:28 schrieb Mike Horvath:
>> I have POV-Ray 3.7 and 3.7 beta installed. How do I uninstall them? They
>> do not appear in the 'Programs and Features' list. I also ran the
>> uninstallers in the program directories, but the files remain.
>>
>> Windows 7 x64 Pro
> 
> Sounds like the uninstallers have already run, but unsuccessfully so
> (for unknown reasons). Otherwise, you should find the application listed
> as "POV-Ray for Windows ..."
> 
> If that is the case, try installing again, then uninstalling.
> 

I logged into my administrator account and the programs showed up in the 
list there. I've never encountered this behavior before, where a program 
doesn't appear in "Programs and Features" unless you are logged in as admin.

Mike

[clipka] Re: How to uninstall? [3229 days 18 hours and 42 minutes ago]

Fri, 23 Jun 2017 19:11:42 GMT

Am 23.06.2017 um 20:28 schrieb Mike Horvath:
> I have POV-Ray 3.7 and 3.7 beta installed. How do I uninstall them? They
> do not appear in the 'Programs and Features' list. I also ran the
> uninstallers in the program directories, but the files remain.
> 
> Windows 7 x64 Pro

Sounds like the uninstallers have already run, but unsuccessfully so
(for unknown reasons). Otherwise, you should find the application listed
as "POV-Ray for Windows ..."

If that is the case, try installing again, then uninstalling.

[Mike Horvath] How to uninstall? [3229 days 19 hours and 26 minutes ago]

Fri, 23 Jun 2017 18:28:23 GMT

I have POV-Ray 3.7 and 3.7 beta installed. How do I uninstall them? They 
do not appear in the 'Programs and Features' list. I also ran the 
uninstallers in the program directories, but the files remain.

Windows 7 x64 Pro

[clipka] Re: Unix version on Windows [3240 days and 24 minutes ago]

Tue, 13 Jun 2017 13:30:14 GMT

Am 13.06.2017 um 09:07 schrieb dick balaska:
> Am 2017-05-18 12:26, also sprach clipka:
>>
>> Performance seems to be just as good as the native Windows binaries --
>> as a matter of fact, on my machine the Unix variant of beta.7 (compiled
>> with g++ 5.4.0) comes out slightly ahead by about 1%.
> 
> I have one thing I've been wanting to write up...
> In the kitchen of my animation, the tile floor is superellipsoids with a
> box for grout between the tiles.
> When the camera looks at this floor, Windows renders this 10x faster
> than Linux/gcc [1].  (The grout must be present for the extreme
> variation.) At least my theory is it's windows vs. Linux.  The problem
> with my theory is that my Windows box is also my only hyperthreaded i7
> cpu. My linux boxen are all i5(s).  But I don't think it's the CPU, I
> think it's the compiler.  Anyway, now I have to write this up as a
> proper test. I thought it might be interesting to compare against the
> clang results, too.

This would have to be examined in more detail.

Do you still see this speed difference with current beta versions?


With "Windows Subsystem for Linux" now able to compile and run POV-Ray,
it should be easy to figure out whether this is a matter of the CPU or
the compiler: Just run POV-Ray for Windows and POV-Ray for Unix on the
same machine. If the factor 10 speed difference is absent, the compiler
is free of guilt; if it is present, it must be the compiler that makes
the difference, and we might want to figure out how to get better
performance out of g++ for whatever piece of code is affected by this.

Also, it might be interesting to compare the performance on different
CPUs, to see whether the Unix performance loss is a general problem or
limited to a particular class of machines. We're in contact with some
folks at AMD who might be able to test-drive a sample scene across a
wide range of different machines (both AMD and Intel).

[William F Pokorny] Re: Unix version on Windows [3240 days 1 hour and 21 minutes ago]

Tue, 13 Jun 2017 12:33:20 GMT

On 06/13/2017 03:07 AM, dick balaska wrote:
> Am 2017-05-18 12:26, also sprach clipka:
>>
>> Performance seems to be just as good as the native Windows binaries --
>> as a matter of fact, on my machine the Unix variant of beta.7 (compiled
>> with g++ 5.4.0) comes out slightly ahead by about 1%.
> 
> I have one thing I've been wanting to write up...
> In the kitchen of my animation, the tile floor is superellipsoids with a 
> box for grout between the tiles.
> When the camera looks at this floor, Windows renders this 10x faster 
> than Linux/gcc [1].  (The grout must be present for the extreme 
> variation.) At least my theory is it's windows vs. Linux.  The problem 
> with my theory is that my Windows box is also my only hyperthreaded i7 
> cpu. My linux boxen are all i5(s).  But I don't think it's the CPU, I 
> think it's the compiler.  Anyway, now I have to write this up as a 
> proper test. I thought it might be interesting to compare against the 
> clang results, too.
> 

We did recently fix a - sometimes significant - 'compiler' related 
degrade with AA mode 2 (+am2) where the windows compiler was OK, but gnu 
g++ and clang were slow. See: https://github.com/POV-Ray/povray/pull/270 
merged April 12, 2017.

Though we saw nothing like a 10x difference.

Bill P.

[dick balaska] Re: Unix version on Windows [3240 days 6 hours and 46 minutes ago]

Tue, 13 Jun 2017 07:07:44 GMT

Am 2017-05-18 12:26, also sprach clipka:
> 
> Performance seems to be just as good as the native Windows binaries --
> as a matter of fact, on my machine the Unix variant of beta.7 (compiled
> with g++ 5.4.0) comes out slightly ahead by about 1%.

I have one thing I've been wanting to write up...
In the kitchen of my animation, the tile floor is superellipsoids with a 
box for grout between the tiles.
When the camera looks at this floor, Windows renders this 10x faster 
than Linux/gcc [1].  (The grout must be present for the extreme 
variation.) At least my theory is it's windows vs. Linux.  The problem 
with my theory is that my Windows box is also my only hyperthreaded i7 
cpu. My linux boxen are all i5(s).  But I don't think it's the CPU, I 
think it's the compiler.  Anyway, now I have to write this up as a 
proper test. I thought it might be interesting to compare against the 
clang results, too.

-- 
dik

[1] The difference is so striking, 2.7 minutes vs. 30 minutes, that I 
thought of modifying my renderfarm to support "prefer this named box for 
that range of frames".

[Christian Froeschlin] Re: Unix version on Windows [3240 days 15 hours and 11 minutes ago]

Mon, 12 Jun 2017 22:43:11 GMT

On 18.05.2017 18:26, clipka wrote:

> (*I have no idea why Microsoft calls it that way round; from my
> understanding "Linux subsystem for Windows" would be a better name.)

 From the company that named their 32-bit subsystem WOW64 :)

[William F Pokorny] Re: Unix version on Windows [3264 days and 18 minutes ago]

Sat, 20 May 2017 13:36:32 GMT

On 05/20/2017 09:09 AM, clipka wrote:
> Am 18.05.2017 um 18:26 schrieb clipka:
> 
>> Performance seems to be just as good as the native Windows binaries --
>> as a matter of fact, on my machine the Unix variant of beta.7 (compiled
>> with g++ 5.4.0) comes out slightly ahead by about 1%.
> 
> For the records: With beta.8, the Linux subsystem binaries now give me a
> performance advantage of just shy of 15% over the native Windows version.
> 
Wow, Cool! Very much looking forward to seeing what I get on my Ubuntu 
system.

Bill P.

[clipka] Re: Unix version on Windows [3264 days and 45 minutes ago]

Sat, 20 May 2017 13:09:22 GMT

Am 18.05.2017 um 18:26 schrieb clipka:

> Performance seems to be just as good as the native Windows binaries --
> as a matter of fact, on my machine the Unix variant of beta.7 (compiled
> with g++ 5.4.0) comes out slightly ahead by about 1%.

For the records: With beta.8, the Linux subsystem binaries now give me a
performance advantage of just shy of 15% over the native Windows version.

[clipka] Re: Unix version on Windows [3265 days 19 hours and 56 minutes ago]

Thu, 18 May 2017 17:58:00 GMT

Am 18.05.2017 um 18:26 schrieb clipka:

> Note that to compile POV-Ray on the Linux subsystem, in addition to the
> various library packages listed in `unix/README.md` you will also need
> to install the following development tool packages:
> 
>     autoconf
>     gcc
>     g++
>     make
> 
> (plus various packages automatically installed when selecting the above)

Add `pkg-config` to that list, otherwise POV-Ray's `./configure` script
may fail to properly identify the OpenEXR library.

[clipka] Unix version on Windows [3265 days 21 hours and 28 minutes ago]

Thu, 18 May 2017 16:26:02 GMT

FYI,

As of the Creators Update, Microsoft's so-called "Windows Subsystem for
Linux"(*) seems to be mature enough now to compile and run the Unix
version of POV-Ray, opening up another way to run a console version of
POV-Ray on Windows machines.

Performance seems to be just as good as the native Windows binaries --
as a matter of fact, on my machine the Unix variant of beta.7 (compiled
with g++ 5.4.0) comes out slightly ahead by about 1%.


Note that to compile POV-Ray on the Linux subsystem, in addition to the
various library packages listed in `unix/README.md` you will also need
to install the following development tool packages:

    autoconf
    gcc
    g++
    make

(plus various packages automatically installed when selecting the above)

In my experiments, I used "sudo apt-get install <PACKAGE>" to install
the packages.


(*I have no idea why Microsoft calls it that way round; from my
understanding "Linux subsystem for Windows" would be a better name.)

[clipka] Power Throttling [3277 days 4 hours and 13 minutes ago]

Sun, 7 May 2017 09:41:29 GMT

FYI,

Microsoft is apparently planning to introduce a new power saving
mechanism, dubbed "Power Throttling", which may - or may not - have an
effect on POV-Ray render performance when running POV-Ray on certain
hardware.

The mechanism is currently implemented in the Windows 10 Insider builds
16176 and 16179, and will presumably be released in September/October as
part of the Windows 10 update codenamed "Redstone 3".

[Source: "c't Magazin fÃ¼r Computer Technik" issue 10/2017, Heise Medien
GmbH & Co. KG]

Please refer to Microsoft or 3rd party information for details on the
matter.

[Alain] Re: Windows 10 and updates [3297 days 20 hours and 51 minutes ago]

Sun, 16 Apr 2017 17:03:24 GMT

Le 17-04-15 Ã  23:16, Mike Horvath a Ã©crit :
> Windows 10 and Server 2016 will install updates automatically, including
> shutting down and restarting the machine. Can POV-Ray cope with this?
> Can it continue the render later?
>
>
> Mike

Absolutely.
Just restart with the +c switch.

Alain

[Mike Horvath] Windows 10 and updates [3298 days 10 hours and 38 minutes ago]

Sun, 16 Apr 2017 03:15:57 GMT

Windows 10 and Server 2016 will install updates automatically, including 
shutting down and restarting the machine. Can POV-Ray cope with this? 
Can it continue the render later?


Mike

[Bald Eagle] Re: How to generate sphere and cylinder with csv... [3304 days 1 hour and 49 minutes ago]

Mon, 10 Apr 2017 12:05:00 GMT

Alain <kua### [at] videotronca> wrote:

> > ----------------what does the code blocks below
> > do?---------------------------#declare EarthRadius = 6367; //radius in km
> > #declare EarthRadius = 6367*0.621371; //radius in mi
>
> Nothing at all as those variables are never used.
> In some other cases, those are usefull for some reason, like actually
> following Earth's curvature.

You were too hasty, my friend.
EarthRadius is used in the S2C macro as the multiplier for the trig functions.

S2C converts Sperical coordinates (lat, long) to Cartesian (x, y, z) and
C2S obviously does the reverse.
I just coded up both for completeness.

If you use layered textures with an alpha channel, you don't need to code up
separate boxes for your maps.   You can just sequentially apply each texture to
the box, with the last texture defined being "on top" - just like applying
successive layers of paint.

See the docs or Lohmueller's site, or maybe the standard insert menu.

[Alain] Re: How to generate sphere and cylinder with csv... [3304 days 11 hours and 22 minutes ago]

Mon, 10 Apr 2017 02:31:53 GMT

Le 17-04-08 à 09:52, Jeff a écrit :
> "Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
>> "Jeff" <jef### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
>
> here is my code now:
>
> global_settings {
>  assumed_gamma 1.0
>  #default {texture {pigment {rgb <1, 1, 1>} finish {ambient 1}}}
>  ambient_light rgb <1, 1, 1> // <======== flat, even illumination

WRONG !
ambient_light is multiplied with the ambient component of the finish. 
rgb<1,1,1> is the DEFAULT value.
So, that line is really a «no operation».
By the way, it's bad practice to place the #default statement into the 
global_settings block. It have nothing to do in that location. Place it 
after.

global_settings{ assumed_gamma 1}
#default{ texture{ pigment{ rgb 1 } finish{ ambient 1 }}}


> }
>
> #include "colors.inc"
>
> camera {
>  location <55,25,80>
>  right    x*image_width/image_height
>  look_at <55,0,126>
> }
>
> light_source{ <10,10,-10>  color rgb <1, 1, 1>}
>
> #declare Feet = 12;
> //  Sized image Map - 1 unit thick box
> #declare XSize = 4*Feet;
> #declare ImageMap = pigment {image_map {png "beijing.png" once} };
> #declare Resolution = max_extent (ImageMap);
> #declare Resolution = Resolution + <0, 0, 1>;
>
> #declare ImageMappedBox =
>  box {0, 1
>   texture {
>    pigment {ImageMap}
>   }
>   translate <0, 0, 0>
>   scale Resolution*(1/Resolution.x)*XSize
>   rotate <90,0,0>
>   //translate y*(Resolution.y / Resolution.x)*XSize/2
>  }
> object {ImageMappedBox translate <31,0,115>}
> object {ImageMappedBox translate <31,5,115>}
> object {ImageMappedBox translate <31,10,115>}
> object {ImageMappedBox translate <31,15,115>}
>
> ----------------what does the code blocks below
> do?---------------------------#declare EarthRadius = 6367; //radius in km
> #declare EarthRadius = 6367*0.621371; //radius in mi

Nothing at all as those variables are never used.
In some other cases, those are usefull for some reason, like actually 
following Earth's curvature.

[Jeff] Re: How to generate sphere and cylinder with csv... [3305 days 23 hours and 59 minutes ago]

Sat, 8 Apr 2017 13:55:00 GMT

"Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
> "Jeff" <jef### [at] gmailcom> wrote:

here is my code now:

global_settings {
 assumed_gamma 1.0
 #default {texture {pigment {rgb <1, 1, 1>} finish {ambient 1}}}
 ambient_light rgb <1, 1, 1> // <======== flat, even illumination
}

#include "colors.inc"

camera {
 location <55,25,80>
 right    x*image_width/image_height
 look_at <55,0,126>
}

light_source{ <10,10,-10>  color rgb <1, 1, 1>}

#declare Feet = 12;
//  Sized image Map - 1 unit thick box
#declare XSize = 4*Feet;
#declare ImageMap = pigment {image_map {png "beijing.png" once} };
#declare Resolution = max_extent (ImageMap);
#declare Resolution = Resolution + <0, 0, 1>;

#declare ImageMappedBox =
 box {0, 1
  texture {
   pigment {ImageMap}
  }
  translate <0, 0, 0>
  scale Resolution*(1/Resolution.x)*XSize
  rotate <90,0,0>
  //translate y*(Resolution.y / Resolution.x)*XSize/2
 }
object {ImageMappedBox translate <31,0,115>}
object {ImageMappedBox translate <31,5,115>}
object {ImageMappedBox translate <31,10,115>}
object {ImageMappedBox translate <31,15,115>}

----------------what does the code blocks below
do?---------------------------#declare EarthRadius = 6367; //radius in km
#declare EarthRadius = 6367*0.621371; //radius in mi

#macro S2C (Spherical)
 // input - 2d vector: <Latitude, Longitude>
 #local Lat = radians (Spherical.x);
 #local Lon = radians (Spherical.y);
 #local X = EarthRadius * cos(Lat) * cos(Lon);
 #local Y = EarthRadius * cos(Lat) * sin(Lon);
 #local Z = EarthRadius * sin(Lat);
 #local Cartesian = <X, Y, Z>;
 Cartesian;
#end // end macro S2C

#macro C2S (Cartesian)

 #local R = sqrt(pow(Cartesian.x, 2) * pow(Cartesian.y, 2) * pow(Cartesian.z,
2));
 #local Lat = degrees (asin (Cartesian.z / R));
 #local Lon = degrees (atan2 (Cartesian.y, Cartesian.x));
 #local LatLon = <Lat, Lon>;
 LatLon;
#end // end macro C2S
------------------------------------------------------------------
//  data format: "bus", "CN/Beijing", "bus2382659521", 39.9067192, 116.4093833,
//    etc.
#declare Mode = "bus";
#declare City = "CN/Beijing";
#declare ID = "bus23822659521";
#declare Latitude = 39.9067192;
#declare Longitude = 116.4093833;

--------------------------------------------------------------
#declare modez = 'bus' = 0; 'subway' = 5; 'rail' = 10; 'tram = 15
here i try to declare different z position for different mode, so they are not
in the same height(layer of picture)
---------------------------------------------------------------
// count locations for sizing array
#declare Locations = 0;
#fopen nodes "nodes.csv" read
#while (defined (nodes))
 #read (nodes, mode, city, ID, Latitude, Longitude)
 #declare Locations = Locations + 1;
#end
#fclose nodes

#declare _mode = bus[Locations];
#declare _city = CN/Beijing[Locations];
#declare _ID = bus2382659521[Locations];
#declare _Latitude = 39.9067192[Locations];
#declare _Longitude = 116.4093833[Locations];
#declare _XYZ = Longitude[Locations];Latitude[Locations];modesz[Locations]

// input data into array
#declare Datapoint = 0;
#fopen links "links.csv" read
#while (defined (links))
 #read (links, Mode, Source, Target, Length)

 #declare _Mode [Datapoint] = Mode;
 #declare _Source [Datapoint] = Source;
 #declare _Target [Datapoint] = Target;
 #declare _Length [Datapoint] = Length;
 #declare _XYZ [Datapoint] = S2C (<_Longitude[Datapoint],
_Latitude[Datapoint,_XYZ[Datapoint]>);
 #declare Datapoint = Datapoint + 1;
#end
#fclose links

#declare Marker = 0.25;
#declare Line = 0.05;
#declare Linecolor = pigment {Magenta};

#for (Point, 0, Locations-1)

 #if (Mode = "bus")
  #declare Color = pigment {Red};
 #elseif (Mode = "subway")
  #declare Color = pigment {Green};
 #elseif (Mode = "rail")
  #declare Color = pigment {Blue};
 #elseif (Mode = "tram")
  #declare Color = pigment {Yellow};
 #else
  #debug "Unidentified Location Type.  \n"
  #declare Color = pigment {White};
 #end

 #declare S = 1; //<0.1, 0.1, 1/4000>;
 #declare T = <1350, 1130, -3500>;

 sphere {0.3, Marker pigment {Color} translate _XYZ[Point]*S translate T}

 #if (Point > 0)
  cylinder {LastPoint*S, _XYZ[Point]*S, Line pigment {Linecolor} translate T}
 #end // end if

 #debug concat( "Vector = ", vstr(3, _XYZ[Point]*S, ", ", 3, 0), " \n")

 #declare LastPoint = _XYZ[Point];

#end // end for Point

[Bald Eagle] Re: How to generate sphere and cylinder with csv... [3306 days 18 hours and 24 minutes ago]

Fri, 7 Apr 2017 19:30:01 GMT

"Jeff" <jef### [at] gmailcom> wrote:

> >>#macro S2C (Spherical)
>  // input - 2d vector: <Latitude, Longitude>
>  #local Lat = radians (Spherical.x);
>  #local Lon = radians (Spherical.y);
>  #local X = EarthRadius * cos(Lat) * cos(Lon);
>  #local Y = EarthRadius * cos(Lat) * sin(Lon);
>  #local Z = EarthRadius * sin(Lat);
> >>#local Cartesian = <X
>
> "" is there anything that i have to change in this part(above and below)? bcos i
> just realized i gave the wrong questions, i said "use the
> "lon" column as the Y position of the sphere, and "lat" column as the Z
> position?" , but its actually use the "lon" column as the X position of the
> sphere and "lat" as the Y positions of the sphere""

Well, since there's x, y, AND z positions of a sphere, and from the above
formulae x and y are computed from BOTH the lat and lon, that's a hard question
to answer - maybe think on it some more.

> "" HERE TOO ? ""

vide supra.

> ""and this part, do i have to do it just one of 'em? or what? ,

I don't understand - one of WHAT?

> i would like to
> change it like this (below) ""
>
> #declare Mode = "";
> #declare City = "";
> #declare ID = "";
> #declare Latitude = 0;
> #declare Longitude = 0;

Sure, that's fine - you're just changing my variable names - it's just a name
internal to the code - otherwise it's irrelevant - it could be called Q or
hhfdiuahfishv for all the computer cares.


> #declare Locations = 0;------> " what does this line do ? "
When you're going to use a variable for something, it needs to be initialized.
So I give it a value of zero.

> #fopen DataFile "LatLongData.txt" read
> #while (defined (DataFile))
>  #read (DataFile, Type, Location, ID, Latitude, Longitude)
>  #declare Locations = Locations + 1;
> #end
> #fclose DataFile
>
> "" this part, i would like to change it to like this (below)""
>
> // count locations for sizing array
> #declare Locations = 0; # i dont understand what is the "Locations" for????
> #fopen Nodes "nodes.csv" read
> #while (defined (Nodes))
>  #read (Nodes, Mode, City, ID, Longitude, Latitude)
>  #declare Locations = Locations + 1;
> #end
> #fclose Nodes

Again, just names.

> ---------------------------------------------------
> >>#declare _Type = array[Locations];
> #declare _Location = array[Locations];
> #declare _ID = array[Locations];
> #declare _Latitude = array[Locations];
> #declare _Longitude = array[Locations];
> #declare _XYZ = array[Locations];
>
> "" and i have problems to understand the block of codes above ""
> -----------------------------------------------------------------
I'm making arrays of values - like a spreadsheet.
rows of values, each with a "header" - the name of the array variable.
Every time I read a line in from the "CSV" file, I increased the "Locations"
counter by one, thus counting how many places you have to plot points.
Then I use that final value of the counter to dimension the array - to give it
the right size.   If Locations = 25, then each array - each "column" of values
in my "spreadsheet" has 25 slots.

(Don't freak out - arrays are kind of a pita the work with at times, and macros
can get a bit hairy too, but using them can make other tasks easier in the long
run)

Move your cursor to "array" and hit F1, and it should bring up the array section
in the Help files...
Or just Google  POV-Ray array and see what pops up.
(be conscious of what version you're looking at the documentation for)
I think the wiki is the most up to date location for documentation.

[Jeff] Re: How to generate sphere and cylinder with csv... [3306 days 20 hours and 54 minutes ago]

Fri, 7 Apr 2017 17:00:01 GMT

"Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
> clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
>
> > My guess would be that you have arbitrary text in the CSV file; in that
> > case, you'll need to make sure it is enclosed in double quotes, e.g.
> >
> >     "Foo"
> >
> > instead of
> >
> >     Foo
>
> Correct.
> Jeff, look at the comment in the code:
> //  data format: "bus", "CN/Beijing", "bus2382659521", 116.4093833, 39.9067192,
> //    etc.
>
> That's exactly how it all will need to be formatted.
> I'd probably use a spreadsheet, "copy" the data into an adjacent set of cells,
> by using a formula that surrounds the relevant data with double quotes (the
> String Literal POV-Ray is wanting for the #read directive) and commas and then
> copying and pasting that into a text document, or displaying the data on a
> separate spreadsheet and saving it to CSV format that way.
>
> ="\""&A1&"\", "&"\""&A2&"\", "&A3&"\", "&A4&"\", "&A5&"\","
> or something like that
>
> POV-Ray is a raytracer that generates 2D static images.  It can't render a 3D
> model that you can then move around and inspect on-the-fly.
> You can make an animation from a large series of static images sequentially
> arranged, but it's as interactive as a VHS movie.
>
> It seems like you have a fair amount of stuff you want to do - so for now, I'd
> step back for a sec, write up some simple scenes from scratch, "wrap your head
> around" POV-Ray's syntax, error messages, definitions, and other things peculiar
> to it, and just get your 4 image layers working all by themselves.
> You will have to use "transmit all 0.9" (or some other value) for the top 3
> layers, so that you can see through them.
>
>
> My standard bit of saved code for Image Mapping a box is:
>
> #declare Feet = 12;
> //  Sized image Map - 1 unit thick box
> #declare XSize = 4*Feet;
> #declare ImageMap = pigment {image_map {png "MyImage.png" once} };
> #declare Resolution = max_extent (ImageMap);
> #declare Resolution = Resolution + <0, 0, 1>;
>
>
> #declare ImageMappedBox =
>  box {0, 1
>   texture {
>    pigment {ImageMap}
>   }
>   translate <-0.5, -0.5, -0.5>
>   scale Resolution*(1/Resolution.x)*XSize
>   //translate y*(Resolution.y / Resolution.x)*XSize/2
>  }
>
> object {ImageMappedBox translate <0, 0, 0>}
>
> Set yourself up some visible axes, and maybe a grid to give yourself some
> orientation in the scene and maybe a sphere at the origin for a reference
> marker.  (AT the beginning, it's easy to forget to include a camera, a light
> source, get you axes mixed up, use right-hand rule instead of left hand rule,
> etc)
>
> You're going to need all these skills once you start creating a scene that's set
> up for rendering frames for an animation - because you're going to need to
> understand how the guts of the code works when you write the formulas with the
> clock variable to control how everything is rendered in each successive frame.
>
> Do everything stepwise, and save a working result with a different filename, so
> that as you progressive, you don't overwrite your Last-Known-Good scene.
>
> 1. make a basic scene with axes
> 2. add a grid to give a sense of scale
> 3. add 4 layered boxes
> 4. move you camera around by editing the code and rerendering
> 4a. save as a different filename
> 5. add image_map textures
> 6. adjust transmit and scaling
> ..
> ..
> ..
> N. add point and lines from the first scene code
> ..
> ..
> ..
> N++. define the formulas to create a series of renders for animating
> N++1.  Run you .ini animation file and let it churn them all out
> N++2. Use a 3rd party software (VideoMach, etc) to make the static images into a
> video file
>
> and then tweak, tweak, tweak, rewrite and debug   ;)
>
> There are plenty of example scenes, Lohmueller's site, the standard include
> drop-down menu, and the POV-Ray scene files sections of the forum.
>
> Only you will know exactly what you want, and we can't write it all for you -
> you're best served by spending a few hours ( ;) ) grappling with what we all
> struggled with when we first started doing this.
>
> But we are here to help  :)


hi, thank you so much. here is my code now. so, i have for layers , and a red
sphere.

#include "colors.inc"

camera {
       location <55,30,90>
       look_at <55,0,126>
       rotate <0,clock*360,0>
       }

light_source  {
              <55,30,75>
              color White
              }

global_settings {
 assumed_gamma 0.1
 #default {texture {pigment {rgb <1, 1, 1>} finish {ambient 1}}}
 ambient_light rgb <1, 1, 1> // <======== flat, even illumination
}

#declare EarthRadius = 6367*0.621371; //radius in m

#declare Feet = 12;
//  Sized image Map - 1 unit thick box
#declare XSize = 4*Feet;
#declare ImageMap = pigment {image_map {png "beijing.png" once} };
#declare Resolution = max_extent (ImageMap);
#declare Resolution = Resolution + <0, 0, 1>;
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>#macro S2C (Spherical)
 // input - 2d vector: <Latitude, Longitude>
 #local Lat = radians (Spherical.x);
 #local Lon = radians (Spherical.y);
 #local X = EarthRadius * cos(Lat) * cos(Lon);
 #local Y = EarthRadius * cos(Lat) * sin(Lon);
 #local Z = EarthRadius * sin(Lat);
>>#local Cartesian = <X

"" is there anything that i have to change in this part(above and below)? bcos i
just realized i gave the wrong questions, i said "use the
"lon" column as the Y position of the sphere, and "lat" column as the Z
position?" , but its actually use the "lon" column as the X position of the
sphere and "lat" as the Y positions of the sphere""

#macro C2S (Cartesian)

 #local R = sqrt(pow(Cartesian.x, 2) * pow(Cartesian.y, 2) * pow(Cartesian.z,
2));
 #local Lat = degrees (asin (Cartesian.z / R));
 #local Lon = degrees (atan2 (Cartesian.y, Cartesian.x));
 #local LatLon = <Lat, Lon>;
 LatLon;
#end // end macro C2S

"" HERE TOO ? ""
------------------------------------------------------------------------
#declare ImageMappedBox =
 box {0, 1
  texture {
   pigment {ImageMap}
  }
  translate <0, 0, 0>
  scale Resolution*(1/Resolution.x)*XSize
  rotate <90,0,0>
  //translate y*(Resolution.y / Resolution.x)*XSize/2
 }

object {ImageMappedBox translate <30,0,110>}
object {ImageMappedBox translate <30,5,110>}
object {ImageMappedBox translate <30,10,110>}
object {ImageMappedBox translate <30,15,110>}

sphere {
        <55,15,110>, 2
        pigment {Red}
}
--------------------------------------------------------
>>//  data format: "bus", "CN/Beijing", "bus2382659521", 116.4093833, 39.9067192,
//    etc.
#declare Type = "";
#declare Location = "";
#declare ID = "";
#declare Latitude = 0;
#declare Longitude = 0;

""and this part, do i have to do it just one of 'em? or what? , i would like to
change it like this (below) ""

#declare Mode = "";
#declare City = "";
#declare ID = "";
#declare Latitude = 0;
#declare Longitude = 0;
------------------------------------------------
>>// count locations for sizing array
#declare Locations = 0;------> " what does this line do ? "
#fopen DataFile "LatLongData.txt" read
#while (defined (DataFile))
 #read (DataFile, Type, Location, ID, Latitude, Longitude)
 #declare Locations = Locations + 1;
#end
#fclose DataFile

"" this part, i would like to change it to like this (below)""

// count locations for sizing array
#declare Locations = 0; # i dont understand what is the "Locations" for????
#fopen Nodes "nodes.csv" read
#while (defined (Nodes))
 #read (Nodes, Mode, City, ID, Longitude, Latitude)
 #declare Locations = Locations + 1;
#end
#fclose Nodes
---------------------------------------------------
>>#declare _Type = array[Locations];
#declare _Location = array[Locations];
#declare _ID = array[Locations];
#declare _Latitude = array[Locations];
#declare _Longitude = array[Locations];
#declare _XYZ = array[Locations];

"" and i have problems to understand the block of codes above ""
-----------------------------------------------------------------

[Alain] Re: How to generate sphere and cylinder with csv... [3307 days 22 hours and 20 minutes ago]

Thu, 6 Apr 2017 15:33:44 GMT

Le 17-04-06 à 02:17, Jeff a écrit :
> Stephen <mca### [at] aolcom> wrote:
>> On 4/1/2017 6:47 AM, Jeff wrote:
>>> example picture:
>>>
https://www.google.com/search?q=multi-layer+networks&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiu9YLwxoLTAhUOwGMKHdU9CTs
> Q_AU
>
>> I use a very thin box instead of a plane and an image_map.
>>
>> Or you can use a polygon. (From help file)
>>
>>
>> polygon {
>>    4,
>>    <0, 0>, <0, 1>, <1, 1>, <1, 0>
>>    texture {
>>      finish { ambient 1 diffuse 0 }
>>      pigment { image_map { gif "test.gif"  } }
>>      }
>>    //scale and rotate as needed here
>>    }
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Regards
>>      Stephen
>
> hi, thanks for answering. however, i want the picture to be normal square that
> is adjustable in size. i try it to use the polygon , but i dont think its what i
> want to do. i want 4 same pictures stack on the top of each other with a little
> bit of distance. :)
>


#declare Base_poly = polygon{5, <0,0>,<0,1>,<1,1>,<1,0>,<0,0>}
// a featureless 4 sided polygon

union{
#declare V_Pos = 0;
#while(V_Pos<4)
  object{ Base_poly translate 0.1*z}
  #declare Z_Pos = Z_Pos + 1;
#end
  texture{image_map{gif"test.gif"}} finish{emission 1 diffuse 0}}
// apply the texture to all polys at once
  scale Your_Scale
  rotate Rotation
  translate Somewhere
}

[Bald Eagle] Re: How to generate sphere and cylinder with csv... [3308 days and 49 minutes ago]

Thu, 6 Apr 2017 13:05:00 GMT

clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:

> My guess would be that you have arbitrary text in the CSV file; in that
> case, you'll need to make sure it is enclosed in double quotes, e.g.
>
>     "Foo"
>
> instead of
>
>     Foo

Correct.
Jeff, look at the comment in the code:
//  data format: "bus", "CN/Beijing", "bus2382659521", 116.4093833, 39.9067192,
//    etc.

That's exactly how it all will need to be formatted.
I'd probably use a spreadsheet, "copy" the data into an adjacent set of cells,
by using a formula that surrounds the relevant data with double quotes (the
String Literal POV-Ray is wanting for the #read directive) and commas and then
copying and pasting that into a text document, or displaying the data on a
separate spreadsheet and saving it to CSV format that way.

="\""&A1&"\", "&"\""&A2&"\", "&A3&"\", "&A4&"\", "&A5&"\","
or something like that

POV-Ray is a raytracer that generates 2D static images.  It can't render a 3D
model that you can then move around and inspect on-the-fly.
You can make an animation from a large series of static images sequentially
arranged, but it's as interactive as a VHS movie.

It seems like you have a fair amount of stuff you want to do - so for now, I'd
step back for a sec, write up some simple scenes from scratch, "wrap your head
around" POV-Ray's syntax, error messages, definitions, and other things peculiar
to it, and just get your 4 image layers working all by themselves.
You will have to use "transmit all 0.9" (or some other value) for the top 3
layers, so that you can see through them.

My standard bit of saved code for Image Mapping a box is:

#declare Feet = 12;
//  Sized image Map - 1 unit thick box
#declare XSize = 4*Feet;
#declare ImageMap = pigment {image_map {png "MyImage.png" once} };
#declare Resolution = max_extent (ImageMap);
#declare Resolution = Resolution + <0, 0, 1>;

#declare ImageMappedBox =
 box {0, 1
  texture {
   pigment {ImageMap}
  }
  translate <-0.5, -0.5, -0.5>
  scale Resolution*(1/Resolution.x)*XSize
  //translate y*(Resolution.y / Resolution.x)*XSize/2
 }

object {ImageMappedBox translate <0, 0, 0>}

Set yourself up some visible axes, and maybe a grid to give yourself some
orientation in the scene and maybe a sphere at the origin for a reference
marker.  (AT the beginning, it's easy to forget to include a camera, a light
source, get you axes mixed up, use right-hand rule instead of left hand rule,
etc)

You're going to need all these skills once you start creating a scene that's set
up for rendering frames for an animation - because you're going to need to
understand how the guts of the code works when you write the formulas with the
clock variable to control how everything is rendered in each successive frame.

Do everything stepwise, and save a working result with a different filename, so
that as you progressive, you don't overwrite your Last-Known-Good scene.

1. make a basic scene with axes
2. add a grid to give a sense of scale
3. add 4 layered boxes
4. move you camera around by editing the code and rerendering
4a. save as a different filename
5. add image_map textures
6. adjust transmit and scaling
..
..
..
N. add point and lines from the first scene code
..
..
..
N++. define the formulas to create a series of renders for animating
N++1.  Run you .ini animation file and let it churn them all out
N++2. Use a 3rd party software (VideoMach, etc) to make the static images into a
video file

and then tweak, tweak, tweak, rewrite and debug   ;)

There are plenty of example scenes, Lohmueller's site, the standard include
drop-down menu, and the POV-Ray scene files sections of the forum.

Only you will know exactly what you want, and we can't write it all for you -
you're best served by spending a few hours ( ;) ) grappling with what we all
struggled with when we first started doing this.

But we are here to help  :)

[clipka] Re: How to generate sphere and cylinder with csv... [3308 days 5 hours and 35 minutes ago]

Thu, 6 Apr 2017 08:19:36 GMT

Am 06.04.2017 um 07:03 schrieb Jeff:

> Hi, when i try to run the code it says "Parse Error: Expected'float,vector,or
> string literal', string identifier found instead".
> 
> do you know what cause the problem?

My guess would be that you have arbitrary text in the CSV file; in that
case, you'll need to make sure it is enclosed in double quotes, e.g.

    "Foo"

instead of

    Foo

[Stephen] Re: How to generate sphere and cylinder with csv... [3308 days 6 hours and 49 minutes ago]

Thu, 6 Apr 2017 07:05:11 GMT

On 4/6/2017 7:17 AM, Jeff wrote:
> Stephen <mca### [at] aolcom> wrote:
>> On 4/1/2017 6:47 AM, Jeff wrote:
>>> example picture:
>>>
https://www.google.com/search?q=multi-layer+networks&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiu9YLwxoLTAhUOwGMKHdU9CTs
> Q_AU
>
>> I use a very thin box instead of a plane and an image_map.
>>
>> Or you can use a polygon. (From help file)
>>
>>
>> polygon {
>>     4,
>>     <0, 0>, <0, 1>, <1, 1>, <1, 0>
>>     texture {
>>       finish { ambient 1 diffuse 0 }
>>       pigment { image_map { gif "test.gif"  } }
>>       }
>>     //scale and rotate as needed here
>>     }
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Regards
>>       Stephen
>
> hi, thanks for answering. however, i want the picture to be normal square that
> is adjustable in size. i try it to use the polygon ,

A box would have been better. Once you have the image in the box, the 
way you want it. Scale and translate the box. The image follows. :)

> but i dont think its what i
> want to do. i want 4 same pictures stack on the top of each other with a little
> bit of distance. :)
>

I would use four boxes for simplicity.
I can think of a couple of ways of making one object that has four 
images stacked.
Create a mesh and uv map the images in layers.
Create a density map with the images in layers and use media.

Four boxes in a union would be the simplest and easiest way to do it.

-- 

Regards
     Stephen

[Jeff] Re: How to generate sphere and cylinder with csv... [3308 days 7 hours and 34 minutes ago]

Thu, 6 Apr 2017 06:20:00 GMT

Stephen <mca### [at] aolcom> wrote:
> On 4/1/2017 6:47 AM, Jeff wrote:
> > example picture:
> >
https://www.google.com/search?q=multi-layer+networks&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiu9YLwxoLTAhUOwGMKHdU9CTs
Q_AU

> I use a very thin box instead of a plane and an image_map.
>
> Or you can use a polygon. (From help file)
>
>
> polygon {
>    4,
>    <0, 0>, <0, 1>, <1, 1>, <1, 0>
>    texture {
>      finish { ambient 1 diffuse 0 }
>      pigment { image_map { gif "test.gif"  } }
>      }
>    //scale and rotate as needed here
>    }
>
>
> --
>
> Regards
>      Stephen

hi, thanks for answering. however, i want the picture to be normal square that
is adjustable in size. i try it to use the polygon , but i dont think its what i
want to do. i want 4 same pictures stack on the top of each other with a little
bit of distance. :)

[Jeff] Re: How to generate sphere and cylinder with csv... [3308 days 7 hours and 39 minutes ago]

Thu, 6 Apr 2017 06:15:01 GMT

clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
> So you want to render not to a static image, but rather to /some/ output
> file format that allows for free manipulation of the camera angle?
 movie, and letting the user jog forward and
> backward through the movie.

-- yes , i want to use my .png file , as the layer , and the nodes and the links
will be on the top of the layer(.png* file).
and i want the camera to rotate horizontal 360*, but i if i could rotate the
camera the way i want it after i render it would be better.

[Jeff] Re: How to generate sphere and cylinder with csv... [3308 days 8 hours and 49 minutes ago]

Thu, 6 Apr 2017 05:05:00 GMT

"Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
> "Jeff" <jef### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
>
> You just need to hit F1 and type in image_map.
> or search around the web
> http://www.joshuarenglish.com/cyclopedia/image_planar.html
> http://www.f-lohmueller.de/pov_tut/tex/tex_870e.htm
>
>
> > another question is , is it possible to rotate, zoom in and zoom out freely in
> > POV-RAY?
>
> Of course.  Read the docs on the camera {}
> You can zoom in, out, rotate, pan, translate, change camera angle, and use all
> sorts of different camera types other than the usual perspective camera.
>
> > i mean, when you have thousands or even millions nodes and links and its so many
> > of em, that you need to put your camera far far away, but then the nodes and
> > links are sooooo small.
>
> Yes, that's a problem with a whole field of study - presentation, analysis, and
> visualization of multidimensional data.
>
> > so, how to deliver the information effectively that people can see all of the
> > nodes and links, but at the same time its not too small (or too hard) to see?
> > is there any solutions to solve this problem in POV-RAY?
>
> There's the size of the nodes, the thickness of the connecting lines, the
> contrast between those and the background, etc.
>
> > so, how did you do it in your experience that you have done it with millions of
> > em?
>
> Well, you have to determine what you want to show, and why.
> Then you have to do the math to place the camera and adjust the view angle and
> zoom.
>
> I'd work on just getting the simple overlays to look good, as that will likely
> take some time to get scaled and transparently overlaid properly.
> Then see how all the data points look once they're all plotted on the map(s)


Hi, when i try to run the code it says "Parse Error: Expected'float,vector,or
string literal', string identifier found instead".

do you know what cause the problem?

[Bald Eagle] Re: How to generate sphere and cylinder with csv... [3312 days 18 hours and 29 minutes ago]

Sat, 1 Apr 2017 19:25:00 GMT

"Jeff" <jef### [at] gmailcom> wrote:

You just need to hit F1 and type in image_map.
or search around the web
http://www.joshuarenglish.com/cyclopedia/image_planar.html
http://www.f-lohmueller.de/pov_tut/tex/tex_870e.htm

> another question is , is it possible to rotate, zoom in and zoom out freely in
> POV-RAY?

Of course.  Read the docs on the camera {}
You can zoom in, out, rotate, pan, translate, change camera angle, and use all
sorts of different camera types other than the usual perspective camera.

> i mean, when you have thousands or even millions nodes and links and its so many
> of em, that you need to put your camera far far away, but then the nodes and
> links are sooooo small.

Yes, that's a problem with a whole field of study - presentation, analysis, and
visualization of multidimensional data.

> so, how to deliver the information effectively that people can see all of the
> nodes and links, but at the same time its not too small (or too hard) to see?
> is there any solutions to solve this problem in POV-RAY?

There's the size of the nodes, the thickness of the connecting lines, the
contrast between those and the background, etc.

> so, how did you do it in your experience that you have done it with millions of
> em?

Well, you have to determine what you want to show, and why.
Then you have to do the math to place the camera and adjust the view angle and
zoom.

I'd work on just getting the simple overlays to look good, as that will likely
take some time to get scaled and transparently overlaid properly.
Then see how all the data points look once they're all plotted on the map(s)

[clipka] Re: How to generate sphere and cylinder with csv... [3313 days 6 hours and 6 minutes ago]

Sat, 1 Apr 2017 07:47:47 GMT

Am 01.04.2017 um 08:01 schrieb Jeff:
> "Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
>> In the wee hours, I was thinking it would be nice to be able to generate a
>> Delaunay triangulation of data like this.
> 
> another question is , is it possible to rotate, zoom in and zoom out freely in
> POV-RAY?
> 
> i mean, when you have thousands or even millions nodes and links and its so many
> of em, that you need to put your camera far far away, but then the nodes and
> links are sooooo small.
> 
> so, how to deliver the information effectively that people can see all of the
> nodes and links, but at the same time its not too small (or too hard) to see?
> is there any solutions to solve this problem in POV-RAY?

So you want to render not to a static image, but rather to /some/ output
file format that allows for free manipulation of the camera angle?

As for zooming in, that's easy: Just render a humongously large image.

As for rotating the camera around the scene, that's tricky. I think some
sites that let you see a product in 3D actually fake this feature by
technically showing a paused movie, and letting the user jog forward and
backward through the movie.

[clipka] Re: How to generate sphere and cylinder with csv... [3313 days 6 hours and 14 minutes ago]

Sat, 1 Apr 2017 07:39:38 GMT

Am 01.04.2017 um 09:17 schrieb Stephen:
> On 4/1/2017 6:47 AM, Jeff wrote:
>> "Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
>>> In the wee hours, I was thinking it would be nice to be able to
>>> generate a
>>> Delaunay triangulation of data like this.
>>
>> Hi, i want to a question.
>> 1. is it possible to use pictures as a plane ? so, i want to use the
>> pictures as
>> the layers, but because i have 4 mode in this file, i need 4 layers
>> for it.
>> so, each layer will have their own picture as the plane.
>>
>> example picture:
>>
https://www.google.com/search?q=multi-layer+networks&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiu9YLwxoLTAhUOwGMKHdU9CTsQ_AU
>>
>> IBigB&biw=1536&bih=724
>>
>> i want to have 4 vertical layers and align to each other.
>>
>>
>>
> I use a very thin box instead of a plane and an image_map.
> 
> Or you can use a polygon. (From help file)

Or use a plane, and use the `once` flag on the image (preventing it from
repeating, and making the rest of the plane transparent) and `use_alpha
on` in the finish (preventing specular highlights from showing up in the
transparent portion).

[Stephen] Re: How to generate sphere and cylinder with csv... [3313 days 6 hours and 37 minutes ago]

Sat, 1 Apr 2017 07:17:22 GMT

On 4/1/2017 6:47 AM, Jeff wrote:
> "Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
>> In the wee hours, I was thinking it would be nice to be able to generate a
>> Delaunay triangulation of data like this.
>
> Hi, i want to a question.
> 1. is it possible to use pictures as a plane ? so, i want to use the pictures as
> the layers, but because i have 4 mode in this file, i need 4 layers for it.
> so, each layer will have their own picture as the plane.
>
> example picture:
>
https://www.google.com/search?q=multi-layer+networks&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiu9YLwxoLTAhUOwGMKHdU9CTsQ_AU
> IBigB&biw=1536&bih=724
>
> i want to have 4 vertical layers and align to each other.
>
>
>
I use a very thin box instead of a plane and an image_map.

Or you can use a polygon. (From help file)


polygon {
   4,
   <0, 0>, <0, 1>, <1, 1>, <1, 0>
   texture {
     finish { ambient 1 diffuse 0 }
     pigment { image_map { gif "test.gif"  } }
     }
   //scale and rotate as needed here
   }


-- 

Regards
     Stephen

[Jeff] Re: How to generate sphere and cylinder with csv... [3313 days 7 hours and 49 minutes ago]

Sat, 1 Apr 2017 06:05:00 GMT

"Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
> In the wee hours, I was thinking it would be nice to be able to generate a
> Delaunay triangulation of data like this.

another question is , is it possible to rotate, zoom in and zoom out freely in
POV-RAY?

i mean, when you have thousands or even millions nodes and links and its so many
of em, that you need to put your camera far far away, but then the nodes and
links are sooooo small.

so, how to deliver the information effectively that people can see all of the
nodes and links, but at the same time its not too small (or too hard) to see?
is there any solutions to solve this problem in POV-RAY?

so, how did you do it in your experience that you have done it with millions of
em?

[Jeff] Re: How to generate sphere and cylinder with csv... [3313 days 8 hours and 4 minutes ago]

Sat, 1 Apr 2017 05:50:00 GMT

"Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
> In the wee hours, I was thinking it would be nice to be able to generate a
> Delaunay triangulation of data like this.

Hi, i want to a question.
1. is it possible to use pictures as a plane ? so, i want to use the pictures as
the layers, but because i have 4 mode in this file, i need 4 layers for it.
so, each layer will have their own picture as the plane.

example picture:
https://www.google.com/search?q=multi-layer+networks&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiu9YLwxoLTAhUOwGMKHdU9CTsQ_AU
IBigB&biw=1536&bih=724

i want to have 4 vertical layers and align to each other.

[Alain] Re: How to generate sphere and cylinder with csv... [3314 days 17 hours and 35 minutes ago]

Thu, 30 Mar 2017 20:19:13 GMT

Le 17-03-29 à 15:17, Bald Eagle a écrit :
> Here ya go.
>
> Pay attention to the data format (see comments)
>
> Needs scaling to fit (a) on the screen better and (b) on top of your image to
> match locations
>
> Better code would have methods built in to catch and reject erroneous data, etc.
>
> But here are the basics.
>
> =========================================================================
>
> // Persistence of Vision Ray Tracer version 3.7
> // Scene Description Language (SDL)
> //      File: Latitude / Longitude Mapping
> //      Version: 1.0
> //      Last updated: 29-Mar-2017
> //      Description: Read Latitude and Longitude from file and connect points on
> map
> //
> // Author:   Bill Walker "Bald Eagle", 2017
> // email:    see posts in news.povray.org
> //
> //------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> #version 3.7;
>
> global_settings {
>  assumed_gamma 1.0
>  #default {texture {pigment {rgb <1, 1, 1>} finish {ambient 1}}}
>  ambient_light rgb <1, 1, 1> // <======== flat, even illumination
> }
>
This is the default value for ambient_lights. So, it's prety useless for 
what you want to do.

Beter to use :
#default{finish{ambient 1 diffuse 0}}
This statement is not a in it's place inside the global_settings block.

Even beter. Don't play with ambient, but, instead, use the +q0 switch.
With that switch, all lights are ignored, as well as reflections and 
refraction, only full ambient pigments are used.
You also get the advantage that it render faster.

[Jeff] Re: How to generate sphere and cylinder with csv... [3314 days 20 hours and 49 minutes ago]

Thu, 30 Mar 2017 17:05:01 GMT

"Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
> Here ya go.
>
> Pay attention to the data format (see comments)
>
> Needs scaling to fit (a) on the screen better and (b) on top of your image to
> match locations
>
> Better code would have methods built in to catch and reject erroneous data, etc.
>
> But here are the basics.
>
> =========================================================================
>
> // Persistence of Vision Ray Tracer version 3.7
> // Scene Description Language (SDL)
> //      File: Latitude / Longitude Mapping
> //      Version: 1.0
> //      Last updated: 29-Mar-2017
> //      Description: Read Latitude and Longitude from file and connect points on
> map
> //
> // Author:   Bill Walker "Bald Eagle", 2017
> // email:    see posts in news.povray.org
> //
> //------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> #version 3.7;
>
> global_settings {
>  assumed_gamma 1.0
>  #default {texture {pigment {rgb <1, 1, 1>} finish {ambient 1}}}
>  ambient_light rgb <1, 1, 1> // <======== flat, even illumination
> }
>
> #include "colors.inc"
>
> camera {
>  location <0, 0, -1>
>  right    x*image_width/image_height
>  look_at <0, 0, 0>
> }
>
> light_source{ <50, 50, -100>  color rgb <1, 1, 1>}
>
> // #declare EarthRadius = 6367; //radius in km
> #declare EarthRadius = 6367*0.621371; //radius in mi
>
> #macro S2C (Spherical)
>  // input - 2d vector: <Latitude, Longitude>
>  #local Lat = radians (Spherical.x);
>  #local Lon = radians (Spherical.y);
>  #local X = EarthRadius * cos(Lat) * cos(Lon);
>  #local Y = EarthRadius * cos(Lat) * sin(Lon);
>  #local Z = EarthRadius * sin(Lat);
>  #local Cartesian = <X, Y, Z>;
>  Cartesian;
> #end // end macro S2C
>
>
> #macro C2S (Cartesian)
>
>  #local R = sqrt(pow(Cartesian.x, 2) * pow(Cartesian.y, 2) * pow(Cartesian.z,
> 2));
>  #local Lat = degrees (asin (Cartesian.z / R));
>  #local Lon = degrees (atan2 (Cartesian.y, Cartesian.x));
>  #local LatLon = <Lat, Lon>;
>  LatLon;
> #end // end macro C2S
>
> //  data format: "bus", "CN/Beijing", "bus2382659521", 116.4093833, 39.9067192,
> //    etc.
> #declare Type = "";
> #declare Location = "";
> #declare ID = "";
> #declare Latitude = 0;
> #declare Longitude = 0;
>
> // count locations for sizing array
> #declare Locations = 0;
> #fopen DataFile "LatLongData.txt" read
> #while (defined (DataFile))
>  #read (DataFile, Type, Location, ID, Latitude, Longitude)
>  #declare Locations = Locations + 1;
> #end
> #fclose DataFile
>
> #declare _Type = array[Locations];
> #declare _Location = array[Locations];
> #declare _ID = array[Locations];
> #declare _Latitude = array[Locations];
> #declare _Longitude = array[Locations];
> #declare _XYZ = array[Locations];
>
> // input data into array
> #declare Datapoint = 0;
> #fopen DataFile "LatLongData.txt" read
> #while (defined (DataFile))
>  #read (DataFile, Type, Location, ID, Latitude, Longitude)
>
>  #declare _Type [Datapoint] = Type;
>  #declare _Location [Datapoint] = Location;
>  #declare _ID [Datapoint] = ID;
>  #declare _Latitude [Datapoint] = Latitude;
>  #declare _Longitude [Datapoint] = Longitude;
>  #declare _XYZ [Datapoint] = S2C (<_Latitude[Datapoint],
> _Longitude[Datapoint]>);
>  #declare Datapoint = Datapoint + 1;
> #end
> #fclose DataFile
>
> #declare Marker = 0.25;
> #declare Line = 0.05;
> #declare Linecolor = pigment {Magenta};
>
> #for (Point, 0, Locations-1)
>
>  #if (Type = "bus")
>   #declare Color = pigment {Red};
>  #elseif (Type = "subway")
>   #declare Color = pigment {Green};
>  #elseif (Type = "rail")
>   #declare Color = pigment {Blue};
>  #elseif (Type = "tram")
>   #declare Color = pigment {Yellow};
>  #else
>   #debug "Unidentified Location Type.  \n"
>   #declare Color = pigment {White};
>  #end
>
>  #declare S = 1; //<0.1, 0.1, 1/4000>;
>  #declare T = <1350, 1130, -3500>;
>
>  sphere {0, Marker pigment {Color} translate _XYZ[Point]*S translate T}
>
>  #if (Point > 0)
>   cylinder {LastPoint*S, _XYZ[Point]*S, Line pigment {Linecolor} translate T}
>  #end // end if
>
>  #debug concat( "Vector = ", vstr(3, _XYZ[Point]*S, ", ", 3, 0), " \n")
>
>  #declare LastPoint = _XYZ[Point];
>
> #end // end for Point

Thank you so much, really appreciate it :)

[Bald Eagle] Re: How to generate sphere and cylinder with csv... [3315 days 2 hours and 14 minutes ago]

Thu, 30 Mar 2017 11:40:00 GMT

In the wee hours, I was thinking it would be nice to be able to generate a
Delaunay triangulation of data like this.

[Bald Eagle] Re: How to generate sphere and cylinder with csv... [3315 days 18 hours and 34 minutes ago]

Wed, 29 Mar 2017 19:20:00 GMT

Here ya go.

Pay attention to the data format (see comments)

Needs scaling to fit (a) on the screen better and (b) on top of your image to
match locations

Better code would have methods built in to catch and reject erroneous data, etc.

But here are the basics.

=========================================================================

// Persistence of Vision Ray Tracer version 3.7
// Scene Description Language (SDL)
//      File: Latitude / Longitude Mapping
//      Version: 1.0
//      Last updated: 29-Mar-2017
//      Description: Read Latitude and Longitude from file and connect points on
map
//
// Author:   Bill Walker "Bald Eagle", 2017
// email:    see posts in news.povray.org
//
//------------------------------------------------------------------------

#version 3.7;

global_settings {
 assumed_gamma 1.0
 #default {texture {pigment {rgb <1, 1, 1>} finish {ambient 1}}}
 ambient_light rgb <1, 1, 1> // <======== flat, even illumination
}

#include "colors.inc"

camera {
 location <0, 0, -1>
 right    x*image_width/image_height
 look_at <0, 0, 0>
}

light_source{ <50, 50, -100>  color rgb <1, 1, 1>}

// #declare EarthRadius = 6367; //radius in km
#declare EarthRadius = 6367*0.621371; //radius in mi

#macro S2C (Spherical)
 // input - 2d vector: <Latitude, Longitude>
 #local Lat = radians (Spherical.x);
 #local Lon = radians (Spherical.y);
 #local X = EarthRadius * cos(Lat) * cos(Lon);
 #local Y = EarthRadius * cos(Lat) * sin(Lon);
 #local Z = EarthRadius * sin(Lat);
 #local Cartesian = <X, Y, Z>;
 Cartesian;
#end // end macro S2C


#macro C2S (Cartesian)

 #local R = sqrt(pow(Cartesian.x, 2) * pow(Cartesian.y, 2) * pow(Cartesian.z,
2));
 #local Lat = degrees (asin (Cartesian.z / R));
 #local Lon = degrees (atan2 (Cartesian.y, Cartesian.x));
 #local LatLon = <Lat, Lon>;
 LatLon;
#end // end macro C2S

//  data format: "bus", "CN/Beijing", "bus2382659521", 116.4093833, 39.9067192,
//    etc.
#declare Type = "";
#declare Location = "";
#declare ID = "";
#declare Latitude = 0;
#declare Longitude = 0;

// count locations for sizing array
#declare Locations = 0;
#fopen DataFile "LatLongData.txt" read
#while (defined (DataFile))
 #read (DataFile, Type, Location, ID, Latitude, Longitude)
 #declare Locations = Locations + 1;
#end
#fclose DataFile

#declare _Type = array[Locations];
#declare _Location = array[Locations];
#declare _ID = array[Locations];
#declare _Latitude = array[Locations];
#declare _Longitude = array[Locations];
#declare _XYZ = array[Locations];

// input data into array
#declare Datapoint = 0;
#fopen DataFile "LatLongData.txt" read
#while (defined (DataFile))
 #read (DataFile, Type, Location, ID, Latitude, Longitude)

 #declare _Type [Datapoint] = Type;
 #declare _Location [Datapoint] = Location;
 #declare _ID [Datapoint] = ID;
 #declare _Latitude [Datapoint] = Latitude;
 #declare _Longitude [Datapoint] = Longitude;
 #declare _XYZ [Datapoint] = S2C (<_Latitude[Datapoint],
_Longitude[Datapoint]>);
 #declare Datapoint = Datapoint + 1;
#end
#fclose DataFile

#declare Marker = 0.25;
#declare Line = 0.05;
#declare Linecolor = pigment {Magenta};

#for (Point, 0, Locations-1)

 #if (Type = "bus")
  #declare Color = pigment {Red};
 #elseif (Type = "subway")
  #declare Color = pigment {Green};
 #elseif (Type = "rail")
  #declare Color = pigment {Blue};
 #elseif (Type = "tram")
  #declare Color = pigment {Yellow};
 #else
  #debug "Unidentified Location Type.  \n"
  #declare Color = pigment {White};
 #end

 #declare S = 1; //<0.1, 0.1, 1/4000>;
 #declare T = <1350, 1130, -3500>;

 sphere {0, Marker pigment {Color} translate _XYZ[Point]*S translate T}

 #if (Point > 0)
  cylinder {LastPoint*S, _XYZ[Point]*S, Line pigment {Linecolor} translate T}
 #end // end if

 #debug concat( "Vector = ", vstr(3, _XYZ[Point]*S, ", ", 3, 0), " \n")

 #declare LastPoint = _XYZ[Point];

#end // end for Point

[clipka] Re: How to generate sphere and cylinder with csv... [3315 days 21 hours and 10 minutes ago]

Wed, 29 Mar 2017 16:43:45 GMT

Am 29.03.2017 um 16:48 schrieb Jeff:
> "Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
>> clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
>>> Accordin to the OP it isn't really CSV, but rather tab-separated (or
>>> blank-separated?) values.
>>>
>>> These are /not/ ideally suited for the use with `#read`.
>>
>> Right on.
>> It looks like space or tab-delimited.
>> Perhaps the OP could link to the source.
>>
>> Opening in Excel or OpenOffice and saving as true CSV ought to do it.
> -- so, i did try to run the code , and it shows me the list of information from
> the nodes.csv file. so, its probably means it could work with it.

IIRC, if your file format does not contain commas, the following may be
misinterpreted:

    47 11
    42 -12

While the first line would be interpreted as the individual numbers 47
and 11, the second line might be misinterpreted as the single number 30
(the result of the expression `42-12`).

[Jeff] Re: How to generate sphere and cylinder with csv... [3315 days 23 hours and 4 minutes ago]

Wed, 29 Mar 2017 14:50:01 GMT

"Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
> clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
> > Accordin to the OP it isn't really CSV, but rather tab-separated (or
> > blank-separated?) values.
> >
> > These are /not/ ideally suited for the use with `#read`.
>
> Right on.
> It looks like space or tab-delimited.
> Perhaps the OP could link to the source.
>
> Opening in Excel or OpenOffice and saving as true CSV ought to do it.
-- so, i did try to run the code , and it shows me the list of information from
the nodes.csv file. so, its probably means it could work with it.


> He's also going to need to fix that ID string with something like (untested):
>
> #declare ID = substr(S3,strlen(S1),strlen(S3)-strlen(S1))
>
> where S1 is the mode, and S3 is the ID.
>
> (BTW, I didn't see a dedicated entry for "strlen()" in the F1 documentation
> section on String Functions. Perhaps I overlooked it...)
-- they are dedicated , but i just put some of it, because they are not in a
organized order. so, i just pick some samples from it.


#include "colors.inc"
#fopen nodesfile "C:\\Users\\Jeff\\Desktop\\nodes.csv" read
#fopen linksfile "C:\\Users\\Jeff\\Desktop\\links.csv" read
  #while (defined(nodesfile))
    #read (nodesfile,Var1,Var2,Var3,Var4)
#declare myImage = pigment {image_map {png "C:/Users/Jeff/Desktop/beijing.png"
}}
#declare Resolution = max_extent (myImage);
#declare ImageHeight = Resolution.y;
#declare ImageWidth = Resolution.x;
box {0, 1, translate -0.5 pigment {myImage} scale
<Resolution.x, Resolution.y, 1>}



#if (Verbose)
     #debug "Debugging on \n"
     etc
#end
#if (Var1 = "bus")
    #declare Color = pigment {Red};
#else if (Var2 = "subway")
    #declare Color = pigment {Green};
#else if (Var3 = "rail")
    #declare Color = pigment {Blue};
#else (Var4 = "tram")
    #declare Color = pigment {Yellow};
#end

camera {
   orthographic
   location <-1000,0,0>
   look_at 0
   rotate <0,clock*360,0>
   }

light_source    {
                <10,10,-1000>
                color White
                }

jeff.federick93@(gmail.com)is my email.

[Bald Eagle] Re: How to generate sphere and cylinder with csv... [3316 days 23 hours and 39 minutes ago]

Tue, 28 Mar 2017 14:15:01 GMT

clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:

> Accordin to the OP it isn't really CSV, but rather tab-separated (or
> blank-separated?) values.
>
> These are /not/ ideally suited for the use with `#read`.

Right on.
It looks like space or tab-delimited.
Perhaps the OP could link to the source.

Opening in Excel or OpenOffice and saving as true CSV ought to do it.

He's also going to need to fix that ID string with something like (untested):

#declare ID = substr(S3,strlen(S1),strlen(S3)-strlen(S1))

where S1 is the mode, and S3 is the ID.

(BTW, I didn't see a dedicated entry for "strlen()" in the F1 documentation
section on String Functions. Perhaps I overlooked it...)

[clipka] Re: How to generate sphere and cylinder with csv... [3317 days and 13 minutes ago]

Tue, 28 Mar 2017 13:40:53 GMT

Am 28.03.2017 um 13:58 schrieb Bald Eagle:
> "Jeff" <jef### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
> 
>> hi, if i open the .csv file , and save it as .txt file, will that do the
>> conversion?
> 
> The .csv file is essentially a text file in exactly the format that POV-Ray
> needs it to be in.  "Comma Separated Values" = CSV

Accordin to the OP it isn't really CSV, but rather tab-separated (or
blank-separated?) values.

These are /not/ ideally suited for the use with `#read`.

[Bald Eagle] Re: How to generate sphere and cylinder with csv... [3317 days 1 hour and 54 minutes ago]

Tue, 28 Mar 2017 12:00:00 GMT

"Jeff" <jef### [at] gmailcom> wrote:

> hi, if i open the .csv file , and save it as .txt file, will that do the
> conversion?

The .csv file is essentially a text file in exactly the format that POV-Ray
needs it to be in.  "Comma Separated Values" = CSV

> and i have like 1000+ sphere that i need to generate from the data,

Not a problem - I've made scenes with millions.

> is there any efficient way to do it, instead of write down the sphere position?

Yes, that's why you're automating the process by reading in the values from an
existing file.
I'd start with a small fragment of the file - say 10-50 entries or so, and
output all of the variables you read in and calculate to the #ebug stream so
that you're sure about what you're working with, and passing on to POV-Ray.

I generally define a Verbose variable, then use
#if (Verbose)
     #debug "Debugging on \n"
     etc
#end
so that I'm not forever commenting and uncommenting debugging tools.

> #include "colors.inc"
> #declare myImage = image{ png "C:\\Users\\Jeff\\Desktop\\beijing.png" }

try:
#declare myImage = pigment {image_map {png "C:/Users/Jeff/Desktop/beijing.png"
}}
#declare Resolution = max_extent (myImage);
#declare ImageHeight = Resolution.y;
#declare ImageWidth = Resolution.x;

Then make a flat box:  box {0, 1, translate -0.5 pigment {myImage} scale
<Resolution.x, Resolution.y, 1>}

> #fopen nodesfile "nodes.txt" read
> #fopen linksfile "links.txt" read
>   #while (defined(nodesfile))
>     #read (nodesfile,Var1,Var2,Var3,Var4)
>
>
> #if (Var1 = "bus")
>     #declare Color = pigment {Red};
> #else if (Var2 = "subway")
>     #declare Color = pigment {Green};
> #else if (Var3 = "rail")
>     #declare Color = pigment {Blue};
> #else (Var4 = "tram")
>     #declare Color = pigment {Yellow};
> #end
>
> camera
> { location <0,0,-10>
>   look_at 0
>   rotate <0,clock*360,0>
> }

I'm not sure why you're using the Clock variable in your camera definition,
unless you plan on animating this later.
Probably gonna have to move that camera WAY back in the -z direction.
I'd also probably use an orthographic camera, and ambient_light to get aa pretty
flat, evenly lit scene, at least at the beginning.

> light_source    {
>                 <10,10,-10>
>                 color White
>                 }

[Jeff] Re: How to generate sphere and cylinder with csv... [3317 days 2 hours and 29 minutes ago]

Tue, 28 Mar 2017 11:25:00 GMT

From: "Jeff" <jef### [at] gmailcom>
Newsgroups: povray.windows
Subject: Re: How to generate sphere and cylinder with csv file

"Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
> So, real quick,
>
> #include "colors.inc"
> #if (variable = "bus")
>   #declare Color = pigment {Red};
> #else if (variable2 = "rail")
>
> #else
> #end
>
> Write your data to a text file, use the #open, #read directives to read the
> values in.
>
> #declare a Y variable as that value.
> same for the Z variable  (notice both are Uppercase)
>
> searching for:  #read #write data from file
> pulls up the following, with lots more
>
>http://news.povray.org/povray.general/thread/%3Cweb.4d05993a67d8c71bd6b9b2630@news.povray.org%3E/?ttop=357624&toff=50
>
>
http://news.povray.org/povray.general/thread/%3Cweb.43886ab1919621bdcce6fd2b0@news.povray.org%3E/?ttop=330491&toff=13
50

>
> Don't worry about the length, just use the coordinates of the 2 spheres as the
> endpoint coordinates of the cylinder.
>
> You're probably going to have to convert your values from long/lat to some
> meaningful x,y,z coordinates (polar to Cartesian)

hi, if i open the .csv file , and save it as .txt file, will that do the
conversion? and i have like 1000+ sphere that i need to generate from the data,
is there any efficient way to do it, instead of write down the sphere position?
so, is this the way to do it? hey, i want to talk more detail about, and i need
your help. here is my email: jef### [at] gmailcom. thanks before :)


#include "colors.inc"
#declare myImage = image{ png "C:\\Users\\Jeff\\Desktop\\beijing.png" }

#fopen nodesfile "nodes.txt" read
#fopen linksfile "links.txt" read
  #while (defined(nodesfile))
    #read (nodesfile,Var1,Var2,Var3,Var4)


#if (Var1 = "bus")
    #declare Color = pigment {Red};
#else if (Var2 = "subway")
    #declare Color = pigment {Green};
#else if (Var3 = "rail")
    #declare Color = pigment {Blue};
#else (Var4 = "tram")
    #declare Color = pigment {Yellow};
#end

camera
{ location <0,0,-10>
  look_at 0
  rotate <0,clock*360,0>
}

light_source    {
                <10,10,-10>
                color White
                }

[Mike Horvath] Re: How to generate sphere and cylinder with csv... [3317 days 10 hours and 6 minutes ago]

Tue, 28 Mar 2017 03:47:43 GMT

I usually do conversions like this in Excel or using some external 
script. You can mix the numbers with short strings of text to generate 
valid POV-Ray code.


Mike

[Bald Eagle] Re: How to generate sphere and cylinder with csv... [3317 days 23 hours and 39 minutes ago]

Mon, 27 Mar 2017 14:15:00 GMT

"Jeff" <jef### [at] gmailcom> wrote:

> so, i want to generate some spheres to represent the information in the csv file
> above,
> how do i generate different color of spheres for different mode,

So, real quick,

#include "colors.inc"
#if (variable = "bus")
  #declare Color = pigment {Red};
#else if (variable2 = "rail")

#else
#end

Write your data to a text file, use the #open, #read directives to read the
values in.

#declare a Y variable as that value.
same for the Z variable  (notice both are Uppercase)

searching for:  #read #write data from file
pulls up the following, with lots more

http://news.povray.org/povray.general/thread/%3Cweb.4d05993a67d8c71bd6b9b2630@news.povray.org%3E/?ttop=357624&toff=50

http://news.povray.org/povray.general/thread/%3Cweb.43886ab1919621bdcce6fd2b0@news.povray.org%3E/?ttop=330491&toff=1350




> then i use these information to generate cylinder and connect the it to sphere
> accordingly by using the "Source" column and "Target" column and the "length"
> column as the length of the cylinders.

Don't worry about the length, just use the coordinates of the 2 spheres as the
endpoint coordinates of the cylinder.

You're probably going to have to convert your values from long/lat to some
meaningful x,y,z coordinates (polar to Cartesian)

[Jeff] How to generate sphere and cylinder with csv file [3318 days 1 hour and 34 minutes ago]

Mon, 27 Mar 2017 12:20:01 GMT

so, i have csv files that i would like to use to do the visualization.its
something like below:

mode country/city ID         lon         lat
bus CN/Beijing bus2382659521 116.4093833 39.9067192
bus CN/Beijing bus1636776952 116.3039935 39.8888451
rail CN/Beijing rail269996666 116.4209908 39.9016416
rail CN/Beijing rail1419861955 116.3465335 39.9430318
subway CN/Beijing subway339089932 116.3572162 39.8980033
subway CN/Beijing subway339086386 116.3041387 39.9061679
tram CN/Beijing tram1408143389 116.3920808 39.8904203
tram CN/Beijing tram1408143387 116.3917507 39.896844


so, i want to generate some spheres to represent the information in the csv file
above,
how do i generate different color of spheres for different mode, and use the
"lon" column as the Y position of the sphere, and "lat" column as the Z
position?



and the other csv file is something like this:

mode Source           Target            length
bus bus332263578   bus2052937452            59.34930975
bus bus268389450   bus268389107            101.9938894
rail rail539260172   rail1182599524           571.7497256
rail rail1182599524   rail273113548            568.8268748
subway subway245154338   subway245143068          81.85897267
subway subway336935693   subway3369356929         99.88085188

then i use these information to generate cylinder and connect the it to sphere
accordingly by using the "Source" column and "Target" column and the "length"
column as the length of the cylinders.

can someone help me please?

[clipka] Re: bishop3d and pov-ray 3.7 integration registr... [3322 days 6 hours and 59 minutes ago]

Thu, 23 Mar 2017 06:55:22 GMT

Am 22.03.2017 um 22:42 schrieb Alain:
> Le 17-03-22 à 17:16, rodv92 a écrit :
...
>> Since Pov-Ray 3.6 cannot be (correct me if I am wrong) installed
>> normally side
>> by side with 3.7 it will take me a bit of time to correct the issue...
...
> You CAN install version 3.6 alongside 3.7. All you need to do is to do a
> custom install to a folder of your choice.

To my knowledge you don't even need a custom install.

[Mike Horvath] Re: bishop3d and pov-ray 3.7 integration registr... [3322 days 11 hours and 34 minutes ago]

Thu, 23 Mar 2017 02:20:10 GMT

On 3/22/2017 5:42 PM, Alain wrote:
> Le 17-03-22 à 17:16, rodv92 a écrit :
>> Hello, i inadvertently lost my reg file containing the entries to fix the
>> bishop3d/Pov-Ray integration.
>>
>> As you may know, bishop3d checks registry entries for Pov-Ray 3.6,
>> that were
>> stripped in 3.7
>>
>> I used MS/Sysinternals procmon to check what were the missing entries
>> at the
>> time, a task that was a bit annoying...
>>
>> Since Pov-Ray 3.6 cannot be (correct me if I am wrong) installed
>> normally side
>> by side with 3.7 it will take me a bit of time to correct the issue...
>>
>> anyone has a similar reg file or found it on the web ?
>>
>> If not, i will regenerate it and post it.
>>
>> As a suggestion, the logic could be added to the  next 3.7 patches (as
>> a "legacy
>> modellers compatibility option" to check in the installer GUI ?
>>
>>
>>
>>
> You CAN install version 3.6 alongside 3.7. All you need to do is to do a
> custom install to a folder of your choice.
>


IIRC on Windows there was the problem of too much stuff getting put in 
the "open with..." dialog when you right-click on a file. All versions 
of POV-Ray use the same string in that dialog, so you can't tell them 
apart. I don't know if that was ever fixed.


Mike

[Alain] Re: bishop3d and pov-ray 3.7 integration registr... [3322 days 16 hours and 12 minutes ago]

Wed, 22 Mar 2017 21:42:19 GMT

Le 17-03-22 à 17:16, rodv92 a écrit :
> Hello, i inadvertently lost my reg file containing the entries to fix the
> bishop3d/Pov-Ray integration.
>
> As you may know, bishop3d checks registry entries for Pov-Ray 3.6, that were
> stripped in 3.7
>
> I used MS/Sysinternals procmon to check what were the missing entries at the
> time, a task that was a bit annoying...
>
> Since Pov-Ray 3.6 cannot be (correct me if I am wrong) installed normally side
> by side with 3.7 it will take me a bit of time to correct the issue...
>
> anyone has a similar reg file or found it on the web ?
>
> If not, i will regenerate it and post it.
>
> As a suggestion, the logic could be added to the  next 3.7 patches (as a "legacy
> modellers compatibility option" to check in the installer GUI ?
>
>
>
>
You CAN install version 3.6 alongside 3.7. All you need to do is to do a 
custom install to a folder of your choice.

[rodv92] bishop3d and pov-ray 3.7 integration registry fix [3322 days 16 hours and 34 minutes ago]

Wed, 22 Mar 2017 21:20:01 GMT

Hello, i inadvertently lost my reg file containing the entries to fix the
bishop3d/Pov-Ray integration.

As you may know, bishop3d checks registry entries for Pov-Ray 3.6, that were
stripped in 3.7

I used MS/Sysinternals procmon to check what were the missing entries at the
time, a task that was a bit annoying...

Since Pov-Ray 3.6 cannot be (correct me if I am wrong) installed normally side
by side with 3.7 it will take me a bit of time to correct the issue...

anyone has a similar reg file or found it on the web ?

If not, i will regenerate it and post it.

As a suggestion, the logic could be added to the  next 3.7 patches (as a "legacy
modellers compatibility option" to check in the installer GUI ?

[William F Pokorny] Re: Log file wrap [3324 days and 10 minutes ago]

Tue, 21 Mar 2017 13:44:00 GMT

On 03/21/2017 02:46 AM, dick balaska wrote:
> Am 2017-03-20 16:32, also sprach Mike Horvath:
>> Currently the debug log file wraps at 80 characters. Would it be
>> possible to make it so that it doesn't wrap? I'm trying to print some
>> tabular data, and this behavior is messing things up.
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>>
>> Mike
>
> Hear! Hear! :)
>
> I asked about this a year ago. I do the same, I output java source which
> I copy/paste into my tomcat servlet.
>
> I thought fixing it would be a good toe dipping into the povray source
> (and the attendant github control).  Oy vey!  What a bizarre thing.  80
> is hardcoded into the constructor of objects (not even, say, LINE_WIDTH)
> and it seemed difficult to fix it the right way. I opted to just fix my
> debug output instead to be less than 80 characters. :) :(
>

Perhaps of use for those compiling their own code - I run with my own 
patch based upon environment variables for this. See:

http://wiki.povray.org/content/User:Wfpokorny

and specifically:

https://github.com/wfpokorny/povray/tree/feature/unixConsoleFileColumnWrapControl

More documentation on use by clicking on the commit to get the commit 
message in github.

There is too an in progress pull req in #117 looking at the console side 
of wrapping. I "think" unix output only, but with the advantage it pulls 
the current column size information from the active console/terminal 
window.

Bill P.

[clipka] Re: Log file wrap [3324 days 4 hours and 37 minutes ago]

Tue, 21 Mar 2017 09:17:27 GMT

Am 20.03.2017 um 21:32 schrieb Mike Horvath:
> Currently the debug log file wraps at 80 characters. Would it be
> possible to make it so that it doesn't wrap? I'm trying to print some
> tabular data, and this behavior is messing things up.

Due to the difficulties involved, I'd recommend using `#write` instead.

[dick balaska] Re: Log file wrap [3324 days 7 hours and 7 minutes ago]

Tue, 21 Mar 2017 06:46:47 GMT

Am 2017-03-20 16:32, also sprach Mike Horvath:
> Currently the debug log file wraps at 80 characters. Would it be
> possible to make it so that it doesn't wrap? I'm trying to print some
> tabular data, and this behavior is messing things up.
>
> Thanks.
>
>
> Mike

Hear! Hear! :)

I asked about this a year ago. I do the same, I output java source which 
I copy/paste into my tomcat servlet.

I thought fixing it would be a good toe dipping into the povray source 
(and the attendant github control).  Oy vey!  What a bizarre thing.  80 
is hardcoded into the constructor of objects (not even, say, LINE_WIDTH) 
and it seemed difficult to fix it the right way. I opted to just fix my 
debug output instead to be less than 80 characters. :) :(

-- 
dik

[Mike Horvath] Log file wrap [3324 days 17 hours and 22 minutes ago]

Mon, 20 Mar 2017 20:31:57 GMT

Currently the debug log file wraps at 80 characters. Would it be 
possible to make it so that it doesn't wrap? I'm trying to print some 
tabular data, and this behavior is messing things up.

Thanks.


Mike

[clipka] Re: #debug not printing tab character [3325 days 14 hours and 56 minutes ago]

Sun, 19 Mar 2017 22:57:41 GMT

Am 18.03.2017 um 19:38 schrieb Mike Horvath:
> Neither of the following are printing the tab character. Not sure what
> is going on.
> 
>     #debug "0.000000\t0.000000\t0.000000\n"
>     #debug "0.000000    0.000000    0.000000\n"
> 
> 3.7.1-alpha.8913469+av318.msvc14.win64

If you copy the message pane, the clipboard contents will include the
tab characters alright.

So it's probably an issue rooted in the GUI component used for the
message pane, and my guess is that we probably won't address this one.

[Stephen] Re: #debug not printing tab character [3326 days 4 hours and 54 minutes ago]

Sun, 19 Mar 2017 09:00:16 GMT

On 3/18/2017 10:57 PM, Mike Horvath wrote:
> On 3/18/2017 2:49 PM, Stephen wrote:
>> On 3/18/2017 6:38 PM, Mike Horvath wrote:
>>> Neither of the following are printing the tab character. Not sure what
>>> is going on.
>>>
>>>      #debug "0.000000\t0.000000\t0.000000\n"
>>>      #debug "0.000000    0.000000    0.000000\n"
>>>
>>> 3.7.1-alpha.8913469+av318.msvc14.win64
>>
>> Just a thought: Put two tab characters together in case it is tabing to
>> the next space with one.
>>
>
> Putting two next to each other makes no difference.
>
>

A shot in the dark. It does eliminate one possible cause.


-- 

Regards
     Stephen

[Mike Horvath] Re: #debug not printing tab character [3326 days 14 hours and 56 minutes ago]

Sat, 18 Mar 2017 22:57:37 GMT

On 3/18/2017 2:49 PM, Stephen wrote:
> On 3/18/2017 6:38 PM, Mike Horvath wrote:
>> Neither of the following are printing the tab character. Not sure what
>> is going on.
>>
>>      #debug "0.000000\t0.000000\t0.000000\n"
>>      #debug "0.000000    0.000000    0.000000\n"
>>
>> 3.7.1-alpha.8913469+av318.msvc14.win64
>
> Just a thought: Put two tab characters together in case it is tabing to
> the next space with one.
>

Putting two next to each other makes no difference.


Mike

[dick balaska] Re: #debug not printing tab character [3326 days 15 hours and 32 minutes ago]

Sat, 18 Mar 2017 22:22:02 GMT

Am 2017-03-18 17:42, also sprach dick balaska:
> #debug "0.000000\t0.000000\t0.000000\n"

Even better, running that line says

0000000   0   .   0   0   0   0   0   0  ht   0   .   0   0   0   0   0
0000020   0  ht   0   .   0   0   0   0   0   0  cr  nl


-- 
dik

[dick balaska] Re: #debug not printing tab character [3326 days 16 hours and 12 minutes ago]

Sat, 18 Mar 2017 21:42:25 GMT

Am 2017-03-18 14:49, also sprach Stephen:
> On 3/18/2017 6:38 PM, Mike Horvath wrote:
>> Neither of the following are printing the tab character. Not sure what
>> is going on.
>>
>>      #debug "0.000000\t0.000000\t0.000000\n"
>>      #debug "0.000000    0.000000    0.000000\n"
>>
>> 3.7.1-alpha.8913469+av318.msvc14.win64
>
> Just a thought: Put two tab characters together in case it is tabing to
> the next space with one.
>

It works for me with beta.3 and beta.4 (povconsole64)

#debug concat("protected static final double reeferInView = ", 
str(SvrReeferInView, 0, -1), ";\t\t\t// F: ", 
str(SvrReeferInView*fps,4,0), "\n")

gives me

0012000                                           p   r   o   t   e   c
0012020   t   e   d  sp   s   t   a   t   i   c  sp   f   i   n   a   l
0012040  sp   d   o   u   b   l   e  sp   r   e   e   f   e   r   I   n
0012060   V   i   e   w  sp   =  sp   3   7   .   5   6   4   6   5   5
0012100   ;  ht  ht  ht   /   /  sp   F   :  sp  sp   9   0   1  cr  nl

-- 
dik

[Stephen] Re: #debug not printing tab character [3326 days 19 hours and 5 minutes ago]

Sat, 18 Mar 2017 18:49:33 GMT

On 3/18/2017 6:38 PM, Mike Horvath wrote:
> Neither of the following are printing the tab character. Not sure what
> is going on.
>
>      #debug "0.000000\t0.000000\t0.000000\n"
>      #debug "0.000000    0.000000    0.000000\n"
>
> 3.7.1-alpha.8913469+av318.msvc14.win64

Just a thought: Put two tab characters together in case it is tabing to 
the next space with one.

-- 

Regards
     Stephen

[Mike Horvath] #debug not printing tab character [3326 days 19 hours and 15 minutes ago]

Sat, 18 Mar 2017 18:38:43 GMT

Neither of the following are printing the tab character. Not sure what 
is going on.

	#debug "0.000000\t0.000000\t0.000000\n"
	#debug "0.000000	0.000000	0.000000\n"

3.7.1-alpha.8913469+av318.msvc14.win64

[dick balaska] Re: Installing CLI interface [3371 days 3 hours and 33 minutes ago]

Thu, 2 Feb 2017 10:21:24 GMT

Am 2017-02-02 01:08, also sprach binki:
> How do I install the povray.exe CLI interface on Windows? I find the GUI
> annoying. I want to be able to run the same scripts that I do on unix on my
> Windows system, but I find pvengine with a bunch of hard to use parameters like
> /EXIT and /RENDER. Also, the Windows GUI likes to make noise, etc.
>
> I am currently working around this by using the Windows 10 Subsystem for Linux
> feature to install the Ubuntu POV-Ray binaries. But this is bulky because I have
> to invoke the Ubuntu version of the povray CLI through an Ubuntu shell or
> indirectly via bash -c "povray". When can I look forward to the
> Download page’s Windows installer providing a native povray.exe which behaves
> like the povray CLI for unix?
>
>
>
I have a build of povray3.7.1-alpha built. It's a wee bit old, but not 
too much...  http://www.buckosoft.com/povclipse2/povray/
The only issue with it is I have to say +wt8 on the CL to use all 8 
threads on my box.
It's just the .exe, you still need a povray distribution first.


-- 
dik

[binki] Installing CLI interface [3371 days 7 hours and 44 minutes ago]

Thu, 2 Feb 2017 06:10:01 GMT

How do I install the povray.exe CLI interface on Windows? I find the GUI
annoying. I want to be able to run the same scripts that I do on unix on my
Windows system, but I find pvengine with a bunch of hard to use parameters like
/EXIT and /RENDER. Also, the Windows GUI likes to make noise, etc.

I am currently working around this by using the Windows 10 Subsystem for Linux
feature to install the Ubuntu POV-Ray binaries. But this is bulky because I have
to invoke the Ubuntu version of the povray CLI through an Ubuntu shell or
indirectly via bash -c "povray". When can I look forward to the
Download page’s Windows installer providing a native povray.exe which behaves
like the povray CLI for unix?

[clipka] Re: feature request: disable file overwrite [3377 days 2 hours and 1 minute ago]

Fri, 27 Jan 2017 11:52:46 GMT

Am 27.01.2017 um 09:47 schrieb Sherry K. Shaw:
> clipka wrote:
>>
>> Hm... this has me thinking: Maybe a smarter way would be to allow
>> certain placeholders in the file name, which would be replaced by the
>> current date and/or time when the render was started (first frame in
>> case of an animation sequence).
>>
>> This would entirely avoid the hassle of checking whether a file of the
>> same name already exists, and yet provide a convenient way to prevent
>> accidental overwriting of existing output files.
>>
> 
> Might something like this be implemented as an INI file option?  Perhaps
> to rename the file (including date and time) at the end of the render,
> or possibly to make a backup copy?  The concept strikes me as rather
> INI-ish.

Post-frame shell-out (`Post_Frame_Command=...`) should be able to do
this. It would be specific to a particular operating system though.

It should also be possible to use pre-frame shell-out
(`Pre_Frame_Command`) to back up an existing file of the same name.

[Sherry K Shaw] Re: feature request: disable file overwrite [3377 days 5 hours and 7 minutes ago]

Fri, 27 Jan 2017 08:46:49 GMT

clipka wrote:
>
> Hm... this has me thinking: Maybe a smarter way would be to allow
> certain placeholders in the file name, which would be replaced by the
> current date and/or time when the render was started (first frame in
> case of an animation sequence).
>
> This would entirely avoid the hassle of checking whether a file of the
> same name already exists, and yet provide a convenient way to prevent
> accidental overwriting of existing output files.
>

Might something like this be implemented as an INI file option?  Perhaps 
to rename the file (including date and time) at the end of the render, 
or possibly to make a backup copy?  The concept strikes me as rather 
INI-ish.

Just a couple of insomniac thoughts...

--Sherry Shaw

-- 
#macro T(E,N)sphere{x,.4rotate z*E*60translate y*N pigment{wrinkles scale
.3}finish{ambient 1}}#end#local I=0;#while(I<5)T(I,1)T(1-I,-1)#local I=I+
1;#end camera{location-5*z}plane{z,37 pigment{granite color_map{[.7rgb 0]
[1rgb 1]}}finish{ambient 2}}//                                   TenMoons

[Stephen] Re: feature request: disable file overwrite [3378 days 4 hours and 38 minutes ago]

Thu, 26 Jan 2017 09:16:20 GMT

On 1/26/2017 8:49 AM, Thomas de Groot wrote:
> On 25-1-2017 16:52, Stephen wrote:
>> On 1/25/2017 2:12 PM, clipka wrote:
>
>>> Hey, that's _my_ line ;)
>>>
>>
>> How much are the royalties?
>>
>> And hay is for horses. ;)
>>
>
> [Ah. Another example of gray/grey...]
>

No not this time. ;-)
http://grammarist.com/homophones/hay-vs-hey/

It is a rejoinder. The follow up is:

Oi!

Oi is for 'orses

Sorry, I can only remember primary school jokes. ;-)

-- 

Regards
     Stephen

[Thomas de Groot] Re: feature request: disable file overwrite [3378 days 5 hours and 5 minutes ago]

Thu, 26 Jan 2017 08:49:19 GMT

On 25-1-2017 16:52, Stephen wrote:
> On 1/25/2017 2:12 PM, clipka wrote:

>> Hey, that's _my_ line ;)
>>
>
> How much are the royalties?
>
> And hay is for horses. ;)
>

[Ah. Another example of gray/grey...]

-- 
Thomas

[Stephen] Re: feature request: disable file overwrite [3378 days 21 hours and 29 minutes ago]

Wed, 25 Jan 2017 16:25:17 GMT

On 1/25/2017 4:05 PM, clipka wrote:
> Am 25.01.2017 um 16:52 schrieb Stephen:

>>> `Output_File_Name=Foo{YYYY}{MM}{DD}.png`
>>>
>>
>> I have more questions but I will wait until it is implemented if it is.
>
> I suggest you better not hold your breath.
>

That is why I am not asking them now. No point in wasting brain cells. :)

-- 

Regards
     Stephen

[clipka] Re: feature request: disable file overwrite [3378 days 21 hours and 48 minutes ago]

Wed, 25 Jan 2017 16:05:49 GMT

Am 25.01.2017 um 16:52 schrieb Stephen:
> On 1/25/2017 2:12 PM, clipka wrote:
>> Am 25.01.2017 um 12:38 schrieb Stephen:
> 
>>>> accidental overwriting of existing output files.
>>>
>>> Would that work when using subsets of frames?
>>>
>>> And thinking out loud:
>>> What is the first frame?
>>> Is it Frame_0, Frame_1 or the first frame actually rendered in the
>>> directory with the same base name?
>>
>> "first frame" would typically be the one specified via
>> `Subset_Start_Frame`/`+SFn` if present, or `Initial_Frame`/`+KFIn`
>> otherwise. ("Typically" because POV-Ray does not always honor these
>> settings as specified; "first frame" would be the first frame actually
>> rendered in any animation sequence.)
>>
>>> Would you have a flag to switch it on and off for when we wanted to
>>> overwrite files?
>>
>> Kind of. You'd have to activate this feature by inserting special
>> strings in the output file name; e.g.
>> `Output_File_Name=Foo{YYYY}{MM}{DD}.png`
>>
> 
> I have more questions but I will wait until it is implemented if it is.

I suggest you better not hold your breath.

[Stephen] Re: feature request: disable file overwrite [3378 days 22 hours and 1 minute ago]

Wed, 25 Jan 2017 15:52:54 GMT

On 1/25/2017 2:12 PM, clipka wrote:
> Am 25.01.2017 um 12:38 schrieb Stephen:

>>> accidental overwriting of existing output files.
>>
>> Would that work when using subsets of frames?
>>
>> And thinking out loud:
>> What is the first frame?
>> Is it Frame_0, Frame_1 or the first frame actually rendered in the
>> directory with the same base name?
>
> "first frame" would typically be the one specified via
> `Subset_Start_Frame`/`+SFn` if present, or `Initial_Frame`/`+KFIn`
> otherwise. ("Typically" because POV-Ray does not always honor these
> settings as specified; "first frame" would be the first frame actually
> rendered in any animation sequence.)
>
>> Would you have a flag to switch it on and off for when we wanted to
>> overwrite files?
>
> Kind of. You'd have to activate this feature by inserting special
> strings in the output file name; e.g.
> `Output_File_Name=Foo{YYYY}{MM}{DD}.png`
>

I have more questions but I will wait until it is implemented if it is.

>> Sorry for sounding negative but I don't think this is trivial.
>
> Hey, that's _my_ line ;)
>

How much are the royalties?

And hay is for horses. ;)

-- 

Regards
     Stephen

[clipka] Re: feature request: disable file overwrite [3378 days 23 hours and 41 minutes ago]

Wed, 25 Jan 2017 14:12:57 GMT

Am 25.01.2017 um 12:38 schrieb Stephen:
> On 1/25/2017 10:25 AM, clipka wrote:
>> Hm... this has me thinking: Maybe a smarter way would be to allow
>> certain placeholders in the file name, which would be replaced by the
>> current date and/or time when the render was started (first frame in
>> case of an animation sequence).
>>
>> This would entirely avoid the hassle of checking whether a file of the
>> same name already exists, and yet provide a convenient way to prevent
>> accidental overwriting of existing output files.
> 
> Would that work when using subsets of frames?
> 
> And thinking out loud:
> What is the first frame?
> Is it Frame_0, Frame_1 or the first frame actually rendered in the
> directory with the same base name?

"first frame" would typically be the one specified via
`Subset_Start_Frame`/`+SFn` if present, or `Initial_Frame`/`+KFIn`
otherwise. ("Typically" because POV-Ray does not always honor these
settings as specified; "first frame" would be the first frame actually
rendered in any animation sequence.)

> Would you have a flag to switch it on and off for when we wanted to
> overwrite files?

Kind of. You'd have to activate this feature by inserting special
strings in the output file name; e.g.
`Output_File_Name=Foo{YYYY}{MM}{DD}.png`

> Sorry for sounding negative but I don't think this is trivial.

Hey, that's _my_ line ;)

[Stephen] Re: feature request: disable file overwrite [3379 days 2 hours and 16 minutes ago]

Wed, 25 Jan 2017 11:38:16 GMT

On 1/25/2017 10:25 AM, clipka wrote:
> Hm... this has me thinking: Maybe a smarter way would be to allow
> certain placeholders in the file name, which would be replaced by the
> current date and/or time when the render was started (first frame in
> case of an animation sequence).
>
> This would entirely avoid the hassle of checking whether a file of the
> same name already exists, and yet provide a convenient way to prevent
> accidental overwriting of existing output files.

Would that work when using subsets of frames?

And thinking out loud:
What is the first frame?
Is it Frame_0, Frame_1 or the first frame actually rendered in the 
directory with the same base name?

Would you have a flag to switch it on and off for when we wanted to 
overwrite files?

Sorry for sounding negative but I don't think this is trivial.
On the positive side. You could pop up a warning asking if the user 
wanted to overwrite with an option to pick Yes/No/All (for animations)

-- 

Regards
     Stephen

[clipka] Re: feature request: disable file overwrite [3379 days 3 hours and 29 minutes ago]

Wed, 25 Jan 2017 10:25:27 GMT

Am 25.01.2017 um 06:45 schrieb omniverse:
> "Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
>> clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
>>
>>> As so often, the devil is in the details though: For instance, how would
>>> you expect POV-Ray to react when rendering an animation, and /some/
>>> frames already exist while others do not?
>> I just thought it would be a nice safeguard against accidentally overwriting
>> images that took a long time to render, or accidentally clicking "RUN" (admit it
>> - we've all done it" when you hadn't manually renamed the last test render prior
>> to rendering the new iteration) when you've been working on something for a long
>> time, it's late, you're tired and distracted....
> 
> You did say command-line, and first thing I think of to do what you ask in a
> roundabout way would be to add to the command-line:
> 
> -orender2
> 
> and next 3, 4, 5, etc. before every scene run.
> 
> Sorry to be glib about it. ;)
> You're idea makes sense to me. Render overwrites can be a bad thing, like you
> say.
> 
> Couldn't this be done by using file write capability from within SDL? Change the
> povray.ini to count file output incrementally on each render like the output
> option I said above?
> Of course that means putting that into every scene so it runs.

Hm... this has me thinking: Maybe a smarter way would be to allow
certain placeholders in the file name, which would be replaced by the
current date and/or time when the render was started (first frame in
case of an animation sequence).

This would entirely avoid the hassle of checking whether a file of the
same name already exists, and yet provide a convenient way to prevent
accidental overwriting of existing output files.

[omniverse] Re: feature request: disable file overwrite [3379 days 8 hours and 4 minutes ago]

Wed, 25 Jan 2017 05:50:01 GMT

"Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
> clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
>
> > As so often, the devil is in the details though: For instance, how would
> > you expect POV-Ray to react when rendering an animation, and /some/
> > frames already exist while others do not?
> I just thought it would be a nice safeguard against accidentally overwriting
> images that took a long time to render, or accidentally clicking "RUN" (admit it
> - we've all done it" when you hadn't manually renamed the last test render prior
> to rendering the new iteration) when you've been working on something for a long
> time, it's late, you're tired and distracted....

You did say command-line, and first thing I think of to do what you ask in a
roundabout way would be to add to the command-line:

-orender2

and next 3, 4, 5, etc. before every scene run.

Sorry to be glib about it. ;)
You're idea makes sense to me. Render overwrites can be a bad thing, like you
say.

Couldn't this be done by using file write capability from within SDL? Change the
povray.ini to count file output incrementally on each render like the output
option I said above?
Of course that means putting that into every scene so it runs.

[Bald Eagle] Re: feature request: disable file overwrite [3379 days 20 hours and 34 minutes ago]

Tue, 24 Jan 2017 17:20:01 GMT

clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:

> As so often, the devil is in the details though: For instance, how would
> you expect POV-Ray to react when rendering an animation, and /some/
> frames already exist while others do not?

I'll have to give it a whirl, but IIRC, in the past when I've done just that,
POV-Ray seemed to have made up some alternate filename suffix, and then I had 2
sets of animation frames in the same directory.
Even if that's not the present case, to answer your question, I'd expect it to
scan for the presence of all anticipated new filenames, and either issue a
warning with a "Continue?" prompt, or just add the "bypass suffix".
That's why I suggested it could be turned on and off.

> Also, it may be non-trivial to implement this in a manner that would fit
> the intended architecture (part of which has already been put in place)
> when we go for distributed rendering.

Well, yes - I don't have a clear view of the code structure from your
perspective.

>
> Besides, should this be a Windows-only feature (you're posting to
> povray.windows, after all)? That would probably make things even more
> complicated.

I'm not picky - I thought maybe somehow doing it in Windows would make it easier
for some reason.

> And last not least, is this something you deem important enough to put
> other stuff aside for? Unfortunately, there's only so much manpower we
> have at our disposal.

I just thought it would be a nice safeguard against accidentally overwriting
images that took a long time to render, or accidentally clicking "RUN" (admit it
- we've all done it" when you hadn't manually renamed the last test render prior
to rendering the new iteration) when you've been working on something for a long
time, it's late, you're tired and distracted....

No worries, just throwing it out there as something to think about.

[clipka] Re: feature request: disable file overwrite [3379 days 21 hours and 2 minutes ago]

Tue, 24 Jan 2017 16:52:04 GMT

Am 24.01.2017 um 14:05 schrieb Bald Eagle:
> I know that when I've downloaded files with a browser, many of the browsers will
> save a file (file1.ext) and then if the same or another file with the same name
> is downloaded, it will create a modified file name (file1(2).ext).
> 
> Could some sort of .ini or command line option be implemented so that POV-Ray
> will not overwrite an existing render in the directory?

Yes, in a theoretical sense such a thing could be implemented.

As so often, the devil is in the details though: For instance, how would
you expect POV-Ray to react when rendering an animation, and /some/
frames already exist while others do not?

Also, it may be non-trivial to implement this in a manner that would fit
the intended architecture (part of which has already been put in place)
when we go for distributed rendering.


Besides, should this be a Windows-only feature (you're posting to
povray.windows, after all)? That would probably make things even more
complicated.

And last not least, is this something you deem important enough to put
other stuff aside for? Unfortunately, there's only so much manpower we
have at our disposal.

[Bald Eagle] feature request: disable file overwrite [3380 days and 44 minutes ago]

Tue, 24 Jan 2017 13:10:00 GMT

I know that when I've downloaded files with a browser, many of the browsers will
save a file (file1.ext) and then if the same or another file with the same name
is downloaded, it will create a modified file name (file1(2).ext).

Could some sort of .ini or command line option be implemented so that POV-Ray
will not overwrite an existing render in the directory?

[Kenneth] Re: 'old' feature request (?) for animation [3395 days 14 hours and 19 minutes ago]

Sun, 8 Jan 2017 23:35:01 GMT

"omniverse" <omn### [at] charternet> wrote:
>
> You're right. I checked this for 3.62, Hide removes render window until Show.
>

Thanks for the confirmation. At least I know that my brain cells aren't dying
off (yet!)

[omniverse] Re: 'old' feature request (?) for animation [3395 days 19 hours and 24 minutes ago]

Sun, 8 Jan 2017 18:30:00 GMT

"Kenneth" <kdw### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
> In v3.7xx (using the Windows GUI version), I've noticed what seems to be a
> change in how the 'Hide' (i.e., hide render) button works in the editor window,
> when animating. (Compared to v3.6xx.)
>
> IIRC(?), in v3.6xx, when I was running a long animation and I hit the 'Hide'
> button (to look at my scene code), the on-going rendered animation frames stayed
> hidden, until I hit the 'Show' button. However, In 3.7, what happens is that
> when each new animation frame is rendered, it immediately comes back to the
> forefront-- requiring another hit of the Hide button (over and over.)
>
> The old behavior was much more convenient! Or am I just *imagining* what the old
> behavior was like??  :-O
>
> (Under the 'Options/Render Window' menu, I have  'Preserve Contents During
> Animation'  active, but I tried various combinations of 'Keep Above Main', 'Get
> Focus On Creation' and 'Hide When Main Minimized', yet nothing seems to change
> the behavior. Maybe I'm still doing something wrong.)
>
> I've searched the newsgroups for an answer, but only came up with this older
> thread...
>
>
http://news.povray.org/povray.windows/thread/%3Cweb.543c53cdafb02fa0c9d8b8ab0%40news.povray.org%3E/

You're right. I checked this for 3.62, Hide removes render window until Show.

I had wondered about this too. I have been minimizing the window. I just hadn't
bothered to find out about it.

[Kenneth] 'old' feature request (?) for animation [3396 days 9 hours and 14 minutes ago]

Sun, 8 Jan 2017 04:40:00 GMT

In v3.7xx (using the Windows GUI version), I've noticed what seems to be a
change in how the 'Hide' (i.e., hide render) button works in the editor window,
when animating. (Compared to v3.6xx.)

IIRC(?), in v3.6xx, when I was running a long animation and I hit the 'Hide'
button (to look at my scene code), the on-going rendered animation frames stayed
hidden, until I hit the 'Show' button. However, In 3.7, what happens is that
when each new animation frame is rendered, it immediately comes back to the
forefront-- requiring another hit of the Hide button (over and over.)

The old behavior was much more convenient! Or am I just *imagining* what the old
behavior was like??  :-O

(Under the 'Options/Render Window' menu, I have  'Preserve Contents During
Animation'  active, but I tried various combinations of 'Keep Above Main', 'Get
Focus On Creation' and 'Hide When Main Minimized', yet nothing seems to change
the behavior. Maybe I'm still doing something wrong.)

I've searched the newsgroups for an answer, but only came up with this older
thread...

http://news.povray.org/povray.windows/thread/%3Cweb.543c53cdafb02fa0c9d8b8ab0%40news.povray.org%3E/

[clipka] Re: Strange delay for larger sized renders [3429 days 13 hours and 28 minutes ago]

Tue, 6 Dec 2016 00:26:08 GMT

Am 05.12.2016 um 18:23 schrieb Bald Eagle:
> Probably somewhat related to:
>
http://news.povray.org/povray.windows/thread/%3Cweb.56edd77df9a19c455e7df57c0%40news.povray.org%3E/
> 
> When I begin a render on a large size resolution image (10240 x 7680), PPOV-Ray
> seems to "hiccup" - it pauses, I get the spinny torus thing, the title bar says
> "[unresponsive]" and then it kicks in, I get the usual messages, and the parsing
> continues as usual.  This seems odd to me and less related the delayed stopping,
> because the rendering hasn't started yet - because the parsing hasn't even begun
> yet.
> 
> Has anyone else experienced this behaviour?

This is perfectly normal behaviour from a certain file size onward.

There are various different data structudes in POV-Ray that hold image data:

- The image buffer.
- The state file.
- The final image.

The image buffer is essentially a chunk of memory where POV-Ray
assembles the render results into a coherent image as they trickle in
from the render threads in somewhat random order. It can be viewed as a
kind of staging area for the image data, to get it into the right order
for processing it into the final image.

By default the image buffer is kept in memory for the sake of speedy
random access, as POV-Ray needs to do a lot of jumping around in it,
which isn't exactly the thing you want to do on a hard drive. However,
this requires that the entire image buffer (which requires 20(*) bytes
per pixel) fits inside the CPU's address space alongside the scene data.
On a 32-bit machine, this would typically limit the image size to just a
little over 12k x 12k pixels, and even less for complex scenes. (Even on
64-bit machines, having the scene plus image buffer exceed the physical
memory limit may not be a good idea.)

Therefore, if the image buffer size exceeds a somewhat arbitrary limit,
POV-Ray will fall back to keeping the image buffer on hard disk.

Since the required file capacity is known beforehand, and it is also
expected that all of it will be filled with data, POV-Ray grows the
corresponding file to the desired size right from the start, so that it
doesn't have to worry about adjusting the size as it writes data to
random positions within the file. The drawback is that the operation to
grow a file to a large size can take a few moments on Windows machines
-- and probably also on other machines if the file system doesn't
support sparse files.

And that's exactly the symptom you're seeing.


The state file is a separate beast: It is used exclusively for render
abort/continue, and is essentially a log of internal messages passed
between the front- and back-end, which includes render results, but also
other status information relevant to re-create POV-Ray's status in a
continue scenario.

The state file starts out at a size of zero, and grows from there as
needed. And while it also effectively writes out image data to the hard
disk like a file-backed image buffer, it does so in a sequential
fashion, which is much easier on the system's file I/O load.

BTW, creation of the state file can be disabled using the `-CC` option.


The final image file is yet another thing: This is where the image data
ultimately ends up in, ready to be loaded by other applications, but
only as soon as image computation has completed and all the image data
has been assembled in the image buffer.


Mental notes to myself:

- On 64-bit systems it is probably a good idea to always keep the image
buffer in memory. Even if it exceeds the physical memory size, the
accesses should be sporadic and localized enough to not displace the
scene data from physical memory (which would result in fatal thrashing),
and while the file-backed image buffer absolutely positively requires
file I/O for each access, holding the image buffer in virtual memory
will give the operating system a fighting chance to avoid at least a
portion of those file I/O operations. Allowing the user to choose
file-backed mode may be useful in fringe cases, but this can easily be
achieved by choosing a higher default for the setting while still
allowing it to be set lower.

- Growing the file-backed image buffer to the final size in a single
instant is probably a bad idea (at least on file systems that don't
support sparse files): Sure, if we would grow the file incrementally the
operating system may have to perform about the same workload, just
spread out over time; however, this is mainly file I/O workload, which
wouldn't stop the render threads from jogging along -- provided they
have been started already.

[Le Forgeron] Re: Strange delay for larger sized renders [3429 days 16 hours and 47 minutes ago]

Mon, 5 Dec 2016 21:07:15 GMT

Le 05/12/2016 Ã  19:15, William F Pokorny a Ã©crit :
> On 12/05/2016 12:23 PM, Bald Eagle wrote:
>> Probably somewhat related to:
>>
http://news.povray.org/povray.windows/thread/%3Cweb.56edd77df9a19c455e7df57c0%40news.povray.org%3E/
>>
>>
>> When I begin a render on a large size resolution image (10240 x 7680),
>> PPOV-Ray
>> seems to "hiccup" - it pauses, I get the spinny torus thing, the title
>> bar says
>> "[unresponsive]" and then it kicks in, I get the usual messages, and
>> the parsing
>> continues as usual.  This seems odd to me and less related the delayed
>> stopping,
>> because the rendering hasn't started yet - because the parsing hasn't
>> even begun
>> yet.
>>
>> Has anyone else experienced this behaviour?
>>
>>
> 
> Are you setting the max image buffer memory to something larger than the
> default of 128MB? I'm not sure of the exact memory footprint, but
> suppose you'd need at least than 10240x7680x4x4 ~= 1260MB to keep the
> image in memory.
> 
> Ref:
> http://wiki.povray.org/content/Reference:General_Output_Options
> 
> I admit to not having played with this option myself...
> 
> Bill P.

You probably have a point. From my memory, Windows won't make a sparse
file for the image buffer, but allocate every sectors of it when povray
write the first bytes in it (at the very end of the file, there is a few
data that are written for later recovery).

So it needs to write about 10240 x 7680 x 5 x 4 bytes (+ a few extras),
about 1.573 GB.
At average 50 MB per second (traditional speed of write on HDD), it
would take at least 30 seconds. But things can be worst.

4 bytes: for size of float
5 for the channels of the render (RGBFT)
the other numbers, you know where they come from.

[Bald Eagle] Re: Strange delay for larger sized renders [3429 days 17 hours and 49 minutes ago]

Mon, 5 Dec 2016 20:05:00 GMT

William F Pokorny <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:

> Are you setting the max image buffer memory to something larger than the
> default of 128MB? I'm not sure of the exact memory footprint, but
> suppose you'd need at least than 10240x7680x4x4 ~= 1260MB to keep the
> image in memory.

Hmm - I'll test that out.   I did notice that the POV-State file is HUGE, and
then it gets smooshed into a regular jpg/png after the rendering is complete.
I suppose I'll adjust it to 2GB since the POV-State file was IIRC 1.5 GB, and
the resulting image file is only 9MB or so...

[William F Pokorny] Re: Strange delay for larger sized renders [3429 days 19 hours and 39 minutes ago]

Mon, 5 Dec 2016 18:15:15 GMT

On 12/05/2016 12:23 PM, Bald Eagle wrote:
> Probably somewhat related to:
>
http://news.povray.org/povray.windows/thread/%3Cweb.56edd77df9a19c455e7df57c0%40news.povray.org%3E/
>
> When I begin a render on a large size resolution image (10240 x 7680), PPOV-Ray
> seems to "hiccup" - it pauses, I get the spinny torus thing, the title bar says
> "[unresponsive]" and then it kicks in, I get the usual messages, and the parsing
> continues as usual.  This seems odd to me and less related the delayed stopping,
> because the rendering hasn't started yet - because the parsing hasn't even begun
> yet.
>
> Has anyone else experienced this behaviour?
>
>

Are you setting the max image buffer memory to something larger than the 
default of 128MB? I'm not sure of the exact memory footprint, but 
suppose you'd need at least than 10240x7680x4x4 ~= 1260MB to keep the 
image in memory.

Ref:
http://wiki.povray.org/content/Reference:General_Output_Options

I admit to not having played with this option myself...

Bill P.

[Bald Eagle] Strange delay for larger sized renders [3429 days 20 hours and 29 minutes ago]

Mon, 5 Dec 2016 17:25:01 GMT

Probably somewhat related to:
http://news.povray.org/povray.windows/thread/%3Cweb.56edd77df9a19c455e7df57c0%40news.povray.org%3E/

When I begin a render on a large size resolution image (10240 x 7680), PPOV-Ray
seems to "hiccup" - it pauses, I get the spinny torus thing, the title bar says
"[unresponsive]" and then it kicks in, I get the usual messages, and the parsing
continues as usual.  This seems odd to me and less related the delayed stopping,
because the rendering hasn't started yet - because the parsing hasn't even begun
yet.

Has anyone else experienced this behaviour?

[Elmar Krieger] POVRay fails to start with message "could not re... [3496 days 8 hours and 39 minutes ago]

Fri, 30 Sep 2016 05:15:00 GMT

Dear all,

my application uses POVRay, and one of my users just reported that installing
the current povwin-3.7-agpl3-setup.exe and running POVRay yielded the error box
"could not register classes".

In the source code, I saw that is message is shown if register_classes() fails:

    if (register_classes () == FALSE)
      MessageBox (NULL, "ERROR : Could not register classes", "Error",
MB_ICONSTOP) ;

Has anyone seen this before? It's certainly not a common problem, since all my
other users are fine.

May I humbly suggest to change the above code so that the GetLastError() value
is shown? This would help to track the issue...

BTW, the user is running a 64bit Windows and reported that the issue only
affects the 64bit POVRay, the 32bit version starts fine.

Many thanks for your help,
Elmar

[Bob N] Re: installation issue for povray 3.7 [3558 days 18 hours and 49 minutes ago]

Fri, 29 Jul 2016 19:05:00 GMT

"Tamas Gunda" <gen### [at] yahoocom> wrote:
> "aluongo" <nomail@nomail> wrote:
> > Hi,
> > i installed the povray 3.7 on windows (both XP and vista) and i've seen the link
> > created on the desktop point to a wrong filename. i've pvengine-sse2.exe instead
> > of pvengine32-sse2.exe
> >
> > HTH
> >
> > Achille
>
> I second this issue (Win 7/32). However, the opposite
> case. I have pvengine32-sse2.exe and the created shortcuts pointed to
> pvengine-sse2.exe.

July 2016 and the same problem is still there (Windows XP and POV-Ray 3.7).
Anyone who can't figure out the relatively easy fix will not be able to install
and run the program.

[Rocco] Re: povdos needed [3592 days 4 hours and 44 minutes ago]

Sun, 26 Jun 2016 09:10:00 GMT

Following this discussion, maybe someone will be interested. This will not be
the latest version but this week I switched on my old computer and. I found my
build scripts of POVRay 3.61 on MinGW32. I recompiled this with my MinGW64
environment and the result is a command-line POVRay version that renders as
expected. The build scripts is mostly inspired by what you see above. If there
is demand about binaries, I can host it on my OneDrive for example. Even if 3.7
is out now, 3.61 is still usable and feature-rich...

This build works and renders as expected. You should only be careful about file
paths (add them in the .INI for example).

[Bald Eagle] Re: Massively delayed Stop Render [3637 days 12 hours and 54 minutes ago]

Thu, 12 May 2016 01:00:01 GMT

"Thorsten Froehlich" <nomail@nomail> wrote:

> The solution is to have enough memory to hold everything in RAM as the effects
> will go away for the most part.

Indeed, adding another 4GB card gave the following:


Render Statistics
Image Resolution 10240 x 7680

Pixels:         78643200   Samples:               0   Smpls/Pxl: 0.00
Rays:           78643200   Saved:                 0   Max Level: 1/5

Ray->Shape Intersection          Tests       Succeeded  Percentage

Cone/Cylinder                  2906377         1227799     42.25
Sphere                          456980          212075     46.41
Bounding Box                1618119693       386343042     23.88

Shadow Ray Tests:            537601   Succeeded:                 18880
Shadow Cache Hits:            15221

Peak memory used:        1867010048 bytes

Render Time:
  Photon Time:      No photons
  Radiosity Time:   No radiosity
  Trace Time:       0 hours  0 minutes 18 seconds (18.858 seconds)
              using 4 thread(s) with 63.304 CPU-seconds total
POV-Ray finished
-
CPU time used: kernel 78.56 seconds, user 122.55 seconds, total 201.12 seconds.
Elapsed time 492.78 seconds.
Render averaged 159591.86 PPS (391033.08 PPS CPU time) over 78643200 pixels.


I could probably figure out a few tricks to trim down the render time for
something that is in essence a "line drawing".

I'm going to see if my system can accept 16GB, and see how things go from there.
  Eventually, I'm sure I'll see if I can find one of these juicy-sounding Xeos
chips and build a system around that with handfuls of memory cards...   :)
Alas, other more mundane things must be financed first.

[clipka] Re: Python, subprocess, error! [3649 days 11 hours and 10 minutes ago]

Sat, 30 Apr 2016 02:44:31 GMT

Am 29.04.2016 um 04:05 schrieb dick balaska:
> Am 2016-04-28 17:37, also sprach clipka:
>> some of the core gizmos of the
>> Windows command prompt (which I do consider part of the OS) still
>> stubbornly refuse to recognize forward slashes as path separators.
> 
> Huh, I never considered command.com to be part of the OS.
> (But I would say that it is an important part of the OS, which by
> definition is part of the OS. My brain is broken.)
> Also:
>     C:\Users\dick>dir "/Users/dick/documents" /w
>      Volume in drive C is Windows
>      Volume Serial Number is 30E6-9CD1
>     
>      Directory of C:\Users\dick\documents
>     
>     [.]
>     [..]
>     audreyad.png

Yup. Many cmd.com (not command.com -- that's an entirely outdated DOS
program, not a Windows program) gizmos are perfectly fine with forward
slashes.

But others aren't. Which is why I've made it a habit to avoid
backslashes in batch files like the devil avoids holy water. Which is
why I've even forgotten by now what the stumbling blocks were. Something
very fundamental, that I do recall. Maybe it was the `for` statement, or
the advanced batch parameter evaluation features like `%~n1`. Something
in that ballpark.


>> But yeah, backslash-only software has become rare. I guess we can thank
>> the internet for that.
> 
> The internet takes full credit for that and demeans you for conceiving
> that there could be otherwise.  And you're fat (or skinny).

General increase in cross-platform data exchange might have been
sufficient to achieve that. But the URL format certainly helped.

And yes, I'm skinny indeed ;)


> I see backslashes:  One of the eclipse/tomcat quick fix hints is to add
> C:\\home\\dick\\tomcat\\long\\path
> "Argh! Seriously!?  I have to change that." -- Living half my life on
> Linux, I really refuse to allow \\ in one of my text files.

I perfectly agree there.


> and did I mention I hate backslashes in paths?
> Dick from the internet says they're evil.

Dick's right about me being skinny, so who am I to contradict him on
this one.

[Alain] Re: Python, subprocess, error! [3649 days 11 hours and 31 minutes ago]

Sat, 30 Apr 2016 02:23:25 GMT

Le 16-04-28 11:16, Mr a écrit :

> Hi,
> The yellow message is still there and Lanuhum architecture is different from
> mine, so that I would need to dig into it to understand...
> What would you advice I do to adapt the current code?  How should we provide a
> cross platform path in our pov files? have them use unix path all allong? so
> reverse all the windows paths slashes or use unix paths everywhere?
>
>

Never ever use any absolute path anywhere. I've seen to many construct 
like «T:/users/someone/files/povray/include/colors.inc»...
Absolute paths only work on the original machine.

Place all source files in the same folder/directory and zip or rar that 
folder. For all standard includes used, assume that each install of 
POV-Ray know how to access them, no mather what OS is used. Don't 
include those standard files, it's not needed.


Alain

[dick balaska] Re: Python, subprocess, error! [3650 days 11 hours and 48 minutes ago]

Fri, 29 Apr 2016 02:05:48 GMT

Am 2016-04-28 17:37, also sprach clipka:
> some of the core gizmos of the
> Windows command prompt (which I do consider part of the OS) still
> stubbornly refuse to recognize forward slashes as path separators.

Huh, I never considered command.com to be part of the OS.
(But I would say that it is an important part of the OS, which by 
definition is part of the OS. My brain is broken.)
Also:
	C:\Users\dick>dir "/Users/dick/documents" /w
	 Volume in drive C is Windows
	 Volume Serial Number is 30E6-9CD1
	
	 Directory of C:\Users\dick\documents
	
	[.]
	[..]
	audreyad.png

>
> I guess I really need to learn Powershell programming.

Certainly far superior to command.com.  Before that existed, I started 
with cygwin bash.  I have no reason to open a command.com shell.
Windows 10 has Ubuntu bash now.  Even less reason to learn powershell. ;)

>
> But yeah, backslash-only software has become rare. I guess we can thank
> the internet for that.

The internet takes full credit for that and demeans you for conceiving 
that there could be otherwise.  And you're fat (or skinny).

I see backslashes:  One of the eclipse/tomcat quick fix hints is to add
C:\\home\\dick\\tomcat\\long\\path
"Argh! Seriously!?  I have to change that." -- Living half my life on 
Linux, I really refuse to allow \\ in one of my text files.

>
> As for "ftfy": Nope, I didn't misspeak, mistype or whatever.

Sorry. Got it.

I focused on povray and python and calling one from the other and did I 
mention I hate backslashes in paths?
Dick from the internet says they're evil.

-- 
dik

[clipka] Re: Python, subprocess, error! [3650 days 16 hours and 17 minutes ago]

Thu, 28 Apr 2016 21:37:24 GMT

Am 28.04.2016 um 22:28 schrieb dick balaska:
> Am 2016-04-28 12:36, also sprach clipka:
> 
>> If you do have compelling reason to spread a scene across multiple
>> directories, use only RELATIVE PATH NAMES with FORWARD SLASHES as path
>> separators. The forward slash is the one and only character that is
>> recognized as a path separator by each and every contemporary official,
>> semi-official or unofficial version, port or fork of POV-Ray I'm
>> currently aware of. (*)
> 
> s/POV-Ray/operating system/
> ftfy.

Not entirely, to my dismay. Most notably, some of the core gizmos of the
Windows command prompt (which I do consider part of the OS) still
stubbornly refuse to recognize forward slashes as path separators.

I guess I really need to learn Powershell programming.

But yeah, backslash-only software has become rare. I guess we can thank
the internet for that.


As for "ftfy": Nope, I didn't misspeak, mistype or whatever. In case of
POV-Ray it's not the OS that decides what characters can be used as path
separators, but POV-Ray itself. Forward slashes would continue to work
perfectly fine in POV-Ray for Windows even if Microsoft suddenly decided
to drop support at the OS level (or so I think; at worst it would be a
matter of changing the compile-time configuration). It should also be
comparatively easy to add support for backslash path separators to the
Unix version (though I don't know why anyone would want to do that).
Conversely, by tampering with the compile-time configuration you could
easily break some functionality of POV-Ray for Windows with regards to
backslash-separated paths.

[dick balaska] Re: Python, subprocess, error! [3650 days 17 hours and 26 minutes ago]

Thu, 28 Apr 2016 20:28:11 GMT

Am 2016-04-28 12:36, also sprach clipka:

> If you do have compelling reason to spread a scene across multiple
> directories, use only RELATIVE PATH NAMES with FORWARD SLASHES as path
> separators. The forward slash is the one and only character that is
> recognized as a path separator by each and every contemporary official,
> semi-official or unofficial version, port or fork of POV-Ray I'm
> currently aware of. (*)

s/POV-Ray/operating system/
ftfy.

backslashes in paths are evil.

-- 
dik

[clipka] Re: Python, subprocess, error! [3650 days 21 hours and 18 minutes ago]

Thu, 28 Apr 2016 16:36:18 GMT

Am 28.04.2016 um 17:16 schrieb Mr:

> What would you advice I do to adapt the current code?  How should we provide a
> cross platform path in our pov files? have them use unix path all allong? so
> reverse all the windows paths slashes or use unix paths everywhere?

For maximum portability, place all files relevant for a scene inside the
very SAME DIRECTORY, and only refer to them by their base filename and
extension.

If you do have compelling reason to spread a scene across multiple
directories, use only RELATIVE PATH NAMES with FORWARD SLASHES as path
separators. The forward slash is the one and only character that is
recognized as a path separator by each and every contemporary official,
semi-official or unofficial version, port or fork of POV-Ray I'm
currently aware of. (*)

Also, when automatically generating scene files and subsequently
invoking POV-Ray to render them, if the scene makes use of library-ish
include files stored someplace else, consider referring to them by their
base filename nonetheless, and instead telling the POV-Ray executable
where to find them by using the +L command-line option. This way you can
keep absolute path names (and usually even relative path names) out of
the scene-specific .ini and .pov files entirely.


(* There's another reason to avoid backslashes as path separators in
POV-Ray scenes or INI files, even if you know your scene will be
rendered by POV-Ray for Windows: The backslash carries special meaning
in string literals as an escape character. Worse yet, versions even as
recent as 3.7.0 included some undocumented inconsistencies in their
backslash handling.)

[Mr] Re: Python, subprocess, error! [3650 days 22 hours and 34 minutes ago]

Thu, 28 Apr 2016 15:20:00 GMT

"Mr" <nomail@nomail> wrote:
> clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
> > Am 29.07.2014 21:24, schrieb LanuHum:
> > > Hellow!
> > > I want to make a render in a shadow mode for a preview of materials in Blender
> > > In Linux - no problem, preview very good
> > > In Windows don't work
> > >
http://blender-3d.ru/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=753.0;attach=2930;image
> >
> > It does tell you what's wrong:
> >
> > "Cannot open INI file 'C:\povray\preview/Preview.ini'."
> >
> > Make sure the file is indeed at that location.
>
> oh, it looks like something is wrong with the slash/backslash\ handling in the
> report.  Can you let me know if the last version does work for you?
>
> wheneverpossible using the os.path module methods to concatenate, truncate or
> whatever one has to do with paths makes sure it works more smoothly across
> platforms. possibly one slash should be removed from the hardwritten filename
> and left to be handled by the python's os.path methods, for instance current
> version is:
>
>
>  workDir=os.path.dirname(__file__)
>  previewDir=os.path.join(workDir, "preview")
>
>  ## Make sure Preview directory exists and is empty
>  if not os.path.isdir(previewDir):
>  os.mkdir(previewDir)
>
>  iniPrevFile=os.path.join(previewDir, "Preview.ini")
>  inputPrevFile=os.path.join(previewDir, "Preview.pov")

Hi,
The yellow message is still there and Lanuhum architecture is different from
mine, so that I would need to dig into it to understand...
What would you advice I do to adapt the current code?  How should we provide a
cross platform path in our pov files? have them use unix path all allong? so
reverse all the windows paths slashes or use unix paths everywhere?

[Thorsten Froehlich] Re: Massively delayed Stop Render [3689 days 16 hours and 54 minutes ago]

Sun, 20 Mar 2016 21:00:00 GMT

clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
> As for the delay when stopping the render, it is important to note that
> the queue of rendered chunks is actually a generic message queue, and so
> the image assembly thread first has to process all the piled-up chunks
> before it even receives the information that the render is to be
> stopped. (Or at least that's what I think is happening; I'm currently
> not deep enough into the details to say for certain. An alternative
> explanation might be that the delay is caused by POV-Ray struggling to
> release all the memory blocks holding the image chunks.)

Each thread has its own queue, so it is not that the backend does not receive to
stop request, but that the frontend is simply still busy drawing the finished
blocks. Then it will find the render statistics etc. in the message queue of the
frontend. It should be visible even in the task manager that POV stops rendering
by the total processor usage, which drops to one thread doing the drawing.

The solution is to have enough memory to hold everything in RAM as the effects
will go away for the most part.

Thorsten

[clipka] Re: Massively delayed Stop Render [3690 days 12 hours and 23 minutes ago]

Sun, 20 Mar 2016 01:31:04 GMT

Am 19.03.2016 um 23:49 schrieb Bald Eagle:
> So, I've noticed that sometimes when I'm rendering a very large sized graphic
> (10240 x 7680), that things slow way down, memory usages goes way up, and
> clicking on _stop render_ is apparently unresponsive.
> Then I wait while POV-Ray happily renders away - and then registers my stop
> render - like minutes later.
> 
> I this a POV-Ray thing, a Windows 7 thing, a Dell Inspiron thing... ?
> Has anyone else noticed this behaviour?
> 
> Win 7 Home Premium SP1
> Dell N5110 i5-2410M 2.3 GHz
> 4GB, 64 bit
> 
> Running 3.7.0.msvc10.win64

This is a known effect for large images of simple scenes: For
sufficiently large images, the buffer in which POV-Ray assembles the
rendered image chunks into a complete image is not held in main memory,
but in a temporary file instead. As a consequence, the performance of
the thread that does this assembly is limited by the disk I/O bandwidth.
On the other hand, the render tasks that compute those chunks are
limited only by processing power and main memory bandwidth, and so in
simple scenes they may crank out results faster than the image assembly
thread can consume them. In such cases, the rendered chunks pile up in a
queue held in main memory, which grows larger and larger as render
progresses.

Of course it doesn't help that as the queue grows larger, chunks spend
more and more time in the queue, and are thus more and more prone to be
swapped out to disk by Windows' virtual memory management, creating even
more disk I/O workload.

As for the delay when stopping the render, it is important to note that
the queue of rendered chunks is actually a generic message queue, and so
the image assembly thread first has to process all the piled-up chunks
before it even receives the information that the render is to be
stopped. (Or at least that's what I think is happening; I'm currently
not deep enough into the details to say for certain. An alternative
explanation might be that the delay is caused by POV-Ray struggling to
release all the memory blocks holding the image chunks.)


> Also, every so often F1 (Help) doesn't respond either.

To my knowledge, this is entirely unrelated.

[Bald Eagle] Massively delayed Stop Render [3690 days 15 hours and 4 minutes ago]

Sat, 19 Mar 2016 22:50:00 GMT

So, I've noticed that sometimes when I'm rendering a very large sized graphic
(10240 x 7680), that things slow way down, memory usages goes way up, and
clicking on _stop render_ is apparently unresponsive.
Then I wait while POV-Ray happily renders away - and then registers my stop
render - like minutes later.

I this a POV-Ray thing, a Windows 7 thing, a Dell Inspiron thing... ?
Has anyone else noticed this behaviour?

Win 7 Home Premium SP1
Dell N5110 i5-2410M 2.3 GHz
4GB, 64 bit

Running 3.7.0.msvc10.win64


Also, every so often F1 (Help) doesn't respond either.

[Mike Horvath] Re: Add additional data embedded in [supported] ... [3708 days 20 hours ago]

Tue, 1 Mar 2016 17:54:17 GMT

On 2/28/2016 11:15 PM, Bald Eagle wrote:
> What about rigging up some kinda post-processing thing?
> Can POV-Ray spit out variables to a 3rd party program that POV-Ray executes on
> completion of the render?
> I dunno much about things like that   :O
>
>

A related idea I came up with is to simply overlay text on top of the 
image with all the information you want. This would be for test renders 
only of course.

Screen.inc might do the trick.

Mike

[Mike Horvath] Re: Add additional data embedded in [supported] ... [3708 days 20 hours and 2 minutes ago]

Tue, 1 Mar 2016 17:51:59 GMT

On 2/28/2016 11:15 PM, Bald Eagle wrote:
> What about rigging up some kinda post-processing thing?
> Can POV-Ray spit out variables to a 3rd party program that POV-Ray executes on
> completion of the render?
> I dunno much about things like that   :O
>
>

Someone would have to create a tool that writes the metadata to the image.


Mike

[clipka] Re: Add additional data embedded in [supported] ... [3710 days 7 hours and 44 minutes ago]

Mon, 29 Feb 2016 06:09:38 GMT

Am 29.02.2016 um 05:15 schrieb Bald Eagle:

> What about rigging up some kinda post-processing thing?
> Can POV-Ray spit out variables to a 3rd party program that POV-Ray executes on
> completion of the render?
> I dunno much about things like that   :O

In the INI file you can instruct POV-Ray to run a post-render command
(typically a batch file on Windows machines), which could then read data
from a file generated using "#write".

Or you could even generate the whole batch file in this manner.

[Bald Eagle] Re: Add additional data embedded in [supported] ... [3710 days 9 hours and 34 minutes ago]

Mon, 29 Feb 2016 04:20:01 GMT

Mike Horvath <mik### [at] gmailcom> wrote:

>
http://news.povray.org/povray.advanced-users/thread/%3C54d7aa78$1@news.povray.org%3E/

Aha!   I see great minds think alike   :)

> It's a "least common denominator" kind of a thing. Some formats don't
> support a lot of metadata, therefore the other formats should also be
> limited to this small amount.
>
> Mike

I was thinking that POV-Ray must have things that it does based upon which file
format it writes to.
Doesn't seem to hard to filter what you can and cannot write out, or how much,
based upon what output format is specified.

#if (format = allowed)
     go hog wild
#else
     #if (format = somewhat)
          write whatever data will fit
     #else
          tactfully tell user most of the data got sh*tcannned
          "Please switch to format A, B, or C to include all desired data"
     #end
#end

What about rigging up some kinda post-processing thing?
Can POV-Ray spit out variables to a 3rd party program that POV-Ray executes on
completion of the render?
I dunno much about things like that   :O

[Mike Horvath] Re: Add additional data embedded in [supported] ... [3710 days 10 hours and 30 minutes ago]

Mon, 29 Feb 2016 03:23:41 GMT

On 2/28/2016 9:52 PM, Bald Eagle wrote:
>
> I was just thinking about this -
>
> Is there a simple way to add additional data to the file formats that allow it -
> metadata, "Alternate Data Streams" for the information that pops-up when
> hovering over the file in a directory, Squirreling away notes - author,
> version/revision, (C), and maybe even SDL code inside PNG files, etc. ???
>
> Having POV-Ray automatically post-process a file would be good, having this
> capability as a native function of POV-Ray would be better   ;)
>
> Being able to load such embedded SDL from a supported graphic file into POV-Ray
> would be super cool as well   :)
>
> Great way to simplify uploading all the data, and HOW you made that great
> raytraced image wouldn't be lost....
>
>
>

http://news.povray.org/povray.advanced-users/thread/%3C54d7aa78$1@news.povray.org%3E/

It's a "least common denominator" kind of a thing. Some formats don't 
support a lot of metadata, therefore the other formats should also be 
limited to this small amount.

Mike

[Bald Eagle] Add additional data embedded in [supported] outp... [3710 days 10 hours and 59 minutes ago]

Mon, 29 Feb 2016 02:55:00 GMT

I was just thinking about this -

Is there a simple way to add additional data to the file formats that allow it -
metadata, "Alternate Data Streams" for the information that pops-up when
hovering over the file in a directory, Squirreling away notes - author,
version/revision, (C), and maybe even SDL code inside PNG files, etc. ???

Having POV-Ray automatically post-process a file would be good, having this
capability as a native function of POV-Ray would be better   ;)

Being able to load such embedded SDL from a supported graphic file into POV-Ray
would be super cool as well   :)

Great way to simplify uploading all the data, and HOW you made that great
raytraced image wouldn't be lost....

[Sven Littkowski] Re: Blobs: Error1:NegativeValues:Holes!/Error2:A... [3756 days 20 hours and 47 minutes ago]

Wed, 13 Jan 2016 17:06:50 GMT

Oh, okay. Yes, will do. Updates will follow.

[clipka] Re: Blobs: Error1:NegativeValues:Holes!/Error2:A... [3757 days and 34 minutes ago]

Wed, 13 Jan 2016 13:20:03 GMT

Sven Littkowski <jam### [at] yahoocom> wrote:

> I am compiling that 64bit version now without own changes, and will make
> some tests. And afterwards, if I still get crashes, I will compile those
> other versions of POV-Ray as suggested by you

As for those other versions, my suggestion was not for you to compile them, but
for you to test the pre-built binaries on your system and with the scene you're
using.

[Sven Littkowski] Re: Blobs: Error1:NegativeValues:Holes!/Error2:A... [3757 days 3 hours and 33 minutes ago]

Wed, 13 Jan 2016 10:21:14 GMT

AVG says, it is a potential thread. Not an actual virus. My system is
clean (was clean before). And I want to assume, that GitHub is also clean.

I am compiling that 64bit version now without own changes, and will make
some tests. And afterwards, if I still get crashes, I will compile those
other versions of POV-Ray as suggested by you (and test for viruses or
potential threads). :-)

[clipka] Re: Blobs: Error1:NegativeValues:Holes!/Error2:A... [3757 days 7 hours and 32 minutes ago]

Wed, 13 Jan 2016 06:22:21 GMT

Am 13.01.2016 um 06:08 schrieb Sven Littkowski:

> During the rendering, my unofficial version crashed. I did a debugging
> with the VS, and post here some of the errors (at the end, in German
> language).

For debugging, you really want to pick "Debug" instead of "Release" from
the combo box up there. It should give you more information about the
problem, and may also take you directly to the offending code.

Also, you want to figure out whether the problem is caused by your
changes (which seems highly unlikely to me, though I wouldn't rule it
out for now), by something breaking your build process, or by something
unrelated to your particular build.

To figure out whether it is your changes that cause the problem should
be easy: Just revert back to the original code, rebuild, then run it in
the same way as before.

To figure out whether it is a problem with your build setup or a more
general issue, I'd recommend trying out the latest semi-official
release, routinely available at
https://github.com/c-lipka/povray/releases. As the latest build is only
available as a 32 bit version, you'll want to test those (possibly both
the 32-bit and 32-bit SSE2 version), but be aware that if it works fine,
there might still be a fundamental problem with the 64 bit version; in
that case you may also want to check the latest available semi-official
64 bit build, though again if that one works fine there still may be a
64 bit problem introduced later. Thus if all the semi-official builds
work fine, you may still want to ask for futher support, providing us
with the scene that causes the crash.


Also, you may want to do the usual stuff to narrow down the root cause:
Trim down your scene to the minimal set that still reproduces the crash.


FYI, a few days ago during development I did encounter a nasty crash
myself that I couldn't attribute to any specific thing I was messing
with at that time, so I wouldn't be too surprised if you did stumble
across an actual bug in the current master branch.

[clipka] Re: Blobs: Error1:NegativeValues:Holes!/Error2:A... [3757 days 7 hours and 58 minutes ago]

Wed, 13 Jan 2016 05:55:56 GMT

Am 13.01.2016 um 05:23 schrieb Sven Littkowski:
> This time, the compilation succeeded ... but:
> 
> AVG reports a thread upon finishing:
> 
> Found Win32/DH{cQ?}
> Object Name:
> h:Setup\Applications\3D\POV-Ray\C++\povray-master\windows\vs10\bin64\pvengine64.exe
> 
> I am sure, this is just a false alarm, as I downloaded the ISO of the
> German VS straight from their website, and as my   computer is otherwise
> virus-free. Thus, I will tell AVG to ignore this "threat".

Given that you also experience problems when running the build, I'd
actually be more cautious. Proper procedure would be to submit the
binary to AVG for analysis.

[Sven Littkowski] Re: Blobs: Error1:NegativeValues:Holes!/Error2:A... [3757 days 8 hours and 39 minutes ago]

Wed, 13 Jan 2016 05:15:22 GMT

During the new compiling with the reduced values, I am seeing this message:

1>  blob.cpp
1>..\..\source\core\shape\blob.cpp(2586): warning C4267: "=":
Konvertierung von "size_t" nach "int", Datenverlust mÃ¶glich

= conversion from "size_t" to "int", data loss possible

Could that be the source of the crash? I am really no C++ programmer,
just wondering. Still, it is interesting to try creating my own
PVEngine64.exe... :-)

[Sven Littkowski] Re: Blobs: Error1:NegativeValues:Holes!/Error2:A... [3757 days 8 hours and 45 minutes ago]

Wed, 13 Jan 2016 05:08:54 GMT

Here an update:

During the rendering, my unofficial version crashed. I did a debugging
with the VS, and post here some of the errors (at the end, in German
language).

I changed both locations inside the blob.cpp file ("const DBL
DEPTH_TOLERANCE = 1.0e-6" and "const DBL INSIDE_TOLERANCE = 1.0e-12"). I
will reduce both values (3 and 9). If that doesn't help, I will just
keep the first change (3) as suggested by William.



-----------------------------

Ausnahmefehler bei 0x00000000778DFFC2 (ntdll.dll) in pvengine64.exe:
0xC0000374: A heap has been corrupted (Parameter: 0x0000000077957470)


---


Ausnahme ausgelÃ¶st bei 0x000000014032B230 in pvengine64.exe: 0xC0000005:
Zugriffsverletzung beim Lesen an Position 0xFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF.

Falls ein Handler fÃ¼r diese Ausnahme vorhanden ist, kann das Programm
mÃ¶glicherweise weiterhin sicher ausgefÃ¼hrt werden.


---


Ausnahmefehler bei 0x000000014032B230 in pvengine64.exe: 0xC0000005:
Zugriffsverletzung beim Lesen an Position 0xFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF

Falls ein Handler fÃ¼r diese Ausnahme vorhanden ist, kann das Programm
mÃ¶glicherweise weiterhin sicher ausgefÃ¼hrt werden.


---


Ausnahmefehler bei 0x000000014032B230 in pvengine64.exe: 0xC0000005:
Zugriffsverletzung beim Lesen an Position 0xFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF

[Sven Littkowski] Re: Blobs: Error1:NegativeValues:Holes!/Error2:A... [3757 days 14 hours and 43 minutes ago]

Tue, 12 Jan 2016 23:11:04 GMT

Yes, agreed. Makes sense. :-)

[Rocco] Re: povdos needed [3819 days 19 hours and 14 minutes ago]

Wed, 11 Nov 2015 18:40:01 GMT

> Do you have povray built like this with the unix front end?

No, the console functions POVRay uses are specific to Unix, there is some work
to do to remove all the unix-oriented functions. Maybe with Cygwin the result is
better but now I don't have time to spend on this.

[Dick Balaska] Re: povdos needed [3819 days 22 hours and 13 minutes ago]

Wed, 11 Nov 2015 15:40:54 GMT

In article <web.563f581a405ef3d9a6fce6540@news.povray.org>, 
nomail@nomail says...
> 
> Hi!
> 
> After some searching, I think I'm on the right path to compile a console version
> of POVRay for Windows using MinGW64. I have all dependencies compiled without
> problem, the problem now is to make changes to use Windows console because the
> source code is configured in the Unix philosophy, using Unix functions for
> console, so unavailable for Windows.
> 
> As I have no time to investigate on this right now, I share here my experience
> so far, maybe it will be useful...

I think building under MinGW64 using the Unix front end is The Right Way 
to go.  You pick up all the switch parsing; common code base. Way back, 
I built my posdos3.1 that way.  Plus, we avoid this crap where the M$ 
version only builds with a compiler no longer available.
As long as there's no Windows Loop needed, this is better.

Do you have povray built like this with the unix front end?

[clipka] Re: povdos needed [3822 days 16 hours and 56 minutes ago]

Sun, 8 Nov 2015 20:57:40 GMT

Am 08.11.2015 um 19:05 schrieb Tim H:
> Before someone beats me to it, I may be remembering running the DOS
> executable in a Windows command prompt, maybe not a Windows console
> program.  Still would the console code from then be any way relevant? Is
> it still available?

There is still exists a bit of dedicated Windows Console code, and even
a "Console" project in the Visual Studio solution; it's normally
deactivated, and it hasn't seen much maintenance, but I had given it
some resuscitation once during the 3.7 beta phase, so I guess it should
be comparatively easy to bring it back to full life. Some CPR
accompanied by liberal application of Epinephrine, and it should be as
good as new.

[Alain] Re: povdos needed [3822 days 17 hours and 10 minutes ago]

Sun, 8 Nov 2015 20:44:19 GMT

Le 15-11-08 13:05, Tim H a écrit :
> Before someone beats me to it, I may be remembering running the DOS
> executable in a Windows command prompt, maybe not a Windows console
> program.  Still would the console code from then be any way relevant? Is
> it still available?
>

After it was discovered that someone made a comercial graphic product 
that used POV-Ray from the command line, WITHOUT giving proper credit 
and without asking, that possibility was totaly removed.

Good news: It's on the To-Do list for future versions.

[Tim H] Re: povdos needed [3822 days 19 hours and 48 minutes ago]

Sun, 8 Nov 2015 18:05:41 GMT

Before someone beats me to it, I may be remembering running the DOS 
executable in a Windows command prompt, maybe not a Windows console 
program.  Still would the console code from then be any way relevant? 
Is it still available?

On 11/8/2015 11:00 AM, Tim H wrote:
> There was at one point a command line windows povray.  I believe it was
> official, seem to recall downloading it from the official site. Probably
> the relevant Windows console code was long ago removed?
>
> On 11/8/2015 7:11 AM, Rocco wrote:
>> Hi!
>>
>> After some searching, I think I'm on the right path to compile a
>> console version
>> of POVRay for Windows using MinGW64. I have all dependencies compiled
>> without
>> problem, the problem now is to make changes to use Windows console
>> because the
>> source code is configured in the Unix philosophy, using Unix functions
>> for
>> console, so unavailable for Windows.
>>
>> As I have no time to investigate on this right now, I share here my
>> experience
>> so far, maybe it will be useful...
>>
>> Tools and compilers needed
>> ==========================
>>   * MinGW64 from http://mingw-w64.yaxm.org/doku.php
>>
>>   * pkg-config from
>>
http://ftp.gnome.org/pub/gnome/binaries/win32/dependencies/pkg-config_0.23-3_win32.zip
>>
>>    glib :
>> http://ftp.gnome.org/pub/gnome/binaries/win32/glib/2.28/glib_2.28.1-1_win32.zip
>>
>>
>>   * MSYS Extensions from
>> http://sourceforge.net/projects/mingw/files/MSYS/Extension/
>>    crypt : libcrypt-1.1_1-3-msys-1.0.13-dll-0.tar.lzma
>>    crypt : crypt-1.1_1-3-msys-1.0.13-bin.tar.lzma
>>    m4 : m4-1.4.16-2-msys-1.0.17-bin.tar.lzma
>>    perl : perl-5.8.8-1-msys-1.0.17-bin.tar.lzma
>>
>>   * MSYS Dev from
>> http://sourceforge.net/projects/mingw/files/MSYS/msysdev/
>>    autoconf : autoconf-2.68-1-msys-1.0.17-bin.tar.lzma
>>    automake : automake-1.11.1-1-msys-1.0.13-bin.tar.lzma
>>
>>   * MSYS Base from http://sourceforge.net/projects/mingw/files/MSYS/Base/
>>    bash : bash-3.1.23-1-msys-1.0.18-bin.tar.xz
>>    coreutils : coreutils-5.97-3-msys-1.0.13-bin.tar.lzma
>>    coreutils : coreutils-5.97-3-msys-1.0.13-ext.tar.lzma
>>    findutils : findutils-4.4.2-2-msys-1.0.13-bin.tar.lzma
>>    gawk : gawk-3.1.7-2-msys-1.0.13-bin.tar.lzma
>>    grep : grep-2.5.4-2-msys-1.0.13-bin.tar.lzma
>>    libiconv : libiconv-1.14-1-msys-1.0.17-dll-2.tar.lzma
>>    gettext : libintl-0.18.1.1-1-msys-1.0.17-dll-8.tar.lzma
>>    regex : libregex-1.20090805-2-msys-1.0.13-dll-1.tar.lzma
>>    termcap : libtermcap-0.20050421_1-2-msys-1.0.13-dll-0.tar.lzma
>>    make : make-3.81-3-msys-1.0.13-bin.tar.lzma
>>    msys-core : msysCORE-1.0.18-1-msys-1.0.18-bin.tar.lzma
>>    msys-core : msysCORE-1.0.18-1-msys-1.0.18-ext.tar.lzma
>>    sed : sed-4.2.1-2-msys-1.0.13-bin.tar.lzma
>>    termcap : termcap-0.20050421_1-2-msys-1.0.13-bin.tar.lzma
>>
>>   * Microsoft assembler 64 bit MASM (ML64.exe is part of Windows SDK, DDK
>>    or Visual Studio, I found it in my Visual Studio Express 2013 in
>>    C:\Program Files (x86)\Microsoft Visual Studio 12.0\VC\bin\x86_amd64
>>
>>   * CMake from http://www.cmake.org/
>>
>> Dependencies
>> ============
>>   Needed
>>   ======
>>   boost  http://www.boost.org
>>   zlib  http://www.zlib.net/
>>   jpeg  http://www.ijg.org/files/
>>   png  http://www.libpng.org/pub/png/libpng.html
>>   tiff  http://www.remotesensing.org/libtiff/
>>
>>   Optional
>>   ========
>>   openexr  http://www.openexr.com/
>>   sdl 1.2  http://www.libsdl.org
>>
>> Prepare a build environment
>> ===========================
>> When I build with MinGW, I always have this directory
>> layout :
>>
>> - The MinGW environment is installed in C:\MinGW.
>> - The CMake binaries are extracted in C:\MinGW\CMake
>> - The MSYS binaries (all MSYS-related stuff above) are
>>    extracted in C:\MinGW\MSYS
>>   => In MSYS, this directory is mapped as /
>> - pkg-config and its DLLs can be placed in C:\MinGW\MSYS
>>    (also copy msys-intl-8.dll to intl.dll in C:\MinGW\MSYS\bin
>>
>> Run the postinstall\pi.bat script to initialize the environment
>> and set some directories (follow the instructions).
>>
>> After first launch of MSYS, a directory is available : /home/<user>/
>> The source code packages go to /home/user/source
>> The build directory (with binaries and libs) is /build
>>
>> So, excluding other files, this is how the directory structure looks
>> like :
>> C:\MinGW
>>    cmake
>>    mingw64
>>    msys
>>      build
>>      home
>>        <user>
>>          source
>>
>> After installation, I create a .bat file to set environment variables
>> needed
>> (for example, to use CMake). This file is buildenv.bat and I place it in
>> /home/<user/. When using MSYS, I simply start the MSYS.bat in
>> C:\MinGW\msys.
>>
>> All the configure scripts have the prefix /build when using MSYS. When
>> building
>> with other tools (for example CMake), I map a drive letter (Z) to the
>> /build
>> folder.
>>
>> Build environment (buildenv.bat) file
>> =====================================
>> @ECHO OFF
>> COLOR 1F
>> TITLE Build environment
>> ECHO Build environment
>> ECHO =================
>>
>> SET PATH=C:\MinGW\msys\build\bin;%PATH%
>> SET PATH=C:\MinGW\msys\build\lib;%PATH%
>>
>> SET PATH=C:\MinGW\mingw64\bin;%PATH%
>> SET PATH=C:\MinGW\cmake\bin;%PATH%
>> SET PATH=C:\Program Files (x86)\Microsoft Visual Studio
>> 12.0\VC\bin\x86_amd64
>>
>> SUBST Z: C:\MinGW\msys\build
>>
>> CD C:\MinGW\msys\home
>> CMD
>>
>> Install tools
>> =============
>> MinGW64
>>   Download from : http://mingw-w64.yaxm.org/doku.php
>>   mingw-w64-install.exe
>>
>>   => C:\MinGW
>>
>> MSYS build environment
>>   Download from : http://sourceforge.net/projects/mingw/files/MSYS/Base/
>>   => C:\MinGW\MSYS
>>
>> CMake : http://www.cmake.org/
>>   => C:\MinGW\CMake
>>
>> MASM 64 (or compatible assembler) : ml64.exe is included with Windows
>> SDK,
>> DDK or Visual Studio.
>>
>> Directories
>> %source% = C:\MinGW\MSYS\home\<user>\source
>> %build% = C:\MinGW\MSYS\build
>> %mingw% = C:\MinGW
>> %prefix% = /build (MSYS), Z:\ (CMake)
>>
>> Set build virtual drive : subst z: %prefix%
>>
>> Build environment
>>   set path=%mingw%\mingw64\bin;%path%
>>   set path=%mingw%\cmake\bin;%path%
>>   set path=%mingw%\swig;%path%
>>
>> Compilation
>> ===========
>> Please follow the order of dependencies.
>>
>> ZLib (CMake)
>> ============
>> cmake -G "MinGW Makefiles" -DCMAKE_INSTALL_PREFIX=%prefix%
>> mingw32-make
>> mingw32-make install
>>
>> ZLib (MSYS)
>> ===========
>> mingw32-make -fwin32/makefile.gcc SHAREDLIB=libz.dll
>> mkdir -p %prefix%/bin
>> mkdir -p %prefix%/include
>> mkdir -p %prefix%/lib
>>
>> cp libz.dll %prefix%/bin
>> cp zlib.h %prefix%include
>> cp lib.dll.a %prefix%/lib
>>
>> JPEG (MSYS)
>> ===========
>> ../configure --prefix=%prefix%
>> make
>> make install
>>
>> PNG (CMake)
>> ==========
>> cmake -G "MinGW Makefiles"
>>   -DZLIB_ROOT=%prefix%\lib
>>   -DPNG_TESTS=OFF
>>   -DCMAKE_INSTALL_PREFIX=%prefix%
>> mingw32-make
>> mingw32-make install
>>
>> TIFF (MSYS)
>> ===========
>> ../configure --prefix=%prefix%
>>   --with-zlib-include-dir=%prefix%/include
>>   --with-zlib-lib-dir=%prefix%/lib
>>   --with-jpeg-include-dir=%prefix%/include
>>   --with-jpeg-lib-dir=%prefix%/lib
>> make
>> make install
>>
>> Boost
>> =====
>> Open buildenv.bat and cd to boost dir
>> booststrap.bat gcc --prefix=Z:\
>> b2 toolset=gcc release
>> b2 toolset=gcc --prefix=Z:\ --variant=release --layout=tagged install
>>
>> OpenEXR (CMake)
>> ===============
>>
>> // Build IlmBase
>> cmake -G "MinGW Makefiles"
>>   -DCMAKE_INSTALL_PREFIX=%prefix%
>>   -DNAMESPACE_VERSIONING=OFF
>> mingw32-make
>> mingw32-make install
>>
>> // Build OpenEXR
>> Needs a modification, see https://github.com/openexr/openexr/issues/95
>>
>> Edit IlmImf/ImfSystemSpecific.h, line 57 replace #ifdef __GNUC__ with
>> #if defined(__GNUC__) && !defined(__MINGW32__)
>>
>> set path=%prefix\bin;%path%
>> set path=%prefix%\lib;%path%
>>
>> cmake -G "MinGW Makefiles"
>>   -DZLIB_ROOT="%prefix%"
>>   -DILMBASE_PACKAGE_PREFIX="%prefix%"
>>   -DCMAKE_INSTALL_PREFIX="%prefix%"
>>   -DCMAKE_CXX_FLAGS="-fpermissive"
>>   -DNAMESPACE_VERSIONING=OFF
>>
>> mingw32-make
>> mingw32-make install
>>
>> !!! OpenEXR.pc was not created, I had to create it manually in
>> /build/lib/pkgconfig
>>
>> Content of OpenEXR.pc :
>>
>> prefix=/build
>> exec_prefix=/build
>> libdir=/build/lib
>> includedir=/build/include
>> OpenEXR_includedir=@includedir@/OpenEXR
>>
>> Name: OpenEXR
>> Description: OpenEXR image library
>> Version: 2.2.0
>>
>> Libs: -L${libdir} -lIlmImf
>> Cflags: -I${OpenEXR_includedir}
>> Requires: IlmBase
>> Libs.private: -lz
>>
>>
>> SDL (MSYS)
>> ==========
>> ../configure --prefix=/build
>> make
>> make install
>>
>> POV-Ray (MSYS)
>> ==============
>> // Patches
>> vfesession.h, vfeplatform.h
>>   #define uint unsigned int
>>
>>
>> In source folder cd unix
>> ../prebuild.sh
>> cd ..
>> export LD_LIBRARY_PATH=%prefix%/lib
>> export LD_FLAGS=%prefix%/lib
>> export C_INCLUDE_PATH=%prefix%/include
>> export CPLUS_INCLUDE_PATH=%prefix%/include
>> export PATH=%prefix%/bin:$PATH
>> export PKG_CONFIG_PATH=%prefix%/lib/pkgconfig
>> ../configure COMPILED_BY="your name <e-mail>" LIBS="-L/build/lib
>> -lboost_system-mt" --prefix=/build
>> make
>> make install
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>

[Tim H] Re: povdos needed [3822 days 19 hours and 54 minutes ago]

Sun, 8 Nov 2015 18:00:24 GMT

There was at one point a command line windows povray.  I believe it was 
official, seem to recall downloading it from the official site. 
Probably the relevant Windows console code was long ago removed?

On 11/8/2015 7:11 AM, Rocco wrote:
> Hi!
>
> After some searching, I think I'm on the right path to compile a console version
> of POVRay for Windows using MinGW64. I have all dependencies compiled without
> problem, the problem now is to make changes to use Windows console because the
> source code is configured in the Unix philosophy, using Unix functions for
> console, so unavailable for Windows.
>
> As I have no time to investigate on this right now, I share here my experience
> so far, maybe it will be useful...
>
> Tools and compilers needed
> ==========================
>   * MinGW64 from http://mingw-w64.yaxm.org/doku.php
>
>   * pkg-config from
>
http://ftp.gnome.org/pub/gnome/binaries/win32/dependencies/pkg-config_0.23-3_win32.zip
>    glib :
> http://ftp.gnome.org/pub/gnome/binaries/win32/glib/2.28/glib_2.28.1-1_win32.zip
>
>   * MSYS Extensions from
> http://sourceforge.net/projects/mingw/files/MSYS/Extension/
>    crypt : libcrypt-1.1_1-3-msys-1.0.13-dll-0.tar.lzma
>    crypt : crypt-1.1_1-3-msys-1.0.13-bin.tar.lzma
>    m4 : m4-1.4.16-2-msys-1.0.17-bin.tar.lzma
>    perl : perl-5.8.8-1-msys-1.0.17-bin.tar.lzma
>
>   * MSYS Dev from http://sourceforge.net/projects/mingw/files/MSYS/msysdev/
>    autoconf : autoconf-2.68-1-msys-1.0.17-bin.tar.lzma
>    automake : automake-1.11.1-1-msys-1.0.13-bin.tar.lzma
>
>   * MSYS Base from http://sourceforge.net/projects/mingw/files/MSYS/Base/
>    bash : bash-3.1.23-1-msys-1.0.18-bin.tar.xz
>    coreutils : coreutils-5.97-3-msys-1.0.13-bin.tar.lzma
>    coreutils : coreutils-5.97-3-msys-1.0.13-ext.tar.lzma
>    findutils : findutils-4.4.2-2-msys-1.0.13-bin.tar.lzma
>    gawk : gawk-3.1.7-2-msys-1.0.13-bin.tar.lzma
>    grep : grep-2.5.4-2-msys-1.0.13-bin.tar.lzma
>    libiconv : libiconv-1.14-1-msys-1.0.17-dll-2.tar.lzma
>    gettext : libintl-0.18.1.1-1-msys-1.0.17-dll-8.tar.lzma
>    regex : libregex-1.20090805-2-msys-1.0.13-dll-1.tar.lzma
>    termcap : libtermcap-0.20050421_1-2-msys-1.0.13-dll-0.tar.lzma
>    make : make-3.81-3-msys-1.0.13-bin.tar.lzma
>    msys-core : msysCORE-1.0.18-1-msys-1.0.18-bin.tar.lzma
>    msys-core : msysCORE-1.0.18-1-msys-1.0.18-ext.tar.lzma
>    sed : sed-4.2.1-2-msys-1.0.13-bin.tar.lzma
>    termcap : termcap-0.20050421_1-2-msys-1.0.13-bin.tar.lzma
>
>   * Microsoft assembler 64 bit MASM (ML64.exe is part of Windows SDK, DDK
>    or Visual Studio, I found it in my Visual Studio Express 2013 in
>    C:\Program Files (x86)\Microsoft Visual Studio 12.0\VC\bin\x86_amd64
>
>   * CMake from http://www.cmake.org/
>
> Dependencies
> ============
>   Needed
>   ======
>   boost  http://www.boost.org
>   zlib  http://www.zlib.net/
>   jpeg  http://www.ijg.org/files/
>   png  http://www.libpng.org/pub/png/libpng.html
>   tiff  http://www.remotesensing.org/libtiff/
>
>   Optional
>   ========
>   openexr  http://www.openexr.com/
>   sdl 1.2  http://www.libsdl.org
>
> Prepare a build environment
> ===========================
> When I build with MinGW, I always have this directory
> layout :
>
> - The MinGW environment is installed in C:\MinGW.
> - The CMake binaries are extracted in C:\MinGW\CMake
> - The MSYS binaries (all MSYS-related stuff above) are
>    extracted in C:\MinGW\MSYS
>   => In MSYS, this directory is mapped as /
> - pkg-config and its DLLs can be placed in C:\MinGW\MSYS
>    (also copy msys-intl-8.dll to intl.dll in C:\MinGW\MSYS\bin
>
> Run the postinstall\pi.bat script to initialize the environment
> and set some directories (follow the instructions).
>
> After first launch of MSYS, a directory is available : /home/<user>/
> The source code packages go to /home/user/source
> The build directory (with binaries and libs) is /build
>
> So, excluding other files, this is how the directory structure looks like :
> C:\MinGW
>    cmake
>    mingw64
>    msys
>      build
>      home
>        <user>
>          source
>
> After installation, I create a .bat file to set environment variables needed
> (for example, to use CMake). This file is buildenv.bat and I place it in
> /home/<user/. When using MSYS, I simply start the MSYS.bat in C:\MinGW\msys.
>
> All the configure scripts have the prefix /build when using MSYS. When building
> with other tools (for example CMake), I map a drive letter (Z) to the /build
> folder.
>
> Build environment (buildenv.bat) file
> =====================================
> @ECHO OFF
> COLOR 1F
> TITLE Build environment
> ECHO Build environment
> ECHO =================
>
> SET PATH=C:\MinGW\msys\build\bin;%PATH%
> SET PATH=C:\MinGW\msys\build\lib;%PATH%
>
> SET PATH=C:\MinGW\mingw64\bin;%PATH%
> SET PATH=C:\MinGW\cmake\bin;%PATH%
> SET PATH=C:\Program Files (x86)\Microsoft Visual Studio 12.0\VC\bin\x86_amd64
>
> SUBST Z: C:\MinGW\msys\build
>
> CD C:\MinGW\msys\home
> CMD
>
> Install tools
> =============
> MinGW64
>   Download from : http://mingw-w64.yaxm.org/doku.php
>   mingw-w64-install.exe
>
>   => C:\MinGW
>
> MSYS build environment
>   Download from : http://sourceforge.net/projects/mingw/files/MSYS/Base/
>   => C:\MinGW\MSYS
>
> CMake : http://www.cmake.org/
>   => C:\MinGW\CMake
>
> MASM 64 (or compatible assembler) : ml64.exe is included with Windows SDK,
> DDK or Visual Studio.
>
> Directories
> %source% = C:\MinGW\MSYS\home\<user>\source
> %build% = C:\MinGW\MSYS\build
> %mingw% = C:\MinGW
> %prefix% = /build (MSYS), Z:\ (CMake)
>
> Set build virtual drive : subst z: %prefix%
>
> Build environment
>   set path=%mingw%\mingw64\bin;%path%
>   set path=%mingw%\cmake\bin;%path%
>   set path=%mingw%\swig;%path%
>
> Compilation
> ===========
> Please follow the order of dependencies.
>
> ZLib (CMake)
> ============
> cmake -G "MinGW Makefiles" -DCMAKE_INSTALL_PREFIX=%prefix%
> mingw32-make
> mingw32-make install
>
> ZLib (MSYS)
> ===========
> mingw32-make -fwin32/makefile.gcc SHAREDLIB=libz.dll
> mkdir -p %prefix%/bin
> mkdir -p %prefix%/include
> mkdir -p %prefix%/lib
>
> cp libz.dll %prefix%/bin
> cp zlib.h %prefix%include
> cp lib.dll.a %prefix%/lib
>
> JPEG (MSYS)
> ===========
> ../configure --prefix=%prefix%
> make
> make install
>
> PNG (CMake)
> ==========
> cmake -G "MinGW Makefiles"
>   -DZLIB_ROOT=%prefix%\lib
>   -DPNG_TESTS=OFF
>   -DCMAKE_INSTALL_PREFIX=%prefix%
> mingw32-make
> mingw32-make install
>
> TIFF (MSYS)
> ===========
> ../configure --prefix=%prefix%
>   --with-zlib-include-dir=%prefix%/include
>   --with-zlib-lib-dir=%prefix%/lib
>   --with-jpeg-include-dir=%prefix%/include
>   --with-jpeg-lib-dir=%prefix%/lib
> make
> make install
>
> Boost
> =====
> Open buildenv.bat and cd to boost dir
> booststrap.bat gcc --prefix=Z:\
> b2 toolset=gcc release
> b2 toolset=gcc --prefix=Z:\ --variant=release --layout=tagged install
>
> OpenEXR (CMake)
> ===============
>
> // Build IlmBase
> cmake -G "MinGW Makefiles"
>   -DCMAKE_INSTALL_PREFIX=%prefix%
>   -DNAMESPACE_VERSIONING=OFF
> mingw32-make
> mingw32-make install
>
> // Build OpenEXR
> Needs a modification, see https://github.com/openexr/openexr/issues/95
>
> Edit IlmImf/ImfSystemSpecific.h, line 57 replace #ifdef __GNUC__ with
> #if defined(__GNUC__) && !defined(__MINGW32__)
>
> set path=%prefix\bin;%path%
> set path=%prefix%\lib;%path%
>
> cmake -G "MinGW Makefiles"
>   -DZLIB_ROOT="%prefix%"
>   -DILMBASE_PACKAGE_PREFIX="%prefix%"
>   -DCMAKE_INSTALL_PREFIX="%prefix%"
>   -DCMAKE_CXX_FLAGS="-fpermissive"
>   -DNAMESPACE_VERSIONING=OFF
>
> mingw32-make
> mingw32-make install
>
> !!! OpenEXR.pc was not created, I had to create it manually in
> /build/lib/pkgconfig
>
> Content of OpenEXR.pc :
>
> prefix=/build
> exec_prefix=/build
> libdir=/build/lib
> includedir=/build/include
> OpenEXR_includedir=@includedir@/OpenEXR
>
> Name: OpenEXR
> Description: OpenEXR image library
> Version: 2.2.0
>
> Libs: -L${libdir} -lIlmImf
> Cflags: -I${OpenEXR_includedir}
> Requires: IlmBase
> Libs.private: -lz
>
>
> SDL (MSYS)
> ==========
> ../configure --prefix=/build
> make
> make install
>
> POV-Ray (MSYS)
> ==============
> // Patches
> vfesession.h, vfeplatform.h
>   #define uint unsigned int
>
>
> In source folder cd unix
> ../prebuild.sh
> cd ..
> export LD_LIBRARY_PATH=%prefix%/lib
> export LD_FLAGS=%prefix%/lib
> export C_INCLUDE_PATH=%prefix%/include
> export CPLUS_INCLUDE_PATH=%prefix%/include
> export PATH=%prefix%/bin:$PATH
> export PKG_CONFIG_PATH=%prefix%/lib/pkgconfig
> ../configure COMPILED_BY="your name <e-mail>" LIBS="-L/build/lib
> -lboost_system-mt" --prefix=/build
> make
> make install
>
>
>
>
>

[Rocco] Re: povdos needed [3822 days 23 hours and 39 minutes ago]

Sun, 8 Nov 2015 14:15:05 GMT

Hi!

After some searching, I think I'm on the right path to compile a console version
of POVRay for Windows using MinGW64. I have all dependencies compiled without
problem, the problem now is to make changes to use Windows console because the
source code is configured in the Unix philosophy, using Unix functions for
console, so unavailable for Windows.

As I have no time to investigate on this right now, I share here my experience
so far, maybe it will be useful...

Tools and compilers needed
==========================
 * MinGW64 from http://mingw-w64.yaxm.org/doku.php

 * pkg-config from
http://ftp.gnome.org/pub/gnome/binaries/win32/dependencies/pkg-config_0.23-3_win32.zip
  glib :
http://ftp.gnome.org/pub/gnome/binaries/win32/glib/2.28/glib_2.28.1-1_win32.zip

 * MSYS Extensions from
http://sourceforge.net/projects/mingw/files/MSYS/Extension/
  crypt : libcrypt-1.1_1-3-msys-1.0.13-dll-0.tar.lzma
  crypt : crypt-1.1_1-3-msys-1.0.13-bin.tar.lzma
  m4 : m4-1.4.16-2-msys-1.0.17-bin.tar.lzma
  perl : perl-5.8.8-1-msys-1.0.17-bin.tar.lzma

 * MSYS Dev from http://sourceforge.net/projects/mingw/files/MSYS/msysdev/
  autoconf : autoconf-2.68-1-msys-1.0.17-bin.tar.lzma
  automake : automake-1.11.1-1-msys-1.0.13-bin.tar.lzma

 * MSYS Base from http://sourceforge.net/projects/mingw/files/MSYS/Base/
  bash : bash-3.1.23-1-msys-1.0.18-bin.tar.xz
  coreutils : coreutils-5.97-3-msys-1.0.13-bin.tar.lzma
  coreutils : coreutils-5.97-3-msys-1.0.13-ext.tar.lzma
  findutils : findutils-4.4.2-2-msys-1.0.13-bin.tar.lzma
  gawk : gawk-3.1.7-2-msys-1.0.13-bin.tar.lzma
  grep : grep-2.5.4-2-msys-1.0.13-bin.tar.lzma
  libiconv : libiconv-1.14-1-msys-1.0.17-dll-2.tar.lzma
  gettext : libintl-0.18.1.1-1-msys-1.0.17-dll-8.tar.lzma
  regex : libregex-1.20090805-2-msys-1.0.13-dll-1.tar.lzma
  termcap : libtermcap-0.20050421_1-2-msys-1.0.13-dll-0.tar.lzma
  make : make-3.81-3-msys-1.0.13-bin.tar.lzma
  msys-core : msysCORE-1.0.18-1-msys-1.0.18-bin.tar.lzma
  msys-core : msysCORE-1.0.18-1-msys-1.0.18-ext.tar.lzma
  sed : sed-4.2.1-2-msys-1.0.13-bin.tar.lzma
  termcap : termcap-0.20050421_1-2-msys-1.0.13-bin.tar.lzma

 * Microsoft assembler 64 bit MASM (ML64.exe is part of Windows SDK, DDK
  or Visual Studio, I found it in my Visual Studio Express 2013 in
  C:\Program Files (x86)\Microsoft Visual Studio 12.0\VC\bin\x86_amd64

 * CMake from http://www.cmake.org/

Dependencies
============
 Needed
 ======
 boost  http://www.boost.org
 zlib  http://www.zlib.net/
 jpeg  http://www.ijg.org/files/
 png  http://www.libpng.org/pub/png/libpng.html
 tiff  http://www.remotesensing.org/libtiff/

 Optional
 ========
 openexr  http://www.openexr.com/
 sdl 1.2  http://www.libsdl.org

Prepare a build environment
===========================
When I build with MinGW, I always have this directory
layout :

- The MinGW environment is installed in C:\MinGW.
- The CMake binaries are extracted in C:\MinGW\CMake
- The MSYS binaries (all MSYS-related stuff above) are
  extracted in C:\MinGW\MSYS
 => In MSYS, this directory is mapped as /
- pkg-config and its DLLs can be placed in C:\MinGW\MSYS
  (also copy msys-intl-8.dll to intl.dll in C:\MinGW\MSYS\bin

Run the postinstall\pi.bat script to initialize the environment
and set some directories (follow the instructions).

After first launch of MSYS, a directory is available : /home/<user>/
The source code packages go to /home/user/source
The build directory (with binaries and libs) is /build

So, excluding other files, this is how the directory structure looks like :
C:\MinGW
  cmake
  mingw64
  msys
    build
    home
      <user>
        source

After installation, I create a .bat file to set environment variables needed
(for example, to use CMake). This file is buildenv.bat and I place it in
/home/<user/. When using MSYS, I simply start the MSYS.bat in C:\MinGW\msys.

All the configure scripts have the prefix /build when using MSYS. When building
with other tools (for example CMake), I map a drive letter (Z) to the /build
folder.

Build environment (buildenv.bat) file
=====================================
@ECHO OFF
COLOR 1F
TITLE Build environment
ECHO Build environment
ECHO =================

SET PATH=C:\MinGW\msys\build\bin;%PATH%
SET PATH=C:\MinGW\msys\build\lib;%PATH%

SET PATH=C:\MinGW\mingw64\bin;%PATH%
SET PATH=C:\MinGW\cmake\bin;%PATH%
SET PATH=C:\Program Files (x86)\Microsoft Visual Studio 12.0\VC\bin\x86_amd64

SUBST Z: C:\MinGW\msys\build

CD C:\MinGW\msys\home
CMD

Install tools
=============
MinGW64
 Download from : http://mingw-w64.yaxm.org/doku.php
 mingw-w64-install.exe

 => C:\MinGW

MSYS build environment
 Download from : http://sourceforge.net/projects/mingw/files/MSYS/Base/
 => C:\MinGW\MSYS

CMake : http://www.cmake.org/
 => C:\MinGW\CMake

MASM 64 (or compatible assembler) : ml64.exe is included with Windows SDK,
DDK or Visual Studio.

Directories
%source% = C:\MinGW\MSYS\home\<user>\source
%build% = C:\MinGW\MSYS\build
%mingw% = C:\MinGW
%prefix% = /build (MSYS), Z:\ (CMake)

Set build virtual drive : subst z: %prefix%

Build environment
 set path=%mingw%\mingw64\bin;%path%
 set path=%mingw%\cmake\bin;%path%
 set path=%mingw%\swig;%path%

Compilation
===========
Please follow the order of dependencies.

ZLib (CMake)
============
cmake -G "MinGW Makefiles" -DCMAKE_INSTALL_PREFIX=%prefix%
mingw32-make
mingw32-make install

ZLib (MSYS)
===========
mingw32-make -fwin32/makefile.gcc SHAREDLIB=libz.dll
mkdir -p %prefix%/bin
mkdir -p %prefix%/include
mkdir -p %prefix%/lib

cp libz.dll %prefix%/bin
cp zlib.h %prefix%include
cp lib.dll.a %prefix%/lib

JPEG (MSYS)
===========
../configure --prefix=%prefix%
make
make install

PNG (CMake)
==========
cmake -G "MinGW Makefiles"
 -DZLIB_ROOT=%prefix%\lib
 -DPNG_TESTS=OFF
 -DCMAKE_INSTALL_PREFIX=%prefix%
mingw32-make
mingw32-make install

TIFF (MSYS)
===========
../configure --prefix=%prefix%
 --with-zlib-include-dir=%prefix%/include
 --with-zlib-lib-dir=%prefix%/lib
 --with-jpeg-include-dir=%prefix%/include
 --with-jpeg-lib-dir=%prefix%/lib
make
make install

Boost
=====
Open buildenv.bat and cd to boost dir
booststrap.bat gcc --prefix=Z:\
b2 toolset=gcc release
b2 toolset=gcc --prefix=Z:\ --variant=release --layout=tagged install

OpenEXR (CMake)
===============

// Build IlmBase
cmake -G "MinGW Makefiles"
 -DCMAKE_INSTALL_PREFIX=%prefix%
 -DNAMESPACE_VERSIONING=OFF
mingw32-make
mingw32-make install

// Build OpenEXR
Needs a modification, see https://github.com/openexr/openexr/issues/95

Edit IlmImf/ImfSystemSpecific.h, line 57 replace #ifdef __GNUC__ with
#if defined(__GNUC__) && !defined(__MINGW32__)

set path=%prefix\bin;%path%
set path=%prefix%\lib;%path%

cmake -G "MinGW Makefiles"
 -DZLIB_ROOT="%prefix%"
 -DILMBASE_PACKAGE_PREFIX="%prefix%"
 -DCMAKE_INSTALL_PREFIX="%prefix%"
 -DCMAKE_CXX_FLAGS="-fpermissive"
 -DNAMESPACE_VERSIONING=OFF

mingw32-make
mingw32-make install

!!! OpenEXR.pc was not created, I had to create it manually in
/build/lib/pkgconfig

Content of OpenEXR.pc :

prefix=/build
exec_prefix=/build
libdir=/build/lib
includedir=/build/include
OpenEXR_includedir=@includedir@/OpenEXR

Name: OpenEXR
Description: OpenEXR image library
Version: 2.2.0

Libs: -L${libdir} -lIlmImf
Cflags: -I${OpenEXR_includedir}
Requires: IlmBase
Libs.private: -lz


SDL (MSYS)
==========
../configure --prefix=/build
make
make install

POV-Ray (MSYS)
==============
// Patches
vfesession.h, vfeplatform.h
 #define uint unsigned int


In source folder cd unix
../prebuild.sh
cd ..
export LD_LIBRARY_PATH=%prefix%/lib
export LD_FLAGS=%prefix%/lib
export C_INCLUDE_PATH=%prefix%/include
export CPLUS_INCLUDE_PATH=%prefix%/include
export PATH=%prefix%/bin:$PATH
export PKG_CONFIG_PATH=%prefix%/lib/pkgconfig
../configure COMPILED_BY="your name <e-mail>" LIBS="-L/build/lib
-lboost_system-mt" --prefix=/build
make
make install

[Christian Froeschlin] Re: How to turn off "render other file"? [3837 days 12 hours and 37 minutes ago]

Sun, 25 Oct 2015 01:16:44 GMT

On 18.10.2015 11:31, clipka wrote:

> AFAIK there is currently no switch that turns off this feature entirely.
> You'll need to pick "No, Don't Ask Again [during this session]" if you
> want to render a file that is included by another file you rendered
> earlier, once per such file per session.

I think the main question is whether there is any way to reset the
state after replying with "don't ask again" (apart from restarting).
Typically in user interface design these types of "show next time"
queries are only convenience shortcuts to settings that are also
accessible via some other means (preferences etc).

In this case it is a bit more involved as the setting is stored
by file (similar to e.g. how browsers store security exceptions per
URL and display them in a list). That may be overkill here but at
least a way to reset / clear all of the mappings would be nice.

[Dick Balaska] Re: How to turn off "render other file"? [3844 days 3 hours and 28 minutes ago]

Sun, 18 Oct 2015 10:26:20 GMT

In article <562366d7$1@news.povray.org>, ano### [at] anonymousorg says...
> 
> Am 18.10.2015 um 06:29 schrieb Dick Balaska:
> > Ahoy,
> > 
> > So povwin has this cool feature whereby when I render a file, it asks 
> > "You rendered this other file before, do you want to do it again?".
> 
> I guess you're talking about the dialog titled "Render Alternate File?"
> that pops up when you try to render a file that's included in some other
> file that you rendered earlier during this session.

yes.

> > I say yes and render away.  Now I *don't* want to render that other 
> > file, but rather render this one.
> 
> Uh... maybe I'm misunderstanding you, but why do you then respond with
> "yes" in the first place?

Because the "other" file is the main scene, and it is neat to be able to 
work on this object while rendering the whole scene.  But now, oops, I 
need to focus on just this object again.
> 
> > How do I turn off the magic "render 
> > other file" setting?
> 
> AFAIK there is currently no switch that turns off this feature entirely.
> You'll need to pick "No, Don't Ask Again [during this session]" if you
> want to render a file that is included by another file you rendered
> earlier, once per such file per session.

nah, I don't want to pick "No".  I have found the easiest/only way to 
turn off "render other" is to exit povwin and come right back in.  I'm 
exactly where I left off, except that switch is cleared.
> 
> Note however that if you start the render via the "Edit Settings/Render"
> dialog from the "Render" menu, the mechanism will be bypassed entirely,
> always rendering the currently selected file with no questions asked. If
> you need this frequently, you may want to memorize the corresponding
> keyboard shortcut, which happens to be "Alt-R Alt-R Alt-R"

Alt-R Alt-R Alt-R could come in handy. Thanks for the tip.

danke
dik

(BTW, I have 4 linux boxes running in my newly reconstructed renderfarm.  
No windows boxes :(  http://www.buckosoft.com/bsac/ )

[clipka] Re: How to turn off "render other file"? [3844 days 4 hours and 23 minutes ago]

Sun, 18 Oct 2015 09:31:03 GMT

Am 18.10.2015 um 06:29 schrieb Dick Balaska:
> Ahoy,
> 
> So povwin has this cool feature whereby when I render a file, it asks 
> "You rendered this other file before, do you want to do it again?".

I guess you're talking about the dialog titled "Render Alternate File?"
that pops up when you try to render a file that's included in some other
file that you rendered earlier during this session.

> I say yes and render away.  Now I *don't* want to render that other 
> file, but rather render this one.

Uh... maybe I'm misunderstanding you, but why do you then respond with
"yes" in the first place?

> How do I turn off the magic "render 
> other file" setting?

AFAIK there is currently no switch that turns off this feature entirely.
You'll need to pick "No, Don't Ask Again [during this session]" if you
want to render a file that is included by another file you rendered
earlier, once per such file per session.

Note however that if you start the render via the "Edit Settings/Render"
dialog from the "Render" menu, the mechanism will be bypassed entirely,
always rendering the currently selected file with no questions asked. If
you need this frequently, you may want to memorize the corresponding
keyboard shortcut, which happens to be "Alt-R Alt-R Alt-R"

[Dick Balaska] How to turn off "render other file"? [3844 days 9 hours and 25 minutes ago]

Sun, 18 Oct 2015 04:29:10 GMT

Ahoy,

So povwin has this cool feature whereby when I render a file, it asks 
"You rendered this other file before, do you want to do it again?".
I say yes and render away.  Now I *don't* want to render that other 
file, but rather render this one.  How do I turn off the magic "render 
other file" setting?

(This is my first post with MicroPlanet Gravity... good luck to me.)

dik

[clipka] Re: povdos needed [3857 days 2 hours and 41 minutes ago]

Mon, 5 Oct 2015 11:13:19 GMT

Am 05.10.2015 um 12:43 schrieb dickbalaska:
> Hi ho,
> 
> Add me to the (very short) list of people, who need a batch windows version of
> povray. Does anyone have 3.7 compiled without the Gui on Windows?

Consider yourself officially added :)

[dickbalaska] povdos needed [3857 days 3 hours and 9 minutes ago]

Mon, 5 Oct 2015 10:45:01 GMT

Hi ho,

Add me to the (very short) list of people, who need a batch windows version of
povray. Does anyone have 3.7 compiled without the Gui on Windows?

My fastest machine (8 thread i7) can not participate in my renderfarm without
it. :(  Once upon a time, I built povwin 3.1 in dos mode, but those days are
gone.

I made a couple of feeble attempts at building 3.7 with MinGW or VS 2015
Community.  Both will need effort that maybe I can avoid.
(Not as easy as sudo apt-get install povray ... )

Thanks,

dik

[Jos leys] Re: Povray on a Xeon processor [4008 days 23 hours and 34 minutes ago]

Wed, 6 May 2015 14:20:01 GMT

Great!
Thanks

Christian Froeschlin <chr### [at] chrfrde> wrote:
> On 02.05.2015 19:10, Jos leys wrote:
> > I have been looking for benchmark results on the web, but they are hard to find.
>
>  From 2013 but includes results for 2 x E5-2690 and several i7 systems:
>
> http://www.anandtech.com/show/7189/choosing-a-gaming-cpu-september-2013/5

[Christian Froeschlin] Re: Povray on a Xeon processor [4009 days 14 hours and 11 minutes ago]

Tue, 5 May 2015 23:42:53 GMT

On 02.05.2015 19:10, Jos leys wrote:
> I have been looking for benchmark results on the web, but they are hard to find.

 From 2013 but includes results for 2 x E5-2690 and several i7 systems:

http://www.anandtech.com/show/7189/choosing-a-gaming-cpu-september-2013/5

[Jos leys] Povray on a Xeon processor [4012 days 20 hours and 39 minutes ago]

Sat, 2 May 2015 17:15:07 GMT

I am considering buying a very powerful desktop for my animation rendering jobs.
As this is a heavy investment, I'd like to make sure it is worth it. I have been
looking for benchmark results on the web, but they are hard to find.

I'm currently looking at a Dual Xeon E5-2690 v3 system.

My current system is I7-4702MQ, and my benchmark results give me 1155.20 PPS for
the standard 3.7 benchmark. ( 227 seconds for the render) I would like this to
be four times better...

Does anyone have any experience with Povray on such Xeon processors (maybe not
the exact same, but in the 26xx family?

Thanks, Jos

[clipka] Re: CPU performance disappointing on some scenes [4020 days 1 hour and 14 minutes ago]

Sat, 25 Apr 2015 12:40:30 GMT

Am 25.04.2015 um 13:15 schrieb rodv92:

> Lastly I got myself access to a HP DL360 g9 server and thought i'd give it a try
> with povray.
>
> It has : two E5-2430 v2 CPUs @ 2.5 Ghz, each 6 core, making 12 physical cores,
> 24 logical with HT enabled.
>
> The previous system i used was a BL460c G1 blade with two E5450 @ 3 Ghz CPUs,
> each 4 core, making 8 physical cores, no HT.
>
>
> The fact is that some custom scenes are rendering far slower on the new
> platform.
>
>
> There are certainly a lot of architectural differences between these two kinds
> of CPUs, since there is more than 6 years gone beetween the two models.
>
> I may think that the difference in performance may be linked to the small L2
> cache of the newer CPU.

As far as the raw number crunching power is concerned, the new computer 
should perform somewhat better: The old one would be equivalent to a 
single 24GHz core, while the new one would be equivalent to a single 
40GHz core, plus a guesstimated 25% bonus from hyperthreading, i.e. a 
50GHz core.

However, there are two caveats to consider:

(1) With the computing power spread across more cores, the new computer 
introduces more synchronization overhead. While most of the computations 
in POV-Ray scale quite well with number of cores, Radiosity in 
particular doesn't play that nice, so in radiosity scenes the higher 
number of cores equals a noticeable loss of effective computing power.

(2) POV-Ray doesn't take the numbers to crunch out of thin air; there's 
the internal representation of the scene as a data source, an image 
buffer as a data sink, and various data buffers - again most notably the 
radiosity buffer - as both sinks and sources. All this data is accessed 
on a regular basis during rendering, and the more of it fits into faster 
caches, the better the CPU can bring its raw power to bear.


> Any idea on what may cause such dramatic performance swings ?

I'd go with your guess that the significantly smaller L2 cache of the 
new computer is the most important factor. If the data and buffers for a 
scene fit entirely inside the new computer's L2 cache, it will certainly 
outperform the old one, but with more memory-hungry scenes it will spend 
much of its time waiting for data from the main memory rather than 
actually computing anything.

> Does a custom build could make some performance improvements ?

That's rather unlikely. Not with the problematic scenes, that is. A 
custom build that utilizes the new CPU's instruction set extensions 
might improve the speed at which the CPU can crunch the data, but it 
won't be able to significantly improve the speed at which the data can 
be fetched from memory in the first place.

[rodv92] CPU performance disappointing on some scenes [4020 days 2 hours and 34 minutes ago]

Sat, 25 Apr 2015 11:20:02 GMT

Hello group !

Lastly I got myself access to a HP DL360 g9 server and thought i'd give it a try
with povray.

It has : two E5-2430 v2 CPUs @ 2.5 Ghz, each 6 core, making 12 physical cores,
24 logical with HT enabled.

The previous system i used was a BL460c G1 blade with two E5450 @ 3 Ghz CPUs,
each 4 core, making 8 physical cores, no HT.


The fact is that some custom scenes are rendering far slower on the new
platform.


There are certainly a lot of architectural differences between these two kinds
of CPUs, since there is more than 6 years gone beetween the two models.

I may think that the difference in performance may be linked to the small L2
cache of the newer CPU.

You can see all the CPU specs differences in :

http://cpuboss.com/cpus/Intel-Xeon-E5450-vs-Intel-Xeon-E5-2430-v2

When comparing using biscuit.pov it is faster on the new E5-2430-v2 CPUs

But on my custom scene that uses quite a lot of transparencies it is far slower
(2 to 3 times slower) on the new CPUs

Any idea on what may cause such dramatic performance swings ?
Does a custom build could make some performance improvements ?

I am quite new in povray benchmarking so i'd liste to your guidance.
May post detailed benchmarks with povray if needed.

[Erich] Re: Notes on multiple user setups [4069 days 16 hours and 29 minutes ago]

Fri, 6 Mar 2015 21:25:00 GMT

Chris Cason <del### [at] deletethistoopovrayorg> wrote:
> The main impetus for the /install switch was requests from lab techs
> using POV in a educational setting. In those cases the software is
> usually available on the network or in some other pre-mapped location.

I'm in an educational setting! :-)

We stopped putting (Windows) executables on the network many years ago because
the bandwidth utilization was too high and desktop hard drives are so big.  I
have not seen any discussion of doing that on a national lab manager listserv
for many years either.  Are you sure that is still regularly/widely done?

We currently (and many others) create generic, monolithic images with many
software packages already installed and roll those out to standardize all the
systems in a lab or even across many labs.  The up-and-coming standard is to use
WDS and SCCM to push a base image with little-to-no software installed, and then
push packages specific to the lab needs.  This makes for much more flexibility,
but it still has the software installed locally.

I think much more common than software on the network is user profiles on the
network, but that too has enough costs and myriad problems that I get the
feeling it is still not the most common method.  We offer file storage, but not
roaming profiles.  Our users get either a fresh, local profile at every logon
(when the machine has DeepFreeze) or their former, local profile which lasts
only until we re-image the machine again (typically every semester).

> I think what I need to do now is actually implement the default file
> install on first launch like you and others have suggested. I need to
> do it in such a way that it works even if the exe is on the network,
> so it can't depend on the files being installed locally; probably to
> do this I'll create a separate user-files installer that lives with
> the main exe.

Does the current creation of the empty Documents folder not work if the .exe is
on the network?  I got the impression that while the "Home" directory may be
tied to the network if the /install flag isn't used (and the .exe is on the
network), but that the user-editable files are sought in (and set to) the
%userprofile% location if the registry entries aren't found.  In that case it
doesn't seem like a major change -- more like change a create dir tree to a copy
dir tree (and files).  Non-standard locations have the option already.

Thanks,
Erich

[Chris Cason] Re: Notes on multiple user setups [4070 days 17 hours and 5 minutes ago]

Thu, 5 Mar 2015 20:49:12 GMT

On 6/03/2015 01:58, Erich wrote:
> "Non-Standard Installations" section which many people seeking help for this are
> directly linked to.  Having a switch named "/Install" for something that is
> already installed adds to the confusion.  I think "\paths" would make more
> sense.

This is a fair point, though I will mention that the main purpose of
/install is not for pre-installed executables but for the case where
the EXE is on the network or has otherwise been made available to the
user without their needing to run anything prior to that.

> The documentation states that "it may not be necessary to install anything", but
> gives no information on how to get POV-Ray on the machine short of
> "installation".

The main impetus for the /install switch was requests from lab techs
using POV in a educational setting. In those cases the software is
usually available on the network or in some other pre-mapped location.

> If I get time (and you are interested), I will take a stab at specific
> suggestions for the documentation related to multiple users to make it less
> "developery" and more friendly for lab manager types who are the ones most
> likely to be using it.

Thanks for the offer.

I think what I need to do now is actually implement the default file
install on first launch like you and others have suggested. I need to
do it in such a way that it works even if the exe is on the network,
so it can't depend on the files being installed locally; probably to
do this I'll create a separate user-files installer that lives with
the main exe.

Once I've done that I'll let folks here know and they can test, and if
you like you can update the documentation to suit.

regards,

-- Chris

[Erich] Notes on multiple user setups [4070 days 22 hours and 54 minutes ago]

Thu, 5 Mar 2015 15:00:01 GMT

There is a previous message thread that this is related to, but it was long and
contentious and I thought this might be more helpful at the top of a new
thread...

I appreciate that some effort was put into this latest version of POV-Ray to try
to accommodate multiple users.  Unfortunately, I think the effort was directed
toward offering options for defining paths in a specific type of multi-user
environment (roaming profiles and apps on shared drives) and less on options
that would help both that environment and the general user or even home users).
I suspect a vast majority of multi-user environments would be happy with the
default locations, but they need the program to work for everyone logging in.  I
think there are two big issues to point out.

1) The documentation (as I comprehend it) about non-standard installations is
not about the _install_ process, but rather the POV-Ray initial start-up
process.  The /INSTALL and /QINSTALL switches are not intended to and *do not
work* with the downloaded installer.  They work with the POV-Ray executable(s).
While this is covered in the documentation, it is not made clear in the
"Non-Standard Installations" section which many people seeking help for this are
directly linked to.  Having a switch named "/Install" for something that is
already installed adds to the confusion.  I think "\paths" would make more
sense.

The documentation states that "it may not be necessary to install anything", but
gives no information on how to get POV-Ray on the machine short of
"installation".

The documentation also states that if the "documents" directory doesn't exist,
"it will be automatically created along with the INI directory beneath it."
What it doesn't say is that those will be empty directories.  It doesn't state
anywhere that it is the responsibility of the user/lab manager to put all the
necessary (and default) documents into that location regardless of whether it is
"inferred" or expressly stated.  What is the point of the code that creates
empty directories when there are files that are clearly needed in those
directories?  This code should be easily extended to resolve the next issue...

2) The required, user-editable documents are only installed for the installing
user (administrator or not).  When a new user tries to start POV-Ray and the
machine they are using was not configured by a competent administrator (with
available time to work out these issues), the first thing they get is an error.
That doesn't look good.

A few years ago, I posted about this and included a simple batch file to be
disguised as POV-Ray.  The .bat checks for the user POV-Ray files and
copies/creates them if they don't exist.  It works fine *except* that most users
don't start POV-Ray from the icon (.bat).  They call POV-Ray directly from
another application and then we get a call because "POV-Ray isn't working."  One
solution is to include the POV-Ray user files in the default profile, but that
doubles our default profile size causing all user's initial log in (which may be
every time with Deep Freeze) to take longer and makes the user profile that much
bigger -- a problem for entities that don't use Deep Freeze or who store
profiles on the network.  This doesn't make sense when only a small (but
significant) percentage of users ever use POV-Ray.

All other software with which I am familiar (which is a significant library)
except for a few packages NOT designed for multiple users (such as to collect
data from equipment that takes a highly trained technician to run) will create
any missing-but-required, default, user-editable files when it starts.  Why
can't POV-Ray do something similar?  You could include a default copy of all the
"documents" files in it's "Home" directory and upon reaching the point that it
currently does where it creates the empty "documents" directory, simply
create/copy the default set of initial user-editable files?

I saw a mention in the other message thread about using a pre-install and
needing MSI support.  I am not a developer, so I am not entirely sure of the
details of those functions, but I know what I have observed with other software.
 Look at Mozilla products for example.  They distinctly do not offer MSI
installation (much to many lab manager's frustration), but they do manage to
create default files on first start for any user whether they had a Windows user
profile at the time of installation or not.  Are they using "MSI support"?

If I get time (and you are interested), I will take a stab at specific
suggestions for the documentation related to multiple users to make it less
"developery" and more friendly for lab manager types who are the ones most
likely to be using it.

Sorry for the long post, but I'm trying to logically explain the frustration of
the end user (like "Nick") without frustrating the developers who have worked so
hard on this.

Thanks,
Erich

[Thomas de Groot] Re: Built in "Help on POV-Ray Window" does not w... [4126 days 22 hours and 43 minutes ago]

Thu, 8 Jan 2015 15:11:18 GMT

From my own experience (with Win 7 but also before with XP) the 
built-in help is far from working well. Many links are broken or 
misdirected. Best is to use the online help at the wiki site.


-- 
Thomas

[COMPATT] Built in "Help on POV-Ray Window" does not work ... [4126 days 23 hours and 59 minutes ago]

Thu, 8 Jan 2015 13:55:01 GMT

I have been using POV-Ray for years when teaching and introduction to Astronomy
class. The computers in our lab have just been upgraded to windows 8 and POV-Ray
itself seems to be working great. However the built in help system does not seem
to allow students to select and display specific topic book marks. For example
they can do a search for the topic describing colors.inc but when they double
click on the topic or click on the display button, the window does not go to the
selected part of the help documentation.

[dilbert firestorm] moray 3.5 & Povray 3.7 paths [4130 days 2 hours and 30 minutes ago]

Mon, 5 Jan 2015 11:23:37 GMT

how do I set up the paths for Moray 3.5 and Povray 3.7?

I want both to point to:
D:\work space - povray - input
D:\work space - povray - output

on moray, how do I set up 2 side view as default view?

-- 
Dilbert Firestorm

remove *byteme* to email me

[jhu] Re: surface pro 3 tablet [4144 days 15 hours and 14 minutes ago]

Sun, 21 Dec 2014 22:40:01 GMT

"aeffects" <nomail@nomail> wrote:
> will povray 3.7 run on this microsoft tablet right out of the box? thanks!
> -DHealy

Yes. Have you tried it yet?

[aeffects] surface pro 3 tablet [4144 days 20 hours and 24 minutes ago]

Sun, 21 Dec 2014 17:30:00 GMT

will povray 3.7 run on this microsoft tablet right out of the box? thanks!
-DHealy

[Lawrence W] Re: POV-Ray v3.5 on Win8 x64 [4146 days 16 hours and 59 minutes ago]

Fri, 19 Dec 2014 20:55:01 GMT

"Lawrence W" <lwi### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
> Hi gang.  I'm stuck; Povray 3.5 will install just fine on Win8 x64, but it WILL
> NOT RENDER ANYTHING by itself.  As soon as I hit F9/Go, it freezes up tight.  I
> know there was lots of discussion about getting Moray v3.5 to work properly with
> Povray v3.5, but I can't even get Povray v3.5 to work all by itself!
>
> Can anyone confirm that it works stand-alone on Win7 or Win8?  And if so, can
> someone help me figure out what I'm doing wrong?
>
> THANKS!

Okay, I know I'm replying to my own post, but I found part of the answer.  I
have a Win7 x64 desktop in the office that I installed Povray 3.5 on, and it
crashed when attempting to render something, just like on my Win8 laptop.  When
I modified the compatibility and Disabled Visual Styles, it rendered just fine.
I re-enabled Visual Styles (unchecked the box) and it crashed again.

The second thing I noticed is that if I install Moray 3.5 along with Povray 3.5,
I can render within Moray 3.5 and it'll properly start Povray 3.5 and render the
scene.  So there must be some problem with an INI file within pure Povray that
screws up.

I know I'm on to something, now I just need to RTFM, I think.

[Lawrence W] POV-Ray v3.5 on Win8 x64 [4146 days 17 hours and 49 minutes ago]

Fri, 19 Dec 2014 20:05:00 GMT

Hi gang.  I'm stuck; Povray 3.5 will install just fine on Win8 x64, but it WILL
NOT RENDER ANYTHING by itself.  As soon as I hit F9/Go, it freezes up tight.  I
know there was lots of discussion about getting Moray v3.5 to work properly with
Povray v3.5, but I can't even get Povray v3.5 to work all by itself!

Can anyone confirm that it works stand-alone on Win7 or Win8?  And if so, can
someone help me figure out what I'm doing wrong?

THANKS!

[clipka] Re: No editor colors? [4201 days 6 hours and 32 minutes ago]

Sun, 26 Oct 2014 07:22:10 GMT

Am 24.10.2014 05:58, schrieb Bald Eagle:

>> POV-Ray
>> tracks file-specific editor settings for the most recently opened files.
>
> Excellent.
> I searched in the Program Files subdirectory
> and the POV-Ray 3.7 subdirectories
> Setting in Editor Preferences / color schemes all seemed normal
>
> Any ideas where the file-specific editor settings are stored?  All the other
> files seem normal, so I'm guessing (hoping) it's only this one.

This information is stored in the registry, at:

     HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\POV-Ray\v3.7\POV-Edit\Open
     HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\POV-Ray\v3.7\POV-Edit\Recent
     HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\POV-Ray\v3.7\POV-Edit\Older

You'd have to either...

... (A) close POV-Ray, then delete the respective entry from whichever 
of these registry keys it is listed in, ...

... (B) within POV-Ray, close the file, then open and close 40 different 
other files to "flush" it out of the registry...


> I suppose if all else fails, I can just rename it...

... or (C) that (but do /not/ use "save as..." for this purpose ;-)).

[Bald Eagle] Re: No editor colors? [4203 days 9 hours and 54 minutes ago]

Fri, 24 Oct 2014 04:00:02 GMT

clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
> Am 24.10.2014 03:03, schrieb Bald Eagle:

> Maybe you accidently pressed some key combo that messed up the editor
> settings - either for all files, or for /this/ particular file:

Once again demonstrating my astounding ability to intuitively sense a software's
weakness and then dealing it the 10-Finger Death Punch.

> POV-Ray
> tracks file-specific editor settings for the most recently opened files.

Excellent.
I searched in the Program Files subdirectory
and the POV-Ray 3.7 subdirectories
Setting in Editor Preferences / color schemes all seemed normal

Any ideas where the file-specific editor settings are stored?  All the other
files seem normal, so I'm guessing (hoping) it's only this one.

I suppose if all else fails, I can just rename it...

[clipka] Re: No editor colors? [4203 days 10 hours and 23 minutes ago]

Fri, 24 Oct 2014 03:31:25 GMT

Am 24.10.2014 03:03, schrieb Bald Eagle:
>
> Just opened a file and none of the SDL text is colored.
> I've opened this file multiple times in the past, and this is the first time
> anything like this has happened.
> I closed POV-Ray and reopened it, but still no colors.
> It's a .pov file...

Maybe you accidently pressed some key combo that messed up the editor 
settings - either for all files, or for /this/ particular file: POV-Ray 
tracks file-specific editor settings for the most recently opened files.

[Bald Eagle] No editor colors? [4203 days 12 hours and 49 minutes ago]

Fri, 24 Oct 2014 01:05:01 GMT

Just opened a file and none of the SDL text is colored.
I've opened this file multiple times in the past, and this is the first time
anything like this has happened.
I closed POV-Ray and reopened it, but still no colors.
It's a .pov file...

Strange.

[clipka] Re: Keyboard shortcut for show/hide render window? [4213 days 10 hours and 40 minutes ago]

Tue, 14 Oct 2014 03:14:06 GMT

Am 14.10.2014 00:35, schrieb Wiering:
> I just installed POV-Ray again after years, now on Windows 8.1 and I am unable
> to close the render window using the keyboard. The option to make it get focus
> (Options, Render Window, Get Focus on Creation) doesn't work. It used to work on
> my previous computer with Vista (not sure which version of POV-Ray that was) and
> I could close it with Alt+F4.

The following key sequence should close the render window:

     "Alt+o", then "r", then "c"

[Stephen] Re: Keyboard shortcut for show/hide render window? [4213 days 14 hours and 55 minutes ago]

Mon, 13 Oct 2014 22:58:41 GMT

On 13/10/2014 23:35, Wiering wrote:
> I just installed POV-Ray again after years, now on Windows 8.1 and I am unable
> to close the render window using the keyboard. The option to make it get focus
> (Options, Render Window, Get Focus on Creation) doesn't work. It used to work on
> my previous computer with Vista (not sure which version of POV-Ray that was) and
> I could close it with Alt+F4.
>
> It's really annoying to have to use the mouse every time just to get that window
> out of the way. I know there is autoclose, but I do want to see the image before
> it closes. Any ideas?
>
>

Have you tried Alt+F4? That works in Win 8.1
You might possibly need to do a Ctrl+Tab to get the focus.


-- 

Regards
     Stephen

[Wiering] Keyboard shortcut for show/hide render window? [4213 days 15 hours and 14 minutes ago]

Mon, 13 Oct 2014 22:40:01 GMT

I just installed POV-Ray again after years, now on Windows 8.1 and I am unable
to close the render window using the keyboard. The option to make it get focus
(Options, Render Window, Get Focus on Creation) doesn't work. It used to work on
my previous computer with Vista (not sure which version of POV-Ray that was) and
I could close it with Alt+F4.

It's really annoying to have to use the mouse every time just to get that window
out of the way. I know there is autoclose, but I do want to see the image before
it closes. Any ideas?

[donmcybertect] Headers [4232 days 22 hours and 39 minutes ago]

Wed, 24 Sep 2014 15:15:01 GMT

What happened to the headers option under the "insert" menu?

[Chris Cason] Re: Install for multiple windows 7 users [4266 days 17 hours and 1 minute ago]

Thu, 21 Aug 2014 20:53:06 GMT

On 21/08/2014 21:18, clipka wrote:
> What that documentation currently fails to mention is that the user 
> directory needs to be populated manually (or via a script of course), as 
> the /INSTALL and /QINSTALL options will only take care of the registry 
> entries.

The fully documented workaround I mention is NOT the command-line
switches but the group policy alternative. I specify the registry
entries and that, along with providing the files in the right places,
is what an admin can use rather than running the program elevated on
each workstation.

Put another way, rather than going through the hassle of organizing an
elevated run of POVWIN on each workstation, they can set files up on
the network (including the end-user files wherever they want), push
the registry entries via group policy, and POVWIN will just work
without *ever* needing to have been run on the workstation in question
at any time previous, with or without elevation.

This is the cleanest way of doing it in a large environment where the
administrator is competent and willing to read documentation.

For smaller installs yes I could add some code to POVWIN.

[clipka] Re: Install for multiple windows 7 users [4267 days 2 hours and 35 minutes ago]

Thu, 21 Aug 2014 11:18:37 GMT

Am 21.08.2014 04:32, schrieb Chris Cason:
> On 20/08/2014 20:25, clipka wrote:
>> (2) On first time startup for a particular user, copy both registry keys
>> and user files from the default user's account (modifying the DocPath
>> registry entry of course).
>>
>> Or am I missing something fundamental there?
>
> Nope, that's one approach I considered. I decided not to because then
> I need to add UI support for failure, retry, and whatever, and that's
> something best done by the OS (which has code for handling exactly
> this) rather than merging it into the base POV-Ray code (or adding a
> separate utility), where it would (in 99.9% of cases) never be used.

If it's such a rare use case, then why can't we just go with 
minimalistic error handling: If it doesn't work, just output an error 
message.

> Put another way, in terms of time involved, it's probably easier to
> get the OS to do it, but that hasn't happened yet,

I guess you're referring to deferred (or "advertised") installation 
here; I'm only starting to dive into this matter now, but Wikipedia has 
this to say about it:

"The user must have administrator privileges to complete the advertised 
installation; in most workplaces, end users are not administrators and 
this method of distribution will fail. Microsoft created a workaround 
via Group Policies to "Elevate user privileges" during MSI 
installations. This is often seen by system administrators as 
compromising security since any MSI would automatically gain 
administrator privileges."

That sounds pretty discouraging.

> and there's a
> pretty straightforward fully-documented workaround for network admins.

What that documentation currently fails to mention is that the user 
directory needs to be populated manually (or via a script of course), as 
the /INSTALL and /QINSTALL options will only take care of the registry 
entries.

[Chris Cason] Re: Install for multiple windows 7 users [4267 days 11 hours and 22 minutes ago]

Thu, 21 Aug 2014 02:32:33 GMT

On 20/08/2014 20:25, clipka wrote:
> (2) On first time startup for a particular user, copy both registry keys 
> and user files from the default user's account (modifying the DocPath 
> registry entry of course).
> 
> Or am I missing something fundamental there?

Nope, that's one approach I considered. I decided not to because then
I need to add UI support for failure, retry, and whatever, and that's
something best done by the OS (which has code for handling exactly
this) rather than merging it into the base POV-Ray code (or adding a
separate utility), where it would (in 99.9% of cases) never be used.

Put another way, in terms of time involved, it's probably easier to
get the OS to do it, but that hasn't happened yet, and there's a
pretty straightforward fully-documented workaround for network admins.

-- Chris

[clipka] Re: Install for multiple windows 7 users [4268 days 3 hours and 29 minutes ago]

Wed, 20 Aug 2014 10:25:29 GMT

Am 19.08.2014 23:37, schrieb Chris Cason:
> On 20/08/2014 07:14, Alain wrote:
>> Did you ever try to install from an administrative account? It's the
>> ONLY way to install ANYTHING for all users. The "thousands of software
>> vendors" that you mention can not preform that "miracle" if the install
>> is not done with administrator credentials.
>>
>> For the file colours.inc, it's a particular case. You need to make sure
>> that all users have a pov-ray folder in their profiles that have an
>> includes folder that will contain that file.
>> Also, have a scenes folder in each profiles. This is to ensure that one
>> user won't accidently modify the scenes from someone else.
>>
>> Normaly, POV-Ray should build the needed registry entries from it's
>> current folder and the profile in use if those don't already exist.
>
> This is a good summary. The main issue is that for a pre-install to
> work we need to advertise a 'deferred install', which requires MSI
> support. A deferred install will automatically install the
> user-specific files in the users account the first time they run POVWIN.

... or we might implement the deferred install thing as part of 
POV-Ray's startup, like this:

(1) To install for all users, actually have the installer perform an 
install for the default user (HKEY_USERS/.DEFAULT).

(2) On first time startup for a particular user, copy both registry keys 
and user files from the default user's account (modifying the DocPath 
registry entry of course).

Or am I missing something fundamental there?

[Chris Cason] Re: Install for multiple windows 7 users [4268 days 12 hours and 20 minutes ago]

Wed, 20 Aug 2014 01:33:44 GMT

On 20/08/2014 09:11, Alain wrote:
> The default include files can reside in a single include folder where 
> everyone have read access, but only the administrator have write access.
> The same can be done for the sample scene files.

Yes, this is in fact the easiest solution. I suggested separate copies
of the files because in general it is assumed that users have write
access to these files (and are even encouraged to edit them where it
suits).

Of course institutions can have different policies, but then it's up
to them to instruct their users accordingly.

I spent some time making the new version network-friendly, but as you
can see from the tone of Nick's post, that's apparently not enough for
him. The simple fact is I can't satisfy everyone, especially those who
want things handed to them on a platter.

As I cannot predict everyone's setup exactly so made it possible to
install via group policy, but of course that's too much work for some
folk ;-)

-- Chris

[Alain] Re: Install for multiple windows 7 users [4268 days 14 hours and 43 minutes ago]

Tue, 19 Aug 2014 23:11:21 GMT

Le 14-08-19 17:37, Chris Cason a écrit :
> On 20/08/2014 07:14, Alain wrote:
>> Did you ever try to install from an administrative account? It's the
>> ONLY way to install ANYTHING for all users. The "thousands of software
>> vendors" that you mention can not preform that "miracle" if the install
>> is not done with administrator credentials.
>>
>> For the file colours.inc, it's a particular case. You need to make sure
>> that all users have a pov-ray folder in their profiles that have an
>> includes folder that will contain that file.
>> Also, have a scenes folder in each profiles. This is to ensure that one
>> user won't accidently modify the scenes from someone else.
>>
>> Normaly, POV-Ray should build the needed registry entries from it's
>> current folder and the profile in use if those don't already exist.
>
> This is a good summary. The main issue is that for a pre-install to
> work we need to advertise a 'deferred install', which requires MSI
> support. A deferred install will automatically install the
> user-specific files in the users account the first time they run POVWIN.
>
> Since we can't do that, in a lab environment it's up to the
> administrator to ensure that when the student wants to run the app,
> the appropriate support files get installed. This is why we clearly
> document the required settings.
>
> Generally speaking letting them all share a single set of files isn't
> suitable, as then they can all edit them. A proper setup requires that
> each student has their own set of editable files in their own account.
> The binaries/help file etc can be shared.
>
> -- Chris
>

The default include files can reside in a single include folder where 
everyone have read access, but only the administrator have write access.
The same can be done for the sample scene files.

[Chris Cason] Re: Install for multiple windows 7 users [4268 days 16 hours and 11 minutes ago]

Tue, 19 Aug 2014 21:42:38 GMT

On 20/08/2014 07:14, Alain wrote:
> Did you ever try to install from an administrative account? It's the 
> ONLY way to install ANYTHING for all users. The "thousands of software 
> vendors" that you mention can not preform that "miracle" if the install 
> is not done with administrator credentials.
> 
> For the file colours.inc, it's a particular case. You need to make sure 
> that all users have a pov-ray folder in their profiles that have an 
> includes folder that will contain that file.
> Also, have a scenes folder in each profiles. This is to ensure that one 
> user won't accidently modify the scenes from someone else.
> 
> Normaly, POV-Ray should build the needed registry entries from it's 
> current folder and the profile in use if those don't already exist.

This is a good summary. The main issue is that for a pre-install to
work we need to advertise a 'deferred install', which requires MSI
support. A deferred install will automatically install the
user-specific files in the users account the first time they run POVWIN.

Since we can't do that, in a lab environment it's up to the
administrator to ensure that when the student wants to run the app,
the appropriate support files get installed. This is why we clearly
document the required settings.

Generally speaking letting them all share a single set of files isn't
suitable, as then they can all edit them. A proper setup requires that
each student has their own set of editable files in their own account.
The binaries/help file etc can be shared.

-- Chris

[Alain] Re: Install for multiple windows 7 users [4268 days 16 hours and 40 minutes ago]

Tue, 19 Aug 2014 21:14:25 GMT

Le 14-08-19 07:32, Nick a écrit :
> Hello
>
> I asked this question about for years ago but gave up as things were clearly
> designed not to work the way I'd expect.  I've come back now for another go and
> I nothing seems to have improved.
>
> I've downloaded  povwin-3.7-agpl3-setup.exe and looked as directed at
> 'non-standard installations'   It says I can use /INSTALL or /QINSTALL.  These
> make not a blind bit of difference you still get led through the prompts for
> directories. and so on as if the didn't exists.  /S though undocumented will get
> you a silent install.
>
> However I've tried to install it I get the same old, same old, dialogues as ever
> when I log in as another user - POVRAY did not find the expected registry
> entries....and a telling off for allegedly not using /INSTALL when I did, then
> 'cannot find colours.inc'
>
> Oh and not that I'm the slightest bit surprised, no shortcuts in the all users
> start menu.
>
> After four years I'd really expected someone to have made a competent job of
> this. A proper installer should default to installing for all users without any
> further action, a miracle thousands of software vendors perform on a daily
> basis.  I fail to understand why POVRAY can't achieve this.
>
>
>   We will continue to have to explain to our students that these errors are not
> of our making and are a poor advertisment for your product.
>
>

Did you ever try to install from an administrative account? It's the 
ONLY way to install ANYTHING for all users. The "thousands of software 
vendors" that you mention can not preform that "miracle" if the install 
is not done with administrator credentials.

For the file colours.inc, it's a particular case. You need to make sure 
that all users have a pov-ray folder in their profiles that have an 
includes folder that will contain that file.
Also, have a scenes folder in each profiles. This is to ensure that one 
user won't accidently modify the scenes from someone else.

Normaly, POV-Ray should build the needed registry entries from it's 
current folder and the profile in use if those don't already exist.




Alain

[Chris Cason] Re: Install for multiple windows 7 users [4268 days 16 hours and 51 minutes ago]

Tue, 19 Aug 2014 21:03:26 GMT

On 19/08/2014 21:32, Nick wrote:
> 'non-standard installations'   It says I can use /INSTALL or /QINSTALL.  These
> make not a blind bit of difference you still get led through the prompts for
> directories. and so on as if the didn't exists.  /S though undocumented will get
> you a silent install.
> 
> However I've tried to install it I get the same old, same old, dialogues as ever
> when I log in as another user - POVRAY did not find the expected registry
> entries....and a telling off for allegedly not using /INSTALL when I did, then
> 'cannot find colours.inc'
> 
> Oh and not that I'm the slightest bit surprised, no shortcuts in the all users
> start menu.
> 
> After four years I'd really expected someone to have made a competent job of
> this. A proper installer should default to installing for all users without any
> further action, a miracle thousands of software vendors perform on a daily
> basis.  I fail to understand why POVRAY can't achieve this.
> 
> 
>  We will continue to have to explain to our students that these errors are not
> of our making and are a poor advertisment for your product.

Hi,

Perhaps you could volunteer to spend the time to correct the issue to
your liking and contribute the changes for the benefit of others. But
I guess that's too much work for you.

Given you are in an academic environment, it may be useful for you to
follow the suggestions documented in
http://wiki.povray.org/content/Documentation:Windows_Section_3#Non-Standard_Installations
such as publishing the required registry entries via group policy, or
alternately you may wish to automate the installation via some other
method. Either way, the required registry entries are clearly documented.

Finally if none of that suffices and you don't like the way the
installer works you are free to return the software for a full refund.

-- Chris

[Nick] Install for multiple windows 7 users [4269 days 2 hours and 19 minutes ago]

Tue, 19 Aug 2014 11:35:01 GMT

Hello

I asked this question about for years ago but gave up as things were clearly
designed not to work the way I'd expect.  I've come back now for another go and
I nothing seems to have improved.

I've downloaded  povwin-3.7-agpl3-setup.exe and looked as directed at
'non-standard installations'   It says I can use /INSTALL or /QINSTALL.  These
make not a blind bit of difference you still get led through the prompts for
directories. and so on as if the didn't exists.  /S though undocumented will get
you a silent install.

However I've tried to install it I get the same old, same old, dialogues as ever
when I log in as another user - POVRAY did not find the expected registry
entries....and a telling off for allegedly not using /INSTALL when I did, then
'cannot find colours.inc'

Oh and not that I'm the slightest bit surprised, no shortcuts in the all users
start menu.

After four years I'd really expected someone to have made a competent job of
this. A proper installer should default to installing for all users without any
further action, a miracle thousands of software vendors perform on a daily
basis.  I fail to understand why POVRAY can't achieve this.


 We will continue to have to explain to our students that these errors are not
of our making and are a poor advertisment for your product.

[LanuHum] Re: Python, subprocess, error! [4283 days 21 hours and 14 minutes ago]

Mon, 4 Aug 2014 16:40:01 GMT

clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
>
> Kind of, I guess (I've never used it myself, due to a lack of a Mac ;-))
> -- but there's a command-line only version for MacOS.
>
>
> The lack of a command-line only version for Windows is a legacy of acts
> of software piracy, where companies would use POV-Ray as the rendering
> engine in their products without so much as giving any credits, let
> alone informing their users that they could get the render engine for
> free. As a consequence, the copyright owners of POV-Ray had at some time
> decided to effectively forbid the distribution of any POV-Ray version
> for Windows that could run silently in the background.
>
> The POV-Ray 3.7.0 release proper is the first version of POV-Ray to
> which this restriction no longer applies (as it is released under the
> AGPL, rather than the proprietary open source license of earlier
> versions). So any inclined contributor could now go ahead and develop a
> Windows command-line variant of POV-Ray 3.7.
>
> Priorities and manpower of the dev team is currently somewhere else
> though, so don't hold your breath for this feature to suddenly appear
> out of thin air by magic.

Thanks for a detailed explanation!

[clipka] Re: Python, subprocess, error! [4284 days 4 hours and 1 minute ago]

Mon, 4 Aug 2014 09:52:44 GMT

Am 03.08.2014 20:33, schrieb Alain:
> Le 14-08-03 08:22, LanuHum a écrit :
>> Le_Forgeron <jgr### [at] freefr> wrote:
>>> No gui: try to have the unix/linux code in a windows port, via thing
>>> like cygwin.
>>>
>>> --
>>> IQ of crossposters with FU: 100 / (number of groups)
>>> IQ of crossposters without FU: 100 / (1 + number of groups)
>>> IQ of multiposters: 100 / ( (number of groups) * (number of groups))
>>
>> There is no such option in Povray for Windows?
>> I will tell about it to users of Windows.
>> Let them study source codes and cygwin.
>> :)
>
> It's possibly the same for the MacOS version.

Kind of, I guess (I've never used it myself, due to a lack of a Mac ;-)) 
-- but there's a command-line only version for MacOS.

The lack of a command-line only version for Windows is a legacy of acts 
of software piracy, where companies would use POV-Ray as the rendering 
engine in their products without so much as giving any credits, let 
alone informing their users that they could get the render engine for 
free. As a consequence, the copyright owners of POV-Ray had at some time 
decided to effectively forbid the distribution of any POV-Ray version 
for Windows that could run silently in the background.

The POV-Ray 3.7.0 release proper is the first version of POV-Ray to 
which this restriction no longer applies (as it is released under the 
AGPL, rather than the proprietary open source license of earlier 
versions). So any inclined contributor could now go ahead and develop a 
Windows command-line variant of POV-Ray 3.7.

Priorities and manpower of the dev team is currently somewhere else 
though, so don't hold your breath for this feature to suddenly appear 
out of thin air by magic.

[Stephen] Re: Python, subprocess, error! [4284 days 18 hours and 25 minutes ago]

Sun, 3 Aug 2014 19:29:21 GMT

On 03/08/2014 13:22, LanuHum wrote:
> I will tell about it to users of Windows.
> Let them study source codes and cygwin.
> :)
>


I would rather eat cake!
:-)

-- 

Regards
     Stephen

[Stephen] Re: Python, subprocess, error! [4284 days 18 hours and 26 minutes ago]

Sun, 3 Aug 2014 19:28:20 GMT

On 03/08/2014 19:33, Alain wrote:
> Let them study source codes and cygwin.
> :)
>

I would rather eat cake! :-)

-- 

Regards
     Stephen

[Alain] Re: Python, subprocess, error! [4284 days 19 hours and 21 minutes ago]

Sun, 3 Aug 2014 18:32:57 GMT

Le 14-08-03 08:22, LanuHum a écrit :
> Le_Forgeron <jgr### [at] freefr> wrote:
>> No gui: try to have the unix/linux code in a windows port, via thing
>> like cygwin.
>>
>> --
>> IQ of crossposters with FU: 100 / (number of groups)
>> IQ of crossposters without FU: 100 / (1 + number of groups)
>> IQ of multiposters: 100 / ( (number of groups) * (number of groups))
>
> There is no such option in Povray for Windows?
> I will tell about it to users of Windows.
> Let them study source codes and cygwin.
> :)
>
>

The Windows version always show the GUI and there are now option or 
switch to change that. The only thing that you may try is to start 
minimised. It's possibly the same for the MacOS version.

[LanuHum] Re: Python, subprocess, error! [4285 days 1 hour and 29 minutes ago]

Sun, 3 Aug 2014 12:25:01 GMT

Le_Forgeron <jgr### [at] freefr> wrote:
> No gui: try to have the unix/linux code in a windows port, via thing
> like cygwin.
>
> --
> IQ of crossposters with FU: 100 / (number of groups)
> IQ of crossposters without FU: 100 / (1 + number of groups)
> IQ of multiposters: 100 / ( (number of groups) * (number of groups))

There is no such option in Povray for Windows?
I will tell about it to users of Windows.
Let them study source codes and cygwin.
:)

[Le Forgeron] Re: Python, subprocess, error! [4285 days 7 hours and 45 minutes ago]

Sun, 3 Aug 2014 06:09:10 GMT

On 02/08/2014 20:26, LanuHum wrote:
> Sorry.
> There was a question: How to give command that Povray rendered without starting
> GUI in Windows?
> I looked for the answer in Google.
> 15 years users ask this question, 15 years you don't answer it.
> 
> :) :) :)
> 
> The automatic exit after a render isn't necessary to me, it is necessary for me
> that there was no GUI in general.
> Preview function in a blender causes Povray constantly. Who needs GUI for a
> preview?
> The shadow mode is necessary.
> 
> 
> 
> 
No gui: try to have the unix/linux code in a windows port, via thing
like cygwin.

-- 
IQ of crossposters with FU: 100 / (number of groups)
IQ of crossposters without FU: 100 / (1 + number of groups)
IQ of multiposters: 100 / ( (number of groups) * (number of groups))

[LanuHum] Re: Python, subprocess, error! [4285 days 19 hours and 24 minutes ago]

Sat, 2 Aug 2014 18:30:00 GMT

Sorry.
There was a question: How to give command that Povray rendered without starting
GUI in Windows?
I looked for the answer in Google.
15 years users ask this question, 15 years you don't answer it.

:) :) :)

The automatic exit after a render isn't necessary to me, it is necessary for me
that there was no GUI in general.
Preview function in a blender causes Povray constantly. Who needs GUI for a
preview?
The shadow mode is necessary.

[LanuHum] Re: Python, subprocess, error! [4288 days 21 hours and 29 minutes ago]

Wed, 30 Jul 2014 16:25:01 GMT

"Mr" <nomail@nomail> wrote:
>
> oh, it looks like something is wrong with the slash/backslash\ handling in the
> report.  Can you let me know if the last version does work for you?
>

I changed all code. Now we use nodes and bl_use_preview = True
I have no Windows. After I will make changes, users will carry out the test,
then to me will tell

> wheneverpossible using the os.path module methods to concatenate, truncate or
> whatever one has to do with paths makes sure it works more smoothly across
> platforms. possibly one slash should be removed from the hardwritten filename
> and left to be handled by the python's os.path methods, for instance current
> version is:
>
>
>  workDir=os.path.dirname(__file__)
>  previewDir=os.path.join(workDir, "preview")
>
>  ## Make sure Preview directory exists and is empty
>  if not os.path.isdir(previewDir):
>  os.mkdir(previewDir)
>
>  iniPrevFile=os.path.join(previewDir, "Preview.ini")
>  inputPrevFile=os.path.join(previewDir, "Preview.pov")

Thanks!

[Mr] Re: Python, subprocess, error! [4289 days 4 hours and 9 minutes ago]

Wed, 30 Jul 2014 09:45:01 GMT

clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
> Am 29.07.2014 21:24, schrieb LanuHum:
> > Hellow!
> > I want to make a render in a shadow mode for a preview of materials in Blender
> > In Linux - no problem, preview very good
> > In Windows don't work
> > http://blender-3d.ru/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=753.0;attach=2930;image
>
> It does tell you what's wrong:
>
> "Cannot open INI file 'C:\povray\preview/Preview.ini'."
>
> Make sure the file is indeed at that location.

oh, it looks like something is wrong with the slash/backslash\ handling in the
report.  Can you let me know if the last version does work for you?

wheneverpossible using the os.path module methods to concatenate, truncate or
whatever one has to do with paths makes sure it works more smoothly across
platforms. possibly one slash should be removed from the hardwritten filename
and left to be handled by the python's os.path methods, for instance current
version is:

 workDir=os.path.dirname(__file__)
 previewDir=os.path.join(workDir, "preview")

 ## Make sure Preview directory exists and is empty
 if not os.path.isdir(previewDir):
 os.mkdir(previewDir)

 iniPrevFile=os.path.join(previewDir, "Preview.ini")
 inputPrevFile=os.path.join(previewDir, "Preview.pov")

[Mr] Re: Python, subprocess, error! [4289 days 4 hours and 14 minutes ago]

Wed, 30 Jul 2014 09:40:00 GMT

"LanuHum" <Lan### [at] yandexru> wrote:
> Hellow!
> I want to make a render in a shadow mode for a preview of materials in Blender
> In Linux - no problem, preview very good
> In Windows don't work
> http://blender-3d.ru/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=753.0;attach=2930;image
>
> pov_binary = os.path.join(win_home, "bin", "pvengine64.exe")
> self._process =
>
subprocess.Popen(["%s"%pov_binary,"%s/Preview.ini"%previewDir],stdout=subprocess.PIPE,stderr=subprocess.STDOUT)
>
> ini:
> Version=3.7
> Input_File_Name='C:\\povray\\preview\\Preview.pov'
> Output_File_Name='C:\\povray\\preview\\Preview.png'
> Width=100
> Height=100
> Bounding_Method=2
> Display=0
> Pause_When_Done=0
> Output_File_Type=N
> Output_Alpha=1
> Antialias=on
> Sampling_Method=3
> Antialias_Depth=3
> Antialias_Threshold=0.1
> Antialias_Gamma=2.5


This Bug is now possibly solved in the official version, thanks for the report:
the preview directory was not created (since I had done it by hand while testing
and forgot to add it in the script later) You can download the corrected version
from the repository or any blender version built after  Monday, July the 28th at
8:02 PM.

[clipka] Re: Python, subprocess, error! [4289 days 14 hours and 49 minutes ago]

Tue, 29 Jul 2014 23:05:23 GMT

Am 29.07.2014 21:24, schrieb LanuHum:
> Hellow!
> I want to make a render in a shadow mode for a preview of materials in Blender
> In Linux - no problem, preview very good
> In Windows don't work
> http://blender-3d.ru/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=753.0;attach=2930;image

It does tell you what's wrong:

"Cannot open INI file 'C:\povray\preview/Preview.ini'."

Make sure the file is indeed at that location.

[LanuHum] Python, subprocess, error! [4289 days 18 hours and 24 minutes ago]

Tue, 29 Jul 2014 19:30:01 GMT

Hellow!
I want to make a render in a shadow mode for a preview of materials in Blender
In Linux - no problem, preview very good
In Windows don't work
http://blender-3d.ru/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=753.0;attach=2930;image

pov_binary = os.path.join(win_home, "bin", "pvengine64.exe")
self._process =
subprocess.Popen(["%s"%pov_binary,"%s/Preview.ini"%previewDir],stdout=subprocess.PIPE,stderr=subprocess.STDOUT)

ini:
Version=3.7
Input_File_Name='C:\\povray\\preview\\Preview.pov'
Output_File_Name='C:\\povray\\preview\\Preview.png'
Width=100
Height=100
Bounding_Method=2
Display=0
Pause_When_Done=0
Output_File_Type=N
Output_Alpha=1
Antialias=on
Sampling_Method=3
Antialias_Depth=3
Antialias_Threshold=0.1
Antialias_Gamma=2.5

[Bald Eagle] Re: povray error ini file [4294 days 23 hours and 59 minutes ago]

Thu, 24 Jul 2014 13:55:01 GMT

Most likely your ini file is in your old POV-Ray version's /ini directory.
Move or copy that to the POV-Ray 3.7 subdirectory (it's a subfolder in your
Documents), and that should fix it.

Same goes for your scene files, etc.

[fennafloor] povray error ini file [4295 days 3 hours and 9 minutes ago]

Thu, 24 Jul 2014 10:45:00 GMT

hey everyone,

hope you can help me here.
Not too long ago I used povray and it worked as a charm.
Then windows got updated to windows 7 and I had to re-instal povray.
unfortunately now... I can't seem to render.
It gives the error: cannot open ini file.

Anyone a clue what i have to do to make it work again?
Thankssss

Looking forward to your repsonse!

[Le Forgeron] Re: Running PovRay on a webserver [4376 days 4 hours and 35 minutes ago]

Sun, 4 May 2014 09:18:54 GMT

Le 04/05/2014 10:04, DampfHans nous fit lire :
> Thanks for your fast answer. Though the process-killing timeout would not be a
> problem -povray has the /EXIT-Option- it's still impossible to run povray on a
> windows(!)-webserver.

I was thinking about the run-time: if the rendering lasts too long.

> In the meantime I found out, that windows server stops a service-started
> process, that wants to open a window by depriving all CPU-time (so the process
> remains as a zombie).
> Since povray for windows opens its window unconditionally it's a candidate for
> this problem.
> For those, who plan to run povray on a windows-webserver: As long, as povray has
> no real (silent) batchmode it's impossible!

With the official binary, yes.
You might make a "DOS-like" home-made binary from the unix source.

[DampfHans] Re: Running PovRay on a webserver [4376 days 5 hours and 44 minutes ago]

Sun, 4 May 2014 08:10:01 GMT

Thanks for your fast answer. Though the process-killing timeout would not be a
problem -povray has the /EXIT-Option- it's still impossible to run povray on a
windows(!)-webserver.
In the meantime I found out, that windows server stops a service-started
process, that wants to open a window by depriving all CPU-time (so the process
remains as a zombie).
Since povray for windows opens its window unconditionally it's a candidate for
this problem.
For those, who plan to run povray on a windows-webserver: As long, as povray has
no real (silent) batchmode it's impossible!
Fore those, who are interested in the background:
http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/hardware/dn653293%28v=vs.85%29.aspx
..

Le_Forgeron <jgr### [at] freefr> wrote:
> Le 03/05/2014 23:02, DampfHans nous fit lire :
> > Hi,
> >
> > I tried to run PovRay 3.7 on a webserver (Win. 2008 Server), starting it with
> > the PHP exec-command.
> >
> > Instead of calculating the image the exec-command hangs. I think, the problem
> > is, that PovRay tries to open a window which must fail on a webserver.
> >
> > Am I right? And is there any way to prevent this problem? What is the situation
> > on a linux-server?
> >
>
> On a unix system, you can use the -D option to not open the preview.
>
> > Thanks in progress!
> >
> >
> If you ever succeed, your process will be killed by the php-timeout.

[Le Forgeron] Re: Running PovRay on a webserver [4376 days 16 hours and 38 minutes ago]

Sat, 3 May 2014 21:16:21 GMT

Le 03/05/2014 23:02, DampfHans nous fit lire :
> Hi,
> 
> I tried to run PovRay 3.7 on a webserver (Win. 2008 Server), starting it with
> the PHP exec-command.
> 
> Instead of calculating the image the exec-command hangs. I think, the problem
> is, that PovRay tries to open a window which must fail on a webserver.
> 
> Am I right? And is there any way to prevent this problem? What is the situation
> on a linux-server?
> 

On a unix system, you can use the -D option to not open the preview.

> Thanks in progress!
> 
> 
If you ever succeed, your process will be killed by the php-timeout.

[DampfHans] Running PovRay on a webserver [4376 days 16 hours and 49 minutes ago]

Sat, 3 May 2014 21:05:01 GMT

Hi,

I tried to run PovRay 3.7 on a webserver (Win. 2008 Server), starting it with
the PHP exec-command.

Instead of calculating the image the exec-command hangs. I think, the problem
is, that PovRay tries to open a window which must fail on a webserver.

Am I right? And is there any way to prevent this problem? What is the situation
on a linux-server?

Thanks in progress!

[jrp] Compiling from GIT source with VS2013 (success) [4380 days 15 hours and 14 minutes ago]

Tue, 29 Apr 2014 22:40:00 GMT

Turned out to be a bit more challenging than I expected (mainly because a later
Boost (1.55 is what I used) is required, or at least preferred.  In fact
VC++2013 has most of the features required to dispense with Boost, but not all
of them (eg, function / hash).

The main change required is to make shared_ptr and weak_ptr explictly boost::
versions to avoid pulling in the std:: versions.

There are still a good few warnings about macro redefinitions and I have not
changed the macros that make the binary Windows 2000 compatible.

If the devs are interested in a patch, I'm happy to provide it.

[Gfans] Re: Command line to make windows povray 3.6 auto... [4394 days 12 hours and 24 minutes ago]

Wed, 16 Apr 2014 01:30:01 GMT

Alain <kua### [at] videotronca> wrote:
> I don't think that the «>null» is needed. It may cause some isues.
> If you set POV-Ray to "Only one instance", you won't need to add «/exit».
> Personaly, I prefered to add +fn in the povray.ini file before going to
> version 3.7.
>
> If at all possible, use the animation feature. That way, you can render
> many frames with only one command. Use the #fopen #fread commands to
> read your data, or beter, use #include "FileName" (you can include files
> that have any extention as long as they contain valid SDL code), and use
> string operation to construct the required files names if you need
> different data set per frame.
>
> If your legacy code DON'T support animation, then it's pre version 3.0...
>
>
> Alain

The code is based on version 3.5/6. As you suggested, I will use its animation
function. As I will render some scenarios with moving rigid bodies/soft bodies
as well, it's kinda a must-use feature in this case.

You helped me a lot.Thanks again.

Xiao

[Alain] Re: Command line to make windows povray 3.6 auto... [4394 days 19 hours and 48 minutes ago]

Tue, 15 Apr 2014 18:06:03 GMT

Le 14-04-15 00:48, Gfans a écrit :
> Alain <kua### [at] videotronca> wrote:
>> Le 14-04-13 11:00, Gfans a écrit :
>>> Hi there,
>>>
>>> I have a legcy rendering code which is based on povray 3.6. Now I have a bunch
>>> of input data to be used together with one .pov file. In every single rendering
>>> process, one data will be read by a simple program and copyed to, let's say
>>> currentData.txt, and this file will be read as an input data and rendered by
>>> this modified povray program. It works fine if I just want to render every frame
>>> manually. So I wrote a simple code and try to automate the rendering task.
>>>
>>> Every time an image is finished rendering, the GUI is closed and re-opened as
>>> expected. But the problem is that I have to press the "run" button to render it
>>> again.
>>>
>>> Does anyone know how to avoid this manual intervention and let it render images
>>> automatically?
>>>
>>> Thanks.
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>> Xiao
>>>
>>>
>>
>> Be sure to add /run in your script on the line that invoque POV-Ray.
>> You should use an INI file instead of calling POV-Ray directly.
>> That ini file will provide the name of the file to be rendered,
>> optionaly, the resolution to be used and other options, like the data
>> source.
>>
>> Another option is to use the animation feature.
>> It work great if you can batch create your currentData files before you
>> start the rendering. You want files named somewhat like this:
>> Data00001.txt, Data00002.txt, Data00003.txt,...
>> Next, in your scene, use string manipulation to construct the name
>> needed for the current frame.
>> #declare InputFileName= concat("Data", str(frame_number,
>> Using read and write, the current render can read your data and write
>> your currentData.txt file for the next frame.
>> The animation can be initiated from the ini file or using command line
>> options.
>>
>> Files based on version 3.6 will render fine with version 3.7 with the
>> following changes:
>> The default image format is now PNG
>> In radiosity scenes, ambient is disabled. Use emission in your finish
>> instead if you want the texture to glow.
>> It is recomended to use assumed_gamma 1.
>
> Hi Alain,
>
> Thanks for the tips. I tried with /run, but it didn't work. Actually, the
> modified povray code works fine under mac os x. Since it has some issues when
> recompiling on intel cpu, I ported to windows platform.
>
> Here is the command line used for mac os x version which runs as expected:
>        unix/povray -Itest.pov +W800 +H600 +FN +Linclude &>/dev/null
>
> On windows, I used the following command in the for loop:
>        povwin.exe -Itest.pov +W800 +H600 +FN +Linclude /render /exit >null
>
> But when even frame is finished, it still waits for me to press the "run" button
> to render the next frame again. Can you please correct me?
>
>
>
>

I don't think that the «>null» is needed. It may cause some isues.
If you set POV-Ray to "Only one instance", you won't need to add «/exit».
Personaly, I prefered to add +fn in the povray.ini file before going to 
version 3.7.

If at all possible, use the animation feature. That way, you can render 
many frames with only one command. Use the #fopen #fread commands to 
read your data, or beter, use #include "FileName" (you can include files 
that have any extention as long as they contain valid SDL code), and use 
string operation to construct the required files names if you need 
different data set per frame.

If your legacy code DON'T support animation, then it's pre version 3.0...


Alain

[Gfans] Re: Command line to make windows povray 3.6 auto... [4395 days 9 hours and 4 minutes ago]

Tue, 15 Apr 2014 04:50:01 GMT

Alain <kua### [at] videotronca> wrote:
> Le 14-04-13 11:00, Gfans a écrit :
> > Hi there,
> >
> > I have a legcy rendering code which is based on povray 3.6. Now I have a bunch
> > of input data to be used together with one .pov file. In every single rendering
> > process, one data will be read by a simple program and copyed to, let's say
> > currentData.txt, and this file will be read as an input data and rendered by
> > this modified povray program. It works fine if I just want to render every frame
> > manually. So I wrote a simple code and try to automate the rendering task.
> >
> > Every time an image is finished rendering, the GUI is closed and re-opened as
> > expected. But the problem is that I have to press the "run" button to render it
> > again.
> >
> > Does anyone know how to avoid this manual intervention and let it render images
> > automatically?
> >
> > Thanks.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Xiao
> >
> >
>
> Be sure to add /run in your script on the line that invoque POV-Ray.
> You should use an INI file instead of calling POV-Ray directly.
> That ini file will provide the name of the file to be rendered,
> optionaly, the resolution to be used and other options, like the data
> source.
>
> Another option is to use the animation feature.
> It work great if you can batch create your currentData files before you
> start the rendering. You want files named somewhat like this:
> Data00001.txt, Data00002.txt, Data00003.txt,...
> Next, in your scene, use string manipulation to construct the name
> needed for the current frame.
> #declare InputFileName= concat("Data", str(frame_number,
> Using read and write, the current render can read your data and write
> your currentData.txt file for the next frame.
> The animation can be initiated from the ini file or using command line
> options.
>
> Files based on version 3.6 will render fine with version 3.7 with the
> following changes:
> The default image format is now PNG
> In radiosity scenes, ambient is disabled. Use emission in your finish
> instead if you want the texture to glow.
> It is recomended to use assumed_gamma 1.

Hi Alain,

Thanks for the tips. I tried with /run, but it didn't work. Actually, the
modified povray code works fine under mac os x. Since it has some issues when
recompiling on intel cpu, I ported to windows platform.

Here is the command line used for mac os x version which runs as expected:
      unix/povray -Itest.pov +W800 +H600 +FN +Linclude &>/dev/null

On windows, I used the following command in the for loop:
      povwin.exe -Itest.pov +W800 +H600 +FN +Linclude /render /exit >null

But when even frame is finished, it still waits for me to press the "run" button
to render the next frame again. Can you please correct me?

[Alain] Re: Command line to make windows povray 3.6 auto... [4396 days 20 hours and 16 minutes ago]

Sun, 13 Apr 2014 17:38:27 GMT

Le 14-04-13 11:00, Gfans a écrit :
> Hi there,
>
> I have a legcy rendering code which is based on povray 3.6. Now I have a bunch
> of input data to be used together with one .pov file. In every single rendering
> process, one data will be read by a simple program and copyed to, let's say
> currentData.txt, and this file will be read as an input data and rendered by
> this modified povray program. It works fine if I just want to render every frame
> manually. So I wrote a simple code and try to automate the rendering task.
>
> Every time an image is finished rendering, the GUI is closed and re-opened as
> expected. But the problem is that I have to press the "run" button to render it
> again.
>
> Does anyone know how to avoid this manual intervention and let it render images
> automatically?
>
> Thanks.
>
> Regards,
> Xiao
>
>

Be sure to add /run in your script on the line that invoque POV-Ray.
You should use an INI file instead of calling POV-Ray directly.
That ini file will provide the name of the file to be rendered, 
optionaly, the resolution to be used and other options, like the data 
source.

Another option is to use the animation feature.
It work great if you can batch create your currentData files before you 
start the rendering. You want files named somewhat like this:
Data00001.txt, Data00002.txt, Data00003.txt,...
Next, in your scene, use string manipulation to construct the name 
needed for the current frame.
#declare InputFileName= concat("Data", str(frame_number,
Using read and write, the current render can read your data and write 
your currentData.txt file for the next frame.
The animation can be initiated from the ini file or using command line 
options.

Files based on version 3.6 will render fine with version 3.7 with the 
following changes:
The default image format is now PNG
In radiosity scenes, ambient is disabled. Use emission in your finish 
instead if you want the texture to glow.
It is recomended to use assumed_gamma 1.

[Gfans] Command line to make windows povray 3.6 autorun [4396 days 22 hours and 49 minutes ago]

Sun, 13 Apr 2014 15:05:00 GMT

Hi there,

I have a legcy rendering code which is based on povray 3.6. Now I have a bunch
of input data to be used together with one .pov file. In every single rendering
process, one data will be read by a simple program and copyed to, let's say
currentData.txt, and this file will be read as an input data and rendered by
this modified povray program. It works fine if I just want to render every frame
manually. So I wrote a simple code and try to automate the rendering task.

Every time an image is finished rendering, the GUI is closed and re-opened as
expected. But the problem is that I have to press the "run" button to render it
again.

Does anyone know how to avoid this manual intervention and let it render images
automatically?

Thanks.

Regards,
Xiao

[Alain] Re: some problems about finish [4440 days 13 hours ago]

Sat, 1 Mar 2014 00:54:34 GMT

Le 14-02-27 01:42, CAS a écrit :
> I want to ask how should I set the value of ambient and diffuse ?
> "pigment {color rgb spectral}" I only used the reflection of object . I do not
> need to consider the ambient and diffuse ,but I want to ask whether  need I to
> set the parameters of ambient and diffuse ?If need, "#default{ finish{ ambient
> 0.1 diffuse 0.9 }}"is OK?
>
>
>

For a purely refflective surface, ambient and diffuse are usualy set to 
zero. Most also set the diffuse and ambient lower for transparent textures.
A good starting diffuse value for a reflective object may be set as 
(when starting from the default diffuse and ambient values):
0.7*(1-reflection).
For ambient, you can try 0.1*(1-reflection).

A diffuse value of 0.9 is OK only for the brightest, extremely high 
albedo, objects. Normaly, the default of 0.7 is very good.




Alain

[CAS] some problems about finish [4442 days 7 hours and 9 minutes ago]

Thu, 27 Feb 2014 06:45:01 GMT

I want to ask how should I set the value of ambient and diffuse ?
"pigment {color rgb spectral}" I only used the reflection of object . I do not
need to consider the ambient and diffuse ,but I want to ask whether  need I to
set the parameters of ambient and diffuse ?If need, "#default{ finish{ ambient
0.1 diffuse 0.9 }}"is OK?

[skywalker89] Re: Installation will not begin - various error ... [4458 days 16 hours and 44 minutes ago]

Mon, 10 Feb 2014 21:10:00 GMT

> Where did you get this installer from? I do not recognize that message.
>
> If you right-click on the installer and choose 'Properties', there
> should be a tab labeled 'Digital Signatures'. Check that this is
> present and shows the exe is signed by us. A damaged file will not
> have a valid digital signature.
>
> -- Chris


The installer was the one I clicked on from your site, povray.org. I will
double-check the signatures.

I did try another browser, and no luck there.

- skywlaker89

[Chris Cason] Re: Installation will not begin - various error ... [4462 days 7 hours and 35 minutes ago]

Fri, 7 Feb 2014 06:19:10 GMT

On 7/02/2014 09:03, skywalker89 wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> I recently downloaded POVray and was trying to begin the installation process,
> but it won't even start. I get various error messages. I tried repeating the
> download, but it seems that each download gives me a different error message.
> Was wondering if anyone could help me. I believe in am working with a 32bit
> system (messages on my computer say Win32).
> 
> Here is the first error message that I see:
> 
> "Installer integrity check has failed. Common causes include incomplete download
> and damaged media. Contact the installer's author to obtain a new copy."
> 
> As I mentioned, I tried to download several other times, but these did not work
> either. On another copy I got this message:
> 
> "The application has failed to start because its side-by-side configuration is
> incorrect. Please see the application event log or use the command-line
> sxtrace.exe tool for more details. "

Where did you get this installer from? I do not recognize that message.

If you right-click on the installer and choose 'Properties', there
should be a tab labeled 'Digital Signatures'. Check that this is
present and shows the exe is signed by us. A damaged file will not
have a valid digital signature.

-- Chris

[Stephen] Re: Installation will not begin - various error ... [4462 days 7 hours and 42 minutes ago]

Fri, 7 Feb 2014 06:12:23 GMT

On 06/02/2014 11:58 PM, skywalker89 wrote:
> All the files I have are 30.3 MB, except for one, which is 30.2 MB.
>
>


Clipka's advice is the first think to try. My download size was 31273 KB

-- 
Regards
     Stephen

[skywalker89] Re: Installation will not begin - various error ... [4462 days 13 hours and 54 minutes ago]

Fri, 7 Feb 2014 00:00:01 GMT

All the files I have are 30.3 MB, except for one, which is 30.2 MB.

Thanks!

-skywalker89

[clipka] Re: Installation will not begin - various error ... [4462 days 14 hours and 1 minute ago]

Thu, 6 Feb 2014 23:52:40 GMT

Am 06.02.2014 23:03, schrieb skywalker89:
> Hello,
>
> I recently downloaded POVray and was trying to begin the installation process,
> but it won't even start. I get various error messages. I tried repeating the
> download, but it seems that each download gives me a different error message.
> Was wondering if anyone could help me. I believe in am working with a 32bit
> system (messages on my computer say Win32).

Sounds like a browser or internet connection problem to me. Try clearing 
the browser cache and re-downloading.

[Stephen] Re: Installation will not begin - various error ... [4462 days 15 hours and 34 minutes ago]

Thu, 6 Feb 2014 22:20:04 GMT

On 06/02/2014 10:03 PM, skywalker89 wrote:
> I'm just trying to get the program installed at this point. Any help would be
> appreciated!

What size was your download?


-- 
Regards
     Stephen

[skywalker89] Installation will not begin - various error mess... [4462 days 15 hours and 49 minutes ago]

Thu, 6 Feb 2014 22:05:00 GMT

Hello,

I recently downloaded POVray and was trying to begin the installation process,
but it won't even start. I get various error messages. I tried repeating the
download, but it seems that each download gives me a different error message.
Was wondering if anyone could help me. I believe in am working with a 32bit
system (messages on my computer say Win32).

Here is the first error message that I see:

"Installer integrity check has failed. Common causes include incomplete download
and damaged media. Contact the installer's author to obtain a new copy."

As I mentioned, I tried to download several other times, but these did not work
either. On another copy I got this message:

"The application has failed to start because its side-by-side configuration is
incorrect. Please see the application event log or use the command-line
sxtrace.exe tool for more details. "

Yet another copy gives me this message:

"The application was unable to start correctly (0xc0000005). Click OK to close
the application."

I'm just trying to get the program installed at this point. Any help would be
appreciated!

Thanks!

[kendfrey] Re: Shell commands are not run [4488 days 22 hours and 4 minutes ago]

Sat, 11 Jan 2014 15:50:00 GMT

clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
> I think I recall notepad to be problematic as a test for this feature
> for /some/ reason, though I don't remember why.
>
> Do try with the batch file.

Aha! I had tried with the batch file, but I put notepad in it, and not mkdir or
del. When I tried mkdir, it worked!

It appears the best way to use shell-outs is to just use a batch file and put
everything in there.

Thank you for your help!

[clipka] Re: Shell commands are not run [4489 days 3 hours and 7 minutes ago]

Sat, 11 Jan 2014 10:47:12 GMT

Am 11.01.2014 06:15, schrieb kendfrey:
> clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
>> As in good old MS-DOS times, mkdir isn't really a program, but a
>> built-in keyword of cmd.exe; this might be why it isn't working.
>>
>> Try placing the command inside a batch file (e.g. "foo.bat") and
>> specifying that batch file as Pre_Scene_Command.
>
> I set Pre_Scene_Command=notepad, which I know isn't a built-in command. Notepad
> did not appear. It doesn't seem to be an issue with command vs. executable.

I think I recall notepad to be problematic as a test for this feature 
for /some/ reason, though I don't remember why.

Do try with the batch file.

[kendfrey] Re: Shell commands are not run [4489 days 8 hours and 34 minutes ago]

Sat, 11 Jan 2014 05:20:01 GMT

clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
> As in good old MS-DOS times, mkdir isn't really a program, but a
> built-in keyword of cmd.exe; this might be why it isn't working.
>
> Try placing the command inside a batch file (e.g. "foo.bat") and
> specifying that batch file as Pre_Scene_Command.

I set Pre_Scene_Command=notepad, which I know isn't a built-in command. Notepad
did not appear. It doesn't seem to be an issue with command vs. executable.

[clipka] Re: Shell commands are not run [4490 days 12 hours and 43 minutes ago]

Fri, 10 Jan 2014 01:10:38 GMT

Am 09.01.2014 20:25, schrieb kendfrey:

> Pre_Scene_Command=mkdir foo
> Input_File_Name=life-Copy.pov
..-
> When rendering, no foo folder appears beside my INI file.
...
> Is this a bug, or am I missing something?

As in good old MS-DOS times, mkdir isn't really a program, but a 
built-in keyword of cmd.exe; this might be why it isn't working.

Try placing the command inside a batch file (e.g. "foo.bat") and 
specifying that batch file as Pre_Scene_Command.

[kendfrey] Shell commands are not run [4490 days 18 hours and 24 minutes ago]

Thu, 9 Jan 2014 19:30:00 GMT

Shell commands in my INI file are not run. I tried Pre- and Post_Scene_Command,
as well as the corresponding Frame commands.

Options > Script I/O restrictions > Disable Starting Other Programs is NOT
checked.

I first tried Pre_Scene_Command=del *.png, since I want to clear all previous
output (for animation). I currently have Pre_Scene_Command=mkdir foo. Neither
command seems to have any effect when rendering. They work fine when run via the
Windows command prompt.

This is the entirety of my current INI file (life-Copy.ini):

Pre_Scene_Command=mkdir foo
Input_File_Name=life-Copy.pov

life-Copy.pov is completely empty.

When rendering, no foo folder appears beside my INI file.

I am using "POV-Ray(tm) for Windows - Version 3.7.0.msvc10.win64" on Windows 7.

Is this a bug, or am I missing something?

Your help is appreciated.

[posfan12] Re: Win7x64: Uninstalled POV 3.62, can no longer... [4494 days 11 hours and 49 minutes ago]

Mon, 6 Jan 2014 02:05:00 GMT

I found the issue and the solution to the issue here:

http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/windows_7-files/problems-with-file-association-in-windows-7-64-bit/8a8
4fcec-22df-4942-8e35-d98dbe96e327

POV-Ray 3.7 wasn't registered correctly. The registry key discussed in the
article was associated with POV 3.62 instead of 3.7.


Mike

[posfan12] Re: Win7x64: Uninstalled POV 3.62, can no longer... [4494 days 12 hours and 4 minutes ago]

Mon, 6 Jan 2014 01:50:01 GMT

"posfan12" <nomail@nomail> wrote:
> I would like to confirm whether this is a bug or not before seeking alternative
> solutions.
>
>
>
> Mike

Update: I was able to set the association with the SSE2 Win32 version, but not
pvengine64.exe or pvengine.exe.

I'm going to keep searching for a solution involving editing the registry.

Mike

[posfan12] Re: Win7x64: Uninstalled POV 3.62, can no longer... [4494 days 12 hours and 34 minutes ago]

Mon, 6 Jan 2014 01:20:01 GMT

Stephen <mca### [at] aolcom> wrote:
> It would be the same procedure with *.inc files. Remember to tick the
> box that says. "Always use the selected program to open this kind of file."
>

Yes, I did this. I am able to set the file association for other programs, like
Notepad++. But it fails to "stick" when trying to do the same for any of
POV-Ray's executables.

> Or you could hack the registry.
>
>
> --
> Regards
>      Stephen

I would like to confirm whether this is a bug or not before seeking alternative
solutions.

Mike

[Stephen] Re: Win7x64: Uninstalled POV 3.62, can no longer... [4494 days 22 hours ago]

Sun, 5 Jan 2014 15:54:05 GMT

On 05/01/2014 2:02 PM, posfan12 wrote:
> Stephen <mca### [at] aolcom> wrote:
>> Have you tried, select the *.pov file, right click, open with, "choose
>> default program"?
>>
>> --
>> Regards
>>       Stephen
>
> Yes, the POV files are properly associated with POV 3.7. It is the INC files
> that are not working.
>

It would be the same procedure with *.inc files. Remember to tick the 
box that says. "Always use the selected program to open this kind of file."

Or you could hack the registry.

-- 
Regards
     Stephen

[posfan12] Re: Win7x64: Uninstalled POV 3.62, can no longer... [4494 days 23 hours and 49 minutes ago]

Sun, 5 Jan 2014 14:05:00 GMT

Stephen <mca### [at] aolcom> wrote:
> Have you tried, select the *.pov file, right click, open with, "choose
> default program"?
>
> --
> Regards
>      Stephen

Yes, the POV files are properly associated with POV 3.7. It is the INC files
that are not working.


Mike

[Stephen] Re: Win7x64: Uninstalled POV 3.62, can no longer... [4495 days 7 hours and 7 minutes ago]

Sun, 5 Jan 2014 06:46:46 GMT

On 05/01/2014 3:11 AM, posfan12 wrote:
> Formerly I had POV 3.62 and 3.7 both installed on the same machine. I switched
> over to 3.7 exclusively.
>
> However, now I cannot associate INC files with POV-Ray on Windows 7 x64. I can
> navigate to the program through the "Open File" dialog, but the association does
> not "stick". I.e. it is simply ignored/reset back to the earlier program, in my
> case Notepad.
>
> Does anyone have any tips on how to resolve this?
>
>
Have you tried, select the *.pov file, right click, open with, "choose 
default program"?

-- 
Regards
     Stephen

[posfan12] Win7x64: Uninstalled POV 3.62, can no longer ass... [4495 days 10 hours and 39 minutes ago]

Sun, 5 Jan 2014 03:15:01 GMT

Formerly I had POV 3.62 and 3.7 both installed on the same machine. I switched
over to 3.7 exclusively.

However, now I cannot associate INC files with POV-Ray on Windows 7 x64. I can
navigate to the program through the "Open File" dialog, but the association does
not "stick". I.e. it is simply ignored/reset back to the earlier program, in my
case Notepad.

Does anyone have any tips on how to resolve this?

[Tamas Gunda] Re: installation issue for povray 3.7 [4498 days 1 hour and 39 minutes ago]

Thu, 2 Jan 2014 12:15:00 GMT

"aluongo" <nomail@nomail> wrote:
> Hi,
> i installed the povray 3.7 on windows (both XP and vista) and i've seen the link
> created on the desktop point to a wrong filename. i've pvengine-sse2.exe instead
> of pvengine32-sse2.exe
>
> HTH
>
> Achille

I second this issue (Win 7/32). However, the opposite
case. I have pvengine32-sse2.exe and the created shortcuts pointed to
pvengine-sse2.exe.

[Chris Cason] Re: installation issue for povray 3.7 [4524 days 3 hours and 44 minutes ago]

Sat, 7 Dec 2013 10:10:06 GMT

On 7/12/2013 20:43, aluongo wrote:
> i installed the povray 3.7 on windows (both XP and vista) and i've seen the link
> created on the desktop point to a wrong filename. i've pvengine-sse2.exe instead

Thanks for bringing this to our attention; it will be fixed.

regards,

-- Chris

[aluongo] installation issue for povray 3.7 [4524 days 4 hours and 9 minutes ago]

Sat, 7 Dec 2013 09:45:01 GMT

Hi,
i installed the povray 3.7 on windows (both XP and vista) and i've seen the link
created on the desktop point to a wrong filename. i've pvengine-sse2.exe instead
of pvengine32-sse2.exe

HTH

Achille

[clipka] Re: how to compile and run .pov through console [4551 days 20 hours and 15 minutes ago]

Sat, 9 Nov 2013 17:38:54 GMT

Am 04.10.2013 15:31, schrieb Christian Froeschlin:
> Alain wrote:
>
>> The Windows version of POV-Ray will always display the editor. There
>> is NO switch to prevent that.
>
> As far as I understand this is to prevent another application from
> easily incorporating POV-Ray without acknowledgement or credit, while
> still supporting such use.

That's what I heard, too, and the old POV-Ray license explicitly forbade 
releasing a patch to suppress that part of the code.

However, with POV-Ray 3.7.0 now released under the AGPL, that 
restriction is gone for good, and we can probably expect future versions 
to provide a "silent" mode - either as an official feature, or at least 
as an unofficial patch.

[Mr] Re: Poet3-D Animation Software [4554 days 5 hours and 44 minutes ago]

Thu, 7 Nov 2013 08:10:00 GMT

"Eric Wessels" <ewe### [at] erolscom> wrote:
> Hello,
>
> My name is Eric Wessels. I recently released a piece of software, Poet3-D,
> as freeware. It is designed to provide a real-time textured OpenGL playback
> of scenes consisting of articulated figures (humans) and primitives. It is
> designed to be an interactive front-end that exports to Pov-Ray.
>
> Anyway, I'm a college professor and I wrote the package for an Animation
> class I taught this spring. So far, I've recieved 1200+ hits on the site but
> not one e-mail response! I'm currently trying to decide whether to flesh-out
> the GUI and functionality of this alpha software or put it on the garbage
> heap.
>
> If anyone could try it out and give me some info I would appreciate it. The
> URL for the software is http://home.winsocket.com/~dreamsir/p3d.htm
>
> I can be contacted at poe### [at] xoommailcom or ewe### [at] erolscom. I have more
> confidence in the latter e-mail address.
>
> If someone could give me some feedback on the software, I would greatly
> appreciate it.
>
> Sincere thanks,
> Eric

Hi,
Updating the POV-Ray links collection,
I am bumping this old thread because this software's homepage is down and none
of the provided emails work. Eric, In case this newsgroup adress is different,
could you please let us know where to download you POET 3D animation software?

Or if anyone else has it around some harddrive and can provide it?

[Alain] Re: Object changes when translated, rotated, or ... [4558 days 10 hours and 41 minutes ago]

Sun, 3 Nov 2013 03:12:57 GMT

Le 13-11-01 12:38, Charles a écrit :
> I have an object bounded by a box. it works fine except when I try and move it
> or change the camera angle and the bounding box looses it's affect.
> Is this a bug?
>   Code:
>
> #declare Lowermouth = union{
> torus{ 0.6, 0.2 texture{Bodytex} rotate<90,0,0>translate <0,-0.2,0>}
> torus{ 0.55, 0.19 texture{Bodytex} rotate<90,0,0>translate <0,-0.2,-0.25>}
> torus{ 0.5, 0.18 texture{Bodytex} rotate<90,0,0>translate <0,-0.2,-0.5>}
> torus{ 0.45, 0.165 texture{Bodytex} rotate<90,0,0>translate <0,-0.2,-0.75>}
> torus{ 0.4, 0.15 texture{Bodytex} rotate<90,0,0>translate <0,-0.2,-1>}
> torus{ 0.35, 0.15 texture{Bodytex} rotate<90,0,0>translate <0,-0.2,-1.25>scale
> <1,0.99,1>}
> torus{ 0.29, 0.15 texture{Bodytex} rotate<90,0,0>translate <0,-0.2,-1.5>scale
> <1,0.98,1>}
> torus{ 0.22, 0.15 texture{Bodytex} rotate<90,0,0>translate <0,-0.2,-1.75>scale
> <1,0.96,1>}
> torus{ 0.15, 0.15 texture{Bodytex} rotate<90,0,0>translate <0,-0.2,-2>scale
> <1,0.94,1>}
>                            }
> #declare Lowermouth1 = object { Lowermouth
>     bounded_by {
>        box {
>           <-3, -0.3, -3>, <3, -3, 3>
>            }
>                }
>                                }
>
>

bounded_by is NO substitute to an intersection.
Missusing it that way will cause many problems:
Improper shadows.
Parts that are outside the bounding object are visible whenever the ray 
can encounter the bounding object. If a ray encounter the bounding 
object, it's content is tested for the entire path of that ray.

If you want to clip the object in a way that it's inside become visible, 
you can use clipped_by.

Use:
#declare Lowermouth1 = intersection{
   object { Lowermouth }
   box { <-3, -0.3, -3>, <3, -3, 3> }
}

OR
#declare Lowermouth1 = object { Lowermouth
    clipped_by {
       box {
          <-3, -0.3, -3>, <3, -3, 3>
           }
         }
     }



Alain

[Le Forgeron] Re: Object changes when translated, rotated, or ... [4559 days 18 hours and 25 minutes ago]

Fri, 1 Nov 2013 19:28:41 GMT

Le 01/11/2013 17:38, Charles nous fit lire :
> I have an object bounded by a box. it works fine except when I try and move it
> or change the camera angle and the bounding box looses it's affect.
> Is this a bug?
>  Code:
> 
> #declare Lowermouth = union{
> torus{ 0.6, 0.2 texture{Bodytex} rotate<90,0,0>translate <0,-0.2,0>}
> torus{ 0.55, 0.19 texture{Bodytex} rotate<90,0,0>translate <0,-0.2,-0.25>}
> torus{ 0.5, 0.18 texture{Bodytex} rotate<90,0,0>translate <0,-0.2,-0.5>}
> torus{ 0.45, 0.165 texture{Bodytex} rotate<90,0,0>translate <0,-0.2,-0.75>}
> torus{ 0.4, 0.15 texture{Bodytex} rotate<90,0,0>translate <0,-0.2,-1>}
> torus{ 0.35, 0.15 texture{Bodytex} rotate<90,0,0>translate <0,-0.2,-1.25>scale
> <1,0.99,1>}
> torus{ 0.29, 0.15 texture{Bodytex} rotate<90,0,0>translate <0,-0.2,-1.5>scale
> <1,0.98,1>}
> torus{ 0.22, 0.15 texture{Bodytex} rotate<90,0,0>translate <0,-0.2,-1.75>scale
> <1,0.96,1>}
> torus{ 0.15, 0.15 texture{Bodytex} rotate<90,0,0>translate <0,-0.2,-2>scale
> <1,0.94,1>}
>                           }
> #declare Lowermouth1 = object { Lowermouth
>    bounded_by {
>       box {
>          <-3, -0.3, -3>, <3, -3, 3>
>           }
>               }
>                               }
> 
> 

Bounded_by is no shortcut for proper intersection.

The Lowermouth is so far inside a box of <-0.800,-1.000,-2.150 >,
<0.800,0.600,0.200>

So your bounded_by box <-3,-0.3, -3>,<3,-3,3> is overlapping (hence
bogus). Garbage in... garbage out.

#declare fom=min_extent(Lowermouth1);
#declare fom2=max_extent(Lowermouth1);
#debug "Hello\n"
#debug concat(vstr(3,fom,",",0,3),"\n")
#debug concat(vstr(3,fom2,",",0,3),"\n")
#debug "World\n"

[Charles] Object changes when translated, rotated, or came... [4559 days 21 hours and 14 minutes ago]

Fri, 1 Nov 2013 16:40:01 GMT

I have an object bounded by a box. it works fine except when I try and move it
or change the camera angle and the bounding box looses it's affect.
Is this a bug?
 Code:

#declare Lowermouth = union{
torus{ 0.6, 0.2 texture{Bodytex} rotate<90,0,0>translate <0,-0.2,0>}
torus{ 0.55, 0.19 texture{Bodytex} rotate<90,0,0>translate <0,-0.2,-0.25>}
torus{ 0.5, 0.18 texture{Bodytex} rotate<90,0,0>translate <0,-0.2,-0.5>}
torus{ 0.45, 0.165 texture{Bodytex} rotate<90,0,0>translate <0,-0.2,-0.75>}
torus{ 0.4, 0.15 texture{Bodytex} rotate<90,0,0>translate <0,-0.2,-1>}
torus{ 0.35, 0.15 texture{Bodytex} rotate<90,0,0>translate <0,-0.2,-1.25>scale
<1,0.99,1>}
torus{ 0.29, 0.15 texture{Bodytex} rotate<90,0,0>translate <0,-0.2,-1.5>scale
<1,0.98,1>}
torus{ 0.22, 0.15 texture{Bodytex} rotate<90,0,0>translate <0,-0.2,-1.75>scale
<1,0.96,1>}
torus{ 0.15, 0.15 texture{Bodytex} rotate<90,0,0>translate <0,-0.2,-2>scale
<1,0.94,1>}
                          }
#declare Lowermouth1 = object { Lowermouth
   bounded_by {
      box {
         <-3, -0.3, -3>, <3, -3, 3>
          }
              }
                              }

[Christian Froeschlin] Re: How do I make a torch shine? [4584 days 3 hours and 11 minutes ago]

Tue, 8 Oct 2013 10:42:44 GMT

Alain wrote:

> This will turn radiosity on using default parameters. Those parameters 
> are a descent starting point.

Also there is a convenient set of presets in rad_def.inc

#include "rad_def.inc"

global_settings
{
   radiosity {Rad_Settings(Radiosity_Normal, off, off)}
}

Replace Radiosity_Normal with, e.g., Radiosity_Debug,
Radiosity_Fast or Radiosity_Final as appropriate.

[Alain] Re: How do I make a torch shine? [4585 days 18 hours and 45 minutes ago]

Sun, 6 Oct 2013 19:09:16 GMT

Le 13-10-06 05:16, TMGellert a écrit :
> Christian Froeschlin <chr### [at] chrfrde> wrote:
>> Note this newsgroup is for Windows-specific questions
>> (e.g. GUI, installation, command line parameters), you
>> might find more help in povray.newusers
>>
>>> The only problem is: How can I make a torch shine or how should I define the
>>> light source?
>>
>> some pointers:
>>
>> to make an object glow by itself in 3.6: Increase ambient in texture
>>
>> to make an object glow by itself in 3.7 RC: Increase emission in texture
>>
>> In both cases this will make the object appear bright. However,
>> it will not only illuminate its surroundings unless "radiosity" is
>> activated.  An alternative is to define a "light_source" at the position
>> where the torch should emit light. If the light source is within the
>> object you need to add "no_shadow" to the object so the light
>> can actually get out.
>
> Hm, I can't make this work. I can define the 'ambient' value but I struggle with
> the radiosity setting. How do I write this so it could work?
>
>

For a start point using radiosity, just add radiosity{} in your 
global_settings section.
This will turn radiosity on using default parameters. Those parameters 
are a descent starting point.

If the torch flame have some transparency, just adding a regular 
light_source inside ot will work, giving uneven and coloured illumination.

To get beter realism, you should use light fading. Add this:
fade_distance 1 fade_power 2

Adjust the light's intencity to get the illumination you want. There is 
no upper limit to a light's intencity.

To further improve realism, you can concider using an area_light.
The following, added to your light_source definition is a good start:
area_light 1*x 1*z 9 9 adaptive 0 circular orient
Using adaptive is importent to greatly improve the rendering time. It 
allow the use of a LOT of samples without slowing you down to much.

This make the light act like a spherical light with a diameter of 1 unit.

Example using both propositions:

light_source{
	<0,1.5,0> // the light's location
	rgb 100 // it's colour and intensity, adjusted for the fading
	fade_distance 1 fade_power 2
// physicaly acurate fading demand fade_power 2
	area_light 1*z 1*x 17 17 adaptive 0 circular orient
	}

Alain

[TMGellert] Re: Some polygons are not lit! Is that a bug? [4586 days 1 hour and 39 minutes ago]

Sun, 6 Oct 2013 12:15:00 GMT

"TMGellert" <nomail@nomail> wrote:
> I'm relatively new to POV-Ray and I'm creating a Minecraft-inspired battle
> scene.
> All objects are defined by polygons.
> So far, so good, but most of them are just not lit no matter how the light
> source is configured. I don't know why this happens.
> The polygons don't have a finish, they just have an image_map texture.
>
> Has somebody an answer?

! THREAD CLOSED ! BUG BIXED !

[Thomas de Groot] Re: Some polygons are not lit! Is that a bug? [4586 days 2 hours and 37 minutes ago]

Sun, 6 Oct 2013 11:16:48 GMT

On 6-10-2013 11:22, TMGellert wrote:
> I'm relatively new to POV-Ray and I'm creating a Minecraft-inspired battle
> scene.
> All objects are defined by polygons.
> So far, so good, but most of them are just not lit no matter how the light
> source is configured. I don't know why this happens.
> The polygons don't have a finish, they just have an image_map texture.
>
> Has somebody an answer?
>
>
It would help if you posted an image at povray.binaries.images (aka p.b.i.).

Thomas

[Stephen] Re: How do I make a torch shine? [4586 days 3 hours and 41 minutes ago]

Sun, 6 Oct 2013 10:12:53 GMT

On 06/10/2013 10:16 AM, TMGellert wrote:
> Hm, I can't make this work. I can define the 'ambient' value but I struggle with
> the radiosity setting. How do I write this so it could work?

Since you are new to Pov. If it were me, I would build your scene using 
traditional lighting, until you get the hang of it. Personally I never 
use radiosity as I've never had the good results that some people here 
have. It is a subject on its own.
To get your torch to light and show a beam. You will need to use media.
You put a hollow container around your light source (hollow is a 
keyword) and use scattering or emissive media. You will need to read up 
on that, as well. :-)

-- 
Regards
     Stephen

[TMGellert] Some polygons are not lit! Is that a bug? [4586 days 4 hours and 29 minutes ago]

Sun, 6 Oct 2013 09:25:00 GMT

I'm relatively new to POV-Ray and I'm creating a Minecraft-inspired battle
scene.
All objects are defined by polygons.
So far, so good, but most of them are just not lit no matter how the light
source is configured. I don't know why this happens.
The polygons don't have a finish, they just have an image_map texture.

Has somebody an answer?

[TMGellert] Re: How do I make a torch shine? [4586 days 4 hours and 34 minutes ago]

Sun, 6 Oct 2013 09:20:00 GMT

Christian Froeschlin <chr### [at] chrfrde> wrote:
> Note this newsgroup is for Windows-specific questions
> (e.g. GUI, installation, command line parameters), you
> might find more help in povray.newusers
>
> > The only problem is: How can I make a torch shine or how should I define the
> > light source?
>
> some pointers:
>
> to make an object glow by itself in 3.6: Increase ambient in texture
>
> to make an object glow by itself in 3.7 RC: Increase emission in texture
>
> In both cases this will make the object appear bright. However,
> it will not only illuminate its surroundings unless "radiosity" is
> activated.  An alternative is to define a "light_source" at the position
> where the torch should emit light. If the light source is within the
> object you need to add "no_shadow" to the object so the light
> can actually get out.

Hm, I can't make this work. I can define the 'ambient' value but I struggle with
the radiosity setting. How do I write this so it could work?

[Christian Froeschlin] Re: How do I make a torch shine? [4586 days 17 hours and 59 minutes ago]

Sat, 5 Oct 2013 19:55:36 GMT

Note this newsgroup is for Windows-specific questions
(e.g. GUI, installation, command line parameters), you
might find more help in povray.newusers

> The only problem is: How can I make a torch shine or how should I define the
> light source?

some pointers:

to make an object glow by itself in 3.6: Increase ambient in texture

to make an object glow by itself in 3.7 RC: Increase emission in texture

In both cases this will make the object appear bright. However,
it will not only illuminate its surroundings unless "radiosity" is
activated.  An alternative is to define a "light_source" at the position
where the torch should emit light. If the light source is within the
object you need to add "no_shadow" to the object so the light
can actually get out.

[TMGellert] How do I make a torch shine? [4586 days 19 hours and 4 minutes ago]

Sat, 5 Oct 2013 18:50:01 GMT

I'm relatively new to POV-Ray and I want to make a Minecraft-inspired cave
scene.
The only problem is: How can I make a torch shine or how should I define the
light source?
My torch is an object made of polygons, so I don't use a box or sth like that.

It would be nice to get an answer!

TMGellert

[ Here you find the POV-Ray Scene, if you need to see it in detail: ]

  // Minecraft TNT Block
  // TMGellert 05 Oct 2013

  //   I N C L U D E D   F I L E S

  #include "colors.inc"

  //   C A M E R A

  camera { location <5, 2.625, -3> look_at  <2, 1.25, 0> }

  //   S T O N E   P L A N E S

  plane { z, 0 pigment { image_map {png "stone.png" } } finish {  } rotate 90*x
}
  plane { z, 0 pigment { image_map {png "stone.png" } } finish {  } translate
z/2 }
  plane { z, 0 pigment { image_map {png "stone.png" } } finish {  } rotate -90*y
translate <-0.5, 0, 0.5> }

  //   T N T   B L O C K

  #declare TNT_Base =
   polygon{
    4, <0,0,0>, <1,0,0>, <1,1,0>, <0,1,0>
    pigment { image_map { png "tnt_bottom.png" } }
    rotate <-90,0,0>
    translate <-0.5,0,0.5>
   }

  #declare TNT_Side =
   polygon{
    4, <0,0,0>, <1,0,0>, <1,1,0>, <0,1,0>
    pigment { image_map { png "tnt_side.png" } }
    rotate <0,0,0>
    translate <-0.5,0,0.5>
   }

  #declare TNT_Top =
   polygon {
    4, <0,0,0>, <1,0,0>, <1,1,0>, <0,1,0>
    pigment { image_map { png "tnt_top.png" } }
    rotate <90,0,0>
    translate <-0.5,1,-0.5>
   }

  #declare TNT_Block = union {
   object { TNT_Base }
   object { TNT_Side                  translate <0,0,-1> }
   object { TNT_Side rotate <0,90,0>  translate <-1,0,0> }
   object { TNT_Side rotate <0,180,0> translate <0,0,1>  }
   object { TNT_Side rotate <0,270,0> translate <1,0,0>  }
   object { TNT_Top }
  }

  object { TNT_Block }

  //   T O R C H

  #declare Torch_Side =
   polygon {
    4, <47/16,0,-1/16> <49/16,0,-1/16> <49/16,5/8,-1/16> <47/16,5/8,-1/16>
    pigment { image_map { png "torch.png" } }
   }

  #declare Torch_Top =
   polygon {
    4, <47/16,1/2,-1/16> <49/16,1/2,-1/16> <49/16,5/8,-1/16> <47/16,5/8,-1/16>
    pigment { image_map { png "torch.png" } }
    rotate <90,0,0>
    translate <0,9/16,-9/16>
   }

  #declare Torch = union {
   object { Torch_Side                                     }
   object { Torch_Side rotate <0,90,0>  translate <3,0,3>  }
   object { Torch_Side rotate <0,180,0> translate <6,0,0>  }
   object { Torch_Side rotate <0,270,0> translate <3,0,-3> }
   object { Torch_Top }
  }

  object { Torch }

[Dirk Höpfner] Re: how to compile and run .pov through console [4587 days 5 hours and 13 minutes ago]

Sat, 5 Oct 2013 08:40:51 GMT

Hi,
try
"http://news.povray.org/povray.windows/thread/<web.454cc15ad579eefad80227fc0@news.povray.org>"
 and the link will do.;)

> Thanks but I had gone through the link and it's again empty ... :)
>

[Chris Cason] Re: how to compile and run .pov through console [4587 days 18 hours and 1 minute ago]

Fri, 4 Oct 2013 19:53:02 GMT

On 5/10/2013 05:47, Samuel Benge wrote:
> plagiarism! At least give us the option to keep a "session" open, so that the
> editor doesn't need to be opened/closed constantly. (Does such an option already
> exist?)

Yes, it does and IIRC always has (or at least goes back around 15 years).

It's even in the documentation ...

-- Chris

[Samuel Benge] Re: how to compile and run .pov through console [4587 days 18 hours and 4 minutes ago]

Fri, 4 Oct 2013 19:50:00 GMT

Alain <kua### [at] videotronca> wrote:
> The Windows version of POV-Ray will always display the editor. There is
> NO switch to prevent that.

I wish there was such a switch :( I'd like to render imagery using POV-Ray
directly from my own C++ programs. I do not always want the editor, and would
not want any popups. There must be /some/ other way to avoid potential
plagiarism! At least give us the option to keep a "session" open, so that the
editor doesn't need to be opened/closed constantly. (Does such an option already
exist?) Also, a way to feed a scene-file into the render engine without using a
physical ASCII file would be nice :)

Sam

[Christian Froeschlin] Re: how to compile and run .pov through console [4588 days and 22 minutes ago]

Fri, 4 Oct 2013 13:31:55 GMT

Alain wrote:

> The Windows version of POV-Ray will always display the editor. There is 
> NO switch to prevent that.

As far as I understand this is to prevent another application from
easily incorporating POV-Ray without acknowledgement or credit, while
still supporting such use.

However, presenting the full-blown GUI to some unsuspecting 3rd party
app user seems a bit like overkill (and can also be quite annoying for
pov users running batch scripts in the background). Would it be an
alternative to simply show a reduced splash screen in the Windows 
notification area (some nifty rendered image or animation, maybe
320 x 240 reading "Powered by POV-Ray rendering engine")?

[Saket] Re: how to compile and run .pov through console [4588 days 8 hours and 49 minutes ago]

Fri, 4 Oct 2013 05:05:08 GMT

Paolo Gibellini <p.g### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
> Tipically you cannot disable the GUI in the windows version.
> See
>
news.povray.org/povray.windows/thread/<web.454cc15ad579eefad80227fc0@news.povray.org>
> for example.

Hi

Thanks but I had gone through the link and it's again empty ... :)

It's really tough to consider, the post is blank from all 2006 and there isn't
any development further to achieve this.

All I need to compile and run ".pov" with concern ".ini" through Visual Studio.
How I should or can proceed ? Any hint ...

[Alain] Re: how to compile and run .pov through console [4588 days 13 hours ago]

Fri, 4 Oct 2013 00:54:17 GMT

Le 13-10-03 03:24, Saket a écrit :
> Hi all
>
> I am using Pov-Ray in Windows plateform as (Windows8).
>
> I need to compile and run my "test.pov" file through console (i.e. cmd). I had
> gone through the documentation entitled "Command Line Options" but I didn't got
> the necessary steps as :
>
> 1. To start Pov-Ray Engine from console.
> 2. To setup the requirement for rendering window (via .INI) from console.
> 3. To compile and run the ".pov" again from console application (or cmd) in
> Windows.
>
> I will be greatly thankfull to you with for the kind reply.
>
>

The .POV file is not compiled but interpreted.

 From the console or command line, you only need a line with pvengine.exe.
In this case, it's normaly followed by the .INI file that will set the 
.POV file to render and the required options, or simply with the part 
and name of the .POV file and some settings as the desired resolution 
and AA settings.

The Windows version of POV-Ray will always display the editor. There is 
NO switch to prevent that.

If you don't want the editor/GUI to be present, you should get the 
Unix/Limux version and compile it yourself.

[Paolo Gibellini] Re: how to compile and run .pov through console [4589 days 3 hours and 34 minutes ago]

Thu, 3 Oct 2013 10:20:07 GMT

>Saket  on date 03/10/2013 10.52 wrote:
> "Saket" <sak### [at] yahoocoin> wrote:
>> 1. To start Pov-Ray Engine from console.
>> 2. To setup the requirement for rendering window (via .INI) from console.
>> 3. To compile and run the ".pov" again from console application (or cmd) in
>> Windows.
>
> I had gone through the posts similar and I got to Run my test.pov from command
> line by following steps:
>
> 1. In console, go to the location of pvengine.exe as:
> C:\cd ...Pov-Ray\v3.6\bin
>
> 2. use command as:
> pvengine +I...path\test.pov +V +H240 +360
>
> Now, This is opening the complete IDE of Pov-Ray, compiling my script file i.e.
> test.pov and generating the rendering window accordingly in dimension specified
> (+H240 +W360).
>
> The problem is, I don't need to open the complete IDE or Rendering Window. All i
> need to compile and run the script-file i.e. test.pov and generate the ouput as
> texture. How I can disable the IDE.
>
>
>
>
Tipically you cannot disable the GUI in the windows version.
See 
news.povray.org/povray.windows/thread/<web.454cc15ad579eefad80227fc0@news.povray.org> 
for example.
Paolo

[Saket] Re: how to compile and run .pov through console [4589 days 4 hours and 59 minutes ago]

Thu, 3 Oct 2013 08:55:01 GMT

"Saket" <sak### [at] yahoocoin> wrote:
> 1. To start Pov-Ray Engine from console.
> 2. To setup the requirement for rendering window (via .INI) from console.
> 3. To compile and run the ".pov" again from console application (or cmd) in
> Windows.

I had gone through the posts similar and I got to Run my test.pov from command
line by following steps:

1. In console, go to the location of pvengine.exe as:
C:\cd ...Pov-Ray\v3.6\bin

2. use command as:
pvengine +I...path\test.pov +V +H240 +360

Now, This is opening the complete IDE of Pov-Ray, compiling my script file i.e.
test.pov and generating the rendering window accordingly in dimension specified
(+H240 +W360).

The problem is, I don't need to open the complete IDE or Rendering Window. All i
need to compile and run the script-file i.e. test.pov and generate the ouput as
texture. How I can disable the IDE.

[Saket] how to compile and run .pov through console [4589 days 6 hours and 29 minutes ago]

Thu, 3 Oct 2013 07:25:01 GMT

Hi all

I am using Pov-Ray in Windows plateform as (Windows8).

I need to compile and run my "test.pov" file through console (i.e. cmd). I had
gone through the documentation entitled "Command Line Options" but I didn't got
the necessary steps as :

1. To start Pov-Ray Engine from console.
2. To setup the requirement for rendering window (via .INI) from console.
3. To compile and run the ".pov" again from console application (or cmd) in
Windows.

I will be greatly thankfull to you with for the kind reply.

[Saket] how to compile and run .pov through console [4589 days 6 hours and 29 minutes ago]

Thu, 3 Oct 2013 07:25:01 GMT

Hi all

I am using Pov-Ray in Windows plateform as (Windows8).

I need to compile and run my "test.pov" file through console (i.e. cmd). I had
gone through the documentation entitled "Command Line Options" but I didn't got
the necessary steps as :

1. To start Pov-Ray Engine from console.
2. To setup the requirement for rendering window (via .INI) from console.
3. To compile and run the ".pov" again from console application (or cmd) in
Windows.

I will be greatly thankfull to you with for the kind reply.

[Saket] how to compile and run .pov through console [4589 days 6 hours and 34 minutes ago]

Thu, 3 Oct 2013 07:20:01 GMT

Hi all

I am using Pov-Ray in Windows plateform as (Windows8).

I need to compile and run my "test.pov" file through console (i.e. cmd). I had
gone through the documentation entitled "Command Line Options" but I didn't got
the necessary steps as :

1. To start Pov-Ray Engine from console.
2. To setup the requirement for rendering window (via .INI) from console.
3. To compile and run the ".pov" again from console application (or cmd) in
Windows.

I will be greatly thankfull to you with for the kind reply.

[Le Forgeron] Re: ah, to dream [4610 days 18 hours and 19 minutes ago]

Wed, 11 Sep 2013 19:35:04 GMT

Le 11/09/2013 00:31, galenwolfe nous fit lire :
> I forgot to add:
> 
> how do I find the new circumference created by the initial row of threads? Thus
> allowing me to continue the thread 'weaving' d # of times?
> 

From looking at
> http://www.wikihow.com/Make-a-Dreamcatcher

it seems that, starting with a 8 attach points, the thread go from N to
N+2 until it cross the line of N-1 to N+1 at which point it goes to N+1.

8 regular points on a circle are every pi/4 (or 45Â°). Going from N to
N+2, the line is also at 45Â° and stop after pi/8 from the center.

Therefore, the ratio between external radius and internal radius (for
the next iteration, turned by pi/8 (22.5Â°)) is 1:sqrt(10)/4

(distance from center of inflexion point is sqrt( (sqrt(2)/2)^2 +
(sqrt(2)/4)^2), angle is pi/8+k*pi/4, when the external points are at 1
at angle of k*pi/4 )

(ratio, aka scale factor for povray, is about 1 to 0.79056941504209483299 )

[Samuel Benge] Re: ah, to dream [4610 days 20 hours and 19 minutes ago]

Wed, 11 Sep 2013 17:35:01 GMT

"galenwolfe" <gal### [at] yahoocom> wrote:
> I forgot to add:
>
> how do I find the new circumference created by the initial row of threads? Thus
> allowing me to continue the thread 'weaving' d # of times?

I'm not going to answer your questions directly (yet), but here is the 'motor'
behind many radial operations in programming:

#declare Rot = 30; // degrees
#declare Rad = 1; // radius

// point of rotation 'Rot' with radius 'Rad' along the x-y plane
#declare RotatedPt =
  Rad*<
   sin(pi*2/360*Rot),
   cos(pi*2/360*Rot),
   0
  >;

Or, you could do it this way:

#declare RotatedPt = vrotate(y*Rad, -z*Rot);

Connecting two points amounts to just making two different points in this
manner!

Does this help?

Sam

[galenwolfe] Re: ah, to dream [4611 days 15 hours and 19 minutes ago]

Tue, 10 Sep 2013 22:35:01 GMT

I forgot to add:

how do I find the new circumference created by the initial row of threads? Thus
allowing me to continue the thread 'weaving' d # of times?

[galenwolfe] ah, to dream [4611 days 15 hours and 29 minutes ago]

Tue, 10 Sep 2013 22:25:01 GMT

One of the few tasks I've set myself in order to stay sane is to get back into
using POV-Ray and not dumping for one of the visual based programs. On that
front, one of the first things I want to do is make a dream catcher that I can
plug simple numbers in as variables and the coding does all the rest of the
work.

So, you set Diameter as the diameter of the hoop (the first part of torus
descriptor) and Thick as the thickness of the hoop (variable 2 of the Torus
descriptor). Automatically you can set the starting point of the thread (Start)
as Diameter-(Thick/2) (as i understand it, the 2nd variable of a torus sets the
total diameter of the cylinder used in making the torus, so finding the inside
edge is half that).

Now, to the hard stuff as I was never more then a geometry kid in high school.

1) I figure telling the computer that the length of each initial cylinder
'thread' is 1/nth (where n = the # of times you wrap the thread around the hoop
that establishes the first part of the weave) the circumference of the inside of
the torus {3.141593*[(r-thickness of hoop)squared]} or (3.141593 * Thick)/n. (if
I'm wrong correct me)

2)How do I tell POV-Ray to draw the Thread from the starting point to the proper
place along the inside of the Hoop without having to manually type in the
coordinates? I mean I understand I know how far the thread with stretch, but I
can't get my head to wrap around telling POV how to find that point. In the real
world I would use a ruler to measure to that point, but what 'ruler' do I get
POV to use?

[LanuHum] Re: How kill IDLE using command line? [4621 days 18 hours and 24 minutes ago]

Sat, 31 Aug 2013 19:30:01 GMT

Chris Cason <del### [at] deletethistoopovrayorg> wrote:

>
> Not a bug, it is working as documented in the manual.
>
>   http://wiki.povray.org/content/Documentation:Windows_Section_3
>
> See the above for how to make it exit.
>
> -- Chris

Thanks, I found an option in GUI!
Render\On completion\Exit Povray for Windows
Gui close after render!
Very,very good! :)

[Chris Cason] Re: How kill IDLE using command line? [4621 days 19 hours and 26 minutes ago]

Sat, 31 Aug 2013 18:28:36 GMT

On 31/08/2013 21:08, LanuHum wrote:
> How automatically close IDLE window after rendering ???
> Open OS Windows - 100000 problem add :)
> -d this is not that. -d - not open render window, but subprocess.wait() closing
> IDLE.
> Why opens if the command line is used?
> It is very serious bug :)

Not a bug, it is working as documented in the manual.

  http://wiki.povray.org/content/Documentation:Windows_Section_3

See the above for how to make it exit.

-- Chris

[Chris Cason] Re: How kill IDLE using command line? [4621 days 19 hours and 42 minutes ago]

Sat, 31 Aug 2013 18:12:03 GMT

On 1/09/2013 04:00, Le_Forgeron wrote:
> (Or did the 3.7 windows version get a removed /EXIT ?)

no, it is still there and works as it did in the past.

-- Chris

[Le Forgeron] Re: How kill IDLE using command line? [4621 days 19 hours and 53 minutes ago]

Sat, 31 Aug 2013 18:00:58 GMT

Le 31/08/2013 18:55, LanuHum nous fit lire :
> clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
>> Am 31.08.2013 13:08, schrieb LanuHum:
>>> How automatically close IDLE window after rendering ???
>>> Open OS Windows - 100000 problem add :)
>>> -d this is not that. -d - not open render window, but subprocess.wait() closing
>>> IDLE.
>>> Why opens if the command line is used?
>>> It is very serious bug :)
>>
>> AFAIK It's currently not possible to automatically close POV-Ray for
>> Windows after rendering; however, if you have thousands of images to
>> render (and for some reason can't make use of the animation feature),
>> you can avoid that many windows to open by using POV-Ray's "keep single
>> instance" option.
>>
>> As long as all the images have the same resolution, I'd suggest trying
>> to use the animation feature though.
> 
> I use povray also for texture preview.
> Look:
> http://yadi.sk/d/2dGKINsP8XpWI
> In Linux - very good option -d. Process in shadow. Press button "update
> preview", wait 3-5 s, image 256x256 automatically opens in small preview
> viewport in Blender
> In Windows: Press button "update preview", public open IDLE, user press quit
> IDLE, only then image 256x256 automatically opens in small preview viewport in
> Blender.Inconveniently, ugly, roughly, not on the feng-shui(geomantic (omen))
> 
> 
It seems someone need a /EXIT on the command line so that *Blender*
behave the same way on Linux and Windows.

At least that information of context is coming only after 3 messages.

(Or did the 3.7 windows version get a removed /EXIT ?)

[LanuHum] Re: How kill IDLE using command line? [4621 days 20 hours and 54 minutes ago]

Sat, 31 Aug 2013 17:00:01 GMT

clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
> Am 31.08.2013 13:08, schrieb LanuHum:
> > How automatically close IDLE window after rendering ???
> > Open OS Windows - 100000 problem add :)
> > -d this is not that. -d - not open render window, but subprocess.wait() closing
> > IDLE.
> > Why opens if the command line is used?
> > It is very serious bug :)
>
> AFAIK It's currently not possible to automatically close POV-Ray for
> Windows after rendering; however, if you have thousands of images to
> render (and for some reason can't make use of the animation feature),
> you can avoid that many windows to open by using POV-Ray's "keep single
> instance" option.
>
> As long as all the images have the same resolution, I'd suggest trying
> to use the animation feature though.

I use povray also for texture preview.
Look:
http://yadi.sk/d/2dGKINsP8XpWI
In Linux - very good option -d. Process in shadow. Press button "update
preview", wait 3-5 s, image 256x256 automatically opens in small preview
viewport in Blender
In Windows: Press button "update preview", public open IDLE, user press quit
IDLE, only then image 256x256 automatically opens in small preview viewport in
Blender.Inconveniently, ugly, roughly, not on the feng-shui(geomantic (omen))

[clipka] Re: How kill IDLE using command line? [4621 days 23 hours and 12 minutes ago]

Sat, 31 Aug 2013 14:42:36 GMT

Am 31.08.2013 13:08, schrieb LanuHum:
> How automatically close IDLE window after rendering ???
> Open OS Windows - 100000 problem add :)
> -d this is not that. -d - not open render window, but subprocess.wait() closing
> IDLE.
> Why opens if the command line is used?
> It is very serious bug :)

AFAIK It's currently not possible to automatically close POV-Ray for 
Windows after rendering; however, if you have thousands of images to 
render (and for some reason can't make use of the animation feature), 
you can avoid that many windows to open by using POV-Ray's "keep single 
instance" option.

As long as all the images have the same resolution, I'd suggest trying 
to use the animation feature though.

[LanuHum] How kill IDLE using command line? [4622 days 2 hours and 44 minutes ago]

Sat, 31 Aug 2013 11:10:01 GMT

How automatically close IDLE window after rendering ???
Open OS Windows - 100000 problem add :)
-d this is not that. -d - not open render window, but subprocess.wait() closing
IDLE.
Why opens if the command line is used?
It is very serious bug :)

[Chris Cason] Testing updated windows editor DLL's [4627 days 1 hour and 34 minutes ago]

Mon, 26 Aug 2013 12:20:15 GMT

Guys,

I'd appreciate it if some of you could bang on some test DLL's I've
built for the editor portion of POVWIN.

These are functionally identical to the ones distributed with RC7.
However I have modified the way they are compiled and want to ensure
that this has not introduced any issues in the release version.

The files are located at http://www.povray.org/temp/editor-test.zip.
There are six DLL's included (two for each pvengine binary). To use
them, back up or rename the existing DLL's in the bin directory of
your RC7 install, then just drop the new DLL's in place.

Initial tests here show basic functionality works, but I haven't had
the chance to go through and test everything: basically the editor
needs to be used with every single option being toggled and checked
for correct operation.

Once these are tested and found to be OK I'll be in a position to
build a test of the POVWIN 3.7 release.

Volunteers? :-)

-- Chris

[Stephen] Re: Rendering 20500 POV Files [4639 days 17 hours and 56 minutes ago]

Tue, 13 Aug 2013 19:58:07 GMT

On 13/08/2013 8:04 PM, Peter wrote:
> Hi Stephen,
>
>     After running through the simulations this way I discovered that with this
> set up the first frame is just rendered 20501 times under sequential filenames.
> For example it doesn't seem to load animate_00001.pov after finishing
> animate_00000.pov, it just outputs animate_00000.bmp (from the first render) and
> animate_00001.bmp (as the "second frame").. however both images are identical.
> If I render 00000 and 00001 using the individual pov files (not using the
> animation option in an ini file) the rendered BMPs are different (as they should
> be).
>
> Thoughts?
>

My first though is take more water with it. (Speaking personally, of 
course :-) )

Make sure that you are using frame_number, not clock. (Less calculations 
for you.)

Find out what is happening by using #debug.
Output your frame_number, the called include file and the object, in the 
include file.
Maybe add a #debug "This is Include NNN \n" to the first few files to 
make sure that they are being called by your master file.

 From there we start fault finding.

-- 
Regards
     Stephen

[Peter] Re: Rendering 20500 POV Files [4639 days 18 hours and 49 minutes ago]

Tue, 13 Aug 2013 19:05:01 GMT

Hi Stephen,

   After running through the simulations this way I discovered that with this
set up the first frame is just rendered 20501 times under sequential filenames.
For example it doesn't seem to load animate_00001.pov after finishing
animate_00000.pov, it just outputs animate_00000.bmp (from the first render) and
animate_00001.bmp (as the "second frame").. however both images are identical.
If I render 00000 and 00001 using the individual pov files (not using the
animation option in an ini file) the rendered BMPs are different (as they should
be).

Thoughts?

Peter

P.S. - For now, I've gone back to my batch file, but it takes much longer as it
(one at a time) opens the pov file, renders it, closes pov-ray, opens the next
pov file, renders it, closes the window, etc ,etc.

Stephen <mca### [at] aolcom> wrote:
> On 26/07/2013 8:51 PM, Peter wrote:
> > I'll update my file and give it a try. I have gotten a batch file working, but
> > the way its set up right now I have POV ray opening, rendering a scene (~1.7
> > seconds) and closing... then repeating over and over and over again.... besides
> > the risk of epileptic seizure, it would obviously be faster to either keep one
> > POV ray open and one after another pass the 20501 files through to be rendered
> > or to have pov-ray start minimized... at least that way the render time would be
> > decreased and I wouldn't have windows flashing every 1-2 seconds!
>
>
> There is a better way than running the files sequentially. You can use
> the animation feature. Here is a snipit of code from an ini file.
>
> Input_File_Name = animate_.pov
> Output_File_Name = animate_
> Initial_Frame = 0
> Final_Frame = 999999
> Subset_Start_Frame = 0
> Subset_End_Frame = 20501
>
>   /* I like to use an underscore between the name and the numbers for
> readability. */
>
>
> "Input_File_Name" calls your PovRay master file (which #includes your
> series of pov files"
>
> "Output_File_Name" is the base name of the rendered files.
>
> "Initial_Frame": Your start frame number. (Keep it 0)
>
> "Final_Frame" : Any number bigger than your largest frame number.
>
> "Subset_Start_Frame": Where you want to start rendering from.
>
> "Subset_End_Frame": Where you want to stop rendering.
>
> You don't need to use an ini file. You can use command line options.
>
> This method works for me.
>
> --
> Regards
>      Stephen

[Alain] Re: Rendering 20500 POV Files [4654 days 13 hours and 31 minutes ago]

Tue, 30 Jul 2013 00:23:23 GMT

Le 13-07-29 11:29, Peter a écrit :
> Stephen, (sorry I refereed to you as Alain last post...  misread the post in my
> haste earlier!).
>
> Your suggestion works great with these changes:
>   Input_File_Name = animate_00000.pov
>   Output_File_Name = animate_00000.bmp
>   Initial_Frame = 0
>   Final_Frame = 999999
>   Subset_Start_Frame = 0
>   Subset_End_Frame = 20501
>
> However, the output files aren't (for example) animate_00000.bmp its
> animate_0000000.bmp... seems to be adding zeros to the front (2 I think a I just
> did a test with 10 files... I'm guessing if I set it up for the entire
> simulation it will add 5 zeros). Is there someway to have it not add padding
> zeros (as they are not needed since the input files are already labelled
> accordingly).
>
> Thanks again for your help,
>
> Peter
>
>

The number of digit is imposed by the value of final_frame. If it have 6 
digits, then the files names will end with 6 digits.

Normaly, I never set final_frame to a large and use a subset. Only 
setting the final_frame value normaly works very well.

Simply using +kff20500 or +kff20501 on the command line start the 
animation for the desired number of frames.

BMPs are huge for nothing as they are not compressed in any way. It's 
highly recomended to set the output format to PNG. Use +fn in an ini 
file or the command line, or way beter, upgrade to version 3.7RC whitch 
default to PNG on all platforms.


Alain

[Stephen] Re: Rendering 20500 POV Files [4654 days 21 hours and 49 minutes ago]

Mon, 29 Jul 2013 16:05:10 GMT

On 29/07/2013 4:29 PM, Peter wrote:
> Stephen, (sorry I refereed to you as Alain last post...  misread the post in my
> haste earlier!).
>

Not the worst thing that I have been called. ;-)

> Your suggestion works great with these changes:
>   Input_File_Name = animate_00000.pov
>   Output_File_Name = animate_00000.bmp
>   Initial_Frame = 0
>   Final_Frame = 999999
>   Subset_Start_Frame = 0
>   Subset_End_Frame = 20501
>
> However, the output files aren't (for example) animate_00000.bmp its
> animate_0000000.bmp... seems to be adding zeros to the front (2 I think a I just
> did a test with 10 files... I'm guessing if I set it up for the entire
> simulation it will add 5 zeros). Is there someway to have it not add padding
> zeros (as they are not needed since the input files are already labelled
> accordingly).
>

The only way that I know of is to reduce the number of digits in 
Final_Frame.
I would be more concerned about using BMP files with the number of 
frames that you are using. BMPs are uncompressed and you will eat a lot 
of HDD space. Why not try PNGs?
Output_File_Type = N

And don't forget to use Continue_Trace=1
In case your machine crashes or you stop the render partway through the 
animation.

> Thanks again for your help,

Only too pleased to pay back some of the help I've had over the years. :-D
-- 
Regards
     Stephen

[Peter] Re: Rendering 20500 POV Files [4654 days 22 hours and 14 minutes ago]

Mon, 29 Jul 2013 15:40:02 GMT

Stephen, (sorry I refereed to you as Alain last post...  misread the post in my
haste earlier!).

Your suggestion works great with these changes:
 Input_File_Name = animate_00000.pov
 Output_File_Name = animate_00000.bmp
 Initial_Frame = 0
 Final_Frame = 999999
 Subset_Start_Frame = 0
 Subset_End_Frame = 20501

However, the output files aren't (for example) animate_00000.bmp its
animate_0000000.bmp... seems to be adding zeros to the front (2 I think a I just
did a test with 10 files... I'm guessing if I set it up for the entire
simulation it will add 5 zeros). Is there someway to have it not add padding
zeros (as they are not needed since the input files are already labelled
accordingly).

Thanks again for your help,

Peter



Stephen <mca### [at] aolcom> wrote:
> On 26/07/2013 8:51 PM, Peter wrote:
> > I'll update my file and give it a try. I have gotten a batch file working, but
> > the way its set up right now I have POV ray opening, rendering a scene (~1.7
> > seconds) and closing... then repeating over and over and over again.... besides
> > the risk of epileptic seizure, it would obviously be faster to either keep one
> > POV ray open and one after another pass the 20501 files through to be rendered
> > or to have pov-ray start minimized... at least that way the render time would be
> > decreased and I wouldn't have windows flashing every 1-2 seconds!
>
>
> There is a better way than running the files sequentially. You can use
> the animation feature. Here is a snipit of code from an ini file.
>
> Input_File_Name = animate_.pov
> Output_File_Name = animate_
> Initial_Frame = 0
> Final_Frame = 999999
> Subset_Start_Frame = 0
> Subset_End_Frame = 20501
>
>   /* I like to use an underscore between the name and the numbers for
> readability. */
>
>
> "Input_File_Name" calls your PovRay master file (which #includes your
> series of pov files"
>
> "Output_File_Name" is the base name of the rendered files.
>
> "Initial_Frame": Your start frame number. (Keep it 0)
>
> "Final_Frame" : Any number bigger than your largest frame number.
>
> "Subset_Start_Frame": Where you want to start rendering from.
>
> "Subset_End_Frame": Where you want to stop rendering.
>
> You don't need to use an ini file. You can use command line options.
>
> This method works for me.
>
> --
> Regards
>      Stephen

[Peter] Re: Starting POV-Ray Miniized - POV-Ray 3.6 Wind... [4654 days 22 hours and 14 minutes ago]

Mon, 29 Jul 2013 15:40:01 GMT

Alain,

  I have done the -d option in my batch file method as it is closing a starting
a new POV-Ray window for eatch POV file to be rendered. However, I am trying the
animation feature now (your second suggestion in my other post).

Thans for all of your help (in this and other post)

Peter

Alain <kua### [at] videotronca> wrote:
> Le 13-07-26 14:29, Peter a écrit :
> > Hi, I am running a sequence of pov files from the command line using a batch
> > file and I'm trying to determine if there is a way to get pov-ray to start
> > minimized (or even better in the system tray). Looking for either a command line
> > argument or switch OR a way to specify this in the ini file. Things work fine as
> > they are, but with each frame only taking a few seconds to render I have windows
> > opening and closing like crazy and since the animation is 20500 frames (and I
> > have 16 animations!) I was looking for an easy way to start minimized (to avoid
> > the constantly popping up windows).
> >
> > Thanks in advance,
> >
> > Peter
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> Render with the -d option. This will suppress the render window for the
> entire animation.
> Now, simply start your animation and minimise the main window.
>
> Not that you won't be able to make the render window visible to check
> the progress. You'll need to use any external image viewer.
>
>
>
> Alain

[Alain] Re: Starting POV-Ray Miniized - POV-Ray 3.6 Wind... [4655 days 16 hours and 47 minutes ago]

Sun, 28 Jul 2013 21:07:23 GMT

Le 13-07-26 14:29, Peter a écrit :
> Hi, I am running a sequence of pov files from the command line using a batch
> file and I'm trying to determine if there is a way to get pov-ray to start
> minimized (or even better in the system tray). Looking for either a command line
> argument or switch OR a way to specify this in the ini file. Things work fine as
> they are, but with each frame only taking a few seconds to render I have windows
> opening and closing like crazy and since the animation is 20500 frames (and I
> have 16 animations!) I was looking for an easy way to start minimized (to avoid
> the constantly popping up windows).
>
> Thanks in advance,
>
> Peter
>
>
>
>

Render with the -d option. This will suppress the render window for the 
entire animation.
Now, simply start your animation and minimise the main window.

Not that you won't be able to make the render window visible to check 
the progress. You'll need to use any external image viewer.



Alain

[Stephen] Re: Rendering 20500 POV Files [4657 days 16 hours and 32 minutes ago]

Fri, 26 Jul 2013 21:21:48 GMT

On 26/07/2013 8:51 PM, Peter wrote:
> I'll update my file and give it a try. I have gotten a batch file working, but
> the way its set up right now I have POV ray opening, rendering a scene (~1.7
> seconds) and closing... then repeating over and over and over again.... besides
> the risk of epileptic seizure, it would obviously be faster to either keep one
> POV ray open and one after another pass the 20501 files through to be rendered
> or to have pov-ray start minimized... at least that way the render time would be
> decreased and I wouldn't have windows flashing every 1-2 seconds!

There is a better way than running the files sequentially. You can use 
the animation feature. Here is a snipit of code from an ini file.

Input_File_Name = animate_.pov
Output_File_Name = animate_
Initial_Frame = 0
Final_Frame = 999999
Subset_Start_Frame = 0
Subset_End_Frame = 20501

  /* I like to use an underscore between the name and the numbers for 
readability. */

"Input_File_Name" calls your PovRay master file (which #includes your 
series of pov files"

"Output_File_Name" is the base name of the rendered files.

"Initial_Frame": Your start frame number. (Keep it 0)

"Final_Frame" : Any number bigger than your largest frame number.

"Subset_Start_Frame": Where you want to start rendering from.

"Subset_End_Frame": Where you want to stop rendering.

You don't need to use an ini file. You can use command line options.

This method works for me.

-- 
Regards
     Stephen

[Stephen] Re: Rendering 20500 POV Files [4657 days 16 hours and 53 minutes ago]

Fri, 26 Jul 2013 21:01:13 GMT

On 26/07/2013 8:57 PM, Peter wrote:
> I
> didn't make that stupid mistake, but I realized once I saw your code Chain02G2Y_
> (with the _ that my filenames are actually animate.XXXXX.pov not
> animateXXXXX.pov!! seems to work now!!

Don't ask me how many times I've made that mistake. :-)

I generally use a #debug to print to screen what the code is writing. 
Good for catching spaces as well.

-- 
Regards
     Stephen

[Peter] Re: Rendering 20500 POV Files [4657 days 17 hours and 54 minutes ago]

Fri, 26 Jul 2013 20:00:01 GMT

Stephen <mca### [at] aolcom> wrote:
> On 26/07/2013 7:25 PM, Peter wrote:
> > However, when I run from the command line, nothing happens. When I run it using
> > the GUI I get an error "Parse Error: Cannot open animate00000.pov" .
>
> A silly question but are your files in the same directory as the master
> file?
>
> This is an example that works for me.
>
> #include concat("f:\\Graphics\\B3D
>
Data\\Scenes\\Earth_Inside\\Chain02G1\\Chain02G2Y_",str(mod(frame_number,89),-4,0),".pov")
>
>
> --
> Regards
>      Stephen

So... you were right to ask about the files being int he same directory... I
didn't make that stupid mistake, but I realized once I saw your code Chain02G2Y_
(with the _ that my filenames are actually animate.XXXXX.pov not
animateXXXXX.pov!! seems to work now!!

Thanks for all of your help everyone!!

[Peter] Re: Rendering 20500 POV Files [4657 days 17 hours and 59 minutes ago]

Fri, 26 Jul 2013 19:55:00 GMT

Stephen <mca### [at] aolcom> wrote:
> On 26/07/2013 7:25 PM, Peter wrote:
> > However, when I run from the command line, nothing happens. When I run it using
> > the GUI I get an error "Parse Error: Cannot open animate00000.pov" .
>
> A silly question but are your files in the same directory as the master
> file?

Yes.. they are in the same directory... but I suppose you had to ask that!! :P

> This is an example that works for me.
>
> #include concat("f:\\Graphics\\B3D
>
Data\\Scenes\\Earth_Inside\\Chain02G1\\Chain02G2Y_",str(mod(frame_number,89),-4,0),".pov")
>
>
> --
> Regards
>      Stephen

I'll update my file and give it a try. I have gotten a batch file working, but
the way its set up right now I have POV ray opening, rendering a scene (~1.7
seconds) and closing... then repeating over and over and over again.... besides
the risk of epileptic seizure, it would obviously be faster to either keep one
POV ray open and one after another pass the 20501 files through to be rendered
or to have pov-ray start minimized... at least that way the render time would be
decreased and I wouldn't have windows flashing every 1-2 seconds!

[Stephen] Re: Rendering 20500 POV Files [4657 days 18 hours and 22 minutes ago]

Fri, 26 Jul 2013 19:31:54 GMT

On 26/07/2013 7:25 PM, Peter wrote:
> However, when I run from the command line, nothing happens. When I run it using
> the GUI I get an error "Parse Error: Cannot open animate00000.pov" .

A silly question but are your files in the same directory as the master 
file?

This is an example that works for me.

#include concat("f:\\Graphics\\B3D 
Data\\Scenes\\Earth_Inside\\Chain02G1\\Chain02G2Y_",str(mod(frame_number,89),-4,0),".pov")


-- 
Regards
     Stephen

[Peter] Starting POV-Ray Miniized - POV-Ray 3.6 Windows ... [4657 days 19 hours and 24 minutes ago]

Fri, 26 Jul 2013 18:30:01 GMT

Hi, I am running a sequence of pov files from the command line using a batch
file and I'm trying to determine if there is a way to get pov-ray to start
minimized (or even better in the system tray). Looking for either a command line
argument or switch OR a way to specify this in the ini file. Things work fine as
they are, but with each frame only taking a few seconds to render I have windows
opening and closing like crazy and since the animation is 20500 frames (and I
have 16 animations!) I was looking for an easy way to start minimized (to avoid
the constantly popping up windows).

Thanks in advance,

Peter

[Peter] Re: Rendering 20500 POV Files [4657 days 19 hours and 24 minutes ago]

Fri, 26 Jul 2013 18:30:00 GMT

Alain <kua### [at] videotronca> wrote:

> Are your source files ending in sequential numbers?

Yes... they are animate00000.pov - animate20500.pov

> If so, you can use the internal animation feature to render all your
> frames within a single sequence.
>
> You can have a main .POV file that will #include the relevent data
> according to the frame_number value using some string manipulations. The
> concat(...) and str(...) string functions will greatly help construct
> the needed files names.
>
> #declare IN_File = concat("Mole",str(frame_number, -5, 0), ".inc")
> #include IN_File
>
> The "-5" in str mean zero-pading of the value to 5 digits.
> The "0" means zero decimal places.
>
> And start the render with +kff 20500 on the command line.
>
> This assume that your molecule are described in files names "Molexxxxx.inx".
> Change the name as needed.
>
> You can include files with any extention as long as they are writen
> using the correct POV syntaxe.

I have created a POV file with this as its contents (based on your suggestions
above):
#declare IN_File = concat("animate",str(frame_number, -5, 0), ".pov")
#include IN_File

However, when I run from the command line, nothing happens. When I run it using
the GUI I get an error "Parse Error: Cannot open animate00000.pov" .

This would suggest (to me at least) that the animate00000.pov is not readable,
however, I know this isn't the case since I have rendered many of the files
individually and using the queue (and a batch file) and they are fine.

Am i missing something?

Peter

[Alain] Re: Rendering 20500 POV Files [4658 days 12 hours and 38 minutes ago]

Fri, 26 Jul 2013 01:16:24 GMT

Le 13-07-25 16:04, Peter a écrit :
> Hi,
>
>    I have 20500 frames written from a molecular dynamics simulation. Is there
> anyway to easily render these is batch (I believe the queue will only allow 512
> files at the moment). Other than staying up all night and re-filling the queue
> when it empties, the only way I can think to do this currently would be to load
> up
> 40 instances of POV ray... each with a full queue and start them
> simultaneously!... guessing that's not the best option!
>
> Any suggestions?
>
> Thanks in advance,
>
> Peter
>
>
>

Are your source files ending in sequential numbers?

If so, you can use the internal animation feature to render all your 
frames within a single sequence.

You can have a main .POV file that will #include the relevent data 
according to the frame_number value using some string manipulations. The 
concat(...) and str(...) string functions will greatly help construct 
the needed files names.

#declare IN_File = concat("Mole",str(frame_number, -5, 0), ".inc")
#include IN_File

The "-5" in str mean zero-pading of the value to 5 digits.
The "0" means zero decimal places.

And start the render with +kff 20500 on the command line.

This assume that your molecule are described in files names "Molexxxxx.inx".
Change the name as needed.

You can include files with any extention as long as they are writen 
using the correct POV syntaxe.




Alain

[Peter] Re: Rendering 20500 POV Files [4658 days 15 hours and 14 minutes ago]

Thu, 25 Jul 2013 22:40:01 GMT

"B. Gimeno" <nomail@nomail> wrote:
>  Write a bat file that you can run from cmd.exe

Been a while since I've had to use them... didn't even think of using that..
I'll give that a try!

Thanks.

peter

[B Gimeno] Re: Rendering 20500 POV Files [4658 days 16 hours and 29 minutes ago]

Thu, 25 Jul 2013 21:25:00 GMT

"Peter" <mur### [at] gmailcom> wrote:

>
> Any suggestions?
>
> Thanks in advance,
>
> Peter

 Write a bat file that you can run from cmd.exe

Use an external text editor or write a macro in povray to generate it as a ascii
text file

B.Gimeno

[Peter] Rendering 20500 POV Files [4658 days 17 hours and 49 minutes ago]

Thu, 25 Jul 2013 20:05:01 GMT

Hi,

  I have 20500 frames written from a molecular dynamics simulation. Is there
anyway to easily render these is batch (I believe the queue will only allow 512
files at the moment). Other than staying up all night and re-filling the queue
when it empties, the only way I can think to do this currently would be to load
up
40 instances of POV ray... each with a full queue and start them
simultaneously!... guessing that's not the best option!

Any suggestions?

Thanks in advance,

Peter

[Kenneth] Re: Output_File_Name -- quoted string question [4731 days 1 hour and 34 minutes ago]

Tue, 14 May 2013 12:20:01 GMT

clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
> Am 12.05.2013 18:26, schrieb Kenneth:

>
> ...Nowadays, Windows - and
> most Windows programs, including POV-Ray - also accept Unix-style
> forward slashes in path names. So the following should work perfectly
> fine without messing up the way the rest of the file is shown:
>
> Output_File_Name = "c:/Documents and Settings/Owner/My
> Documents/POV-Ray/v3.6/tests/"
>

Hmm. My results with this in Windows XP are interesting and weird: It *does*
eliminate the 'unending string quote' appearance in the INI file; but it
produces a fatal error, "File Init Error: Cannot open output file."

(I double-checked to see if I had made any errors with my syntax.)

Perhaps it works with *later* Windows editions(?)

[Thomas de Groot] Re: Output_File_Name -- quoted string question [4731 days 7 hours and 6 minutes ago]

Tue, 14 May 2013 06:48:22 GMT

On 13-5-2013 20:03, clipka wrote:

> Or, actually, it would have done so in the past. Nowadays, Windows - and
> most Windows programs, including POV-Ray - also accept Unix-style
> forward slashes in path names. So the following should work perfectly
> fine without messing up the way the rest of the file is shown:
>
> Output_File_Name = "c:/Documents and Settings/Owner/My
> Documents/POV-Ray/v3.6/tests/"
>
> You can also mix both styles.
>

Good to know. One is never too old to learn new tricks ;-)

Thomas

[clipka] Re: Output_File_Name -- quoted string question [4731 days 19 hours and 51 minutes ago]

Mon, 13 May 2013 18:03:23 GMT

Am 12.05.2013 18:26, schrieb Kenneth:
> Thomas de Groot <tho### [at] degrootorg> wrote:
>> On 12-5-2013 14:16, Kenneth wrote:
>> In my own povray.ini file, I write these things between quotes:
>>
>> Output_File_Name = "c:\Documents and Settings\Owner\My
>> Documents\POV-Ray\v3.6\tests\"
>>
>
> Hey, this works!
>
> I'm embarrassed to say that I tried this earlier...but I didn't run
> an actual render to see what would happen!!  :-/  The reason being, that all of
> the text in my quickres file that *followed* this line then took on the
> appearance of being in string notation--like one *long* string, all the way to
> the end of the file. (Rather hard to describe.) So I didn't pursue it, thinking
> I had made a mistake.
>
> That behavior is rather odd, to say the least--although it doesn't affect the
> operation of the code.

The reason is the trailing backslash: In POV-Ray's scene description 
language (and many other languages), the backslash serves as an "escape 
character" that changes the meaning of the following character(s); if it 
precedes a double quote, this double quote is taken as part of the 
string rather than the end of it.

This is not the case in INI files, because it would make specifying 
Windows path names a pain.

Or, actually, it would have done so in the past. Nowadays, Windows - and 
most Windows programs, including POV-Ray - also accept Unix-style 
forward slashes in path names. So the following should work perfectly 
fine without messing up the way the rest of the file is shown:

Output_File_Name = "c:/Documents and Settings/Owner/My 
Documents/POV-Ray/v3.6/tests/"

You can also mix both styles.

[Thomas de Groot] Re: Output_File_Name -- quoted string question [4732 days 6 hours and 40 minutes ago]

Mon, 13 May 2013 07:14:36 GMT

On 13-5-2013 2:50, Alain wrote:
> The back slash is the escape character in strings. For example, "\n" is
> used as a new line character, if you have \Skies\Pano,
> it get parsed as "\s" "kies" "\p" "ano"
> \s stand for the control character DC3 and \p for DLE
>

Ah yes, of course. Forgot about the rationale of character strings, 
while using them all the time ;-)

Thomas

[Kenneth] Re: Output_File_Name -- quoted string question [4732 days 11 hours and 34 minutes ago]

Mon, 13 May 2013 02:20:01 GMT

BTW, the thing that prompted me to try and solve my original problem was a
subtle difference in behavior between v3.62 and 3.7RC7. In 3.62, the "unquoted
string" error message was benign--just showing up in the message stream, if I
cared to look for it. In 3.7, though, POV-Ray actively switches attention from
the scene file to the quickres.ini file, pointing out the location of the error.

I'm not sure which method of behavior I like better. I suppose 3.7 is doing the
'right thing' by drawing attention to the error; but it can't be so easily
ignored this way, if I *wanted* to ignore it.

[Kenneth] Re: Output_File_Name -- quoted string question [4732 days 12 hours and 4 minutes ago]

Mon, 13 May 2013 01:50:01 GMT

"Kenneth" <kdw### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
> Stephen <mca### [at] aolcom> wrote:
>
> >
> > Try
> >
> > Output_File_Name="c:\\Documents and Settings\\Owner\\My
> > Documents\\POV-Ray\\v3.6\\tests\\"
>
> This actually works even better; the double slashes eliminate the 'unending
> string' behavior that the single slashes produce. Using this particular syntax
> never occurred to me, though; the docs don't mention it.
>

Hmm, I see now that the docs do mention something very similar to this (in the
'String Literals' section), but in a different context; it wasn't enough of a
clue for me to expand on it successfully, though.

Strings are mighty strange creatures, IMO, and I'm always learning something new
about their use.

While I was trying to solve my problem, I tried this version of the code as well
(based solely on a sentence in the docs, "if you need to specify a quote mark in
a string literal you must precede it with a backslash")--I just naively added a
slash-and-double-quote at the beginning and end...

\"c:\Documents and Settings\Owner\My Documents\POV-Ray\v3.6\tests\\"

With this version, the 'unending string' appearance cropped up again; but I
proceeded with the render anyway. It did eliminate the original error message--
but the rendered image ended up in the top level of the c: directory!
                 c:\my_image.png

I suppose there's a method to this madness, but it sure is hard to comprehend.
Like a 'black art.' :-O

[Alain] Re: Output_File_Name -- quoted string question [4732 days 13 hours and 3 minutes ago]

Mon, 13 May 2013 00:50:45 GMT

Le 13-05-12 10:55, Thomas de Groot a écrit :
> On 12-5-2013 16:36, Stephen wrote:
>> It also works with "\" instead of "\\" as Thomas posted.
>>
>
> In some cases double back slashes are needed instead of single ones, I
> found out by experience. In particular, when declaring names to be used
> later in the code, like:
>
> #declare Terragen_Sky_Name = "Terragen files\\Skies\\Pano_09_0h_50a_"
>
> Not sure why that is though.
>
> Thomas
>

The back slash is the escape character in strings. For example, "\n" is 
used as a new line character, if you have \Skies\Pano,
it get parsed as "\s" "kies" "\p" "ano"
\s stand for the control character DC3 and \p for DLE

Alain

[Stephen] Re: Output_File_Name -- quoted string question [4732 days 20 hours and 1 minute ago]

Sun, 12 May 2013 17:53:33 GMT

On 12/05/2013 5:51 PM, Kenneth wrote:
> Output_File_Name="c:\Documents and Settings\Owner\My
> Documents\POV-Ray\v3.6\tests\\"
>
> No error message, and no 'unending strings.'  Great!
>

IIRC it is the spaces in the directory names that cause the trouble. 
There is or was, in a previous version, documented. But not under the 
INI settings.

> Many thanks, to you and to Thomas. Mystery solved!

I am sure that I can speak for Thomas when I say, that it is our 
pleasure to help.

-- 
Regards
     Stephen

[Kenneth] Re: Output_File_Name -- quoted string question [4732 days 20 hours and 59 minutes ago]

Sun, 12 May 2013 16:55:01 GMT

Stephen <mca### [at] aolcom> wrote:

>
> Try
>
> Output_File_Name="c:\\Documents and Settings\\Owner\\My
> Documents\\POV-Ray\\v3.6\\tests\\"

This actually works even better; the double slashes eliminate the 'unending
string' behavior that the single slashes produce. Using this particular syntax
never occurred to me, though; the docs don't mention it.

But your suggestion gave me an idea: I'm guessing that the most 'important'
slash is the final one, preceding the last double-quote. My goofy intuition,
anyway, based on something I read in the docs. So I tried it a third way--
single slashes *except* at the end-- and it works as well as using all double
slashes:

Output_File_Name="c:\Documents and Settings\Owner\My
Documents\POV-Ray\v3.6\tests\\"

No error message, and no 'unending strings.'  Great!

Many thanks, to you and to Thomas. Mystery solved!

[Kenneth] Re: Output_File_Name -- quoted string question [4732 days 21 hours and 24 minutes ago]

Sun, 12 May 2013 16:30:03 GMT

Thomas de Groot <tho### [at] degrootorg> wrote:
> On 12-5-2013 14:16, Kenneth wrote:
> In my own povray.ini file, I write these things between quotes:
>
> Output_File_Name = "c:\Documents and Settings\Owner\My
> Documents\POV-Ray\v3.6\tests\"
>

Hey, this works!

I'm embarrassed to say that I tried this earlier...but I didn't run
an actual render to see what would happen!!  :-/  The reason being, that all of
the text in my quickres file that *followed* this line then took on the
appearance of being in string notation--like one *long* string, all the way to
the end of the file. (Rather hard to describe.) So I didn't pursue it, thinking
I had made a mistake.

That behavior is rather odd, to say the least--although it doesn't affect the
operation of the code.

Thanks!

[Stephen] Re: Output_File_Name -- quoted string question [4732 days 22 hours and 30 minutes ago]

Sun, 12 May 2013 15:24:27 GMT

On 12/05/2013 3:55 PM, Thomas de Groot wrote:
>
> In some cases double back slashes are needed instead of single ones, I
> found out by experience. In particular, when declaring names to be used
> later in the code, like:
>
> #declare Terragen_Sky_Name = "Terragen files\\Skies\\Pano_09_0h_50a_"
>
> Not sure why that is though.

"#include" paths need double slashes.
It must be different modules parsing the ini files and the pov files.
I would think.

-- 
Regards
     Stephen