irtc.animations message digest

[imap4testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: Fwd: test [666 days 23 hours and 52 minutes ago]

Mon, 10 Jun 2024 07:30:49 GMT

02.11.2023 13:15, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> 
> 
> 
> -------- Forwarded Message --------
> Subject: test
> Date: Thu, 22 Jun 2023 17:25:16 +0600
> From: Test <pop### [at] mykdtkz>
> Newsgroups: irtc.animations
> 
> test 17 25
test

[pop3testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: test [670 days 21 hours and 22 minutes ago]

Thu, 6 Jun 2024 10:00:25 GMT

09.11.2023 15:07, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> On 22.06.2023 14:41, Pulsar Test wrote:
>> test
> test2

[Test] Re: test [687 days 3 hours and 48 minutes ago]

Tue, 21 May 2024 03:35:17 GMT

On 22.06.2023 16:25, Test wrote:
> test 17 25
test 08 34

[pop3testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: Fwd: test [690 days 19 hours and 9 minutes ago]

Fri, 17 May 2024 12:13:39 GMT

02.11.2023 13:15, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> 
> 
> 
> -------- Forwarded Message --------
> Subject: test
> Date: Thu, 22 Jun 2023 17:25:16 +0600
> From: Test <pop### [at] mykdtkz>
> Newsgroups: irtc.animations
> 
> test 17 25
test

[pop3testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: Fwd: test [690 days 23 hours and 5 minutes ago]

Fri, 17 May 2024 08:17:57 GMT

11.11.2023 7:53, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> 02.11.2023 14:15, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>
>>
>>
>> -------- Forwarded Message --------
>> Subject: test
>> Date: Thu, 22 Jun 2023 17:25:16 +0600
>> From: Test <pop### [at] mykdtkz>
>> Newsgroups: irtc.animations
>>
>> test 17 25
> test
test

[pop3testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: test 14 26 [691 days 1 hour and 27 minutes ago]

Fri, 17 May 2024 05:55:58 GMT

02.02.2024 10:03, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> On 01.02.2024 09:18, pop### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
>> On 31.01.2024 11:10, pulsar test wrote:
>>> On 22.01.2024 14:22, ingo wrote:
>>>> "ima### [at] mykdtkz" <ima### [at] mykdtkz> wrote:
>>>>> 15.01.2024 14:26, ima### [at] mykdtkz 
>>>>> пишет:
>>>>>> 25.11.2023 1:40, Kenneth пишет:
>>>>>>> "Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Well, we're up to 22.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Maybe we can do something about this?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> At first, I assumed it was a POV-ray developer testing something; 
>>>>>>> but
>>>>>>> that seems
>>>>>>> doubtful now. There would have been a heads-up or some 
>>>>>>> identification
>>>>>>> to let us
>>>>>>> know.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> test 14 26
>>>>> test 12 55
>>>>
>>>> Сіз не 
>>>> сынап
>>>> жатырсыз?
>>>>
>>> test 11 09
>> test 0918
> test 11 03
test

[test] Re: test [793 days and 53 minutes ago]

Mon, 5 Feb 2024 06:30:14 GMT

On 09.11.2023 16:07, pop### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
> On 22.06.2023 14:41, Pulsar Test wrote:
>> test
> test2
sendtest

[pop3testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: test 14 26 [796 days 2 hours and 20 minutes ago]

Fri, 2 Feb 2024 05:03:17 GMT

On 01.02.2024 09:18, pop### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
> On 31.01.2024 11:10, pulsar test wrote:
>> On 22.01.2024 14:22, ingo wrote:
>>> "ima### [at] mykdtkz" <ima### [at] mykdtkz> wrote:
>>>> 15.01.2024 14:26, ima### [at] mykdtkz 
>>>> пишет:
>>>>> 25.11.2023 1:40, Kenneth пишет:
>>>>>> "Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
>>>>>>> Well, we're up to 22.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Maybe we can do something about this?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> At first, I assumed it was a POV-ray developer testing something; but
>>>>>> that seems
>>>>>> doubtful now. There would have been a heads-up or some identification
>>>>>> to let us
>>>>>> know.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>> test 14 26
>>>> test 12 55
>>>
>>> Сіз не сынап
>>> жатырсыз?
>>>
>> test 11 09
> test 0918
test 11 03

[pop3testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: test 14 26 [797 days 4 hours and 4 minutes ago]

Thu, 1 Feb 2024 03:18:36 GMT

On 31.01.2024 11:10, pulsar test wrote:
> On 22.01.2024 14:22, ingo wrote:
>> "ima### [at] mykdtkz" <ima### [at] mykdtkz> wrote:
>>> 15.01.2024 14:26, ima### [at] mykdtkz 
>>> пишет:
>>>> 25.11.2023 1:40, Kenneth пишет:
>>>>> "Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
>>>>>> Well, we're up to 22.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Maybe we can do something about this?
>>>>>
>>>>> At first, I assumed it was a POV-ray developer testing something; but
>>>>> that seems
>>>>> doubtful now. There would have been a heads-up or some identification
>>>>> to let us
>>>>> know.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> test 14 26
>>> test 12 55
>>
>> Сіз не сынап
>> жатырсыз?
>>
> test 11 09
test 0918

[pulsar test] Re: test 14 26 [798 days 2 hours and 13 minutes ago]

Wed, 31 Jan 2024 05:10:00 GMT

On 22.01.2024 14:22, ingo wrote:
> "ima### [at] mykdtkz" <ima### [at] mykdtkz> wrote:
>> 15.01.2024 14:26, ima### [at] mykdtkz пишет:
>>> 25.11.2023 1:40, Kenneth пишет:
>>>> "Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
>>>>> Well, we're up to 22.
>>>>>
>>>>> Maybe we can do something about this?
>>>>
>>>> At first, I assumed it was a POV-ray developer testing something; but
>>>> that seems
>>>> doubtful now. There would have been a heads-up or some identification
>>>> to let us
>>>> know.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>> test 14 26
>> test 12 55
> 
> Сіз не сынап
> жатырсыз?
> 
test 11 09

[ingo] Re: test 14 26 [806 days 22 hours and 58 minutes ago]

Mon, 22 Jan 2024 08:25:00 GMT

"ima### [at] mykdtkz" <ima### [at] mykdtkz> wrote:
> 15.01.2024 14:26, ima### [at] mykdtkz пишет:
> > 25.11.2023 1:40, Kenneth пишет:
> >> "Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
> >>> Well, we're up to 22.
> >>>
> >>> Maybe we can do something about this?
> >>
> >> At first, I assumed it was a POV-ray developer testing something; but
> >> that seems
> >> doubtful now. There would have been a heads-up or some identification
> >> to let us
> >> know.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> > test 14 26
> test 12 55

Сіз не сынап
жатырсыз?

[imap4testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: test 14 26 [807 days and 27 minutes ago]

Mon, 22 Jan 2024 06:55:28 GMT

15.01.2024 14:26, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> 25.11.2023 1:40, Kenneth
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>> "Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
>>> Well, we're up to 22.
>>>
>>> Maybe we can do something about this?
>>
>> At first, I assumed it was a POV-ray developer testing something; but 
>> that seems
>> doubtful now. There would have been a heads-up or some identification 
>> to let us
>> know.
>>
>>
>>
>>
> test 14 26
test 12 55

[imap4testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: test 14 26 [807 days and 47 minutes ago]

Mon, 22 Jan 2024 06:35:35 GMT

16.01.2024 14:52, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> 15.01.2024 14:26, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>> 25.11.2023 1:40, Kenneth
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>> "Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
>>>> Well, we're up to 22.
>>>>
>>>> Maybe we can do something about this?
>>>
>>> At first, I assumed it was a POV-ray developer testing something; but 
>>> that seems
>>> doubtful now. There would have been a heads-up or some identification 
>>> to let us
>>> know.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>> test 14 26
> test 14 52
test 12 35

[imap4testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: test 14 26 [811 days 3 hours and 30 minutes ago]

Thu, 18 Jan 2024 03:52:56 GMT

15.01.2024 14:26, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> 25.11.2023 1:40, Kenneth
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>> "Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
>>> Well, we're up to 22.
>>>
>>> Maybe we can do something about this?
>>
>> At first, I assumed it was a POV-ray developer testing something; but 
>> that seems
>> doubtful now. There would have been a heads-up or some identification 
>> to let us
>> know.
>>
>>
>>
>>
> test 14 26
test 09 52

[imap4testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: test 14 26 [812 days 22 hours and 30 minutes ago]

Tue, 16 Jan 2024 08:52:41 GMT

15.01.2024 14:26, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> 25.11.2023 1:40, Kenneth
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>> "Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
>>> Well, we're up to 22.
>>>
>>> Maybe we can do something about this?
>>
>> At first, I assumed it was a POV-ray developer testing something; but 
>> that seems
>> doubtful now. There would have been a heads-up or some identification 
>> to let us
>> know.
>>
>>
>>
>>
> test 14 26
test 14 52

[imap4testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: test 14 26 [813 days 22 hours and 56 minutes ago]

Mon, 15 Jan 2024 08:26:30 GMT

25.11.2023 1:40, Kenneth Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> "Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
>> Well, we're up to 22.
>>
>> Maybe we can do something about this?
> 
> At first, I assumed it was a POV-ray developer testing something; but that seems
> doubtful now. There would have been a heads-up or some identification to let us
> know.
> 
> 
> 
> 
test 14 26

[pop3testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: Fwd: test [820 days 22 hours and 59 minutes ago]

Mon, 8 Jan 2024 08:23:59 GMT

05.01.2024 18:00, test Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> On 05.01.2024 16:07, ima### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
>> 26.12.2023 10:14, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>> On 22.12.2023 11:05, pop### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
>>>> On 07.12.2023 11:10, pop### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
>>>>> 24.11.2023 10:39, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>> 23.11.2023 15:36, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>> 23.11.2023 12:09, test
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>>> Ð¢Ð•Ð¡Ð¢ 12 08
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> test 1536
>>>>>> test 10 39
>>>>> Ñ‚ÐµÑÑ‚ 11 11
>>>> test 11 05
>>> test 10 14
>> test 16 07
> test 18 00
test 14 23

[test] Re: Fwd: test [823 days 19 hours and 22 minutes ago]

Fri, 5 Jan 2024 12:00:46 GMT

On 05.01.2024 16:07, ima### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
> 26.12.2023 10:14, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>> On 22.12.2023 11:05, pop### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
>>> On 07.12.2023 11:10, pop### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
>>>> 24.11.2023 10:39, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>> 23.11.2023 15:36, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>> 23.11.2023 12:09, test
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>> Ð¢Ð•Ð¡Ð¢ 12 08
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> test 1536
>>>>> test 10 39
>>>> Ñ‚ÐµÑÑ‚ 11 11
>>> test 11 05
>> test 10 14
> test 16 07
test 18 00

[imap4testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: Fwd: test [823 days 21 hours and 16 minutes ago]

Fri, 5 Jan 2024 10:07:18 GMT

26.12.2023 10:14, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> On 22.12.2023 11:05, pop### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
>> On 07.12.2023 11:10, pop### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
>>> 24.11.2023 10:39, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>> 23.11.2023 15:36, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>> 23.11.2023 12:09, test
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>> Ð¢Ð•Ð¡Ð¢ 12 08
>>>>>>
>>>>> test 1536
>>>> test 10 39
>>> Ñ‚ÐµÑÑ‚ 11 11
>> test 11 05
> test 10 14
test 16 07

[pop3testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: Fwd: test [834 days 3 hours and 8 minutes ago]

Tue, 26 Dec 2023 04:14:51 GMT

On 22.12.2023 11:05, pop### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
> On 07.12.2023 11:10, pop### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
>> 24.11.2023 10:39, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>> 23.11.2023 15:36, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>> 23.11.2023 12:09, test
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>> Ð¢Ð•Ð¡Ð¢ 12 08
>>>>>
>>>> test 1536
>>> test 10 39
>> Ñ‚ÐµÑÑ‚ 11 11
> test 11 05
test 10 14

[pop3testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: Fwd: test [838 days 2 hours and 17 minutes ago]

Fri, 22 Dec 2023 05:05:59 GMT

On 07.12.2023 11:10, pop### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
> 24.11.2023 10:39, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>> 23.11.2023 15:36, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>> 23.11.2023 12:09, test
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>> Ð¢Ð•Ð¡Ð¢ 12 08
>>>>
>>> test 1536
>> test 10 39
> Ñ‚ÐµÑÑ‚ 11 11
test 11 05

[pop3testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: Fwd: test [845 days 2 hours and 15 minutes ago]

Fri, 15 Dec 2023 05:07:58 GMT

13.12.2023 17:43, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> 12.12.2023 16:23, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>> 12.12.2023 12:36, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>> 11.12.2023 17:45, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>> 11.12.2023 17:09, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>> 11.12.2023 15:18, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>> 11.12.2023 14:34, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>> test 14 34
>>>>>> test 15 18
>>>>> test 17 09
>>>> test 17 45
>>> test 12 36
>> test 16 23
> ÐµÑƒÑ‹Ðµ 17 43
test

[pop3testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: Fwd: test [846 days 19 hours and 40 minutes ago]

Wed, 13 Dec 2023 11:43:03 GMT

12.12.2023 16:23, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> 12.12.2023 12:36, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>> 11.12.2023 17:45, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>> 11.12.2023 17:09, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>> 11.12.2023 15:18, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>> 11.12.2023 14:34, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>> test 14 34
>>>>> test 15 18
>>>> test 17 09
>>> test 17 45
>> test 12 36
> test 16 23
ÐµÑƒÑ‹Ðµ 17 43

[pop3testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: Fwd: test [847 days 20 hours and 59 minutes ago]

Tue, 12 Dec 2023 10:23:54 GMT

12.12.2023 12:36, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> 11.12.2023 17:45, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>> 11.12.2023 17:09, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>> 11.12.2023 15:18, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>> 11.12.2023 14:34, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>> test 14 34
>>>> test 15 18
>>> test 17 09
>> test 17 45
> test 12 36
test 16 23

[pop3testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: Fwd: test [848 days and 47 minutes ago]

Tue, 12 Dec 2023 06:36:06 GMT

11.12.2023 17:45, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> 11.12.2023 17:09, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>> 11.12.2023 15:18, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>> 11.12.2023 14:34, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>> test 14 34
>>> test 15 18
>> test 17 09
> test 17 45
test 12 36

[pop3testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: Fwd: test [848 days 19 hours and 37 minutes ago]

Mon, 11 Dec 2023 11:45:43 GMT

11.12.2023 17:09, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> 11.12.2023 15:18, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>> 11.12.2023 14:34, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>> test 14 34
>> test 15 18
> test 17 09
test 17 45

[pop3testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: Fwd: test [848 days 20 hours and 14 minutes ago]

Mon, 11 Dec 2023 11:09:20 GMT

11.12.2023 15:18, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> 11.12.2023 14:34, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>> test 14 34
> test 15 18
test 17 09

[pop3testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: Fwd: test [848 days 22 hours and 5 minutes ago]

Mon, 11 Dec 2023 09:18:17 GMT

11.12.2023 14:34, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> test 14 34
test 15 18

[pop3testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: Fwd: test [848 days 22 hours and 48 minutes ago]

Mon, 11 Dec 2023 08:34:48 GMT

test 14 34

[pop3testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: Fwd: test [851 days 20 hours and 26 minutes ago]

Fri, 8 Dec 2023 10:56:47 GMT

08.12.2023 16:04, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> 08.12.2023 11:17, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>> 29.11.2023 12:40, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>> 24.11.2023 11:40, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>> 24.11.2023 10:39, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>> 23.11.2023 15:36, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>> 23.11.2023 12:09, test
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>> Ð¢Ð•Ð¡Ð¢ 12 08
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> test 1536
>>>>> test 10 39
>>>> test 1140
>>> test 12 40
>> Ñ‚ÐµÑÑ‚ 11 17
> test 16 05
test 16 56

[pop3testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: Fwd: test [851 days 21 hours and 18 minutes ago]

Fri, 8 Dec 2023 10:05:00 GMT

08.12.2023 11:17, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> 29.11.2023 12:40, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>> 24.11.2023 11:40, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>> 24.11.2023 10:39, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>> 23.11.2023 15:36, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>> 23.11.2023 12:09, test
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>> Ð¢Ð•Ð¡Ð¢ 12 08
>>>>>>
>>>>> test 1536
>>>> test 10 39
>>> test 1140
>> test 12 40
> Ñ‚ÐµÑÑ‚ 11 17
test 16 05

[pop3testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: Fwd: test [852 days 2 hours and 6 minutes ago]

Fri, 8 Dec 2023 05:17:20 GMT

29.11.2023 12:40, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> 24.11.2023 11:40, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>> 24.11.2023 10:39, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>> 23.11.2023 15:36, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>> 23.11.2023 12:09, test
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>> Ð¢Ð•Ð¡Ð¢ 12 08
>>>>>
>>>> test 1536
>>> test 10 39
>> test 1140
> test 12 40
Ñ‚ÐµÑÑ‚ 11 17

[pop3testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: Fwd: test [853 days 2 hours and 13 minutes ago]

Thu, 7 Dec 2023 05:10:21 GMT

24.11.2023 10:39, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> 23.11.2023 15:36, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>> 23.11.2023 12:09, test
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>> Ð¢Ð•Ð¡Ð¢ 12 08
>>>
>> test 1536
> test 10 39
Ñ‚ÐµÑÑ‚ 11 11

[pop3testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: Fwd: test [853 days 20 hours and 9 minutes ago]

Wed, 6 Dec 2023 11:14:10 GMT

24.11.2023 11:40, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> 24.11.2023 10:39, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>> 23.11.2023 15:36, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>> 23.11.2023 12:09, test
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>> Ð¢Ð•Ð¡Ð¢ 12 08
>>>>
>>> test 1536
>> test 10 39
> test 1140
test 17 14

[pop3testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: Fwd: test [861 days and 42 minutes ago]

Wed, 29 Nov 2023 06:40:48 GMT

24.11.2023 11:40, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> 24.11.2023 10:39, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>> 23.11.2023 15:36, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>> 23.11.2023 12:09, test
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>> Ð¢Ð•Ð¡Ð¢ 12 08
>>>>
>>> test 1536
>> test 10 39
> test 1140
test 12 40

[Kenneth] Re: test [865 days 11 hours and 38 minutes ago]

Fri, 24 Nov 2023 19:45:00 GMT

"Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
> Well, we're up to 22.
>
> Maybe we can do something about this?

At first, I assumed it was a POV-ray developer testing something; but that seems
doubtful now. There would have been a heads-up or some identification to let us
know.

[Bald Eagle] Re: test [865 days 19 hours and 58 minutes ago]

Fri, 24 Nov 2023 11:25:00 GMT

Well, we're up to 22.

Maybe we can do something about this?

[imap4testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: Fwd: test [866 days 1 hour and 42 minutes ago]

Fri, 24 Nov 2023 05:40:54 GMT

24.11.2023 10:39, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> 23.11.2023 15:36, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>> 23.11.2023 12:09, test
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>> Ð¢Ð•Ð¡Ð¢ 12 08
>>>
>> test 1536
> test 10 39
test 1140

[imap4testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: Fwd: test [866 days 2 hours and 43 minutes ago]

Fri, 24 Nov 2023 04:39:24 GMT

23.11.2023 15:36, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> 23.11.2023 12:09, test Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>> Ð¢Ð•Ð¡Ð¢ 12 08
>>
> test 1536
test 10 39

[pop3testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: Fwd: test [866 days 21 hours and 47 minutes ago]

Thu, 23 Nov 2023 09:36:13 GMT

23.11.2023 12:09, test Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> Ð¢Ð•Ð¡Ð¢ 12 08
> 
test 1536

[test] Re: Fwd: test [867 days 1 hour and 14 minutes ago]

Thu, 23 Nov 2023 06:09:02 GMT

Ð¢Ð•Ð¡Ð¢ 12 08

[imap4testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: Fwd: test [867 days 2 hours and 24 minutes ago]

Thu, 23 Nov 2023 04:58:25 GMT

22.11.2023 15:57, test Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> On 22.11.2023 14:19, ima### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
>> 22.11.2023 13:25, test
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>> On 21.11.2023 14:08, test wrote:
>>>> On 21.11.2023 12:55, ima### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
>>>>> 21.11.2023 10:07, test
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>> On 20.11.2023 11:08, test wrote:
>>>>>>> On 17.11.2023 14:08, ima### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
>>>>>>>> 15.11.2023 14:05, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>>>> 14.11.2023 10:12, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>>>>> 13.11.2023 21:35, test
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>>>>>> On 13.11.2023 15:32, test wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> On 13.11.2023 10:28, ima### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 11.11.2023 9:29, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 11.11.2023 5:53, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 02.11.2023 14:15, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -------- Forwarded Message --------
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: test
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Date: Thu, 22 Jun 2023 17:25:16 +0600
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: Test <pop### [at] mykdtkz>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Newsgroups: irtc.animations
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> test 17 25
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> test
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> test
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> TEST 10:28
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Test 21 35
>>>>>>>>>> test 10 12test 14 05
>>>>>>>> Ñ‚ÐµÑÑ‚ 14 08
>>>>>>> test 11 08
>>>>>> test 10:06
>>>>> test 12 55
>>>> test 14 08
>>> TEST 13 25
>> TEST 14 19
> TEST 15 57
TEST 10 58

[test] Re: Fwd: test [867 days 21 hours and 26 minutes ago]

Wed, 22 Nov 2023 09:57:17 GMT

On 22.11.2023 14:19, ima### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
> 22.11.2023 13:25, test Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>> On 21.11.2023 14:08, test wrote:
>>> On 21.11.2023 12:55, ima### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
>>>> 21.11.2023 10:07, test
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>> On 20.11.2023 11:08, test wrote:
>>>>>> On 17.11.2023 14:08, ima### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
>>>>>>> 15.11.2023 14:05, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>>> 14.11.2023 10:12, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>>>> 13.11.2023 21:35, test
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>>>>> On 13.11.2023 15:32, test wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> On 13.11.2023 10:28, ima### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> 11.11.2023 9:29, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 11.11.2023 5:53, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 02.11.2023 14:15, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -------- Forwarded Message --------
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: test
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Date: Thu, 22 Jun 2023 17:25:16 +0600
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: Test <pop### [at] mykdtkz>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Newsgroups: irtc.animations
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> test 17 25
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> test
>>>>>>>>>>>>> test
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> TEST 10:28
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Test 21 35
>>>>>>>>> test 10 12test 14 05
>>>>>>> Ñ‚ÐµÑÑ‚ 14 08
>>>>>> test 11 08
>>>>> test 10:06
>>>> test 12 55
>>> test 14 08
>> TEST 13 25
> TEST 14 19
TEST 15 57

[imap4testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: Fwd: test [867 days 23 hours and 3 minutes ago]

Wed, 22 Nov 2023 08:19:38 GMT

22.11.2023 13:25, test Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> On 21.11.2023 14:08, test wrote:
>> On 21.11.2023 12:55, ima### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
>>> 21.11.2023 10:07, test
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>> On 20.11.2023 11:08, test wrote:
>>>>> On 17.11.2023 14:08, ima### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
>>>>>> 15.11.2023 14:05, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>> 14.11.2023 10:12, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>>> 13.11.2023 21:35, test
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>>>> On 13.11.2023 15:32, test wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On 13.11.2023 10:28, ima### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> 11.11.2023 9:29, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>>>>>>> 11.11.2023 5:53, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 02.11.2023 14:15, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -------- Forwarded Message --------
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: test
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Date: Thu, 22 Jun 2023 17:25:16 +0600
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: Test <pop### [at] mykdtkz>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Newsgroups: irtc.animations
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> test 17 25
>>>>>>>>>>>>> test
>>>>>>>>>>>> test
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> TEST 10:28
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Test 21 35
>>>>>>>> test 10 12test 14 05
>>>>>> Ñ‚ÐµÑÑ‚ 14 08
>>>>> test 11 08
>>>> test 10:06
>>> test 12 55
>> test 14 08
> TEST 13 25
TEST 14 19

[test] Re: Fwd: test [867 days 23 hours and 57 minutes ago]

Wed, 22 Nov 2023 07:25:57 GMT

On 21.11.2023 14:08, test wrote:
> On 21.11.2023 12:55, ima### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
>> 21.11.2023 10:07, test
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>> On 20.11.2023 11:08, test wrote:
>>>> On 17.11.2023 14:08, ima### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
>>>>> 15.11.2023 14:05, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>> 14.11.2023 10:12, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>> 13.11.2023 21:35, test
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>>> On 13.11.2023 15:32, test wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On 13.11.2023 10:28, ima### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> 11.11.2023 9:29, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>>>>>> 11.11.2023 5:53, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>>>>>>> 02.11.2023 14:15, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> -------- Forwarded Message --------
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: test
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Date: Thu, 22 Jun 2023 17:25:16 +0600
>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: Test <pop### [at] mykdtkz>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Newsgroups: irtc.animations
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> test 17 25
>>>>>>>>>>>> test
>>>>>>>>>>> test
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> TEST 10:28
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Test 21 35
>>>>>>> test 10 12test 14 05
>>>>> Ñ‚ÐµÑÑ‚ 14 08
>>>> test 11 08
>>> test 10:06
>> test 12 55
> test 14 08
TEST 13 25

[test] Re: Fwd: test [868 days 23 hours and 14 minutes ago]

Tue, 21 Nov 2023 08:08:32 GMT

On 21.11.2023 12:55, ima### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
> 21.11.2023 10:07, test Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>> On 20.11.2023 11:08, test wrote:
>>> On 17.11.2023 14:08, ima### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
>>>> 15.11.2023 14:05, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>> 14.11.2023 10:12, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>> 13.11.2023 21:35, test
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>> On 13.11.2023 15:32, test wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 13.11.2023 10:28, ima### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
>>>>>>>>> 11.11.2023 9:29, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>>>>> 11.11.2023 5:53, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>>>>>> 02.11.2023 14:15, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> -------- Forwarded Message --------
>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: test
>>>>>>>>>>>> Date: Thu, 22 Jun 2023 17:25:16 +0600
>>>>>>>>>>>> From: Test <pop### [at] mykdtkz>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Newsgroups: irtc.animations
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> test 17 25
>>>>>>>>>>> test
>>>>>>>>>> test
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> TEST 10:28
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Test 21 35
>>>>>> test 10 12test 14 05
>>>> Ñ‚ÐµÑÑ‚ 14 08
>>> test 11 08
>> test 10:06
> test 12 55
test 14 08

[imap4testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: Fwd: test [869 days and 27 minutes ago]

Tue, 21 Nov 2023 06:55:53 GMT

21.11.2023 10:07, test Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> On 20.11.2023 11:08, test wrote:
>> On 17.11.2023 14:08, ima### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
>>> 15.11.2023 14:05, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>> 14.11.2023 10:12, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>> 13.11.2023 21:35, test
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>> On 13.11.2023 15:32, test wrote:
>>>>>>> On 13.11.2023 10:28, ima### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
>>>>>>>> 11.11.2023 9:29, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>>>> 11.11.2023 5:53, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>>>>> 02.11.2023 14:15, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> -------- Forwarded Message --------
>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: test
>>>>>>>>>>> Date: Thu, 22 Jun 2023 17:25:16 +0600
>>>>>>>>>>> From: Test <pop### [at] mykdtkz>
>>>>>>>>>>> Newsgroups: irtc.animations
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> test 17 25
>>>>>>>>>> test
>>>>>>>>> test
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> TEST 10:28
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Test 21 35
>>>>> test 10 12test 14 05
>>> Ñ‚ÐµÑÑ‚ 14 08
>> test 11 08
> test 10:06
test 12 55

[test] Re: Fwd: test [869 days 3 hours and 16 minutes ago]

Tue, 21 Nov 2023 04:07:05 GMT

On 20.11.2023 11:08, test wrote:
> On 17.11.2023 14:08, ima### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
>> 15.11.2023 14:05, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>> 14.11.2023 10:12, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>> 13.11.2023 21:35, test
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>> On 13.11.2023 15:32, test wrote:
>>>>>> On 13.11.2023 10:28, ima### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
>>>>>>> 11.11.2023 9:29, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>>> 11.11.2023 5:53, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>>>> 02.11.2023 14:15, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> -------- Forwarded Message --------
>>>>>>>>>> Subject: test
>>>>>>>>>> Date: Thu, 22 Jun 2023 17:25:16 +0600
>>>>>>>>>> From: Test <pop### [at] mykdtkz>
>>>>>>>>>> Newsgroups: irtc.animations
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> test 17 25
>>>>>>>>> test
>>>>>>>> test
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> TEST 10:28
>>>>>
>>>>> Test 21 35
>>>> test 10 12test 14 05
>> Ñ‚ÐµÑÑ‚ 14 08
> test 11 08
test 10:06

[test] Re: Fwd: test [870 days 2 hours and 14 minutes ago]

Mon, 20 Nov 2023 05:08:25 GMT

On 17.11.2023 14:08, ima### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
> 15.11.2023 14:05, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>> 14.11.2023 10:12, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>> 13.11.2023 21:35, test
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>> On 13.11.2023 15:32, test wrote:
>>>>> On 13.11.2023 10:28, ima### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
>>>>>> 11.11.2023 9:29, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>> 11.11.2023 5:53, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>>> 02.11.2023 14:15, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> -------- Forwarded Message --------
>>>>>>>>> Subject: test
>>>>>>>>> Date: Thu, 22 Jun 2023 17:25:16 +0600
>>>>>>>>> From: Test <pop### [at] mykdtkz>
>>>>>>>>> Newsgroups: irtc.animations
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> test 17 25
>>>>>>>> test
>>>>>>> test
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> TEST 10:28
>>>>
>>>> Test 21 35
>>> test 10 12test 14 05
> Ñ‚ÐµÑÑ‚ 14 08
test 11 08

[imap4testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: Fwd: test [872 days 23 hours and 14 minutes ago]

Fri, 17 Nov 2023 08:08:57 GMT

15.11.2023 14:05, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> 14.11.2023 10:12, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>> 13.11.2023 21:35, test
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>> On 13.11.2023 15:32, test wrote:
>>>> On 13.11.2023 10:28, ima### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
>>>>> 11.11.2023 9:29, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>> 11.11.2023 5:53, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>> 02.11.2023 14:15, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -------- Forwarded Message --------
>>>>>>>> Subject: test
>>>>>>>> Date: Thu, 22 Jun 2023 17:25:16 +0600
>>>>>>>> From: Test <pop### [at] mykdtkz>
>>>>>>>> Newsgroups: irtc.animations
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> test 17 25
>>>>>>> test
>>>>>> test
>>>>>>
>>>>> TEST 10:28
>>>
>>> Test 21 35
>> test 10 12test 14 05
Ñ‚ÐµÑÑ‚ 14 08

[imap4testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: Fwd: test [874 days 23 hours and 17 minutes ago]

Wed, 15 Nov 2023 08:05:42 GMT

14.11.2023 10:12, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> 13.11.2023 21:35, test Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>> On 13.11.2023 15:32, test wrote:
>>> On 13.11.2023 10:28, ima### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
>>>> 11.11.2023 9:29, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>> 11.11.2023 5:53, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>> 02.11.2023 14:15, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -------- Forwarded Message --------
>>>>>>> Subject: test
>>>>>>> Date: Thu, 22 Jun 2023 17:25:16 +0600
>>>>>>> From: Test <pop### [at] mykdtkz>
>>>>>>> Newsgroups: irtc.animations
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> test 17 25
>>>>>> test
>>>>> test
>>>>>
>>>> TEST 10:28
>>
>> Test 21 35
> test 10 12test 14 05

[pop3testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: Fwd: test [876 days 3 hours and 10 minutes ago]

Tue, 14 Nov 2023 04:12:51 GMT

13.11.2023 21:35, test Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> On 13.11.2023 15:32, test wrote:
>> On 13.11.2023 10:28, ima### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
>>> 11.11.2023 9:29, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>> 11.11.2023 5:53, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>> 02.11.2023 14:15, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -------- Forwarded Message --------
>>>>>> Subject: test
>>>>>> Date: Thu, 22 Jun 2023 17:25:16 +0600
>>>>>> From: Test <pop### [at] mykdtkz>
>>>>>> Newsgroups: irtc.animations
>>>>>>
>>>>>> test 17 25
>>>>> test
>>>> test
>>>>
>>> TEST 10:28
> 
> Test 21 35
test 10 12

[test] Re: Fwd: test [876 days 15 hours and 47 minutes ago]

Mon, 13 Nov 2023 15:35:46 GMT

On 13.11.2023 15:32, test wrote:
> On 13.11.2023 10:28, ima### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
>> 11.11.2023 9:29, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>> 11.11.2023 5:53, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>> 02.11.2023 14:15, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> -------- Forwarded Message --------
>>>>> Subject: test
>>>>> Date: Thu, 22 Jun 2023 17:25:16 +0600
>>>>> From: Test <pop### [at] mykdtkz>
>>>>> Newsgroups: irtc.animations
>>>>>
>>>>> test 17 25
>>>> test
>>> test
>>>
>> TEST 10:28

Test 21 35

[test] Re: Fwd: test [876 days 21 hours and 50 minutes ago]

Mon, 13 Nov 2023 09:32:24 GMT

On 13.11.2023 10:28, ima### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
> 11.11.2023 9:29, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>> 11.11.2023 5:53, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>> 02.11.2023 14:15, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -------- Forwarded Message --------
>>>> Subject: test
>>>> Date: Thu, 22 Jun 2023 17:25:16 +0600
>>>> From: Test <pop### [at] mykdtkz>
>>>> Newsgroups: irtc.animations
>>>>
>>>> test 17 25
>>> test
>> test
>>
> TEST 10:28
TEST 15 32

[imap4testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: Fwd: test [877 days 2 hours and 55 minutes ago]

Mon, 13 Nov 2023 04:28:20 GMT

11.11.2023 9:29, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> 11.11.2023 5:53, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>> 02.11.2023 14:15, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -------- Forwarded Message --------
>>> Subject: test
>>> Date: Thu, 22 Jun 2023 17:25:16 +0600
>>> From: Test <pop### [at] mykdtkz>
>>> Newsgroups: irtc.animations
>>>
>>> test 17 25
>> test
> test
> 
TEST 10:28

[pop3testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: Fwd: test [879 days 3 hours and 53 minutes ago]

Sat, 11 Nov 2023 03:29:49 GMT

11.11.2023 5:53, ima### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> 02.11.2023 14:15, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
>>
>>
>>
>> -------- Forwarded Message --------
>> Subject: test
>> Date: Thu, 22 Jun 2023 17:25:16 +0600
>> From: Test <pop### [at] mykdtkz>
>> Newsgroups: irtc.animations
>>
>> test 17 25
> test
test

[imap4testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: Fwd: test [879 days 4 hours and 30 minutes ago]

Sat, 11 Nov 2023 02:53:18 GMT

02.11.2023 14:15, pop### [at] mykdtkz
Ð¿Ð¸ÑˆÐµÑ‚:
> 
> 
> 
> -------- Forwarded Message --------
> Subject: test
> Date: Thu, 22 Jun 2023 17:25:16 +0600
> From: Test <pop### [at] mykdtkz>
> Newsgroups: irtc.animations
> 
> test 17 25
test

[pop3testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: test [880 days 20 hours and 18 minutes ago]

Thu, 9 Nov 2023 11:04:55 GMT

On 09.11.2023 16:59, pop### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
> On 09.11.2023 16:58, pop### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
>> On 09.11.2023 16:07, pop### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
>>> On 22.06.2023 14:41, Pulsar Test wrote:
>>>> test
>>> test2
>>
> 
test23

[pop3testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: test [880 days 20 hours and 23 minutes ago]

Thu, 9 Nov 2023 10:59:47 GMT

On 09.11.2023 16:58, pop### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
> On 09.11.2023 16:07, pop### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
>> On 22.06.2023 14:41, Pulsar Test wrote:
>>> test
>> test2
>

[pop3testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: test [880 days 20 hours and 24 minutes ago]

Thu, 9 Nov 2023 10:58:39 GMT

On 09.11.2023 16:07, pop### [at] mykdtkz wrote:
> On 22.06.2023 14:41, Pulsar Test wrote:
>> test
> test2

[pop3testpulsar@mykdt kz] Re: test [880 days 21 hours and 15 minutes ago]

Thu, 9 Nov 2023 10:07:31 GMT

On 22.06.2023 14:41, Pulsar Test wrote:
> test
test2

[pop3testpulsar@mykdt kz] Fwd: test [887 days 23 hours and 7 minutes ago]

Thu, 2 Nov 2023 08:15:52 GMT

-------- Forwarded Message --------
Subject: test
Date: Thu, 22 Jun 2023 17:25:16 +0600
From: Test <pop### [at] mykdtkz>
Newsgroups: irtc.animations

test 17 25

[Test] test [1020 days 19 hours and 58 minutes ago]

Thu, 22 Jun 2023 11:25:19 GMT

test 17 25

[Pulsar Test] test [1020 days 22 hours and 42 minutes ago]

Thu, 22 Jun 2023 08:41:20 GMT

test

[gregjohn] Re: "In the Year 2889" is the Random Sci-Fi Stor... [5607 days 3 hours and 43 minutes ago]

Wed, 1 Dec 2010 03:40:00 GMT

Here's my entry to the Challenge.
It's far from complete, but what I was able to do in 30 days.
Okay, I realize 30 days was too short a contest timeline!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5wsyRYetDhQ

If anyone were to have prepared an entry, it can go as a response to the
announcement, as it appears that YouTube Groups are going away:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uko84R52NXk

[gregjohn] Re: "In the Year 2889" is the Random Sci-Fi Stor... [5627 days 5 hours and 13 minutes ago]

Thu, 11 Nov 2010 02:10:01 GMT

"gregjohn" <pte### [at] yahoocom> wrote:

> http://www.youtube.com/group/rssrc


It's only November 10th, and I have an 80 second draft complete with captions
that tell the story and stationary views of all my sets, only one or two of
which need major tweaking.  Now to texture a character or two and start
animating the figures!  It's probably already better than my worst ever, so all
improvements are a joy from here on out!

The group now has 11 members, maybe at least half of which appear to be actual
animators.

[gregjohn] Re: "In the Year 2889" is the Random Sci-Fi Stor... [5637 days 6 hours and 8 minutes ago]

Mon, 1 Nov 2010 01:15:01 GMT

"gregjohn" <pte### [at] yahoocom> wrote:
> Hope to see your videos in the channel by the end of November!
>
> https://sites.google.com/site/rssrtc/announcement-video
> https://sites.google.com/site/rssrtc/list-of-topics
> https://sites.google.com/site/rssrtc/faq
>
> http://www.youtube.com/group/rssrc

There's already one entry, which fully appears to have been made in response to
the topic, and even appears to be povray!  It's a success!

[gregjohn] Re: "In the Year 2889" is the Random Sci-Fi Stor... [5638 days 12 hours and 23 minutes ago]

Sat, 30 Oct 2010 19:00:01 GMT

Glad you think so!  Think you might want to produce some quick animation in 30
days with that title?

[nemesis] Re: "In the Year 2889" is the Random Sci-Fi Stor... [5639 days 3 hours and 23 minutes ago]

Sat, 30 Oct 2010 04:00:02 GMT

"gregjohn" <pte### [at] yahoocom> wrote:
> Hope to see your videos in the channel by the end of November!
>
> https://sites.google.com/site/rssrtc/announcement-video
> https://sites.google.com/site/rssrtc/list-of-topics
> https://sites.google.com/site/rssrtc/faq
>
> http://www.youtube.com/group/rssrc

cool!

[gregjohn] "In the Year 2889" is the Random Sci-Fi Storytel... [5639 days 4 hours and 23 minutes ago]

Sat, 30 Oct 2010 03:00:01 GMT

Hope to see your videos in the channel by the end of November!

https://sites.google.com/site/rssrtc/announcement-video
https://sites.google.com/site/rssrtc/list-of-topics
https://sites.google.com/site/rssrtc/faq

http://www.youtube.com/group/rssrc

[gregjohn] Re: Attempting it on youtube! [5647 days 4 hours and 33 minutes ago]

Fri, 22 Oct 2010 02:50:01 GMT

"gregjohn" <pte### [at] yahoocom> wrote:
> http://www.youtube.com/group/rssrc
> Possibly starting November 1st.


Announcement video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uko84R52NXk

[gregjohn] Attempting it on youtube! [5649 days 7 hours and 8 minutes ago]

Wed, 20 Oct 2010 00:15:01 GMT

http://www.youtube.com/group/rssrc
Possibly starting November 1st.

[gregjohn] Re: What about... [5695 days 6 hours and 3 minutes ago]

Sat, 4 Sep 2010 01:20:01 GMT

Le_Forgeron <lef### [at] freefr> wrote:
> making a change to the animation rules, to replace mpeg-1 encoding with
> WebM (the new html5 video standard) ?
> (Allow to have stereo sound by default)
>
> (I wonder about the filesize limit too, but as I do not know if place is
> an issue on the server nor how well WebM can be more efficient than
> mpeg-1, I guess that the 10 megabytes limit is still fine in theory, at
> least until we get more experience with that format)
>
> and then having some animation rounds ?
>


To the great chagrin of a very many of us, it appears that there is no interest
on the part of IRTC of getting Animations contests back on line.

[Le Forgeron] What about... [5699 days 23 hours and 24 minutes ago]

Mon, 30 Aug 2010 07:58:57 GMT

making a change to the animation rules, to replace mpeg-1 encoding with
WebM (the new html5 video standard) ?
(Allow to have stereo sound by default)

(I wonder about the filesize limit too, but as I do not know if place is
an issue on the server nor how well WebM can be more efficient than
mpeg-1, I guess that the 10 megabytes limit is still fine in theory, at
least until we get more experience with that format)

and then having some animation rounds ?


-- 
A good Manager will take you
through the forest, no mater what.
A Leader will take time to climb on a
Tree and say 'This is the wrong forest'.

[Kzerphii Toomk] Re: Automatic anaglyph animation [6048 days 8 hours and 44 minutes ago]

Tue, 15 Sep 2009 22:38:49 GMT

Thanks :-))

"gregjohn" <pte### [at] yahoocom> a écrit dans le message de news: 
web.4a830b15c15fa995ae3cb5160@news.povray.org...
> "Kzerphii Toomk" <kze### [at] orangefr> wrote:
>> Is it possible to make an anaglyphic animation with moray, only
>> using moray technicals (refraction, transparency, reflects...) ?
>>
>> Anaglyphic readable with RB glasses...
>>
>> Thanks for ideas... ;-)
>>
>> Kzerphii
>> http://www.youtube.com/HenPiaoliang
>
>
> I've done it with Megapov in one-pass rendering using averaged camera 
> pigments.
>
> http://pterandon.blogspot.com/2009/05/how-to-make-one-pass-3d-anaglyphs-in.html
>
>
>
>

[Stephen] Re: New member [6068 days 9 hours and 27 minutes ago]

Wed, 26 Aug 2009 21:56:07 GMT

On Wed, 26 Aug 2009 17:40:03 -0400, "Sentenza" <iro### [at] videotronca>
wrote:

>Hi I m new in the newsgroup business, can someone please tell me what is the 
>subject of this particular newsgroup. Thank you have a great day. 
>

Hi Sentenza,
This is a newsgroup devoted to Pov-Ray raytracing software.
http://www.povray.org/

You have posted in the Internet Raytracing Contest folder. If you are interested
in computer graphics this is a good place to be :)
-- 

Regards
     Stephen

[Sentenza] New member [6068 days 9 hours and 42 minutes ago]

Wed, 26 Aug 2009 21:40:29 GMT

Hi I m new in the newsgroup business, can someone please tell me what is the 
subject of this particular newsgroup. Thank you have a great day.

[gregjohn] Re: Automatic anaglyph animation [6082 days 12 hours and 48 minutes ago]

Wed, 12 Aug 2009 18:35:01 GMT

"Kzerphii Toomk" <kze### [at] orangefr> wrote:
> Is it possible to make an anaglyphic animation with moray, only
> using moray technicals (refraction, transparency, reflects...) ?
>
> Anaglyphic readable with RB glasses...
>
> Thanks for ideas... ;-)
>
> Kzerphii
> http://www.youtube.com/HenPiaoliang


I've done it with Megapov in one-pass rendering using averaged camera pigments.

http://pterandon.blogspot.com/2009/05/how-to-make-one-pass-3d-anaglyphs-in.html

[Kzerphii Toomk] Automatic anaglyph animation [6087 days 20 hours ago]

Fri, 7 Aug 2009 11:22:54 GMT

Is it possible to make an anaglyphic animation with moray, only
using moray technicals (refraction, transparency, reflects...) ?

Anaglyphic readable with RB glasses...

Thanks for ideas... ;-)

Kzerphii
http://www.youtube.com/HenPiaoliang

[epic] --- [6152 days 23 hours and 50 minutes ago]

Wed, 3 Jun 2009 07:32:44 GMT

[Thomas de Groot] Re: A confession [6214 days 23 hours and 33 minutes ago]

Thu, 2 Apr 2009 07:49:24 GMT

There are not enough impostors like you.... :-)

Thomas

[Warp] Re: A confession [6215 days 17 hours and 8 minutes ago]

Wed, 1 Apr 2009 14:15:21 GMT

In povray.general Sascha Ledinsky <sas### [at] ledinskynet> wrote:
> I have to make a confession:
> My animation called "The Impostor", which won the April 2005 IRTC 
> animation contest, was not original. I've found it on some old betamax 
> tape and given the video quality it's probably much older (16mm film I 
> guess.)

> All I did was removing the scratches and colorizing it frame by frame 
> with The Gimp, lip-syncing a soundtrack to the video and uploading it to 
> the IRTC webpage.

> Well, I can't live with that lie any longer, so here's a link to the 
> original version of "The Impostor":

> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SftAX9zn9HA
> or
> http://jpatch.com/animations/vintage_impostor.mpg

> My apologies, I'm very sorry!

  Now you'll have to redeem yourself by making another, brand new animation
with POV-Ray.

-- 
                                                          - Warp

[Chris B] Re: A confession [6215 days 20 hours and 56 minutes ago]

Wed, 1 Apr 2009 10:26:28 GMT

"Sascha Ledinsky" <sas### [at] ledinskynet> wrote in message 
news:49d2c1a8$1@news.povray.org...
>I have to make a confession:
> My animation called "The Impostor", which won the April 2005 IRTC 
> animation contest, was not original. I've found it on some old betamax 
> tape and given the video quality it's probably much older (16mm film I 
> guess.)
>
> All I did was removing the scratches and colorizing it frame by frame with 
> The Gimp, lip-syncing a soundtrack to the video and uploading it to the 
> IRTC webpage.
>
> Well, I can't live with that lie any longer, so here's a link to the 
> original version of "The Impostor":
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SftAX9zn9HA
> or
> http://jpatch.com/animations/vintage_impostor.mpg
>
> My apologies, I'm very sorry!

This is outrageous and you're clearly doing it again! You've even retitled 
this 'original' as if it's you're own work, when it is recognisably a 
retouch of Walt Harvards 1943 short film for which he was largely 
discredited, accused of stealing Albert Finklestein's ideas and preliminary 
sketches from 1941, which themselves turned out to be a plagiarism of a 
cartouche found in the tomb of Archenarchenarchenen. When will this deceipt 
end?

The only saving grace is your excellent colorization work, enabling this 
classic to be appreciated by a whole new generation.

[Carlo C ] Re: A confession [6215 days 21 hours and 23 minutes ago]

Wed, 1 Apr 2009 10:00:01 GMT

Sascha Ledinsky <sas### [at] ledinskynet> wrote:
> I have to make a confession:
> My animation called "The Impostor", which won the April 2005 IRTC
> animation contest, was not original. I've found it on some old betamax
> tape and given the video quality it's probably much older (16mm film I
> guess.)
>
> All I did was removing the scratches and colorizing it frame by frame
> with The Gimp, lip-syncing a soundtrack to the video and uploading it to
> the IRTC webpage.

I almost believed it! :-D

>
> Well, I can't live with that lie any longer, so here's a link to the
> original version of "The Impostor":
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SftAX9zn9HA
> or
> http://jpatch.com/animations/vintage_impostor.mpg
>
> My apologies, I'm very sorry!

A masterpiece!

--
Carlo

[Stephen] Re: A confession [6215 days 23 hours and 4 minutes ago]

Wed, 1 Apr 2009 08:18:54 GMT

On Wed, 01 Apr 2009 03:21:43 +0200, Sascha Ledinsky <sas### [at] ledinskynet> wrote:

>I have to make a confession:

Nice one :-)
-- 

Regards
     Stephen

[triple r] Re: A confession [6216 days 5 hours and 28 minutes ago]

Wed, 1 Apr 2009 01:55:00 GMT

Jim Henderson <nos### [at] nospamcom> wrote:
> Very nice work, Sascha - I have to admit, you had me going there for a
> minute. ;-)

Oh yeah.  In my rage, I forgot to note what an excellent animation it is.  Of
course I thought you were serious, too.

 - Ricky

[Jim Henderson] Re: A confession [6216 days 5 hours and 39 minutes ago]

Wed, 1 Apr 2009 01:43:54 GMT

On Wed, 01 Apr 2009 03:21:43 +0200, Sascha Ledinsky wrote:

> Well, I can't live with that lie any longer, so here's a link to the
> original version of "The Impostor":

Very nice work, Sascha - I have to admit, you had me going there for a 
minute. ;-)

Jim

[Sascha Ledinsky] A confession [6216 days 6 hours and 1 minute ago]

Wed, 1 Apr 2009 01:21:44 GMT

I have to make a confession:
My animation called "The Impostor", which won the April 2005 IRTC 
animation contest, was not original. I've found it on some old betamax 
tape and given the video quality it's probably much older (16mm film I 
guess.)

All I did was removing the scratches and colorizing it frame by frame 
with The Gimp, lip-syncing a soundtrack to the video and uploading it to 
the IRTC webpage.

Well, I can't live with that lie any longer, so here's a link to the 
original version of "The Impostor":

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SftAX9zn9HA
or
http://jpatch.com/animations/vintage_impostor.mpg

My apologies, I'm very sorry!

[Stephen] Re: TC-RTC [6408 days 23 hours and 13 minutes ago]

Sat, 20 Sep 2008 08:09:55 GMT

On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 20:16:25 EDT, "gregjohn" <pte### [at] yahoocom> wrote:

>Stephen <mcavoysAT@aolDOTcom> wrote:
>> Does anyone have plans to enter this Challenge?
>> I've got an idea sketched out but I felt very lonely for the last one.
>>
>> BTW If anyone would like to comment on my last entry I would appreciate it.
>> --
>
>
>I hope I'm not taking advantage of the situation by grinding an old axe, but the
>idea of fourth months' time to produce an animation increases my anxieties about
>starting.
>
>

Why?
-- 

Regards
     Stephen

[gregjohn] Re: TC-RTC [6411 days 7 hours and 3 minutes ago]

Thu, 18 Sep 2008 00:20:01 GMT

Stephen <mcavoysAT@aolDOTcom> wrote:
> Does anyone have plans to enter this Challenge?
> I've got an idea sketched out but I felt very lonely for the last one.
>
> BTW If anyone would like to comment on my last entry I would appreciate it.
> --

I hope I'm not taking advantage of the situation by grinding an old axe, but the
idea of fourth months' time to produce an animation increases my anxieties about
starting.

[Stephen] Re: TC-RTC [6418 days 19 hours and 13 minutes ago]

Wed, 10 Sep 2008 12:10:00 GMT

Markus Altendorff <maa### [at] panoramasde> wrote:
> Stephen schrieb:
> > Does anyone have plans to enter this Challenge?
>
> Every darn time I have 'em, every darn time...
>

You are lucky it is only seldom that my ideas intersect with my ability. :)

> > I've got an idea sketched out but I felt very lonely for the last one.
>
> By all means, go ahead. Even if you're lonely on the TC-RTC list, at
> least you'd get three (!) keyrings: (NB: kiddin'!)
>

There is that, of course. And it is a challenge not a competition. The fun is in
making the animation.

But I don’t think Steve would give me three.

> Seriously, I must've missed that:
> http://www.tc-rtc.co.uk/prizes/index.html
>
> > BTW If anyone would like to comment on my last entry I would appreciate it.
>
> Well, I was pleasantly surprised. I think it's a clever idea, and well
> executed.
>
> -M

I think that it is a bit of a smartarse idea but I know the play very well as it
was the one that hooked me on Shakespeare when I was at school.
Thanks

[Markus Altendorff] Re: TC-RTC [6419 days 22 hours and 16 minutes ago]

Tue, 9 Sep 2008 09:06:42 GMT

Stephen schrieb:
> Does anyone have plans to enter this Challenge?

Every darn time I have 'em, every darn time...

> I've got an idea sketched out but I felt very lonely for the last one.

By all means, go ahead. Even if you're lonely on the TC-RTC list, at 
least you'd get three (!) keyrings: (NB: kiddin'!)

Seriously, I must've missed that:
http://www.tc-rtc.co.uk/prizes/index.html

> BTW If anyone would like to comment on my last entry I would appreciate it.

Well, I was pleasantly surprised. I think it's a clever idea, and well 
executed.

-M

[Stephen] TC-RTC [6420 days 21 hours and 59 minutes ago]

Mon, 8 Sep 2008 09:23:54 GMT

Does anyone have plans to enter this Challenge?
I've got an idea sketched out but I felt very lonely for the last one.

BTW If anyone would like to comment on my last entry I would appreciate it.
-- 

Regards
     Stephen

[Markus Altendorff] Re: The Tempest! [6546 days 11 hours and 43 minutes ago]

Mon, 5 May 2008 19:39:39 GMT

gregjohn wrote:
> Sounds interesting, although I'm not sure how I'm going to storyboard this plot:
> http://www.shakespeare-literature.com/The_Tempest/0.html

There's always an emergency fallback :)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tempest_in_a_tea_cup

-M

[John VanSickle] Re: The Tempest! [6552 days 19 hours and 28 minutes ago]

Tue, 29 Apr 2008 11:55:18 GMT

gregjohn wrote:
> Sounds interesting, although I'm not sure how I'm going to storyboard this plot:
> http://www.shakespeare-literature.com/The_Tempest/0.html

There was a video game by that name.  That should make things easier.

Regards,
John

[gregjohn] The Tempest! [6559 days 6 hours and 43 minutes ago]

Wed, 23 Apr 2008 00:40:00 GMT

Sounds interesting, although I'm not sure how I'm going to storyboard this plot:
http://www.shakespeare-literature.com/The_Tempest/0.html

[Markus Altendorff] While the IRTC is away, TC-RTC new animation top... [6566 days 1 hour ago]

Wed, 16 Apr 2008 06:22:32 GMT

Hi, quiet list,

the new animation topic for the TC-RTC is "Tempest" (as in, ya know, 
that Shakespeare guy's play, but don't let that limit your ideas too much).

In regard to the last topic, "In the Wilderness", this here after-hour 
wannabe animator can't help to declare his complete and utter FAIL to 
get it done in time for the deadline. :(
Idea: check
Script: check
Storyboard: check
Modelling scenery: 25% - FAIL
Modelling characters: 10% - FAIL
Animating: EPIC FAIL

Man, this "real life" stuff just keeps on eating away on my spare time...

-M

[Markus Altendorff] Still no IRTC? TC-RTC animation topic "In the Wi... [6625 days 8 hours and 6 minutes ago]

Sat, 16 Feb 2008 23:17:08 GMT

Hi,

just in case you're only subscribed to the irtc.animations 
newsgroup: The TC-RTC.co.uk topic is (still) "In the 
Wilderness", with the deadline on April 17th.

That's only 60 days as of today, so better finally start 
working your animation epic now. I know i should, too...

-Markus

[pan] Re: It's been a {FILTERED} year now. [6631 days 11 hours and 33 minutes ago]

Sun, 10 Feb 2008 19:49:40 GMT

"John VanSickle" <evi### [at] hotmailcom> wrote in message 
news:47aba535@news.povray.org...
> PASSENGER:  How long until this train leaves?
>
> CONDUCTOR:  That depends.
>
> PASSENGER:  Depends on what?
>
> CONDUCTOR:  That, also, depends.
>
> --
>
> It has been over a year since activity took place on the IRTC. 
> If the old admin won't come back and do the admin thing, 
> replacement is long overdue.
>
> If the admin, in spite of his/her/its inactivity, cannot be 
> replaced, the reasons therefore need to be made known to the IRTC 
> community.
>
> If the IRTC is dead and cannot be brought back, the time has come 
> to make it official.
>
> Regards,
> John


me too

[John VanSickle] It's been a {FILTERED} year now. [6634 days 6 hours and 41 minutes ago]

Fri, 8 Feb 2008 00:41:25 GMT

PASSENGER:  How long until this train leaves?

CONDUCTOR:  That depends.

PASSENGER:  Depends on what?

CONDUCTOR:  That, also, depends.

--

It has been over a year since activity took place on the IRTC.  If the 
old admin won't come back and do the admin thing, replacement is long 
overdue.

If the admin, in spite of his/her/its inactivity, cannot be replaced, 
the reasons therefore need to be made known to the IRTC community.

If the IRTC is dead and cannot be brought back, the time has come to 
make it official.

Regards,
John

[Mike the Elder] Re: TC-RTC: "Mother Hive" deadline passed, next ... [6683 days 14 hours and 8 minutes ago]

Thu, 20 Dec 2007 17:15:01 GMT

"Dan Byers" <goofygraffix_at_geemail_dot_com> wrote:
> "gregjohn" <pte### [at] yahoocom> wrote:
> >
> > Early on in round: Oh my, there's SOOOO much time that I have to plan an
> > enormous project. Do lots of thinking.
> >
> > Late in round: Eh, too late to start.
>
> Then there's the "Yeah, I can SO do this topic for once!", followed by the "Oh,
> crud... where in the %$#@ am I going to squeeze this project in???"
>
> There needs to be 600 hours per day.  That's the only way I can find time to do
> all the things I'd like to do :(
>
A nice man named Zeno solved this problem for us a while back:

Any portion of the project not completed in the first half of the round can be
done in the second half.

Any work not completed in the third quarter can be done in the fourth.

Any work not finished by the seventh eighth can be ...

This sequence can be continued indefinitely, thus providing an infinite number
of work phases in which to complete any project by its deadline.  Therefore
there is NO excuse for failing to submit an entry like I... oh, never mind!

Best Regards,
Mike C.

[Dan Byers] Re: TC-RTC: "Mother Hive" deadline passed, next ... [6683 days 14 hours and 43 minutes ago]

Thu, 20 Dec 2007 16:40:00 GMT

"gregjohn" <pte### [at] yahoocom> wrote:
>
> Early on in round: Oh my, there's SOOOO much time that I have to plan an
> enormous project. Do lots of thinking.
>
> Late in round: Eh, too late to start.

Then there's the "Yeah, I can SO do this topic for once!", followed by the "Oh,
crud... where in the %$#@ am I going to squeeze this project in???"

There needs to be 600 hours per day.  That's the only way I can find time to do
all the things I'd like to do :(

Dan
--
See my movies -- http://goofygraffix.com
Read my blog  -- http://goofygraffix.blogspot.com

[gregjohn] Re: TC-RTC: "Mother Hive" deadline passed, next ... [6683 days 19 hours and 13 minutes ago]

Thu, 20 Dec 2007 12:10:01 GMT

"St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote:

> Motivation Greg. Forget the planning.
> Just start it, then finish it.
> Let it build...  ;)
>

i) Wife tells me a I gotta story board.
ii) Weren't you all baffled by the plot line all those times I used that
planning methodology for the IRTC?   :-)

[John VanSickle] Re: TC-RTC: "Mother Hive" deadline passed, next ... [6684 days 8 hours and 17 minutes ago]

Wed, 19 Dec 2007 23:05:35 GMT

gregjohn wrote:
> "St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote: failure here, it's me, I do it. Manually.  ;)
>> Anyway, the next challenge has been chosen for both Stills and Anims,
>> and it's:
>>
>>      'In The Wilderness' by Robert Smythe Hichens, 1846-1950. (
>> http://www.tc-rtc.co.uk/index/index.html )
>>
>>      So, get your thinking caps on, and let's make it a good one for the New
>> Year!  :)
>>
> 
> 
> Thanks, St., for doing this project.  I've got my heart in it, even if I haven't
> produced yet.
> 
> Early on in round: Oh my, there's SOOOO much time that I have to plan an
> enormous project. Do lots of thinking.

And think things like, "there's lots of time.  No need to start today."

> Late in round: Eh, too late to start.

If it weren't for the last minute, I'd never get anything done.

Regards,
John

[St ] Re: TC-RTC: "Mother Hive" deadline passed, next ... [6684 days 10 hours and 39 minutes ago]

Wed, 19 Dec 2007 20:43:42 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote in message 
news:47694e0c@news.povray.org...
> gregjohn wrote:
>> "St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote: failure here, it's me, I do it. Manually.  ;)
>>> Anyway, the next challenge has been chosen for both Stills and Anims,
>>> and it's:
>>>
>>>      'In The Wilderness' by Robert Smythe Hichens, 1846-1950. (
>>> http://www.tc-rtc.co.uk/index/index.html )
>>>
>>>      So, get your thinking caps on, and let's make it a good one for the 
>>> New
>>> Year!  :)
>>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks, St., for doing this project.  I've got my heart in it, even if I 
>> haven't
>> produced yet.
>>
>> Early on in round: Oh my, there's SOOOO much time that I have to plan an
>> enormous project. Do lots of thinking.
>>
>> Late in round: Eh, too late to start.
>
> Same here :) except for me, another commitment popped up unexpectedly.
>
> This afternoon, i already got a script ready for "The Wilderness". Again, 
> just stealing the title, not the book ;)
> Only seven or eight camera angles, only one location. Need to model a 
> convincing tree and hilltop for the first time ever, though...

    I'm sure a man with your ability can do that simple task...   :)

       ~Steve~



>
> -M

[St ] Re: TC-RTC: "Mother Hive" deadline passed, next ... [6684 days 10 hours and 39 minutes ago]

Wed, 19 Dec 2007 20:43:41 GMT

"gregjohn" <pte### [at] yahoocom> wrote in message 
news:web.4768701270dd9e4b34d207310@news.povray.org...
> "St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote: failure here, it's me, I do it. Manually.  ;)
>>
>> Anyway, the next challenge has been chosen for both Stills and Anims,
>> and it's:
>>
>>      'In The Wilderness' by Robert Smythe Hichens, 1846-1950. (
>> http://www.tc-rtc.co.uk/index/index.html )
>>
>>      So, get your thinking caps on, and let's make it a good one for the 
>> New
>> Year!  :)
>>
>
>
> Thanks, St., for doing this project.  I've got my heart in it, even if I 
> haven't
> produced yet.
>
> Early on in round: Oh my, there's SOOOO much time that I have to plan an
> enormous project. Do lots of thinking.
>
> Late in round: Eh, too late to start.


     Motivation Greg. Forget the planning. Just start it, then finish it. 
Let it build...  ;)


        ~Steve~

[Markus Altendorff] Re: TC-RTC: "Mother Hive" deadline passed, next ... [6684 days 14 hours and 23 minutes ago]

Wed, 19 Dec 2007 16:59:56 GMT

gregjohn wrote:
> "St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote: failure here, it's me, I do it. Manually.  ;)
>> Anyway, the next challenge has been chosen for both Stills and Anims,
>> and it's:
>>
>>      'In The Wilderness' by Robert Smythe Hichens, 1846-1950. (
>> http://www.tc-rtc.co.uk/index/index.html )
>>
>>      So, get your thinking caps on, and let's make it a good one for the New
>> Year!  :)
>>
> 
> 
> Thanks, St., for doing this project.  I've got my heart in it, even if I haven't
> produced yet.
> 
> Early on in round: Oh my, there's SOOOO much time that I have to plan an
> enormous project. Do lots of thinking.
> 
> Late in round: Eh, too late to start.

Same here :) except for me, another commitment popped up 
unexpectedly.

This afternoon, i already got a script ready for "The 
Wilderness". Again, just stealing the title, not the book ;)
Only seven or eight camera angles, only one location. Need 
to model a convincing tree and hilltop for the first time 
ever, though...

-M

[gregjohn] Re: TC-RTC: "Mother Hive" deadline passed, next ... [6685 days 6 hours and 8 minutes ago]

Wed, 19 Dec 2007 01:15:00 GMT

"St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote: failure here, it's me, I do it. Manually.  ;)
>
> Anyway, the next challenge has been chosen for both Stills and Anims,
> and it's:
>
>      'In The Wilderness' by Robert Smythe Hichens, 1846-1950. (
> http://www.tc-rtc.co.uk/index/index.html )
>
>      So, get your thinking caps on, and let's make it a good one for the New
> Year!  :)
>

Thanks, St., for doing this project.  I've got my heart in it, even if I haven't
produced yet.

Early on in round: Oh my, there's SOOOO much time that I have to plan an
enormous project. Do lots of thinking.

Late in round: Eh, too late to start.

[John VanSickle] Re: TC-RTC: "Mother Hive" deadline passed, next ... [6685 days 7 hours and 26 minutes ago]

Tue, 18 Dec 2007 23:57:19 GMT

Markus Altendorff wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> the "mother hive" animation topic timeframe is done, with one entry by 
> the unfailing John VanSickle.

And there almost wasn't one from me.  The final rendering was done mere 
hours before the deadline.  Too much Diablo II, again.

Regards,
John

[St ] Re: TC-RTC: "Mother Hive" deadline passed, next ... [6685 days 12 hours and 28 minutes ago]

Tue, 18 Dec 2007 18:54:55 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote in message 
news:476800c5$1@news.povray.org...
> Hi,
>
> the "mother hive" animation topic timeframe is done, with one entry by the 
> unfailing John VanSickle.
>
> Next topic: ???
> (Steve, if the next topic was supposed to be announced automatically, then 
> i guess there's a server script that needs some extra ironing out ;)

    No, no server script failure here, it's me, I do it. Manually.  ;)

    Anyway, the next challenge has been chosen for both Stills and Anims, 
and it's:

     'In The Wilderness' by Robert Smythe Hichens, 1846-1950. ( 
http://www.tc-rtc.co.uk/index/index.html )

     So, get your thinking caps on, and let's make it a good one for the New 
Year!  :)

      ~Steve~




>
> -M

[Markus Altendorff] TC-RTC: "Mother Hive" deadline passed, next topic? [6685 days 14 hours and 5 minutes ago]

Tue, 18 Dec 2007 17:17:57 GMT

Hi,

the "mother hive" animation topic timeframe is done, with 
one entry by the unfailing John VanSickle.

Next topic: ???
(Steve, if the next topic was supposed to be announced 
automatically, then i guess there's a server script that 
needs some extra ironing out ;)

-M

[Markus Altendorff] Re: tc-rtc.co.uk Request [6687 days 8 hours and 27 minutes ago]

Sun, 16 Dec 2007 22:56:16 GMT

John VanSickle wrote:
> Could the site show the exact date and time of the submission deadline? 
>  At the moment (1715 EST on 16 Dec) the site shows only that there is 
> one day left.  That's not terribly useful.
> 

AFAIK this was "high noon" Greenwich/UT time, but the text 
should change to something along the "XYZ hours left" line 
once it's less than a day.

Sorry, that's not really helpful, i guess...

-Markus

[John VanSickle] tc-rtc.co.uk Request [6687 days 9 hours and 6 minutes ago]

Sun, 16 Dec 2007 22:17:10 GMT

Could the site show the exact date and time of the submission deadline? 
  At the moment (1715 EST on 16 Dec) the site shows only that there is 
one day left.  That's not terribly useful.

Regards,
John

[St ] Re: Countdown: 9 days for "Mother Hive" animatio... [6693 days and 38 minutes ago]

Tue, 11 Dec 2007 06:45:12 GMT

"John VanSickle" <evi### [at] hotmailcom> wrote in message 
news:475dc49b@news.povray.org...


> I'm also starting to put my animations up on YouTube, which among other 
> things frees me from worrying about topics.  The main reason I 
> participated in the IRTC was because the work was hosted.  With YouTube, I 
> might start putting work into more developed story lines now.

       John, you might want to consider this newish site: 
http://www.stage6.com

       I believe they spit out hi-res work only. There's some good stuff in 
the animations section.

         ~Steve~


>
> Regards,
> John

[St ] Re: Countdown: 9 days for "Mother Hive" animatio... [6693 days and 38 minutes ago]

Tue, 11 Dec 2007 06:45:11 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote in message 
news:475c00d4$1@news.povray.org...
> Hi,
>
> the next round on tc-rtc.co.uk (a.k.a. "IRTC 2" ;) starts on the 17th with 
> the announcement of the the next topic. The current topic ("The Mother 
> Hive") ends on the same day.
>
> Just a reminder :)

      Thanks Markus. :o)

>
> I'm not going to enter the "Hive" topic, though. Never got beyond the 
> storyboard phase. Darn that real life thing... :(

    Shame about that, but I know what you mean about the RL thing though.

     There's plenty more to come yet though, so keep your eye on it.  ;)

      ~Steve~



>
> -M

[John VanSickle] Re: Countdown: 9 days for "Mother Hive" animatio... [6693 days 8 hours and 24 minutes ago]

Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:58:35 GMT

Markus Altendorff wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> the next round on tc-rtc.co.uk (a.k.a. "IRTC 2" ;) starts on the 17th 
> with the announcement of the the next topic. The current topic ("The 
> Mother Hive") ends on the same day.
> 
> Just a reminder :)
> 
> I'm not going to enter the "Hive" topic, though. Never got beyond the 
> storyboard phase. Darn that real life thing... :(

I might end up submitting something not entirely complete, thanks to 
Diablo II.

I'm also starting to put my animations up on YouTube, which among other 
things frees me from worrying about topics.  The main reason I 
participated in the IRTC was because the work was hosted.  With YouTube, 
I might start putting work into more developed story lines now.

Regards,
John

[Markus Altendorff] Countdown: 9 days for "Mother Hive" animation ro... [6694 days 16 hours and 32 minutes ago]

Sun, 9 Dec 2007 14:51:00 GMT

Hi,

the next round on tc-rtc.co.uk (a.k.a. "IRTC 2" ;) starts on 
the 17th with the announcement of the the next topic. The 
current topic ("The Mother Hive") ends on the same day.

Just a reminder :)

I'm not going to enter the "Hive" topic, though. Never got 
beyond the storyboard phase. Darn that real life thing... :(

-M

[David Cuny] Re: Sound? [6751 days 10 hours and 48 minutes ago]

Sat, 13 Oct 2007 20:35:00 GMT

Some IRTC judges were under the mistaken impression that sound was
prohibited. That's not the case.

The rules say that sound should be "ignored" by judges, in that it shouldn't
effect the score because it's the *animation* that's being judged, not the
audio.

The rules point out that, (at the time they were written), most people would
not be able to hear the sound if it were included. That's just a statement
of fact, but it's no longer the case today. It would be the same as saying
most people at the time would only have VGA monitors. It would be silly for
a judge to take that as an instruction that the monitor would have to be set
to 256 color mode before watching videos.

However, I've had one judge do exactly that - he wrote that since the
instructions used the word "ignored", that meant that the animation should
be watched *with the sound turned off*.

Then he deducted points from the animation because he couldn't
understand what the animation was about. :(

(The irony here was the sound was mixed so badly, he wouldn't have
understood the animation *with* the sound. But that's another story).

I wrote to the person in charge at the time, but he sort of shrugged it off.
He thought he rules were clear, and if the judges couldn't understand them,
what could he do?

The upshot of this is that, because the judges wrongly assume that
animations should be silent, animations with sound have been submitted with
subtitles, so they wouldn't get judged negatively.

Again, there was *never* an intent to prohibit sound from the IRTC
animations. It's fine that some people choose to use subtitles, but that
doesn't mean that it should be forced on others if they want to use sound.

[dbott] Re: Sound? [6773 days 2 hours and 59 minutes ago]

Sat, 22 Sep 2007 04:24:00 GMT

It's funny you mentioned blender, I just installed it and have been messing
around with it for the last 2 weeks. While trying to produce a decent
animation "The Mother Hive" in pov. WIP `~~~>
http://www.eastsoundsuites.com/animations/test.bmp. I kinda like blender. I
spent 2 1/2 years off and on with pov, I think it might be time for a
change. But it's like starting all over. We will see how it
goes.............

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Sound? [6773 days 13 hours and 38 minutes ago]

Fri, 21 Sep 2007 17:44:57 GMT

Stephen wrote:

> That is an impressive list of software, for me Pov-Ray was the first
> graphics engine I tried and it stuck. It is probably more than what I need
> of a renderer but the price was right. And the people who frequent these
> news groups are OK, on the whole.

If i were to name the software i actually used on a larger 
scale, it'd be Specular InfiniD, at a time when the company 
i'm working for also did some experiments in multimedia and 
presentation videos - never really took off, we had one or 
two in-house examples and that was it - and then Cinema4D 
after Specular went under.

I just had a nostalgic glance at the Macromedia Graphics 
Studio boxing: that other 3D software i didn't recall was 
first called MacroModel, then "Extreme 3D" (and "E3D 2").

The "Extreme" is hinting at the render times on a 10-MHz 
68000 CPU, of course :)

-M

[Stephen] Re: Sound? [6773 days 18 hours and 23 minutes ago]

Fri, 21 Sep 2007 13:00:00 GMT

Markus Altendorff <maa### [at] panoramasde> wrote:
> Stephen wrote:
> > I don’t know Macs so I can’t comment but it gets good reviews.
> > It is a shame (I think) that you can’t run Pov-Ray but other than haunting
> > these newsgroups do you really need it?
>
> Uh... no. That's why i'm only in the IRTC newsgroups, because they're
> supposed to be "for everyone" :)

Oh! I did not notice that I’ve not seen your name on other groups. Of course
they’re for anyone who can find them and be bothered to stay :-)

> Then again, i've got a collection of software that goes back to 1996 or
> something,
[snip]

> and effects. So also checking out PoVray isn't all that off-base for me :)
>
> -Markus

That is an impressive list of software, for me Pov-Ray was the first
graphics engine I tried and it stuck. It is probably more than what I need
of a renderer but the price was right. And the people who frequent these
news groups are OK, on the whole.

Stephen

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Sound? [6773 days 19 hours and 43 minutes ago]

Fri, 21 Sep 2007 11:40:19 GMT

Stephen wrote:
> I don’t know Macs so I can’t comment but it gets good reviews.
> It is a shame (I think) that you can’t run Pov-Ray but other than haunting
> these newsgroups do you really need it?

Uh... no. That's why i'm only in the IRTC newsgroups, because they're 
supposed to be "for everyone" :)
Then again, i've got a collection of software that goes back to 1996 or 
something, and it's nice to look "across the fence" from time to time. 
Specular Infini-D 3 or something was the first one i had (bought at a 
local mac store when they cleared their inventory), followed by 3.1 and 
3.5 until Specular collapsed and ID3.5 was sold to Metacreations, only 
to later resurface as ... uh ... wasn't it called "Canoma" or something? 
Box cover had a marble gargoyle sitting at a pond. Been a long time... 
by then, i was already too comfortable with C4D to spend substantial 
money on a second lane of tools.
Cinema started with version 5 (from a magazine, one of those "discount 
for upgrade" things), and i've kept up with it to the day. Even had some 
misspent cash on add-ons like "Shave and a Haircut" (hair plugin) or the 
Ozone "Sky and Clouds" extensions, that years later got rolled into the 
master software and only then became usable for me.
Another software i met was in Macromedia's Studio package (they even hat 
xRes, which was sort of a Photoshop rival), it was included when i 
bought my DTP tools, but i never really got the hang of it. Same for 
Poser, though i tend to follow the updates to the legal free older 
versions that are occasionally offered for promotion.
Looking back, it's amazing what got bundled into those "Studio" packages 
then.
Then there's Blender, of course, but i just can't wrap my mind around 
the interface - or i'm just no trying hard enough. Has some nice tools 
and effects. So also checking out PoVray isn't all that off-base for me :)

-Markus

[Stephen] Re: Sound? [6773 days 20 hours and 8 minutes ago]

Fri, 21 Sep 2007 11:15:00 GMT

Markus Altendorff <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote:
> Stephen wrote:
>
> > That’s a shame what are you using, a Cray?
>
> As of July '07, it's the "middle model" MacPro (4x2.66 GHz).
> Nice box :) though i've managed to safely dissipate the
> increase in CPU performance by excessive use of hair+cloth
> simulation...
>
> :)
>
> There's something odd with PoVray, on some machines, it's
> been reported to work, on some not. Mine is of the latter type.
>
> -M

Ah! The “Never let a CPU tick go unused” syndrome :-) I know about cloth
simulation, in Poser and you can never have a fast enough computer.
Unfortunately hair is a bit of a problem getting it into Pov-Ray so I use
short unmovable cuts.
I don’t know Macs so I can’t comment but it gets good reviews.
It is a shame (I think) that you can’t run Pov-Ray but other than haunting
these newsgroups do you really need it?

Stephen

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Sound? [6774 days 15 hours and 9 minutes ago]

Thu, 20 Sep 2007 16:13:37 GMT

Stephen wrote:

> That’s a shame what are you using, a Cray?

As of July '07, it's the "middle model" MacPro (4x2.66 GHz).
Nice box :) though i've managed to safely dissipate the 
increase in CPU performance by excessive use of hair+cloth 
simulation...

:)

There's something odd with PoVray, on some machines, it's 
been reported to work, on some not. Mine is of the latter type.

-M

[Stephen] Re: Sound? [6774 days 16 hours and 48 minutes ago]

Thu, 20 Sep 2007 14:35:01 GMT

Markus Altendorff <maa### [at] panoramasde> wrote:
> Stephen wrote:
> > I’m in two minds about animations with sound. ...

>
> Me too. Sound shouldn't be a deciding factor. It seems unfair -
> composing or mixing an additional soundtrack is something that favours
> things like audio clipart collections or software that doesn't come
> cheap, OR just slapping some MP3 to a video and risk getting into
> trouble with copyright. OR digging for hours through the Creative
> Commons file pools in search of something that fits the mood of the video.

Too much like hard work for my liking :)

> > But I did switch it on for Markus and Rob’s animations and it did enhance
> > the experience. (I must watch Markus’s previous entries with the sound
> > switched on.)
>
> <me waving hand in Jedi gesture>You do not at all want to watch my
> previous entries.</>
> ;)

LOL


>
> I'm not exactly inclined to talk you out of this - sound or no sound is
> also a matter of having the tools and resources available, and this
> shouldn't be a deciding factor for an animation competition. Just
> because i've happened to be editing home videos for more than a decade,
> which means i've stacks of disks of background music that came with the
> software available, to use legally, doesn't mean i should be getting a
> higher rating for an animation because of the soundtrack.
> Sound is extremely powerful in evoking emotions, i'd say much more so
> than visuals alone. Videos without sound are automatically at a
> disadvantage, no doubt about it.


True and it can’t be unheard, once you have listened to it. Your mind then
fills in the details.
Maybe the real reason I’m against it is because, it would be too dificult
for me to do :-)
I can imagine putting music to my shorts but then they would become full
length movies.



>
> You can't begin to imagine how hard it is. :)

How did I know that you would say that :)


> Basically, anything that can be "script-controlled" or is
> procedural/recursive by nature is easier in POV than in Cinema. Pushing
> polygons or meshes around is easier in C4D than in
> POV-without-a-modeller. Particle effects are so-so. Setting them up and
> previewing is easier in C4D. Rule-based particles are a pain in each
> software. Setting up dynamic effects (clothing, hair) is easy in C4D,
> getting them to work as desired is unnerving, but i guess that's the
> same in every software.

Thanks for the synopsis and yes I guess clothing is fun in any S/Ware :)


> It seems POV compares rather to the render module of Cinema alone than
> the whole C4D package, e.g. feeding said module the data by hand would
> be the equivalent of using POVray combined with a text editor.

Well I’m no purist I always use a modeller to set up my scene then tinker by
hand. My entry to the Tina Chep was the first time I’ve used the animation
controls in the modeller.


> I've played around with "plain" POV for a while (sadly, it doesn't
> launch any more on my new computer), and that's why i've got lots of
> respect for everyone doing computer animation that way...
>
That’s a shame what are you using, a Cray?




Stephen

[gregjohn] Re: Sound? [6774 days 18 hours and 13 minutes ago]

Thu, 20 Sep 2007 13:10:01 GMT

"St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote:
>
> If it's needed in the FAQ, I'll add it. Please let
> me know your thoughts.
>

First of all, apologies for nagging questions like mine here, but I was
starting to take ** my possible involvement** in the contest (not the
contest itself) more seriously, and so I went to look for info with a
"newbie" hat on.  I was just wondering if it were either now verbotten or
encouraged.

My idea:
If there is a polite, brotherly, non-consensus of differing views, than put
a FAQ which explicitly states the status of opinions.

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Sound? [6774 days 21 hours and 33 minutes ago]

Thu, 20 Sep 2007 09:49:34 GMT

Stephen wrote:
> "St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote:
> 
>>        Anyway, this isn't the Stills group, this is the Animations group, so
>> all, what's the general consensus with 'sound' in animations?
>>
> 
> I’m in two minds about animations with sound. On one hand this is a
> raytracing comp and adding sound adds another dimension. I seldom listen to
> sound on my machine, in fact I generally have it switched off completely.

Me too. Sound shouldn't be a deciding factor. It seems unfair - 
composing or mixing an additional soundtrack is something that favours 
things like audio clipart collections or software that doesn't come 
cheap, OR just slapping some MP3 to a video and risk getting into 
trouble with copyright. OR digging for hours through the Creative 
Commons file pools in search of something that fits the mood of the video.

> But I did switch it on for Markus and Rob’s animations and it did enhance
> the experience. (I must watch Markus’s previous entries with the sound
> switched on.) 

<me waving hand in Jedi gesture>You do not at all want to watch my 
previous entries.</>
;)

 > So I think that since sound can improve or detract from the
> enjoyment of an animation it should have a separate category for marking
> which is not taken into account for the final placing but only for feedback
> for the authors. I think that the ratings should not take sound into
> account. I would be willing to be talked out of this.

I'm not exactly inclined to talk you out of this - sound or no sound is 
also a matter of having the tools and resources available, and this 
shouldn't be a deciding factor for an animation competition. Just 
because i've happened to be editing home videos for more than a decade, 
which means i've stacks of disks of background music that came with the 
software available, to use legally, doesn't mean i should be getting a 
higher rating for an animation because of the soundtrack.
Sound is extremely powerful in evoking emotions, i'd say much more so 
than visuals alone. Videos without sound are automatically at a 
disadvantage, no doubt about it.

> Another point is the Technical rating. How are we supposed to judge this?
> For me it is fine marking Pov-Ray created animations but how would I know
> what is hard or easy to do in Cinema 4D? Just a point for discussion.

You can't begin to imagine how hard it is. :)
Basically, anything that can be "script-controlled" or is 
procedural/recursive by nature is easier in POV than in Cinema. Pushing 
polygons or meshes around is easier in C4D than in 
POV-without-a-modeller. Particle effects are so-so. Setting them up and 
previewing is easier in C4D. Rule-based particles are a pain in each 
software. Setting up dynamic effects (clothing, hair) is easy in C4D, 
getting them to work as desired is unnerving, but i guess that's the 
same in every software.

It seems POV compares rather to the render module of Cinema alone than 
the whole C4D package, e.g. feeding said module the data by hand would 
be the equivalent of using POVray combined with a text editor.

I've played around with "plain" POV for a while (sadly, it doesn't 
launch any more on my new computer), and that's why i've got lots of 
respect for everyone doing computer animation that way...

-Markus

[Stephen] Re: Sound? [6774 days 22 hours and 43 minutes ago]

Thu, 20 Sep 2007 08:40:00 GMT

"St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote:

>        Anyway, this isn't the Stills group, this is the Animations group, so
> all, what's the general consensus with 'sound' in animations?
>

I’m in two minds about animations with sound. On one hand this is a
raytracing comp and adding sound adds another dimension. I seldom listen to
sound on my machine, in fact I generally have it switched off completely.
But I did switch it on for Markus and Rob’s animations and it did enhance
the experience. (I must watch Markus’s previous entries with the sound
switched on.) So I think that since sound can improve or detract from the
enjoyment of an animation it should have a separate category for marking
which is not taken into account for the final placing but only for feedback
for the authors. I think that the ratings should not take sound into
account. I would be willing to be talked out of this.

Another point is the Technical rating. How are we supposed to judge this?
For me it is fine marking Pov-Ray created animations but how would I know
what is hard or easy to do in Cinema 4D? Just a point for discussion.

Stephen

[St ] Re: Sound? [6775 days 7 hours and 50 minutes ago]

Wed, 19 Sep 2007 23:32:58 GMT

"Greg M. Johnson" <pte### [at] thecommononethatstartswithYcom> wrote in 
message news:46f08c94@news.povray.org...
> Should this be a line item in the FAQ?

      Quite possibly Greg. I really don't know, I'm a Stills guy, and as far 
as I know, sound isn't allowed within the Stills Challenges, but hey, 
there's a new scope yet for Stills, eh? :)

       Anyway, this isn't the Stills group, this is the Animations group, so 
all, what's the general consensus with 'sound' in animations?

         If it's needed in the FAQ, I'll add it. Please let me know your 
thoughts.


            ~Steve~

[Greg M Johnson] Sound? [6776 days 4 hours and 40 minutes ago]

Wed, 19 Sep 2007 02:42:28 GMT

Should this be a line item in the FAQ?

[Markus Altendorff] Re: End date? [6776 days 8 hours and 19 minutes ago]

Tue, 18 Sep 2007 23:03:22 GMT

gregjohn wrote:
> I don't see any mention of the end date for the September 2007 round on the
> contest web page. A note in the previous thread made a reference to a
> contest length that IMO was incorrect.

At the moment, the web page says "104 days", which points to 
a December 31st end date. However, Stephen mentioned that 
for the voting to work "as usual" (i.e. voting only AFTER 
the deadline) within the current schedule, it'd be necessary 
to move the deadline for uploads backwards to the 17th, then 
enable voting from 18th to 31st. The new topic would be 
announced on the 17th/18th, too, so the "effective working 
time" would remain at 4 months, with the exception of the 
current round.
At least that was the idea, because (i guess) then Colin 
wouldn't need to re-write much of the automation of the web 
page. So far, there's not been another word wether/when 
this'll be activated. Maybe they just need a little more 
time to work it out. For more details, take a look at 
irtc.stills, Sept. 12th

(i hope this URL works, lots of funny characters in it: )
http://news.povray.org/irtc.stills/thread/%3C46e7d2fc%241%40news.povray.org%3E/

-Markus

[gregjohn] End date? [6776 days 13 hours and 53 minutes ago]

Tue, 18 Sep 2007 17:30:01 GMT

I don't see any mention of the end date for the September 2007 round on the
contest web page. A note in the previous thread made a reference to a
contest length that IMO was incorrect.

[dbott] Re: Last ("black robe") round: a follow-up [6777 days 7 hours and 35 minutes ago]

Mon, 17 Sep 2007 23:47:48 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote in message
news:46ecf5ed@news.povray.org...
> Hi, me again,
>
> (cue: groaning from the audience) ;)
> (in that case, could "someone" punch in 1/1/1 for my entry
> so that i at least show up on the "ranking" page? "0/0/0"
> seems to fall off the ledge somehow :)

Markus-
I expressed how I felt in regards to your animation. I would put marks on
the board for you, but the tc-rtc web page will not give me access to the
voting page. I keep on checking.................Darin

[Markus Altendorff] Last ("black robe") round: a follow-up [6778 days 22 hours ago]

Sun, 16 Sep 2007 09:22:53 GMT

Hi, me again,

(cue: groaning from the audience) ;)

another question: from the descriptions and message exchange 
over the last weeks, it seems the timeframes and intervals 
for voting, uploading etc. are pretty much hard-coded into 
the scripts driving the tc-rtc.co.uk. So are we going to 
have a chance at "re-commenting/re-voting" on "Black Robe" 
on the webpage at all, or is this simply not practical 
because the scripts don't support time-shifting, and should 
we talk about our opinions on the videos here on 
irtc.animations instead and label "Black Robe" as 
"Beta-testing" instead?

(in that case, could "someone" punch in 1/1/1 for my entry 
so that i at least show up on the "ranking" page? "0/0/0" 
seems to fall off the ledge somehow :)

Another idea: if, on Sept. 18th there is a "fake" stop time 
entry of Sept. 17th retro-created for "Black Robe", would 
this mean that voting/commenting would work again up to 
Sept. 31st? Or would this mess up the whole 
upload/topic/etc. system?

-M

[Markus Altendorff] Changes to tc-rtc upload/voting/etc. [6780 days 22 hours and 27 minutes ago]

Fri, 14 Sep 2007 08:55:24 GMT

Hi,

just in case you're not also subscribed to irtc.stills, this is what has 
  evolved over the last week:

As announced by Steven, to get voting etc. on tc-rtc.co.uk working "as 
used to be", those technical changes are most likely to happen:

1) new topics are announced on the 17th of the respective month
2) uploads are possible from the beginning of the following month.
3) uploads end on the 17th instead of the 31st/30th
4) voting on a topic is possible from 18th to 31st/30th

In short, the length remains at four months, it's just shifted by 
approx. two weeks. Uploading is possible at the earliest two weeks after 
the topics announcement (not much of a problem, i'd say).

This most likely means that your "The Mother Hive" animation better be 
ready by Dec. 17th instead of Dec. 31st...

-Markus

"Dec. 17th? <whimper>" ;)

[Nimish Ajmani] Re: in scene,windows in wall,how simulate sunlig... [6787 days 10 hours and 3 minutes ago]

Fri, 7 Sep 2007 21:20:01 GMT

I am assuming you meen how to simulate sunlight causing a media effect
coming through the window.

You will want to place a light_source outside your "room", then place a box
with media inside, where the sunbeam falls.  I think there's a sample in
the documentation.

[jack zhang] Re: who know sunlight in povray? [6787 days 14 hours and 27 minutes ago]

Fri, 7 Sep 2007 16:55:30 GMT

thank you very much!
"Warp" <war### [at] tagpovrayorg>
Ð´ÈëÏûÏ¢ÐÂÎÅ:46e17483@news.povray.org...
> jack zhang <zha### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
>> in secene,windows in wall,how simulate sunlight in povray?
>
>  You mean like this?
>
> http://povray.org/documentation/view/3.6.1/100/
>
> -- 
>                                                          - Warp

[jack zhang] in scene,windows in wall,how simulate sunlight f... [6787 days 14 hours and 31 minutes ago]

Fri, 7 Sep 2007 16:51:37 GMT

[Warp] Re: who know sunlight in povray? [6787 days 15 hours and 27 minutes ago]

Fri, 7 Sep 2007 15:55:47 GMT

jack zhang <zha### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
> in secene,windows in wall,how simulate sunlight in povray?

  You mean like this?

http://povray.org/documentation/view/3.6.1/100/

-- 
                                                          - Warp

[jack zhang] Re: who know sunlight in povray? [6787 days 15 hours and 35 minutes ago]

Fri, 7 Sep 2007 15:48:04 GMT

in secene,windows in wall,how simulate sunlight in povray?
"Stephen" <mcavoys_AT_aolDOT.com> 
??????:web.46e15f597120d11c726bd13c0@news.povray.org...
> "jack zhang" <zha### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
>> about sunlight in povray
>
> Hello Jack
> Maybe you could phrase you question again. What do you want to know about
> sunlight? What sort of experience of Pov-Ray do you have and what sort of
> scene would you want to create.
> Sunlight is not trivial, unfortunately, and creating realistic lighting is
> not easy.
>
>
> Stephen
>
>
>

[Stephen] Re: who know sunlight in povray? [6787 days 16 hours and 53 minutes ago]

Fri, 7 Sep 2007 14:30:00 GMT

"jack zhang" <zha### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
> about sunlight in povray

Hello Jack
 Maybe you could phrase you question again. What do you want to know about
sunlight? What sort of experience of Pov-Ray do you have and what sort of
scene would you want to create.
Sunlight is not trivial, unfortunately, and creating realistic lighting is
not easy.


Stephen

[Warp] Re: who know sunlight in povray? [6787 days 17 hours and 14 minutes ago]

Fri, 7 Sep 2007 14:08:57 GMT

jack zhang <zha### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
> about sunlight in povray 

  Yeah, it's sunlight.

-- 
                                                          - Warp

[jack zhang] who know sunlight in povray? [6788 days 5 hours and 16 minutes ago]

Fri, 7 Sep 2007 02:06:53 GMT

about sunlight in povray

[Nimish Ajmani] Re: Next Challenge [6788 days 6 hours and 48 minutes ago]

Fri, 7 Sep 2007 00:35:00 GMT

"dbott" <dbo### [at] eastsoundsuitescom> wrote:
> > I've been itching to use a new Star-ship model which, thinking of this
> idea,
> > I may already have an idea set.
> >
> > How big can the files be?
> >
> >   --Nimish
>
> Animations can be 12 megs or less.....
>
> Darin

Thanks for the file size

  --Nimish

[dbott] Re: Next Challenge [6789 days 3 hours and 39 minutes ago]

Thu, 6 Sep 2007 03:43:40 GMT

> I've been itching to use a new Star-ship model which, thinking of this
idea,
> I may already have an idea set.
>
> How big can the files be?
>
>   --Nimish

Animations can be 12 megs or less.....

Darin

[Nimish Ajmani] Re: Next Challenge [6789 days 6 hours and 3 minutes ago]

Thu, 6 Sep 2007 01:20:00 GMT

I think I allready have a design made out for this.

I've been itching to use a new Star-ship model which, thinking of this idea,
I may already have an idea set.

How big can the files be?

  --Nimish

[Stephen] Re: So What's going on??? [6791 days and 3 minutes ago]

Tue, 4 Sep 2007 07:20:00 GMT

"dbott" <dbo### [at] eastsoundsuitescom> wrote:
> I went to judge the "The Black Robe" round of animation and a winner has
> been chosen. Well Steve, you knew this comment was coming. I'm sure you are
> working on the problem...........
>
> Darin (dbott)

Does that mean that I’m in second place to John? That’s a win in my book :-)

Yes Beta testing is still going on, where do we send the bug reports, Steve?

I agree with Markus’s suggestion, btw.
I have my votes and comments in a s/sheet ready for cut and pasting.
Another suggestion is to hide the display of votes until after the count.

Stephen

[Markus Altendorff] Re: So What's going on??? [6791 days and 31 minutes ago]

Tue, 4 Sep 2007 06:52:13 GMT

dbott schrieb:
> I went to judge the "The Black Robe" round of animation and a winner has
> been chosen. Well Steve, you knew this comment was coming. I'm sure you are
> working on the problem...........

Having managed to kick myself out of the ranking page by doing my public 
service of voting (no comments on electoral systems, please ;-) ), i'm 
inclined to consider the voting system "beta" for the time being, too... ;)

Seriously, though, a second timeframe for voting (i.e. voting can not 
start until primary deadline has passed, and the winner is picked after 
the second timeframe) is something that should be considered.

Take this example:
Film 1 (entered one month early) is voted on several times by members, 
up until the entry deadline.
Films 2 thru X are entered very close to the deadline.
No chance to ever vote on them...

-M

[dbott] So What's going on??? [6791 days 1 hour and 29 minutes ago]

Tue, 4 Sep 2007 05:54:21 GMT

I went to judge the "The Black Robe" round of animation and a winner has
been chosen. Well Steve, you knew this comment was coming. I'm sure you are
working on the problem...........

Darin (dbott)

[Stephen] Re: Next Challenge [6791 days 20 hours and 48 minutes ago]

Mon, 3 Sep 2007 10:35:01 GMT

"St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote:
> "dbott" <dbo### [at] eastsoundsuitescom> wrote in message
> news:46dae8c6@news.povray.org...
> > Great pick for the next title........"The Mother Hive".........a house
> > divided (very cool).
> >
> > Can't get to the animations for commenting. Should I comment here or wait
> > till the animation page is up?
>
>       If you can give it a day or two to wait Darin, (I'll let you know here
> soon), that would be much appreciated. (Obviously, this goes for other
> peoples comments too for Animations).
>
>        Thank you (all) for your patience.
>
>         ~Steve~


Actually, if you leave it the way it is I’ll have a better score :-)

Just let us know when we can vote and comment. Sorry your feeling poorly.


Stephen

[John VanSickle] Re: Next Challenge [6792 days 4 hours and 38 minutes ago]

Mon, 3 Sep 2007 02:44:36 GMT

St. wrote:
> "John VanSickle" <evi### [at] hotmailcom> wrote in message 
> news:46da182b$1@news.povray.org...
> 
>>If my modeler can do a human being, I might be able to gin up something 
>>good for this.
> 
>      Hey John, I've tried your modeler and I know it's more than capable. 
> It's all about what the artist (modeller) does with it/can do with it. Keep 
> at it, it'll be worth it. :)
> 
>    As for the topic, yeah, this is a good one for you too.  ;)

I have a definite story idea worked out.  It all hangs on whether I can 
design a workable human model and animate it well in four months.

Regards,
John

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Next Challenge [6792 days 7 hours and 56 minutes ago]

Sun, 2 Sep 2007 23:27:02 GMT

St. wrote:

>     No, not nuked, it's still there. I think it's something to do with the 
> change-over code for the end of the month, (so you're right with the 
> 'updating topics' part). It *will* be sorted, as will the voting and 
> commenting time period. <Sigh, sorry everyone, I feel not too good at this 
> moment in time>.

Take your time, and get well soon. You're doing a great job 
keeping this all running, and communicating about it.

Ah, the pages are back online! Still some things to sort 
out, i guess (topic isn't yet showing at 
http://www.tc-rtc.co.uk/display/animation.html etc.)

Yeah, the voting/commenting really needs a bit more 
fine-tuning, at least a secondary timeframe from deadline to 
maybe a week later - i tried voting, and what do i get? 
Totally disappeared from the tabulated list ... ah, the joys 
of betatesting  :)

Well, at least i can report that voting works, not giving 
points to one's own entry works, and commenting works, too :)

However, for a vote to "work out" (this includes the math of 
adding the results), i suggest that either we need the panel 
judges approach back, and at least require all entrants to 
vote or none at all, for the vote to be valid. Otherwise, 
those that do vote get a penalty over those that do not vote 
(on average by 100 % * voting entrants / number of entrants, 
or something ;) because by voting one boosts all other 
entries except one's own - which is OK, if everyone in the 
current round does it.

I hope that description does make sense...?

-M

[St ] Re: Next Challenge [6792 days 11 hours and 59 minutes ago]

Sun, 2 Sep 2007 19:23:43 GMT

"John VanSickle" <evi### [at] hotmailcom> wrote in message 
news:46da182b$1@news.povray.org...
> St. wrote:
>> Hi All
>>
>>     The next Stills and Animations Challenge is "The Mother Hive" by 
>> Rudyard Kipling 1865-1936
>>
>>       Sounds good to me!  :o)
>>
>>      (I'm aware that the animations page isn't showing. I have no idea 
>> why, but this will be fixed sometime this evening. Sorry about this).

        Well, hey, soon.  :(

>
> If my modeler can do a human being, I might be able to gin up something 
> good for this.

     Hey John, I've tried your modeler and I know it's more than capable. 
It's all about what the artist (modeller) does with it/can do with it. Keep 
at it, it'll be worth it. :)

   As for the topic, yeah, this is a good one for you too.  ;)

    ~Steve~



>
> Regards,
> John

[St ] Re: Next Challenge [6792 days 12 hours and 14 minutes ago]

Sun, 2 Sep 2007 19:09:10 GMT

"dbott" <dbo### [at] eastsoundsuitescom> wrote in message 
news:46dae8c6@news.povray.org...
> Great pick for the next title........"The Mother Hive".........a house
> divided (very cool).
>
> Can't get to the animations for commenting. Should I comment here or wait
> till the animation page is up?

      If you can give it a day or two to wait Darin, (I'll let you know here 
soon), that would be much appreciated. (Obviously, this goes for other 
peoples comments too for Animations).

       Thank you (all) for your patience.

        ~Steve~


>
> Darin
>
>

[St ] Re: Next Challenge [6792 days 12 hours and 26 minutes ago]

Sun, 2 Sep 2007 18:57:17 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote in message 
news:46da97b4$1@news.povray.org...
> St. wrote:
>> Hi All
>>
>>     The next Stills and Animations Challenge is "The Mother Hive" by 
>> Rudyard Kipling 1865-1936
>>
>>       Sounds good to me!  :o)
>
> Me too :) finally a chance to do a "character background" storyline. 
> *grin*

   Oh yes, I thought this might be up your street...  :)


>
> Uh. Hold that thought. I'd need to build *even more* character models for 
> that. (sound of head banging on table...)

    Heh, don't knock yourself out buddy, you're more than capable.  :)


>
>>
>>      (I'm aware that the animations page isn't showing. I have no idea 
>> why, but this will be fixed sometime this evening. Sorry about this).
>>
>
> Beyond login it's empty-white, too. After the page not recognizing the 
> "hanging login cookie", i entered U/PW, and got white pages instead. Even 
> when trying the bookmarks in the animation section.
> e.g. nada at:
> http://www.tc-rtc.co.uk/displayallimages/animation/18/2007-May.html
>
> Looks like something went wrong when updating topics? /animations 
> directory accidentally nuked?

    No, not nuked, it's still there. I think it's something to do with the 
change-over code for the end of the month, (so you're right with the 
'updating topics' part). It *will* be sorted, as will the voting and 
commenting time period. <Sigh, sorry everyone, I feel not too good at this 
moment in time>.

     ~Steve~


>
> -M

[dbott] Re: Next Challenge [6792 days 14 hours and 37 minutes ago]

Sun, 2 Sep 2007 16:45:58 GMT

Great pick for the next title........"The Mother Hive".........a house
divided (very cool).

Can't get to the animations for commenting. Should I comment here or wait
till the animation page is up?

Darin

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Next Challenge [6792 days 20 hours and 23 minutes ago]

Sun, 2 Sep 2007 11:00:04 GMT

St. wrote:
> Hi All
> 
>     The next Stills and Animations Challenge is "The Mother Hive" by Rudyard 
> Kipling 1865-1936
> 
>       Sounds good to me!  :o)

Me too :) finally a chance to do a "character background" 
storyline. *grin*

Uh. Hold that thought. I'd need to build *even more* 
character models for that. (sound of head banging on table...)

> 
>      (I'm aware that the animations page isn't showing. I have no idea why, 
> but this will be fixed sometime this evening. Sorry about this).
> 

Beyond login it's empty-white, too. After the page not 
recognizing the "hanging login cookie", i entered U/PW, and 
got white pages instead. Even when trying the bookmarks in 
the animation section.
e.g. nada at:
http://www.tc-rtc.co.uk/displayallimages/animation/18/2007-May.html

Looks like something went wrong when updating topics? 
/animations directory accidentally nuked?

-M

[John VanSickle] Re: Next Challenge [6793 days 5 hours and 27 minutes ago]

Sun, 2 Sep 2007 01:55:55 GMT

St. wrote:
> Hi All
> 
>     The next Stills and Animations Challenge is "The Mother Hive" by Rudyard 
> Kipling 1865-1936
> 
>       Sounds good to me!  :o)
> 
>      (I'm aware that the animations page isn't showing. I have no idea why, 
> but this will be fixed sometime this evening. Sorry about this).

If my modeler can do a human being, I might be able to gin up something 
good for this.

Regards,
John

[St ] Next Challenge [6793 days 18 hours and 31 minutes ago]

Sat, 1 Sep 2007 12:51:48 GMT

Hi All

    The next Stills and Animations Challenge is "The Mother Hive" by Rudyard 
Kipling 1865-1936

      Sounds good to me!  :o)

     (I'm aware that the animations page isn't showing. I have no idea why, 
but this will be fixed sometime this evening. Sorry about this).

       ~Steve~

[John VanSickle] Re: Only 48 hours, and: how long should the desc... [6794 days 4 hours and 11 minutes ago]

Sat, 1 Sep 2007 03:12:09 GMT

Stephen wrote:
> Markus Altendorff <maa### [at] panoramasde> wrote:
> 
>>Markus Altendorff wrote:
>>
>>>Hi, me again, sorry, ...
>>>
>>
>>and one more thing...
>>
>>how big can/should the thumbnail be? The current ones are square in
>>shape and rather compact - i've gotten used to the 320x240 of the old
>>IRTC...
>>
>>-M
> 
> 
> I had the problem the other way. How to make the preview intelligible but
> obscuring the nudity. I think that I made it 200x150.
> I wish that I had another couple of weeks because I’ve changed the materials
> in the stage to metal which I like but the render time has gone through the
> roof 20 mins + time for a memory leak, per frame.

20 minutes per frame?  That's not long.  I generally don't do anything 
about render times until they're over a half hour.  The memory leak is a 
problem, though.

Regards,
John

[John VanSickle] Re: Rusty #33 uploaded to TC-RTC [6794 days 5 hours and 2 minutes ago]

Sat, 1 Sep 2007 02:21:03 GMT

Trevor G Quayle wrote:
> John VanSickle <evi### [at] hotmailcom> wrote:
> 
>>Now I can go do something else for a while...
> 
> After almost 9 years of Rusty, when can we expect the feature length
> big-screen film? (I guess the Simpson's took 18 years so I'll give you a
> little slack).

That reminds me; I haven't checked up on the IMP for some time...  Ooh. 
  Doesn't look like much has happened in about a year.  Pity.

Anyhoo, the Rusty Movie will have to wait until I can come up with a 
story that works with the way Rusty and the rest communicate.

Regards,
John

[Markus Altendorff] Re: TC-RTC: my upload's done, with 12 hours to s... [6794 days 20 hours and 8 minutes ago]

Fri, 31 Aug 2007 11:15:18 GMT

St. wrote:
> "Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote in message 
> news:46d749df$1@news.povray.org...
> 
>      :o)  You know, I had the most horrible time trying to view your 
> animation last night Markus. Not your fault, Windows. ;) Or rather, I should 
> say Media Player's. When I clicked on the thumb and MP10 came up, it 
> immediately gave me some kind of codec error. "Hmm... What gives?" I 
> thought. "Nope, it's not gonna play." And then out of the blue came another 
> message that an upgrade to MP11 was available, so I tried that, and nope, 
> that didn't work either! And more to the point, the others didn't also. 
> Oops, what to do, what to do... Well, in the end I just rolled back to MP10 
> and they all worked again. Hmm. <scratches head> 

That's why i keep a copy of VideoLANclient (videolan.org) at hand. I'm 
always wondering why Quicktime seems to have a different kind of 
brightness correction for each and every codec - JPEG intermediate files 
seemed OK viewed "standalone", then too dark in the video editor (while 
looking OK in freeze-frame mode!), then the final video was too bright 
after converting to MPEG-4, then again OK as MPEG-1, but washed out when 
i viewed them at another machine... $%&!"§$!

VideoLAN's display brightness didn't jump around nearly as much...

> 
>> Bracing myself for any kind of comments now... :S
> 
>     Well, let's just say that my hassle with MP was worth it.  :o)

Heh. Thanks, nice to hear :) Did you check out JvS's Rusty #33? Now THAT 
is excellent video quality! And i couldn't help but chuckle at the blue 
robot "running away" in the end :)

-M

[St ] Re: TC-RTC: my upload's done, with 12 hours to s... [6794 days 21 hours and 42 minutes ago]

Fri, 31 Aug 2007 09:40:44 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote in message 
news:46d749df$1@news.povray.org...

     :o)  You know, I had the most horrible time trying to view your 
animation last night Markus. Not your fault, Windows. ;) Or rather, I should 
say Media Player's. When I clicked on the thumb and MP10 came up, it 
immediately gave me some kind of codec error. "Hmm... What gives?" I 
thought. "Nope, it's not gonna play." And then out of the blue came another 
message that an upgrade to MP11 was available, so I tried that, and nope, 
that didn't work either! And more to the point, the others didn't also. 
Oops, what to do, what to do... Well, in the end I just rolled back to MP10 
and they all worked again. Hmm. <scratches head>


> Bracing myself for any kind of comments now... :S

    Well, let's just say that my hassle with MP was worth it.  :o)

       ~Steve~


>
> -M

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Rusty #33 uploaded to TC-RTC [6795 days and 56 minutes ago]

Fri, 31 Aug 2007 06:27:11 GMT

Trevor G Quayle schrieb:
> John VanSickle <evi### [at] hotmailcom> wrote:
>> Now I can go do something else for a while...

Yay! Downloading it right now...

> After almost 9 years of Rusty, when can we expect the feature length
> big-screen film? (I guess the Simpson's took 18 years so I'll give you a
> little slack).

Yes, though it pays off to start planning early! ;)

-M

[Trevor G Quayle] Re: Rusty #33 uploaded to TC-RTC [6795 days 3 hours and 28 minutes ago]

Fri, 31 Aug 2007 03:55:00 GMT

John VanSickle <evi### [at] hotmailcom> wrote:
> Now I can go do something else for a while...
>
> Regards,
> John

After almost 9 years of Rusty, when can we expect the feature length
big-screen film? (I guess the Simpson's took 18 years so I'll give you a
little slack).

-tgq

[John VanSickle] Rusty #33 uploaded to TC-RTC [6795 days 4 hours and 37 minutes ago]

Fri, 31 Aug 2007 02:46:14 GMT

Now I can go do something else for a while...

Regards,
John

[Markus Altendorff] TC-RTC: my upload's done, with 12 hours to spare... [6795 days 8 hours and 32 minutes ago]

Thu, 30 Aug 2007 22:51:11 GMT

... and if anyone's curious as to what the non-scaled-down 
version looks like, there's a 720x360 30-megabyte MP-4 file at:

http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/maal_tbr.mp4

Bracing myself for any kind of comments now... :S

-M

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Only 48 hours, and: how long should the desc... [6795 days 17 hours and 3 minutes ago]

Thu, 30 Aug 2007 14:19:32 GMT

Stephen wrote:

> 
> 2 min/frame! How can you complain about that, luxury :-)

Tell me about it :) though what i've found has helped me most are the 
new graphics cards inside the new box, because i spend most of my time 
working "visually", and the abysmal speed of the old PCI/AGP mix i had 
before was really cramping my style ;)

Ah well, that see-through chainmail top really did kill the speed, it 
seems - with that out of the picture, even the older box is pushing to 
1/min.

> 
> Mac? What’s a Mac?
> Only joking, I’ve never used one. They look good though :-)

Well, inside the 3D software, it doesn't matter, and while editing the 
videos, it's much easier to handle all those files and folders than on 
the XP box i use for the occasional software development and the 
"compatibility"... - eh, looks? With a computer? It's below the desk, it 
could be a brick for all i care :) but sure is much more orderly on the 
inside of the chassis than my PC.

>> file, though. Maybe i should put that online somewhere, too ;)
>>
> Actually yes, I’d like to see it.

OK, i'll drop the URL once it's finished.

>> P.S.: Aw, so far there's nothing to be seen from Rusty? :(
> 
> I thought that John said that he would enter something.

Yes, that's what i remembered, too. But i keep on hoping... still 18 
hours to go, or something. It's UK-time based, isn't it?

-M

P.S.: Arrrgh! Need another 150 frames to add a final punchline... Well, 
not "need"... "WANT!"

*sigh*

Creativity, where were you half a month ago...?

[Stephen] Re: Only 48 hours, and: how long should the desc... [6795 days 18 hours and 18 minutes ago]

Thu, 30 Aug 2007 13:05:00 GMT

Markus Altendorff <maa### [at] panoramasde> wrote:
> Stephen wrote:
>
> > That’s good, I’m glad you fixed it. Serves you right for using esoteric
> > types of mapping :-)
>
> Hey, the doorframe is made from three cubes, so it seemed like a natural
> pick... waitaminute, it used to be "flat" mapping, maybe something was
> "corrected" when i moved it from C4D R8 to C4D R10... d'oh.

I’m glad you could get that off your chest :-)

> > Just out of interest how does cubical mapping work? I have never used it. I
> > don’t understand why it is happening from what I’ve read about cubical
> > mapping. I can see a line/edge on the cube giving problems but have
> > difficulty visualising a major problem. But what do I know :-)
>
> It's no real "cubical" mapping as in e.g. a VR six-faced cube
> environment map, it's more of a "one image projected onto the faces of a
> "texture space" cube, and then mapped to the UV mesh of the real object."
> I think it's because there's a tipping point where the "left side"
> becomes the "front side" if the surface normal crosses it, and with me
> defining the texture rotation exactly at that angle, any minor
> calculation rounding can make it flip to either side. Cool, my very
> first own fractal texture :)

That could be interesting I’ve read SF stories that could be used for. The
line: “who’s your tailor, Mandelbrot?” always sets me on a fantasy :-)


> >
> > Today for me, I hope that you don’t have any more problems and all goes
> > well.
>
> Unless my PC blows a fuse, it should work out. Need to tweak a few
> subtitles i'm not yet happy with, and just noticed that there's a few
> seconds where i mismatched the talk timing (A: moving mouth, B:
> gesturing...), need to re-run this. Another hour or so, at home. But
> since i don't need my workplace computer right now, i've launched the
> render there. Ouch. That box is SLOOOOOW. At home, the quad core eats
> through the frames at 30 sec/frm., this box here is more like 2 min/frm
> (single CPU G5 iMac).

2 min/frame! How can you complain about that, luxury :-)

> I can definitely say, with my old home computer, i'd never have been
> able to do the film i managed this time :)
>
> Oh, and in regard to encoding: I can hardly believe there's no decent
> and free MPEG-1 encoder for Mac... with the video editing stuff, i got
> all the shiny tools and the latest codecs, but MPEG-1 ...? "VCD standard
> 150 kB/s" (waaay too big and wrong aspect ratio...) is all i can pick,
> with no manual overrides anywhere. So i'm transcoding it back and forth
> until i get an AVI-wrapped anamorphic DV-Stream, transfer that to my PC
> and run it through TMPEGenc Lite under Windows.

Mac? What’s a Mac?
Only joking, I’ve never used one. They look good though :-)

> Well, at full resolution (720x360) it is a nice compact 29 MB H.264 MP4
> file, though. Maybe i should put that online somewhere, too ;)
>
Actually yes, I’d like to see it.

>
> P.S.: Aw, so far there's nothing to be seen from Rusty? :(

I thought that John said that he would enter something.

Stephen

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Only 48 hours, and: how long should the desc... [6795 days 20 hours and 55 minutes ago]

Thu, 30 Aug 2007 10:27:27 GMT

Stephen wrote:

> That’s good, I’m glad you fixed it. Serves you right for using esoteric
> types of mapping :-)

Hey, the doorframe is made from three cubes, so it seemed like a natural 
pick... waitaminute, it used to be "flat" mapping, maybe something was 
"corrected" when i moved it from C4D R8 to C4D R10... d'oh.

> Just out of interest how does cubical mapping work? I have never used it. I
> don’t understand why it is happening from what I’ve read about cubical
> mapping. I can see a line/edge on the cube giving problems but have
> difficulty visualising a major problem. But what do I know :-)

It's no real "cubical" mapping as in e.g. a VR six-faced cube 
environment map, it's more of a "one image projected onto the faces of a 
"texture space" cube, and then mapped to the UV mesh of the real object."
I think it's because there's a tipping point where the "left side" 
becomes the "front side" if the surface normal crosses it, and with me 
defining the texture rotation exactly at that angle, any minor 
calculation rounding can make it flip to either side. Cool, my very 
first own fractal texture :)

> 
>> I'll let it run again, so my video won't be ready until
>> tomorrow afternoon...
> 
> Today for me, I hope that you don’t have any more problems and all goes
> well.

Unless my PC blows a fuse, it should work out. Need to tweak a few 
subtitles i'm not yet happy with, and just noticed that there's a few 
seconds where i mismatched the talk timing (A: moving mouth, B: 
gesturing...), need to re-run this. Another hour or so, at home. But 
since i don't need my workplace computer right now, i've launched the 
render there. Ouch. That box is SLOOOOOW. At home, the quad core eats 
through the frames at 30 sec/frm., this box here is more like 2 min/frm 
(single CPU G5 iMac).
I can definitely say, with my old home computer, i'd never have been 
able to do the film i managed this time :)

Oh, and in regard to encoding: I can hardly believe there's no decent 
and free MPEG-1 encoder for Mac... with the video editing stuff, i got 
all the shiny tools and the latest codecs, but MPEG-1 ...? "VCD standard 
150 kB/s" (waaay too big and wrong aspect ratio...) is all i can pick, 
with no manual overrides anywhere. So i'm transcoding it back and forth 
until i get an AVI-wrapped anamorphic DV-Stream, transfer that to my PC 
and run it through TMPEGenc Lite under Windows.

Well, at full resolution (720x360) it is a nice compact 29 MB H.264 MP4 
file, though. Maybe i should put that online somewhere, too ;)

-M

P.S.: Aw, so far there's nothing to be seen from Rusty? :(

[Stephen] Re: Only 48 hours, and: how long should the desc... [6795 days 21 hours and 43 minutes ago]

Thu, 30 Aug 2007 09:40:01 GMT

Markus Altendorff <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote:
> Stephen wrote:
>
> > Not knowing anything about your application (and when has that ever stopped
> > me mouthing off:-). It sounds as if there is a corrupt file somewhere. I’ve
> > had that a few times and when I re-create the file all has been well. If in
> > doubt blame someone else.
>
> Heh :) but it was my mistake, of course... that, and the
> problem that precision is finite.
>
> Mapping: cubical. My chosen angle: 45 degrees.
> Problem: during rotation, the cumulated result down the
> object hierarchy may have been 44.999999 - or 45.000001
> Result: every now and then, the texture was indecisive if if
> belonged to the front or the side of the cube.
> Solution: use 44 degrees. And it's OK now. :)

That’s good, I’m glad you fixed it. Serves you right for using esoteric
types of mapping :-)
Just out of interest how does cubical mapping work? I have never used it. I
don’t understand why it is happening from what I’ve read about cubical
mapping. I can see a line/edge on the cube giving problems but have
difficulty visualising a major problem. But what do I know :-)

> I'll let it run again, so my video won't be ready until
> tomorrow afternoon...

Today for me, I hope that you don’t have any more problems and all goes
well.

Stephen

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Only 48 hours, and: how long should the desc... [6796 days 12 hours and 54 minutes ago]

Wed, 29 Aug 2007 18:28:53 GMT

Stephen wrote:

> Not knowing anything about your application (and when has that ever stopped
> me mouthing off:-). It sounds as if there is a corrupt file somewhere. I’ve
> had that a few times and when I re-create the file all has been well. If in
> doubt blame someone else.

Heh :) but it was my mistake, of course... that, and the 
problem that precision is finite.

Mapping: cubical. My chosen angle: 45 degrees.
Problem: during rotation, the cumulated result down the 
object hierarchy may have been 44.999999 - or 45.000001
Result: every now and then, the texture was indecisive if if 
belonged to the front or the side of the cube.
Solution: use 44 degrees. And it's OK now. :)

I'll let it run again, so my video won't be ready until 
tomorrow afternoon...

-M

[Stephen] Re: Only 48 hours, and: how long should the desc... [6796 days 18 hours and 53 minutes ago]

Wed, 29 Aug 2007 12:30:01 GMT

Markus Altendorff <maa### [at] panoramasde> wrote:

> Well, i did test it, sort of, uhm... but not this time - the whole
> object group is copied straight from the IRTC "Escape" ("Escape^2")
> short i did (2003? 2004?). And it's not so much "flickering" as in
> "in-texture antialiasing too weak", but it's actually "jumping around"
> on the object... weirdest thing i've seen so far. It's OK for a few
> frames, then it shifts a bit to the left/right, then it's back to where
> it started. At first i thought i had accidentally animated some mapping
> parameter in a loop, but there's nothing in the timeline that would
> indicate such a thing, and i'm out of production time... i'll look into
> converting the cubes that build the doorframe to polygon meshes, maybe
> this'll help.
> The "usual" flicker of interpolation doesn't bother me as much because i
> compress the video to death anyway, so my problem is there's always
> worse MPEG artefacts than the grainy pulsing of texture edges :)

Not knowing anything about your application (and when has that ever stopped
me mouthing off:-). It sounds as if there is a corrupt file somewhere. I’ve
had that a few times and when I re-create the file all has been well. If in
doubt blame someone else.

With my sort of animation lack of quality can kill it, there is no real
story line. I’ve become quite adept at making small files. Steve’s excess
of space takes all the skill out of it.
Only kidding :-)

Stephen

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Only 48 hours, and: how long should the desc... [6796 days 19 hours and 57 minutes ago]

Wed, 29 Aug 2007 11:25:47 GMT

Stephen wrote:

> I generally do test animations of any materials I am going to use. Just to
> see if there is any flicker. If that is what you mean? Recently I tried
> changing turbulence to warp turbulence to se if it would help. But it made
> things worse. I think this problem is one of the worst in making
> animations.

Well, i did test it, sort of, uhm... but not this time - the whole 
object group is copied straight from the IRTC "Escape" ("Escape^2") 
short i did (2003? 2004?). And it's not so much "flickering" as in 
"in-texture antialiasing too weak", but it's actually "jumping around" 
on the object... weirdest thing i've seen so far. It's OK for a few 
frames, then it shifts a bit to the left/right, then it's back to where 
it started. At first i thought i had accidentally animated some mapping 
parameter in a loop, but there's nothing in the timeline that would 
indicate such a thing, and i'm out of production time... i'll look into 
converting the cubes that build the doorframe to polygon meshes, maybe 
this'll help.
The "usual" flicker of interpolation doesn't bother me as much because i 
compress the video to death anyway, so my problem is there's always 
worse MPEG artefacts than the grainy pulsing of texture edges :)

-M

[Stephen] Re: Only 48 hours, and: how long should the desc... [6796 days 20 hours and 8 minutes ago]

Wed, 29 Aug 2007 11:15:01 GMT

Markus Altendorff <maa### [at] panoramasde> wrote:
>
> Ah. Well, the server setup is to crop it down to 140x140 anyway, which
> is what bothers me - i'm used to putting the title etc. in it, like with
> the IRTC... it'll be unreadable and no use if it gets pressed into 140x140.

But do you really need a title in the thumbnail? If it is short it will
appear above the thumbnail. Mine was truncated, oh dear.

>
> Yes, metal can do that... that's why i've got a "losing the shiny
> armour" scene at about the middle my clip :)

LOL

> - metal + reflection of
> "media" material in it (if i'm using the povray term right? that
> half-transparent plasma stuff...?) isn't good for the render rate.

I think that I’ll have to put up with it, I like the scene so much more with
the metal.

> Textures going "boink" isn't, either, though for different reasons ...
> the last location i used is a walk back to daylight through an
> underground passage that had the occasional decorative doorway left and
> right, but the texture there was "hopping" between frames - i guess i've
> either messed up the texture space orientation when i declared the
> material or it wasn't properly fixed to the object. The render is
> running for the third time now, because i've kicked those objects from
> the scene to just get it over with... should be done about the time i
> get home from work today.

I generally do test animations of any materials I am going to use. Just to
see if there is any flicker. If that is what you mean? Recently I tried
changing turbulence to warp turbulence to se if it would help. But it made
things worse. I think this problem is one of the worst in making
animations.

Stephen

[St ] Re: Only 48 hours, and: how long should the desc... [6796 days 21 hours and 16 minutes ago]

Wed, 29 Aug 2007 10:07:08 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] panoramasde> wrote in message 
news:46d53d6d$1@news.povray.org...
> St. schrieb:

>>       Good idea Markus! Something like this? 
>> http://smartwebby.com/DHTML/textbox_characters_counter.asp#explanation
>
> *shriek* No! Actually, the opposite - people can enter as much as they 
> want, but the display in "viewing mode" starts with only the first one or 
> two paragraphs or 200/300 characters, whatever happens first, and the 
> remaining text is initially hidden, but "unfolds" when clicked upon. Like:
>
> "Blah blah blah Blah blah blah Blah blah blah...
> August 16th: Rendered the first part, and built the .... [more >]"
>
> Clicking "more" turns it into:
>
> "Blah blah blah Blah blah blah Blah blah blah...
> August 16th: Rendered the first part, and built the scenery
> for the second half of the video. Working time: about 6-8 hours today. [< 
> less]"
>
> i.e. Just initally hiding long texts, not discarding them entirely :)
>
> like those (the tiny +/- below the headers would be the "more/less", and 
> i'd start with at least part of the text visible instead of entirely 
> hiding it)
> http://www.splintered.co.uk/experiments/archives/blog_last_visited/


   Ah, I see. Ok, that's a good idea. I think we can get that implemented 
somehow. Thanks again for your input Markus! :)

       ~Steve~


>
> -M

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Only 48 hours, and: how long should the desc... [6796 days 21 hours and 49 minutes ago]

Wed, 29 Aug 2007 09:33:33 GMT

St. schrieb:
> "Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] panoramasde> wrote in message 
> news:46d52d67@news.povray.org...
>> Hi, me again, sorry, ...
>>
>> "...NOT!" ;)
> 
>       Heh... :)
> 
>> Well, i'm almost ready to upload now (assuming the final video compression 
>> later today works out), but how long can/should the text description be? 
>> Checking my production notes and the writeup following the old IRTC form, 
>> I'm afraid i already got a bit of logorrhea there... ;) (i.e.: you'll have 
>> to scroll the page... several times...)
>>
>> Maybe, for the webpage, something like a "... more >" link that cuts in 
>> after ... 500? 1000? characters of a text would be a good idea?
> 
>       Good idea Markus! Something like this? 
> http://smartwebby.com/DHTML/textbox_characters_counter.asp#explanation

*shriek* No! Actually, the opposite - people can enter as much as they 
want, but the display in "viewing mode" starts with only the first one 
or two paragraphs or 200/300 characters, whatever happens first, and the 
remaining text is initially hidden, but "unfolds" when clicked upon. Like:

"Blah blah blah Blah blah blah Blah blah blah...
August 16th: Rendered the first part, and built the .... [more >]"

Clicking "more" turns it into:

"Blah blah blah Blah blah blah Blah blah blah...
August 16th: Rendered the first part, and built the scenery
for the second half of the video. Working time: about 6-8 hours today. 
[< less]"

i.e. Just initally hiding long texts, not discarding them entirely :)

like those (the tiny +/- below the headers would be the "more/less", and 
i'd start with at least part of the text visible instead of entirely 
hiding it)
http://www.splintered.co.uk/experiments/archives/blog_last_visited/

-M

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Only 48 hours, and: how long should the desc... [6796 days 22 hours ago]

Wed, 29 Aug 2007 09:23:04 GMT

Stephen wrote:
> Markus Altendorff <maa### [at] panoramasde> wrote:
>> how big can/should the thumbnail be? The current ones are square in
>> shape and rather compact - i've gotten used to the 320x240 of the old
>> IRTC...
>>
>> -M
> 
> I had the problem the other way. How to make the preview intelligible but
> obscuring the nudity. I think that I made it 200x150.

Ah. Well, the server setup is to crop it down to 140x140 anyway, which 
is what bothers me - i'm used to putting the title etc. in it, like with 
the IRTC... it'll be unreadable and no use if it gets pressed into 140x140.

> I wish that I had another couple of weeks because I’ve changed the materials
> in the stage to metal which I like but the render time has gone through the
> roof 20 mins + time for a memory leak, per frame.

Yes, metal can do that... that's why i've got a "losing the shiny 
armour" scene at about the middle my clip :)  - metal + reflection of 
"media" material in it (if i'm using the povray term right? that 
half-transparent plasma stuff...?) isn't good for the render rate.

Textures going "boink" isn't, either, though for different reasons ... 
the last location i used is a walk back to daylight through an 
underground passage that had the occasional decorative doorway left and 
right, but the texture there was "hopping" between frames - i guess i've 
either messed up the texture space orientation when i declared the 
material or it wasn't properly fixed to the object. The render is 
running for the third time now, because i've kicked those objects from 
the scene to just get it over with... should be done about the time i 
get home from work today.

-M

[St ] Re: Only 48 hours, and: how long should the desc... [6796 days 22 hours and 6 minutes ago]

Wed, 29 Aug 2007 09:16:24 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] panoramasde> wrote in message 
news:46d52e19$1@news.povray.org...
> Markus Altendorff wrote:
>> Hi, me again, sorry, ...
>>
>
> and one more thing...
>
> how big can/should the thumbnail be? The current ones are square in shape 
> and rather compact - i've gotten used to the 320x240 of the old IRTC...

       I think if you send a 320x240, it will still be automatically resized 
to 100x100, which is why some of them look a little distorted. I'll see if I 
can get the thumbs changed to at least 160x120.

      ~Steve~


>
> -M

[St ] Re: Only 48 hours, and: how long should the desc... [6796 days 22 hours and 6 minutes ago]

Wed, 29 Aug 2007 09:16:23 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] panoramasde> wrote in message 
news:46d52d67@news.povray.org...
> Hi, me again, sorry, ...
>
> "...NOT!" ;)

      Heh... :)

>
> Well, i'm almost ready to upload now (assuming the final video compression 
> later today works out), but how long can/should the text description be? 
> Checking my production notes and the writeup following the old IRTC form, 
> I'm afraid i already got a bit of logorrhea there... ;) (i.e.: you'll have 
> to scroll the page... several times...)
>
> Maybe, for the webpage, something like a "... more >" link that cuts in 
> after ... 500? 1000? characters of a text would be a good idea?

      Good idea Markus! Something like this? 
http://smartwebby.com/DHTML/textbox_characters_counter.asp#explanation

       ~Steve~


>
> -M

[Stephen] Re: Only 48 hours, and: how long should the desc... [6796 days 22 hours and 28 minutes ago]

Wed, 29 Aug 2007 08:55:01 GMT

Markus Altendorff <maa### [at] panoramasde> wrote:
> Markus Altendorff wrote:
> > Hi, me again, sorry, ...
> >
>
> and one more thing...
>
> how big can/should the thumbnail be? The current ones are square in
> shape and rather compact - i've gotten used to the 320x240 of the old
> IRTC...
>
> -M

I had the problem the other way. How to make the preview intelligible but
obscuring the nudity. I think that I made it 200x150.
I wish that I had another couple of weeks because I’ve changed the materials
in the stage to metal which I like but the render time has gone through the
roof 20 mins + time for a memory leak, per frame.

Stephen

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Only 48 hours, and: how long should the desc... [6796 days 22 hours and 55 minutes ago]

Wed, 29 Aug 2007 08:28:09 GMT

Markus Altendorff wrote:
> Hi, me again, sorry, ...
> 

and one more thing...

how big can/should the thumbnail be? The current ones are square in 
shape and rather compact - i've gotten used to the 320x240 of the old 
IRTC...

-M

[Markus Altendorff] Only 48 hours, and: how long should the descript... [6796 days 22 hours and 58 minutes ago]

Wed, 29 Aug 2007 08:25:11 GMT

Hi, me again, sorry, ...

"...NOT!" ;)

Well, i'm almost ready to upload now (assuming the final video 
compression later today works out), but how long can/should the text 
description be? Checking my production notes and the writeup following 
the old IRTC form, I'm afraid i already got a bit of logorrhea there... 
;) (i.e.: you'll have to scroll the page... several times...)

Maybe, for the webpage, something like a "... more >" link that cuts in 
after ... 500? 1000? characters of a text would be a good idea?

-M

[Stephen] Re: Ping-of-life message: 8 days remaining until... [6797 days 21 hours and 53 minutes ago]

Tue, 28 Aug 2007 09:30:00 GMT

"gregjohn" <pte### [at] yahoocom> wrote:
>
> Also just now I came up with a wonderful idea for an animation in povray:
> I'm hoping my new idea will somehow mesh with the randomly chosen new
> topic.

There is probably little to worry about as it will be a book title you could
find a theme in the book to base your animation on. It does not IMO have to
be based solely on the title. For instance the Black Robe could be
interpreted as “The Black Coat” ot you could use the concept that, and I
quote. “That not one woman in a thousand sees anything objectionable in the
gloomy and hideous evening costume of a gentleman in the nineteenth century.
A handsome man is, to their eyes, more seductive than ever in the
contemptible black coat and the stiff white cravat.”
Hmm! Not what I know of Willkie Collins attitude to women. He was in the
forefront of liberalism in that field. Even though he was a opium addict
and lived with two common law wives at the same time. An interesting
person.

Stephen

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Ping-of-life message: 8 days remaining until... [6797 days 22 hours and 56 minutes ago]

Tue, 28 Aug 2007 08:27:12 GMT

gregjohn wrote:
> I've picked up blender again, and interested in seeing if I can produce
> something with it.

Good luck! I'm eager to see the results!
I've tried Blender (in fact, i download a new version every now and 
then), but i'm already so settled in my "Cinema4D" ways that i'm finding 
it hard to adjust to the entirely different user interface of Blender.

> Also just now I came up with a wonderful idea for an animation in povray:
> I'm hoping my new idea will somehow mesh with the randomly chosen new
> topic.

"Wherever there's a will, there's a way" ;)
Another video to look forward to! We're slowly making inroads in terms 
of participation. I've mentioned the tc-rtc over at the Cinema4d forum, 
because there are a few other hobbyists that seemed interested to join, 
too. I think such a fun, collaborative, hobbyist arena isn't represented 
enough on the web (yet). Most of the 3D video websites i find or am 
pointed to by friends seem to be of the "pro-for-hire" or 
"woowee-i've-graduated-from-moviemaking-university" kind ;) (at least 
that's what it looks to me, maybe i'm using google wrong)... excellent 
works, of course, but not everyone has a chance to work in a team of 
three or four people full time for half a year with 12-hour-days on a 
sixty seconds masterpiece... (besides, most of the time, i just don't 
"get" those stories...) ;)

In a way, 3D is my substitue for tinkering with model railways ;)

-M
--
"Black Robe" video now in the home stretch... no more time for WiPs now.

[Stephen] Re: Ping-of-life message: 8 days remaining until... [6797 days 23 hours and 3 minutes ago]

Tue, 28 Aug 2007 08:20:01 GMT

Markus Altendorff <maa### [at] panoramasde> wrote:
> Stephen wrote:
>

>
> Ouch. Hey, you realize that by entering values for every frame by hand
> you're now in the same league as the creators of "Tron"? :)

Don’t remind me:-) and I made an arithmetic mistake right at the beginning
that kept throwing the smoothness of the motion out.

> > I could have told you but then I would have had to transmogrify you :-)
>
> "Calvin & Hobbes" reference? :)

Oh! I thought that it had passed into common usage. Yes a "Calvin & Hobbes"
reference. :-)

>
> Been watching it on my side-notebook at work, and that doesn't do
> "subtle" ;) will have to check again at home.

It was much less subtle using courser aa settings. I didn’t have time to
find the correct material settings.

> The "decanting" is just mentioned, not described in detail, i think, as
> the process when the New World (clone?) children are "born", i.e.
> removed from their nurturing containers. Isn't Huxley's Lenina character
> working in such a factory, or something? Reading it has been a while...
> Usually i'm more into TPratchett, Asimov, Lem, if i'm not wasting time
> on the intertubes ;)
> I've just finished the brothers Strugatzki's "Roadside picnic"
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roadside_Picnic - interesting idea for a book.

You remember Brave New World better than I do but I think that you are
right, I do remember something about a factory being mentioned.
Here and now!
Here and now!
Yes I’m a bit of a fan of T Pratchett but I’ve not read the good doctor in
years.
"Roadside picnic" again it was years ago but the Wikipedia article refreshed
my memory. An excellent idea, unfortunately I found that style of writing
too literary for my poor dyslectic brain.

>>
> > I always look forward to seeing yours
>
> Me too :)
LOL
>i'm even more looking forward to the comments... it's been cut
> to quite a fast pace, which might be too much for working with
> subtitles. If only i had some decent voice actors :)

That is a problem but it is one I ignore by making silent moving pictures
:-)

Stephen

[gregjohn] Re: Ping-of-life message: 8 days remaining until... [6798 days 9 hours and 58 minutes ago]

Mon, 27 Aug 2007 21:25:00 GMT

I've picked up blender again, and interested in seeing if I can produce
something with it.

Also just now I came up with a wonderful idea for an animation in povray:
I'm hoping my new idea will somehow mesh with the randomly chosen new
topic.

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Ping-of-life message: 8 days remaining until... [6798 days 16 hours and 47 minutes ago]

Mon, 27 Aug 2007 14:35:32 GMT

Stephen wrote:

> Well one of the good things about Beta testing software is the opportunity
> to influence the final product. One of the bad things was entering values
> for every Keyframe as a linear spline had not been implemented (it has now
> in a new release).

Ouch. Hey, you realize that by entering values for every frame by hand 
you're now in the same league as the creators of "Tron"? :)

> I could have told you but then I would have had to transmogrify you :-)

"Calvin & Hobbes" reference? :)

> I would not say that it is less artistic to create characters, plot,
> storyboard etc. Doing a "living freeze-frame" (I like that term, I think of
> it as Masque-like) is simple in most cases, but like a short SF story it
> must have a twist. For me the twist is wondering what is going to happen to
> the lady in the arch.
> Did you notice the stars twinkling? It is quite subtle.

Been watching it on my side-notebook at work, and that doesn't do 
"subtle" ;) will have to check again at home.

> Well I read a lot of SF but seldom watch any films and as I said I stole the
> idea from Gail. I think that I must reread Brave New World as I cannot
> remember the decanting" plant. Dystopian is right but maybe it is not and
> these are souls in the process of being sent to their lives. Hmm I just

The "decanting" is just mentioned, not described in detail, i think, as 
the process when the New World (clone?) children are "born", i.e. 
removed from their nurturing containers. Isn't Huxley's Lenina character 
working in such a factory, or something? Reading it has been a while... 
Usually i'm more into TPratchett, Asimov, Lem, if i'm not wasting time 
on the intertubes ;)
I've just finished the brothers Strugatzki's "Roadside picnic" 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roadside_Picnic - interesting idea for a book.

> realised that this scene might be related to my Dance IRTC entry “Waiting
> for Copernicus” April-July 2004.

Have to check that one, i might have missed it the first time.
(Update: maybe because it kills my browser if i try to open it directly 
;) will have to download and try again...

> I always look forward to seeing yours

Me too :) i'm even more looking forward to the comments... it's been cut 
to quite a fast pace, which might be too much for working with 
subtitles. If only i had some decent voice actors :)

-M

[Stephen] Re: Ping-of-life message: 8 days remaining until... [6798 days 18 hours and 18 minutes ago]

Mon, 27 Aug 2007 13:05:00 GMT

Markus Altendorff <maa### [at] panoramasde> wrote:
> Stephen wrote:
> >
> > That must be mine. I was in a rush to get it posted and hassled by lack of
> > time and bad traveling experiences at the weekend.
>
> Yes, it is. Well, with two to choose from, the chance was about 50% ;)

That’s about right :-)

> > A description of the way I built the scene would be easy but a bit “This is
> > the way I worked out how a new program behaves” and what I did to get round
> > the limitations of a Beta release. – Boring :-)
> > As for the image it is a traditional cyclic doodle. I would have liked to
> > put more moving elements but was limited by the modeler in its present
> > state.
>
> Don't i know that... though i must admit, playing with my new toys
> (Cinema 10.1 + new computer) has broadend my toolchest and options to
> create scenes in 3D significantly. :)
>
Well one of the good things about Beta testing software is the opportunity
to influence the final product. One of the bad things was entering values
for every Keyframe as a linear spline had not been implemented (it has now
in a new release).

> > What can I say about the scene? Well obviously we are looking at someone in
> > a Black Robe with two companions but why is one of them unclothed and the
> > other looking pensive? What entity, streams bodies from one place to
> > another in a surreal environment?
>
> Oops. I was actually hoping for answers to those :)

I could have told you but then I would have had to transmogrify you :-)

> > Questions, questions and I have no answers, only a viewport to this sphere
> > of existence.
>
> Ah, it's sort of "bringing alive a mental image" or doing a "living
> freeze-frame". This is something i've not even thought about. Inspiring!
> Leaves the viewer with a lot to think and wonder about. Me, i'm somehow
> stuck in the less artistic, more manufactural "getting that inner
> movie/script thing on the screen" mode... :S

I would not say that it is less artistic to create characters, plot,
storyboard etc. Doing a "living freeze-frame" (I like that term, I think of
it as Masque-like) is simple in most cases, but like a short SF story it
must have a twist. For me the twist is wondering what is going to happen to
the lady in the arch.
Did you notice the stars twinkling? It is quite subtle.


> Your scene brought (for me) quite a lot of associations, most from
> dystopian Sci-Fi films, i'll readily admit. "Ambulance", "Minority
> Report", even the multimedia elements of Mike Oldfield's "Songs of
> Distant Earth" ("Hibernaculum") or maybe something like the "decanting"
> plant described in Huxley's Brave New World...
>
> -M

Well I read a lot of SF but seldom watch any films and as I said I stole the
idea from Gail. I think that I must reread Brave New World as I cannot
remember the decanting" plant. Dystopian is right but maybe it is not and
these are souls in the process of being sent to their lives. Hmm I just
realised that this scene might be related to my Dance IRTC entry “Waiting
for Copernicus” April-July 2004.

I always look forward to seeing yours

Stephen

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Ping-of-life message: 8 days remaining until... [6798 days 19 hours and 47 minutes ago]

Mon, 27 Aug 2007 11:35:44 GMT

Stephen wrote:
> 
> That must be mine. I was in a rush to get it posted and hassled by lack of
> time and bad traveling experiences at the weekend.

Yes, it is. Well, with two to choose from, the chance was about 50% ;)

> A description of the way I built the scene would be easy but a bit “This is
> the way I worked out how a new program behaves” and what I did to get round
> the limitations of a Beta release. – Boring :-)
> As for the image it is a traditional cyclic doodle. I would have liked to
> put more moving elements but was limited by the modeler in its present
> state.

Don't i know that... though i must admit, playing with my new toys 
(Cinema 10.1 + new computer) has broadend my toolchest and options to 
create scenes in 3D significantly. :)

> What can I say about the scene? Well obviously we are looking at someone in
> a Black Robe with two companions but why is one of them unclothed and the
> other looking pensive? What entity, streams bodies from one place to
> another in a surreal environment?

Oops. I was actually hoping for answers to those :)

> Questions, questions and I have no answers, only a viewport to this sphere
> of existence.

Ah, it's sort of "bringing alive a mental image" or doing a "living 
freeze-frame". This is something i've not even thought about. Inspiring! 
Leaves the viewer with a lot to think and wonder about. Me, i'm somehow 
stuck in the less artistic, more manufactural "getting that inner 
movie/script thing on the screen" mode... :S

Your scene brought (for me) quite a lot of associations, most from 
dystopian Sci-Fi films, i'll readily admit. "Ambulance", "Minority 
Report", even the multimedia elements of Mike Oldfield's "Songs of 
Distant Earth" ("Hibernaculum") or maybe something like the "decanting" 
plant described in Huxley's Brave New World...

-M

[Stephen] Re: Ping-of-life message: 8 days remaining until... [6798 days 20 hours and 18 minutes ago]

Mon, 27 Aug 2007 11:05:01 GMT

Markus Altendorff <maa### [at] panoramasde> wrote:
> St. wrote:
> >
> >     OMG... really? (SELF: No, not really, it's 6 days to go as of typing
> > this..!)
>
> Four days... but who's counting? (ME! (runs around screaming and waving
> arms - "aaargh! Needtofinishneedtofinishneedtofinish...") ;)
>
> There's a second entry online! Looks like a motion cycle, interesting
> concept. A bit cryptic, was hoping for the description to clear it up.

That must be mine. I was in a rush to get it posted and hassled by lack of
time and bad traveling experiences at the weekend.
A description of the way I built the scene would be easy but a bit “This is
the way I worked out how a new program behaves” and what I did to get round
the limitations of a Beta release. – Boring :-)
As for the image it is a traditional cyclic doodle. I would have liked to
put more moving elements but was limited by the modeler in its present
state.
What can I say about the scene? Well obviously we are looking at someone in
a Black Robe with two companions but why is one of them unclothed and the
other looking pensive? What entity, streams bodies from one place to
another in a surreal environment?
Questions, questions and I have no answers, only a viewport to this sphere
of existence.

Stephen

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Ping-of-life message: 8 days remaining until... [6798 days 22 hours and 45 minutes ago]

Mon, 27 Aug 2007 08:38:09 GMT

St. wrote:
> 
>     OMG... really? (SELF: No, not really, it's 6 days to go as of typing 
> this..!)

Four days... but who's counting? (ME! (runs around screaming and waving 
arms - "aaargh! Needtofinishneedtofinishneedtofinish...") ;)

There's a second entry online! Looks like a motion cycle, interesting 
concept. A bit cryptic, was hoping for the description to clear it up.

Oh, by the way: I get lots of "undefined" characters (UTF-8 charset 
markers in my browser, should be apostrophes) when viewing the page. 
Might want to do a ' to "&39;" translation on the output side of things, 
maybe?
Oh, the template says "JPG: something.MPG" :) but that's just nitpicking. :)

Also, there's an URL in the description that looks pretty beat up, but 
mostly because it's a newsgroup web interface pointer, i guess. Little 
that can be done about that.

>> a) Uploads are possible until the deadline
> 
>         Yes, although, I don't know what would happen if someone uploaded an 
> image or animation let's say, 1 minute before the deadline. I'll look into 
> this.
> 

Depends on when the script checks the date/time. After pressing the 
submit button in the browser, either the recipient script is immediately 
invoked on the server and remains active during the transfer, or the 
server buffers the upload and only afterwards calls the script to handle 
the data. It's safer to assume all must be completed before the deadline 
(and it's the servers' clock setting that determins this, not the local 
one).

>> b) Voting is possible until the deadline, AND for a week thereafter
> 
>           I've got a feeling I may have said that as an idea here somewhere, 
> but as yet, I don't think it's implimented.
> 
Ah, OK. Um. (starts running/screaming again "three days! three days! OMFG!")

>> c) Only those that entered can vote
> 
>          No, as far as I know, other members can vote too, even though they 
> didn't enter. I'll check that too.
> 

Heh, i voted on a still image recently. So i guess it's a membership 
thing, not an entering thing.

>> d) Commenting is not (yet) automated
> 
>         Should be, seems to be working ok from what I've seen.

Ah, fine. Does commenting still work after the deadline? (does one get a 
  mail or something, if a comment was added to one's entries?)

>> [e) Are these in the FAQs already, and i've been too daft to find?]
> 
>    Dang. Now you've found the dent in my armour... :o)
> 
>      The FAQS are due to be updated soon Markus, no, you're not "too daft". 

The court is still out on this... judging from the amount of things i've 
learned about my tools and abilities during this round, i'm afraid 
there's still plenty of daft left in me :)

e.g. i completely forgot that C4D's automated hair guides can be "tied" 
to polygonal surfaces. Yay! Now, even though the character accelerates 
at 5 m/s/s, the hairdo doesn't go "sproink"! Of course, i remembered 
this feature ... yesterday. (sound of head pounding on table)

Ah well, the "core" storyline is rendered! All that's left it one minute 
of "talking heads and a few gestures" to wrap things up. This should be 
manageable (render time permitting)...

-M

--
Now this wouldn't be complete without some more WiP shots, would it?

The apprentice is "a bit" overwhelmed by how things are progressing...
http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070824_215327_snap_78807.jpg
(just editor pre-render, lacking pillar-of-fire lighting because the 
particle lights are !$§# slow... :(

... and that sight's going to be detrimental to his ease of mind, too...
http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070826_032453_snap_12293.jpg
(light setup incomplete, reason: see above)

Whoops, there goes the grimoire...
http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070826_110029_snap_2096.jpg
(that's actual output size 720x360, from the final)

[St ] Re: Ping-of-life message: 8 days remaining until... [6800 days 12 hours and 26 minutes ago]

Sat, 25 Aug 2007 18:57:18 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] panoramasde> wrote in message 
news:46cd61ea@news.povray.org...
> Hi, dear readers,

     Heh...    :o)


>
> only 8 days to go until "The Black Robe" animation deadline (at 
> tc-rtc.co.uk ) is upon us.

    OMG... really? (SELF: No, not really, it's 6 days to go as of typing 
this..!)

     normal{eek 1 scale 1}}



       ;)



>
> Alright, with that out of the way, i've dug through the irtc.stills 
> newsgroup and found some info on the new voting procedure, which i'd like 
> to ask St. to confirm...

     Hmm.. ok...


>
> Is the following correct?


      Let's see now... <taps fingers>


>
> a) Uploads are possible until the deadline

        Yes, although, I don't know what would happen if someone uploaded an 
image or animation let's say, 1 minute before the deadline. I'll look into 
this.


> b) Voting is possible until the deadline, AND for a week thereafter

          I've got a feeling I may have said that as an idea here somewhere, 
but as yet, I don't think it's implimented.


> c) Only those that entered can vote

         No, as far as I know, other members can vote too, even though they 
didn't enter. I'll check that too.


> d) Commenting is not (yet) automated

        Should be, seems to be working ok from what I've seen.

>
> [e) Are these in the FAQs already, and i've been too daft to find?]

   Dang. Now you've found the dent in my armour... :o)

     The FAQS are due to be updated soon Markus, no, you're not "too daft". 
:)


>
> -Markus
>
> --
>
> Current occupation: Keyframing, previewing, cussing, keyframing...
>
> WiP Snapshots-of-the-day:
> "Crush" goes the wall... (actual video frame)
> http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070823_122540_preview.jpg
>
> ... and in case anyone was wondering how/if i'd introduce any of my 
> regular characters into my "The Black Robe" story... :)
> http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070821_204401_snap_74640.jpg


        Heck, they're good! It's working for me.   :o)

         ~Steve~

[Markus Altendorff] Ping-of-life message: 8 days remaining until cha... [6802 days 20 hours and 52 minutes ago]

Thu, 23 Aug 2007 10:31:06 GMT

Hi, dear readers,

only 8 days to go until "The Black Robe" animation deadline (at 
tc-rtc.co.uk ) is upon us.

Alright, with that out of the way, i've dug through the irtc.stills 
newsgroup and found some info on the new voting procedure, which i'd 
like to ask St. to confirm...

Is the following correct?

a) Uploads are possible until the deadline
b) Voting is possible until the deadline, AND for a week thereafter
c) Only those that entered can vote
d) Commenting is not (yet) automated

[e) Are these in the FAQs already, and i've been too daft to find?]

-Markus

--

Current occupation: Keyframing, previewing, cussing, keyframing...

WiP Snapshots-of-the-day:
"Crush" goes the wall... (actual video frame)
http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070823_122540_preview.jpg

... and in case anyone was wondering how/if i'd introduce any of my 
regular characters into my "The Black Robe" story... :)
http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070821_204401_snap_74640.jpg

[dbott] Re: 13 days to go, and a question re: voting on ... [6806 days 3 hours and 3 minutes ago]

Mon, 20 Aug 2007 04:19:24 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote in message
news:46c8da74$1@news.povray.org...
> dbott wrote:
>
> > ---------You have to keep using it or you lose
> > it---------
>
>
> That's so true! And there's always something new to learn on
> top of that, either... Friday i got myself Richard Williams'
> "The Animator's Survival Kit" (paperback, faber & faber,
> London)- that's pretty cool stuff, the scribbles and notes
> of the guy that was responsible for directing the animation
> on "Who framed Roger Rabbitt". While the examples are mostly
> from hand-drawn animations, the ideas on timing and workflow
> apply on 3D as well, of course. Amazing, but something that
> obviously needs endless practice to make it second nature...
>
> Well, looks like as of today, i've got enough render
> snippets to get at least a storyline with a "black robe" in
> it ready, even if i don't manage to complete the whole
> script i intended. :) (of course, re-cutting it would turn
> it into some sort of ordinary fantasy thing, which i
> originally wanted to make fun of ... :S
>
> -M
>
> And, it's time for some more WiPs:
>
> (sorry, i'm just utterly happy with what the new computer
> can do within reasonable time :)
>
> Wizard opening his book:
> (note the "edge backlight" effect on the robe, that's the
> Fresnel shader in the luminance channel of the material)
> http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070819_163051_snap_59451.jpg
>
> After throwing the contents of the cup towards the portal
> drawn on the floor, the liquid gets caught in its energy field:
> (inverse volumetric light coupled with ambient lighting for
> the liquid "glow", liquid made from metaball and particles
> in a set of force fields)
> http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070819_171939_snap_62379.jpg
>
> Things start to go wrong for our apprentice - the formula
> said nothing about "fire from the floor"...:
> http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070820_002716_snap_1635.jpg
>
> OK, that was definitely NOT what he was trying to conjure:
> http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070820_005249_snap_3168.jpg

I'll be watching...........My Black Robe is a little orphan sitting all by
itself. I finished early due to my summer work schedule. And then, ~Steve~
wanted me to submit early for testing.   .jpg's are looking good.
Darin

[Markus Altendorff] Re: 13 days to go, and a question re: voting on ... [6806 days 7 hours and 19 minutes ago]

Mon, 20 Aug 2007 00:04:04 GMT

dbott wrote:

> ---------You have to keep using it or you lose
> it---------

That's so true! And there's always something new to learn on 
top of that, either... Friday i got myself Richard Williams' 
"The Animator's Survival Kit" (paperback, faber & faber, 
London)- that's pretty cool stuff, the scribbles and notes 
of the guy that was responsible for directing the animation 
on "Who framed Roger Rabbitt". While the examples are mostly 
from hand-drawn animations, the ideas on timing and workflow 
apply on 3D as well, of course. Amazing, but something that 
obviously needs endless practice to make it second nature...

Well, looks like as of today, i've got enough render 
snippets to get at least a storyline with a "black robe" in 
it ready, even if i don't manage to complete the whole 
script i intended. :) (of course, re-cutting it would turn 
it into some sort of ordinary fantasy thing, which i 
originally wanted to make fun of ... :S

-M

And, it's time for some more WiPs:

(sorry, i'm just utterly happy with what the new computer 
can do within reasonable time :)

Wizard opening his book:
(note the "edge backlight" effect on the robe, that's the 
Fresnel shader in the luminance channel of the material)
http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070819_163051_snap_59451.jpg

After throwing the contents of the cup towards the portal 
drawn on the floor, the liquid gets caught in its energy field:
(inverse volumetric light coupled with ambient lighting for 
the liquid "glow", liquid made from metaball and particles 
in a set of force fields)
http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070819_171939_snap_62379.jpg

Things start to go wrong for our apprentice - the formula 
said nothing about "fire from the floor"...:
http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070820_002716_snap_1635.jpg

OK, that was definitely NOT what he was trying to conjure:
http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070820_005249_snap_3168.jpg

[dbott] Re: 13 days to go, and a question re: voting on ... [6806 days 11 hours and 57 minutes ago]

Sun, 19 Aug 2007 19:26:21 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote in message
news:46c8154d@news.povray.org...
> dbott wrote:
> > Well, I am looking forward to seeing your animation and
Johns.......????? It
> > inspires me to keep on learning new rendering techniques with pov. I
spent
> > most of Saturday learning Carneholm smoke generator that follows a
spline.
> > By the end of the afternoon I managed to produce a small test.
> > http://www.eastsoundsuites.com/animations/smoke.mpg
>
> That's a nice start! You may want to play with the StartTurb
> and TurbIncRate settings of the generator to get a smoke
> that dissolves over time.
>
> Of course, smoke/volume media eats CPU cycles like little
> else... no matter which software. In Cinema, there's the
> "PyroCluster" plugin suite to get those effects, since it
> doesn't know anything like the PovRay media effects AFAIK.
> They start out with a default "trace step" of 1 by default,
> which in my scenes usually means 1 = 1 cm. Hint: slooooow.
>
> For this reason, i've kept well away from these effects...
>
> Since this time i definitely need a menacing mass of fiery
> rolling clouds (if only to hide the fact that my
> demon/dragon model has no feet ;), i've caved in and read
> the manual. After this, i've upped the trace step distance
> to 60 and shrunk the precision to 1%. Result: 1 frame ever
> 30 seconds. Happy :)
>
> Oh, and i learned that the plasma noise that creates the
> cloud-like structure has a parameter called "phase" which
> needs to be animated by hand - the default non-animated
> setting makes "copies of a frozen fireball floating up to
> the ceiling while slowly turning black" :)
>
> Well, at least it works now for an animation. A freeze frame
> looks a bit "blotchy" and artefacts-ridden and would need
> much more render time...
>
> -M

Yes, rendering is a very slow process, more so with smoke. It took 25 min to
render my little test.
We will see if I incorporate it into a more complex animation. And, yes I
will start messing around with
wind, turbulence and rotation....I just striped the code down to the minimum
to see how it all works and build
up from there. The Smoke Generator uses Chris Colefax Spline generator inc
file (he is good). One
day I'll get there. ---------You have to keep using it or you lose
it---------
Darin

[Markus Altendorff] Re: 13 days to go, and a question re: voting on ... [6806 days 21 hours and 20 minutes ago]

Sun, 19 Aug 2007 10:02:53 GMT

dbott wrote:
> Well, I am looking forward to seeing your animation and Johns.......????? It
> inspires me to keep on learning new rendering techniques with pov. I spent
> most of Saturday learning Carneholm smoke generator that follows a spline.
> By the end of the afternoon I managed to produce a small test.
> http://www.eastsoundsuites.com/animations/smoke.mpg

That's a nice start! You may want to play with the StartTurb 
and TurbIncRate settings of the generator to get a smoke 
that dissolves over time.

Of course, smoke/volume media eats CPU cycles like little 
else... no matter which software. In Cinema, there's the 
"PyroCluster" plugin suite to get those effects, since it 
doesn't know anything like the PovRay media effects AFAIK. 
They start out with a default "trace step" of 1 by default, 
which in my scenes usually means 1 = 1 cm. Hint: slooooow.

For this reason, i've kept well away from these effects...

Since this time i definitely need a menacing mass of fiery 
rolling clouds (if only to hide the fact that my 
demon/dragon model has no feet ;), i've caved in and read 
the manual. After this, i've upped the trace step distance 
to 60 and shrunk the precision to 1%. Result: 1 frame ever 
30 seconds. Happy :)

Oh, and i learned that the plasma noise that creates the 
cloud-like structure has a parameter called "phase" which 
needs to be animated by hand - the default non-animated 
setting makes "copies of a frozen fireball floating up to 
the ceiling while slowly turning black" :)

Well, at least it works now for an animation. A freeze frame 
looks a bit "blotchy" and artefacts-ridden and would need 
much more render time...

-M

[dbott] Re: 13 days to go, and a question re: voting on ... [6807 days 1 hour and 8 minutes ago]

Sun, 19 Aug 2007 06:14:57 GMT

Well, I am looking forward to seeing your animation and Johns.......????? It
inspires me to keep on learning new rendering techniques with pov. I spent
most of Saturday learning Carneholm smoke generator that follows a spline.
By the end of the afternoon I managed to produce a small test.
http://www.eastsoundsuites.com/animations/smoke.mpg

Darin (dbott)

[Markus Altendorff] Re: 13 days to go, and a question re: voting on ... [6807 days 6 hours and 59 minutes ago]

Sun, 19 Aug 2007 00:23:35 GMT

St. wrote:
> "Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote in message 
> news:46c6cf9a$1@news.povray.org...
>> Hi,
> 
>    Hi Markus
> 
> 
>> two things:
>>
>> a)
>> - 13 days until the next deadline/topic at http://tc-rtc.co.uk/
>> - Nothing new on the IRTC main page.
>> But you knew that already, didn't you?
> 
> 
>     Of course! :o)  My friend, if I had control of it, it would all be 
> there - everything. But I don't have control, even though I'm the owner (no, 
> we're the owner). 

Does that mean that there's a new IRTC admin? (or is it just 
figure-of-speech? ;)

Regarding the "vote only during deadline" thing:

>     This has more or less been put to me in email too, and all I can say is 
> that Colin is thinking about it. He is aware of this problem, but finds it 
> an 'interesting' problem. His initial response was "Let's run it as it is 
> for 6 months first."  -  "Let's see what happens." I kind of agree with this 
> because for a start, there won't be many animations, and there won't be many 
> stills, (not like the heyday of the IRTC - (I think I've seen 80+ images in 
> one round), but, with the help of you guys, this just might change.

Ah, might as well brace myself for a solid (0/0/0) rating 
this time, then ;)

>      Man, those are good. That's all I can say.    :oO

Nah, it's just throwing more time than i probably should at 
a hobby ... :) though i may later give this one enough 
polish so that i can enter it at our local short film 
festival next year - if i dare. Somehow, no matter what i 
try, it never feels "good enough" to me.

Just wait until you've seen the monk's walk cycle. Ugly :( 
despite that i've just spent three hours placing 500 
keyframes. Guess i'll need clever editing to pick the best 
pieces, keeping fingers crossed that the cloth effect hides 
the knees... and cut it up into short 3-seconds-pieces to 
bring some feeling of speed to the intro sequence.

Well, here goes nothing. I've just started the overnight 
render because i'm under the "running-out-of-time" feeling 
again. Am robably going to throw away the result first thing 
in the morning because i've missed something ...

Man, do i admire Jon VanSickle and his robots with their 
built-in leg logic. These can walk by themselves, if i've 
read the descriptions of previous rounds correctly. That 
sure is handy...

-M

[St ] Re: 13 days to go, and a question re: voting on ... [6807 days 11 hours and 56 minutes ago]

Sat, 18 Aug 2007 19:27:19 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote in message 
news:46c6cf9a$1@news.povray.org...
> Hi,

   Hi Markus


>
> two things:
>
> a)
> - 13 days until the next deadline/topic at http://tc-rtc.co.uk/
> - Nothing new on the IRTC main page.
> But you knew that already, didn't you?


    Of course! :o)  My friend, if I had control of it, it would all be 
there - everything. But I don't have control, even though I'm the owner (no, 
we're the owner). This thing is out of my league in the coding department at 
the moment. BUT, that's not to say that I can't learn. ;) I've seen what it 
looks like on the screen, and I think I can handle it. (We'll see!)  ;)



>
> b) i'm a bit unsure how the voting on the TC-RTC website works. There's 
> the upload time limit, and one can vote during the upload time (i.e. while 
> the round is still incomplete). Is there some "after-closing" timeframe 
> where one can continue to vote? i.e. someone's *cough* entry that will 
> definitely need to be submitted very very close to the deadline can not be 
> voted on at all if voting closes with the deadline, too ;)
>
> Any insights on this?

    This has more or less been put to me in email too, and all I can say is 
that Colin is thinking about it. He is aware of this problem, but finds it 
an 'interesting' problem. His initial response was "Let's run it as it is 
for 6 months first."  -  "Let's see what happens." I kind of agree with this 
because for a start, there won't be many animations, and there won't be many 
stills, (not like the heyday of the IRTC - (I think I've seen 80+ images in 
one round), but, with the help of you guys, this just might change.

       I'll keep you (all) updated where and when  I can.



    (Don't go just yet Markus, see below...)



>
> -Markus
>
> -- 
>
> <grins madly, waves album of preview images, ignoring groans from the 
> audience>
>
> The apprentice and the robe:
> http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070815_223935_snap_81575.jpg
>
> Oooh, mysterious drawing on the dungeon floor:
> http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070818_121445_snap_44085.jpg
>
> Whoops, that's not supposed to happen:
> http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070818_122241_snap_44561.jpg




     Man, those are good. That's all I can say.    :oO

       ~Steve~

[Markus Altendorff] 13 days to go, and a question re: voting on TC-R... [6807 days 20 hours and 30 minutes ago]

Sat, 18 Aug 2007 10:53:14 GMT

Hi,

two things:

a)
- 13 days until the next deadline/topic at http://tc-rtc.co.uk/
- Nothing new on the IRTC main page.
But you knew that already, didn't you?

b) i'm a bit unsure how the voting on the TC-RTC website 
works. There's the upload time limit, and one can vote 
during the upload time (i.e. while the round is still 
incomplete). Is there some "after-closing" timeframe where 
one can continue to vote? i.e. someone's *cough* entry that 
will definitely need to be submitted very very close to the 
deadline can not be voted on at all if voting closes with 
the deadline, too ;)

Any insights on this?

-Markus

-- 

<grins madly, waves album of preview images, ignoring groans 
from the audience>

The apprentice and the robe:
http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070815_223935_snap_81575.jpg

Oooh, mysterious drawing on the dungeon floor:
http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070818_121445_snap_44085.jpg

Whoops, that's not supposed to happen:
http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070818_122241_snap_44561.jpg

[Stephen] Re: Animations now working [6818 days and 18 minutes ago]

Wed, 8 Aug 2007 07:05:01 GMT

"St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote:
> "Stephen" <mcavoys_AT_aolDOT.com> wrote in message
> news:web.46b88645c506f08ec4e49fa40@news.povray.org...
> >
> > Great job Steve.
>
>     Thanks Stephen, I'll pass that on to Colin too.
>
>        ~Steve~
>
Of course, I meant the both of you. Give him a free subscription to Pov-Ray
for his good work.


Stephen

[dbott] Re: Animations now working [6818 days 13 hours and 46 minutes ago]

Tue, 7 Aug 2007 17:36:52 GMT

"St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote in message news:46b86a45$1@news.povray.org...
> Hi all
>
>      As promised, the animations for TC-RTC is now working. Everyone has
the
> option to either enter the Stills or the Animations or both.  :o)
>
>       Please login and have a look around...   http://www.tc-rtc.co.uk
>
>
>      (Darin, could I ask you to upload your animation, and then could you
> please let me know via here or email whether you encountered any bugs at
> all? I don't think you will have any problems, but any feedback would be
> appreciated).
>
>
>      Soon(ish), there will also be a new look supplied by Michael Hunter
> that I think is fantastic! THANK YOU Michael.  :o)
>
>
>          ~Steve~
>
Ok - Steve, Its on the way. Glad to be of service.

Darin

[St ] Re: Animations now working [6818 days 14 hours and 44 minutes ago]

Tue, 7 Aug 2007 16:39:17 GMT

Ah, it's ok, I've found them Markus. Thanks for pointing it out. This is 
happening because I made all the test animations 'dead', but on the 'Overall 
Results' page, it's showing what you see. I thought that would disappear 
too. Anyway, I'll get that sorted out.

    ~Steve~

[St ] Re: Animations now working [6818 days 15 hours and 52 minutes ago]

Tue, 7 Aug 2007 15:31:07 GMT

"Stephen" <mcavoys_AT_aolDOT.com> wrote in message 
news:web.46b88645c506f08ec4e49fa40@news.povray.org...
>I thought that it was a new topic - Working :-)

   LOL! That would be quite a good one!  :o)


>
> Great job Steve.

    Thanks Stephen, I'll pass that on to Colin too.

       ~Steve~


>
> Stephen
>
>
>

[St ] Re: Animations now working [6818 days 15 hours and 52 minutes ago]

Tue, 7 Aug 2007 15:31:06 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote in message 
news:46b88bfe$1@news.povray.org...
>
> Great!
>
> I guess there are still some broken parts - at least i'm seeing lots of 
> $USERNAME $IMAGENAME placeholders?

     Hi Markus, I don't see those at all, (using IE, Firefox and Opera) 
which page were they on? It may be that Colin is tidying some things up at 
the moment.

        ~Steve~



>
> -M

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Animations now working [6818 days 16 hours and 10 minutes ago]

Tue, 7 Aug 2007 15:13:02 GMT

St. wrote:
> Hi all
> 
>      As promised, the animations for TC-RTC is now working. Everyone has the 
> option to either enter the Stills or the Animations or both.  :o)
> 
>       Please login and have a look around...   http://www.tc-rtc.co.uk
> 
> 
>      (Darin, could I ask you to upload your animation, and then could you 
> please let me know via here or email whether you encountered any bugs at 
> all? I don't think you will have any problems, but any feedback would be 
> appreciated).
> 
> 
>      Soon(ish), there will also be a new look supplied by Michael Hunter 
> that I think is fantastic! THANK YOU Michael.  :o)
> 
> 

Great!

I guess there are still some broken parts - at least i'm 
seeing lots of $USERNAME $IMAGENAME placeholders?

-M

[Stephen] Re: Animations now working [6818 days 16 hours and 33 minutes ago]

Tue, 7 Aug 2007 14:50:01 GMT

I thought that it was a new topic – Working :-)

Great job Steve.

Stephen

[St ] Animations now working [6818 days 18 hours and 34 minutes ago]

Tue, 7 Aug 2007 12:49:09 GMT

Hi all

     As promised, the animations for TC-RTC is now working. Everyone has the 
option to either enter the Stills or the Animations or both.  :o)

      Please login and have a look around...   http://www.tc-rtc.co.uk


     (Darin, could I ask you to upload your animation, and then could you 
please let me know via here or email whether you encountered any bugs at 
all? I don't think you will have any problems, but any feedback would be 
appreciated).


     Soon(ish), there will also be a new look supplied by Michael Hunter 
that I think is fantastic! THANK YOU Michael.  :o)


         ~Steve~

[Nimish Ajmani] Re: Server hiccup - any info? [6819 days 14 hours and 33 minutes ago]

Mon, 6 Aug 2007 16:50:00 GMT

Markus Altendorff <maa### [at] panoramasde> wrote:
> Hi,
>
> seems the IRTC server disappeared from the map for a day and took the
> most recent messages with it? Anyone any info on this? Harddisk b0rken?
> Restored from backup?

I noticed that too.  Seems to be just a glitch in the server.  The same
thing happened to the Pov-Ray Website.
It must have been restored from backup, because everything a couple days
before vanished.

That's my best guess.

  --Nimish

> Just curious.
>
> -M
>
> --
> "Black Robe" WIP (25 days remaining):
>
> Minor tweaking: Hair interpolation closer to guide elements:
> http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070805_154750_snap_56870.jpg
>
> Added object: Wizard needs book, of course:
> http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070805_170122_snap_61282.jpg
> http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070805_170313_snap_61392.jpg

[Markus Altendorff] Server hiccup - any info? [6819 days 18 hours and 57 minutes ago]

Mon, 6 Aug 2007 12:26:09 GMT

Hi,

seems the IRTC server disappeared from the map for a day and took the 
most recent messages with it? Anyone any info on this? Harddisk b0rken? 
Restored from backup?

Just curious.

-M

--
"Black Robe" WIP (25 days remaining):

Minor tweaking: Hair interpolation closer to guide elements:
http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070805_154750_snap_56870.jpg

Added object: Wizard needs book, of course:
http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070805_170122_snap_61282.jpg
http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070805_170313_snap_61392.jpg

[Markus Altendorff] Re: IRTC Animations Suplement [6824 days 10 hours and 1 minute ago]

Wed, 1 Aug 2007 21:22:17 GMT

St. wrote:
> "Nimish Ajmani" <nomail@nomail> wrote in message 
> news:web.46b0cc47afce77d93d7f9ec10@news.povray.org...
> 
>> OK, thanks for the info.  I had no idea the TC-RTC was working on an
>> animation outlet.
> 
>    Thank you for your understanding Nimish.
> 
> 
>> I'll see what I can do for the Black robe.
> 
>     That would be wonderful! No problem if you can't make it, but there's 
> always the next one for the animations - "The History of Science". Same 
> rules as stills - anything to do with that title goes. This one is from 
> September 1st to December 31st, and I for one, can't wait for that!  :o)
> 

Uh. Huh?
I thought there'd be another topic picked on September 1st, 
along with the next stills round? (otherwise, within a year, 
we'll have a head start on each animation topic by six months ;)

Like:

Stills Topic A -> Animation Topic A
Stills Topic B -> (Topic A cont.)
Stills Topic C -> Animation Topic C
Stills Topic D -> (Topic C cont.)
Stills Topic E -> Animation Topic E

...

instead of:

Stills Topic A -> Animation Topic A
Stills Topic B -> (Topic A cont.)
Stills Topic C -> Animation Topic B
Stills Topic D -> (Topic B cont.)
Stills Topic E -> Animation Topic C

(see the problem?)

Not that i wouldn't like to do something for "the history of 
Science" ;)


"Black Robe": progressing, but still slow.
Latest accessory object:
http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070801_230638_snap_83197.jpg

-M

[Nimish Ajmani] Re: IRTC Animations Suplement [6824 days 11 hours and 58 minutes ago]

Wed, 1 Aug 2007 19:25:02 GMT

"St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote:
> "Nimish Ajmani" <nomail@nomail> wrote in message
> news:web.46b0d84eafce77d93d7f9ec10@news.povray.org...
> > "St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote:
> >> "Nimish Ajmani" <nomail@nomail> wrote in message
> >> news:web.46b0cc47afce77d93d7f9ec10@news.povray.org...
> >>
> >> > OK, thanks for the info.  I had no idea the TC-RTC was working on an
> >> > animation outlet.
> >>
> >>    Thank you for your understanding Nimish.
> >>
> >>
> >> >
> >> > I'll see what I can do for the Black robe.
> >>
> >>     That would be wonderful! No problem if you can't make it, but there's
> >> always the next one for the animations - "The History of Science". Same
> >> rules as stills - anything to do with that title goes. This one is from
> >> September 1st to December 31st, and I for one, can't wait for that!  :o)
> >>
> >>       ~Steve~
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> >
> >> > Nmajmani
> >> >
> >> >
> >
> > I was not aware that the 'History of Science' would be an animation topic.
>
>
>    The Stills topic will also be the animation topic.
>
>
> > I could do that one instead.
> > Can we start now?
>
>      Heh, no. But you can 'think' now.   :o)

OK.  I'll wait off.  Besides, I still have another project runnin.

Thanks for all the info.

 --Nimish

>
>
>       ~Steve~
>
>

[St ] Re: IRTC Animations Suplement [6824 days 12 hours and 10 minutes ago]

Wed, 1 Aug 2007 19:12:39 GMT

"Nimish Ajmani" <nomail@nomail> wrote in message 
news:web.46b0d84eafce77d93d7f9ec10@news.povray.org...
> "St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote:
>> "Nimish Ajmani" <nomail@nomail> wrote in message
>> news:web.46b0cc47afce77d93d7f9ec10@news.povray.org...
>>
>> > OK, thanks for the info.  I had no idea the TC-RTC was working on an
>> > animation outlet.
>>
>>    Thank you for your understanding Nimish.
>>
>>
>> >
>> > I'll see what I can do for the Black robe.
>>
>>     That would be wonderful! No problem if you can't make it, but there's
>> always the next one for the animations - "The History of Science". Same
>> rules as stills - anything to do with that title goes. This one is from
>> September 1st to December 31st, and I for one, can't wait for that!  :o)
>>
>>       ~Steve~
>>
>>
>>
>> >
>> > Nmajmani
>> >
>> >
>
> I was not aware that the 'History of Science' would be an animation topic.


   The Stills topic will also be the animation topic.


> I could do that one instead.
> Can we start now?

     Heh, no. But you can 'think' now.   :o)


      ~Steve~



>
>  --Nimish
>
>
>

[Nimish Ajmani] Re: IRTC Animations Suplement [6824 days 12 hours and 18 minutes ago]

Wed, 1 Aug 2007 19:05:01 GMT

"St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote:
> "Nimish Ajmani" <nomail@nomail> wrote in message
> news:web.46b0cc47afce77d93d7f9ec10@news.povray.org...
>
> > OK, thanks for the info.  I had no idea the TC-RTC was working on an
> > animation outlet.
>
>    Thank you for your understanding Nimish.
>
>
> >
> > I'll see what I can do for the Black robe.
>
>     That would be wonderful! No problem if you can't make it, but there's
> always the next one for the animations - "The History of Science". Same
> rules as stills - anything to do with that title goes. This one is from
> September 1st to December 31st, and I for one, can't wait for that!  :o)
>
>       ~Steve~
>
>
>
> >
> > Nmajmani
> >
> >

I was not aware that the 'History of Science' would be an animation topic.
I could do that one instead.
Can we start now?

  --Nimish

[St ] Re: IRTC Animations Suplement [6824 days 12 hours and 29 minutes ago]

Wed, 1 Aug 2007 18:54:14 GMT

"Nimish Ajmani" <nomail@nomail> wrote in message 
news:web.46b0cc47afce77d93d7f9ec10@news.povray.org...

> OK, thanks for the info.  I had no idea the TC-RTC was working on an
> animation outlet.

   Thank you for your understanding Nimish.


>
> I'll see what I can do for the Black robe.

    That would be wonderful! No problem if you can't make it, but there's 
always the next one for the animations - "The History of Science". Same 
rules as stills - anything to do with that title goes. This one is from 
September 1st to December 31st, and I for one, can't wait for that!  :o)

      ~Steve~



>
> Nmajmani
>
>

[Nimish Ajmani] Re: IRTC Animations Suplement [6824 days 13 hours and 13 minutes ago]

Wed, 1 Aug 2007 18:10:02 GMT

"St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote:
> "Nmajmani" <nomail@nomail> wrote in message
> news:web.46b0abc35553fd253d7f9ec10@news.povray.org...
> >I know that the Stills creators have a nice Stills compotition running on
> > the TC-RTC, but I noticed that the animators don't have a nice outlet.
> >
> > I was wondering if anyone would like me to set up a small fill-in
> > compotition on my webspace, for animations.   There will be the same
> > three-month deadlines.
> >
> > I have much more free time on my hands, and could make sure the system
> > would
> > work perfectly.  Not to mention I'd announce new topics before setting up
> > the viewing and voting page for the last topic.
> >
> > It would be partially automated.  Please post if anyone supports, because
> > I
> > myself am in need of an outlet for my creativity.
>
>      Hi Nmajmani
>
>        Thank you so much for your kind offer, really. But there will be an
> animations outlet on the TC-RTC by the 13th August, and if not, sooner.
> Apparently, adding animations isn't as easy as adding the stills, as it's
> more complicated to do so. So please be patient, it will be up and running
> two weeks before the end of the competition.
>
>    If you have an animation that you have worked on, and want to enter "The
> Black Robe", then please do. It ends on August 31st, (and is now 4 months
> long, with a 12Mb limit), it would be very much appreciated.
>
>      ~Steve~
>
>         TC-RTC admin.
>
>
> >  --Nmajmani
> >
> >

OK, thanks for the info.  I had no idea the TC-RTC was working on an
animation outlet.

I'll see what I can do for the Black robe.

Nmajmani

[St ] Re: IRTC Animations Suplement [6824 days 13 hours and 19 minutes ago]

Wed, 1 Aug 2007 18:03:37 GMT

"Nmajmani" <nomail@nomail> wrote in message 
news:web.46b0abc35553fd253d7f9ec10@news.povray.org...
>I know that the Stills creators have a nice Stills compotition running on
> the TC-RTC, but I noticed that the animators don't have a nice outlet.
>
> I was wondering if anyone would like me to set up a small fill-in
> compotition on my webspace, for animations.   There will be the same
> three-month deadlines.
>
> I have much more free time on my hands, and could make sure the system 
> would
> work perfectly.  Not to mention I'd announce new topics before setting up
> the viewing and voting page for the last topic.
>
> It would be partially automated.  Please post if anyone supports, because 
> I
> myself am in need of an outlet for my creativity.

     Hi Nmajmani

       Thank you so much for your kind offer, really. But there will be an 
animations outlet on the TC-RTC by the 13th August, and if not, sooner. 
Apparently, adding animations isn't as easy as adding the stills, as it's 
more complicated to do so. So please be patient, it will be up and running 
two weeks before the end of the competition.

   If you have an animation that you have worked on, and want to enter "The 
Black Robe", then please do. It ends on August 31st, (and is now 4 months 
long, with a 12Mb limit), it would be very much appreciated.

     ~Steve~

        TC-RTC admin.


>  --Nmajmani
>
>

[Nmajmani] IRTC Animations Suplement [6824 days 15 hours and 28 minutes ago]

Wed, 1 Aug 2007 15:55:02 GMT

I know that the Stills creators have a nice Stills compotition running on
the TC-RTC, but I noticed that the animators don't have a nice outlet.

I was wondering if anyone would like me to set up a small fill-in
compotition on my webspace, for animations.   There will be the same
three-month deadlines.

I have much more free time on my hands, and could make sure the system would
work perfectly.  Not to mention I'd announce new topics before setting up
the viewing and voting page for the last topic.

It would be partially automated.  Please post if anyone supports, because I
myself am in need of an outlet for my creativity.

  --Nmajmani

[St ] Re: 32 days remaining on animation topic "Black ... [6825 days and 6 minutes ago]

Wed, 1 Aug 2007 07:16:23 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] panoramasde> wrote in message 
news:46b02597@news.povray.org...
> John VanSickle wrote:
>
>> http://www.zazzle.com/pd/awards?at=daily_top_10%25&day=12%2f5%2f2006
>>
>> works better for me.
>
> This one gives me the stranges redirection loop, with the date counting up 
> and up and up in the browser's URL field, until Zazzle complains about 
> "too many redirections"... (Safari/Mac)
> Ah, the joy of different web browsers! Indispensable tools for the rich 
> multi-media experience ;)


      Wow, it counted down for me using IE until it got to 1998 and then 
produced a 'cannot find server' page. Weird...

         ~Steve~



>
> -M

[Markus Altendorff] Re: 32 days remaining on animation topic "Black ... [6825 days 1 hour and 5 minutes ago]

Wed, 1 Aug 2007 06:17:59 GMT

John VanSickle wrote:

> http://www.zazzle.com/pd/awards?at=daily_top_10%25&day=12%2f5%2f2006
> 
> works better for me.

This one gives me the stranges redirection loop, with the date counting 
up and up and up in the browser's URL field, until Zazzle complains 
about "too many redirections"... (Safari/Mac)
Ah, the joy of different web browsers! Indispensable tools for the rich 
multi-media experience ;)

-M

[John VanSickle] Re: 32 days remaining on animation topic "Black ... [6825 days 7 hours and 51 minutes ago]

Tue, 31 Jul 2007 23:32:03 GMT

Markus Altendorff wrote:
> While we're on the topic of "shirts" - i couldn't believe this:
> 
> http://www.zazzle.com/pd/awards/pt-235?st=award&at=daily_top_10%25&day=05.12.2006 
> 
> 
> Among the TOP 10 of shirt designs - december 5, 2006?! (designs viewed - 
> not necessarily bought)
> 
> Ooops. Weird. After all that time.

http://www.zazzle.com/pd/awards?at=daily_top_10%25&day=12%2f5%2f2006

works better for me.

Regards,
John

[Markus Altendorff] Re: 32 days remaining on animation topic "Black ... [6826 days 9 hours and 5 minutes ago]

Mon, 30 Jul 2007 22:17:43 GMT

While we're on the topic of "shirts" - i couldn't believe this:

http://www.zazzle.com/pd/awards/pt-235?st=award&at=daily_top_10%25&day=05.12.2006

Among the TOP 10 of shirt designs - december 5, 2006?! 
(designs viewed - not necessarily bought)

Ooops. Weird. After all that time.

-M

[Markus Altendorff] Re: 32 days remaining on animation topic "Black ... [6826 days 9 hours and 20 minutes ago]

Mon, 30 Jul 2007 22:02:48 GMT

John VanSickle wrote:
> 
> For some reason I hear the sound of cash registers.

No, we're running our internet assoc. on a honorary basis 
(and have been doing for the last decade) ... :)

That *other* sound of cash registers may be due to the costs 
associated with creating computer animations, mainly 
electricity bills from overnight renders. This is one thing 
that affects me, too, and there's not much i can do about 
that. At least, i looked all over your homepage for a way to 
buy the Rusty T-shirt ;)

OT: That was another Google accident waiting to happen:
"rusty robot shirt"
resulted in (among others, of course)
http://www.robotcountryusa.com/cgi-bin/wwwcat_2.cgi?pagewant=1&catwant=wwwcat_2

Ouch. That's not even remotely similar. Then again, 30,000 $ 
for the group of robot orchestra players ?!

-M

[John VanSickle] Re: 32 days remaining on animation topic "Black ... [6826 days 13 hours and 50 minutes ago]

Mon, 30 Jul 2007 17:33:00 GMT

Markus Altendorff wrote:
> John VanSickle wrote:
> 
>> I plan to be there.
> 
> 
> That's great! Is it going to be something with Rusty, or the Commander?
> No, don't tell... :) i enjoy looking forward to the unknown.
> 
> You do realize you've got quite the fan base for your creations? I know 
> of at least three other people at our local internet assoc. meetings 
> that also are waiting for the next episode.

For some reason I hear the sound of cash registers.

Regards,
John

[Markus Altendorff] Re: 32 days remaining on animation topic "Black ... [6826 days 19 hours and 57 minutes ago]

Mon, 30 Jul 2007 11:26:03 GMT

John VanSickle wrote:

> I plan to be there.

That's great! Is it going to be something with Rusty, or the Commander?
No, don't tell... :) i enjoy looking forward to the unknown.

You do realize you've got quite the fan base for your creations? I know 
of at least three other people at our local internet assoc. meetings 
that also are waiting for the next episode.

-M

[Stephen] Re: 32 days remaining on animation topic "Black ... [6826 days 22 hours and 43 minutes ago]

Mon, 30 Jul 2007 08:40:02 GMT

Markus Altendorff <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote:
> ... and if you're reading this - shouldn't you instead be
> working on a video for it? :)
[Snip]
>
> Comments welcome. Hey, there's got to be someone left out
> there - last count was only four different senders over the
> last three weeks. That's hardly worthy for a competition
> that is heading into its tenth year! C'mon people... anyone?
> (sigh)
>
> -Markus

I’ve got a WIP that I think will be in a submit-able condition for the
deadline. I don’t think that I’ll be able to finish what I want to do but I
should be able to post a cyclic doodle. It’s the first time I’ve used the
animation feature of a modeler so the movement is simple and limited. But
it’s better for some one to be first out of six than five :-)

Stephen

[John VanSickle] Re: 32 days remaining on animation topic "Black ... [6827 days 7 hours and 46 minutes ago]

Sun, 29 Jul 2007 23:36:28 GMT

Markus Altendorff wrote:
> ... and if you're reading this - shouldn't you instead be working on a 
> video for it? :)
> 
> Remember, it's for fun and learning.
> 
> Latest things i learned how to do:
> 
> Modelling: Lady's got new wings:
> http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070729_224316_snap_81796.jpg
> Automation: Anti-gravity strength control script-wired into dynamic 
> hair/cloth.
> Zero-G mode off:
> http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070729_225442_snap_82482.jpg
> Zero-G mode on:
> http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070729_225258_snap_82378.jpg
> 
> Comments welcome. Hey, there's got to be someone left out there - last 
> count was only four different senders over the last three weeks. That's 
> hardly worthy for a competition that is heading into its tenth year! 
> C'mon people... anyone?
> (sigh)

I plan to be there.

Regards,
John

[Markus Altendorff] 32 days remaining on animation topic "Black Robe" [6827 days 8 hours and 42 minutes ago]

Sun, 29 Jul 2007 22:40:34 GMT

... and if you're reading this - shouldn't you instead be 
working on a video for it? :)

Remember, it's for fun and learning.

Latest things i learned how to do:

Modelling: Lady's got new wings:
http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070729_224316_snap_81796.jpg
Automation: Anti-gravity strength control script-wired into 
dynamic hair/cloth.
Zero-G mode off:
http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070729_225442_snap_82482.jpg
Zero-G mode on:
http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070729_225258_snap_82378.jpg

Comments welcome. Hey, there's got to be someone left out 
there - last count was only four different senders over the 
last three weeks. That's hardly worthy for a competition 
that is heading into its tenth year! C'mon people... anyone?
(sigh)

-Markus

[St ] Re: Free chain mail texture [6827 days 12 hours and 19 minutes ago]

Sun, 29 Jul 2007 19:03:47 GMT

"dbott" <dbo### [at] eastsoundsuitescom> wrote in message 
news:46ab9cd9@news.povray.org...
>* I have been away from everything for three days. Just sat down and turned
> on the old computer.
> *My little POV animation is just hanging out, waiting for instructions.
>
> *(ON COMMAND..........dbott)

    Darin, that command will happen. Please be patient. That's all I can say 
for now.

[dbott] Re: Free chain mail texture [6828 days 11 hours and 37 minutes ago]

Sat, 28 Jul 2007 19:45:29 GMT

* I have been away from everything for three days. Just sat down and turned
on the old computer.
*My little POV animation is just hanging out, waiting for instructions.

*(ON COMMAND..........dbott)


"St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote in message news:46a8fab2@news.povray.org...
>
> "Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] panoramasde> wrote in message
> news:46a6fc7d@news.povray.org...
> > Hi,
> >
> > I've made a chain mail texture "endless" tile, which works quite well
when
> > used together with displacement mapping (and a little less well without,
> > if you don't get too close with the camera). Being more of a Cinema4D
> > user, i've initially posted it at a C4D forum, in german language no
less.
> > The bump/displacement/alpha maps should work fine in any 3D software,
> > though, so if someone wants to download the files, they're attached to
> > this forum thread:
> >
> > http://www.cgnetwork.de/forum/showthread.php?t=90211
> >
> > Free to be used whichever way, i frankly don't care :)
>
>       Thank you Markus, I'll certainly have a play!  :o)
>
> >
> > -Markus
> >
> > P.S.: How's the animations subsection of http://www.tc-rtc.co.uk/ coming
> > along? Anyone reading here with any insights?
>
>      <Waves hand> Yes, me!   ;)
>
>        Don't worry, everything is ship-shape and dandy Markus. All will be
> revealed soon.
>
>
> >
> > P.P.S.: Anyone still working on an animation for "the black robe"? I am.
> > But it's going very, very slow. Still need to build/rig a wizard
character
> > with said robe...
>
>      Keep at it, because as a member, you will be fined 50 Tracer Dollars
> for not entering...  ;)
>
>       (That goes for Mr.Dbott too!)
>
>       Seriously, everything is A/ok.
>
>
>
>            ~Steve~
>
>
>
>

[Thomas de Groot] Re: Free chain mail texture [6828 days 23 hours and 30 minutes ago]

Sat, 28 Jul 2007 07:52:55 GMT

Thank you, Markus!
That will be very useful indeed.

Thomas

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Free chain mail texture [6829 days 15 hours and 51 minutes ago]

Fri, 27 Jul 2007 15:31:51 GMT

St. wrote:
>       That would be cool. You should be highlighting your past works...

Not sure there's much to highlight there. It's just toying 
around and things hastily thrown together due to IRTC 
deadlines and nowhere near what i'd actually like to be able 
to pull off. :)

>> Same thing (the fresnel effect) was added to the main skin texture, 
>> providing a 20% illuminated edge at all times, no matter the lighting:
>> http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070726_221333_snap_80013.jpg
>> Improves shadow contour visibility in the dark and doesn't get in the way 
>> in the light, without render hogs like ambient occlusion.
> 
>      Oh, that's neat. Is that possible in PoV-Ray, do you think?

Should be, there's a "fresnel on" keyword, but that's a 
reflection attribute. What you'd want would be a texture 
that changes color/brightness in relation to the angle 
between surface normal and incoming camera ray, and set it 
to increase the surface luminance the more this angle nears 
90 degrees (or, better yet, by a user-defineable formula). 
Maybe something like the "normal" command, applied to 
brightness? Can't test this, MacPov is now b0rken on my new 
MacPro with Intel. :(

>      >
>>>      The teeth work for me.
>> I'm not going to respond to that line, no way ;)
> 
>      GNASH!  :)

I just had that last sound FX of the title track of the 
Diana Ross 1985 "Eaten Alive" album play back in my head, 
which until just now i found "funny". :)

And then i searched the video to that song on YouTube. :(
My. If you'll excuse me, i now need to drain the liquid 
crystal substance from my screen to rinse it with acid, cut 
up the monitor cable into tiny pieces, crush the frame with 
a sledgehammer and run the resulting debris through a 
blender. I'll proceed to double wrap the dust and send it 
off to hawaii to be thrown into any volcano currently active.

Scrap that. Instead, throw it into the sea just off the San 
Francisco Bay and watch it be buried under the colliding 
tectonic plates of Pacific and North America.

That.
Was.
Bad.

"Bad" bad. Not "funny" bad like Ed Wood's "Plan 9 from Outer 
Space".

Random scene cutting is NOT working well here. The el-cheapo 
40's werewolf monster movie look doesn't work either. I'd 
never thought that i'd ever say this about any kind of video 
clip, but those 3:30 of my life i WANT back. Train wreck. 
Bleagh. No information on the director, but it looks like 
someone tried to rip off a few ideas from John Landis' 
"Thriller" video after watching "Island of Dr. Moreau" while 
under influence.

I'm very, very happy i did meet MTV only briefly during the 
nineties. This has reinforced my belief that music shouldn't 
be SEEN, it should be LISTENED TO.

Well, except of course the first steps into 3D animation 
like Dire Straits' "Money for nothing" or Mick Jagger's 1986 
"Hard Woman". Oooh - nostalgia urge coming up. Going to get 
my a-ha Best Of Videos DVD to make sure that i remember 
there *were* a few fresh ideas in music video style in the 
80s. :)

Well, it doesn't get any more off-topic than that, i guess ;)

-M

P.S.: Opinions expressed are my own, and should be taken 
with a grain of salt. Do Not Try This At Home ;)

[St ] Re: Free chain mail texture [6829 days 20 hours and 39 minutes ago]

Fri, 27 Jul 2007 10:43:38 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] panoramasde> wrote in message 
news:46a9a1e3@news.povray.org...
> St. wrote:
>>
>>    Well, it is.  :)
>>
>
> That's nice :)
>
>>> http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070727_000401_snap.jpg
>>
>>    Oooo, she's a mean-lookin' Ladysphinx!
>
> Within the story context, no. The "Sphinx" species is the other one.

       Yes, of course it is.


> I guess i need to draw some "stat sheets" like in RPGs someday to clarify 
> that muddled universe i've been building over the last decade. :) Maybe 
> even get that old website of mine working again...

      That would be cool. You should be highlighting your past works...


>
> As for mean-lookin', try this :)
> http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070723_001904_snap_1143.jpg

       Yep, that's mean-lookin' alright!


> (found the picture of a growling cat online, and noticed the definite lack 
> of teeth in my old design - didn't know that there are at least three 
> canines on either side, two in the uppper, one in the lower jaw)
> I've since switched off the reflection attribute that never mattered much 
> in the dark spaceship locations but broke in "sky dome" environments and 
> instead added a Fresnel shader in the luminance component to make the 
> edges "glow" a bit. No sample of that yet. Saves some render time, too, 
> because oversampling and the to/fro running rays caused the render to 
> really slow down there.
>
> Same thing (the fresnel effect) was added to the main skin texture, 
> providing a 20% illuminated edge at all times, no matter the lighting:
> http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070726_221333_snap_80013.jpg
> Improves shadow contour visibility in the dark and doesn't get in the way 
> in the light, without render hogs like ambient occlusion.

     Oh, that's neat. Is that possible in PoV-Ray, do you think?


>
> > I like that bling too...
>
> Well, needed some polygon surfaces to hang the chain mail on, and 
> extending the cloth sim around the neck was too unpredictable with motion 
> (Janet Jackson, anyone? ;) I already messed up the connection of 
> cloth<->anchors on the left side - there's a gap, but if i set the 
> "attachment distance" any smaller, the cloth simulation goes "boink"... 
> :( and once a cloth sim is attached to an object, you can't tweak the 
> original poly points without needing to DELETE the sim container and 
> re-configure a new one. Or i just can't find the right buttons in Cinema.

 I wonder if Gilles knows anything about that? I think he uses Cinema.



The printed manual has been scrapped in favour of a few thousand
> HTML pages and "inline help". Gah.

     >
>>      The teeth work for me.
>
> I'm not going to respond to that line, no way ;)


     GNASH!  :)


>
>>> Oh, regarding TC-RTC website: is it intentional that members can 
>>> (pre-)view uploaded entries during the timeframe?
>>
>>     For the life of me, I can't remember how the IRTC did it, (it's been 
>> so long), but for now, I don't see any harm in it, unless others can 
>> point out possible pitfalls?
>
> The IRTC had the upload open, but had the files set to "no access" until 
> the voting started. Possibly to avoid giving ideas away early, so we don't 
> end up with lots of similar pictures because someone thought "great idea, 
> but i can one-up the execution of XYZ's picture".
>
> Just a thought. Not that i'd suspect that to happen often, or at all. At 
> least it shouldn't, due to things like artistic integrity and stuff...

      Yes, yes, I remember now. They held the images on the FTP site until 
ready. Hmm, I wonder if I can somehow only show a part of an image as a 
thumbnail (like a teaser), until they're ready for rating? I'll look into 
this. Thanks for the input Markus!

       ~Steve~



>
> -M

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Free chain mail texture [6829 days 23 hours and 40 minutes ago]

Fri, 27 Jul 2007 07:42:27 GMT

St. wrote:
> 
>    Well, it is.  :)
> 

That's nice :)

>> http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070727_000401_snap.jpg
> 
>    Oooo, she's a mean-lookin' Ladysphinx! 

Within the story context, no. The "Sphinx" species is the other one.
I guess i need to draw some "stat sheets" like in RPGs someday to 
clarify that muddled universe i've been building over the last decade. 
:) Maybe even get that old website of mine working again...

As for mean-lookin', try this :)
http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070723_001904_snap_1143.jpg
(found the picture of a growling cat online, and noticed the definite 
lack of teeth in my old design - didn't know that there are at least 
three canines on either side, two in the uppper, one in the lower jaw)
I've since switched off the reflection attribute that never mattered 
much in the dark spaceship locations but broke in "sky dome" 
environments and instead added a Fresnel shader in the luminance 
component to make the edges "glow" a bit. No sample of that yet. Saves 
some render time, too, because oversampling and the to/fro running rays 
caused the render to really slow down there.

Same thing (the fresnel effect) was added to the main skin texture, 
providing a 20% illuminated edge at all times, no matter the lighting:
http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070726_221333_snap_80013.jpg
Improves shadow contour visibility in the dark and doesn't get in the 
way in the light, without render hogs like ambient occlusion.

 > I like that bling too...

Well, needed some polygon surfaces to hang the chain mail on, and 
extending the cloth sim around the neck was too unpredictable with 
motion (Janet Jackson, anyone? ;) I already messed up the connection of 
cloth<->anchors on the left side - there's a gap, but if i set the 
"attachment distance" any smaller, the cloth simulation goes "boink"... 
:( and once a cloth sim is attached to an object, you can't tweak the 
original poly points without needing to DELETE the sim container and 
re-configure a new one. Or i just can't find the right buttons in 
Cinema. The printed manual has been scrapped in favour of a few thousand 
HTML pages and "inline help". Gah.

>      The teeth work for me.

I'm not going to respond to that line, no way ;)

>> Oh, regarding TC-RTC website: is it intentional that members can 
>> (pre-)view uploaded entries during the timeframe?
> 
>     For the life of me, I can't remember how the IRTC did it, (it's been so 
> long), but for now, I don't see any harm in it, unless others can point out 
> possible pitfalls?

The IRTC had the upload open, but had the files set to "no access" until 
the voting started. Possibly to avoid giving ideas away early, so we 
don't end up with lots of similar pictures because someone thought 
"great idea, but i can one-up the execution of XYZ's picture".

Just a thought. Not that i'd suspect that to happen often, or at all. At 
least it shouldn't, due to things like artistic integrity and stuff...

-M

[St ] Re: Free chain mail texture [6830 days 5 hours and 5 minutes ago]

Fri, 27 Jul 2007 02:18:20 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote in message 
news:46a92a43$1@news.povray.org...
> St. wrote:
>>
>>       Seriously, everything is A/ok.
>>
>
> Let's hope so.

   Well, it is.  :)


 I must admit I've not yet modelled as much
> new (and necessary) objects for my animation idea as i had hoped because i 
> got stuck refining existing models instead... (been leafing through 
> Koenigsmarck's tutorials again, and couldn't resist tweaking face 
> polygons...)
>
> http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070727_000401_snap.jpg


   Oooo, she's a mean-lookin' Ladysphinx! I like that bling too...


>
> Added some more teeth (now six up front, which actually is non-human if 
> you try to fit the canines into the picture, but seems to look more 
> "natural" (cough) ;) and fixed the arrangement into something a little 
> less of a straight line. Also had phong shading off, too. D'oh.

     The teeth work for me.


>
> And, another spaceship type added to the arsenal:
> http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070718_215626_Test2.mpg
> (added some more detail since this version)
>
> Lessons learned:
> - adding/removing polygons kills the guide placement of Cinema4D's hair 
> generator. Whoops. Didn't expect that to happen.
> - Save. Document. Now. Or else...

     Oh, tell me about it. I've had our electric going off before now, 
and... didn't save. That is so annoying.


>
>
> Oh, regarding TC-RTC website: is it intentional that members can 
> (pre-)view uploaded entries during the timeframe?

    For the life of me, I can't remember how the IRTC did it, (it's been so 
long), but for now, I don't see any harm in it, unless others can point out 
possible pitfalls?

      ~Steve~



>
> -M

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Free chain mail texture [6830 days 8 hours and 11 minutes ago]

Thu, 26 Jul 2007 23:12:03 GMT

St. wrote:
> 
>       Seriously, everything is A/ok.
> 

Let's hope so. I must admit I've not yet modelled as much 
new (and necessary) objects for my animation idea as i had 
hoped because i got stuck refining existing models 
instead... (been leafing through Koenigsmarck's tutorials 
again, and couldn't resist tweaking face polygons...)

http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070727_000401_snap.jpg

Added some more teeth (now six up front, which actually is 
non-human if you try to fit the canines into the picture, 
but seems to look more "natural" (cough) ;) and fixed the 
arrangement into something a little less of a straight line. 
    Also had phong shading off, too. D'oh.

And, another spaceship type added to the arsenal:
http://wip.anthrosphinx.de/episode010/20070718_215626_Test2.mpg
(added some more detail since this version)

Lessons learned:
- adding/removing polygons kills the guide placement of 
Cinema4D's hair generator. Whoops. Didn't expect that to happen.
- Save. Document. Now. Or else...

Oh, regarding TC-RTC website: is it intentional that members 
can (pre-)view uploaded entries during the timeframe?

-M

[St ] Re: Free chain mail texture [6830 days 11 hours and 34 minutes ago]

Thu, 26 Jul 2007 19:49:06 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] panoramasde> wrote in message 
news:46a6fc7d@news.povray.org...
> Hi,
>
> I've made a chain mail texture "endless" tile, which works quite well when 
> used together with displacement mapping (and a little less well without, 
> if you don't get too close with the camera). Being more of a Cinema4D 
> user, i've initially posted it at a C4D forum, in german language no less. 
> The bump/displacement/alpha maps should work fine in any 3D software, 
> though, so if someone wants to download the files, they're attached to 
> this forum thread:
>
> http://www.cgnetwork.de/forum/showthread.php?t=90211
>
> Free to be used whichever way, i frankly don't care :)

      Thank you Markus, I'll certainly have a play!  :o)

>
> -Markus
>
> P.S.: How's the animations subsection of http://www.tc-rtc.co.uk/ coming 
> along? Anyone reading here with any insights?

     <Waves hand> Yes, me!   ;)

       Don't worry, everything is ship-shape and dandy Markus. All will be 
revealed soon.


>
> P.P.S.: Anyone still working on an animation for "the black robe"? I am. 
> But it's going very, very slow. Still need to build/rig a wizard character 
> with said robe...

     Keep at it, because as a member, you will be fined 50 Tracer Dollars 
for not entering...  ;)

      (That goes for Mr.Dbott too!)

      Seriously, everything is A/ok.



           ~Steve~

[Markus Altendorff] Free chain mail texture [6831 days 23 hours and 51 minutes ago]

Wed, 25 Jul 2007 07:32:13 GMT

Hi,

I've made a chain mail texture "endless" tile, which works quite well 
when used together with displacement mapping (and a little less well 
without, if you don't get too close with the camera). Being more of a 
Cinema4D user, i've initially posted it at a C4D forum, in german 
language no less. The bump/displacement/alpha maps should work fine in 
any 3D software, though, so if someone wants to download the files, 
they're attached to this forum thread:

http://www.cgnetwork.de/forum/showthread.php?t=90211

Free to be used whichever way, i frankly don't care :)

-Markus

P.S.: How's the animations subsection of http://www.tc-rtc.co.uk/ coming 
along? Anyone reading here with any insights?

P.P.S.: Anyone still working on an animation for "the black robe"? I am. 
But it's going very, very slow. Still need to build/rig a wizard 
character with said robe...

[Markus Altendorff] While IRTC is on hiatus... (a reminder) [6837 days 22 hours and 49 minutes ago]

Thu, 19 Jul 2007 08:33:37 GMT

Hi,

while the IRTC is still on hiatus, there's still the TC-RTC 
going on (which has grown from the irtc.stills group).

If you want to have an outlet for your creative urges, the 
current topics are "The Black Robe" for animations (ends 
August 31st, 2007), and "The History of Science" for the 
stills (ditto 8/31).

Interpretation of the topic is up to you. Both are book 
titles from the Project Gutenberg, picked at random. 
Participation is a bit low, so i thought i'd give it a 
little push here :)

-Markus

[St ] Re: irtc ??? [6847 days 8 hours and 57 minutes ago]

Mon, 9 Jul 2007 22:26:08 GMT

"dbott" <dbo### [at] eastsoundsuitescom> wrote in message 
news:46923dce$1@news.povray.org...
> Thank You Steve -
> You are bringing irtc back to life. I am not trying to rag on you, just
> being a squeaky
> wheel.    Thank you again  -  Darin

  Hey, Darin, it's ok, really.  :o)

   Look, (all), I can't say too much at this point, but what I have planned 
as regards to the TC-RTC is, well, let's just say *good* for everyone, and 
in particular, (but not discounting others), POV-Ray users.

   You know, one of my old bosses said to me once, "Steve, don't jump into 
'that' water, you don't know what's below it". He said that in reference to 
all kinds of ideas I had for the job that I was in at the time; Signwriting 
and screen printing. I was 18 and busting to conquer the world.  ;)

   But, you know, he was right. In my later years, I learnt the hard way. 
:o/  Which was good.  :o)

     Let it flow its natural course. It will be ok.

     ~Steve~

[dbott] Re: irtc ??? [6847 days 17 hours and 30 minutes ago]

Mon, 9 Jul 2007 13:53:18 GMT

Thank You Steve -
You are bringing irtc back to life. I am not trying to rag on you, just
being a squeaky
wheel.    Thank you again  -  Darin

[St ] Re: irtc ??? [6847 days 22 hours and 2 minutes ago]

Mon, 9 Jul 2007 09:20:56 GMT

"dbott" <dbo### [at] eastsoundsuitescom> wrote in message 
news:4691972f$1@news.povray.org...
>  but no mention of animations
> (not that
> I am going to submit early). I would  just like to see some kind of dialog
> on animations.
> It would make me feel better.

     Well, I have already mentioned it in reply to Markus - animations will 
be up-and-running very soon.

        ~Steve~



>
> Have a good day
> Darin
>
>

[dbott] Re: irtc ??? [6848 days 5 hours and 20 minutes ago]

Mon, 9 Jul 2007 02:02:23 GMT

Hey Markus -
I hope you do complete "The Black Robe" I look forward to seeing what you
come up with.
I was very motivated to complete mine early. Since, I work alot in the
summer months.
Steve has put alot of work in the new web site, but no mention of animations
(not that
I am going to submit early). I would  just like to see some kind of dialog
on animations.
It would make me feel better.

Have a good day
Darin

[Markus Altendorff] Re: irtc ??? [6848 days 10 hours and 16 minutes ago]

Sun, 8 Jul 2007 21:07:17 GMT

dbott wrote:
> ????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
> ???
> ? Has anyone checked the old irtc site? The POV-Ray Webmaster has posted an
> update.  ?

Hey, thanks! I usually check it once a week, but missed it. 
This is nice to hear, though i guess i'll complete my "Black 
Robe" contribution to tc-rtc anyway :)

(that is, once i get to actually model + animate. I'm still 
drawing a pencil storyboard to figure out how long the 
sequences will be and how it'll fit into the size limit...)

-M

[dbott] irtc ??? [6849 days 1 hour and 26 minutes ago]

Sun, 8 Jul 2007 05:56:28 GMT

????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
???
? Has anyone checked the old irtc site? The POV-Ray Webmaster has posted an
update.  ?
????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
???

[Markus Altendorff] Re: What's the status of the IRTC? [6854 days 20 hours and 55 minutes ago]

Mon, 2 Jul 2007 10:28:16 GMT

David Cuny wrote:
> On March 12, Thorsten Froehlich wrote:
> 
>> Only six weeks have past. I would recommend at least two or three
>> more months of patience...
> 
> So what's the status of the IRTC? I haven't seen anything posted to this
> site, and the IRTC site still says "We will provide more details soon."

Well, it's dead in the water for now, for all practical purposes.
(my opinion, of course).

There's a stand-in/replacement being run by members of the irtc.stills 
group where "us anim people" can also particpate.

Current topic is "The Black Robe" (title of an 19th century novel, 
IIRC), which may be interpreted as one sees fit. The stills round on 
that has just finished (June 30th), the anims round goes on for another 
two months.

http://www.tc-rtc.co.uk/

Rather nice, automated site (go to: "public view" or "register" to vote).

Participant turnout is quite low at the moment, but better than a 
non-functioning IRTC (gah, did i really write that...?)

Will hopefully get better as the word is spread.

I'm flipflopping between a more action-oriented ("mad wizard") or more 
atmosphere-oriented ("loss mourning") interpretation of "black robe" for 
now, but do intend to produce a contribution...

-Markus

[David Cuny] What's the status of the IRTC? [6855 days and 33 minutes ago]

Mon, 2 Jul 2007 06:50:01 GMT

On March 12, Thorsten Froehlich wrote:

> Only six weeks have past. I would recommend at least two or three
> more months of patience...

So what's the status of the IRTC? I haven't seen anything posted to this
site, and the IRTC site still says "We will provide more details soon."

[OpalPlanet] Re: IRTC redults [6858 days 10 hours and 13 minutes ago]

Thu, 28 Jun 2007 21:10:01 GMT

I loved your vid! I'm just getting started in POV - I'm learning it for my
job - and stuff like yours makes me want to make things for the fun, rather
than the money.

Any way, i was wondering if it would be possible for me to get that pigment?
I'm doing a solar system image right nw, and I can't seem to find a good way
to add the asteroid belt.
Thanks!
OpalPlanet


"Tek" <tek### [at] evilsuperbraincom> wrote:
> "Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote in message
> news:3ebc0cbe@news.povray.org...
> > One thing that's been puzzling me for quite a while: How many
> > particles form the planet's rings at 1:30, and how long did it
> > take to render?
>
> none! :)
>
> It's a trick. The rings of the planet are completely flat and textured with a
> very complicated pigment I dreamt up. It's based on pov's crackle function, with
> a slight noise pattern layered over it. That is used to cut out the silhouette
> of the rocks (so there's see thru bits and solid bits). Then the "lighting" on
> the rocks is faked by using the same pattern in a function, but computing very
> simple lighting as if it was a bump map. I would use a real bump map but that
> renders much slower than my trick. All of this means the rings render in just a
> few seconds per frame.
>
> The same pattern is used as the backdrop to the sequence inside the asteroid
> field, meaning that I only needed about 20 3D asteroids, and the rest are flat
> ones on the sky sphere. If you look closely you'll see none of them are moving
> :)
>
> > (2nd place! Woohoo too... :-)
>
> Congratulations! Your entry was my favourite :)
>
> > My opinion is that it's especially the "negative" comments that
> > help with improvement.
>
> I agree, except that I always feel kinda down if all I get are negative
> comments! I feel a bit mean, always finding some fault in other people's scenes,
> so I try to give some positive and some negative.
>
> BTW, sorry I couldn't think of anything much to say on your one! I was feeling a
> little uninspired. To rectify, I'll comment a bit more here, but I'll avoid
> saying stuff others have said:
>
> The camera movement seems a little excessive, it's like the Matrix at times but
> that seems out of place when it's not used in an action scene. A trick I think
> works well is to think about how you could move the camera if you were actually
> there shooting a movie with real cameras, because people are used to seeing
> footage filmed in that way.
>
> The editing is generally good but gets a bit quick in the desert sequence. I
> would expect to get lots of much longer shots emphasizing the heat and weariness
> of those scenes, but instead they're shown almost as a montage. A classic shot
> pointing towards the sun would be nice (i.e. with just the sun in the centre of
> the frame), it's a bit cliched but it works.
>
> And one other thought: why are your characters a big cat-woman and some girl
> with wings? Maybe I missed an earlier episode where this was explained, but they
> look kinda like someone's just taken a model of a nude and decided to mess
> around and see what happens. I'm pretty sure that isn't the case 'cause the
> cat's face is really detailed, but I'm curious about that choice of character.
>
> --
> Tek
> http://www.evilsuperbrain.com

[Luis] Re: EXPORT FROM WINGS 3D [6899 days 15 hours and 15 minutes ago]

Fri, 18 May 2007 16:07:53 GMT

dbott wrote:
> I was wondering...... if anyone knows if there is an export plug-in to POV
> from WINGS 3D? If there is where could I find it.....The Link on the WINGS
> home page for a plug-in can not be found......
> 
> Thanks
>   Darin
> 
> 

It's too late but ...
This plug-in is also here, from Wings 3D BR :

http://www.wings3d.com.br/kayosiii/wingspov-0.98.28_v1.tgz

Nevertheless, it is not very powerful and became old compared to the 
version 0.98.32a of Wings.
The author of plug-in does not seem very active since more than one year.
A conversion into OBJ format to POSERAY will be more effective

Luis
http://www.lightning-generator.org

[Jim Henderson] Re: EXPORT FROM WINGS 3D [6902 days 15 hours and 17 minutes ago]

Tue, 15 May 2007 16:06:10 GMT

On Tue, 15 May 2007 07:09:15 +0100, St. wrote:

> "Jim Henderson" <nos### [at] nospamcom> wrote in message
> news:4649227e@news.povray.org...
> 
>> Hmmm, I might need a pointer at those other plugins you've got - the
>> POV one is the only one I've installed...
> 
>      Yep, here you go, http://www.manifoldlab.com/wings_manifoldlab/ -
>      it's
> the latest version at the bottom. I think the shape extruder plugin is
> in a 2006 file, but he's not listing them any more for some reason.
> There is a video on the previous page showing what it can do.

Cool, thanks!

Jim

[St ] Re: EXPORT FROM WINGS 3D [6903 days 1 hour and 14 minutes ago]

Tue, 15 May 2007 06:09:21 GMT

"Jim Henderson" <nos### [at] nospamcom> wrote in message 
news:4649227e@news.povray.org...

> Hmmm, I might need a pointer at those other plugins you've got - the POV
> one is the only one I've installed...

     Yep, here you go, http://www.manifoldlab.com/wings_manifoldlab/ - it's 
the latest version at the bottom. I think the shape extruder plugin is in a 
2006 file, but he's not listing them any more for some reason. There is a 
video on the previous page showing what it can do.

       ~Steve~


>
> Jim

[Jim Henderson] Re: EXPORT FROM WINGS 3D [6903 days 4 hours and 22 minutes ago]

Tue, 15 May 2007 03:01:18 GMT

On Tue, 15 May 2007 00:04:12 +0100, St. wrote:

>>> and couldn't find it. Hand it over Jim, or I'll jinx you with bad
>>> pixels.
>>
>> And don't think that that doesn't work - now I've got a bad pixel on my
>> camera's CCD. ;-)
> 
>      Heh, sorry about that. I didn't mean it, honest. :)

That's OK, it seems to be working properly now for some reason. ;-)

>> http://hendersj.googlepages.com/wingspov-0.98.28_v1.tgz
>>
>> It seems, generally, to work for me with Wings 0.98.36 (which is the
>> version I have installed at the moment).
> 
>     That's what I've got installed with a few extra plugin's from the
> hard-working Ggaliens, (nice - I like the 'bend' feature, although, I'm
> still looking for the 'extrude shape' feature, dated around March 2006 I
> believe), and looking at those filenames in your .tgz file, I think I
> came across them in my search! I didn't know what to do with them at
> first with an extension of .beam.

Hmmm, I might need a pointer at those other plugins you've got - the POV 
one is the only one I've installed...

Jim

[dbott] Re: EXPORT FROM WINGS 3D [6903 days 6 hours and 57 minutes ago]

Tue, 15 May 2007 00:25:31 GMT

Thank You --Jim and Steve,
I have the files, and will start playing around with them.
I am glad no one was jinxed with bad pixels....................

[St ] Re: EXPORT FROM WINGS 3D [6903 days 8 hours and 19 minutes ago]

Mon, 14 May 2007 23:04:19 GMT

"Jim Henderson" <nos### [at] nospamcom> wrote in message 
news:46489f9c$1@news.povray.org...
> On Mon, 14 May 2007 18:25:03 +0100, St. wrote:
>
>> "Jim Henderson" <nos### [at] nospamcom> wrote in message
>> news:4647662c$1@news.povray.org...
>>>I did a search on the filename and found it elsewhere on the web...While
>>> it says it might not work with more recent versions of Wings, it seems
>>> to work fine...
>>
>>     DingDang. I looked all over the place most of Sunday morning for
>>     Darin,
>> and couldn't find it. Hand it over Jim, or I'll jinx you with bad
>> pixels.
>
> And don't think that that doesn't work - now I've got a bad pixel on my
> camera's CCD. ;-)


     Heh, sorry about that. I didn't mean it, honest. :)



>
> I've uploaded the version I have on my laptop here to:
>
> http://hendersj.googlepages.com/wingspov-0.98.28_v1.tgz
>
> It seems, generally, to work for me with Wings 0.98.36 (which is the
> version I have installed at the moment).

    That's what I've got installed with a few extra plugin's from the 
hard-working Ggaliens, (nice - I like the 'bend' feature, although, I'm 
still looking for the 'extrude shape' feature, dated around March 2006 I 
believe), and looking at those filenames in your .tgz file, I think I came 
across them in my search! I didn't know what to do with them at first with 
an extension of .beam.

     Ah well, thank you Jim, you're a star!  :)

       ~Steve~



>
> Jim

[Jim Henderson] Re: EXPORT FROM WINGS 3D [6903 days 13 hours and 40 minutes ago]

Mon, 14 May 2007 17:42:52 GMT

On Mon, 14 May 2007 18:25:03 +0100, St. wrote:

> "Jim Henderson" <nos### [at] nospamcom> wrote in message
> news:4647662c$1@news.povray.org...
>>I did a search on the filename and found it elsewhere on the web...While
>> it says it might not work with more recent versions of Wings, it seems
>> to work fine...
> 
>     DingDang. I looked all over the place most of Sunday morning for
>     Darin,
> and couldn't find it. Hand it over Jim, or I'll jinx you with bad
> pixels.

And don't think that that doesn't work - now I've got a bad pixel on my 
camera's CCD. ;-)

I've uploaded the version I have on my laptop here to:

http://hendersj.googlepages.com/wingspov-0.98.28_v1.tgz

It seems, generally, to work for me with Wings 0.98.36 (which is the 
version I have installed at the moment).

Jim

[St ] Re: EXPORT FROM WINGS 3D [6903 days 13 hours and 58 minutes ago]

Mon, 14 May 2007 17:25:03 GMT

"Jim Henderson" <nos### [at] nospamcom> wrote in message 
news:4647662c$1@news.povray.org...
>I did a search on the filename and found it elsewhere on the web...While
> it says it might not work with more recent versions of Wings, it seems to
> work fine...

    DingDang. I looked all over the place most of Sunday morning for Darin, 
and couldn't find it. Hand it over Jim, or I'll jinx you with bad pixels.

          ;)

      ~Steve~


>
> Jim

[triple r] Re: EXPORT FROM WINGS 3D [6904 days 9 hours and 53 minutes ago]

Sun, 13 May 2007 21:30:02 GMT

"dbott" <dbo### [at] eastsoundsuitescom> wrote:
> I was wondering...... if anyone knows if there is an export plug-in to POV
> from WINGS 3D? If there is where could I find it.....The Link on the WINGS
> home page for a plug-in can not be found......
>
> Thanks
>   Darin

I got stuck with this problem a while ago, but I exported the .obj format
and realized it's just a mesh2 in different syntax.  Lately I've just been
using a simple little shell script that is horribly inefficient but does
the trick.  It would be very simple and much more efficient to write a
little converter in c or something, but if you have access to a unix-like
system it works although it might combine all objects together.  It should
handle uv-mapping and normals without a problem.  You just have to make
sure it's triangulated when exported.

http://home.eng.iastate.edu/~rreusser/converttopov.sh

Yes, I know it couldn't be much worse, but it's worked for me.

 - Ricky

[Jim Henderson] Re: EXPORT FROM WINGS 3D [6904 days 11 hours and 57 minutes ago]

Sun, 13 May 2007 19:25:32 GMT

I did a search on the filename and found it elsewhere on the web...While 
it says it might not work with more recent versions of Wings, it seems to 
work fine...

Jim

[Roman Reiner] Re: EXPORT FROM WINGS 3D [6904 days 16 hours and 48 minutes ago]

Sun, 13 May 2007 14:35:01 GMT

"dbott" <dbo### [at] eastsoundsuitescom> wrote:
> I was wondering...... if anyone knows if there is an export plug-in to POV
> from WINGS 3D? If there is where could I find it.....The Link on the WINGS
> home page for a plug-in can not be found......
>
> Thanks
>   Darin

Try POSERay (http://mysite.verizon.net/sfg0000/)
I recommend using the OBJ format for transferring the data from Wings3D to
POSERay  (as POSERay doesn't import Wings files natively). Exporting to
POVRay from POSERay is supported directly.

Regards Roman

[dbott] EXPORT FROM WINGS 3D [6905 days 5 hours and 41 minutes ago]

Sun, 13 May 2007 01:41:24 GMT

I was wondering...... if anyone knows if there is an export plug-in to POV
from WINGS 3D? If there is where could I find it.....The Link on the WINGS
home page for a plug-in can not be found......

Thanks
  Darin

[St ] Re: April 30th approaching... [6909 days 23 hours and 29 minutes ago]

Tue, 8 May 2007 07:53:37 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote in message 
news:463c5d72$1@news.povray.org...

> I wouldn't complain about a 20% file size increase, either :)

    Well, that's what it is...  A file size increase.   :o)

     ~Steve~



>
> -Markus

[St ] Re: April 30th approaching... [6909 days 23 hours and 36 minutes ago]

Tue, 8 May 2007 07:47:07 GMT

"John VanSickle" <evi### [at] hotmailcom> wrote in message 
news:463bbd84@news.povray.org...
> St. wrote:

>> upload your file, (>12MB cap).

> Um, do you mean to say that animations must be a *minimum* of 12 
> megabytes?

     No, no, sorry, I meant an upper cap of 12 Mb's. Seeing as how the 
Stills get an extra 100kb's, then I thought anims should get a little extra 
too.

      ~Steve~


>
> Regards,
> John
> (who thinks that it was a typo.)

[John VanSickle] Re: April 30th approaching... [6912 days 7 hours and 32 minutes ago]

Sat, 5 May 2007 23:50:56 GMT

Markus Altendorff wrote:
> John VanSickle wrote:
> 
>> St. wrote:
>>
>>>     *Animations will DEFINATELY be included on our new website, so 
>>> get your
>>> thinking cap on. It will be ready for approximately the middle of 
>>> July to
>>> upload your file, (>12MB cap). Look out for an update on this in the 
>>> coming
>>> months.  :)
>>
>>
>> Um, do you mean to say that animations must be a *minimum* of 12 
>> megabytes?
> 
> 
> Hey, that's easy to do! Just increase the bitrate of the compressor :)
> 
> No, my guess would be it's the upload file size limit of the web 
> server's script engine, since it was mentioned earlier the new website's 
> going to be heavily automated. Not necessarily connected to the file 
> size limit as declared in the IRTC rules.
> 
> I wouldn't complain about a 20% file size increase, either :)

It probably wouldn't affect me, unless the 12M limit was a lower limit; 
I've never had to cut to reduce the size of my .mpg files.

Regards,
JOhn

[Markus Altendorff] Re: April 30th approaching... [6912 days 20 hours and 49 minutes ago]

Sat, 5 May 2007 10:33:22 GMT

John VanSickle wrote:
> St. wrote:
> 
>>     *Animations will DEFINATELY be included on our new website, so get 
>> your
>> thinking cap on. It will be ready for approximately the middle of July to
>> upload your file, (>12MB cap). Look out for an update on this in the 
>> coming
>> months.  :)
> 
> Um, do you mean to say that animations must be a *minimum* of 12 megabytes?

Hey, that's easy to do! Just increase the bitrate of the 
compressor :)

No, my guess would be it's the upload file size limit of the 
web server's script engine, since it was mentioned earlier 
the new website's going to be heavily automated. Not 
necessarily connected to the file size limit as declared in 
the IRTC rules.

I wouldn't complain about a 20% file size increase, either :)

-Markus

[John VanSickle] Re: April 30th approaching... [6913 days 8 hours and 12 minutes ago]

Fri, 4 May 2007 23:11:00 GMT

St. wrote:

>     *Animations will DEFINATELY be included on our new website, so get your
> thinking cap on. It will be ready for approximately the middle of July to
> upload your file, (>12MB cap). Look out for an update on this in the coming
> months.  :)

Um, do you mean to say that animations must be a *minimum* of 12 megabytes?

Regards,
John
(who thinks that it was a typo.)

[dbott] Re: April 30th approaching... [6914 days 3 hours and 7 minutes ago]

Fri, 4 May 2007 04:15:30 GMT

>     *Animations will DEFINATELY be included on our new website, so get
your
> thinking cap on. It will be ready for approximately the middle of July to
> upload your file, (>12MB cap). Look out for an update on this in the
coming
> months.  :)
>
>       ~Steve~


I was unaware we were given an extra 2MB ---- It's Great ---- 
Thank you,
Darin   (I find so much joy in the little things)

[St ] Re: April 30th approaching... [6914 days 6 hours and 56 minutes ago]

Fri, 4 May 2007 00:26:35 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote in message
news:46374dca$1@news.povray.org...

> (and yes, i realize i'm the cinema4d-black-sheep in a POVray newsgroup, 
> thankyouverymuch ;)

    My friend, you are more than welcome around here.



> P.S.: Who in this newsgroup is really, really, honestly, seriously going 
> to build something for "The black robe" animation topic?

    Don't forget that it's an 'interpretation' of the title. "The Black
Robe" could be the name of a starfleet battle cruiser, a public house, a
euphemism for a disease, the name of a race horse, the name of a secret
sect, a wizards' special clothing, etc. What you do with it is down to you.
Personally, I really like it, and I'm thinking of entering the Animations*
as well as the Stills too.

    *Animations will DEFINATELY be included on our new website, so get your
thinking cap on. It will be ready for approximately the middle of July to
upload your file, (>12MB cap). Look out for an update on this in the coming
months.  :)

      ~Steve~

[dbott] Space Settlment [6915 days 2 hours and 57 minutes ago]

Thu, 3 May 2007 04:25:32 GMT

Markus
Wow----Next to Steve, I would like to say you did an awesome job
on the animation....You truly captured what a lot of people are feeling.

"Hats off to you"
Darin

[dbott] Re: April 30th approaching... [6916 days 2 hours and 49 minutes ago]

Wed, 2 May 2007 04:33:31 GMT

> P.S.: Who in this newsgroup is really, really, honestly,
> seriously going to build something for "The black robe"
> animation topic?

Markus --
I have started and will submit an animation for the new round.
Once again, sorry I let you down on the "Space Settlement....

Hey, I am acting like the old irtc>>>>One minute I am there, and
the next minute I am gone.......

"The Black Robe" -------->Wilkie Collins-------->Lewis Romanyne
Working on it
Darin

[Stephen] Re: April 30th approaching... [6916 days 15 hours and 56 minutes ago]

Tue, 1 May 2007 15:26:32 GMT

On Tue, 01 May 2007 16:24:32 +0200, Markus Altendorff
<maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote:

>
>Comments always welcome...
>(and yes, i realize i'm the cinema4d-black-sheep in a POVray 
>newsgroup, thankyouverymuch ;)

I downloaded the big file. Impressive and sad.

>
>P.S.: Who in this newsgroup is really, really, honestly, 
>seriously going to build something for "The black robe" 
>animation topic?

Not me I'm afraid.

Regards
	Stephen

[Markus Altendorff] Re: April 30th approaching... [6916 days 16 hours and 58 minutes ago]

Tue, 1 May 2007 14:25:14 GMT

St. wrote:
> "Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] panoramasde> wrote in message 
> news:4631cc60@news.povray.org...
>>
>> Will there be more participants this time...?
> 
> I certainly hope so. And even if yours is the only one, you won't be 
> disappointing me.  :o)

Right, let's talk about low expectations ;)

I had some trouble getting the data through to Steve by mail 
(we resorted to trying a download after that failed), but it 
should be up and available at TINA-CheP soon.

For the curious that aren't afraid of "MPEG compression 
rash", it's currently stored at:
http://www.asamnet.de/~altendom/irtcstuff/maal_req.mpg
(9.5 MB)

For the size-doesnt-matter folk, there's also a larger and 
cleaner version at
http://www.asamnet.de/~altendom/irtcstuff/maal_req.480x240.mp4
(23.8 MB)

Comments always welcome...
(and yes, i realize i'm the cinema4d-black-sheep in a POVray 
newsgroup, thankyouverymuch ;)

-Markus

P.S.: Who in this newsgroup is really, really, honestly, 
seriously going to build something for "The black robe" 
animation topic?

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Confirm topic and deadline, please [6919 days 7 hours and 4 minutes ago]

Sun, 29 Apr 2007 00:19:12 GMT

Greg M. Johnson wrote:
> thanks

The topics have been added to the RTC page:

http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/3dextra/

"The NEXT topic for both Stills and Animations, is: "The 
Black Robe" and the deadline is June 30th for Stills, and 
August 31st for Animations."

-Markus

[Greg M Johnson] Confirm topic and deadline, please [6919 days 7 hours and 25 minutes ago]

Sat, 28 Apr 2007 23:57:53 GMT

thanks

[John VanSickle] Re: April 30th approaching... [6920 days 7 hours and 59 minutes ago]

Fri, 27 Apr 2007 23:24:04 GMT

St. wrote:
> "John VanSickle" <evi### [at] hotmailcom> wrote in message 
> news:463134a4@news.povray.org...
> 
>>Markus Altendorff wrote:
>>
>>>... how's tracing?
>>>
>>>Anyone working on the interim "Space Settelement" animation topic?
>>
>>I've decided that I'm not going to do any animations until there is a 
>>definite word on whether the IRTC is coming back or not.  At that time 
>>I'll decide when and where I'll be resuming animations.
> 
> 
>         The thing is John, you'll be an old man by the time the folks at the 
> IRTC decide to say ANYTHING at all. Personally, even if the IRTC came back 
> with a new website, new comps, whatever, I wouldn't entertain them. I think 
> it's really bad form to have done what they've done without doing anything, 
> saying anything, to ANYONE that's involved. It was just really bad 
> etiquette, (or, netiquette, if you like).
> 
>       I would start on "The Black Robe" if I were you John - I was always 
> intrigued by what you might come up with for this round.

I would, except that the "topic" would be more of an "alleged topic" for 
anything I did.

At the moment, when I'm not playing Diablo II, I'm slowly whipping up 
some macros to do Catmull-Clark surface subdivision, so that the next 
version of my modeler will be useful.

Regards,
John

[Dan Byers] Re: April 30th approaching... [6920 days 15 hours and 58 minutes ago]

Fri, 27 Apr 2007 15:25:01 GMT

Markus Altendorff <maa### [at] panoramasde> wrote:
> Now 3D isn't quite the mass market (yes,
> YouTube, i'm looking accusingly into your direction...), and i'm not
> something like a real "artist"...

*snip*

Art is subjective.  I would submit your average YouTube video of some skate
punk racking himself doing a rail slide doesn't constitute "art", but
beauty is in the eye of the beholder :)
--
Dan
GoofyGraffix.com

[St ] Re: April 30th approaching... [6920 days 18 hours and 32 minutes ago]

Fri, 27 Apr 2007 12:50:29 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] panoramasde> wrote in message 
news:4631cc60@news.povray.org...
> St. wrote:
>
>>         The thing is John, you'll be an old man by the time the folks at 
>> the IRTC decide to say ANYTHING at all. Personally, even if the IRTC came 
>> back with a new website, new comps, whatever, I wouldn't entertain them. 
>> I think it's really bad form to have done what they've done without doing 
>> anything, saying anything, to ANYONE that's involved. It was just really 
>> bad etiquette, (or, netiquette, if you like).
>
> It sure feels like this, but i'm not certain it was *meant* like that.

    I'm not too sure about that. What if they planned it this way so they 
didn't have to burden themselves with it any more, I mean, whoever was in 
charge, was in charge for a very long time - I can see that they got bored 
with it, I can see that they didn't want this burden any more, and I can see 
that they may have had problems passing the buck to someone other than that 
young lad who lives in a field all alone with no electricity or broadband 
cables around him. Damn, no cellphone too. Not even paper and pen, toboot. 
Fairplay to him though, at least he tried once.

  If I'm wrong, I'll be the first to hold my hand up. (I hope I am wrong).



> Will there be more participants this time...?

      I certainly hope so. And even if yours is the only one, you won't be 
disappointing me.  :o)

>
> Yoohoo...?
>
> *sigh*

     Hey, "It ain't over 'til the fat lady sings!"   ;)

      ~Steve~


>
> -Markus
> (slightly depressed)

[dbott] Re: April 30th approaching... [6920 days 18 hours and 44 minutes ago]

Fri, 27 Apr 2007 12:39:06 GMT

"St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote in message news:46317c69$1@news.povray.org...
>
> "Greg M. Johnson" <pte### [at] thecommononethatstartswithYcom> wrote in
> message news:46315014@news.povray.org...
>
> > I personally think LOOONNG contest rounds may discourage some who may
fear
> > looking bad in comparison to someone who has the time to put in a full
4.0
> > months of evenings into a project.
>
>         I disagree with that Greg. We all know how hard it is to even
> complete a still image, let alone an animation. I think when new people
see
> the quality that will be involved, they will be glad of the 4 months to at
> least get something done. That's the challenge.
>
>
> > I wouldda moved us to 2.
>
>    I understand Markus' earlier point about this in another thread. Two
> months is just too short to produce quality, and quality is definately
> what's needed to get those newbies interested. I think they'll be glad to
> have four months.
>
>     And anyway, who's to say that there won't be a 'one week' or 'one
month'
> animation challenge too?  ;)
>
>         ~Steve~

Yes --- 4 months is perfect, especially for people that work 1 or 2 hours a
night
on them. And again, sorry Markus, I lost steam.....Working on coo-coo for 2
months <my first entry to irtc> only to find out I submitted to a closed web
site.
Very frustrating..............Steve, I am working on the Black Robe. It will
be nice
to see the web page -----  I am looking forward to participating in
something active.

Darin

[Markus Altendorff] Re: April 30th approaching... [6920 days 21 hours and 11 minutes ago]

Fri, 27 Apr 2007 10:11:44 GMT

>> Markus Altendorff wrote:
>>> ... how's tracing?
>>>
>>> Anyone working on the interim "Space Settelement" animation topic?

Wow, with the overwhelmingly "positive" response to that question ... i 
can almost see the tumbleweeds rolling by and hear the broken window 
panes of the IRTC animation community in the distance, rattling in the 
desert wind ;)

Now do i want to publicly embarrass myself by hurrying to finish my 
video, just to find out it's the only entry? :(

I mean, i enjoy making 3-D animations, and now the tools that work well 
with my workflow seem to be available to me. Yeah, nice. Great. But 
what's even more fun is *talking* (resp. writing) about the results and 
the whole feedback stuff. Now 3D isn't quite the mass market (yes, 
YouTube, i'm looking accusingly into your direction...), and i'm not 
something like a real "artist", that's why i've always enjoyed this 
"peer group" talk with other people that already know what doing 3-D 
amateur projects is like here. "You don't have to be any good" (quote 
from the IRTC rulebook) - that's not something you'll find on the front 
page of any other contest/gallery website...
I mean, c'mon. Talking about e.g. "surface normals" isn't quite part of 
the common vocabulary. Most people i know in "real life" tend to 
interpret that as a reference to people who are "secretly nuts" - and 
who am i to blame them ;)
This is why the whole IRTC affair... it just hurts to see it in this 
state of decay.

 > "John VanSickle" <evi### [at] hotmailcom> wrote in message
 > news:463134a4@news.povray.org...

>> I've decided that I'm not going to do any animations until there is a 
>> definite word on whether the IRTC is coming back or not.  At that time 
>> I'll decide when and where I'll be resuming animations.

Sorry to hear that. I'm missing Rusty already. Watching the re-runs just 
isn't the same...

St. wrote:

>         The thing is John, you'll be an old man by the time the folks at the 
> IRTC decide to say ANYTHING at all. Personally, even if the IRTC came back 
> with a new website, new comps, whatever, I wouldn't entertain them. I think 
> it's really bad form to have done what they've done without doing anything, 
> saying anything, to ANYONE that's involved. It was just really bad 
> etiquette, (or, netiquette, if you like).

It sure feels like this, but i'm not certain it was *meant* like that. 
 From what i've gathered over time, the voluntary "staff" of the IRTC is 
really, really small (at some point in time, there were 3 at most? It 
started in its first incarnation as a one-man-show, IIRC), and now with 
the admin gone for unknown reasons...

(i blushingly recall always being under the impression of the IRTC being 
physically locate in Australia, which is why i half-jokingly speculated 
about a surfer accident or posion spiders back in december - until i 
recently learned it's in the U.S.A - Ooops. )
I've seen artist's websites (i'm also into webcomics... can't seem to 
keep away from anything that a) requires computers, b) comes with flashy 
graphics and c) wastes my time ;) with notes like "sorry, i'm in the 
military and i'm heading off to Bagdad in a week. Won't have internet 
for the next year." Now that's a scary thought... and in that case, i'm 
pretty sure nominating a replacement admin would be waaay down on my list.

>       I would start on "The Black Robe" if I were you John - I was always 
> intrigued by what you might come up with for this round.

Will there be more participants this time...?

Yoohoo...?

*sigh*

-Markus
(slightly depressed)

[St ] Re: April 30th approaching... [6921 days 2 hours and 52 minutes ago]

Fri, 27 Apr 2007 04:30:33 GMT

"John VanSickle" <evi### [at] hotmailcom> wrote in message 
news:463134a4@news.povray.org...
> Markus Altendorff wrote:
>> ... how's tracing?
>>
>> Anyone working on the interim "Space Settelement" animation topic?
>
> I've decided that I'm not going to do any animations until there is a 
> definite word on whether the IRTC is coming back or not.  At that time 
> I'll decide when and where I'll be resuming animations.

        The thing is John, you'll be an old man by the time the folks at the 
IRTC decide to say ANYTHING at all. Personally, even if the IRTC came back 
with a new website, new comps, whatever, I wouldn't entertain them. I think 
it's really bad form to have done what they've done without doing anything, 
saying anything, to ANYONE that's involved. It was just really bad 
etiquette, (or, netiquette, if you like).

      I would start on "The Black Robe" if I were you John - I was always 
intrigued by what you might come up with for this round.


         ~Steve~



>
> Regards,
> John

[St ] Re: April 30th approaching... [6921 days 2 hours and 52 minutes ago]

Fri, 27 Apr 2007 04:30:33 GMT

"Greg M. Johnson" <pte### [at] thecommononethatstartswithYcom> wrote in 
message news:46315014@news.povray.org...

> I personally think LOOONNG contest rounds may discourage some who may fear
> looking bad in comparison to someone who has the time to put in a full 4.0
> months of evenings into a project.

        I disagree with that Greg. We all know how hard it is to even 
complete a still image, let alone an animation. I think when new people see 
the quality that will be involved, they will be glad of the 4 months to at 
least get something done. That's the challenge.

> I wouldda moved us to 2.

   I understand Markus' earlier point about this in another thread. Two 
months is just too short to produce quality, and quality is definately 
what's needed to get those newbies interested. I think they'll be glad to 
have four months.

    And anyway, who's to say that there won't be a 'one week' or 'one month' 
animation challenge too?  ;)

        ~Steve~

>
>
> Markus Altendorff wrote:
>
>> ... how's tracing?
>> Anyone working on the interim "Space Settelement" animation topic?
>>
>

[St ] Re: April 30th approaching... [6921 days 2 hours and 52 minutes ago]

Fri, 27 Apr 2007 04:30:32 GMT

"dbott" <dbo### [at] eastsoundsuitescom> wrote in message 
news:46315314@news.povray.org...


> Things got crazy busy for me. But I am starting to work on the next topic.
> I Think it is "The Black Robe" ?????????

      Yes, it's "The Black Robe" for both Stills and Animations. Stills is 
from May to end of June, and Animations is May to to end of August. Two and 
four months repectively. So, keep at it Darin!   :o)

        ~Steve~




> Darin

[dbott] Re: April 30th approaching... [6921 days 5 hours and 49 minutes ago]

Fri, 27 Apr 2007 01:34:12 GMT

"Greg M. Johnson" <pte### [at] thecommononethatstartswithYcom> wrote in
message news:46315014@news.povray.org...
> For various reasons, I'm ready to get back in the saddle. (One personal
> commitment eased up, computer problems solved, day-job animation project
> complete.)
>
> But I'm not doing anything for this round.
>
> Note: if you are using my povray file. per se,  for selecting topics, make
> sure that you enter in a pre-seed number of the exact specified number of
> digits (you can choose one anyway you like).
>
> I personally think LOOONNG contest rounds may discourage some who may fear
> looking bad in comparison to someone who has the time to put in a full 4.0
> months of evenings into a project.  I am sad the 10second club went under.
> They were able to generate tons of quality entries with a one-month cycle.
> I wouldda moved us to 2.
>
>
> Markus Altendorff wrote:
>
> > ... how's tracing?
> > Anyone working on the interim "Space Settelement" animation topic?
> >
>

Sorry - Markus I  let this one slip bye...........and I helped picked the
topic.
Things got crazy busy for me. But I am starting to work on the next topic.
I Think it is "The Black Robe" ?????????
Darin

[Greg M Johnson] Re: April 30th approaching... [6921 days 6 hours and 1 minute ago]

Fri, 27 Apr 2007 01:21:25 GMT

For various reasons, I'm ready to get back in the saddle. (One personal
commitment eased up, computer problems solved, day-job animation project
complete.)

But I'm not doing anything for this round.

Note: if you are using my povray file. per se,  for selecting topics, make
sure that you enter in a pre-seed number of the exact specified number of
digits (you can choose one anyway you like).

I personally think LOOONNG contest rounds may discourage some who may fear
looking bad in comparison to someone who has the time to put in a full 4.0
months of evenings into a project.  I am sad the 10second club went under.
They were able to generate tons of quality entries with a one-month cycle. 
I wouldda moved us to 2. 

Markus Altendorff wrote:

> ... how's tracing?
> Anyone working on the interim "Space Settelement" animation topic?
>

[John VanSickle] Re: April 30th approaching... [6921 days 7 hours and 59 minutes ago]

Thu, 26 Apr 2007 23:24:20 GMT

Markus Altendorff wrote:
> ... how's tracing?
> 
> Anyone working on the interim "Space Settelement" animation topic?

I've decided that I'm not going to do any animations until there is a 
definite word on whether the IRTC is coming back or not.  At that time 
I'll decide when and where I'll be resuming animations.

Regards,
John

[St ] Re: April 30th approaching... [6922 days 12 hours and 26 minutes ago]

Wed, 25 Apr 2007 18:56:43 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] panoramasde> wrote in message 
news:462f67df$1@news.povray.org...
> ... how's tracing?

  PDG at the moment... I think, (I hope!!)   ;)


>
> Anyone working on the interim "Space Settelement" animation topic?

    "Not I" said the fly... but I'm sure a few others are, well, I hope they 
are... <shrug>


>
> Will it be added to http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/3dextra/ ?

    Of course.  :)


>
> So many questions... :)

  Questions, questions, questions... Where would we be without questions?! 
;)

      ~Steve~

>
> -Markus
> (lagging behind my schedule due to a nasty cold... argh!)

    <sniff-shoo!>

[Markus Altendorff] April 30th approaching... [6922 days 16 hours and 44 minutes ago]

Wed, 25 Apr 2007 14:38:23 GMT

... how's tracing?

Anyone working on the interim "Space Settelement" animation topic?

Will it be added to http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/3dextra/ ?

So many questions... :)

-Markus
(lagging behind my schedule due to a nasty cold... argh!)

[Greg M Johnson] Re: Status? [6928 days 5 hours and 8 minutes ago]

Fri, 20 Apr 2007 02:14:56 GMT

I'm just a bystander for this process.  But my intent was that each of the
two responses were equally valid:

i) A key moment from the book (but hey, who's actually gonna bother to read
some of these obscure ones)?
ii) Whatever comes to mind from the words "The Black Robe."  Me, I'm thinkin
Vader.  Not that I'd actually use Lucasfilm characters.


Markus Altendorff wrote:

> - do i now really have to read the story each time? ;)

[St ] Re: Confirm Topic And Completion Date [6932 days 8 hours and 25 minutes ago]

Sun, 15 Apr 2007 22:57:58 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote in message 
news:46222dfa$1@news.povray.org...

> I also was under the impression of "The black robe" being the next topic.

   Yes, I'm sorry, looking back at what I typed, it did look like that. 
Anyway, the next topic is now set.


> OK, i'm going back to building a bigger spaceship now...

    Hey, looking forward to seeing it Markus.  :o)


       ~Steve~


>
> -Markus
>
> --
> Current Song: "Lit" : "Over my Head" (Titan A.E. Soundtrack)

[St ] Re: Confirm Topic And Completion Date [6932 days 9 hours and 42 minutes ago]

Sun, 15 Apr 2007 21:40:54 GMT

"dbott" <dbo### [at] eastsoundsuitescom> wrote in message 
news:46225770$1@news.povray.org...
>
> "Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote in message
> news:46222dfa$1@news.povray.org...
>> St. wrote:
>> >       No, 'The Black Robe" was just an example Darin. Of course, you 
>> > can
> go
>> > with this subject if you all want to, or if you all want me to, I'll
> pick
>> > another one for you.
>> >
>> >      As for the Anims completion date, that would be for you all to
> decide
>> > on. The present Stills competition (Before and After) will end on the
> 30th
>> > April. If you want the Anims to tie-in with the Stills, I don't see why
> the
>> > Anims is every 4 months - would this be too long? Or would 2 months be
> too
>> > short?
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> -> just stating my own opinion here - will also bend to the
>> majority ;) <-
>>
>> four months is OK - that's 120 days, and more chance to
>> sneak working on 3D in between this "real life" i've been
>> hearing so much about ;)
>>
>> 60 days is a bit short for animations (esp. if modelling is
>> included - i find that it takes more than 2/3 of the time i
>> spend on an animation)
>>
>> I also was under the impression of "The black robe" being
>> the next topic.
>>
>> For a timeframe, i think months-aligned (i.e. 30/31/1st)
>> should do nicely.
>>
>> OK, i'm going back to building a bigger spaceship now...
>>
>> -Markus
>>
>> --
>> Current Song: "Lit" : "Over my Head" (Titan A.E. Soundtrack)
>
> Yes - I agree with Markus --- I like 4 months. It will give us plenty of
> time
> to produce a praiseworthy animation. This will also tie-in nicely with the
> stills comp.
> Also, it might be kinda fun to have one topic for both stills and
> animation....
> One could look at the interpretation of a still picture (and then click)
> to see the interpretation in animation. (interesting ????)
> However, the still and animation topic will not be concurrent on 
> completion
> date
> which should not make a difference. If the web page is designed properly,
> one will
> see the evolution of this scheme.
>
> These are only suggestion. By consolidating same topic and completion 
> dates
> for stills and animations; it should make managing the web site easier to
> start with.
>
> .....Ok,  I think animation should join in on the next topic starting 
> after
> April 30th
> this will help get animation involved in the new web site. It was starting
> to feel like
> we were not part of it.
>
> Thanx  ~Steve~  for keeping the this community alive.

 No, *thank you* for your input and suggestions guys. This is shaping up 
nicely! I agree that  4 months would be good for the animations, and Darin, 
your suggestion of having the same topic for both the Stills and Anims is a 
good one. I really like the idea of being able to switch over to see an 
animated version of what would be the current topic, (and of course, you 
could always enter a still from your animation in the Stills challenge 
too!). However, you're also correct, this would mean that you miss 3 topics 
per year, but I really don't think that it will matter that much seeing as 
you guys are on the ball with your anims and any 'past' anims (to the Still 
guys and public) will surely be worth the wait.

  Ok, now we're getting somewhere. :o) I can now add animations to the 
website too because having everything tie-in together will be so much easier 
to control even though the website will be fully automated.

   As for the next topic, yes, it will be "The Black Robe" for both the 
Stills and Animations. I think this will 'kick-off' the new website very 
nicely indeed, and don't forget that both Stills and Animations will be 
voted and commented on too using the same system, i.e., Artistic - 
Technical - Concept.

   Hopefully, in the next few days, I'll post an update in the Stills group 
about what is planned and what changes are going to take place for the new 
Ray Tracing Challenge - I think the whole concept of this new website will 
be very interesting indeed for *all* Tracers.   :o)

      ~Steve~

[dbott] Re: Confirm Topic And Completion Date [6932 days 14 hours and 34 minutes ago]

Sun, 15 Apr 2007 16:48:48 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote in message
news:46222dfa$1@news.povray.org...
> St. wrote:
> >       No, 'The Black Robe" was just an example Darin. Of course, you can
go
> > with this subject if you all want to, or if you all want me to, I'll
pick
> > another one for you.
> >
> >      As for the Anims completion date, that would be for you all to
decide
> > on. The present Stills competition (Before and After) will end on the
30th
> > April. If you want the Anims to tie-in with the Stills, I don't see why
the
> > Anims is every 4 months - would this be too long? Or would 2 months be
too
> > short?
>
> Hi,
>
> -> just stating my own opinion here - will also bend to the
> majority ;) <-
>
> four months is OK - that's 120 days, and more chance to
> sneak working on 3D in between this "real life" i've been
> hearing so much about ;)
>
> 60 days is a bit short for animations (esp. if modelling is
> included - i find that it takes more than 2/3 of the time i
> spend on an animation)
>
> I also was under the impression of "The black robe" being
> the next topic.
>
> For a timeframe, i think months-aligned (i.e. 30/31/1st)
> should do nicely.
>
> OK, i'm going back to building a bigger spaceship now...
>
> -Markus
>
> --
> Current Song: "Lit" : "Over my Head" (Titan A.E. Soundtrack)

Yes - I agree with Markus --- I like 4 months. It will give us plenty of
time
to produce a praiseworthy animation. This will also tie-in nicely with the
stills comp.
Also, it might be kinda fun to have one topic for both stills and
animation....
One could look at the interpretation of a still picture (and then click)
to see the interpretation in animation. (interesting ????)
However, the still and animation topic will not be concurrent on completion
date
which should not make a difference. If the web page is designed properly,
one will
see the evolution of this scheme.

These are only suggestion. By consolidating same topic and completion dates
for stills and animations; it should make managing the web site easier to
start with.

.....Ok,  I think animation should join in on the next topic starting after
April 30th
this will help get animation involved in the new web site. It was starting
to feel like
we were not part of it.

Thanx  ~Steve~  for keeping the this community alive.

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Confirm Topic And Completion Date [6932 days 17 hours and 31 minutes ago]

Sun, 15 Apr 2007 13:51:54 GMT

St. wrote:
>       No, 'The Black Robe" was just an example Darin. Of course, you can go 
> with this subject if you all want to, or if you all want me to, I'll pick 
> another one for you.
> 
>      As for the Anims completion date, that would be for you all to decide 
> on. The present Stills competition (Before and After) will end on the 30th 
> April. If you want the Anims to tie-in with the Stills, I don't see why the 
> Anims is every 4 months - would this be too long? Or would 2 months be too 
> short?

Hi,

-> just stating my own opinion here - will also bend to the 
majority ;) <-

four months is OK - that's 120 days, and more chance to 
sneak working on 3D in between this "real life" i've been 
hearing so much about ;)

60 days is a bit short for animations (esp. if modelling is 
included - i find that it takes more than 2/3 of the time i 
spend on an animation)

I also was under the impression of "The black robe" being 
the next topic.

For a timeframe, i think months-aligned (i.e. 30/31/1st) 
should do nicely.

OK, i'm going back to building a bigger spaceship now...

-Markus

--
Current Song: "Lit" : "Over my Head" (Titan A.E. Soundtrack)

[St ] Re: Confirm Topic And Completion Date [6932 days 21 hours and 34 minutes ago]

Sun, 15 Apr 2007 09:49:07 GMT

"dbott" <dbo### [at] eastsoundsuitescom> wrote in message 
news:4621bde5$1@news.povray.org...
> Sorry, just got back..............been out of town and away from the
> computer.
> So the topic is "The Black Robe" and when is the completion date for
> stills and animations?

      No, 'The Black Robe" was just an example Darin. Of course, you can go 
with this subject if you all want to, or if you all want me to, I'll pick 
another one for you.

     As for the Anims completion date, that would be for you all to decide 
on. The present Stills competition (Before and After) will end on the 30th 
April. If you want the Anims to tie-in with the Stills, I don't see why the 
Anims is every 4 months - would this be too long? Or would 2 months be too 
short?

     ~Steve~



>
> Thanx Darin
>
>

[dbott] Confirm Topic And Completion Date [6933 days 1 hour and 29 minutes ago]

Sun, 15 Apr 2007 05:53:41 GMT

Sorry, just got back..............been out of town and away from the
computer.
So the topic is "The Black Robe" and when is the completion date for
stills and animations?

Thanx Darin

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Status? [6934 days 22 hours and 10 minutes ago]

Fri, 13 Apr 2007 09:13:19 GMT

St. wrote:

>      Here's another one: "Before Adam" by Jack London, 1876-1916.
> 
>     Now, interpretate that title in any way that you want, Stills or Anims. 
> I personally like this one, (even though I've only just seen it), and it 
> sets your mind thinking about what it may have been like before Adam. But 
> *who* is Adam?

"Before Adam"? Ouch. That just screams for trouble with 
Creationists ;) [well, actually, no - there are at least 
five days available before that, and you could depict "The 
Hiding Of The Dinosaur Skeletons" and apply for public 
funding ;)]

>       Here's another example: "The Doctors Dilemma" by Bernard Shaw, 
> 1856-1950. What 'Dilemma'? Who 'is' the Doctor?

Funny, now somehow the image of a phone booth popped up in 
my mind... ;) it's weird how pre-made popular culture has 
gotten a hold on imagination. I guess i'll never be a "real" 
artist :)

-M

P.S.: We're still "officially" going to use the "The Black 
Robe" title, are we?

[Stephen] Re: Status? [6934 days 23 hours and 36 minutes ago]

Fri, 13 Apr 2007 07:46:33 GMT

On Fri, 13 Apr 2007 00:22:51 +0100, "St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote:

>
>    Heh, no. I'm sure Stephen is holding his tongue in his cheek here... 
>:o)

Yes, I'm just showing off :-)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Moonstone


Regards
	Stephen

[St ] Re: Status? [6935 days 8 hours ago]

Thu, 12 Apr 2007 23:22:50 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote in message 
news:461eaf4a$1@news.povray.org...
> Stephen wrote:
>> On Wed, 11 Apr 2007 23:22:36 +0100, "St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote:
>>
>>>  Next topic? Sure: "The Black Robe" by Wilkie Collins - 1824-1889.
>>>
>>>   (Pulled via "The Hat")
>>>
>>>  Set your imagination alight...
>>
>> Oh! Drat. Couldn't it have been the "Moonstone" or "The lady in White" by 
>> Wilkie
>> Collins? I've read them. And the Moonstone gives lots of scope; India, 
>> Fakirs,
>> Robinson Crusoe, Napoleon etc.
>
> Oh. Now i'm confused. I thought it was about what one comes up with, 
> looking at the title alone (instead of the content) - do i now really have 
> to read the story each time? ;)

    Heh, no. I'm sure Stephen is holding his tongue in his cheek here... 
:o)

     Here's another one: "Before Adam" by Jack London, 1876-1916.

    Now, interpretate that title in any way that you want, Stills or Anims. 
I personally like this one, (even though I've only just seen it), and it 
sets your mind thinking about what it may have been like before Adam. But 
*who* is Adam?

      Here's another example: "The Doctors Dilemma" by Bernard Shaw, 
1856-1950. What 'Dilemma'? Who 'is' the Doctor?

        Set your mind alight...

            ~Steve~



> -Markus

[John VanSickle] Re: 100 days, 6 minutes, and 38 seconds... [6935 days 8 hours and 27 minutes ago]

Thu, 12 Apr 2007 22:55:41 GMT

St. wrote on irtc.stills:
>   Hi Guys
> 
>     Well, a 100 days of no IRTC...  And not whisper from anyone, anywhere. 
> :o/

It's the latter part that I find annoying.  I don't understand why 
*monthly* updates are not forthcoming.  Are they trying to get the old 
admin to take up the gauntlet again?  Are they looking for a new admin? 
  Are they so occupied with their own issues that they've not had time 
for anything IRTC-related?

I mean, the POV-Ray site is being updated every once in a while (last 
dated news item was April the 1st), so somebody at the server has time.

Come on, toss us a bone, here.

Regards,
John

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Status? [6935 days 9 hours and 8 minutes ago]

Thu, 12 Apr 2007 22:14:34 GMT

Stephen wrote:
> On Wed, 11 Apr 2007 23:22:36 +0100, "St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote:
> 
>>  Next topic? Sure: "The Black Robe" by Wilkie Collins - 1824-1889.
>>
>>   (Pulled via "The Hat")
>>
>>  Set your imagination alight...
> 
> Oh! Drat. Couldn't it have been the "Moonstone" or "The lady in White" by Wilkie
> Collins? I've read them. And the Moonstone gives lots of scope; India, Fakirs,
> Robinson Crusoe, Napoleon etc.   
> 

Oh. Now i'm confused. I thought it was about what one comes 
up with, looking at the title alone (instead of the content) 
- do i now really have to read the story each time? ;)
(though it's hard to NOT think of submarines if it would've 
been "20000 leagues under the sea"... ;) - but i'd not have 
associated India with "Moonstone"...

-Markus

[Stephen] Re: Status? [6935 days 11 hours and 14 minutes ago]

Thu, 12 Apr 2007 20:08:52 GMT

On Wed, 11 Apr 2007 23:22:36 +0100, "St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote:

>  Next topic? Sure: "The Black Robe" by Wilkie Collins - 1824-1889.
>
>   (Pulled via "The Hat")
>
>  Set your imagination alight...

Oh! Drat. Couldn't it have been the "Moonstone" or "The lady in White" by Wilkie
Collins? I've read them. And the Moonstone gives lots of scope; India, Fakirs,
Robinson Crusoe, Napoleon etc.   

Regards
	Stephen

[St ] Re: Status? [6936 days 8 hours and 57 minutes ago]

Wed, 11 Apr 2007 22:25:54 GMT

"dbott" <dbo### [at] eastsoundsuitescom> wrote in message 
news:461ca3f8$1@news.povray.org...
>
> "St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote in message news:461c9ba6$1@news.povray.org...
>>
>>
>>    Guys, check the Stills group.
>>
>>     (And thanks Darin, you are of the same ilk as me...)

   And of course, I meant a few others around here too - all positive 
thoughts on something that's good for our community and souls, are good and 
*much* appreciated!


> Thanks Steve --
> I have been reading the stills group, and it sounds like you have it under
> control.

      Yes, I do believe I have so far. Let's just get through these first 
few months and hopefully everything will be fine and settled by then.


> Hope you don't leave out the animation guys, on your new site.

    *Our* new site Darin. This isn't for me, this is for 'Us' - the 3D 
graphics community that *we know* and love. Animations WILL be on this site, 
I promise, it's just that I've got to twist this guy Colin's arm a little to 
get it right, so bear with me for a short while. Colin? He's the guy that's 
doing this for us along with my help, (he's not into 3D graphics at all, but 
has been creating websites for the last 15 years - you should see him on his 
keyboard, I've not seen anything like it - it's just a blur as he moves 
around it, seriously. The chap knows his stuff and he's a nice guy toboot).


> I am willing to help out.

    I/We know that Darin, thanks, and I think we all appreciate any help 
that we can get around here. For now though, just play around with your Anim 
and relax - I/We want to see it.  :o)

        Regs,

      ~Steve~


> Darin

[St ] Re: Status? [6936 days 8 hours and 57 minutes ago]

Wed, 11 Apr 2007 22:25:53 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] panoramasde> wrote in message 
news:461cc521$1@news.povray.org...


 I think this will still give the anim guys a chance to get something
>> completed, although, I don't know how this will tie-in with their comp 
>> end date.
>>
>>      If this is ok for now, then arrange to email your animations to me 
>> at: mr_gold at tiscali.co.uk
>>
>
> -> If i read this right, this would set the end date around April 30th/May 
> 1st, so there's some more time to add that extra polish to your 
> animation...

   Ah, cool. Ok, this is fine with me, and as you all might know by now, I'm 
getting quite excited about playing with animations myself, time permitting, 
and thanks to you and others Markus, I will get that merry-go-round working 
correctly. I know that what I  have planned is all circular, but my dream is 
to do a fly-through around the carousel (up and down) with Poser figures sat 
on the horses or in a some kind of cart too. Should be fun doing it!  :o)


>
> -> I really like the idea with the 1.000 (or so ;) book titles and the 
> POVray random draw that Greg Johnson posted earlier, too. Anyone wants to 
> draw up the next topic?

      This is what we'll be using for the Stills topics, and I think it will 
work great for the Anims too. It's a wonderful idea, and I really thank Greg 
for this great idea too. It will work just fine. With this method, everyone 
will be challenged to produce their INTERPRETATION of the title of an old 
'known' book (whether we know of that title or not). I think this will 
produce diverse Stills/Anims that will be certainly more interesting than 
following a unique topic. I think this idea will really get some minds 
thinking first before prodding finger-to-key.

  Next topic? Sure: "The Black Robe" by Wilkie Collins - 1824-1889.

   (Pulled via "The Hat")

  Set your imagination alight...


>
> -> how about overlapping the announcement of the next topic with the 
> current round? (like, announcing the topic one, two, four weeks early?)
>
> Opinions?

    Well, the way that this website is working out at the moment is that 
when the end of a round arrives, the next topic will be 'live' on the 1st of 
the next month/topic. Would this be ok with both Stills and Anims?

   Also, about the Anims, what would you guys prefer? Would you want an 
extra month to develop your animations so that everything ties in with the 
Stills for viewing? (So, instead of 4 anims a year, it would be 3?)

   Thanks for your input Markus, all, it's very much appreciated.

    ~Steve~


>
> -Markus

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Status? [6936 days 20 hours ago]

Wed, 11 Apr 2007 11:23:13 GMT

dbott schrieb:
> "St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote in message news:461c9ba6$1@news.povray.org...
>>
>>    Guys, check the Stills group.
>>
>>     (And thanks Darin, you are of the same ilk as me...)
>>
>>          ~Steve~
>>
>>
>>
> 
> Thanks Steve --
> I have been reading the stills group, and it sounds like you have it under
> control.
> Hope you don't leave out the animation guys, on your new site.
> I am willing to help out.
> Darin

I'd suggest that for now, we go with Steve's offer to host the animation 
files together with the stills pictures.

Quoting from irtc.stills (Steve's posting):

>    Anyway, I'm still in the fold with our new website, and it's coming along 
> nicely. It will be ready for the May-June Stills competition, but 
> unfortunately, at this time, it won't be able to host the Animations, so 
> what I propose to do for now, is to host the animations on 
> http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/3dextra/ when the March-April Stills comp has 
> ended. I think this will still give the anim guys a chance to get something 
> completed, although, I don't know how this will tie-in with their comp end 
> date.
> 
>      If this is ok for now, then arrange to email your animations to me at: 
> mr_gold at tiscali.co.uk
> 

-> If i read this right, this would set the end date around April 
30th/May 1st, so there's some more time to add that extra polish to your 
animation...

-> I really like the idea with the 1.000 (or so ;) book titles and the 
POVray random draw that Greg Johnson posted earlier, too. Anyone wants 
to draw up the next topic?

-> how about overlapping the announcement of the next topic with the 
current round? (like, announcing the topic one, two, four weeks early?)

Opinions?

-Markus

[dbott] Re: Status? [6936 days 22 hours and 21 minutes ago]

Wed, 11 Apr 2007 09:01:44 GMT

"St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote in message news:461c9ba6$1@news.povray.org...
>
>
>    Guys, check the Stills group.
>
>     (And thanks Darin, you are of the same ilk as me...)
>
>          ~Steve~
>
>
>

Thanks Steve --
I have been reading the stills group, and it sounds like you have it under
control.
Hope you don't leave out the animation guys, on your new site.
I am willing to help out.
Darin

[St ] Re: Status? [6936 days 22 hours and 57 minutes ago]

Wed, 11 Apr 2007 08:26:14 GMT

Guys, check the Stills group.

    (And thanks Darin, you are of the same ilk as me...)

         ~Steve~

[dbott] Re: Status? [6937 days 3 hours and 18 minutes ago]

Wed, 11 Apr 2007 04:05:00 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote in message
news:461bd229$1@news.povray.org...
> i_need_a_unique_name wrote:
> > I for one have harldy got started on the space colony (with house move
and
> > arm breakages getting in the way) - I'd love to finish it 'cos I quite
like
> > my idea even if my rendering/modelling isn't upto it. Though if folks
want
> > to move on to another topic I'd guess I'd follow.
>
> Same here (minus the house move and arm breakages ... ;)
>
> Why not move the timeframe for the somehow-interim "Space
> Settlement" topic to May 1st? (and keep following topic with
> a 3- or 4-months timeframe, so that it falls together with
> every other stills competition?)
>
> > .... though we seem to be lacking a competition infrastructure ... I'm
> > tempted now things are settling down at home just to write one myself
and
> > host it in my shed.
>
> That would be great! With the IRTC it feels like it's still
> the same situation: only thing missing is some web home and
> someone that declares a topic every now and then ;)
>
> I must admit i've even put something up on YouTube (two
> older samples of vfx's i made for a small faerytale parody)
> - man, i thought the MPEG compression loss for the IRTC was
> bad, but ... you know, YouTube flash video ... yuck... and
> already got 165 visitors (and a comment! Wow...). Odd. I'm
> still uneasy with YouTube's "we can use your stuff for our
> promotion anytime anywhere" rules...
>
> -Markus

Well, now that we have come to the realization that irtc will not take
another breath of cyber air. I would be willing to collaborate on a web
site with anyone. And, will go as far as buying a domain name and server
time.
I would invest a hundred bucks or so to make it happen........Markus---John.
There have been some great ideas for scripts coming out of the stills
newsgroup.

What do you think..................
Darin

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Status? [6937 days 13 hours and 16 minutes ago]

Tue, 10 Apr 2007 18:06:33 GMT

i_need_a_unique_name wrote:
> I for one have harldy got started on the space colony (with house move and
> arm breakages getting in the way) - I'd love to finish it 'cos I quite like
> my idea even if my rendering/modelling isn't upto it. Though if folks want
> to move on to another topic I'd guess I'd follow.

Same here (minus the house move and arm breakages ... ;)

Why not move the timeframe for the somehow-interim "Space 
Settlement" topic to May 1st? (and keep following topic with 
a 3- or 4-months timeframe, so that it falls together with 
every other stills competition?)

> .... though we seem to be lacking a competition infrastructure ... I'm
> tempted now things are settling down at home just to write one myself and
> host it in my shed.

That would be great! With the IRTC it feels like it's still 
the same situation: only thing missing is some web home and 
someone that declares a topic every now and then ;)

I must admit i've even put something up on YouTube (two 
older samples of vfx's i made for a small faerytale parody) 
- man, i thought the MPEG compression loss for the IRTC was 
bad, but ... you know, YouTube flash video ... yuck... and 
already got 165 visitors (and a comment! Wow...). Odd. I'm 
still uneasy with YouTube's "we can use your stuff for our 
promotion anytime anywhere" rules...

-Markus

[i need a unique name] Re: Status? [6937 days 16 hours and 38 minutes ago]

Tue, 10 Apr 2007 14:45:02 GMT

I for one have harldy got started on the space colony (with house move and
arm breakages getting in the way) - I'd love to finish it 'cos I quite like
my idea even if my rendering/modelling isn't upto it. Though if folks want
to move on to another topic I'd guess I'd follow.

.... though we seem to be lacking a competition infrastructure ... I'm
tempted now things are settling down at home just to write one myself and
host it in my shed.

[John VanSickle] Status? [6938 days 6 hours and 33 minutes ago]

Tue, 10 Apr 2007 00:49:30 GMT

Do I start ginning up for another IRTC round (April-July), or do I go 
find something else to do?

Regards,
John

[Markus Altendorff] Re: >>it's to quiet<< [6952 days 19 hours and 15 minutes ago]

Mon, 26 Mar 2007 12:08:11 GMT

i_need_a_unique_name wrote:
> I thought the end date for the space settlement was 23rd April, I'm still
> working on mine - being honest only just really got started but I've got a
> script and everything.

Well, i've got no objections to continuing a long-standing IRTC 
tradition of dragging out the due date ;)

> Its a crying shame that just when I decide to get back into raytracing the
> IRTC thing dies on its feet. 

It really is. I thought i could do a "participate once a year" schedule 
(after all, there *are* things like Real Life [don't need an additional 
"Second Life", thankyouverymuch ;) ] or "can't make head nor tail of 
that topic", and now that i've finally gotten a comfortable workflow... 
like you said.

 > (That and I break my shoulder, the resulting
> pain keeping me up at night with consequential lowering of IQ over the past
> few weeks).

Ouch. Get well...

> I'd be happy to lend a hand with dev/admin work for a new competition site.
> My day job is pretty much Java based but I'm sure PHP/Perl wouldn't be too
> hard to get upto speed with.

IIRC, the guys at irtc.stills are considering adding the option for 
animation entries to their plans for the interim page. Not sure if this 
stand-in contest is going to be POV only, or as open as the IRTC.

-Markus

[i need a unique name] Re: >>it's to quiet<< [6952 days 22 hours and 53 minutes ago]

Mon, 26 Mar 2007 08:30:01 GMT

I thought the end date for the space settlement was 23rd April, I'm still
working on mine - being honest only just really got started but I've got a
script and everything.

Its a crying shame that just when I decide to get back into raytracing the
IRTC thing dies on its feet. (That and I break my shoulder, the resulting
pain keeping me up at night with consequential lowering of IQ over the past
few weeks).

I'd be happy to lend a hand with dev/admin work for a new competition site.
My day job is pretty much Java based but I'm sure PHP/Perl wouldn't be too
hard to get upto speed with.

[Markus Altendorff] Re: >>it's to quiet<< [6955 days 21 hours and 19 minutes ago]

Fri, 23 Mar 2007 10:03:37 GMT

dbott wrote:
> HELLO, HELLO, hello...
> IS, IS, is,
> ANY, ANY, any,
> ONE, ONE, one,
> OUT, OUT, out,
> THERE, THERE, there.....?
> Sorry about the echo, the hallways of the irtc are still empty.
> 
> Just checking in......Still pretty quiet.....
> Sorry, Markus I did not complete the topic (space settlement.) I
> was working on some (pov isosurface) and was taking to long to render
> for animation.

No worries, i'm finding it hard to work on it, too. (got preparations 
for a trade fair this weekend) Well, there are still three more 
week(ends) to go, so i guess i won't be letting my new "circular tube" 
space settlement model go to waste (though i guess i'll cut down on my 
first draft of the storyline, for now somehow aptly labelled "requiem").

If the final animation ever sees the light of day (there's actually a 
good chance for that, though i guess i'll have to upload it to my 
webspace and post the URL here, instead of it ever showing up on the 
IRTC itself), then it's going to be about a research trip to a lifeless 
station accidentally crossing path with the solar system. Last scene was 
planned to be a shot of an envelope labelled "Incoming Ring Type Craft, 
2007" (note the acronym ;)

I was actually looking forward for this to be a little inside joke, with 
the IRTC being back up and running by now. Seems to turn into foreboding 
instead... ah well, maybe i'll be able to do something beyond the IRTC 
limits, like a... a... a five-minute epic instead of a 3:45 epic! ;)
Not sure where to post something like that, though... youtube just isn't 
my cup of tea.

-M

[dbott] Re: >>it's to quiet<< [6956 days 5 hours and 1 minute ago]

Fri, 23 Mar 2007 02:21:36 GMT

"John VanSickle" <evi### [at] hotmailcom> wrote in message
news:46033980$1@news.povray.org...
> dbott wrote:
> > HELLO, HELLO, hello...
> > IS, IS, is,
> > ANY, ANY, any,
> > ONE, ONE, one,
> > OUT, OUT, out,
> > THERE, THERE, there.....?
> > Sorry about the echo, the hallways of the irtc are still empty.
> >
> > Just checking in......Still pretty quiet.....
> > Sorry, Markus I did not complete the topic (space settlement.) I
> > was working on some (pov isosurface) and was taking to long to render
> > for animation.
>
> I have only the first shot of my own animation rendered.  I haven't
> really worked on it much.
>
> Regards,
> John

Hi John,
Yup, the motivation is just not there. I have been working on some C++ stuff
and
a little pov on the side using Mr. BORÅS SmokeGenerator....pretty cool
stuff.

Take care
Darin

[John VanSickle] Re: >>it's to quiet<< [6956 days 6 hours and 2 minutes ago]

Fri, 23 Mar 2007 01:20:48 GMT

dbott wrote:
> HELLO, HELLO, hello...
> IS, IS, is,
> ANY, ANY, any,
> ONE, ONE, one,
> OUT, OUT, out,
> THERE, THERE, there.....?
> Sorry about the echo, the hallways of the irtc are still empty.
> 
> Just checking in......Still pretty quiet.....
> Sorry, Markus I did not complete the topic (space settlement.) I
> was working on some (pov isosurface) and was taking to long to render
> for animation.

I have only the first shot of my own animation rendered.  I haven't 
really worked on it much.

Regards,
John

[St ] Re: >>it's to quiet<< [6956 days 12 hours and 46 minutes ago]

Thu, 22 Mar 2007 18:37:14 GMT

"dbott" <dbo### [at] eastsoundsuitescom> wrote in message 
news:4602c478$1@news.povray.org...

> Just checking in......Still pretty quiet.....

   Zz-ZzZ-zZzzzz-ZzZzZ-zzZ

[dbott] >>it's to quiet<< [6956 days 14 hours and 21 minutes ago]

Thu, 22 Mar 2007 17:01:28 GMT

HELLO, HELLO, hello...
IS, IS, is,
ANY, ANY, any,
ONE, ONE, one,
OUT, OUT, out,
THERE, THERE, there.....?
Sorry about the echo, the hallways of the irtc are still empty.

Just checking in......Still pretty quiet.....
Sorry, Markus I did not complete the topic (space settlement.) I
was working on some (pov isosurface) and was taking to long to render
for animation.

Darin

[gregjohn] Using povray to select a raytracing competition ... [6959 days 9 hours and 23 minutes ago]

Mon, 19 Mar 2007 22:00:02 GMT

I put a file here:
http://news.povray.org/povray.text.scene-files/thread/%3Cweb.45ff13a5e7f00d1334d207310%40news.povray.org%3E/

Basically, I went to project gutenberg, downloaded their list of some 5800
book titles, and selected the 830-odd of which I thought would make really
cool titles for a raytracing competition.

What's best about is is that there is a random, verifiable, yet completely
uncontrollable and unpredictable way of picking the topic!  It's based on
some agreed-upon number chosen in the future.  I chose the Dow Jones (TM)
Industrial Average.  This version of the .pov file has you type in the
average to two decimal places, but only uses the last four significant
digits (in order to prevent anyone from trying to affect the market in
order to sway choice of the topic). :)

Enjoy.

Someday if no one comes up with a better idea, I may use this as a
youtube.com-based animation contest.

[David Cuny] Re: IRTC Status [6959 days 21 hours and 53 minutes ago]

Mon, 19 Mar 2007 09:30:01 GMT

My initial question was:

> So what's the plan? Is there going to be some effort
> made in continuing the IRTC, or will it be left in
> permanant limbo?

If this has been answered, it hasn't been clearly communicated. From the
responses given by the POV-Ray team, the answer seems to be "We haven't
decided, and we won't for at least three or four months."

That's fine, and there's nothing the matter with saying that. So how about
the following:

1. The current plan, if any, should be posted on the IRTC site. That way,
there wouldn't be speculation, people wouldn't have to try digging through
this site or the mailing list, wondering if they've missed some
information. A plan can be as simple as "We will wait until <DATE> before
taking any action."

2. If there's any hint as to what that action might be, that would be
helpful as well.

3. If there's a date for any of this - even if it's months away - please
post that, too.

4. If there are reasons that could help people understand (and even
sympathize) with how/why/when the POV-Ray team is doing whatever actions
they are, it would be helpful to post these as well.

Thanks!

[Stephen] Re: IRTC Status [6963 days 23 hours and 53 minutes ago]

Thu, 15 Mar 2007 07:30:01 GMT

Thorsten Froehlich <tho### [at] trfde> wrote:
>
> (not only responding to you)
>
> Guys, you are repeating incorrect assumptions and guesses already clarified
> in various previous discussions, particularly in the stills group. There is
> no uncertainty who "owns the site" or anything like that.
>
> Just get some perspective here: Do you think everybody who can do something
> about the IRTC situation has just been sitting around for years with an
> alternate plan to jump in at the very instance something goes wrong, has the
> time to do that instantly, and really nothing better to do? Just get real,
> please!!! Things take a bit of time and wild speculation about facts already
> known to be false won't get you *anywhere*. Those speculations are just
> waste _your_ own time -- lots of ray-tracing to do, you don't need a
> competition for that! ;-)
>
>  Thorsten, POV-Team

Maybe one of the reasons that there is a bit of speculation is that people
are unclear of the situation. True there has been clarifications of wrong
assumptions but it has been piecemeal and not in the same place. It might
help the community if someone could take the time and trouble to spell out
the situation, simply.



Stephen

[Trevor G Quayle] Re: IRTC Status [6965 days 5 hours and 42 minutes ago]

Wed, 14 Mar 2007 01:40:34 GMT

"Chris Cason" <del### [at] deletethistoopovrayorg> wrote in 
message news:45bf152b$1@news.povray.org...
> Folks,
>
> I've been getting a fair bit of mail about the status of the IRTC. I hope 
> to
> have some sort of indication of the direction for you to take within 24 
> hours
> of this post. For now, please just wait.
>
> -- Chris

I do find it unfortunate though that the current round can't be evaluated 
and completed in the very least.  Perhaps with the talk of the new 
competition, these entries can be ported to a closed round and given the 
attention they deserve for the people that took the time to work on them and 
submit.

-tgq

[St ] Re: IRTC Status [6966 days 14 hours and 36 minutes ago]

Mon, 12 Mar 2007 16:47:03 GMT

"Mike the Elder" <zer### [at] wyanorg> wrote in message 
news:web.45f53a08463ebb8f6d4565230@news.povray.org...
> Thorsten Froehlich <tho### [at] trfde> wrote:
>
>> Only six weeks have past. I would recommend at least two or three more
>> months of patience...
>>
>>  Thorsten, POV-Team
>
> Good plan. And as for this global warming thing, another century or so of
> complacent inactivity should let us know for sure whether or not there's
> really a problem.

   Gah, that's the way I see it. I really don't get it. All those years, and 
no-one can talk to the guy hosting it.

    Or, did Thorsten hint at what's to come?


      ~Steve~


>
>

[Markus Altendorff] Re: IRTC Status [6966 days 19 hours and 1 minute ago]

Mon, 12 Mar 2007 12:22:15 GMT

Mike the Elder wrote:
> Thorsten Froehlich <tho### [at] trfde> wrote:
> 
>> Only six weeks have past. I would recommend at least two or three more
>> months of patience...
>>
>>  Thorsten, POV-Team
> 
> Good plan. And as for this global warming thing, another century or so of
> complacent inactivity should let us know for sure whether or not there's
> really a problem.

Call me overly sensitive, but do i sense a slight hint of sarcasm in 
that statement? ;)

In a more serious state of mind, i'm sad to see the IRTC fall into 
limbo. It's (was?) a place where you can (could?) send in your 
contributions and (quoted from the rules) "don't have to be any good." 
When it comes to 3-D, there's not much of that around the web any more. 
E.g. i wouldn't dare enter any of my stuff into the galleries of the 
Cinema4D forum that i also frequent, simply because i can't compete with 
users that do things like character design or architectural 
visualisation or movie f/x for a living. IRTC is/was where hobbyists or 
after-hour dabblers like me could go and get feedback for their work, 
and get a regular challenge to work on, learn and improve.
Then there's YouTube where you simply get lost among millions of dumb 
stunts and/or even dumber comments spewed out by spambots, and that's 
about it. Then there are all those teams of graphic design students that 
build a video as final exam (like all theses SupInfoCom people), or f/x 
pros with too much time at hand (e.g. 405-the-movie).

Doesn't leave much space to fit in...

-Markus

[Mike the Elder] Re: IRTC Status [6966 days 20 hours and 48 minutes ago]

Mon, 12 Mar 2007 10:35:00 GMT

Thorsten Froehlich <tho### [at] trfde> wrote:

> Only six weeks have past. I would recommend at least two or three more
> months of patience...
>
>  Thorsten, POV-Team

Good plan. And as for this global warming thing, another century or so of
complacent inactivity should let us know for sure whether or not there's
really a problem.

[Stephen] Re: IRTC Status [6966 days 20 hours and 58 minutes ago]

Mon, 12 Mar 2007 10:25:01 GMT

Thorsten Froehlich <tho### [at] trfde> wrote:
> David Cuny wrote:
> > What I expected would happen by this point - now that several months
>
> Only six weeks have past. I would recommend at least two or three more
> months of patience...
>
>  Thorsten, POV-Team

Ah! The modern world, everything should be instant :)
Strange behaviour form people who will wait an hour for one line of an image
to render :-)

Stephen

[Thorsten Froehlich] Re: IRTC Status [6966 days 21 hours and 30 minutes ago]

Mon, 12 Mar 2007 09:53:01 GMT

David Cuny wrote:
> What I expected would happen by this point - now that several months

Only six weeks have past. I would recommend at least two or three more
months of patience...

	Thorsten, POV-Team

[David Cuny] Re: IRTC Status [6967 days and 13 minutes ago]

Mon, 12 Mar 2007 07:10:02 GMT

So what's the status of the IRTC?

What I expected would happen by this point - now that several months have
passed, and it's abundantly clear that the last IRTC admin is AWOL - is
that Chris would be asking if anyone would be interesting in taking over
the admin role.

I could be wrong, but that doesn't seem to be happening.

The IRTC itself seems to be on permanent hold. The prior contest images and
animations are "available for comment", but none of these comments seem to
have been posted.

The impression I get is that the prior IRTC administration has managed to
alienate a lot of people, including Chris and ex-IRTC administration. The
workings of the IRTC seem to have been done out of sight of the general
public.

Chris has spoken of a "clone" of the IRTC, but it's not clear to me why
someone can't just take over the administration role. The IRTC rules are
laid out, the structure is in place... What's issue?

So what's the plan? Is there going to be some effort made in continuing the
IRTC, or will it be left in permanant limbo?

[Stephen] Re: to those that understand [6975 days 19 hours and 9 minutes ago]

Sat, 3 Mar 2007 12:14:04 GMT

On Thu,  1 Mar 2007 18:52:20 EST, "i_need_a_unique_name"
<ine### [at] gmailcom> wrote:

>
>I feel a bit guilty buying in a model but in this day and age, 

I know what you mean but not everyone is altruistic and some people what to earn
some cash from their hard work. 

>with fast
>hardware and cheap/free software to me the IRTC animation competition is
>about being able to tell as story with the level of skill one has.
>
I mostly agree with you about the IRTC being a place to show off your own work
but I can see the argument that says if you can buy a professional modeller and
renderer you should be allowed to use it combined with your skill and artistic
talent to enter. After all it's not the Internet Pov-Ray Tracing Competition :-)
 

Regards
	Stephen

[i need a unique name] Re: to those that understand [6976 days 20 hours and 48 minutes ago]

Fri, 2 Mar 2007 10:35:00 GMT

> Try *writing* a point-and-click modeller.<

Admiration is off the scale for folks that do that.

> The posing is done with an app called Marionette <

Yeah, for my first entry into IRTC I tried writing something similar (in a
tiny-unworhty-way) so I could script the movement of Poser figures. It
works of a fashion but my math just isn't upto it yet

I notice that Pixar have written quite a lot of propriatary stuff. REYES
(Renders Everything You Ever Saw) may make an interesting IRTC animation
topic - a bit of a tribute to one of our inspirations and quite open ended
in its interpretation?

[Markus Altendorff] Re: to those that understand [6977 days and 9 minutes ago]

Fri, 2 Mar 2007 07:13:27 GMT

John VanSickle wrote:

> The posing is done with an app called Marionette, which looks like a 
> spreadsheet of animation variables over time.  Pixar doesn't appear to 
> use motion-capture (although other houses definitely do), which makes 
> their work even more impressive.

I'm not sure how to put this in words, but most motion-captured 
animations in videos appears a bit "odd" to me. Most recent example i 
saw was "Final Fantasy VII: Advent Children" (yes, it's actually a 
movie, not a video game - but it sure feels like just watching someone 
play 1 1/2 hours without ever making a wrong move on the joystick ;) and 
before that, "Final Fantasy: Spirits within". Maybe it's because the 
actor supplying the spatial data doesn't exactly match the proportions 
of the CG character? Or maybe because the data needs to be smoothed or 
oversampled or something, removing what makes it "human" instead of 
"machine-like"? Whatever it is, it flips the "there's something wrong" 
switch in my brain... especially compared to Pixar. Maybe the manual 
tweaking approach, with the animators acting it all out in front of the 
mirror and then playing with the motion curves (i've seen the add-on 
DVD, too ;) works better - like an actor that needs to act 
"larger-than-life" on the stage to make it appear "natural" to the audience?

-Markus

[John VanSickle] Re: to those that understand [6977 days 5 hours and 48 minutes ago]

Fri, 2 Mar 2007 01:34:39 GMT

i_need_a_unique_name wrote:
>>>>whats wrong with the human body <<<
> 
> Yeah point taken - though I think in Western society nudity to the level of
> explicit genetailia is a bit more controversial than naked breasts.
> Actually to be honest I think the temperature of Hades would be a degree or
> two higher if I released an animation with an explicit vagina than the
> penis.... anyway this post is as far as I fear to push the boundaries of
> respectability :-) - my main distress was the workflow aspect of poser.
> 
> Yup I've recently started trying blender and other gui modellers (like 4
> weeks ago) and already my admiration for anyone that can do modelling with
> a point and click modeller has jumped by a few orders of magnitude.

Try *writing* a point-and-click modeller.

> I get the impression, from the special features section of DVD's, that the
> animation houses don't model using point and click stuff - well at least
> the initial models most of which appear to be scanned in. I'm not knocking
> them I'm just wondering what the right approach for an amateur is.

 From what I see on the 2nd disc in the Incredibles 2-dvd set, the 
scanned models, if they use them, have to be heavily edited by mouse. 
The clothing in the Incredibles involved a masochistic amount of work, 
and a lot of it appears to have been done with a GUI interface and not a 
scanner.

One of their models, called Universal Man, probably was done in a 
modelling app.

The posing is done with an app called Marionette, which looks like a 
spreadsheet of animation variables over time.  Pixar doesn't appear to 
use motion-capture (although other houses definitely do), which makes 
their work even more impressive.

Regards,
John

[i need a unique name] Re: to those that understand [6977 days 7 hours and 28 minutes ago]

Thu, 1 Mar 2007 23:55:00 GMT

> I just did a test and when I uncheck Genitalia, they are not exported in 3DS or
> OBJ meshes.

hmm, well for Poser 4 exporting as detailer they did ... oh well I can live
with it I'm just glad I gotta robot for $8 because its crucial to the story
(unlike my last IRTC entry which really didn't have any meaning).

I feel a bit guilty buying in a model but in this day and age, with fast
hardware and cheap/free software to me the IRTC animation competition is
about being able to tell as story with the level of skill one has.

[Stephen] Re: to those that understand [6977 days 10 hours and 53 minutes ago]

Thu, 1 Mar 2007 20:29:37 GMT

On Thu,  1 Mar 2007 07:48:46 EST, "Stephen" <mcavoys_AT_aolDOT.com> wrote:

>AFAICR when I had a male model’s dangly bits poking through its clothes,
>turning off genatalia stopped it being exported. I’d have to check.
>

I just did a test and when I uncheck Genitalia, they are not exported in 3DS or
OBJ meshes. Note that it is a global setting.

Regards
	Stephen

[Trevor G Quayle] Re: to those that understand [6977 days 14 hours and 38 minutes ago]

Thu, 1 Mar 2007 16:45:01 GMT

"i_need_a_unique_name" <ine### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
> told my wife this, but she just doesn't really care :-(

This I understand.  I've tried to explain photons and radiosity and HDRI to
my wife, but she doesn't want to understand.  She isn't even convinced that
my hobby is a legitimate, constructive way to spend spare time.

-tgq

[Stephen] Re: to those that understand [6977 days 18 hours and 33 minutes ago]

Thu, 1 Mar 2007 12:50:01 GMT

"i_need_a_unique_name" <ine### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
> >>> whats wrong with the human body <<<
>
> Yeah point taken - though I think in Western society nudity to the level of
> explicit genetailia is a bit more controversial than naked breasts.
> Actually to be honest I think the temperature of Hades would be a degree or
> two higher if I released an animation with an explicit vagina than the
> penis.... anyway this post is as far as I fear to push the boundaries of
> respectability :-) - my main distress was the workflow aspect of poser.

You are right of course and I don’t think this is the place to discuss it
further.
AFAICR when I had a male model’s dangly bits poking through its clothes,
turning off genatalia stopped it being exported. I’d have to check.


Stephen

[Stephen] Re: to those that understand [6977 days 20 hours and 53 minutes ago]

Thu, 1 Mar 2007 10:30:01 GMT

Markus Altendorff <maa### [at] panoramasde> wrote:
> Stephen wrote:
>
> > What's wrong with the human body? At least for adults. It strikes me as very
> > strange that the female form is acceptable naked but show a nude man and all
> > Hades breaks loose,
>
> The following comment may be considered juvenile and/or offensive: "Envy" ;)

I know it was a humorous remark but I don’t think it’s envy. I think it is
repression. (No offence to “I need a snappier name” :-)


> > As for your BTW there was a free version of Poser 5 given away a few months ago.
> > I am sure that you could get a copy if a way could be worked out.
>
> Maybe there is a way to use Blender or some other free modeller? My most
> recent run-in with Poser (yes, from that free giveaway thing) left me a
> bit unimpressed (the last Poser version i had was, i think, 2 or
> something, when it was still with MetaCreations(?) - back in the 20th
> century ;)

I don’t see what else you can use if you want halfway realistic human forms.
At least without spending more time on the modelling than anything else. As
it is I spend more time in Poser than I want to.


> I've only recently (like, three days ago) made my first POV scene, and
> already my admiration for anyone that can do an animation with a text
> editor alone has jumped by a few orders of magnitude :)

Me too. But then I use a modeller ‘cause I can’t.


Stephen

[i need a unique name] Re: to those that understand [6977 days 20 hours and 53 minutes ago]

Thu, 1 Mar 2007 10:30:01 GMT

>>> whats wrong with the human body <<<

Yeah point taken - though I think in Western society nudity to the level of
explicit genetailia is a bit more controversial than naked breasts.
Actually to be honest I think the temperature of Hades would be a degree or
two higher if I released an animation with an explicit vagina than the
penis.... anyway this post is as far as I fear to push the boundaries of
respectability :-) - my main distress was the workflow aspect of poser.


Yup I've recently started trying blender and other gui modellers (like 4
weeks ago) and already my admiration for anyone that can do modelling with
a point and click modeller has jumped by a few orders of magnitude.

I get the impression, from the special features section of DVD's, that the
animation houses don't model using point and click stuff - well at least
the initial models most of which appear to be scanned in. I'm not knocking
them I'm just wondering what the right approach for an amateur is.

[Markus Altendorff] Re: to those that understand [6977 days 23 hours and 45 minutes ago]

Thu, 1 Mar 2007 07:38:21 GMT

Stephen wrote:
> On Wed, 28 Feb 2007 16:09:00 EST, "i_need_a_unique_name"
> <ine### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
>>
>> btw I've given up and bought a model of a poser robot for $8 because after a
>> month of trying I've still not managed to build my own in poser 4 (I think
>> poser 5 and onwards are easier to work with but I missed the free download
>> and I can't justify $230 to upgrade) ... is that like cheating?
>>

I wouldn't think so - alas, the link i wanted to add (something in the 
irtc anim rules i vaguely recall) seems to have gone missing from the 
IRTC homepage.

> What's wrong with the human body? At least for adults. It strikes me as very
> strange that the female form is acceptable naked but show a nude man and all
> Hades breaks loose, 

The following comment may be considered juvenile and/or offensive: "Envy" ;)

> As for your BTW there was a free version of Poser 5 given away a few months ago.
> I am sure that you could get a copy if a way could be worked out.

Maybe there is a way to use Blender or some other free modeller? My most 
recent run-in with Poser (yes, from that free giveaway thing) left me a 
bit unimpressed (the last Poser version i had was, i think, 2 or 
something, when it was still with MetaCreations(?) - back in the 20th 
century ;)
I've only recently (like, three days ago) made my first POV scene, and 
already my admiration for anyone that can do an animation with a text 
editor alone has jumped by a few orders of magnitude :)

-Markus

[Stephen] Re: to those that understand [6978 days 8 hours and 31 minutes ago]

Wed, 28 Feb 2007 22:51:22 GMT

On Wed, 28 Feb 2007 16:09:00 EST, "i_need_a_unique_name"
<ine### [at] gmailcom> wrote:

>told my wife this, but she just doesn't really care :-(
>
>so here I go, gotta a bloke in Poser - turned of genatalia 'cos we don't
>really want to see that sort of thing in a space colony movie, export and
>convert to POV and there it is a big fat willy  ... ok so I can probably
>turn it off in the export heirachy thing but all the same very distressing
>from a work flow point of view...
>
>.... just needed to let of steam to those who would understand.
>
>btw I've given up and bought a model of a poser robot for $8 because after a
>month of trying I've still not managed to build my own in poser 4 (I think
>poser 5 and onwards are easier to work with but I missed the free download
>and I can't justify $230 to upgrade) ... is that like cheating?
>

What's wrong with the human body? At least for adults. It strikes me as very
strange that the female form is acceptable naked but show a nude man and all
Hades breaks loose, 

As for your BTW there was a free version of Poser 5 given away a few months ago.
I am sure that you could get a copy if a way could be worked out.

Regards
	Stephen

[i need a unique name] to those that understand [6978 days 10 hours and 13 minutes ago]

Wed, 28 Feb 2007 21:10:00 GMT

told my wife this, but she just doesn't really care :-(

so here I go, gotta a bloke in Poser - turned of genatalia 'cos we don't
really want to see that sort of thing in a space colony movie, export and
convert to POV and there it is a big fat willy  ... ok so I can probably
turn it off in the export heirachy thing but all the same very distressing
from a work flow point of view...

.... just needed to let of steam to those who would understand.

btw I've given up and bought a model of a poser robot for $8 because after a
month of trying I've still not managed to build my own in poser 4 (I think
poser 5 and onwards are easier to work with but I missed the free download
and I can't justify $230 to upgrade) ... is that like cheating?

[Warp] Re: Looking to the future [6998 days 11 hours and 59 minutes ago]

Thu, 8 Feb 2007 19:23:28 GMT

David Cuny <dcu### [at] lansetcom> wrote:
> It's not clear to me why the IRTC can't be continued in the current form.

  Many people have the opinion that the IRTC could benefit from some
spicing up. Give people more varied challenges than just a topic.
Appeal to a more wide variety of people. Try something different from
time to time.

  The IRTC could also perhaps benefit from a more focused approach.
The current liberal approach is ok, but it has gotten a bit old. That
doesn't mean that there couldn't be free-form rounds from time to time,
but perhaps increase the challenge and set up more specific rules.

-- 
                                                          - Warp

[David Cuny] Re: Looking to the future [6998 days 12 hours and 13 minutes ago]

Thu, 8 Feb 2007 19:10:01 GMT

Chris Cason <del### [at] deletethistoopovrayorg> wrote:

> Even if the current situation is not resolved there is no technical
> reason for the site to be closed down (though of course it would
> be wise to modify any parts that refer to accepting submissions
> and so forth).

It's not clear to me why the IRTC can't be continued in the current form. As
I understand things, the primary issue is that the admin is AWOL. Prior to
that, the primary issue was the admin was consistantly late in posting and
announcing new topics.

I don't understand why, if the current admin has disappeared, the IRTC can't
be taken over by another administrator. There have been various admins that
have come and gone in the past, and I don't see why the contest hinges on
this one particular admin.

> Going on, to me, the question is: what would pique your interest and keep
> it long term? A clone of the IRTC? Or something quite different, but with a
> similar flavor? Or something else entirely? Or even a competition that has no
> set flavor - one that changes according to the times?

Again, I don't understand the necessity of closing the "old" IRTC and coming
up with another contest. It seems to me that there's still
considerable interest in maintaining the IRTC in its current form.

I understand how it would be beneficial to have additional competitions,
especially if they are focused on POV-Ray specific features. However,
replacing the IRTC with something new is a bit like throwing the baby out
with the bathwater.

In fact, given the number of submissions for this Animation round, I don't
understand why this round can't be open for judging.

-- David

[dbott] Re: One Small Favor [7001 days 4 hours and 15 minutes ago]

Tue, 6 Feb 2007 03:07:58 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] panoramasde> wrote in message
news:45c71154$1@news.povray.org...
> i_need_a_unique_name wrote:
> > I'd be happy with the "Space Settlements" topic. It was I understand
chosen
> > randomly...
>
> Yes, a "double-blind random draw" - i had an random list of all visible
> IRTC topic suggestions, and dbott picked a number...
>
> In a way, Space Settlements is a "Barnum" topic - "something for anyone"
> (like the way horoscopes usually "are right" ;). Wether you're good at
> creating procedural landscapes, or elaborate machinery - wrap it in a
> ring, or a sphere, or a cube, or a pipe - and presto: instant space
> settlement :)
>
> Oh my. Since this is animations, i'm afraid we may be swamped with
> pre-made Babylon 5 downloadable models ;)
>
> Apart from that, it could be something on a planet (inflatable domes?)
> or the classic "ring-in-space" design, a random cluster of
> welded-together wrecks ("Titan A.E.", anyone? ;) ...
>
> Topic also lends itself well to scenes with robots, i'd guess ;)
>
> -Markus

Yes, I agree, it would be nice to know what irtc's future is looking
like....
And yes, I have started on my space settlement animation. I have a nice
little
scenario to go along with it. Once again, irtc was motivating me to use POV,
and MORAY (which is now part of POV...very cool). But if the irtc turns
to cyber dust, I'll go back to my c++ programming and work on my
raycasting engine. Which I was doing before I discovered all these rendering
programs.

I liked the irtc format the way it was. I like the consistency. And, it is
intriguing to have
a longer and more sophisticated competition on top of the original format.

O-Well, I have offered to help out as a admin. I am not out for any
personal or financial gain. It would be nice to see the irtc continue on.
It is an important motivating venue for learning and feedback in this
medium.
On top of that it has attracted many unique people.

All right, I am going back to my space settlement.........

first time submitter
(going coo coo)
dbott

[i need a unique name] Re: One Small Favor [7001 days 4 hours and 53 minutes ago]

Tue, 6 Feb 2007 02:30:00 GMT

>> greeble <<

Is there an equivalent word for audio-greeble? - I was watching the DVD of
Alien a couple of nights ago and its full of sound-greebles, like since
when has a computer monitor ever made the sound of a tele-type? (but hey
why let reality get in the way of good effects...

[John VanSickle] Re: One Small Favor [7001 days 6 hours and 15 minutes ago]

Tue, 6 Feb 2007 01:07:44 GMT

Markus Altendorff wrote:

> I've started modeling a ring-type space station (and really do wish i 
> knew how to handle advanced scripting, because decorating something like 
> that with all those little tubes and edges and blinkenlights by hand is 
> going to be ... ugh ...),

Someone ought to write a greebling tutorial.

Regards,
John

[Markus Altendorff] Re: One Small Favor [7001 days 20 hours and 9 minutes ago]

Mon, 5 Feb 2007 11:13:24 GMT

i_need_a_unique_name wrote:
> I'd be happy with the "Space Settlements" topic. It was I understand chosen
> randomly...

Yes, a "double-blind random draw" - i had an random list of all visible 
IRTC topic suggestions, and dbott picked a number...

In a way, Space Settlements is a "Barnum" topic - "something for anyone" 
(like the way horoscopes usually "are right" ;). Wether you're good at 
creating procedural landscapes, or elaborate machinery - wrap it in a 
ring, or a sphere, or a cube, or a pipe - and presto: instant space 
settlement :)

Oh my. Since this is animations, i'm afraid we may be swamped with 
pre-made Babylon 5 downloadable models ;)

Apart from that, it could be something on a planet (inflatable domes?) 
or the classic "ring-in-space" design, a random cluster of 
welded-together wrecks ("Titan A.E.", anyone? ;) ...

Topic also lends itself well to scenes with robots, i'd guess ;)

-Markus

[i need a unique name] Re: One Small Favor [7001 days 20 hours and 58 minutes ago]

Mon, 5 Feb 2007 10:25:01 GMT

I'd be happy with the "Space Settlements" topic. It was I understand chosen
randomly...

[Markus Altendorff] Re: One Small Favor [7001 days 23 hours and 15 minutes ago]

Mon, 5 Feb 2007 08:08:21 GMT

John VanSickle wrote:
> Does the present admin situation prevent the next topic from being 
> published?
> 
> If not, I would be grateful if the topic were chosen and announced.

I second that.

Also, it'd be nice to know if there's some plan for continuing the IRTC 
in its current form? (apart from "waiting indefinitely for admin to reply"?)

Uh, by the way, anyone already started with our for-fun stand-in topic 
of "Space Settlements"? (see postings at irtc.animations around Jan. 30)

I've started modeling a ring-type space station (and really do wish i 
knew how to handle advanced scripting, because decorating something like 
that with all those little tubes and edges and blinkenlights by hand is 
going to be ... ugh ...), but i'd be happy to have/work on an official 
IRTC topic, nonetheless. There's always a chance to slip in your 
pre-made space station into another topic, anyway :)

-Markus

[John VanSickle] One Small Favor [7002 days 3 hours and 12 minutes ago]

Mon, 5 Feb 2007 04:10:34 GMT

Does the present admin situation prevent the next topic from being 
published?

If not, I would be grateful if the topic were chosen and announced.

Regards,
John

[Markus Altendorff] Re: I've started a preview-viewing page. Oh woe ... [7006 days 10 hours and 12 minutes ago]

Wed, 31 Jan 2007 21:10:42 GMT

Hi,

first, a big "thank you" to all that gave me permission to 
show their files. As i said when i began the preview page, 
i'm going to close it once the IRTC is back.

Well, it is, and so i did :)

I'm not quite sure what to make of the IRTC hiatus or the 
non-voting for the round, but whatever helps the admins will 
be OK, i guess.

Going to take a look at the stills now...

-Markus

[Chris Cason] Looking to the future [7006 days 20 hours and 22 minutes ago]

Wed, 31 Jan 2007 11:00:52 GMT

Having seen the amount of comments regarding the IRTC's current pause, it's
clear that there is a real spirit of competition amongst many users who are
now looking for a productive outlet for that.

I've been associated with the IRTC since it was the 'RTC' and run by Matt
Kruse. However irtc.org has always been 'the' IRTC, and honestly I don't
expect this to change a lot. IMO the admins have done a fantastic job in
keeping the competition rolling for more than ten years. Even if the current
situation is not resolved there is no technical reason for the site to be
closed down (though of course it would be wise to modify any parts that refer
to accepting submissions and so forth).

However this is not the primary point I want to make in this post.

My point I think is that the IRTC can operate in parallel with whatever might
come up to serve as an outlet for this creative spirit of yours. It is not a
case of 'replacing' the IRTC, or even having a successor to it. Just for
there to be something suitable (and preferably fairly automated) that can
operate as your virtual sounding stage.

I can provide the POVCOMP site source code and web hosting for a new
competition. Long-time POV user Lance Birch, a professional web designer, is
willing to supervise and assist with the coding stage. We would need some
additional help there, as well as at least three trusted people who are
willing to make a long term commitment to supervising the operation of the
contest.

Going on, to me, the question is: what would pique your interest and keep it
long term? A clone of the IRTC? Or something quite different, but with a
similar flavor? Or something else entirely? Or even a competition that has no
set flavor - one that changes according to the times?

I would like to suggest one possibility. It would be interesting to be able
to conduct a series of competitions - of variable length according to
difficulty - that I would perhaps describe as the "POV-Team's Challenge".

This would involve us coming up with interesting or intriguing ideas for
renderings - either stills or animations - and challenging you guys to show
us what y'all can do. It need not be limited to POV-Ray, though of course
that's our primary focus.

I've no opinion how voting would work. But the winner(s) of each round would
get a nice virtual medal rendered in 100% recycled electrons and a spiffy
title of some sort. Possibly I could even tweak the news server web view to
auto-append an award JPG of some sort to the bottom of all their posts whilst
they hold the title (i.e. the badge stays there permanently, but only gets
added to posts they make whilst title-holder. Or something like that.)

Anyhow: what sort of ideas might we pitch? Here's a few that come to mind:

  1. Challenge: make us laugh. No cliches! Be original.

  2. Challenge: using http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/28710584/ as your
     inspiration, come up with something different (no copies!) but that
     invokes a similar sense (of, perhaps, anticipation?*) in viewers minds.

     * this word makes me think of the RHPS. Anyone for a Rocky Horror round?

  3. You are provided with a photograph of an equipment room of some sort
     (perhaps a server room). It has plenty of electronic/computer gear/
     wiring in it. You also get measurements of the room and of the larger
     bits of furniture within it, sufficient to re-create a reasonable
     facsimile of it.

     Challenge: steampunk it. Photorealism is encouraged.

  4. You are supplied a music track in mp3 format and a data file in text
     format, suitable for parsing by POV-Ray's SDL.

     Prior to the start of the competition, a group of you would have created
     a set of SDL routines to manipulate, interpolate, and otherwise use this
     raw data in order to be able to perform the below task (if you're not
     using POV, you will have to find your own way to deal with it).

     The data file contains sufficient information that the audio can be
     matched to each of the 3 or 4 instruments used to record it, such that
     an instrument or scene could be animated in time with it.

     Challenge: create an animation using the above. It is not required that
     you animate instruments. You may choose to make something trippy or
     cool coupled with the beat. It's up to you. Length should be at least
     20 seconds, but would preferably be the same as that of the audio file.

     To be reasonably feasible I would expect that most of the animation
     would have to be automated - but SDL is one of POV's strengths.

     [This challenge was inspired by Animusic*, LOR**, the 'Wizards of
      Winter' video***, and similar items over the years].

      *   http://www.animusic.com/
      **  http://www.lotsofrobots.com/
      *** http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IK90Ys2LhSo

  5. You are supplied with a set of images that, if put together, form a
     short film (in the region of 300 seconds or so). This movie is shot
     using a real video camera and consists of a defined room or outdoor
     area, the measurements of which are supplied to you, along with the
     details and locations of one or two of the major items of furniture
     present. You are additionally provided with camera tracking data* in
     a form suitable to be used in SDL, plus some macros to deal with it.

     The actual details of the video, where it is shot, and what it contains
     (e.g. if there are people present, and if so, what they are doing/saying
     etc) will be determined by reasonable consensus in advance.

     Challenge: render something into this scene such that the finished
     result appears seamless. You can choose any part of the supplied data,
     including non-sequential portions, but the result should be at least 20
     seconds long.

     [Obviously, http://runevision.com/3d/anims/hologram.asp inspired this].

     * If possible this will be high-accuracy date captured from the physical
       camera motion, if we can get access to the equipment required. If not
       then it would be derived.

4 and 5 would obviously be longer-term projects and may run in parallel with
shorter ones. Participants in all of these challenges would be encouraged to
share WIP's, techniques, and macros with others if they so choose. The spirit
of the challenges to experiment, learn, enjoy, do new things, and most of all
create neat stuff with POV.

So. Anyone interested?

-- Chris

[Chris Cason] Re: IRTC Status [7006 days 20 hours and 49 minutes ago]

Wed, 31 Jan 2007 10:33:25 GMT

As promised, here is my response:

We have not heard from Jesse, which is a worry. The other active IRTC admin
(Chip) was holding off in the hope he would respond, since the tasks of
releasing the rounds are usually done by him.

Chip has agreed that the best course right now is to release the round for
viewing, which will be done within 24 hours. Voting will not be enabled at
this point.

With respect to the direction to take for the future ... I have some
comments regarding this. I will make that shortly in a new thread.

regards,

-- Chris Cason

[dbott] Re: IRTC Status [7007 days 6 hours and 48 minutes ago]

Wed, 31 Jan 2007 00:34:31 GMT

"Chris Cason" <del### [at] deletethistoopovrayorg> wrote in
message news:45bf152b$1@news.povray.org...
> Folks,
>
> I've been getting a fair bit of mail about the status of the IRTC. I hope
to
> have some sort of indication of the direction for you to take within 24
hours
> of this post. For now, please just wait.
>
> -- Chris

Pinch me, am I dreaming........Thank you Chris.......

[Doctor John] Re: IRTC Status [7007 days 15 hours and 20 minutes ago]

Tue, 30 Jan 2007 16:02:59 GMT

"Chris Cason" <del### [at] deletethistoopovrayorg> wrote in 
message news:45bf152b$1@news.povray.org...
> Folks,
>
> I've been getting a fair bit of mail about the status of the IRTC. I hope 
> to
> have some sort of indication of the direction for you to take within 24 
> hours
> of this post. For now, please just wait.
>
> -- Chris

Thanks, Chris. I am sure that we all appreciate your assistance rendered in 
your <irony>copious</irony> free time

John

-- 
"Please refrain from fondling the nymphs and sprites
- it makes them giggly and skittish.
Thank you for your co-operation.
The Management"

[Chris Cason] IRTC Status [7007 days 21 hours and 31 minutes ago]

Tue, 30 Jan 2007 09:51:39 GMT

Folks,

I've been getting a fair bit of mail about the status of the IRTC. I hope to
have some sort of indication of the direction for you to take within 24 hours
of this post. For now, please just wait.

-- Chris

[i need a unique name] Re: Stand-in IRTC animation: while we're waiting... [7007 days 21 hours and 33 minutes ago]

Tue, 30 Jan 2007 09:50:00 GMT

I'll be looking to enter the "Space Settlement" round, many thanks Markus
for keeping irtc going and all you other folks for such inspirational
entries.

[Markus Altendorff] Re: I've started a preview-viewing page. Oh woe ... [7007 days 23 hours and 34 minutes ago]

Tue, 30 Jan 2007 07:48:35 GMT

John VanSickle wrote:
> Markus Altendorff wrote:
> 
>> <quiet>Rusty...?</quiet>
> 
> In the mail.

Aaand - on the web! I guess this is the one we've all been waiting 
for... (no offense to all others, but in my brain, when i think of IRTC, 
i see robots moving around ;)

<giggle>Ha! Was the first one to get to look at it!</giggle>

http://www.asamnet.de/~altendom/irtcstuff/20070115/index.php

(it's at the bottom of the list - sorry, alphabetical order can do that 
to files starting with "r"...)

(and i took the liberty to rename it from "rusty" to "rusty032" - trying 
to keep it with the IRTC's "incoming" filenames)

<spoiler>(and, well, watching it closely, you can actually see the 
un-pixelized shadow of a naked ladybot...) </spoiler>

There. If that isn't going to trash my bandwidth, nothing will. :)

-M

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Stand-in IRTC animation: while we're waiting... [7007 days 23 hours and 58 minutes ago]

Tue, 30 Jan 2007 07:24:37 GMT

dbott wrote:

> "Space Settlement"
> The completion date March 15th?

No, April 15th, actually. Let's not do some speed modelling contest ;)

> I can try. I'll be gone for ten day in the middle of Feb.
> Winter break taking the wife and kids on vacation.

Man, i'm really looking forward to having a break, too. Last few month's 
overtime is starting getting to me... (work-wise, not 3d-wise ;)

-M

[dbott] Re: Stand-in IRTC animation: while we're waiting... [7008 days 1 hour and 25 minutes ago]

Tue, 30 Jan 2007 05:57:53 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote in message
news:45be8d18@news.povray.org...
> ... why not do something like the irtc.stills folks?
>
> (A short summary, in case you're reading the newsgroups
> only, and are not subscribed to irt### [at] irtcorg: )
>
> 1) IRTC.stills is doing a "replacement IRTC" to bridge the
> time until the next official stills round is (hopefully)
> announced.
>
> 2) It's two weeks into IRTC.animations Jan.-Apr. 2007, with
> no current topic.
>
> 3) so far, no luck in contacting the admin
>
> 4) Point 1) was kind of an inspiration, and dbott and me
> sort of drew lots, using the irtc topics suggestion list and
> a single random number.
> This pointed to "Space Settlement" as a topic (as good as
> any, i guess ;)
>
> Anyone willing to join in? We're at least three (four?)
> people already. The IRTC ruleset for filesize and all the
> related stuff. There most likely won't be voting (difficult
> to handle), it's just for fun. I'm willing to do the interim
> hosting for the files, but i'm equally willing to pass this
> on to anyone else (of course, including anyone from official
> IRTC).
>
> This is not meant to replace the IRTC or anything. It's just
> an idea to keep our CPUs warm and toasty while hopefully the
> current situation is resolved.
>
> -Markus

"Space Settlement"
The completion date March 15th?
I can try. I'll be gone for ten day in the middle of Feb.
Winter break taking the wife and kids on vacation.

[dbott] Re: irtc...being proactive [7008 days 1 hour and 35 minutes ago]

Tue, 30 Jan 2007 05:47:57 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] panoramasde> wrote in message
news:45bde6c9@news.povray.org...
> Thorsten Froehlich wrote:
> > Markus Altendorff wrote:
> >> If no one has already contacted the nic.com's contact
> >> dc(something)@aussie.org, i'll write a letter to them once i'm back at
> >> my home computer.
> >
> > Aussie.org owner and admin is also Chris Cason, so no need to send him
yet
> > another email about the IRTC issue.
>
> Understood :)
>
> I'm just wondering what the next steps can/should be now? I'll try the
> one not-yet-tried mail address of Jesse Becker that was mentioned below,
> and i'm really hoping any kind of contact can be established, but i'd be
> more than happy to have some fail-safe scenario at hand if that doesn't
> work out either...
>
> <rant>i don't want the IRTC to dwindle just because no one's really in
> effin' charge</rant> ;)
>
> -Markus

Here Here, yes, I agree. I am a (n00b) with POV, but I have reached
a certain plateau. The irtc was my motivating force to take pov
to a new level.

[John VanSickle] Re: I've started a preview-viewing page. Oh woe ... [7008 days 6 hours and 22 minutes ago]

Tue, 30 Jan 2007 01:01:15 GMT

Markus Altendorff wrote:

> <quiet>Rusty...?</quiet>

In the mail.

Regards,
John

[Markus Altendorff] Stand-in IRTC animation: while we're waiting... [7008 days 7 hours and 12 minutes ago]

Tue, 30 Jan 2007 00:11:04 GMT

... why not do something like the irtc.stills folks?

(A short summary, in case you're reading the newsgroups 
only, and are not subscribed to irt### [at] irtcorg: )

1) IRTC.stills is doing a "replacement IRTC" to bridge the 
time until the next official stills round is (hopefully) 
announced.

2) It's two weeks into IRTC.animations Jan.-Apr. 2007, with 
no current topic.

3) so far, no luck in contacting the admin

4) Point 1) was kind of an inspiration, and dbott and me 
sort of drew lots, using the irtc topics suggestion list and 
a single random number.
This pointed to "Space Settlement" as a topic (as good as 
any, i guess ;)

Anyone willing to join in? We're at least three (four?) 
people already. The IRTC ruleset for filesize and all the 
related stuff. There most likely won't be voting (difficult 
to handle), it's just for fun. I'm willing to do the interim 
hosting for the files, but i'm equally willing to pass this 
on to anyone else (of course, including anyone from official 
IRTC).

This is not meant to replace the IRTC or anything. It's just 
an idea to keep our CPUs warm and toasty while hopefully the 
current situation is resolved.

-Markus

[Markus Altendorff] Re: I've started a preview-viewing page. Oh woe ... [7008 days 9 hours and 16 minutes ago]

Mon, 29 Jan 2007 22:06:27 GMT

i_need_a_unique_name wrote:
> 
> I was using the povray web page to view these news links, only e-mail
> address was that  newsgroup id ... zoiks 14 years in the IT industry and I
> can still sometimes comeout looking like a noob... ;-)

Isn't that supposed to be spelled "n00b"? ;)

OK, we're up to six previews for Oct-Jan now!

<quiet>Rusty...?</quiet>

I went all fancy CSS and stuff on the preview page (well, a 
little), so please drop me a note if it's now "b0rken" in 
your browser (it shouldn't, but these days, you never know), 
in which case i'll go back to basics.

http://www.asamnet.de/~altendom/irtcstuff/20070115/index.php

-Markus

[i need a unique name] Re: I've started a preview-viewing page. Oh woe ... [7008 days 11 hours and 13 minutes ago]

Mon, 29 Jan 2007 20:10:00 GMT

> displayed in the message view of newsreaders? I'm using Thunderbird, but

I was using the povray web page to view these news links, only e-mail
address was that  newsgroup id ... zoiks 14 years in the IT industry and I
can still sometimes comeout looking like a noob... ;-)

[Markus Altendorff] Re: I've started a preview-viewing page. Oh woe ... [7008 days 16 hours and 43 minutes ago]

Mon, 29 Jan 2007 14:40:16 GMT

i_need_a_unique_name schrieb:
> Markus,
> 
> Tried sending you my entry but gmail says the delivery is delayed, is
> 45ba726e@news.povray.org the correct e-mail address (I assumed the
> newsgroup software forwards it on to the real private e-mail).

I guess not... ;) try irtc @ panoramas.de (isn't the sender's address 
displayed in the message view of newsreaders? I'm using Thunderbird, but 
i may have been too assuming in what's usually displayed and what not...)

-Markus

[Thorsten Froehlich] Re: I've started a preview-viewing page. Oh woe ... [7008 days 17 hours and 37 minutes ago]

Mon, 29 Jan 2007 13:46:19 GMT

i_need_a_unique_name wrote:
> Tried sending you my entry but gmail says the delivery is delayed, is
> 45ba726e@news.povray.org the correct e-mail address (I assumed the
> newsgroup software forwards it on to the real private e-mail).

That is *not* an email address but a newsgroup message id ... naturally, you
cannot send email to a message id.

	Thorsten

[i need a unique name] Re: I've started a preview-viewing page. Oh woe ... [7008 days 17 hours and 58 minutes ago]

Mon, 29 Jan 2007 13:25:00 GMT

Markus,

Tried sending you my entry but gmail says the delivery is delayed, is
45ba726e@news.povray.org the correct e-mail address (I assumed the
newsgroup software forwards it on to the real private e-mail).

Cheers
Rob

[Markus Altendorff] Re: irtc...being proactive [7008 days 19 hours and 1 minute ago]

Mon, 29 Jan 2007 12:21:29 GMT

Thorsten Froehlich wrote:
> Markus Altendorff wrote:
>> If no one has already contacted the nic.com's contact
>> dc(something)@aussie.org, i'll write a letter to them once i'm back at
>> my home computer.
> 
> Aussie.org owner and admin is also Chris Cason, so no need to send him yet
> another email about the IRTC issue.

Understood :)

I'm just wondering what the next steps can/should be now? I'll try the 
one not-yet-tried mail address of Jesse Becker that was mentioned below, 
and i'm really hoping any kind of contact can be established, but i'd be 
more than happy to have some fail-safe scenario at hand if that doesn't 
work out either...

<rant>i don't want the IRTC to dwindle just because no one's really in 
effin' charge</rant> ;)

-Markus

[Thorsten Froehlich] Re: irtc...being proactive [7008 days 22 hours and 24 minutes ago]

Mon, 29 Jan 2007 08:58:44 GMT

Markus Altendorff wrote:
> If no one has already contacted the nic.com's contact
> dc(something)@aussie.org, i'll write a letter to them once i'm back at
> my home computer.

Aussie.org owner and admin is also Chris Cason, so no need to send him yet
another email about the IRTC issue.

	Thorsten, POV-Team

[Markus Altendorff] Re: irtc...being proactive [7008 days 23 hours and 41 minutes ago]

Mon, 29 Jan 2007 07:41:30 GMT

dbott wrote:

> no, we just see what develops.........

As much as i hate to say it, but i'm sure this isn't really an option 
any more...

> 
> And, Markus you are right (the voice of reason) I would hate it
> if someone or a group of someone's walked into my house
> and started cooking.

Wow, "voice of reason" - that's a first for me ;)
Seriously: Yes, it's usually not quite good style to do so. However, two 
details just stepped up from the back of my mind:
1) The IRTC has a provable track record of various admins already, so 
it's supposedly "for the community" and not "someone's very own baby". 
(that's not meant as harsh as it sounds, though.)
2) In Nov. 2006, Jesse already asked for "someone to move things along" 
while he was busy.

In *that* light, it should be possible to at least ask the Povray.org 
admin to assign someone to help out.

That doesn't solve the problem of possibly no-one being familiar with 
irtc.org's inner workings. We really need some lead to someone who is, 
to make this work. This, too, is something i hope someone from the upper 
tier at povray.org has a lead to.

If no one has already contacted the nic.com's contact 
dc(something)@aussie.org, i'll write a letter to them once i'm back at 
my home computer.

-Markus

[dbott] Re: irtc...being proactive [7009 days 2 hours and 48 minutes ago]

Mon, 29 Jan 2007 04:35:05 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote in message
news:45B### [at] anthrosphinxde...
> I wrote five minutes ago, in irtc.animations:
>
> > The current admin is supposedly Jesse Becker, though it's really
> > worrisome that he's so long unaccounted for... maybe just because i've
> > had very bad experiences when people suddenly stopped their online
> > activities, because things DO happen...
> >
> > Feeding J.B.'s PGP key (not the name) from his Nov.2006 postings into
> > Google turned up no newsgroup posts after Jan. 2005. OK, that's not
> > quite thorough research, and proves just about nothing, but it's as
> > disquieting as the IRTC's silence.
> >
> > I've written to his two PGP-confirmed mail accounts that turned up in
> > the process. Keeping fingers crossed...
>
> Alright, i'm officially creeped out now.
>
> Both accounts, at speakeasy.net and yahoo.com, do not exist
> (any more?). Bounce, end of Data, "This user doesn't have a
> yahoo.com account", "speakeasy.net: Sorry, no mailbox here
> by that name".
>
> Well, i ran out of ideas and can see the floor of my toolbox
> now. Don't know what else to do. Will pass this on to stills
> and irtc-l, too. Don't flame me for crossposting. I just
> felt it's important.
>
> Anybody else any bright ideas...?
>
> -Markus

no, we just see what develops.........

And, Markus you are right (the voice of reason) I would hate it
if someone or a group of someone's walked into my house
and started cooking.

Bruno
Last, I would never want harm to come to anybody....I hope this
person (irtc.admin) is not hurt or in any kind of serious danger.
We have enough crap to deal with on this planet.
I guess that's why I escape into my computer and program.

dbott

[Markus Altendorff] Re: irtc...being proactive [7009 days 9 hours and 11 minutes ago]

Sun, 28 Jan 2007 22:11:42 GMT

I wrote five minutes ago, in irtc.animations:

> The current admin is supposedly Jesse Becker, though it's really 
> worrisome that he's so long unaccounted for... maybe just because i've 
> had very bad experiences when people suddenly stopped their online 
> activities, because things DO happen...
> 
> Feeding J.B.'s PGP key (not the name) from his Nov.2006 postings into 
> Google turned up no newsgroup posts after Jan. 2005. OK, that's not 
> quite thorough research, and proves just about nothing, but it's as 
> disquieting as the IRTC's silence.
> 
> I've written to his two PGP-confirmed mail accounts that turned up in 
> the process. Keeping fingers crossed...

Alright, i'm officially creeped out now.

Both accounts, at speakeasy.net and yahoo.com, do not exist 
(any more?). Bounce, end of Data, "This user doesn't have a 
yahoo.com account", "speakeasy.net: Sorry, no mailbox here 
by that name".

Well, i ran out of ideas and can see the floor of my toolbox 
now. Don't know what else to do. Will pass this on to stills 
and irtc-l, too. Don't flame me for crossposting. I just 
felt it's important.

Anybody else any bright ideas...?

-Markus

[Markus Altendorff] Re: irtc...being proactive [7009 days 9 hours and 20 minutes ago]

Sun, 28 Jan 2007 22:02:54 GMT

dbott schrieb:
> Markus -
> I saw his web page and he looks busy.......

I just looked at http://www.irtc.org/team.html and was 
shocked to find that the people listed there are (at least 
to me) "retired from service" for at least a year or two! 
Really needs to be brought up-to-date sometime soon.

The current admin is supposedly Jesse Becker, though it's 
really worrisome that he's so long unaccounted for... maybe 
just because i've had very bad experiences when people 
suddenly stopped their online activities, because things DO 
happen...

Feeding J.B.'s PGP key (not the name) from his Nov.2006 
postings into Google turned up no newsgroup posts after Jan. 
2005. OK, that's not quite thorough research, and proves 
just about nothing, but it's as disquieting as the IRTC's 
silence.

I've written to his two PGP-confirmed mail accounts that 
turned up in the process. Keeping fingers crossed...

> Question 1: Who owns the irtc web page?
>  I know it lives on the povray.org server.
> And, I know it is run by irtc admin.

The hosting is done by povray.org, which means that this 
server's root admin typically has "access all areas" and 
could create/assign a new user account to handle 
IRTC-related tasks. However, to the current IRTC admin, this 
is like coming home from a holiday and finding the house has 
been sold, and the locks already changed. To describe this 
as "awkward" may be an understatement... i'm running several 
domains myself, and finding that someone else has taken over 
one of these in my absence is very near the top of my 
internet horrors list, thus my reluctance to step up and say 
"we want IRTC to be run by someone who actually cares" ...
Also, the POVray.org master admin has to "give away the 
keys" to someone else he may or may not know anything about 
- passing hosting responsibilites is a rather big leap of 
faith if it's entirely online.

> Question 2: Why won't someone step up
> and take it over?
> (If this is one person who is done with it)

There are several script-driven things on the server, and 
(speaking as an outsider to IRTC's internal workings, so 
this is pure guesswork) i'm not sure who knows how these 
work, what these things do, or if it's at all documented 
somewhere (being familiar with "organic growth" websites 
myself)... Most of the IRTC preparation could likely be 
handled manually, like copying files or creating a web page. 
(see my preview page, which took about all of ten minutes to 
set up). With the registration and voting stuff, i honestly 
don't know. I fear it's "secret knowledge" passed on from 
one admin to the next, but that's exactly where the current 
problem lies. The last admin's mail from November seems to 
hint at "someone else" that's also able to move things 
around, which would indicate the presence of at least one 
more backup admin (or someone from POVray?). None has 
stepped forward so far, and this is equally worrisome.

> Statement : The IRTC has been around a long
> time. Obviously, many talented people are participants.
> When reading the irtc.stills a lot of people were willing
> to take it over. But instead they have started a pseudo
> competition.

To fill in the time, of course, but i agree, without the 
IRTC webpage to offer a "web-visible" beacon, this is about 
as interim as it gets ;)

> I will throw my name in the hat, I will be willing to take it
> over. If this is would be allowed......and get backup admin.
> (It has such a great following, it can't just disappear).

Amen to that!

> Yes, Markus I know what your going to say we need to
> see what develops with the current situation. That's fine,
> but it would be nice to have something and someone in place
> to take over. Which gets back to my original  question----
> Who owns the irtc web page?  And, can we use it?

Previous mails from the povray group raise the impression 
that the current IRTC admin "owns" it alone. This IS a 
problem in the current situation... although to me, it's 
more of a moral dilemma... (see above). If the IRTC was a 
"wholly owned subsidiary" of povray.org, i'd say full steam 
ahead, in with a new admin (because then it's not someone's 
own project, but community-driven), and let's get rolling!

(Querying nic.com, the IRTC.org is registered to an email 
address at aussie.org, and sponsered by Tucows Inc. - same 
as the povray.org address.)

> A web site that gets pass around from admin to admin
> when he retires...putting his own mark on it.
> (That might be to optimistic)

Why? I think that would be great!

-Markus

[Bruno Cabasson] Re: irtc...being proactive [7009 days 10 hours and 48 minutes ago]

Sun, 28 Jan 2007 20:35:00 GMT

"dbott" <dbo### [at] eastsoundsuitescom> wrote:
> Statement : The IRTC has been around a long
> time. Obviously, many talented people are participants.
> When reading the irtc.stills a lot of people were willing
> to take it over. But instead they have started a pseudo
> competition.
>

Hello. I participated to the discussion on irtc.stills. The current round
(Jan-Feb) was obviously skipped. It has been commonly decided to make this
pseudo competition in order to keep us busy and to wait until next period
(mar-apr) in case the irtc admin(s) re-appear. Personnaly, I hope nothing
serious happend to him (them)...

    Bruno

[Bruno Cabasson] Re: IRTC / admin dilemma [7009 days 12 hours and 8 minutes ago]

Sun, 28 Jan 2007 19:15:00 GMT

"dbott" <dbo### [at] eastsoundsuitescom> wrote:
> "David Cuny" <dcu### [at] lansetcom> wrote in message
> news:web.45bce760678d470cb55da6960@news.povray.org...
> > I've been following this (and the stills thread). If I understand
> correctly:
> >
> > * Both the Stills and Animation rounds are weeks overdue.
> > * There appears to only be a single IRTC admin.
> > * The IRTC admin hasn't responded to email, the mailing list, or this
> list.
> >
> > Is that right? It seems odd that there's not even a backup admin for the
> > contest.
> >
> >
>
> David -
> I think it is one person and he is done with it.......
> Hence the beginning of the year.
> dbott

Let us hope nothing happend to him ...

    Bruno

[dbott] irtc...being proactive [7009 days 12 hours and 10 minutes ago]

Sun, 28 Jan 2007 19:13:16 GMT

Markus -
I saw his web page and he looks busy.......

Question 1: Who owns the irtc web page?
 I know it lives on the povray.org server.
And, I know it is run by irtc admin.

Question 2: Why won't someone step up
and take it over?
(If this is one person who is done with it)

Statement : The IRTC has been around a long
time. Obviously, many talented people are participants.
When reading the irtc.stills a lot of people were willing
to take it over. But instead they have started a pseudo
competition.

I will throw my name in the hat, I will be willing to take it
over. If this is would be allowed......and get backup admin.
(It has such a great following, it can't just disappear).

Yes, Markus I know what your going to say we need to
see what develops with the current situation. That's fine,
but it would be nice to have something and someone in place
to take over. Which gets back to my original  question----
Who owns the irtc web page?  And, can we use it?
A web site that gets pass around from admin to admin
when he retires...putting his own mark on it.
(That might be to optimistic)

dbott
......and I like the newest entry Danse Macabre....good one.

[dbott] Re: IRTC / admin dilemma [7009 days 12 hours and 59 minutes ago]

Sun, 28 Jan 2007 18:23:46 GMT

"David Cuny" <dcu### [at] lansetcom> wrote in message
news:web.45bce760678d470cb55da6960@news.povray.org...
> I've been following this (and the stills thread). If I understand
correctly:
>
> * Both the Stills and Animation rounds are weeks overdue.
> * There appears to only be a single IRTC admin.
> * The IRTC admin hasn't responded to email, the mailing list, or this
list.
>
> Is that right? It seems odd that there's not even a backup admin for the
> contest.
>
>

David -
I think it is one person and he is done with it.......
Hence the beginning of the year.
dbott

[David Cuny] Re: IRTC / admin dilemma [7009 days 13 hours and 8 minutes ago]

Sun, 28 Jan 2007 18:15:01 GMT

I've been following this (and the stills thread). If I understand correctly:

* Both the Stills and Animation rounds are weeks overdue.
* There appears to only be a single IRTC admin.
* The IRTC admin hasn't responded to email, the mailing list, or this list.

Is that right? It seems odd that there's not even a backup admin for the
contest.

[Markus Altendorff] IRTC / admin dilemma [7009 days 16 hours and 5 minutes ago]

Sun, 28 Jan 2007 15:17:58 GMT

Me wrote (replying to a message from dbott in another thread 
about contacting Bill Marrs):
> I've sent a mail. He's updating his LiveJournal entry rather regularly, 
> so i'm hoping we'll hear back from him soon.

I've received his reply (wow, that was quick), but he's not 
had any contact with the IRTC/admins at all for almost two 
years now, and really doesn't want to get re-involved (and i 
fully understand - check his LiveJournal, i guess he has 
enough at hands already, and his priorities set 
differently). He suggested we might need to talk to the 
"master admins" (i.e. POVray.org) about the situation.

Comments?

-Markus

[Markus Altendorff] Re: I've started a preview-viewing page. Oh woe ... [7009 days 22 hours and 36 minutes ago]

Sun, 28 Jan 2007 08:46:36 GMT

dbott wrote:

> It's nice to see it there. Well a pseudo irtc page is better than nothing.
> What's up with this guy http://billmarrs.com/ - he is on the irtc
> admin team and has an active web page. Has anyone talk to him?

I've sent a mail. He's updating his LiveJournal entry rather regularly, 
so i'm hoping we'll hear back from him soon.

-Markus

[dbott] Re: I've started a preview-viewing page. Oh woe ... [7010 days 3 hours and 32 minutes ago]

Sun, 28 Jan 2007 03:51:11 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote in message
news:45bbc459@news.povray.org...
> dbott wrote:
>
> > oops  --
> > That's not me. dbott is "Darin"........I emailed my 3 files in win zip,
> > did you receive them? And, thank you for the explanation on the way
> > you produce your animation. If you did not receive my files,
> > I will email a link where you can download them.
>
> Alright, i'm fetching them now. Should be up in ten minutes.
> Sorry for the name mix-up, i've not yet received your zip
> file. I guess my mailbox isn't half as tough  as i thought,
> or the zip has triggered some over-zealous antivirus blocker
> - come to think about it, if a run-of-the-mill 50 kByte
> virus is nasty, imagine the havoc a 10-MB-virus could wreak ;)
>
> -Markus

Cool - Thank you Markus,
It's nice to see it there. Well a pseudo irtc page is better than nothing.
What's up with this guy http://billmarrs.com/ - he is on the irtc
admin team and has an active web page. Has anyone talk to him?

Once again thanx, the page looks great.....

dbott

[David Cuny] Re: I've started a preview-viewing page. Oh woe ... [7010 days 7 hours and 38 minutes ago]

Sat, 27 Jan 2007 23:45:00 GMT

Hi, Markus

Thanks for hosting the files.

-- David "dcuny" Cuny

[Markus Altendorff] Re: I've started a preview-viewing page. Oh woe ... [7010 days 9 hours and 53 minutes ago]

Sat, 27 Jan 2007 21:30:01 GMT

dbott wrote:

> oops  --
> That's not me. dbott is "Darin"........I emailed my 3 files in win zip,
> did you receive them? And, thank you for the explanation on the way
> you produce your animation. If you did not receive my files,
> I will email a link where you can download them.

Alright, i'm fetching them now. Should be up in ten minutes. 
Sorry for the name mix-up, i've not yet received your zip 
file. I guess my mailbox isn't half as tough  as i thought, 
or the zip has triggered some over-zealous antivirus blocker 
- come to think about it, if a run-of-the-mill 50 kByte 
virus is nasty, imagine the havoc a 10-MB-virus could wreak ;)

-Markus

[dbott] Re: I've started a preview-viewing page. Oh woe ... [7010 days 13 hours and 15 minutes ago]

Sat, 27 Jan 2007 18:08:05 GMT

"dbott" <dbo### [at] eastsoundsuitescom> wrote in message
news:45bb898d$1@news.povray.org...
>
> "Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote in message
> news:45bb7020@news.povray.org...
> > dbott wrote:
> > > "Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote in
> message
> > > news:45ba726e@news.povray.org...
> > >> Here goes nothing:
> > >> http://www.asamnet.de/~altendom/irtcstuff/index.html
> >
> > OK, David "dbott" Cuny's "Dancing with Moai" is available now.
> >
> > -Markus
>
> oops  --
> That's not me. dbott is "Darin"........I emailed my 3 files in win zip,
> did you receive them? And, thank you for the explanation on the way
> you produce your animation. If you did not receive my files,
> I will email a link where you can download them.
>
> Thanx   dbott
>
>

Markus
I set up a page where you can get the 3 filles. It is
http://www.eastsoundsuites.com/animation

Thank you...dbott

[dbott] Re: I've started a preview-viewing page. Oh woe ... [7010 days 14 hours and 4 minutes ago]

Sat, 27 Jan 2007 17:19:09 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote in message
news:45bb7020@news.povray.org...
> dbott wrote:
> > "Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote in
message
> > news:45ba726e@news.povray.org...
> >> Here goes nothing:
> >> http://www.asamnet.de/~altendom/irtcstuff/index.html
>
> OK, David "dbott" Cuny's "Dancing with Moai" is available now.
>
> -Markus

oops  --
That's not me. dbott is "Darin"........I emailed my 3 files in win zip,
did you receive them? And, thank you for the explanation on the way
you produce your animation. If you did not receive my files,
I will email a link where you can download them.

Thanx   dbott

[Markus Altendorff] Re: I've started a preview-viewing page. Oh woe ... [7010 days 15 hours and 52 minutes ago]

Sat, 27 Jan 2007 15:30:40 GMT

dbott wrote:
> "Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote in message
> news:45ba726e@news.povray.org...
>> Here goes nothing:
>> http://www.asamnet.de/~altendom/irtcstuff/index.html

OK, David "dbott" Cuny's "Dancing with Moai" is available now.

-Markus

[Markus Altendorff] Re: I've started a preview-viewing page. Oh woe ... [7010 days 19 hours and 40 minutes ago]

Sat, 27 Jan 2007 11:43:07 GMT

dbott wrote:

> Ok Markus -
> I just emailed you my animation submission. Like I said, this is my
> first time. Tell me what you think......I know I could have added
> a lot more detail.....I watched yours, and you kicked my ass.
> So can you tell me why your 9.5 meg animation is 5 times longer
> than my 9.5 meg animation. Do you use a compression program?
> Just trying to find answers and learn...........

Usually, i'm rendering out the frames as 720x360 (720 means 
it's not going to be re-scaled, just letterboxed when it 
goes to DVD, which has 720x576 size).

I'm a mac guy, so this is a quicktime .mov file, with jpeg 
at maximum quality. About 600 MB for 3:44. I export that to 
DV stream AVI, and copy it over to my PC (haven't found a 
well-working MPEG compressor for mac yet...).

I run that file through TMPEGenc (which has a very 
unscrupulous setting of 320 kbits/sec for video + 32 
kbit/sec mono audio) with an output size of 320x160). I try 
to ignore the horrible compression artefacts :) and that's 
about it.

Without a soundtrack, you may go to 360 kbit video for 9.99 
MB at 3:44.

I've picked that time when i was using Astarte's M.Pack, 
which had a lowest possible 360 kBit preset for that. Ah, 
the days of MacOS 9... long gone, as is M.Pack.

-Markus

[dbott] Re: I've started a preview-viewing page. Oh woe ... [7011 days 4 hours and 21 minutes ago]

Sat, 27 Jan 2007 03:01:40 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote in message
news:45ba726e@news.povray.org...
> Here goes nothing:
> http://www.asamnet.de/~altendom/irtcstuff/index.html
>
> (Notice for future archive diggers: This address will be
> 404'd once the real IRTC is again updated... it is not
> intended to be permanent.)
>
> If, for now, you want your movie to appear in that list,
> too, and you've entered this round of the IRTC animations,
> please either send me the files to publish *) or just a link
> to the three IRTC files **).
>
> *) This means i need to put them on my webspace. Don't send
> your files if you're not OK with that! As for the mail
> address, try the one from the news header :)
>
> **) In that case, i'll link to your files. If you remove
> them from your webspace, the links will be broken.
>
> -Markus

Ok Markus -
I just emailed you my animation submission. Like I said, this is my
first time. Tell me what you think......I know I could have added
a lot more detail.....I watched yours, and you kicked my ass.
So can you tell me why your 9.5 meg animation is 5 times longer
than my 9.5 meg animation. Do you use a compression program?
Just trying to find answers and learn...........

dbott

[Markus Altendorff] I've started a preview-viewing page. Oh woe me..... [7011 days 9 hours and 55 minutes ago]

Fri, 26 Jan 2007 21:28:14 GMT

Here goes nothing:
http://www.asamnet.de/~altendom/irtcstuff/index.html

(Notice for future archive diggers: This address will be 
404'd once the real IRTC is again updated... it is not 
intended to be permanent.)

If, for now, you want your movie to appear in that list, 
too, and you've entered this round of the IRTC animations, 
please either send me the files to publish *) or just a link 
to the three IRTC files **).

*) This means i need to put them on my webspace. Don't send 
your files if you're not OK with that! As for the mail 
address, try the one from the news header :)

**) In that case, i'll link to your files. If you remove 
them from your webspace, the links will be broken.

-Markus

[Markus Altendorff] Re: IRTC...The Future [7011 days 22 hours and 28 minutes ago]

Fri, 26 Jan 2007 08:54:59 GMT

dbott wrote:
>>
>>> I hope it all works out for the irtc.......Ok, as for my number, how
>>> about......hm..........................45.
>> Congratulations, this corresponds to topic: "Space Settlements"
>> Annotation reads: "These huge artificial worlds were
>> conceived in the 1970s, but there have been almost no
>> artist's renderings since then. Hills, lakes, buildings,
>> vehicles, people -- all on the INSIDE of the world instead
>> of the outside. (See http://tinyurl.com/n83uy)"
> 
> All right -
> Yes very interesting topic.....lets set a completion time.
> Something quick and dirty or should we put some time into it. I worked on
> coo
> coo (my official irtc entry for Jan 15th) in about a month. I could and
> should have
> put a little more time into it. I'm kinda angry no one gets to see it right
> now.

Hey, just upload it and i'll promise to look at it. Maybe we should 
build a preliminary viewing page until the "real IRTC" is back? I've 
some webspace to spare, so drop a link and i'll see what i can do. Or 
zip it up and send it to
the_missing_irtc
then insert (at) and then complete the mail address with
anthrosphinx.de
(the hoops you need to jump through just to keep spammers out... sigh.)

> """"WHERE IS IRTC""" Sorry just venting a little................hm

Well, (just some delirious scenario following, not meant to offend 
anyone): according to what clichés i know about australia, it's either 
endless desert and/or ridden with the most poisonous creatures 
imaginable and/or full of easy-going people with floppy hats full of 
fishing hooks and corks ;) - so maybe our missing admin had a bad run-in 
with some jellyfish and needs to stay in hospital for a month without 
web access...?

> Anyone else want to join in on this topic..............

I've felt inspired, though i must admit my idea for an animation wasn't 
original but rather leaned on an older short story from a 70s SciFi 
collection. Would be nice to see if Cinema4D now can handle a 200 units 
figure inside a 2,000,000 units toroid... older versions went through 
the roof with rendering times if you did that - i had to split scenes 
with backgrounds when i made the "Escape" outdoor scenes and render the 
close-ups in two passes, with the background from pass1 as moving 
texture in pass 2.

> How do you want to access them. You can download mine from
> my web page eastsoundsuites.com. I can add a page to it.
> It's not a graphics web site it's my business site.
> Vacation rental...

Careful: if we decide to do this (like the irtc.stills people working on 
their "stand-in" project right now), its resulting movies may not make 
it back to the irtc website - at least not as an "official" round. Of 
course, i may be totally wrong there. I just don't want to "branch off 
the IRTC", it's such a nice household name.

Hey, maybe my question about "two extra weeks" was taken seriously, and 
the admin will be back by Jan.31st and wondering what all this was about...?

-Markus

[dbott] Re: IRTC...The Future [7012 days 1 hour and 36 minutes ago]

Fri, 26 Jan 2007 05:47:19 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote in message
news:45b8f63b$1@news.povray.org...
> dbott wrote:
>
> > I hope it all works out for the irtc.......Ok, as for my number, how
> > about......hm..........................45.
>
> Congratulations, this corresponds to topic: "Space Settlements"
> Annotation reads: "These huge artificial worlds were
> conceived in the 1970s, but there have been almost no
> artist's renderings since then. Hills, lakes, buildings,
> vehicles, people -- all on the INSIDE of the world instead
> of the outside. (See http://tinyurl.com/n83uy)"
>
> Interesting.
>
> -Markus

All right -
Yes very interesting topic.....lets set a completion time.
Something quick and dirty or should we put some time into it. I worked on
coo
coo (my official irtc entry for Jan 15th) in about a month. I could and
should have
put a little more time into it. I'm kinda angry no one gets to see it right
now.
""""WHERE IS IRTC""" Sorry just venting a little................hm

Anyone else want to join in on this topic..............

How do you want to access them. You can download mine from
my web page eastsoundsuites.com. I can add a page to it.
It's not a graphics web site it's my business site.
Vacation rental...

dbott

[Dan Byers] Re: IRTC is it alive....? [7012 days 5 hours and 23 minutes ago]

Fri, 26 Jan 2007 02:00:00 GMT

Don't know too much about what the future may hold, but I'd be disappointed
if there were no more Rusty entries to look forward to seeing...

--
Dan
GoofyGraffix.com

[Markus Altendorff] Re: IRTC...The Future [7012 days 12 hours and 57 minutes ago]

Thu, 25 Jan 2007 18:26:03 GMT

dbott wrote:

> I hope it all works out for the irtc.......Ok, as for my number, how
> about......hm..........................45.

Congratulations, this corresponds to topic: "Space Settlements"
Annotation reads: "These huge artificial worlds were 
conceived in the 1970s, but there have been almost no 
artist's renderings since then. Hills, lakes, buildings, 
vehicles, people -- all on the INSIDE of the world instead 
of the outside. (See http://tinyurl.com/n83uy)"

Interesting.

-Markus

[dbott] Re: IRTC...The Future [7012 days 17 hours and 31 minutes ago]

Thu, 25 Jan 2007 13:52:15 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] panoramasde> wrote in message
news:45b8902d$1@news.povray.org...
> dbott schrieb:
> > Like I said earlier, I am just a programming hobbyist.
> > (kinda nerdy thing to do, but I like it) I am self-
> > employed and very successful. I taught myself  POV
> > and submitted an animation for the first time.
> > Only to find out IRTC is in a BLACK HOLE.
>
> No it's not. Just because something has an attraction doesn't make it a
> black hole. You may want to think of your upload as a file backup to a
> write-only device for now, but i'm still hoping. ;)
>
> > All you animators should read the last couple
> > of threads of irtc.stills. (Markus Altendorff told
> > me to do this) I am sad, I followed IRTC the
> > last two years and learned from it......
>
> No need for sadness, i guess. Looks like there's enough people
> interested in it to keep it going, we may just need a bit of time to
> sort things out :)
>
> For fun: hey, i've sorted the IRTC's topics suggestions list in
> mysterious ways. Let's play topics lottery: Post a number between 1 and
> 55 and i'll tell you what topic that would be ;)
> Then feel free to animate something around that ;)
>
> -Markus

I hope it all works out for the irtc.......Ok, as for my number, how
about......hm..........................45.
dbott

[Markus Altendorff] Re: IRTC...The Future [7012 days 20 hours and 12 minutes ago]

Thu, 25 Jan 2007 11:10:37 GMT

dbott schrieb:
> Like I said earlier, I am just a programming hobbyist.
> (kinda nerdy thing to do, but I like it) I am self-
> employed and very successful. I taught myself  POV
> and submitted an animation for the first time.
> Only to find out IRTC is in a BLACK HOLE.

No it's not. Just because something has an attraction doesn't make it a 
black hole. You may want to think of your upload as a file backup to a 
write-only device for now, but i'm still hoping. ;)

> All you animators should read the last couple
> of threads of irtc.stills. (Markus Altendorff told
> me to do this) I am sad, I followed IRTC the
> last two years and learned from it......

No need for sadness, i guess. Looks like there's enough people 
interested in it to keep it going, we may just need a bit of time to 
sort things out :)

For fun: hey, i've sorted the IRTC's topics suggestions list in 
mysterious ways. Let's play topics lottery: Post a number between 1 and 
55 and i'll tell you what topic that would be ;)
Then feel free to animate something around that ;)

-Markus

[dbott] IRTC...The Future [7013 days 2 hours ago]

Thu, 25 Jan 2007 05:23:03 GMT

Like I said earlier, I am just a programming hobbyist.
(kinda nerdy thing to do, but I like it) I am self-
employed and very successful. I taught myself  POV
and submitted an animation for the first time.
Only to find out IRTC is in a BLACK HOLE.
All you animators should read the last couple
of threads of irtc.stills. (Markus Altendorff told
me to do this) I am sad, I followed IRTC the
last two years and learned from it......
dbott
Here is the last thread I read from irtc.stills:



Greetings once again everyone.
As I promised in my last message, posted on the "New Topic?" thread,
I have returned with word from a Povray administrator concerning the
situation
with the IRTC.

The message I received is as follows:


>> I am concerned about the situation too, and have raised it with the
[IRTC]
>> admins. One of them (who normally does the final round processing) is not
>> responding to email, so I don't really know what is up.

>> Ultimately, if the IRTC isn't going to work properly anymore, probably it
>> might be time for it to have a rest. The code developed for POVCOMP is
>> available to restructure into a new competition, if someone wants to take
>> on the work, but it would be a fair job to make it all work automatically
>> (which IMO is important). I will of course offer support for this and the
>> needed hosting.

>> At the moment all we can do is wait and see what eventuates.

So it looks like there's a certain amount of confusion taking place among
the Povray admins themselves.

Perhaps we should be patient for a while longer and see what happens
concerning the IRTC.  Though, in the meantime, it would probably be prudent
to continue developing plans for a potential successor to the IRTC, if it
should fail altogether.


Also, as I've said before, I vote for "primitives" for the Jan-Feb
pseudo-competition.  But, then, where would we send our submissions to?
Would someone be willing to accept entries (just this one time) and post
them online?

Regards,

-Isaac K

[dbott] Re: IRTC is it alive....? [7014 days 4 hours and 31 minutes ago]

Wed, 24 Jan 2007 02:51:30 GMT

"dbott" <dbo### [at] eastsoundsuitescom> wrote in message
news:45b6b46c$1@news.povray.org...
>
> "Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] panoramasde> wrote in message
> news:45b652a9@news.povray.org...
> > i_need_a_unique_name wrote:
> > > "dbott" <dbo### [at] eastsoundsuitescom> wrote:
> > >> How sad, I teach myself  POV and I'm ready to go only
> > >> to find nobody home at IRTC............
> > >
> > > well its not exactly dead, a little slow and behind schedule but the
> stills
> > > competition has lots of entries and rumour has it this round animation
> has
> > > a reasonable number of entries.
> >
> > Hi,
> >
> > i'm not sure if others on irtc.animations are also subscribed to
> > irtc.stills, but there's quite something happening over there, so you
> > may want to join (at least temporary) to add to the momentum of
> > not-so-happy participants :)
> >
> > - Markus
>
> Thanks Markus,
> I will look into it. I know it's a volunteer web site and
> everyone is busy and has a life....(I Hope). It would be nice to get some
> response from IRTC. As you know it
> also takes time to produce an animation or still
> (participants time). I am not out for any prizes, I am just a hobbyist
> looking for a venue to display my
> work...good or bad.
> I like your work Markus...
> dbott
>
>
Wow Markus -
I just read all the current threads in the irtc.stills news
group and WOW...........

[dbott] Re: IRTC is it alive....? [7014 days 6 hours and 2 minutes ago]

Wed, 24 Jan 2007 01:20:44 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] panoramasde> wrote in message
news:45b652a9@news.povray.org...
> i_need_a_unique_name wrote:
> > "dbott" <dbo### [at] eastsoundsuitescom> wrote:
> >> How sad, I teach myself  POV and I'm ready to go only
> >> to find nobody home at IRTC............
> >
> > well its not exactly dead, a little slow and behind schedule but the
stills
> > competition has lots of entries and rumour has it this round animation
has
> > a reasonable number of entries.
>
> Hi,
>
> i'm not sure if others on irtc.animations are also subscribed to
> irtc.stills, but there's quite something happening over there, so you
> may want to join (at least temporary) to add to the momentum of
> not-so-happy participants :)
>
> - Markus

Thanks Markus,
I will look into it. I know it's a volunteer web site and
everyone is busy and has a life....(I Hope). It would be nice to get some
response from IRTC. As you know it
also takes time to produce an animation or still
(participants time). I am not out for any prizes, I am just a hobbyist
looking for a venue to display my
work...good or bad.
I like your work Markus...
dbott

[Markus Altendorff] Re: IRTC is it alive....? [7014 days 12 hours and 59 minutes ago]

Tue, 23 Jan 2007 18:23:37 GMT

i_need_a_unique_name wrote:
> "dbott" <dbo### [at] eastsoundsuitescom> wrote:
>> How sad, I teach myself  POV and I'm ready to go only
>> to find nobody home at IRTC............
> 
> well its not exactly dead, a little slow and behind schedule but the stills
> competition has lots of entries and rumour has it this round animation has
> a reasonable number of entries. 

Hi,

i'm not sure if others on irtc.animations are also subscribed to 
irtc.stills, but there's quite something happening over there, so you 
may want to join (at least temporary) to add to the momentum of 
not-so-happy participants :)

- Markus

[John VanSickle] Re: Looks like a real round this time [7017 days 3 hours and 58 minutes ago]

Sun, 21 Jan 2007 03:24:52 GMT

David Cuny wrote:
>>>* POV doesn't have a GUI for animation.
> 
>>But the author of the aforementioned app hopes to get that working
>>sometime this year...
> 
> Heh. I wondered when you'd add that to LionSnake and join the dark side! ;-)

I've been scheming it for a while (since 2003 at least).

> AFAIK, the early days of Pixar animation used a POV=SDL sort of approach.
> They have a proprietary interface called 'Marionette.' Characters were
> rigged with 'avars' (articulation variables), and characters were animated
> using a spreadsheet sort of interface. Time (in frames) ran along the 'x'
> axis, and 'avars' on the 'y' axis. To animate a character, you could either
> click in a cell and enter a value, or click a cell and drag the mouse to
> change the cell value.
> 
> A lot's changed since then, although if you check out the 'extras' in "The
> Incredibles" video, you can see that same interface is being used.

Been there, done that, still considering the idea.  My present ambition 
is to have that view and the scene view, and to allow edits in either 
view, with the edit being translated over to the other view.  I hope it 
works.

> There are only a handful of free animation programs that are capable of
> supporting the features that are needed for character animation - bones,
> morphs, and so on. By their nature, most have a pretty steep learning
> curve.

My hope is to have a user interface with one rule:  "When in doubt, 
right-click."  The idea is that a right-click should bring up a context 
menu that covers everything the user can do with the object over which 
the mouse pointer is hovering at the time.  The features can be accessed 
in other ways, true, but the learning curve is simplified if newbies 
have one-stop shopping for their info.

> * LionSnake: Still in development.

And I made a design decision a couple weeks ago that's going to delay 
things.  For some reason I decided that supporting only 3- and 4-sided 
faces was too limiting, so I'm adding support for faces with unlimited 
number of sides[1].  This means:

*  Just about every function that deals with faces has to be rewritten[2];
*  The save format has to be changed [3];
* My surface subdivision macros have to be completely rewritten, because 
the export POV SDL files use the macros [4].

So except for bugfixes to the current version (1.6), there won't be 
anything released in a while.

Regards,
John

[1] Well, okay, the number of sides for a given face is limited to 
32767.  You got a problem with that?

[2] I still have to rewrite the functions to subdivide a portion of the 
mesh; split edges; and to join two vertices together.  The subdivision 
preview is back down to one preview step, and the child faces are flat, 
not smoothed, to the results are still kind of rough.  And of course all 
of the file operations have to be rewritten to support the new features, 
too.

[3] I decided to abandon the save format I developed (since the world 
really did not need a new 3d model format) and have the app use OBJ and 
MTL files for saving and loading geometry and texturing data; the 
animation data will go into a separate file, format to be determined. 
As I write this I am downloading a spec that uses XML :P, but if it's 
too complicated, or if I don't like the way it supports things, I won't 
use it.

[4] This is because the modified Loop scheme I'm presently using doesn't 
support the higher-sided faces.  The Catmull-Clark scheme supports any 
number of sides in a face, so that's what will be forthcoming.

[David Cuny] Re: Looks like a real round this time [7017 days 11 hours and 28 minutes ago]

Sat, 20 Jan 2007 19:55:00 GMT

>> * POV doesn't have a GUI for animation.

> But the author of the aforementioned app hopes to get that working
> sometime this year...

Heh. I wondered when you'd add that to LionSnake and join the dark side! ;-)

AFAIK, the early days of Pixar animation used a POV=SDL sort of approach.
They have a proprietary interface called 'Marionette.' Characters were
rigged with 'avars' (articulation variables), and characters were animated
using a spreadsheet sort of interface. Time (in frames) ran along the 'x'
axis, and 'avars' on the 'y' axis. To animate a character, you could either
click in a cell and enter a value, or click a cell and drag the mouse to
change the cell value.

A lot's changed since then, although if you check out the 'extras' in "The
Incredibles" video, you can see that same interface is being used.

There are only a handful of free animation programs that are capable of
supporting the features that are needed for character animation - bones,
morphs, and so on. By their nature, most have a pretty steep learning
curve. Although it's subjective, it's generally safe to say that the more
features an application has, the more difficult it is to learn.

Problematically, most don't support POV. Here are the ones that I'm aware
of:

* Blender: Very functional. They've added an internal raytracer as well as
export to Yafray and Sunflow, so I don't know if POV is supported anymore.

* Art of Illusion: This is another nice program, written in Java. It has
it's own advanced raytracer, so there's no export to POV.

* Anim8or: Pretty easy to use, and more animation functionality has been
added. Because of licensing issues, POV is not supported.

* K3D: Renderman only. I've never seen an animation done with this.

In the 'beta' category, I'll add the following, since they both support POV:

* JPatch: Still in beta. Exports to POV for rendering, not POV-SDL.

* LionSnake: Still in development.

So not only is animation hard, but animation using POV is harder, because
it's decades behind other programs. It'll be interesting to see how
LionSnake turns out.

Personally, I'm using JPatch, but with Inyo (my own raytracer) instead of
POV. You've got to eat your own dogfood, right?

[i need a unique name] Re: IRTC is it alive....? [7017 days 11 hours and 43 minutes ago]

Sat, 20 Jan 2007 19:40:00 GMT

"dbott" <dbo### [at] eastsoundsuitescom> wrote:
> How sad, I teach myself  POV and I'm ready to go only
> to find nobody home at IRTC............

well its not exactly dead, a little slow and behind schedule but the stills
competition has lots of entries and rumour has it this round animation has
a reasonable number of entries. Though it does not seem as lively as it
used to be in the old days - perhaps the general public is taking graphics
a bit too much for granted these days.

[John VanSickle] Re: Looks like a real round this time [7018 days 4 hours and 13 minutes ago]

Sat, 20 Jan 2007 03:09:24 GMT

David Cuny wrote:
>>Why is it that the IRTC animation comp always seems so under-entered but the
>>stills typically has loads of entries?
> 
> 
> I can think of a lot of reasons that have very little to do with the
> competition itself:
> 
> * Animation is hard. Good animation is harder.

And designing a model that is easily animated is harder.  AFAIK, there 
is one mesh modeling program that exports an .INC containing a model 
that is posable by POV-Ray SDL.

> * POV doesn't have a GUI for animation.

But the author of the aforementioned app hopes to get that working 
sometime this year...

> * More models have to be made, for multiple scenes.
> * Models have to be articulated for animation, or they break in nasty ways.

Which ties in with the first item.

> * Animation needs a story with a beginning, middle and end.
> * Render times are much higher, because you need 24 frames for one second.

This is, indeed, the killer.  The stills side frequently has pictures 
that takes days to render.  One hour per frame limits animation entries 
to 90 seconds of animation, tops, minus one second for every day spent 
in modeling or test animating, or not rendering because nothing's ready 
for final render.

A lot of Rusty was rendered while I've been at work or asleep.

> Additionally:
> 
> * There aren't many free animation programs.
> * Animation programs have a large learning curve.
> * It's hard to compete against professional animation packages.
> 
> Now, John VanSickle scored all the animation rounds last year using "pure"
> POV-Ray, even against Markus Altendorff's excellent animations, which used
> Maxxon 3D. So take three with a grain of salt.

It's true that everything was rendered by POV-Ray, but two models were 
done with my modeler instead of hand-written SDL code.  One model 
probably could have been done with SDL code, but the other one 
definitely required my modeler.

> On the other hand, there were a number of submissions I was surprised to
> find didn't even make Honorable Mention:
> 
>    - Leroy Whetstone/October-January 2006
>    - M.A.c.v./October-January 2006
>    - Nimish Ajmani/July-October 2006
> 
> So why didn't these get Honorable Mentions? It's because the scoring doesn't
> actually follow the above guidelines.

And because due to low turnout, there haven't been Honorable Mentions 
since the April-July 2005 round.

Many of the times this has happened, there have been only six entries 
(or fewer).  The first time this happened, there was grumbling because 
it guaranteed that everyone would get at least an H.M., which did not 
sit well with some people.

> What if (like John VanSickle and his
> LionSnake modeler) you've actually written your own modeler or animator?
> Should you get extra points for that?

No, I should get a lifetime supply of Diet Coke!

> Making Honorable Mention a bit easier to get into might help (i.e. adding a
> "cheap tool" or "newbie" bonus), but that's awfully subjective.
> 
> Anyway, these can be factors in discouraging someone who submitted from
> submitting again. But I'm guessing the biggest barrier to people submitting
> animations in the first place is still my first point: Animation is Hard.

Yup.

Regards,
John

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Looks like a real round this time [7018 days 4 hours and 47 minutes ago]

Sat, 20 Jan 2007 02:35:58 GMT

Hildur K. wrote:
> Careful! We´re watching you! :-)

*Gasp* Incredible! Those ninja stills guys! Always around, 
but invisible right until they move :)

> Anyway, it seems like we have one problem in common. The IRTC server has
> been buggy when uploading, people haven´t received confirmations, and even
> though the stills round deadline ended on the 31st of December, a new topic
> hasn´t yet been announced. I everything was normal, this should happen
> immediately. I noticed a new topic hasn´t been announced for you guys
> either.
> So I´m worried, I don´t remember waiting so long for a update on the ftp
> ever.

Last animations round, it took three weeks plus (Oct. 15 - 
Nov. 10) for the next topic to appear.

I'm hoping for something to happen over the weekend... 
anyway, i wouldn't mind delays, if at least there'd be the 
occasional heads-up from the admins... the way it's right 
now, it feels like some kind of limbo.

Currently, i'm re-rendering my animation with the camera 10 
cm to the left and 1 degree turned right, and then i'll try 
to create a red-green anaglyph video version. I'd rather be 
dwelling on the new topic, though...
I've also had good success by cross-eyeing two playback 
windows side-by-side, it helps to hold the hand so that the 
left eye sees the right window and vice versa.

-Markus

[dbott] IRTC is it alive....? [7018 days 7 hours and 20 minutes ago]

Sat, 20 Jan 2007 00:02:36 GMT

How sad, I teach myself  POV and I'm ready to go only
to find nobody home at IRTC............

[Hildur K ] Re: Looks like a real round this time [7018 days 7 hours and 38 minutes ago]

Fri, 19 Jan 2007 23:45:01 GMT

> Well, unless you're doing an incredibly detailed still
> scene, animating may be even more time-consuming than
> building a still picture? (did i write that out loud?
> Ooops... anyone from the stills crowd here? Nobody? Whew... ;)
>
> -Markus

Careful! We´re watching you! :-)

Of course we know that making animations is more time assuming than stills.

That´s why we admire you guys.

Anyway, it seems like we have one problem in common. The IRTC server has
been buggy when uploading, people haven´t received confirmations, and even
though the stills round deadline ended on the 31st of December, a new topic
hasn´t yet been announced. I everything was normal, this should happen
immediately. I noticed a new topic hasn´t been announced for you guys
either.
So I´m worried, I don´t remember waiting so long for a update on the ftp
ever.
Just wanted to make you aware of this, and perhaps to drag you into the
discussion :-)

Hildur (one of those many stills submitters).

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Looks like a real round this time [7018 days 8 hours and 12 minutes ago]

Fri, 19 Jan 2007 23:10:34 GMT

dbott wrote:
> A great book is Beginning Math and Physics for Game
> Programmers...by Wendy Stahler. You don't have to a
> Astrophysicist to understand it. I'm a newbe, but I will
> start competing regularly. This is my third animation I've completed and I
> seem to getting better with each one.
> But I guess you'll be the judge of  that. ()^()...........

We'd all like to, i guess (to the admins: hint, hint, nudge, 
nudge ;)

> --NEED A NEW TOPIC--
> dbott
> 
> 
> "i_need_a_unique_name" <ine### [at] gmailcom> wrote in message
> news:web.45b0e6a648a177e0c3e0e7940@news.povray.org...
>>> Yuck. Ewww. I did that hideous stuff, and it's OUT IN PUBLIC? Uh oh...
> ;)
>> Bet mines more yucky than yours.
>>
>> So what was on your reading list? I think I'm sorley in need of some
>> education (especially regards to 3D maths).

Uh, sorry, i'm more of the mouse-pushing type, and less 
competent when it comes to the actual math behind it... 
(though i once wrote a 3-D drawing routine on my ZX Spectrum 
48 kByte, and a spinning 3-D map for a never-to-be 
roleplaying game on my Amiga 2000 - am i a fossil or what? ;)

Well, a book that really inspired was Arndt von 
Koenigsmarck's "Femme Digitale" (Addison-Wesley), though 
i've not even started yet to build more of his sculpting 
hints into my models - except for the design guides to build 
eyes from separate layers instead of textured sphere 
primitives. It's geared towards the 
Maya/3Ds/Cinema/Blender/etc. users, though, not those that 
enjoy coding by TextPad ;)
At least i've learned that mixing triangles and quads in a 
mesh isn't the brightest thing to do, and that there's much 
to learn when shaping hands and feet :)

There's another one, sneakily also called "Femme Digitale", 
by Michael Burns. I'd NOT recommend that one, because it's 
trying to do too much in too little space. Nice pictures, 
nice screenshots, but - trying to explaind modelling AND 
texturing of a complete human figure on six pages doesn't 
really teach you anything. It covers everything and then 
some, from Photoshop to Poser to Max to Featured Artists, 
but it doesn't do anything really in depth. Where AvK takes 
a dozen pages for the do's and dont's of the fingers alone, 
with MB it's more like "hey, pick a Poser preset, run 
Photoshop across and be done with it." I was lucky as it was 
on sale when i ordered it at a well-known internet book 
retailer whose name vaguely reminds of a tropical river ;), 
because i wouldn't spend more than the 5 $ on it - if i want 
pictures to make me green with envy, i'd get a high-gloss 
Royo, Sorayama or Vallejo collection for 9,95 $ ;)

The other was Koenigsmark's "Cinema 4D v.9" workshop book 
(published by Addison-Wesley, too), which i got for an 
incredible 3 Euros at an electronics store (with v.10 out, 
they were clearing their stock), without which i wouldn't 
have started to save time by animating using "intelligent" 
objects (like e.g. mechanical devices that are operated by a 
single keyframed input which internally calculates/affects 
various angles/positions - i've built a robot arm that has 
an attached user data slider which not only opens/closes the 
"fingers" but also drives the angle of the corresponding 
worm gear in a convincing manner; a four-layer door with 
bolts that makes use of a similar logic, and warning beacons 
spinning and flashing all by themselves (and a timer) ;)

Also, this time, the arms of my humanoid models don't use 
inverse kinematics for positioning, but instead a set of 
multiple 2-axis remote-control input boxes cross-connected 
to multiple bones, including mapping input/output values to 
avoid unnatural poses:
- Shoulder X/Y translates the angle of the shoulder bone
- Upper Arm X/Y has "up/down +/- 100 degrees" on the Y axis, 
and "forward/back +/- 100 degrees" on the X axis
- Lower Arm X/Y has "Heading Straight 0 / folded on + 170" 
for the Lower Arm on the X, and "Rotate Upper Arm Bone +/- 
90 degrees" on the Y axis
- Hand X/Y has a wiring to the Tilt and Roll of the hand 
bone, instead of the heading/tilt.

When i animate, i animate the controllers instead of the 
actual bones, which looks a bit different compared to 
keyframing the bones' angles themselves, but the tweening is 
less artificial than IK can sometimes be.

There are a few "broken by design" points i still need to 
address, like the problem of the upper arm mesh rolling at 
the shoulder joint (it shouldn't, because the twist of 
tissue extends across the whole upper arm - need to create a 
chain of "helper bones" that maintain the shoulder at null 
twist and accumulate the twist down the upper arm). Another 
mess is that once the arm tilt approaches 90 degrees (arm 
down/up), the result of heading and roll axis collapse into 
one. A null bone for the heading/tilt, and an additional one 
for the roll would solve that.
And don't get me started about the hip bone, which i failed 
to de-couple from the standard orientation, so any swaying 
left/right runs through a 0/360 border - it's OK if you 
keyframe it, but once you decide to re-work the motion 
curves, it tends to do lower-back-breaking because the any 
little shifting of H/P/R angles wreaks havoc on the 
orientation...

>> Why is it that the IRTC animation comp always seems so under-entered but
> the
>> stills typically has loads of entries?

Well, unless you're doing an incredibly detailed still 
scene, animating may be even more time-consuming than 
building a still picture? (did i write that out loud? 
Ooops... anyone from the stills crowd here? Nobody? Whew... ;)

-Markus

[David Cuny] Re: Looks like a real round this time [7018 days 8 hours and 58 minutes ago]

Fri, 19 Jan 2007 22:25:00 GMT

> Why is it that the IRTC animation comp always seems so under-entered but the
> stills typically has loads of entries?

I can think of a lot of reasons that have very little to do with the
competition itself:

* Animation is hard. Good animation is harder.
* POV doesn't have a GUI for animation.
* POV doesn't render MPEG files automatically.
* More models have to be made, for multiple scenes.
* Models have to be articulated for animation, or they break in nasty ways.
* Animation needs a story with a beginning, middle and end.
* Render times are much higher, because you need 24 frames for one second.

Additionally:

* There aren't many free animation programs.
* Animation programs have a large learning curve.
* It's hard to compete against professional animation packages.

Now, John VanSickle scored all the animation rounds last year using "pure"
POV-Ray, even against Markus Altendorff's excellent animations, which used
Maxxon 3D. So take three with a grain of salt.

On the other hand, there were a number of submissions I was surprised to
find didn't even make Honorable Mention:

   - Leroy Whetstone/October-January 2006
   - M.A.c.v./October-January 2006
   - Nimish Ajmani/July-October 2006

So why didn't these get Honorable Mentions? It's because the scoring doesn't
actually follow the above guidelines. The Animation Rules page says the
competition is "run by and for amateurs with cheap tools":

> The competition is not about winning. You do not have to be a professional,
> or even any good! Experts are welcome, but the contest is run by and for
> amateurs with cheap tools. Those lucky enough to have more impressive skills
> and equipment are asked to share their wisdom, but we are more impressed by
> someone who can be creative with what they have, than someone who has
> everything.

Finding the actual guidelines is a bit difficult:

   - They aren't on the Animation Rules page
   - They aren't on the Animation Voting Rules page
   - They aren't on the Animation FAQ page

Instead, it's buried in the Stills FAQ page, and specifically references
IMAGES, not animation (emphasis added):

> [5.1] How are the winners selected?
>    By a vote among the other entrants and IRTC Panel Judges. Once the ratings
> are in for all the IMAGES, each IMAGE has an "overall" rating calculated, as
> the mean of its artistic, technical, and concept ratings. The three IMAGES
> with the highest overall ratings are selected as the first, second, and third
> place winners.

> [5.2] What is Honorable Mention?
>    Sometimes one or more IMAGES have higher ratings in one or two categories
> than some or all of the winners. To honor such IMAGES we developed the
> "Honorable Mention" designation. We select the three IMAGES which had the
> highest rating in a single category, exclusive of winners and other Honorably
> Mentioned IMAGES. An IMAGE designated for Honorable Mention may or may not
> receive a prize, depending on availability and the discretion of the IRTC
> admins.

All the submissions I referenced are on low-submission rounds, and the pages
say "Due to low turnout this round, no Honorable Mentions were awarded."
I've read through the rules, and I'm not sure where the "low turnout" rule
is mentioned.

It's particularly ironic in that prize winning submissions actually benefit
from less submissions, but "amateur" submissions suffer.

Animations can also score in:

> Notable for: [ ]Texture [ ]Lighting [ ]Modelling [ ]Composition [ ]Originality

These are the same as the Still Images - no animation-specific scoring (such
as lipsync, etc.). If these are factored into scores, I don't see it
documented anywhere.

Anyway, my suspicion is that the scoring system actually ends up
discouraging "amateurs with cheap tools". A POV-Ray user might get extra
points in the "Technical" category, but how about a user of Art of
Illusion, Anim8or, or Blender? What if (like John VanSickle and his
LionSnake modeler) you've actually written your own modeler or animator?
Should you get extra points for that?

Making Honorable Mention a bit easier to get into might help (i.e. adding a
"cheap tool" or "newbie" bonus), but that's awfully subjective.

Anyway, these can be factors in discouraging someone who submitted from
submitting again. But I'm guessing the biggest barrier to people submitting
animations in the first place is still my first point: Animation is Hard.

[dbott] Re: Looks like a real round this time [7018 days 10 hours and 22 minutes ago]

Fri, 19 Jan 2007 21:00:33 GMT

A great book is Beginning Math and Physics for Game
Programmers...by Wendy Stahler. You don't have to a
Astrophysicist to understand it. I'm a newbe, but I will
start competing regularly. This is my third animation I've completed and I
seem to getting better with each one.
But I guess you'll be the judge of  that. ()^()...........
--NEED A NEW TOPIC--
dbott


"i_need_a_unique_name" <ine### [at] gmailcom> wrote in message
news:web.45b0e6a648a177e0c3e0e7940@news.povray.org...
> > Yuck. Ewww. I did that hideous stuff, and it's OUT IN PUBLIC? Uh oh...
;)
>
> Bet mines more yucky than yours.
>
> So what was on your reading list? I think I'm sorley in need of some
> education (especially regards to 3D maths).
>
> Why is it that the IRTC animation comp always seems so under-entered but
the
> stills typically has loads of entries?
>
>
>

[i need a unique name] Re: Looks like a real round this time [7018 days 15 hours and 38 minutes ago]

Fri, 19 Jan 2007 15:45:01 GMT

> Yuck. Ewww. I did that hideous stuff, and it's OUT IN PUBLIC? Uh oh... ;)

Bet mines more yucky than yours.

So what was on your reading list? I think I'm sorley in need of some
education (especially regards to 3D maths).

Why is it that the IRTC animation comp always seems so under-entered but the
stills typically has loads of entries?

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Looks like a real round this time [7018 days 19 hours and 21 minutes ago]

Fri, 19 Jan 2007 12:02:12 GMT

dbott schrieb:
> When do we start viewing.....? First time submitting.
> I don't expect to place, I am just curious.
> Also, I never received a confirmation email,
> but my animation is there. Is that normal......?

"Sort of".

If my memory servers right, back in the old days { ca. 2003 ;) }, the 
server ran on automatic, checking the entries and sending out 
confirmation mails as the movies came in. Even then, there was a certain 
delay, often days, until the web pages were updated. The FTP and 
download files were usually available rather soon.
Since there's this sort-of transitional phase now going on (with new 
programming, new admins, admins being busy, etc.), the check-and-confirm 
is launched by hand -> admin no time = no confirmation.
Don't ask for the web pages :)

I guess it's going to take a few days (fingers crossed...) until things 
start moving...

Yo, admins: new topic? Pretty please?

-Markus

[dbott] Re: Looks like a real round this time [7019 days 3 hours and 22 minutes ago]

Fri, 19 Jan 2007 04:01:00 GMT

When do we start viewing.....? First time submitting.
I don't expect to place, I am just curious.
Also, I never received a confirmation email,
but my animation is there. Is that normal......?
dbott


"John VanSickle" <evi### [at] hotmailcom> wrote in message
news:45aee6de@news.povray.org...
> 11 entries (not counting what look like replacement entries).
>
> We haven't had this many since July of 2005.
>
> Regards,
> John

[dbott] Re: Looks like a real round this time [7019 days 3 hours and 22 minutes ago]

Fri, 19 Jan 2007 04:00:59 GMT

When do we start viewing.....? First time submitting.
I don't expect to place, I am just curious.
Also, I never received a confirmation email,
but my animation is there. Is that normal......?
dbott


"John VanSickle" <evi### [at] hotmailcom> wrote in message
news:45aee6de@news.povray.org...
> 11 entries (not counting what look like replacement entries).
>
> We haven't had this many since July of 2005.
>
> Regards,
> John

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Looks like a real round this time [7019 days 21 hours and 10 minutes ago]

Thu, 18 Jan 2007 10:13:15 GMT

John VanSickle wrote:
> 11 entries (not counting what look like replacement entries).
> 
> We haven't had this many since July of 2005.

Indeed! I can hardly wait to see what's been sent in. And, for the first 
time in quite some time, i found an insane amount of fun in working with 
3D - may be the new software, or some of the how-to books i actually 
read through and remembered, i don't know. It seemed much easier this 
time to get the effects i wanted, or to at least understand why things 
did *not* work out how i wanted, and to make the computer do some things 
  by itself, not by tedious click-drag-click-point-click-click ;)

I also had a real learning experience yesterday - i put my previous 
contributions into a playlist and watched them end-to-end.

Yuck. Ewww. I did that hideous stuff, and it's OUT IN PUBLIC? Uh oh... ;)
In hindsight, i'd diagnose myself with a severe case of 
look-what-i-built-Disease, i.e. neglecting a video's timing because 
"hey, this was so hard to create, let's show it like an exhibit, not 
like a prop in a movie"...

Did anyone already tell me this, and was i just not listening? ;)

-Markus

[John VanSickle] Looks like a real round this time [7020 days 4 hours and 5 minutes ago]

Thu, 18 Jan 2007 03:17:50 GMT

11 entries (not counting what look like replacement entries).

We haven't had this many since July of 2005.

Regards,
John

[John VanSickle] Re: Anim: How about an additional two weeks time... [7021 days 4 hours and 41 minutes ago]

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 02:41:55 GMT

John VanSickle wrote:
> Markus Altendorff wrote:
> 
>> John VanSickle wrote:
>>
>>> Mine is done, but the HTML submission page thinks that we're in the 
>>> voting phase, either six hours early or still left over from the 
>>> previous round.  And I can't access the FTP server with my browser, 
>>> so that's out, too.  Grumble grumble grumble grumble...
>>
>>
>> No chance of using "plain old FTP" ? - on second thought, why not clog 
>> the admin's mail inbox and submit your file by e-mail? :)
> 
> 
> I can't connect to the FTP site with my client, although there is a 
> chance that it's my ISP doing that.
> 
> I mailed it in.  Hope it works.

ANd for good measure, I went over to www.01ftp.com and used a web-based 
FTP client to get it in.  Hope this doesn't mess anything up.

Regards,
John

[David Cuny] Re: Next topic? [7021 days 13 hours and 3 minutes ago]

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 18:20:00 GMT

Thanks!

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Next topic? [7021 days 13 hours and 29 minutes ago]

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 17:53:30 GMT

David Cuny wrote:
> Any word on what the next topic (ending April '07) will be?

Not yet. While the web pages usually lag behind, the FTP 
server's welcome message files are the first to show the new 
topic. Either check regularly by connecting to ftp.irtc.org, 
or (for convenience) use the web mirror links below:

Inside the "incoming" directory:
http://www.irtc.org/ftp/pub/anims/incoming/.message

At the root:
http://www.irtc.org/ftp/.message
(this one may download instead of showing up in the browser, 
it's supposedly saved as text file on your computer.)

-Markus

[David Cuny] Next topic? [7021 days 20 hours and 8 minutes ago]

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 11:15:00 GMT

Any word on what the next topic (ending April '07) will be?

[John VanSickle] Re: Anim: How about an additional two weeks time... [7022 days 3 hours and 13 minutes ago]

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 04:09:27 GMT

Markus Altendorff wrote:
> John VanSickle wrote:
> 
>> Mine is done, but the HTML submission page thinks that we're in the 
>> voting phase, either six hours early or still left over from the 
>> previous round.  And I can't access the FTP server with my browser, so 
>> that's out, too.  Grumble grumble grumble grumble...
> 
> No chance of using "plain old FTP" ? - on second thought, why not clog 
> the admin's mail inbox and submit your file by e-mail? :)

I can't connect to the FTP site with my client, although there is a 
chance that it's my ISP doing that.

I mailed it in.  Hope it works.

Regards,
John

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Anim: How about an additional two weeks time... [7022 days 5 hours and 14 minutes ago]

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 02:08:31 GMT

John VanSickle wrote:

> Mine is done, but the HTML submission page thinks that we're in the 
> voting phase, either six hours early or still left over from the 
> previous round.  And I can't access the FTP server with my browser, so 
> that's out, too.  Grumble grumble grumble grumble...

No chance of using "plain old FTP" ? - on second thought, 
why not clog the admin's mail inbox and submit your file by 
e-mail? :)

-Markus

[John VanSickle] Re: Anim: How about an additional two weeks time... [7022 days 8 hours and 17 minutes ago]

Mon, 15 Jan 2007 23:06:07 GMT

Markus Altendorff wrote:
> 
> Wow, already six animations! (nothing by the name of "Rusty", so i guess 
> we'll see at least one more?) and unless something bad happens, i guess 
> i'll also have one ready by tomorrow night. Four scenes in the render 
> queue, and 27 hours remaining...

Mine is done, but the HTML submission page thinks that we're in the 
voting phase, either six hours early or still left over from the 
previous round.  And I can't access the FTP server with my browser, so 
that's out, too.  Grumble grumble grumble grumble...

Regards,
John

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Anim: How about an additional two weeks time... [7023 days 5 hours and 53 minutes ago]

Mon, 15 Jan 2007 01:29:37 GMT

> i_need_a_unique_name wrote:
>> Hope there are a decent number of entries this time round, I'd hate 
>> for my
>> entry to get listed in any of the winners just because there is <= 3
>> because being my first it really isn't upto story content standard of the
>> previous rounds.
> 

i wrote:

> Well, there's a mystery entry already on the server, i'm still trying to 
> make one, and i guess we've an all but confirmed VanSickle movie on the 
> radar...
> Would all others planning to enter please step up, too...? ;)

Wow, already six animations! (nothing by the name of 
"Rusty", so i guess we'll see at least one more?) and unless 
something bad happens, i guess i'll also have one ready by 
tomorrow night. Four scenes in the render queue, and 27 
hours remaining...

>> Is it possible to enter multiple times, overwriting previous entries with
>> better versions if rendered in time?
> 
> Yes, that would be nice :) otherwise, i guess i'll have to fill in the 
> missing scenes in my new epic with my scanned-in storyboard drawings - 
> not a sight for the squeamish ;)

After thinking a bit about that, i think it may be a bad 
idea (the "overwrite previous", not the "drawings" ;) - 
overwriting same-name files on a server without 
authorization isn't really nice to do...

> At least i've learned a LOT about my 3D software over the last two 
> weeks... (updated C4D 9->10, all new shiny buttons, but WTF has the 
> workflow i was used to gone...?! ;)

Just in case someone's actually caring about that ;)
after about a hundred hours of severe computer prodding, i 
feel i've got some of my workflow back - and then some :)

-Markus

[John VanSickle] Re: Anim: How about an additional two weeks time... [7027 days 4 hours and 58 minutes ago]

Thu, 11 Jan 2007 02:24:25 GMT

i_need_a_unique_name wrote:
>>Pardon me, but the Bugbot, TC, Joe, and the Greb all have legs.
> 
> Oh yeah, my apologies - legs with all the internal workings showing as well,
> no slippage in sight ...
> 
> ...... all I can say is sorry, I can only think that I'm distracted by the
> absorbing and witty story lines.

Didn't know I had any of those...

>>As for voices without sound, if I could find a good free tool for
>>putting sound into an MPEG, I'd use it.
> 
> Sure, but you really could choose to keep only the visual voices its not as
> if they are inadequate.

The main drawback to having sound is that I'd need to gin up sounds for 
everything that should be making sound, or the effect wouldn't be that good.

Regards,
John

[Verm] Re: Anim: How about an additional two weeks time... [7027 days 19 hours and 30 minutes ago]

Wed, 10 Jan 2007 11:52:31 GMT

Markus Altendorff wrote:
> Oh, by the way: anyone knows if the "Blue Danube" is still 
> copyrighted...? (hacking the sheet notes into GarageBand, not ripping 
> some copyrighted recording!)

According to wikipedia it was first performed in 1867 and was written by 
J Straus (died 1899) so the score is well out of copyright :-) - I think 
copyright for european sheet music is 70 years after death of the author 
so you're ok.

There should even be some recordings out there that are out of 
copyright, which is 50 years for recorded music in Europe - although if 
the irtc server is in the US I don't know how US law applies to european 
recordings.

So as far as I can tell for some music it could be legal to use someone 
else's recording but not to do your own, which makes no sense. (I am not 
a lawyer or musician just curious and possibly wrong)

Hmm drifted well off topic here sorry.

[i need a unique name] Re: Anim: How about an additional two weeks time... [7028 days 23 hours and 13 minutes ago]

Tue, 9 Jan 2007 08:10:01 GMT

> Pardon me, but the Bugbot, TC, Joe, and the Greb all have legs.

Oh yeah, my apologies - legs with all the internal workings showing as well,
no slippage in sight ...

...... all I can say is sorry, I can only think that I'm distracted by the
absorbing and witty story lines.

> As for voices without sound, if I could find a good free tool for
> putting sound into an MPEG, I'd use it.

Sure, but you really could choose to keep only the visual voices its not as
if they are inadequate.

Regards and apologies
i_need_to_look_more_closely

(though I wish I hand't seen the dancing round, especially red dog, still
I'll submit what comes of out of my computer when it deigns to finish)

[John VanSickle] Re: Anim: How about an additional two weeks time... [7029 days 2 hours and 45 minutes ago]

Tue, 9 Jan 2007 04:37:49 GMT

i_need_a_unique_name wrote:
> Ah, Mr VanSickle what a stroke of genius it was of yours to come if with
> characters that don't have legs!!! Not to mention the fantastic way of
> giving them voices without sound... marvelous stuff.

Pardon me, but the Bugbot, TC, Joe, and the Greb all have legs.

As for voices without sound, if I could find a good free tool for 
putting sound into an MPEG, I'd use it.

> Hope there are a decent number of entries this time round, I'd hate for my
> entry to get listed in any of the winners just because there is <= 3
> because being my first it really isn't upto story content standard of the
> previous rounds.

Hey, feasting on weak rounds worked for me!

> Is it possible to enter multiple times, overwriting previous entries with
> better versions if rendered in time?

I don't see the admins having any problems with it.

Regards,
John

[waggy] Re: Anim: How about an additional two weeks time... [7029 days 4 hours and 3 minutes ago]

Tue, 9 Jan 2007 03:20:01 GMT

Markus Altendorff <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote:
> Would all others planning to enter please step up, too...? ;)
>
I was planning to enter this round, but spent all of last weekend trying to
wrap my head around the interactions among fake caustics, media, surface
properties, and light distance and strength.  I have provisionally
concluded that above- and below-water views of the same scene need to be
treated separately, effectively doubling my scene count and knocking this
animation from being difficult to get in by the original deadline to nearly
impossible to get it done properly by the proposed deadline extension.

Anyway, I could probably get a different animation in if I find out soon
that the deadline is to be extended as proposed and start right away.  I'm
willing to give it a shot, but it might not be right by those who keep on
top of these things, started earlier, and are already submitting their
entries.

-David

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Anim: How about an additional two weeks time... [7029 days 8 hours and 33 minutes ago]

Mon, 8 Jan 2007 22:49:30 GMT

i_need_a_unique_name schrieb:
> Ah, Mr VanSickle what a stroke of genius it was of yours to come if with
> characters that don't have legs!!! Not to mention the fantastic way of
> giving them voices without sound... marvelous stuff.
> 
> Hope there are a decent number of entries this time round, I'd hate for my
> entry to get listed in any of the winners just because there is <= 3
> because being my first it really isn't upto story content standard of the
> previous rounds.

Well, there's a mystery entry already on the server, i'm 
still trying to make one, and i guess we've an all but 
confirmed VanSickle movie on the radar...
Would all others planning to enter please step up, too...? ;)

> Is it possible to enter multiple times, overwriting previous entries with
> better versions if rendered in time?

Yes, that would be nice :) otherwise, i guess i'll have to 
fill in the missing scenes in my new epic with my scanned-in 
storyboard drawings - not a sight for the squeamish ;)

At least i've learned a LOT about my 3D software over the 
last two weeks... (updated C4D 9->10, all new shiny buttons, 
but WTF has the workflow i was used to gone...?! ;)

Oh, by the way: anyone knows if the "Blue Danube" is still 
copyrighted...? (hacking the sheet notes into GarageBand, 
not ripping some copyrighted recording!)

-Markus

[i need a unique name] Re: Anim: How about an additional two weeks time... [7029 days 12 hours and 43 minutes ago]

Mon, 8 Jan 2007 18:40:00 GMT

Ah, Mr VanSickle what a stroke of genius it was of yours to come if with
characters that don't have legs!!! Not to mention the fantastic way of
giving them voices without sound... marvelous stuff.

Hope there are a decent number of entries this time round, I'd hate for my
entry to get listed in any of the winners just because there is <= 3
because being my first it really isn't upto story content standard of the
previous rounds.

Is it possible to enter multiple times, overwriting previous entries with
better versions if rendered in time?

[FrogRay] Re: I'm Feasting on Small Rounds! [7030 days and 3 minutes ago]

Mon, 8 Jan 2007 07:20:00 GMT

Markus Altendorff <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote:
> Tek wrote:
>
> > I really want to enter but I just don't like the topics. I mean "Dance"?!!?!
> > What self respecting geek knows a damn thing about dance?
>
> Well, i'm not sure about geeks and formal dance, but
> couldn't all this martial arts stuff be considered "dance"
> in the broadest meaning of the word? I mean, there's those
> monks touring all those concert halls with their
> swords-and-sticks ritual fight shows...

Some forms of martial-arts such as the Brazilian Capoeira are as much about
dance and music as about fighting.  The history is interesting for those
into martial-arts.

The New Zealand Maori also perform "war-dances" know as "haka" s.

> And let's not forget the classical geek dance moves brought
> to the public by means of "inadvertently leaving the webcam
> on" ;)
>
> -M

[John VanSickle] Re: Anim: How about an additional two weeks time... [7030 days 11 hours and 4 minutes ago]

Sun, 7 Jan 2007 20:19:16 GMT

Markus Altendorff wrote:
> Well, for this anim round only, of course ;)
> 
> What i mean is:
> - announce the new topic "near" the regular date, Jan. 16, 2007
> - take a relaxed attitude for submissions for "Dance" until Jan. 30, 
> 2007 (instead of Jan.15), due to a certain delay on announcing it on ... 
> hold it ... November 10th, 2006?

Well, every round is unofficially extended until a human tells the 
server to stop accepting submissions.  That's how I entered the last round.

> Hey, i'm just listening to the voices in my head, here ... and they're 
> screaming "only 11 days left" ;)

8 days as of this writing.  Scene 8 out of 11 is rendering (four hours 
left on that scene).  Scenes 9 and eleven will be easy.  Ten may take a 
couple of days to get right, but it will render quickly.

Regards,
John

[i need a unique name] Re: Anim: How about an additional two weeks time... [7030 days 17 hours and 23 minutes ago]

Sun, 7 Jan 2007 14:00:01 GMT

When do we know for definitive if the 30th Jan is the final entry date? I've
started the final prodcution run for my render (i'tll take 5 days I think)
but if we have more time then I can make the content of the animataion
better.

[Markus Altendorff] Anim: How about an additional two weeks time? :) [7033 days 12 hours and 8 minutes ago]

Thu, 4 Jan 2007 19:15:09 GMT

Well, for this anim round only, of course ;)

What i mean is:
- announce the new topic "near" the regular date, Jan. 16, 2007
- take a relaxed attitude for submissions for "Dance" until 
Jan. 30, 2007 (instead of Jan.15), due to a certain delay on 
announcing it on ... hold it ... November 10th, 2006?

Hey, i'm just listening to the voices in my head, here ... 
and they're screaming "only 11 days left" ;)

Oh, almost forgot: Happy New Year 2007!

-Markus

[Markus Altendorff] Re: I'm Feasting on Small Rounds! [7056 days 11 hours and 16 minutes ago]

Tue, 12 Dec 2006 20:06:51 GMT

Tek wrote:

> I really want to enter but I just don't like the topics. I mean "Dance"?!!?! 
> What self respecting geek knows a damn thing about dance?

Well, i'm not sure about geeks and formal dance, but 
couldn't all this martial arts stuff be considered "dance" 
in the broadest meaning of the word? I mean, there's those 
monks touring all those concert halls with their 
swords-and-sticks ritual fight shows...

And let's not forget the classical geek dance moves brought 
to the public by means of "inadvertently leaving the webcam 
on" ;)

-M

[Tek] Re: I'm Feasting on Small Rounds! [7059 days 1 hour and 41 minutes ago]

Sun, 10 Dec 2006 05:41:40 GMT

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote in message 
news:4571e638$1@news.povray.org...
> John VanSickle schrieb:
>> 'Tain't hard to get first place if only five other people enter.
>
> I guess that's supposed to be a challenge to all those that didn't enter? 
> ;)

I really want to enter but I just don't like the topics. I mean "Dance"?!!?! 
What self respecting geek knows a damn thing about dance?

I want a topic like "hot anime chick on a motorbike"! Or at least something 
ambiquous and dynamic like "action" or "fight"... I vote for these things on 
the topic suggestion system but people keep picking things that bore me (for 
animations, most of them would be great for stills).

The last good topic was "explosion", but I didn't have the time :(

-- 
Tek
http://evilsuperbrain.com

[John VanSickle] Re: I'm Feasting on Small Rounds! [7064 days 6 hours and 20 minutes ago]

Tue, 5 Dec 2006 01:03:04 GMT

Markus Altendorff wrote:
> John VanSickle schrieb:
> 
>> 'Tain't hard to get first place if only five other people enter.
> 
> 
> I guess that's supposed to be a challenge to all those that didn't 
> enter? ;)
> 
>> But a mark in the W column is a mark in the W column.
> 
> Well deserved, too. Is there a medal for "all-year winner"?

I'm not sure I deserve a prize when people who produced better work than 
I do (such as H. E. Day and Neil Alexander) have been out of it.

> Apart from the obvious respect earned for you entering 20 rounds in a row!

And you can thank Osama Bin Laden for the round I missed in 2001. 
September 11th made a lot of work for our military.

Regards,
John

[Markus Altendorff] Re: I'm Feasting on Small Rounds! [7066 days 10 hours and 36 minutes ago]

Sat, 2 Dec 2006 20:46:48 GMT

John VanSickle schrieb:
> 'Tain't hard to get first place if only five other people enter.

I guess that's supposed to be a challenge to all those that 
didn't enter? ;)

> But a mark in the W column is a mark in the W column.

Well deserved, too. Is there a medal for "all-year winner"?

(see:
http://www.irtc.org/anims/index.html#s2006
)

Apart from the obvious respect earned for you entering 20 
rounds in a row!

-Markus

[John VanSickle] I'm Feasting on Small Rounds! [7066 days 11 hours and 19 minutes ago]

Sat, 2 Dec 2006 20:04:19 GMT

'Tain't hard to get first place if only five other people enter.

But a mark in the W column is a mark in the W column.

Regards,
John

[Markus Altendorff] Re: WTF? [7087 days 16 hours and 37 minutes ago]

Sat, 11 Nov 2006 14:46:16 GMT

John VanSickle wrote:
> Markus Altendorff wrote:
> 
>> Not sure if it's really necessary to repeat here (are there users 
>> relying solely on the newsgroups?), but the new anim topic is "Dance".
> 
> The July 2004 topic was "Dancing."
> 
> Do I have to do another animation with square-dancing robots?

No fair. You've already got everything and just need to 
change a few colors. That's a two-years head start ;)

Just kidding...

-Markus

[John VanSickle] WTF? [7088 days 8 hours and 31 minutes ago]

Fri, 10 Nov 2006 22:52:09 GMT

Markus Altendorff wrote:

> Not sure if it's really necessary to repeat here (are there users 
> relying solely on the newsgroups?), but the new anim topic is "Dance".

The July 2004 topic was "Dancing."

Do I have to do another animation with square-dancing robots?

Regards,
John

[Markus Altendorff] Re: topic? [7088 days 9 hours and 51 minutes ago]

Fri, 10 Nov 2006 21:31:43 GMT

Not sure if it's really necessary to repeat here (are there 
users relying solely on the newsgroups?), but the new anim 
topic is "Dance".

-Markus

[Markus Altendorff] Re: topic? [7097 days 18 hours and 9 minutes ago]

Wed, 1 Nov 2006 13:13:33 GMT

(various people) wrote:
>>> Just a heads-up that the processing for the current
>>> Animation round ("Technology") is going to be delayed a few
>>> days.  The admin responsible for this (namely "me") just
>>> got swamped with buying a house, getting a new job, and
>>> quitting the old one.
>>
>>
>> Still, it would be nice to know what the next *topic* was. I guess the
>> consolation is that (as John found out) the system will apparently allow
>> you to submit your entries after the deadline. :-)

Oh my, it's two weeks now. I really don't mind at all if the 
processing of the last round is delayed (voting and all), 
but it'd be very nice to have at least the topic for the 
current one... can't start tinkering without at least some 
direction to head to.

I've looked through the topic suggestion system, but there's 
no hint there, either.

Maybe a cgi script that could be fed with the upcoming 
topics and their "trigger dates" would be helpful? I could 
supply some PHP script for that ;)

-M

[John VanSickle] Re: topic? [7101 days 10 hours and 42 minutes ago]

Sat, 28 Oct 2006 20:41:05 GMT

David Cuny wrote:
> I'm guessing this has something to do with it (snipped from the IRTC mailing
> list):
> 
> 
>>Just a heads-up that the processing for the current
>>Animation round ("Technology") is going to be delayed a few
>>days.  The admin responsible for this (namely "me") just
>>got swamped with buying a house, getting a new job, and
>>quitting the old one.
> 
> 
> Still, it would be nice to know what the next *topic* was. I guess the
> consolation is that (as John found out) the system will apparently allow
> you to submit your entries after the deadline. :-)

The admins have stated in times past that the server does not slam the 
gate down, so to speak, at the deadline.  Instead, a human being tells 
the server to stop accepting submissions, at the deadline, or sometime 
after that.  In this case, the human being has not gotten around to it.

I suppose that it would be fair if everyone knew this, so that more 
people could jump on the wagon, but life in unfair.

Regards,
John

[David Cuny] Re: topic? [7101 days 12 hours and 38 minutes ago]

Sat, 28 Oct 2006 18:45:01 GMT

I'm guessing this has something to do with it (snipped from the IRTC mailing
list):

> Just a heads-up that the processing for the current
> Animation round ("Technology") is going to be delayed a few
> days.  The admin responsible for this (namely "me") just
> got swamped with buying a house, getting a new job, and
> quitting the old one.

Still, it would be nice to know what the next *topic* was. I guess the
consolation is that (as John found out) the system will apparently allow
you to submit your entries after the deadline. :-)

[John VanSickle] Guess what? [7107 days 11 hours and 28 minutes ago]

Sun, 22 Oct 2006 19:55:14 GMT

The server accepted my submission, even though it is "6 days, 15 hours, 
53 minutes" past the deadline.

If the IRTC organizers want to DQ it, I won't be upset.

Regards,
John

[Markus Altendorff] Re: topic? [7109 days 9 hours and 46 minutes ago]

Fri, 20 Oct 2006 21:36:59 GMT

Tek wrote:
> Come on, seriously, what's the new topic? We've already wasted 5 days of 
> good rendering time...

I second that... i'm not expecting a surprise overnight 
update to the website ;) - i'd be happy with a simple 
newsgroup or mail posting...

-Markus

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Few hours left, only two submissions in the ... [7109 days 9 hours and 48 minutes ago]

Fri, 20 Oct 2006 21:34:41 GMT

John VanSickle wrote:

> I've been off-line until about ten minutes ago, so I'm not in.  But my 
> record for most consecutive rounds entered now stands at 19!

Awww. It's just not the same without Rusty. :(
(seriously)

Hoping to see you around for the next (current...) round.

-Markus

[John VanSickle] Re: Few hours left, only two submissions in the ... [7109 days 10 hours and 9 minutes ago]

Fri, 20 Oct 2006 21:14:08 GMT

Markus Altendorff wrote:

> OK, make that three submissions, once i get the compression done... but 
> somehow i feel a bit sad. Where did all the active participants go? Did 
> i miss something?

I've been off-line until about ten minutes ago, so I'm not in.  But my 
record for most consecutive rounds entered now stands at 19!

Regards,
John

[Tek] Re: topic? [7109 days 18 hours and 11 minutes ago]

Fri, 20 Oct 2006 13:11:43 GMT

Come on, seriously, what's the new topic? We've already wasted 5 days of 
good rendering time...

-- 
Tek
http://evilsuperbrain.com

"Tek" <tek### [at] evilsuperbraincom> wrote in message 
news:4534ff2e@news.povray.org...
>I find myself suddenly inclined to tackle a serious pov project, but it's 
>too close to the stills deadline and there's not yet any word on the next 
>anim topic... sigh...
>
> Hopefully it'll be something that inspires me, I keep getting mental 
> blocks when I see the topic!
>
> -- 
> Tek
> http://evilsuperbrain.com
>
>

[Tek] topic? [7112 days 15 hours and 18 minutes ago]

Tue, 17 Oct 2006 16:05:02 GMT

I find myself suddenly inclined to tackle a serious pov project, but it's 
too close to the stills deadline and there's not yet any word on the next 
anim topic... sigh...

Hopefully it'll be something that inspires me, I keep getting mental blocks 
when I see the topic!

-- 
Tek
http://evilsuperbrain.com

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Few hours left, only two submissions in the ... [7114 days 9 hours and 7 minutes ago]

Sun, 15 Oct 2006 22:15:27 GMT

Tek wrote:
> I thought about entering, but the topic didn't really inspire me... maybe 
> next time...

(Almost) the same here, but then with two weeks to the 
deadline i sort of forced myself to submit at least 
something. Otherwise (me only being an after-hour animation 
hack with intermittent phases of couch-potatoism) my 
software might have begun collecting dusty bytes on the 
harddisk...

I started out with storyboarding at the beginning of 
September. Then i started moving packing cases due to a 
renovation instead ;)

In the end, two weeks ago, i threw out the original 
storyboard which i saw i wouldn't be able to complete by 
October 15th, and threw together some bits and pieces 
instead. I've found i only need to overcome my initial 
inertia to get going...
so, i managed to stretch a new effect i came up with, lots 
of camera movement on a static scene, a single odd idea plus 
a few less-than-stellar subtitled quips into a 3:40 MPEG 
with a severe case of compression wrinkles. And, well, if it 
gets accepted, it'll be entry #3 for this round ;)

While a three-entries-round makes for a fast and easy 
download, i wouldn't mind downloading significantly larger 
amounts... *wink, wink*

I'm not sure if i'd needed to hurry, because the readme file 
on the server claims September-November as animation 
timeframe (huh? two months only? more like for stills 
contest?) as well as July-October. Seems there's been some 
mix-up...

Anyway, longing for the next topic to be announced... (ah, 
anyone remembering the times of our collaborative IRTC 
t-shirt...? those were the days ;)

-Markus

[Tek] Re: Few hours left, only two submissions in the ... [7114 days 12 hours and 24 minutes ago]

Sun, 15 Oct 2006 18:59:02 GMT

I thought about entering, but the topic didn't really inspire me... maybe 
next time...

-- 
Tek
http://evilsuperbrain.com

"Markus Altendorff" <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote in message 
news:45324911$1@news.povray.org...
> OK, make that three submissions, once i get the compression done... but 
> somehow i feel a bit sad. Where did all the active participants go? Did i 
> miss something?
>
> -Markus

[Markus Altendorff] Few hours left, only two submissions in the serv... [7114 days 16 hours and 39 minutes ago]

Sun, 15 Oct 2006 14:43:29 GMT

OK, make that three submissions, once i get the compression 
done... but somehow i feel a bit sad. Where did all the 
active participants go? Did i miss something?

-Markus

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Next topic? [7179 days 13 hours and 28 minutes ago]

Fri, 11 Aug 2006 17:54:45 GMT

While we're on the subject of "next topic" - i noticed that 
the animation's web page seems a bit over due, even after i 
cleared my browser cache...?

I recall reading about a change in the admin team, and there 
may be some "holiday gap" or other issues, but ... anybody 
out there listening?

-Markus

[Dave Matthews] Re: Next topic? [7195 days 12 hours and 13 minutes ago]

Wed, 26 Jul 2006 19:10:00 GMT

Markus Altendorff <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote:
> Dave Matthews wrote:

> Either use a terminal and run "ftp ftp.irtc.org", user
> "anonymous", and read the welcome message, or point your
> browser to:
>
> http://www.irtc.org/ftp/pub/anims/incoming/
>
> Depending on your browser, the welcome message may be
> visible there, too.
>

Thanks!  That's the one I was looking for.

Dave

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Next topic? [7195 days 12 hours and 26 minutes ago]

Wed, 26 Jul 2006 18:57:13 GMT

Dave Matthews wrote:

> Aargh.  I've forgotten, yet again, where to find the ftp "new topic" page.
> Help, please!

Either use a terminal and run "ftp ftp.irtc.org", user 
"anonymous", and read the welcome message, or point your 
browser to:

http://www.irtc.org/ftp/pub/anims/incoming/

Depending on your browser, the welcome message may be 
visible there, too.

I'm still holding off until the current topic page is 
updated, because sometimes the notes there are useful for 
defining the topic a bit further... (real technology? Sci-Fi 
tech? ancient tech? retro style? or anything?)

http://www.irtc.org/anims/curtopic.html

(though this page usually suffers from "real-world lag", 
i.e. gets updated once the admins find the time)

-Markus

[Dave Matthews] Re: Next topic? [7197 days 15 hours and 13 minutes ago]

Mon, 24 Jul 2006 16:10:00 GMT

"Greg M. Johnson" <pte### [at] thecommononethatstartswithYcom> wrote:
> Now that's one that is so open that probably any anim made with a computer
> can said to be on-topic.  I always bristle whenever the topic seems like
> it's more of an invitation to make a demonstration piece for exhaustive
> photorealism than it is for storytelling. This one is more open.
>
> I've typically had computer problems the past year or so which required as
> much attention as did the raytracing. It's because I've been sloughing
> through a different Linux distro on my boxes almost every quarter.  My
> latest infatuation is with a HDD install of Knoppix.
>
> Markus Altendorff wrote:
>
> > Next topic: "Technology".
> >

Aargh.  I've forgotten, yet again, where to find the ftp "new topic" page.
Help, please!

Thanks

Dave Matthews

[Greg M Johnson] Re: Next topic? [7199 days 4 hours and 45 minutes ago]

Sun, 23 Jul 2006 02:37:43 GMT

Now that's one that is so open that probably any anim made with a computer
can said to be on-topic.  I always bristle whenever the topic seems like
it's more of an invitation to make a demonstration piece for exhaustive
photorealism than it is for storytelling. This one is more open.

I've typically had computer problems the past year or so which required as
much attention as did the raytracing. It's because I've been sloughing
through a different Linux distro on my boxes almost every quarter.  My
latest infatuation is with a HDD install of Knoppix.

Markus Altendorff wrote:

> Next topic: "Technology".
>

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Next topic? [7202 days 8 hours and 45 minutes ago]

Wed, 19 Jul 2006 22:37:32 GMT

Markus Altendorff wrote:
> The FTP server hasn't changed yet

Wouldn't you know it. Just posted, already obsoleted. ;)

Next topic: "Technology".

OK, on to the drawing board!

-Markus

[Markus Altendorff] Re: Next topic? [7202 days 14 hours and 55 minutes ago]

Wed, 19 Jul 2006 16:27:39 GMT

Greg M. Johnson wrote:
> .

The FTP server hasn't changed yet, and it looks like there's 
only going to be three entries this time. I'm hoping for a 
topic that immediately gets my mental wheels spinning - 
"Water and Waves" took me six weeks to come up with 
something i liked, and then i ran straight into some 
real-life deadlines...

-Markus

(keeps repeating to himself: "participate at least once a 
year!" ;)

[Greg M Johnson] Next topic? [7204 days 4 hours and 41 minutes ago]

Tue, 18 Jul 2006 02:42:08 GMT

[John VanSickle] Re: Animations April 2006 [7254 days 11 hours and 6 minutes ago]

Sun, 28 May 2006 20:16:57 GMT

RT Cook wrote:

> John VanSickle wrote:
> 
>> Markus Altendorff wrote:
> 
> 
>>> New topic for 2006-07-15: Water and Waves
>>> (see: http://www.irtc.org/ftp/pub/.message )
> 
> 
>> Hmm, this'll be hard to match up to Rusty...
> 
> 
>     So why is not Rusty finally getting rusty hard to match?

He's been rusty from the start.  Look carefully at his finish.

Regards,
John

[Greg M Johnson] Free Animation Hosting! [7264 days 4 hours and 51 minutes ago]

Fri, 19 May 2006 02:31:52 GMT

Does the existence of all these free video hosting sites offer any
opportunity for IRTC? I've followed the discussions over the years and
thought I heard some discussions of volunteer turnover. Would a complete
do-it-yourself upload experience save any aggravations, or just displace
them to a server out of the team's control?

I guess one consideration is that among revver, youtube, and vimeo, my guess
is that 2-3 will be gone in a year. But google video I would surmise is
here to stay.

[Greg M Johnson] Re: Animations April 2006 [7286 days 6 hours and 38 minutes ago]

Thu, 27 Apr 2006 00:44:41 GMT

John VanSickle wrote:

> Greg M. Johnson wrote:

> 
> I also thought of doing cheap puns.  "Hi Bob!  Water you doing?"
> 
> "Here's a sine wave:"  (Picture of a sign, with a hand waving.)
> 
> Whatever,
> John


I was thinking waves as in some kind of teleportation or laser thing.

[John VanSickle] Re: Animations April 2006 [7288 days 10 hours and 3 minutes ago]

Mon, 24 Apr 2006 21:20:10 GMT

Greg M. Johnson wrote:
>>Markus Altendorff wrote:
>>
>>
>>>New topic for 2006-07-15: Water and Waves
>>>(see: http://www.irtc.org/ftp/pub/.message )
> 
> 
> 
> Ick.
> 
> John VanSickle wrote:
>  
> 
>>Hmm, this'll be hard to match up to Rusty...
> 
> Yes, I've finally settled on my installation(s) and was ready to roll.  Now
> instead of fun storytelling in this medium, I'll be worrying about making
> exhaustively photorealistic waves.  Actually at this point I may go look
> elsewhere for creative output once again.

"Welcome to the Petrified Orchard Valley, where it hasn't rained in over 
ten thousand years."

I might do something non-Rusty...

I also thought of doing cheap puns.  "Hi Bob!  Water you doing?"

"Here's a sine wave:"  (Picture of a sign, with a hand waving.)

Whatever,
John

[Greg M Johnson] Re: Animations April 2006 [7289 days 5 hours and 29 minutes ago]

Mon, 24 Apr 2006 01:53:52 GMT

> Markus Altendorff wrote:
> 
>> New topic for 2006-07-15: Water and Waves
>> (see: http://www.irtc.org/ftp/pub/.message )

Ick.

John VanSickle wrote:

> Hmm, this'll be hard to match up to Rusty...
> 
> Regards,
> John

Yes, I've finally settled on my installation(s) and was ready to roll.  Now
instead of fun storytelling in this medium, I'll be worrying about making
exhaustively photorealistic waves.  Actually at this point I may go look
elsewhere for creative output once again.

[John VanSickle] Re: Animations April 2006 [7293 days 5 hours and 52 minutes ago]

Thu, 20 Apr 2006 01:30:39 GMT

Markus Altendorff wrote:

> Hi,
> 
> looks like the April animations (Special FX) are ready to look at 
> (though the website isn't updated (yet?), so no voting for now, i guess...)
> 
> http://www.irtc.org/ftp/pub/anims/2006-04-15/

Looks like there's no Honorable mentions this round, with only five 
entries total...

> New topic for 2006-07-15: Water and Waves
> (see: http://www.irtc.org/ftp/pub/.message )

Hmm, this'll be hard to match up to Rusty...

Regards,
John

[Markus Altendorff] Animations April 2006 [7293 days 11 hours and 30 minutes ago]

Wed, 19 Apr 2006 19:53:06 GMT

Hi,

looks like the April animations (Special FX) are ready to 
look at (though the website isn't updated (yet?), so no 
voting for now, i guess...)

http://www.irtc.org/ftp/pub/anims/2006-04-15/

New topic for 2006-07-15: Water and Waves
(see: http://www.irtc.org/ftp/pub/.message )

-Markus

[John VanSickle] First [7307 days 3 hours and 18 minutes ago]

Thu, 6 Apr 2006 04:04:55 GMT

Odd.  There's only a hair under ten days left, and my submission is the 
first.

Regards,
John

[Mike the Elder] Re: Where to find MPEG1 freeware? [7327 days 11 hours and 48 minutes ago]

Thu, 16 Mar 2006 19:35:00 GMT

Thanks - and by the way, nice anagram.

>John VanSickle <evi### [at] hotmailcom> wrote:

> I still use CMPEG, believe it or not.
>
> I think you can find it at www.mpeg.org .
>
> Regards,
> John

[John VanSickle] Re: Where to find MPEG1 freeware? [7327 days 12 hours and 46 minutes ago]

Thu, 16 Mar 2006 18:36:47 GMT

Mike the Elder wrote:

> Checking out the "Resources" section of the POVRay site has led to a maze of
> old and often expired links.  I'm hoping some kind soul can point me to a
> current link to a freware program that can assemble POVRay generated frames
> into the type of MPEG1 file that the ITRC animation contest requires.
> Recommendations and/or warnings in regard to particular programs would also
> be most welcome.  Thanks!

I still use CMPEG, believe it or not.

I think you can find it at www.mpeg.org .

Regards,
John

[Mike the Elder] Re: Where to find MPEG1 freeware? [7328 days 18 hours and 8 minutes ago]

Wed, 15 Mar 2006 13:15:00 GMT

I'll check it out - thank you.

Le Forgeron <jgr### [at] freefr> wrote:
> For your linux box, have a look at ffmpeg and toolame packages.
> the man page of toolame is long and full of informations.

> Eifersucht ist die Leidenschaft, die mit Eifer sucht, was Leiden
> schafft.

[Le Forgeron] Re: Where to find MPEG1 freeware? [7328 days 18 hours and 22 minutes ago]

Wed, 15 Mar 2006 13:01:20 GMT

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Mike the Elder scripsit::
> Sorry, I'll have to send my brain into the shop along with your cryatal
> ball.  I have access to Windows (98 and 2K PRO -  I REFUSE to use XP) and
> Linux (Redhat 9) machines, no Mac OS. I spend my work day in a dull business
> environment where users ( who, as McGruff the Crime Dog warned us, ARE
> losers) simply assume that computers are Windows machines.  The constant
> exposure seems to have begun to damage my own thought processes.  Thanks
> for the wake up call. :-)

For your linux box, have a look at ffmpeg and toolame packages.
the man page of toolame is long and full of informations.



- --
Eifersucht ist die Leidenschaft, die mit Eifer sucht, was Leiden
schafft.

Eco: -8.75 Soc: -6.72
http://www.politicalcompass.org/
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Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org

iD8DBQFEGBAfs/YJ43cSjHIRAr7rAJ9X0JrYSwopGZpQnBew6LvdbdecUwCfeCsC
eHcdS7Q4Hyx7qVGA4wGxoQk=
=Tiw3
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

[Mike the Elder] Re: Where to find MPEG1 freeware? [7328 days 18 hours and 48 minutes ago]

Wed, 15 Mar 2006 12:35:00 GMT

Sorry, I'll have to send my brain into the shop along with your cryatal
ball.  I have access to Windows (98 and 2K PRO -  I REFUSE to use XP) and
Linux (Redhat 9) machines, no Mac OS. I spend my work day in a dull business
environment where users ( who, as McGruff the Crime Dog warned us, ARE
losers) simply assume that computers are Windows machines.  The constant
exposure seems to have begun to damage my own thought processes.  Thanks
for the wake up call. :-)

> Which OS ?
> My crystal ball is blurred, I cannot see well your computer...
>
>
> --
> Eifersucht ist die Leidenschaft, die mit Eifer sucht, was Leiden
> schafft.
>
> Eco: -8.75 Soc: -6.72
> http://www.politicalcompass.org/

[Le Forgeron] Re: Where to find MPEG1 freeware? [7328 days 23 hours and 15 minutes ago]

Wed, 15 Mar 2006 08:08:08 GMT

Mike the Elder scripsit::
> Checking out the "Resources" section of the POVRay site has led to a maze of
> old and often expired links.  I'm hoping some kind soul can point me to a
> current link to a freware program that can assemble POVRay generated frames
> into the type of MPEG1 file that the ITRC animation contest requires.
> Recommendations and/or warnings in regard to particular programs would also
> be most welcome.  Thanks!
> 
> 
Which OS ?
My crystal ball is blurred, I cannot see well your computer...


-- 
Eifersucht ist die Leidenschaft, die mit Eifer sucht, was Leiden
schafft.

Eco: -8.75 Soc: -6.72
http://www.politicalcompass.org/

[Mike the Elder] Re: Where to find MPEG1 freeware? [7329 days 12 hours and 3 minutes ago]

Tue, 14 Mar 2006 19:20:00 GMT

Thanks - I'll definitely check it out.

"Tim Nikias" <JUSTTHELOWERCASE:timISNOTnikias(at)gmx.netWARE> wrote:

> This what I and a couple of others use:
> http://www.tmpgenc.net/
>
> It's great, via the File -> Output to File -> Avi you can even output to
> Divx or something else if you've got the Codec installed. Pretty simple and
> clean application, I really recommend it.
>
> Regards,
> Tim
>
> --
> aka "Tim Nikias v2.0"
> Homepage: <http://www.nolights.de>

[Tim Nikias] Re: Where to find MPEG1 freeware? [7329 days 12 hours and 17 minutes ago]

Tue, 14 Mar 2006 19:05:43 GMT

> Checking out the "Resources" section of the POVRay site has led to a maze
of
> old and often expired links.  I'm hoping some kind soul can point me to a
> current link to a freware program that can assemble POVRay generated
frames
> into the type of MPEG1 file that the ITRC animation contest requires.
> Recommendations and/or warnings in regard to particular programs would
also
> be most welcome.  Thanks!

This what I and a couple of others use:
http://www.tmpgenc.net/

It's great, via the File -> Output to File -> Avi you can even output to
Divx or something else if you've got the Codec installed. Pretty simple and
clean application, I really recommend it.

Regards,
Tim

-- 
aka "Tim Nikias v2.0"
Homepage: <http://www.nolights.de>

[Mike the Elder] Where to find MPEG1 freeware? [7329 days 12 hours and 23 minutes ago]

Tue, 14 Mar 2006 19:00:00 GMT

Checking out the "Resources" section of the POVRay site has led to a maze of
old and often expired links.  I'm hoping some kind soul can point me to a
current link to a freware program that can assemble POVRay generated frames
into the type of MPEG1 file that the ITRC animation contest requires.
Recommendations and/or warnings in regard to particular programs would also
be most welcome.  Thanks!

[John VanSickle] Thanks [7363 days 4 hours and 17 minutes ago]

Thu, 9 Feb 2006 03:05:58 GMT

Thanks to everyone whose votes put me into first place.

Regards,
John

[JC (Exether)] Re: Overal Championship? [7366 days and 11 minutes ago]

Mon, 6 Feb 2006 07:11:55 GMT

Yes, all the participations are taken into account for the overall ranking.
Obviously, it will be difficult to over-rank John. :-)
But note that he didn't only came 5 or 6, but rather 1st or 3rd. There's 
much points awarded to the first ones.
Normally there's a point table in the FAQs of the site, but I just saw 
that the link was broken, I'll have to fix that.

gregjohn wrote:
> http://exether.free.fr/irtc/index.php?sub=champ&lang=en&typ=A&mrk=O
> 
> I saw this web page and at first was honored, but then I wondered exactly
> how the ranking were acheived.  If say one entered in every round since the
> beginning, and came in 5 of 6 every time, would you eventually rise to the
> top of this list?
> 
> ;-p
> 
> 

-- 
http://sibylone.free.fr

[John VanSickle] Re: Overal Championship? [7376 days 4 hours and 3 minutes ago]

Fri, 27 Jan 2006 03:19:38 GMT

gregjohn wrote:

> http://exether.free.fr/irtc/index.php?sub=champ&lang=en&typ=A&mrk=O
> 
> I saw this web page and at first was honored, but then I wondered exactly
> how the ranking were acheived.  If say one entered in every round since the
> beginning, and came in 5 of 6 every time, would you eventually rise to the
> top of this list?

That's how I did it. (Okay, I did miss three rounds.)

Regards,
John

[gregjohn] 100 seconds [7376 days 14 hours and 3 minutes ago]

Thu, 26 Jan 2006 17:20:00 GMT

http://100second.ltc.org/

Apparently no cash or prizes, just the joy of submitting a 100s anim.

-- begin quote -------------

HOW IT WORKS

Since the beginning of time people have been making 100 second works, there
just wasn't a festival that recognized their greatness. Now, any piece of
motion media that is under 1 minute and 40 seconds can be considered part
of this festival. The rules are very open on content. Personal narratives,
music videos, youth media, digital stories, animations, documentary, found,
orphan or collage work are just some of the genres. These are part of a
growing catalogue of 100 second works.

Selections from this anthology are downloaded and bundled into DVDs and
curated for public screenings. We hope that under a Creative Commons
(Attribution - Non Commercial - Share Alike) the ability to host or screen
a festival is super easy.

The ability to share full quality files in this way is powered by the
DigitalBicycle. While a date is set for the summer time screening, we have
rolling submissions because the online archive is not bound by any dates.
The online archive is an opportunity for those who like downloading music
or making mix tapes to do the same with videos.

-- end quote -------------

[gregjohn] Best concept ever for "Inventions" round [7376 days 14 hours and 23 minutes ago]

Thu, 26 Jan 2006 17:00:00 GMT

I didn't enter because I had a host of technical difficulties trying to
upgrade two different boxes to linux, personal life, yadayadayada.

About a day before the deadline, I had the best idea.  I heard that Steve
Balmer of Microsoft at one time said that ipod owners were theives because
they were carrying around stolen music.  That gave me an idea.  Someone
invents a Great Thing and suddenly gets in trouble with The Man for
violating a software patent, some false claim of ownership or theft.

The engineer invents the great thing in a lab; robot goons from The Man
break into the lab and chase,  yadayadayada.

[gregjohn] Overal Championship? [7376 days 14 hours and 28 minutes ago]

Thu, 26 Jan 2006 16:55:00 GMT

http://exether.free.fr/irtc/index.php?sub=champ&lang=en&typ=A&mrk=O

I saw this web page and at first was honored, but then I wondered exactly
how the ranking were acheived.  If say one entered in every round since the
beginning, and came in 5 of 6 every time, would you eventually rise to the
top of this list?

;-p

[danny berne] Re: RenderFarm needed? [7441 days 15 hours and 15 minutes ago]

Tue, 22 Nov 2005 16:08:02 GMT

yeah... I'm into trying that

danny
dan### [at] yahoocom


"Benk Stefan" <Ste### [at] ruhr-uni-bochumde> wrote in message
news:37F8A92A.175CAE9E@ruhr-uni-bochum.de...
> Do you need a programm which distributes your povray-animation-frames
> automatically in an interlaced order on several network-computer?
>
> Maybe I have a solution for you, if you want to be a betatester.
> (based on a win95-system)
>
> Contact me via this Newsgroup!
>
>
>
>
>

[John VanSickle] A Confession [7499 days 11 hours and 4 minutes ago]

Sun, 25 Sep 2005 20:19:04 GMT

I never expected to get third in the Explosions round...

Regards,
John
(back after a long hiatus)

[sascha] Re: Explosion: Thanks, and Comments on Comments [7504 days 12 hours and 44 minutes ago]

Tue, 20 Sep 2005 18:38:46 GMT

Markus Altendorff wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> anybody listening on irtc.animations any more?
> Hello? *tap* *tap* Is this on?

Yes :-)

Congratulations! Nice to see that the IRTC animation competition is
still alive (I was quite shocked last round because there were only
three entrants).

I won't submit an entry this round (Sports), but try to participate
again next time...

-sascha

[Markus Altendorff] Explosion: Thanks, and Comments on Comments [7507 days 14 hours and 56 minutes ago]

Sat, 17 Sep 2005 16:26:32 GMT

Hi,

anybody listening on irtc.animations any more?
Hello? *tap* *tap* Is this on?

Thanks everybody who participated in the Explosion round and 
thanks to all that voted. I'm really, really happy with my 
#1 badge ;) and kudos to all participants, especially to 
Philippe Hovaguimian - i think this was the tightest result 
between #1 and #2 i've seen so far (15.9630 vs. 15.9333 - 
looks like "technical merit" was the edge).

Anyway, in a desperate try to somehow revive this newsgroup 
;) i'll comment on the three (!) comments from my comments 
file...

> =====
> From fcu### [at] riceedu:
> Nice.

Thank you :)

> =====
> From mar### [at] ulethca:
> 
> Nice animation.  The technical aspects were great.  My only problem was
> following the story line - I found it a bit disjointed and hard to follow. 
> Perhaps that is just me.

No, it's me too, and i've written it... ;) guess i've wanted 
to show too much in too little time. I'll try to do better 
the time after next time - i don't think i'll be able to get 
something ready for SPORTS, been slacking for too long...

> =====
> From lou### [at] yahoocom:
> Excellent, I don't know who picked on your lighting. I thought it was lit very
> well. 

I'm not sure about lighting. Most of my animations tend to 
play in outer space or in dark places, and sometimes the 
MPEG encoders seem to add an extra layer of obscurity on top 
of what little brightness is there to start with. Of course, 
picking an actor that already has a black/blue surface 
doesn't help much...

> Your texturing and materials were first class. 

Not really - look at the rooftop. There are - except for the 
metal surface of the window cleaning wagon - no textures on 
the roof or any other object. I originally had planned to 
use photographs to create realistic textures, but ran out of 
time. What helped were a) the sky dome (made from a fisheye 
cloud shot i did in 1998 or somewhere), and b) the windows 
that reflected that shot. One of the reasons why the camera 
is tilted upwards most of the time - to avoid showing the 
non-existing ground.

> Character animation was pretty good. 

Thanks! Most of the facial features are made with Cinema's 
PoseMixer which controls a "magnetic wire" (a spline that 
acts as a mesh deformer). A set of invisible splines 
represent various poses (lip sets for vocals, eyebrows 
etc.), and the PoseMixer controls with sliders how much of 
each target splines is mixed into the "master" deforming spline.
For the bones motions, i did forward animation instead of IK 
- IK is great for "hands on objects" or "feet on ground", 
but most of the movements in the animation are not 
target-driven and would require setting at least extra 
"magnets" to keep e.g. the elbows straight.

> I'd like a little more variety in my fireball color please, and maybe a little
billowing smoke too. 

Oh yes - the fireball is a single voxel from PyroCluster, 
and only after the deadline did i find solutions to two 
problems in the animation:
1) Fireball color: I've made the material too "dense", and 
the inner color too similar, that's why it's mostly an 
orange ball...

> The shockwave effect with the windows was pretty cool with sound that would have
been sweet.

2) Wow, thanks a lot. To me, actually, the windows look like 
the World Glassware Championship of synchronised jumping - 
because the "explosion" algorithm does calculate the 
movement based on the axis of each window. Since these 
windows are cloned objects, each of them has the same base 
axis settings - no variation in the movement. I've recreated 
the scene with the windows as one big mesh, resulting in a 
much more convincing "bang". Only problem is that i did so a 
week later... ;)


As always: looking forward to seeing the videos from the 
next round!

-Markus

[Markus Altendorff] New topic is SPORTS, current videos are reachable [7568 days 13 hours and 30 minutes ago]

Mon, 18 Jul 2005 17:53:21 GMT

The subject line is the message :)

http://www.irtc.org/ftp/pub/anims/2005-07-15/

-Markus

[Markus Altendorff] Animation deadline in two hours... [7571 days 6 hours and 2 minutes ago]

Sat, 16 Jul 2005 01:20:37 GMT

... and I MADE IT! I've actually managed to complete a video 
after all those years (OK, so one-and-a-half or something, 
actually ;)

Fourty-one scenes crammed into 3:45, and boy, am i proud i 
did pull this off. Especially since i've started only last 
week... (i'm on holiday right now :).

Sorry for any incoherence in this message. I'm running on 
caffeine and chocolate for almost 20 hours straight, but the 
upload is running right now...

Looking forward to all the other entries (from the numbers 
alone, this looks better than the last round!)

-Markus

[David Cuny] Re: April 2005 results [7624 days and 58 minutes ago]

Tue, 24 May 2005 06:25:01 GMT

> David Cuny wrote the initial script, and as it seems to be the plot that
> is responsible for that high score, I'd again like to thank both of
> them! (I wish I had such funny ideas on my own :-)

You're welcome. :-)

But I think all the credit for the animation should go to Sascha. Ask anyone
who's done any animation, and they'll tell you there's a world of
difference between coming up with an idea, and actually _implementing_ that
idea.

[Bernard Hatt] Re: April 2005 results [7624 days 1 hour and 13 minutes ago]

Tue, 24 May 2005 06:10:13 GMT

Sascha Ledinsky wrote:
> 
> The results are in. I'd like to thank you all for the score you gave my
> entry and also for the nice (and valuable) comments!

Well done, it was a good entry.

I'm quite happy with the results (and comments) I got,
and I also got 5th place in the stills (just missing out on
the 'medals') too.

Bernard

[Roberto Amorim] Re: April 2005 results [7624 days 9 hours and 39 minutes ago]

Mon, 23 May 2005 21:44:13 GMT

You definitely deserve the high score you got. The movie is great!

> I've made a mistake in my submission text-file: It was Roberto Amorim
> who posted the idea of using a Rusty impostor to the newsgroup.
> David Cuny wrote the initial script, and as it seems to be the plot that
> is responsible for that high score, I'd again like to thank both of
> them! (I wish I had such funny ideas on my own :-)

I'm glad that quick joke turned into something as original as your entry.
Congratulations again!

[JC (Exether)] Re: April 2005 results [7624 days 13 hours and 16 minutes ago]

Mon, 23 May 2005 18:06:49 GMT

I also updated my website as both competition have been updated:
http://exether.free.fr/irtc

JC

Sascha Ledinsky wrote:
> The results are in. I'd like to thank you all for the score you gave my 
> entry and also for the nice (and valuable) comments!
> 
> That should be enough encouragement for me to keep on woring on JPatch :-)
> 
> I've made a mistake in my submission text-file: It was Roberto Amorim 
> who posted the idea of using a Rusty impostor to the newsgroup.
> David Cuny wrote the initial script, and as it seems to be the plot that 
> is responsible for that high score, I'd again like to thank both of 
> them! (I wish I had such funny ideas on my own :-)
> 
> The sources for two shots of this animation are now available with the 
> latest release (0.4 preview 1) of JPatch, which can be downloaded from 
> http://www.jpatch.com
> I'll make the sources for the whole animation availiable once u/v 
> mapping is "officially" supported...
> 
> Best regards,
> -sascha


-- 
http://sibylone.free.fr

[Sascha Ledinsky] April 2005 results [7624 days 14 hours and 27 minutes ago]

Mon, 23 May 2005 16:55:50 GMT

The results are in. I'd like to thank you all for the score you gave my 
entry and also for the nice (and valuable) comments!

That should be enough encouragement for me to keep on woring on JPatch :-)

I've made a mistake in my submission text-file: It was Roberto Amorim 
who posted the idea of using a Rusty impostor to the newsgroup.
David Cuny wrote the initial script, and as it seems to be the plot that 
is responsible for that high score, I'd again like to thank both of 
them! (I wish I had such funny ideas on my own :-)

The sources for two shots of this animation are now available with the 
latest release (0.4 preview 1) of JPatch, which can be downloaded from 
http://www.jpatch.com
I'll make the sources for the whole animation availiable once u/v 
mapping is "officially" supported...

Best regards,
-sascha

[Francois Labreque] Re: April 2005 videos [7640 days 18 hours and 12 minutes ago]

Sat, 7 May 2005 13:10:33 GMT

Markus Altendorff wrote:
> If you've not yet downloaded this round's videos, i strongly recommend 
> to do so. Congratulations all of them, i am still impressed :)
> 
> -Markus

Seconded.

-- 
/*Francois Labreque*/#local a=x+y;#local b=x+a;#local c=a+b;#macro P(F//
/*    flabreque    */L)polygon{5,F,F+z,L+z,L,F pigment{rgb 9}}#end union
/*        @        */{P(0,a)P(a,b)P(b,c)P(2*a,2*b)P(2*b,b+c)P(b+c,<2,3>)
/*   videotron.ca  */}camera{orthographic location<6,1.25,-6>look_at a }

[Markus Altendorff] April 2005 videos [7641 days 13 hours and 42 minutes ago]

Fri, 6 May 2005 17:41:00 GMT

If you've not yet downloaded this round's videos, i strongly 
recommend to do so. Congratulations all of them, i am still 
impressed :)

-Markus

[Bernard Hatt] Re: Next topic [7652 days 14 hours and 29 minutes ago]

Mon, 25 Apr 2005 16:53:56 GMT

gregjohn wrote:
> 
> "Roberto Amorim" <wol### [at] hotmailcom> wrote:
> > > > Has the next animation topic been announced yet?
> >
> > Explosion!!! :-)
> >
> 
> I am so sorry that Real Life kept me away from participating in "Impostor,"
> as it's right up the character-themed animation  I love to dabble in, and I
> think I was even it originator.
> 
> I however do not do explosions.  I don't like the topic as it seems to call
> for overkilled realism that I'm incapable of and not going to develop as a
> cg skill.
> 
> Greg M. Johnson

I wasn't very inspired by the topic at first, but not explosions
are fire/flames/bits flung everywhere, you could show events
before/after the explosion, firework type things or explosive
applications like air bags (or maybe the heroic prevention of
an explosion) ...

Bernard

[gregjohn] Re: Next topic [7653 days 6 hours and 13 minutes ago]

Mon, 25 Apr 2005 01:10:00 GMT

"Roberto Amorim" <wol### [at] hotmailcom> wrote:
> > > Has the next animation topic been announced yet?
>
> Explosion!!! :-)
>

I am so sorry that Real Life kept me away from participating in "Impostor,"
as it's right up the character-themed animation  I love to dabble in, and I
think I was even it originator.

I however do not do explosions.  I don't like the topic as it seems to call
for overkilled realism that I'm incapable of and not going to develop as a
cg skill.

Greg M. Johnson