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29 Mar 2024 04:27:16 EDT (-0400)
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From: Jim Charter
Subject: Re: Stuck for ideas
Date: 7 Feb 2004 10:21:30
Message: <4025027a$1@news.povray.org>
One characteristic SciFi is the reliance on special effects and sets to 
create an otherwise unexperienceable experience.  The characteristic of 
classic scifi is that these effects will be unconvincing, even naive. 
Yet we treat them with affection.  The original intention can be to 
create an otherworldly even disturbing experience.  Bladerunner did this 
effectively the first time I saw it with effective use of the 
soundtrack. Sometimes the soundstage set can be exploited. The cozy 
spacestation becomes a trap with a alien onboard.  Another intention or 
inevitable result is to create a safe, often intimate, platform from 
which to speculate about otherworldly experiences.  Those early Startrek 
planet surfaces.  They worked because the designers never violated the 
limits of a soundstage.  This sence of intimate scale enlisted to 
express something alien you almost get for free with raytracing.


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From: Tek
Subject: Re: Stuck for ideas
Date: 7 Feb 2004 15:18:31
Message: <40254817$1@news.povray.org>
"Jim Charter" <jrc### [at] msncom> wrote in message
news:4025027a$1@news.povray.org...
> The characteristic of
> classic scifi is that these effects will be unconvincing, even naive.

I think I have to disagree with you there. Some of my favourite sci-fi which I'd
consider classic which doesn't have wobbly sets and unconvincing effects. Most
notably 2001: A Space Odyssey.

Which again confounds any attempt I make to put my ideas into the category of
"classic" sci fi :(

-- 
Tek
www.evilsuperbrain.com


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From: Tom Galvin
Subject: Re: Stuck for ideas
Date: 7 Feb 2004 15:40:21
Message: <Xns94889F351F913tomatimporg@203.29.75.35>
"Tek" <tek### [at] evilsuperbraincom> wrote in news:40254817$1@news.povray.org:

> 
> I think I have to disagree with you there. Some of my favourite sci-fi
> which I'd consider classic which doesn't have wobbly sets and
> unconvincing effects. Most notably 2001: A Space Odyssey.
> 

I consider that movie as the dividing line.   Before then SciFi was found 
in mostly B movies and after it was in some of the best films, and 
blockbusters with monster budgets.  

Close Encounters of the Third Kind
Star Wars
Alien
BladeRunner
Terminator

-- 
Tom
_________________________________
The Internet Movie Project
http://www.imp.org/


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From: Tek
Subject: Re: Stuck for ideas
Date: 7 Feb 2004 15:54:54
Message: <4025509e$1@news.povray.org>
"Tom Galvin" <tom### [at] imporg> wrote in message
news:Xns94889F351F913tomatimporg@203.29.75.35...
> > Most notably 2001: A Space Odyssey.
>
> I consider that movie as the dividing line.   Before then SciFi was found
> in mostly B movies and after it was in some of the best films, and
> blockbusters with monster budgets.

I totally agree it's a dividing line, where mainstream sci-fi films became
commonplace, but are you suggesting it's not on topic for this round?

i.e. does "classic sci-fi" necessarily mean Ed Wood or are we allowed to do
something, dare I say it, *Good*? :)

Bear in mind I was born in the mid-seventies so I really don't have a lot of
affection for badly made sci-fi. In fact about the only thing like that which I
genuinely enjoy is Barbarella. Which I am considering doing for this round,
since it is bang on topic, but I'd rather do something that doesn't rely on
character animation.


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From: Jim Charter
Subject: Re: Stuck for ideas
Date: 7 Feb 2004 21:54:59
Message: <4025a503$1@news.povray.org>
Tek wrote:

> I think I have to disagree with you there. Some of my favourite sci-fi which I'd
> consider classic which doesn't have wobbly sets and unconvincing effects. Most
> notably 2001: A Space Odyssey.

Hmmm I guess you got me there.  The effects don't have to be wobbly just 
dated to be a bit unconvincing. I find the final sesquence a bit that 
way.  Nevertheless "2001" has remarkable staying power.  Wouldn't expect 
anything less from Kubrick.  Did I mention he's my all time top movie man?


> 
> Which again confounds any attempt I make to put my ideas into the category of
> "classic" sci fi


I still think the use of sets, costumes, and effects is distinctive 
within the genre.  Certain plots and themes also recur.


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From: Tom Galvin
Subject: Re: Stuck for ideas
Date: 7 Feb 2004 22:49:54
Message: <Xns9488E8078C5F0tomatimporg@203.29.75.35>
"Tek" <tek### [at] evilsuperbraincom> wrote in news:4025509e$1@news.povray.org:


> 
> i.e. does "classic sci-fi" necessarily mean Ed Wood or are we allowed
> to do something, dare I say it, *Good*? :)
> 
> 

I am such a Luddite :D

I consider Classic SciFi to be books from the 30s, 40s, and 50s, by authors 
like Asimov, Heinlien, Piper...



-- 
Tom
_________________________________
The Internet Movie Project
http://www.imp.org/


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From: Tek
Subject: Re: Stuck for ideas
Date: 7 Feb 2004 23:13:00
Message: <4025b74c$1@news.povray.org>
"Tom Galvin" <tom### [at] imporg> wrote in message
news:Xns9488E8078C5F0tomatimporg@203.29.75.35...
> I consider Classic SciFi to be books from the 30s, 40s, and 50s, by authors
> like Asimov, Heinlien, Piper...

I'm ashamed to admit that I read very little. I've read a lot of comics and
terry pratchett, but the only "classic" thing I've read is... 2001! ;)

-- 
Tek
www.evilsuperbrain.com


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From: Tek
Subject: Re: Stuck for ideas
Date: 10 Feb 2004 00:11:38
Message: <4028680a@news.povray.org>
Okay, I've got an idea which I think qualifies. Something like a Battlestar
Galactica / Star Wars large scale space battle, with lots of automated AI
spaceships.

I reckon that counts as classic sci-fi. :)

Although now I want to design the ships to look nothing like SW! Must resist
urge to be creative...

-- 
Tek
www.evilsuperbrain.com


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From: Jim Charter
Subject: Re: Stuck for ideas
Date: 10 Feb 2004 02:13:41
Message: <402884a5$1@news.povray.org>
Tek wrote:

> Okay, I've got an idea which I think qualifies. Something like a Battlestar
> Galactica / Star Wars large scale space battle, with lots of automated AI
> spaceships.
> 
> I reckon that counts as classic sci-fi. :)

Reckon so, though for me I always thought of SW as "classic adventure" 
too.  But it certainly answers my criteria of depending on sets and effects.

> 
> Although now I want to design the ships to look nothing like SW! Must resist
> urge to be creative...
> 
Huh?  Really don't think so.

BTW my favorite SciFi movie that I would call "classic" is "Andromeda 
Strain", again, use of sets,...a scientific setting but an interesting 
reversal of the usual, here the encapsulation is about containing rather 
than excluding what is hostile,  recurring theme,... meeting with 
extra-terrestial life but it doesn't walk and talk, 
means,...scientific/crisis procedural but speculative modelling, 
move-counter-move, well thought out protocol proves inadequate.


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From: Greg M  Johnson
Subject: Re: Stuck for ideas
Date: 11 Feb 2004 23:05:00
Message: <402afb6c$1@news.povray.org>
I have a book on the classic "pulp" books like the first Tarzans, etc.,
from the early 20th century, up through WWII.

Do you know what is the most common design element in the creatures and
crafts of the early science fiction in my book?
TENDRILS TENDRILS TENDRILS

There's a new Sky Captain movie coming out where aliens of ca. 1920 scifi
stories attack circa 1940 earth, and the robots have TENDRILS! :-0


I think anything with a simple construction-- evocative of high-school
graduate movie prop deparatments hurriedly throwing something together in
1930-- but with knockout sophisticated movement will be a winner. Take that
campy world and give it 21st century sophistication.


I have a plot idea, but am not sure if I'll exactly be able to get a quality
entry in this round.  And it just barely escapes the scorn of John's list of
cliches!


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