On Mon, 21 Jul 2008 22:51:03 +0100
"St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote:

> > Conceptually I don't understand how voting could improve the artistic
> > value of a submission (or concept, tech value, for that matter)...
> > Mixing apples and oranges? (of course I understand the need for voter
> > incentive, but is this the right way?)
> 
>      Well, one thing I can say is that, with experience, this is one
> hard cooky to crumble. Getting it right is the aim, but that certainly
> isn't easy.
> 
>      Who wins? What do I put on the front page for the supposed winner
> (s)?

That's why major exposure is essential (see below). There are many
popular photo sites that have a rating system in place.

> > Anyway, I would suggest that having a completely separate site for
> > these competitions does no good to increasing the exposure of the
> > competition (or raytracing in general).
> 
>   Not quite sure what you mean with this...

This is related to the 'popularity' issue of Google. An isolated site
doesn't rate, until links to that site are appearing on the 'net. Then
the site rises in google's opinion. Presenting it through the google
interface doesn't do much - in fact, I doubt it does anything,
particularly with google. At the beginning, if I remember well, they
didn't even have that page. They always declared that it isn't up to the
page owner to get rating.

TC needs links to it, and a big hand can be had if the images appear on
a large site. Ever considered presenting them with the new Google picture
feature?

Another issue with lack of publicity is that I suspect that these
discussion lists on aren't as visible (~ popular) as 'normal' forums on
the 'net. And, even though some of the discussion subjects are found on
the copy at the povray.org site, there is no clear indication on those
pages how to get to the list itself and participate.

Newbies have little idea of the existence of 'news' lists.

> > wouldn't being a part of something more popular boost things a little?
> > (maybe - just a suggestion - something like deviantart.com?) It would
> > solve things like 20/20/20 - participants should be excluded from
> > voting.  The votes should come from the general public (IMHO).
> 
>       Well, don't forget that this comp., (TINA CHeP), is supposed to
> be in keeping with the IRTC as a 'stand-in' project whilst it was on
> hiatus. And, as we all know, the IRTC is being re-established - which
> is good, and I wish the team well. I'll be the first in the queue to
> participate, that's for sure. ;)
> 
>     But, the TC-RTC comp. will always be around even if it is a backup.

Ok... I've offered my help to get the IRTC on-line again too - you might
have noticed that on the other list.

> > in Google, and the initial 5 pages of links, none points to TC-RTC.
> 
>     Yep, because I simply haven't promoted it yet to any search engine.
> When I feel the time is right, I will, and I have the experience with
> that side of things. I don't want, and won't have, egg on my face to
> the world. Can you understand that?

Ok... But remaining with the poultry example - you can't have many
participants (and voters) if you don't publicize... Chicken and egg
problem.

> > Please take these (radical?) ideas as suggestions, not criticism. I
> > don't want to start a flame war...
> 
>    No flame war here John. I really appreciate your thoughts and
> idea's. Keep them coming.
> 
>    Oh, and btw, yes, you can enter as many times as you want in all 
> categories. (Sorry I didn't get back to you).
> 
>       ~Steve~

Great - thanks!

May I suggest adding the closing date for the active competition on the
page... 'July 2008' doesn't state the closing date (which, if I'm correct
is 15th of August). I'm somewhat of a fanatic on the dating subject - I
have to be. My students have a very inventive mind on how to interpret my
dates ;-)

John

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