Hi!

New version of PoPOV is available at http://abx.art.pl/pov/popov/

This release contains next set of patches I gathered in repository at
http://abx.art.pl/pov/patches/ and introduce windows port. Sorry for lack of
sources and documentation. I have to make some work on them. I hope it can be
already usefull for community.

Thanks to all contributors (they are listed in banners).

Request:
please, help me create better examples for features, in particular for normals
in smooth heighfield. Thanks.

ABX

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> This release contains next set of patches I gathered

Your initiative is very welcome. But I was hoping you would include
Grimbert's tesselation patch (perhaps with a legal note) and the great
glow{} from MegaPOV.. I don't see them in the list.. And now a dump
question: Since your version is not compiled with Intels compiler, I suppose
it doesn't utilize the optimations made in the offical Pov3.5 for modern
CPUs?

Regards,
Hugo

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On Mon, 21 Oct 2002 23:33:22 +0200, "Hugo" <hua### [at] post3teledk> wrote:
> > This release contains next set of patches I gathered
>
> Your initiative is very welcome. But I was hoping you would include
> Grimbert's tesselation patch (perhaps with a legal note) and the great
> glow{} from MegaPOV..

Nobody said 'no'. But I include 3.5 compatible patches first. 

> And now a dump
> question: Since your version is not compiled with Intels compiler, I suppose
> it doesn't utilize the optimations made in the offical Pov3.5 for modern
> CPUs?

Doesn't. Borland compiler is supposed mostly as free compiler for testing
compilation of whole package. If you wish you are welcome to buy Intels
compiler and use (now released) sources to build your own version :-)
Unfortunatelly I have no free resources for such task :-(

ABX

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I don't understand your spline/array fix.

My interest is in splines for keyframing the animation variables of a
blob-based character.

If you've seen any of the professional packages, there are dozens of
variables for limb position/rotation, etc., and the transition is done in
"spline-like" graphs.    Obviously, every limb control variable can be set
independently, with different ones having different control points at
different frames.

Managing all of this with three dozen cubic_splines is doable but somewhat
of a headache.  Is your patch offering any help here?

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On Tue, 22 Oct 2002 09:11:13 -0400, "Greg M. Johnson" <gregj:-)565### [at] aolcom>
wrote:
> I don't understand your spline/array fix.

You mean array-like access to splines ?
Have you checked original page (http://abx.art.pl/pov/patches/arspline.php)?
It basically is possibility of _reading_ number of control points and theirs
values. Imagine you have spline already created as
  #declare S=spline{0,x 1,y 2,z};
which means S is linear spline with segments from <1,0,0>to<0,1,0>to<0,0,1>
With my patch you can acces those parameters, so:

#delcare N=dimension_size(S); // returns 3
#declare T1=S[0][0];          // returns 0
#declare V1=S[0][1];          // returns <1,0,0>
#declare T2=S[1][0];          // returns 1
#declare V2=S[1][1];          // returns <0,1,0>
#declare T3=S[2][0];          // returns 2
#declare V3=S[2][1];          // returns <0,0,1>

Advantage of this is that you can now write macros to operate on splines
without storing values in additional arrays.

> My interest is in splines for keyframing the animation variables of a
> blob-based character.
> If you've seen any of the professional packages, there are dozens of
> variables for limb position/rotation, etc., and the transition is done in
> "spline-like" graphs.    Obviously, every limb control variable can be set
> independently, with different ones having different control points at
> different frames.
> Managing all of this with three dozen cubic_splines is doable but somewhat
> of a headache.  Is your patch offering any help here?

Hard to say. I don't know internals of your human animation.

But I understand feature you are looking for. I have in mind some system for
helping in controlling such animations. But it is in my TODO since months and
when will be incorporated.

ABX

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Greg M. Johnson wrote:
> My interest is in splines for keyframing the animation
> variables of a blob-based character.
>
> If you've seen any of the professional packages, there
> are dozens of variables for limb position/rotation,
> etc., and the transition is done in "spline-like"
> graphs.    Obviously, every limb control variable can
> be set independently, with different ones having
> different control points at different frames.
>
> Managing all of this with three dozen cubic_splines is
> doable but somewhat of a headache.  Is your patch
> offering any help here?

I think a system like that is too complicated and specialized for an
internal feature in POV-Ray, it would be difficult to make a system that
fits all cases.

I have tried to implement similar things in POV-script. Some of it is
used in my Lip Synch System, which can be found on my web site.

In the lip synch system it only applies to the muscles in the mouth, but
the concept is the same for anything moving that is controlled with
splines and where the concept of key frames make sense.

Rune
--
3D images and anims, include files, tutorials and more:
rune|vision:  http://runevision.com (updated Oct 19)
POV-Ray Ring: http://webring.povray.co.uk

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"Rune" <run### [at] mobilixnetdk> wrote in message
news:3db558d8@news.povray.org...
>
> I think a system like that is too complicated and specialized for an
> internal feature in POV-Ray, it would be difficult to make a system
> that fits all cases.
>

Perhaps especially for a text-based SDL. I suppose one could write a program
which has a GUI where you click & drag your spline points and their control
points.

I envision a system (INC or patch) where you have a table, with clock values
0 to 1 on one axis and on the other,  the x,y,z of say two dozen
vectors(representing translations & rotations).   Then you just type in the
values you're interested in,  and somebody turns all of them into a smoothly
flowing function of the clock over the places where your table is blank.
Oh, perhaps I could do this myself with Lotus 1-2-3 --- it's the
"programming language" I'm most fluent at-- but it wouldn't be very useful
to others, if I ever wanted to share....


ABX:
Could you humour me with the results when one has a spline of:

>>  #declare S=spline{0.110 , x  0.151,y , 0.92 , z};

Q: Do you mind being called ABX?

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On Wed, 23 Oct 2002 08:47:54 -0400, "Greg M. Johnson" <gregj:-)565### [at] aolcom>
wrote:
> Perhaps especially for a text-based SDL. I suppose one could write a program
> which has a GUI where you click & drag your spline points and their control
> points.

Ingo recently made such addition for GIMP. Look for his post on 06.10.2002 in
povray.general.

> I envision a system (INC or patch) where you have a table, with clock values
> 0 to 1 on one axis and on the other,  the x,y,z of say two dozen
> vectors(representing translations & rotations).   Then you just type in the
> values you're interested in,  and somebody turns all of them into a smoothly
> flowing function of the clock over the places where your table is blank.

I probably not understand You becouse from what I read in your wish is
basically what splines exactly do. You write clock values and vectors and then
spline represents smoothly flowing function of the clock.

> ABX:
> Could you humour me with the results when one has a spline of:
> > >  #declare S=spline{0.110 , x  0.151,y , 0.92 , z};

Sorry, I can't recognize meaning and intentions of above with my poor English
:-(    and I don't understand why you have changed content in quoted text.
You don't know what above is ? It is linear spline with two segments.

> Q: Do you mind being called ABX?

Since I use it for domains, emails and for posting ...

ABX

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"ABX" <abx### [at] abxartpl> wrote in message
news:ik6druo1klvj3cqfsnns7dvugik9hv4sti@4ax.com...
> I probably not understand You becouse from what I read in your wish is
> basically what splines exactly do. You write clock values and vectors and
> then spline represents smoothly flowing function of the clock.
>

But if you have about two dozen splines, they're sprawled all across the
several "pages" of text, with lots of re-typing and re-pasting of similar
information.
I made up a sample Lotus 1-2-3 file with the type of spreadsheet I'd like to
work with, and here is the .CSV formatted export of that file:

//---start pasted file
,"hand.x","hand.y","hand.z","arm.x","arm.y","arm.z"
0,1,0,0.25,0.75,0.5,0
0.1,,,,,,
0.2,,,,0.75,0.75,0.1
0.3,,,,,,
0.4,,,,,,
0.5,1,0.5,1,0.75,1,0
0.6,,,,,,
0.7,,,,,,
0.8,,,,,,
0.9,,,,,,
1,1,0,0.25,0.75,0.5,0
//---end pasted file

For example, I may want the hand file to have key frames at 0.00, 0.50, and
1.00, with the arms at 0.00, 0.25, 0.50, and 1.00.  Of course instead of two
variables, it'd easily be two dozen.

So I suppose for my own benefit I could write my own pov file to read this
(yikes, what a task!), but "the system" might not be very useful to others
who don't have 1-2-3 or don't want to mess with a spreadsheet. And I'd have
to touch my mouse more often to do extra saves & switches between programs,
but I suppose I could survie this...

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On Wed, 23 Oct 2002 12:39:43 -0400, "Greg M. Johnson" <gregj:-)565### [at] aolcom>
wrote:
> //---start pasted file
> ,"hand.x","hand.y","hand.z","arm.x","arm.y","arm.z"
> 0,1,0,0.25,0.75,0.5,0
> 0.1,,,,,,
> 0.2,,,,0.75,0.75,0.1
> 0.5,1,0.5,1,0.75,1,0
> 0.6,,,,,,
> 1,1,0,0.25,0.75,0.5,0
> //---end pasted file

I think you can write a macro for this to operate on arrays. You can test
whether specified cell in array is defined or not and then create dedicated
spline.

ABX

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