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Ken wrote in message <3EE08022.941B6091@pacbell.net>...
>
>fabien Henon wrote:
>
>> In one word, has the survey been used ?
>
>That's 5 words. The one word answer though is, yes.
>
>--
>Ken Tyler
Ask for a pixel, get *a* pixel!! Trouble is it's hard to tell what the
picture is by looking at a single pixel.
Either:
1] You were very busy (likely).
2] You were trying to be cute (no prob).
3] You were being mean (Our mean ol' Uncle Ken. What? NO WAY!).
A link would sure be nice (my connection take 3-5 minutes just to load
a single web page these days. (20k < on 56k modem!!!) Even simple
searches are beyond my financial means. 'Information Superhighway' my
butt!!).
So, should I spend a couple more weeks trying to get a simple 'modal
dialog' to return to the calling 'dialog' [a], or is the P-Team going
to make a GUI for POVray.Linux?
[a] - it disappears, no destructor called. heck, I don't even know if
it's using KDE, X-windows, Vesa, or??? At least microslut win API
returns an error when something fails!! <G> I feel like i'm walking up
the 'down escalator'!
--
Bob 'perpetual bug hunter' R
POVrookie
--
MinGW (GNU compiler): http://www.mingw.com/
Dev-C++ IDE: http://www.bloodshed.net/
V IDE & V GUI: http://www.objectcentral.com/
POVray: http://www.povray.org/
Good C++ book: http://www.mindview.net/Books
alt.comp.lang.learn.c-c++: ftp://snurse-l.org/pub/acllc-c++/faq
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Ken wrote:
>
> fabien Henon wrote:
>
>
>>In one word, has the survey been used ?
>
>
> That's 5 words. The one word answer though is, yes.
>
I was just wondering. Maybe that considering the number of people who
are using Pov for *nix, the POV-Team of some other skilled programmer
It may sound something like that from a guy who writes Pyvon (an editor
for POV under Linux), but Pyvon is written with Python. As Perl, Java or
other script language, Python can not match the speed of C or C++.
I know that many *nix gurus are going to yell at this message (in that
they do not need an editor), but there is an increasing number of people
who discover Linux. Most of them come from a windows world. Having a
proper interface will ease 'arrival' in the Linux world.
Pyvon has been downloaded over 500 times so far. So there must be a need
for an interface.
I do know that writing an interface is easier said than done, but with
Kylix 3 it **might** be faster to write a proper Linux Interface to Linux.
Windows has one, Mac has one as well, why not Linux ?
Fabien H
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fabien Henon wrote:
> Ken wrote:
>>
>> fabien Henon wrote:
>>
>>
>>>In one word, has the survey been used ?
>>
>>
>> That's 5 words. The one word answer though is, yes.
>>
> I was just wondering. Maybe that considering the number of people who
> are using Pov for *nix, the POV-Team of some other skilled programmer
>
> It may sound something like that from a guy who writes Pyvon (an editor
> for POV under Linux), but Pyvon is written with Python. As Perl, Java or
> other script language, Python can not match the speed of C or C++.
>
> I know that many *nix gurus are going to yell at this message (in that
> they do not need an editor), but there is an increasing number of people
> who discover Linux. Most of them come from a windows world. Having a
> proper interface will ease 'arrival' in the Linux world.
>
> Pyvon has been downloaded over 500 times so far. So there must be a need
> for an interface.
>
>
> I do know that writing an interface is easier said than done, but with
> Kylix 3 it **might** be faster to write a proper Linux Interface to Linux.
> Windows has one, Mac has one as well, why not Linux ?
>
>
>
> Fabien H
I'm not sure what you mean by an interface, I've not seen the windows
or Mac versions of POV, but for Unix KPovModeller for KDE looks pretty good,
It's quite tight to the SDL (I mean if you know the SDL you can kind of
tell what's going on) and it makes some things like splines a lot easier.
I've only played with it though, I don't think any GUI can equal the power
of a language. Alternatively, if the proposed GUI just provides a text
editor and a "render" button, I'd be much happier using my own favourite
editor (vim has syntax hilighting for POV, I'm sure emacs has too) and "!!"
to re-render :-)
--
Bill Hails
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fabien Henon wrote:
>
> I was just wondering. Maybe that considering the number of people who
> are using Pov for *nix, the POV-Team of some other skilled programmer
I really can't say. The reason for the survey was not so much to gauge the
interests in a GUI interface for a .nix environment as it was to better
gauge the distribution of .nix users and the variants they use in order to
present the best possible configuration scripts for install and compiling.
With the wide proliferation of .nix variants out there the POV-Team realized
they needed a better way to cater to those using that platform.
> It may sound something like that from a guy who writes Pyvon (an editor
> for POV under Linux), but Pyvon is written with Python. As Perl, Java or
> other script language, Python can not match the speed of C or C++.
>
> I know that many *nix gurus are going to yell at this message (in that
> they do not need an editor), but there is an increasing number of people
> who discover Linux. Most of them come from a windows world. Having a
> proper interface will ease 'arrival' in the Linux world.
>
> Pyvon has been downloaded over 500 times so far. So there must be a need
> for an interface.
>
> I do know that writing an interface is easier said than done, but with
> Kylix 3 it **might** be faster to write a proper Linux Interface to Linux.
> Windows has one, Mac has one as well, why not Linux ?
Unfortunately, the POV-Team currently does not have the personnel on board
to offer a GUI for Linux. That may change and if it does the consideration
for a GUI *might* become something they will look into (I/we/they/them
don't promise anything). In the mean time your efforts with Pyvon and the
efforts of those distributing configurations for the other .nix editing
systems are invaluable resources for the POV-Ray community and your efforts
are truly appreciated, by both the POV-Team and the users of the program.
--
Ken Tyler
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Bob R wrote:
>
> Ken wrote in message <3EE08022.941B6091@pacbell.net>...
> >
> >fabien Henon wrote:
> >
> >> In one word, has the survey been used ?
> >
> >That's 5 words. The one word answer though is, yes.
> >
> >--
> >Ken Tyler
>
> Ask for a pixel, get *a* pixel!! Trouble is it's hard to tell what the
> picture is by looking at a single pixel.
>
> Either:
> 1] You were very busy (likely).
I have been, that's true.
> 2] You were trying to be cute (no prob).
That is also true.
> 3] You were being mean (Our mean ol' Uncle Ken. What? NO WAY!).
Playfully guilty.
> So, should I spend a couple more weeks trying to get a simple 'modal
> dialog' to return to the calling 'dialog' [a], or is the P-Team going
> to make a GUI for POVray.Linux?
See my reply to Fabien...
--
Ken Tyler
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In article <3ee6580f@news.povray.org>, fabien Henon <fabienhenon@fr>
wrote:
> I know that many *nix gurus are going to yell at this message (in that
> they do not need an editor), but there is an increasing number of people
> who discover Linux. Most of them come from a windows world. Having a
> proper interface will ease 'arrival' in the Linux world.
There are already very good POV editors under Linux. I personally use
jEdit, which is an extremely customizeable programmer's editor that
comes with a POV-Ray editing mode, and there's an editing mode for
Emacs, which is the definition of customizeable. You can run the
existing Unix version of POV directly from within both of these.
> I do know that writing an interface is easier said than done, but with
> Kylix 3 it **might** be faster to write a proper Linux Interface to Linux.
> Windows has one, Mac has one as well, why not Linux ?
I like this idea better: create a Cocoa interface, and port it to
GNUStep for other systems.
--
Christopher James Huff <cja### [at] earthlink net>
http://home.earthlink.net/~cjameshuff/
POV-Ray TAG: chr### [at] tagpovrayorg
http://tag.povray.org/
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Christopher James Huff wrote:
> There are already very good POV editors under Linux. I personally use
> jEdit, which is an extremely customizeable programmer's editor that
> comes with a POV-Ray editing mode, and there's an editing mode for
> Emacs, which is the definition of customizeable. You can run the
> existing Unix version of POV directly from within both of these.
>
The thing is that a general editor like jEdit, emacs,... ( even
though they may be extremely customizeable), can not meet all the
specific needs a POV-RAY user can have.
Most of the time, these editors are meant for programming or script
languages (C, java, python,..). Even if POV uses a script language, it
is a raytracer not a language : It produces images, not software.
I do not know the answers to the following questions, but does Jedit or
Emacs has these features :
- handle multiple files at once : Has the user to select one files among
others with a mouse-click ?
- Is it possible to choose a predefined resolution without typing +W...
+H... in a command line ?
- Is it possible to choose the quality settings ( from +Q0 to Q9) with a
mouse click ?
- Does your editor show you the previously opened POV-Ray files (so that
you can open them with a mere click) ?
- Do you have the possiblity to define which area to render (+sc...
+ec.... ) without the command line
- Does it handle syntax hightlighting well ( I know that Pyvon does not
do it well either because of speed)
- Can you pause, then resume a render ?
- Can you choose the color for each type of keywords in a simple window
dialog ?
- Can you do queue rendering ( render one file then another unattended) ?
These are all the features can I can think of for the moment. There
might be others.
As I am not sure that you can answer yes to all the questions above,
that is why I think POV would 'deserve' a GUI on its own.
>
>
>>I do know that writing an interface is easier said than done, but with
>>Kylix 3 it **might** be faster to write a proper Linux Interface to Linux.
>>Windows has one, Mac has one as well, why not Linux ?
>
>
> I like this idea better: create a Cocoa interface, and port it to
> GNUStep for other systems.
>
Could you tell more about Cocoa ?
I don't know much about it, but I thought it was a graphical toolkit for
Mac OS.X.
Besides, is it easily portable to other platform ?
Is it freely available ?
Fabien
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As for examcs...
fabien Henon <fabienhenon@fr> wrote:
> - handle multiple files at once : Has the user to select one files among
> others with a mouse-click ?
Yes. But not with tabs, if that's what you meant. Either from a menu
or a shortcut key.
> - Is it possible to choose a predefined resolution without typing +W...
> +H... in a command line ?
You can create new menus in emacs where you can put diverse functionality.
Naturally this requires some elisp knowledge and I don't remember if
the pov-mode script has something like this or not.
So the answer would be "yes, but it requires some scripting, so it's
not trivial".
> - Is it possible to choose the quality settings ( from +Q0 to Q9) with a
> mouse click ?
Same as above.
> - Does your editor show you the previously opened POV-Ray files (so that
> you can open them with a mere click) ?
Actually I don't remember if emacs has file history. If it doesn't by
default, it can probably be scripted in. If so, the problem is the same
as above.
> - Do you have the possiblity to define which area to render (+sc...
> +ec.... ) without the command line
Nope.
> - Does it handle syntax hightlighting well ( I know that Pyvon does not
> do it well either because of speed)
Quite well.
Moreover, it supports a quite good auto-indentation which is pretty handy.
This is something I really miss in the winpov editor.
> - Can you pause, then resume a render ?
Not that I'm aware of.
> - Can you choose the color for each type of keywords in a simple window
> dialog ?
You can change the color scheme by editing the configuration file.
There's even a configuration program in emacs for doing it from inside
emacs itself with the mouse, but it's not as simple as a simple dialog.
> - Can you do queue rendering ( render one file then another unattended) ?
This is probably easier to do with a shell script than with emacs.
--
#macro M(A,N,D,L)plane{-z,-9pigment{mandel L*9translate N color_map{[0rgb x]
[1rgb 9]}scale<D,D*3D>*1e3}rotate y*A*8}#end M(-3<1.206434.28623>70,7)M(
-1<.7438.1795>1,20)M(1<.77595.13699>30,20)M(3<.75923.07145>80,99)// - Warp -
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fabien Henon wrote:
>
In addition to what Warp wrote:
> [...]
> - Does your editor show you the previously opened POV-Ray files (so that
> you can open them with a mere click) ?
There are various add-ons for emacs allowing this in some form.
> - Does it handle syntax hightlighting well ( I know that Pyvon does not
> do it well either because of speed)
Emacs does this extremely well, in addition you also have a section
browser.
> - Can you pause, then resume a render ?
I doubt Pyvon can do this (unless you 'pause' by changing priority to
lowest).
> These are all the features can I can think of for the moment. There
> might be others.
>
> As I am not sure that you can answer yes to all the questions above,
> that is why I think POV would 'deserve' a GUI on its own.
The question is not whether it 'deserves' it but whether a proprietary GUI
would be better to use and more powerful than a good and customizable
editor and some additional tools. WinPOV - although being worked on for
quite some time - is still much less powerful than a good editor. Some
key features of Emacs for me are:
- auto-indention (which is much more than WinPOV offers)
- ability to edit all kind of text files in one editor (and each file type
with its own syntax highlighting, navigation helps etc.)
- auto-completition (which is syntax sensitive in emacs)
- templates with automatically updated 'last modified' field
- integration of tools like 'diff', 'ispell' and regular expression search
These are just examples although you will already have a hard time
implementing them in WinPOV or Pyvon. I have no doubt there are some
things rather difficult to do in emacs but for this some small tools
implementing specific features would be better than a whole new editor.
Christoph
--
POV-Ray tutorials, include files, Sim-POV,
HCR-Edit and more: http://www.tu-bs.de/~y0013390/
Last updated 28 Feb. 2003 _____./\/^>_*_<^\/\.______
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In article <3eec650f@news.povray.org>, fabien Henon <fabienhenon@fr>
wrote:
> - handle multiple files at once : Has the user to select one files among
> others with a mouse-click ?
Both do. jEdit has a buffer menu, tabs, or a buffer selector which
contains a button for each open file, depending on which plugins you
use. Emacs can switch buffers with keystrokes when in a console, and has
similar facilities for switching buffers when using the graphical
interfaece.
> - Is it possible to choose a predefined resolution without typing +W...
> +H... in a command line ?
This is possible with some simple scripting and an ordinary terminal
program. With Emacs, you could probably do a fairly sophisticated
interface in the editor itself, with jEdit a simple plugin should do.
> - Is it possible to choose the quality settings ( from +Q0 to Q9) with a
> mouse click ?
Not "out of the box". Both are customizeable enough to make it possible
though.
> - Does your editor show you the previously opened POV-Ray files (so that
> you can open them with a mere click) ?
jEdit: yes. Emacs: I don't know if it has a file history or not.
> - Do you have the possiblity to define which area to render (+sc...
> +ec.... ) without the command line
Not out of the box.
> - Does it handle syntax hightlighting well ( I know that Pyvon does not
> do it well either because of speed)
Both handle it quite well.
> - Can you pause, then resume a render ?
The Unix version handles this just fine, the method you use to start it
doesn't affect it.
> - Can you choose the color for each type of keywords in a simple window
> dialog ?
jEdit: yes. Emacs has a different interface for setting these options,
but you can enter a "dialog" where you choose the colors.
> - Can you do queue rendering ( render one file then another unattended) ?
Not out of the box.
> As I am not sure that you can answer yes to all the questions above,
> that is why I think POV would 'deserve' a GUI on its own.
Faulty thinking. The existing solutions don't cover 100% of the needs,
that does not mean you have to go use something else. It should be quite
easy to build a plugin for jEdit which puts all the rendering options in
the toolbar, and you would be building on an already highly capable
editor for the scene files.
> > I like this idea better: create a Cocoa interface, and port it to
> > GNUStep for other systems.
> Could you tell more about Cocoa ?
> I don't know much about it, but I thought it was a graphical toolkit for
> Mac OS.X.
> Besides, is it easily portable to other platform ?
> Is it freely available ?
It is one of the primary APIs for Mac OS X, and is pretty much the
modern OpenStep API. GNUStep is the open source implementation, which
tries to follow Cocoa as closely as possible. It isn't complete, but
should be enough for a POV interface.
--
Christopher James Huff <cja### [at] earthlinknet>
http://home.earthlink.net/~cjameshuff/
POV-Ray TAG: chr### [at] tagpovrayorg
http://tag.povray.org/
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