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>> but if you want to do digital circuit design for a job there are plenty
>> of opportunities in a vast range of industries.
>
> Seriously... Doing what? Everything seems to be made of off-the-shelf
> parts (which, by definition, already exist). What's to design?
I guarantee you that if you open up any phone/monitor/TV/camera there will
be at least one custom IC that is not an off-the-shelf part. It's not just
IC makers that design ICs, any company that has a relatively high-tec
product does it. For example we design our own driver and controller ICs
for LCD panels, I know Canon designs their DIGIC image processing IC, I
imagine all other camera and display makers do similar. For TVs and
monitors I also assume they design controller ICs, because often there is no
off-the-shelf part to exactly fit your product. What about specialist
electronic test equipment? Presumably FPGAs will need to be designed for
that. How about network cards and routers, someone needs to design the
chipsets for those which are always being improved. What about when
Logitech develop a new mouse technology, I doubt they can just pick up an IC
from RS that does the job. What about the thousands of companies that offer
FPGA and ASIC design services - who are they doing work for? Who is working
for them?
>> If you were degree qualified I could point you to an opening we have at
>> the moment.
>
> Really? Are you ser- oh, wait, you work in Germany, don't you?
Yes, but this job is at our Oxford lab.
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Am 11.06.2010 10:12, schrieb Invisible:
> And an even smaller portion of the human race *care* how computers work.
>
> Most people's reaction would be "you poor autistic weirdo, you should
> seek professional help".
Nope. While most people don't /care/ how computers work, my experience
is that many of them still tend to be impressed when people know.
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On 6/11/2010 3:10 AM, Invisible wrote:
> Sure. But spending weeks wiring together little black blobs in order to
> make a few LEDs flash in a pattern with hypothetically means something?
> Most people wouldn't regard that as "fun".
In the same way I don't regard watching people beat eachother to the
ground over a small, oddly shaped, brown ball as fun.
But, what you're doing sounds fun to me. :)
--
~Mike
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On 6/11/2010 5:32 AM, Invisible wrote:
> Sure. It would just be nice if the entire human race _didn't_ regard me
> as a total loser, that's all...
There is a not insignificant portion of the human race that is aware of
your existence that does not regard you as a loser in the least.
There is a massive proportion of the human race that is not even aware
of your existence. This segment does not count, as they cannot possibly
form an opinion of you.
--
~Mike
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Am 11.06.2010 11:27, schrieb Invisible:
>> Get a qualification or training in electronics and apply for some jobs
>> then. Don't expect someone to phone you up one day and say they saw
>> your posts about building a CPU and want to employ you. If you really
>> want to do it then it's possible, but you have to put in some effort.
>
> I don't think knowing how to throw a few 7400s together qualifies you as
> a logic designer. Hell, there are kids out there who have spent years
> playing with FPGAs and doing real qualifications and stuff who have
> produced things actually worth having. Why hire me when you can hire one
> of those kids?
(1) That's where the "get a qualification or training" suggestion kicks in.
(2) You just named another point why toying around with 7400s may not be
wasted time after all: FPGAs are essentially nothing but a bunch of
(N)AND and (N)OR gates, plus a few flip-flops, that you can "wire up"
programmatically. Once you have toyed around with 7400s and the like,
going for FGPAs is a piece of cake. All you need is a dev tool (some
FPGA manufacturers give you at least some trial version for free) and a
dev kit (which you can solder together yourself in some cases; that's
what I did), and there you go.
> My knowledge of logic design is insufficient for me to work as a logic
> designer.
At present, maybe. If you keep going (and possibly do some qualification
on it), things could look different soon.
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Invisible <voi### [at] dev null> wrote:
> nemesis wrote:
>
> > is learning not useful?
>
> Depends on your point of view.
>
> On the one hand, knowing stuff always holds the possibility that one day
> it'll somehow be useful.
>
> On the other hand, what possible purpose could there be to knowing how
> to build an RS Flip-Flop from two NOR latches? I mean, unless I actually
> get hired by an IC design firm (which will never, ever happen), it's
> useless knowledge. It has no practical use of any kind. Hell, even
> learning to use regular expressions is theoretically more useful!
how about it being a practical intro to general chip design?
> http://xkcd.com/208/
regexes are definitely useful. :)
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"scott" <sco### [at] scottcom> wrote:
> >> is learning not useful?
> > On the other hand, what possible purpose could there be to knowing how to
> > build an RS Flip-Flop from two NOR latches?
>
> Those skills will be a useful base to learn more complex things, and also to
> use as part of more complex projects.
plus, if there's ever Armageddon, Andy will be King by getting networks back
online made out of 8-bit chips. He'll get all woman bowing to his supreme
intelect bringing back Farmville and Facebook (8-bit renditions).
Of course, there's first the little problem of getting electricity back and
molding his own sylicon devices out of sand...
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clipka wrote:
>> And an even smaller portion of the human race *care* how computers work.
>
> Nope. While most people don't /care/ how computers work, my experience
> is that many of them still tend to be impressed when people know.
Rly?
Clearly I'm going to the wrong sort of parties...
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nemesis wrote:
> plus, if there's ever Armageddon, Andy will be King by getting networks back
> online made out of 8-bit chips. He'll get all woman bowing to his supreme
> intelect
Dude, why the *** would women are about...
> bringing back Farmville and Facebook (8-bit renditions).
...oh, I see. Actually, you may have something there!
> Of course, there's first the little problem of getting electricity back and
> molding his own sylicon devices out of sand...
Who needs electricity when there's water pressure? ;-)
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>> On the other hand, what possible purpose could there be to knowing how
>> to build an RS Flip-Flop from two NOR latches?
>
> how about it being a practical intro to general chip design?
...which isn't useful unless you happen to design chips for a living,
with approximately 0.0% of the population does.
>> http://xkcd.com/208/
>
> regexes are definitely useful. :)
.......
...no, I'm not even going to say it. :-P
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