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6 Sep 2024 17:20:08 EDT (-0400)
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From: Mike Raiford
Subject: Re: REAL random numbers :D
Date: 6 Jan 2009 08:09:34
Message: <4963580e$1@news.povray.org>
Darren New wrote:
> Mike Raiford wrote:
>> http://www.fourmilab.ch/hotbits/
> 
> I liked better the one that had a camera pointed at half a dozen lava 
> lamps, and took the sha-1 of the webcam's output to generate random 
> streams. :-)
> 

I think beta decay is probably a bit more random. After all, there is 
that whole uncertainty thing .. :)

-- 
~Mike


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From: Darren New
Subject: Re: REAL random numbers :D
Date: 6 Jan 2009 13:18:30
Message: <4963a076$1@news.povray.org>
Mike Raiford wrote:
> Darren New wrote:
>> Mike Raiford wrote:
>>> http://www.fourmilab.ch/hotbits/
>>
>> I liked better the one that had a camera pointed at half a dozen lava 
>> lamps, and took the sha-1 of the webcam's output to generate random 
>> streams. :-)
>>
> 
> I think beta decay is probably a bit more random.

Hard to say.  It's certainly less amusing to watch, and certainly harder to 
explain to a layman. :-)

 > After all, there is that whole uncertainty thing .. :)

What do you think drives the randomness of lava lamps? Pixies?

-- 
   Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
   Why is there a chainsaw in DOOM?
   There aren't any trees on Mars.


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From: Mike Raiford
Subject: Re: REAL random numbers :D
Date: 6 Jan 2009 13:29:07
Message: <4963a2f3$1@news.povray.org>
Darren New wrote:

> 
> What do you think drives the randomness of lava lamps? Pixies?
> 

Fluid Dynamics? Heat?

Oh, hell, just take a shot of the back of the lens cap every so often 
(at high ISO), You'll get plenty of quantum randomness there. Or, 
amplify an idle input from the sound card to a great extent. More 
randomness, there, or a radio tuner tuned to a non-station, and use the 
universe as your source of randomness.  Plenty of sources. :)

-- 
~Mike


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From: Darren New
Subject: Re: REAL random numbers :D
Date: 6 Jan 2009 13:54:42
Message: <4963a8f2$1@news.povray.org>
Mike Raiford wrote:
> Darren New wrote:
> 
>>
>> What do you think drives the randomness of lava lamps? Pixies?
>>
> 
> Fluid Dynamics? Heat?

And ... those in turn are caused by ... ?

Granted, individual atom decay is less likely to exhibit statistical 
groupings. And you rarely have your radioactive source get too cold to be 
random. :-)

-- 
   Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
   Why is there a chainsaw in DOOM?
   There aren't any trees on Mars.


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From: Mike Raiford
Subject: Re: REAL random numbers :D
Date: 6 Jan 2009 14:03:15
Message: <4963aaf3$1@news.povray.org>
Darren New wrote:
> Mike Raiford wrote:
>> Darren New wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> What do you think drives the randomness of lava lamps? Pixies?
>>>
>>
>> Fluid Dynamics? Heat?
> 
> And ... those in turn are caused by ... ?
> 

electron motion converted to heat by squeezing them through a thin 
filament of tungsten? Molecules of water and wax interacting with each 
other once the wax is liquid.

> Granted, individual atom decay is less likely to exhibit statistical 
> groupings. And you rarely have your radioactive source get too cold to 
> be random. :-)
> 

Right, and occasionally my lava lamp acts completely non-random. It 
forms a single blob that just hangs there.

-- 
~Mike


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From: Invisible
Subject: Re: REAL random numbers :D
Date: 7 Jan 2009 04:15:46
Message: <496472c2@news.povray.org>
Mike Raiford wrote:

> Right, and occasionally my lava lamp acts completely non-random. It 
> forms a single blob that just hangs there.

I saw a laval lamp in a shop that had been left on for, like, the entire 
day or something.

Do you know what a homogenous wax/water emulsion looks like? I do.


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From: Mike Raiford
Subject: Re: REAL random numbers :D
Date: 7 Jan 2009 08:32:49
Message: <4964af01$1@news.povray.org>
Invisible wrote:

> Do you know what a homogenous wax/water emulsion looks like? I do.

Someone shook it, I bet.

-- 
~Mike


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From: Invisible
Subject: Re: REAL random numbers :D
Date: 7 Jan 2009 08:33:52
Message: <4964af40$1@news.povray.org>
>> Do you know what a homogenous wax/water emulsion looks like? I do.
> 
> Someone shook it, I bet.

Well, the instruction on mine do say not to run it for too long. And, 
just once, I accidentally left it on too long and it did emulsify to 
some degree.


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From: Mike Raiford
Subject: Re: REAL random numbers :D
Date: 7 Jan 2009 11:21:56
Message: <4964d6a4$1@news.povray.org>
Invisible wrote:
>>> Do you know what a homogenous wax/water emulsion looks like? I do.
>>
>> Someone shook it, I bet.
> 
> Well, the instruction on mine do say not to run it for too long. And, 
> just once, I accidentally left it on too long and it did emulsify to 
> some degree.

Mine always eventually became one single amorphous blob that would just 
sit there.. But, didn't emulsify. I did shake it once just for fun. That 
emulsified it. Took days for the wax to settle out of the water.

-- 
~Mike


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From: Invisible
Subject: Re: REAL random numbers :D
Date: 7 Jan 2009 11:28:31
Message: <4964d82f@news.povray.org>
Mike Raiford wrote:
> Invisible wrote:
>>>> Do you know what a homogenous wax/water emulsion looks like? I do.
>>>
>>> Someone shook it, I bet.
>>
>> Well, the instruction on mine do say not to run it for too long. And, 
>> just once, I accidentally left it on too long and it did emulsify to 
>> some degree.
> 
> Mine always eventually became one single amorphous blob that would just 
> sit there.. But, didn't emulsify. I did shake it once just for fun. That 
> emulsified it. Took days for the wax to settle out of the water.

Interesting. After mine emulsified, I just turned it off, and fairly 
quickly (about 20 minutes) all the wax sank to the bottom and co... 
uh... no, sorry, I can't spell that word. :-S


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