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From: David Buck
Subject: Commercial project using POVRay
Date: 23 Nov 2017 09:59:30
Message: <5a169c02$1@news.povray.org>
I know that this group is for discussions of POVRay and not a forum for 
promoting commercial products.  I have a case which covers both so I 
thought I'd ask the group for opinions before posting the details.

Basically, I've developed a game for Android and iOS devices and the 
graphics for the game were all rendered using POVRay.  If people here 
feel that it's permissible, I would like to post a short description of 
the game with a screenshot posted in povray.binaries.images.

If the consensus is that you'd feel spammed, I'd be happy to abide by 
your wishes and not post anything here about the game (besides this 
message).

What do you think?  What constitutes acceptable speech in this forum?  I 
could simply post an image to p.b.images (which doesn't contain the 
product name) if that's an option.  I don't know quite how to handle 
this so I'm looking for some opinions.

Thanks,
David Buck


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From: Stephen
Subject: Re: Commercial project using POVRay
Date: 23 Nov 2017 10:44:51
Message: <5a16a6a3$1@news.povray.org>
On 23/11/2017 09:59, David Buck wrote:
> I know that this group is for discussions of POVRay and not a forum for 
> promoting commercial products.  I have a case which covers both so I 
> thought I'd ask the group for opinions before posting the details.
> 
I can see no reason why you don't post the text in p.news-submissions. 
That's what it is for. ;)

> Basically, I've developed a game for Android and iOS devices and the 
> graphics for the game were all rendered using POVRay.  If people here 
> feel that it's permissible, I would like to post a short description of 
> the game with a screenshot posted in povray.binaries.images.
> 
> If the consensus is that you'd feel spammed, I'd be happy to abide by 
> your wishes and not post anything here about the game (besides this 
> message).
> 
Others have posted game images generated by PovRay in the past.

> What do you think?  What constitutes acceptable speech in this forum?  

When you find out. Let me know. ;)

>I could simply post an image to p.b.images (which doesn't contain the 
> product name) if that's an option.  I don't know quite how to handle 
> this so I'm looking for some opinions.
> 

Go for it. We owe you a favour or two. :-D



-- 

Regards
     Stephen


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From: Jim Holsenback
Subject: Re: Commercial project using POVRay
Date: 23 Nov 2017 13:02:11
Message: <5a16c6d3$1@news.povray.org>
On 11/23/2017 4:59 AM, David Buck wrote:
> I know that this group is for discussions of POVRay and not a forum for 
> promoting commercial products.  I have a case which covers both so I 
> thought I'd ask the group for opinions before posting the details.
> 
> Basically, I've developed a game for Android and iOS devices and the 
> graphics for the game were all rendered using POVRay.  If people here 
> feel that it's permissible, I would like to post a short description of 
> the game with a screenshot posted in povray.binaries.images.
> 
> If the consensus is that you'd feel spammed, I'd be happy to abide by 
> your wishes and not post anything here about the game (besides this 
> message).
> 
> What do you think?  What constitutes acceptable speech in this forum?  I 
> could simply post an image to p.b.images (which doesn't contain the 
> product name) if that's an option.  I don't know quite how to handle 
> this so I'm looking for some opinions.
> 
> Thanks,
> David Buck

heck yeah ... go for it!


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From: Bald Eagle
Subject: Re: Commercial project using POVRay
Date: 23 Nov 2017 14:10:00
Message: <web.5a16d69d4e9f106a5cafe28e0@news.povray.org>
David Buck <dav### [at] simberoncom> wrote:

> [...] I have a case which covers both...

Well then I see no problem.
As the terms of use for POV-Ray clearly state that it can be used for commercial
purposes (and I have a lengthening thread dedicated almost solely to how other
people use POV-Ray and what they use it for), then I see no problems whatsoever.
http://news.povray.org/povray.general/thread/%3Cweb.59662d4457ffa8e8c437ac910%40news.povray.org%3E/
What specific information you post may determine which specific area of the
forum you decide to post it in - news, binaries, off-topic, etc.

> Basically, I've developed a game for Android and iOS devices and the
> graphics for the game were all rendered using POVRay.
That sounds great!  I'm sure that's exactly the kind of thing that people would
love to see here, especially since (as mentioned) there are game developers who
do that, and internet search results may inspire others unfamiliar with
raytracing to also use POV-Ray for that purpose.

> If people here
> feel that it's permissible, I would like to post a short description of
> the game with a screenshot posted in povray.binaries.images.

Certainly.  Mike Horvath and others have done the same in the past.

> What do you think?  What constitutes acceptable speech in this forum?

To preface my statement (vide infra), I'd say that most of us try to limit
discussion of politics, religion, and any other topics that might tend to "stir
the pot" - simply because there's a whole internet of other places to do that,
and I think most people come here to escape from that and focus on their
interest in raytracing (and SDL programming) in relative peace.

I think it largely comes down to using the sort of common sense that seems to be
rapidly vanishing from the globe.  To me, that you're even worried to the extent
that you feel the need to ask such a question is indicative of the kind of
straightjacket that's tightening on what ought to be free people whose existence
entitles them to natural rights and liberties.
I think it's a [sad] indicator of the indignities that people are expected to
endure in the form of some arbitrary, capricious, and constantly shifting
measure of correctness that you even feel the _need_ to ask
- and at the same time it's a strong indicator that you have the sort of
["common"] courtesy, consideration and respect that you do [voluntarily choose
to] ask.  Therefore I can't see you "spamming" - intentionally or otherwise.

"Here's what I've been busy working on _with POV-Ray_" is exactly what this
forum (in my mind) is about. Whether you're selling the product those images get
integrated into or not is largely irrelevant.


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From: David Buck
Subject: Re: Commercial project using POVRay
Date: 23 Nov 2017 14:49:58
Message: <5a16e016$1@news.povray.org>
Ok, I've been developing a game for Android and iOS called HexSolve. 
It's a puzzle game.  It's currently in the Google Play Store as an Open 
Beta.  I'm working to get it ready to submit to the Apple App Store.

Although POVRay doesn't run while you're playing the game, the graphics 
for the game were rendered using POVRay to draw the board and the tiles 
that move across it.

The textures are pretty much out of the box of for POVRay.  Tiles range 
from #1 to #9 and each number corresponds to a different texture. I 
tried making the textures more interesting as you get to higher numbers. 
  The board itself is created with CSG and a wood texture.  The text and 
graphics on the buttons and tiles was part of the POVRay scene.  Other 
text around the game was rendered directly on the device using the 
Freetype library.  Once rendered, the tiles and board were incorporated 
as textures for OpenGL ES and all game graphics were rendered using 
OpenGL ES in a 2D mode.

I also used POVRay to render the image that appears on the store and the 
icon that appears on the device.

I'm posting a screenshot of the game to povray.binary.images.

I'd be happy to answer any questions.  The game's web site is 
http://www.simberon.com/HexSolve/

David Buck


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From: clipka
Subject: Re: Commercial project using POVRay
Date: 23 Nov 2017 15:09:52
Message: <5a16e4c0@news.povray.org>
Am 23.11.2017 um 10:59 schrieb David Buck:
> Basically, I've developed a game for Android and iOS devices and the
> graphics for the game were all rendered using POVRay.  If people here
> feel that it's permissible, I would like to post a short description of
> the game with a screenshot posted in povray.binaries.images.

I /think/ I recall something about you having developed something else,
some 25+ years ago... ;)

> If the consensus is that you'd feel spammed, I'd be happy to abide by
> your wishes and not post anything here about the game (besides this
> message).
> 
> What do you think?  What constitutes acceptable speech in this forum?  I
> could simply post an image to p.b.images (which doesn't contain the
> product name) if that's an option.  I don't know quite how to handle
> this so I'm looking for some opinions.

Are you kidding? You know who you are, right?

If I were asked, I'd say that we're honored that you're even still
sticking around, and that you have all the rights in the world to
/define/ what's acceptable in these newsgroups ;)


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From: David Buck
Subject: Re: Commercial project using POVRay
Date: 23 Nov 2017 15:57:31
Message: <5a16efeb$1@news.povray.org>
On 2017-11-23 10:09 AM, clipka wrote:
> Am 23.11.2017 um 10:59 schrieb David Buck:
>> Basically, I've developed a game for Android and iOS devices and the
>> graphics for the game were all rendered using POVRay.  If people here
>> feel that it's permissible, I would like to post a short description of
>> the game with a screenshot posted in povray.binaries.images.
> 
> I /think/ I recall something about you having developed something else,
> some 25+ years ago... ;)
> 
>> If the consensus is that you'd feel spammed, I'd be happy to abide by
>> your wishes and not post anything here about the game (besides this
>> message).
>>
>> What do you think?  What constitutes acceptable speech in this forum?  I
>> could simply post an image to p.b.images (which doesn't contain the
>> product name) if that's an option.  I don't know quite how to handle
>> this so I'm looking for some opinions.
> 
> Are you kidding? You know who you are, right?
> 
> If I were asked, I'd say that we're honored that you're even still
> sticking around, and that you have all the rights in the world to
> /define/ what's acceptable in these newsgroups ;)
> 


Actually, it was about 31 years ago when I developed DKBTrace which 
became the foundation for POVRay.

Some 15 years ago or so I developed a program called ElastoLab which did 
simulated physics.  I set it up so it could output a format that POVRay 
could input and rendered a few physics animations to post here.  I was 
chastised for spamming the group with commercial messages.


This time, I thought I'd test the waters first.  Even though I was 
involved in the early development of POVRay, this is a community group 
and I want to abide by community standards.  I don't just want to pull 
the privilege card and post things that offend people.

Thanks for understanding.
David


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From: Stephen
Subject: Re: Commercial project using POVRay
Date: 23 Nov 2017 16:16:03
Message: <5a16f443$1@news.povray.org>
On 23/11/2017 15:57, David Buck wrote:
> Some 15 years ago

There were some stroppy people around then. Now we are all older and 
more tolerant. ;-)

BTW I noticed that you write POVRay, I write it as PovRay and the 
program itself is titled POV-Ray. I've always wondered if anyone gets 
irked at the different spellings.

-- 

Regards
     Stephen


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From: David Buck
Subject: Re: Commercial project using POV-Ray
Date: 23 Nov 2017 16:56:16
Message: <5a16fdb0@news.povray.org>
On 2017-11-23 11:15 AM, Stephen wrote:
> On 23/11/2017 15:57, David Buck wrote:
>> Some 15 years ago
> 
> There were some stroppy people around then. Now we are all older and 
> more tolerant. ;-)
> 
> BTW I noticed that you write POVRay, I write it as PovRay and the 
> program itself is titled POV-Ray. I've always wondered if anyone gets 
> irked at the different spellings.
> 


I should be spelling it POV-Ray.  In the early days, there was some 
discussion of the spelling.  I remembered that some people were calling 
it PVRay.  I believe my original proposal was STAR.  I'm glad that 
POV-Ray was chosen because it's much more Google friendly.

David


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From: Jim Henderson
Subject: Re: Commercial project using POVRay
Date: 23 Nov 2017 20:00:04
Message: <5a1728c4@news.povray.org>
On Thu, 23 Nov 2017 16:15:55 +0000, Stephen wrote:

> There were some stroppy people around then. Now we are all older and
> more tolerant. ;-)

Absolutely! :D



-- 
"I learned long ago, never to wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and 
besides, the pig likes it." - George Bernard Shaw


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