Here is the next version of my interpretation of Tim Nikias' room. This
image is rendered without radiosity (see below).

Changes have been made to:
- finish/diffuse of the background image to make it slightly brighter.
- wall and ceiling textures; blending more the different colors, adding a
crackle pattern and tweaking the normals.
- texture of the crates; different wood textures underlying the paint.
- a stove in the corner; I googled a barrel stove from Alaska that exactly
fitted my needs, and modelled it in Moray and Silo before exporting it to
POV-Ray through PoseRay. I used two image_maps provided by Nicolas Rougier
for his Chain in this ng, that perfectly fitted the stove.

I experimented with photons to see if some caustics would be reflected on
the ceiling, but results were unconclusive, so I left it for the time being.

I still have to do something about the glass in the windows.

And then radiosity:
I noted that Tim used two different render sizes: a smaller one for the
gathering pass, and a larger one for the second pass. I was wondering how
much the two sizes could differ. A small size for gathering radiosity data
is faster, but to what degree can you then use that data in a final larger
render, e.g. 320x240 for the gathering pass and 800x600 for the final pass?
I could not find info about this in the docs. The point is important to me
because I have a slow computer, I have to increase count substantially to
diminish color banding which tend to hide the more subtle wall texture, and
I encountered some memory problems. All in all, the gathering pass takes
several hours on my machine.

Like always, comments welcome!!

Thomas

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Attachments:
Download 'windows_room_03.jpg' (86 KB)

Preview of image 'windows_room_03.jpg'

Thomas

The ice looks very very realistic. How did you make it? Isosurface? Perhaps 
an hdri photo? Your drawing reminds me the Gold Rush of Chaplin!

Friendly


433fa5a7@news.povray.org...
> Here is the next version of my interpretation of Tim Nikias' room. This
> image is rendered without radiosity (see below).
>
> Changes have been made to:
> - finish/diffuse of the background image to make it slightly brighter.
> - wall and ceiling textures; blending more the different colors, adding a
> crackle pattern and tweaking the normals.
> - texture of the crates; different wood textures underlying the paint.
> - a stove in the corner; I googled a barrel stove from Alaska that exactly
> fitted my needs, and modelled it in Moray and Silo before exporting it to
> POV-Ray through PoseRay. I used two image_maps provided by Nicolas Rougier
> for his Chain in this ng, that perfectly fitted the stove.
>
> I experimented with photons to see if some caustics would be reflected on
> the ceiling, but results were unconclusive, so I left it for the time 
> being.
>
> I still have to do something about the glass in the windows.
>
> And then radiosity:
> I noted that Tim used two different render sizes: a smaller one for the
> gathering pass, and a larger one for the second pass. I was wondering how
> much the two sizes could differ. A small size for gathering radiosity data
> is faster, but to what degree can you then use that data in a final larger
> render, e.g. 320x240 for the gathering pass and 800x600 for the final 
> pass?
> I could not find info about this in the docs. The point is important to me
> because I have a slow computer, I have to increase count substantially to
> diminish color banding which tend to hide the more subtle wall texture, 
> and
> I encountered some memory problems. All in all, the gathering pass takes
> several hours on my machine.
>
> Like always, comments welcome!!
>
> Thomas
>
>
>
>

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"Remy Closset" <rem### [at] tiscalifr> schreef in bericht
news:4340e839@news.povray.org...
> Thomas
>
> The ice looks very very realistic. How did you make it? Isosurface?
Perhaps
> an hdri photo? Your drawing reminds me the Gold Rush of Chaplin!
>

original scene from which this is a variation (see the tread of 21-9-2005
for the first version).
The Gold Rush! Yes! I remember though, that Chaplin had 'real' furniture in
his log cabin, hadn't he?

Thomas

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I like it!

Maybe you should try to add some normals to the wooden crates, as to
simulate a change in depth between painted and unpainted regions. I'd also
go for a rusty spot on the ceiling, where the stove is.

And I'd try to use some no_shadow-lightsources with fade_power in order to
create more contrast in the shadowed parts of the image. They look
"depthless" as it is now.

And have you thought about adding some icy crust to the edges of the
windows?

Regards,
Tim

-- 
"Tim Nikias v2.0"
Homepage: <http://www.nolights.de>

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"Tim Nikias" <JUSTTHELOWERCASE:timISNOTnikias(at)gmx.netWARE> schreef in
bericht news:43413251$1@news.povray.org...
> I like it!
>
> Maybe you should try to add some normals to the wooden crates, as to
> simulate a change in depth between painted and unpainted regions. I'd also
> go for a rusty spot on the ceiling, where the stove is.
>
> And I'd try to use some no_shadow-lightsources with fade_power in order to
> create more contrast in the shadowed parts of the image. They look
> "depthless" as it is now.
>
> And have you thought about adding some icy crust to the edges of the
> windows?
>

Thank you Tim!
Yes, the crates need some extra normals. I shall look into that, as also
into the shadow lights. I agree that this is still not satisfactory. In the
present image there are two shadowless lights (one is your original one, the
other is a very feeble one at the camera location), but htey lack fade_power
yet.
Yes, still have to work on the windows!!!
Do you have an idea about my radiosity question? My latest esperiment,
yesterday, was not really satisfying for the aspect of the walls.

Thomas

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"Tim Nikias" <JUSTTHELOWERCASE:timISNOTnikias(at)gmx.netWARE> schreef in
bericht news:43413251$1@news.povray.org...
>
> And have you thought about adding some icy crust to the edges of the
> windows?
>
I have just done this for the round window (spherical color_map). It looks
good, except for the thickness of the glass which becomes visible as the
texture is applied to both sides of the cylinder. I shall have to reduce the
thickness to make it less conspicuous.

Thomas

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> I have just done this for the round window (spherical color_map). It looks
> good, except for the thickness of the glass which becomes visible as the
> texture is applied to both sides of the cylinder. I shall have to reduce
the
> thickness to make it less conspicuous.

Hm. Is frost always on both sides? I remember that I'd often have frost on
the inside of my windows, because of the moisture in the air due to my
breath, or outside because of fog or such...

Dunno, but less thick windows might be a good move as well, just wanted to
voice a comment. :-)

-- 
"Tim Nikias v2.0"
Homepage: <http://www.nolights.de>

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"Tim Nikias" <JUSTTHELOWERCASE:timISNOTnikias(at)gmx.netWARE> schreef in
bericht news:4344dcf2@news.povray.org...
>
> Hm. Is frost always on both sides? I remember that I'd often have frost on
> the inside of my windows, because of the moisture in the air due to my
> breath, or outside because of fog or such...
>
> Dunno, but less thick windows might be a good move as well, just wanted to
> voice a comment. :-)
>
No, frost is not (necessarily) on both sides, but this was an effect of the
cylindrical color_map. I solved it easily by adding an extra layer (very
thin cylinder or box) to the outside of the windows (kept their thickness).
See the image below.
Also added a soot stain on the ceiling around the chimney (also a
cylindrical color_map).
I added some normals to the paint on the crates
Finally, I commented out the shadowless on one of the extra lights inside
the room and added fade and fade_power. This gives a better view (although
with some shadows) than my experiments with radiosity.

Thomas

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Attachments:
Download 'windows_room_04.jpg' (85 KB)

Preview of image 'windows_room_04.jpg'

I like it, the lighting has improved significantly with more contrast. You
should work a little more on the frost, but I guess that the current version
is just preliminary. Often, you can still see through the frost, and the
edge is always as hard as you've made it.

Apart of that, have you tried getting the paint to appear thicker than the
wood beneath using normals? It seems like they have some grain now, which is
fine, but there's still no discernable edge between paint and wood.

Regards,
Tim

-- 
"Tim Nikias v2.0"
Homepage: <http://www.nolights.de>

Post a reply to this message

"Tim Nikias" <JUSTTHELOWERCASE:timISNOTnikias(at)gmx.netWARE> schreef in
bericht news:43453d63$1@news.povray.org...
> I like it, the lighting has improved significantly with more contrast. You
> should work a little more on the frost, but I guess that the current
version
> is just preliminary. Often, you can still see through the frost, and the
> edge is always as hard as you've made it.
>
> Apart of that, have you tried getting the paint to appear thicker than the
> wood beneath using normals? It seems like they have some grain now, which
is
> fine, but there's still no discernable edge between paint and wood.
>

Yes the frost is preliminary. It is rather tricky to control its shape,
especially on the rectangular windows, as it is the combination of color_map
index and turbulence that does the trick. Yes, it is still too opaque. I
gave it some small transmit value but I want to experiment with higher ones
and with filter values.

The paint: I think The problem lies in the final texture_map of  Tim
McMurdo's macro that I have worked on for this scene. There is probably to
much fading from the paint texture to the wood texture, giving a kind of
rubbed-off or eroded look to the object. But in this case, the edges should
be sharper indeed, showing flacking paint instead. I think this is easy to
implement.

Thanks indeed for your comment, btw! They are very helpful and keep me on my
toes, sts  :-)

Thomas

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