POV-Ray : Newsgroups : povray.beta-test : v3.7.1 beta.6 Server Time
28 Mar 2024 09:19:51 EDT (-0400)
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From: Kenneth
Subject: Re: v3.7.1 beta.6
Date: 8 May 2017 13:00:00
Message: <web.5910a307e4817c0b883fb31c0@news.povray.org>
(Windows 7 Ultimate, 64-bit, 6 gigs RAM)

I get the same immediate non-start issue; it doesn't even get to the GUI. I
tried three different times.

Error-box message:
"Unfortunately, it appears that the execution of an illegal instruction at
address 0x000000014001D6D3 has caused this unofficial POV-Ray build to crash."

Another error box:
"Failed to initialize frontend. Timed out waiting for worker thread startup."

I saved the DMP file, METADATA file and MINIDUMP file, if they can be useful
(although the DMP file is huge, at 100+ MB.)


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From: clipka
Subject: Re: v3.7.1 beta.6
Date: 8 May 2017 13:15:31
Message: <5910a7b3$1@news.povray.org>
Am 08.05.2017 um 18:55 schrieb Kenneth:
> (Windows 7 Ultimate, 64-bit, 6 gigs RAM)
> 
> I get the same immediate non-start issue; it doesn't even get to the GUI. I
> tried three different times.
> 
> Error-box message:
> "Unfortunately, it appears that the execution of an illegal instruction at
> address 0x000000014001D6D3 has caused this unofficial POV-Ray build to crash."
> 
> Another error box:
> "Failed to initialize frontend. Timed out waiting for worker thread startup."

Can you confirm that you have a non-AVX-capable CPU?


> I saved the DMP file, METADATA file and MINIDUMP file, if they can be useful
> (although the DMP file is huge, at 100+ MB.)

Let me know how I can get hold of the files.
See one of my other posts in this thread for details about my e-mail
address.


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From: Kenneth
Subject: Re: v3.7.1 beta.6
Date: 8 May 2017 13:20:00
Message: <web.5910a873e4817c0b883fb31c0@news.povray.org>
Forgot to mention that I used the regular Windows binary install. My machine
specs...

Intel Core 2 Duo CPU E4600 @ 2.40GHz
Intel Q965/Q963 Express Chipset Family
DirectX 9.0 ("or better")

Uh... is 3.7.1 beta 5 still available? I decided to trash it before installing
this new one :-(


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From: clipka
Subject: Re: v3.7.1 beta.6
Date: 8 May 2017 14:42:33
Message: <5910bc19$1@news.povray.org>
Am 08.05.2017 um 19:18 schrieb Kenneth:
> Forgot to mention that I used the regular Windows binary install. My machine
> specs...
> 
> Intel Core 2 Duo CPU E4600 @ 2.40GHz
> Intel Q965/Q963 Express Chipset Family
> DirectX 9.0 ("or better")
> 
> Uh... is 3.7.1 beta 5 still available? I decided to trash it before installing
> this new one :-(

Sure. They're /all/ still there:

https://github.com/POV-Ray/povray/releases

Just be advised that we officially no longer provide any support for any
of them.

(Not that we have ever officially provided any support for any version
of POV-Ray in the first place; but in this case officially you won't
even get any of the unofficial support we've been providing at our own
discretion all these years ;))

In other words: While we technically /have/ no obligation to provide any
support for POV-Ray, with respect to old beta versions we may, depending
on circumstances, actually /feel/ no obligation either ;)

(Also, we might not fancy bug reports for old betas that fail to clearly
state right away that they're about an old beta.)


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From: omniverse
Subject: Re: v3.7.1 beta.6
Date: 8 May 2017 18:30:00
Message: <web.5910f14de4817c0b9c5d6c810@news.povray.org>
"Kenneth" <kdw### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
> Forgot to mention that I used the regular Windows binary install. My machine
> specs...
>
> Intel Core 2 Duo CPU E4600

Quick check shows it might not have AVX from what I found.

Beta 6 is okay on my i5 6200U processor, which apparently has both AVX and AVX
2.0, and with Windows 10.

However... I looked at a scene file of a plotted chart I have for keeping track
of motorcycle MPG and maintenance, which uses a cubic spline sphere_sweep, and
found differences in appearance of that.

Official 3.7 and beta 5 is able to do the sphere_sweep with only one minor tiny
slice at a bend, almost unnoticeable, yet the beta 6 makes a few other places
look like discontinuities at other bends.

I haven't checked into that more than just rendering the scene file as it
already was; in other words, not tried to see it in other ways or make changes
to learn what the actual defect looks like at larger scale or closer viewpoint.

Curiously the *always there* artifact is diagonal and not at a bend (not exactly
anyway) while the new ones seem to be vertical and at either top or bottom of
the bends yet not all bends (it is an erratic sine wave), although most are
overlapped by a sphere as plotting points.

The good news: render time goes down from 9 minutes 27 seconds to 8 minutes 54
seconds, give or take a few seconds.


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From: Kenneth
Subject: Re: v3.7.1 beta.6
Date: 8 May 2017 18:35:01
Message: <web.5910f163e4817c0b883fb31c0@news.povray.org>
clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
> Am 08.05.2017 um 18:55 schrieb Kenneth:
> > (Windows 7 Ultimate, 64-bit, 6 gigs RAM)

>
> Can you confirm that you have a non-AVX-capable CPU?

As far as I can determine, mine does not have that. My Dell 'Optiplex 745' was
manufactured in September 2010, and it looks like AVX appeared shortly *after*
that date.

From Wikipedia:
"Advanced Vector Extensions (AVX) are extensions to the x86 instruction set
architecture for microprocessors from Intel and AMD proposed by Intel in March
2008 and first supported by Intel with the Sandy Bridge[1] processor shipping in
Q1 2011 and later on by AMD with the Bulldozer."

Here's a more detailed list of my machine specs (which is probably not helpful
anyway...)

Dell Optiplex 745

Model 0MM599


and up to 4MB L2 cache, EIST and VT (E6000 series) -- code name "Conroe"



Southbridge: Intel 82801HB/HR (ICH8/R) Rev. B0

Bios: Dell v2.6.4

Instructions: MMX, SSE, SSE2, SSE3, SSSE3, EM64T

>
> > I saved the DMP file, METADATA file and MINIDUMP file, if they can be useful
> > (although the DMP file is huge, at 100+ MB.)
>
> Let me know how I can get hold of the files.
> See one of my other posts in this thread for details about my e-mail
> address.

Unfortunately, my email account-- gmail-- seems to have an upload/download limit
of 20MB, AFAIK; the crash-dump files, even when zipped (using my 7zFM app)take
up 45MB. If there's another way for me to send them to you, or if you have a
suggestion, let me know.


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From: Kenneth
Subject: Re: v3.7.1 beta.6
Date: 8 May 2017 19:05:01
Message: <web.5910f938e4817c0b883fb31c0@news.povray.org>
clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
> Am 08.05.2017 um 19:18 schrieb Kenneth:

> >
> > Uh... is 3.7.1 beta 5 still available? I decided to trash it before installing
> > this new one :-(
>
> Sure. They're /all/ still there:
>
> https://github.com/POV-Ray/povray/releases
>

Ha! I didn't think to scroll down the page earlier (!!)

Thanks.


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From: omniverse
Subject: Re: v3.7.1 beta.6
Date: 9 May 2017 01:55:01
Message: <web.591158dbe4817c0b9c5d6c810@news.povray.org>
Simple example of sphere_sweep cubic spline problem I told of earlier, if
rendered using beta 6. Does not show same in official 3.7 or previous beta 5.

/* begin */
#version 3.7; // or 3.71

global_settings {assumed_gamma 1}

#local SplineType=1;

#local Scale=12.3; // larger scale worsens defect

light_source {<5,10,-20>*Scale, 1}

camera {
 location <0,0,-4*Scale>
 look_at 0
}

/* defect(?) of sphere_sweep cubic spline at center */

sphere_sweep
{
 #if (SplineType) cubic_spline 9,
 #else linear_spline 9,
 #end
 <-3,0,0>,0.1,
 <-2.5,0.5,0>,0.1,
 <-2,-0.2,0>,0.1,
 <-1,0.3,0>,0.1,
 <-0.5,-0.4,0>,0.1,
 <1,0.6,0>,0.1,
 <1.5,-0.1,0>,0.1,
 <2.5,0.3,0>,0.1,
 <3,0,0>,0.1,
 //tolerance 12.3 // uncomment, higher number lessens defect
 // and object might disappear if number very big
 pigment {rgb <1,1,1>}
 scale <1,1,1>*Scale
}
/* end */


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From: William F Pokorny
Subject: Re: v3.7.1 beta.6
Date: 9 May 2017 08:14:46
Message: <5911b2b6$1@news.povray.org>
On 05/09/2017 01:51 AM, omniverse wrote:
> Simple example of sphere_sweep cubic spline problem I told of earlier, if
> rendered using beta 6. Does not show same in official 3.7 or previous beta 5.
>
> /* begin */
...
> /* end */
>
>
>
Thanks for the test scene. I've added it to a small collection of 
problem sphere_sweeps I have going. Also helpful to see you trying such 
a large value for tolerance and getting a better result. I'd always 
followed the documentation with respect to magnitude suggestions and had 
never seen tolerance affect much.

Christoph backed out a fix in beta 6 which caused other problems but 
made sphere_sweep artifacts like yours better. I thrashed around in this 
code yesterday without much luck. Starting to think completely fixing 
things here may require changes in the core solver - that sphere_sweep 
issues might be tangled somewhat in the tiny discontinuities we see in 
other objects at times due scale and ray/surface/coordinate inflections.

The great news is Christoph fixed ALL the sphere_sweep auto-bounding 
issues I have in hand in beta 6! The auto-bounding issue has dogged 
sphere_sweeps from day one with this object.

Bill P.


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From: clipka
Subject: Re: v3.7.1 beta.6
Date: 9 May 2017 10:05:32
Message: <5911ccac$1@news.povray.org>
Am 09.05.2017 um 00:29 schrieb omniverse:

> However... I looked at a scene file of a plotted chart I have for keeping track
> of motorcycle MPG and maintenance, which uses a cubic spline sphere_sweep, and
> found differences in appearance of that.
> 
> Official 3.7 and beta 5 is able to do the sphere_sweep with only one minor tiny
> slice at a bend, almost unnoticeable, yet the beta 6 makes a few other places
> look like discontinuities at other bends.

Yes that's a known regression.

Unfortunately, the patch that fixed this in 3.7.0 has turned out to
totally wreck cubic sphere sweeps in differences and merges.

So the patch has been withdrawn, and it's back to the drawing board to
find a different solution for those sphere sweep artifacts.

I intend to address the issue prior to the final 3.7.1 release, but
currently I must admit that I can't promise anything.


> Curiously the *always there* artifact is diagonal and not at a bend (not exactly
> anyway) while the new ones seem to be vertical and at either top or bottom of
> the bends yet not all bends (it is an erratic sine wave), although most are
> overlapped by a sphere as plotting points.

As far as we are aware so far, the artifacts appear in places where the
sphere sweep runs nearly perpendicular to the viewing direction. Can you
confirm this?


> The good news: render time goes down from 9 minutes 27 seconds to 8 minutes 54
> seconds, give or take a few seconds.

Yes, we've managed to improve performance in a few places, including
sphere sweeps (both cubic and linear). We've also fixed the cubic sphere
sweep bounding at last.


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